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Here in Australia we would call that a three tyne cultivator. Cultivators are usually used on ground that has already been disturbed rather than on virgin ground.
This was used in US as a chisel plow. It was generally used to eliminate soil compaction on ground that that was in general annual agricultural production. Moldboard plows can be used for this, but it’s generally for turning biomass under, then followed by a disc harrow. Tillers are generally new to US and most larger farmer use no till procedures
Courtney, I am a retired farmer and what your using is a spring tooth cultivator which to me is a mini version of a chisel plow. It just doesn't go as deep as it's big brother! As for results you're attacking your field incorrectly. You should go one direction on the first pass and cross hatch on the second pass. Like tic tac toe. #
Thanks Frederick. I'm not going wide enough to criss cross. That is the right approach, but at only 16' wide, it would take an absolute eternity to do. Thanks for chiming in!
When Chisel plows first came out, the rule of thumb was 10 PTO HP per shank if you were running 10 inches deep. That depth was determined because 8 " was the depth most people moldboard plowed. The idea was to shatter thru the hard pan that had gotten established from decades of that practice. The other upside is you could cover more ground. A 90-100 PTO HP tractor could pull a 9 ft 9 shank chisel. By comparison, a 5 bottom plow with 16" moldboards would only cover 80" or just under 7 ft. Those 2 extra feet per pass was like having a tractor with 135 to 150 PTO HP. I doubt you can put 3 shanks 10 inches deep with this rig, but I imagine 5-6 " is not asking too much of it depending on soil type.
excellent explanation ! we typically used our chisel plow after 2 or 3 years of no till planting field corn or when opening up a piece of virgin ground that was abnormally hard. Then went down 8"-10" first time, then perpendicular another 6"-8"
@Papa A's Off Grid Retirement Where I live, there are sandy soils. They get pretty tight after a couple of years. Usually, 2 years of no till corn, then 1 year of beans. Then a Disc Chisel combination or a Multch till implement is used to loosen things up. It's usually ran slightly biased to the previous row direction. The hard pan from moldboarding is gone these days, but you can get vertical and horizontal soil mix in one pass and cover a lot of ground in one 10 hour day. A 225 hp FWA tractor with a 24ft disc chisel can cover 100 acres in about 8 hours and not kill the fuel bill or beat you to death.
I've run a 7 shank chisel, approx 6' wide, behind a Ford 800 series. In truth, it should be a nine shank, but some springs were broken when my uncle bought it, so he just removed two shanks. Anyway, about 8-10" deep is about all the old Ford will pull. No water in the tires or any other extra weight, so it just doesn't have enough traction.
I prefer a moldboard plow in the fall to turn the sod and composted manure. A rototiller will only plug up with manure in the fall. Then I rototil in the spring to complete the field for planting. The rototiller does a great job then.
I prefer a 3 bottom lister over chisel plows, chisel plows work best in sandy soil and are designed to open up the soil for disking. A lister then light disking then box blade, then bring in the roto Tiller and you have the perfect seed bed, every 2 years I also subsoil to breakup the hard pan.
Interesting. We started a new food plot for this season. Turned it with a 3 bottom plow, broke it up with a few runs with a disk, then finished it with a tiller. Did this over several weeks to let the biomass die down. Hopefully we did enough and picked a good spot. Thanks for the videos. Good works 👍❤️🚜
Thank you, thank you for doing this comparison! It's disappointing (and expensive) to go out and buy an attachment and have it not work the way I'd hoped. Plus it busts the budget for another year and delays buying the right attachment. Your videos are really valuable!
For virgin ground i always start with a plow and then till. After that I subsoil the rows if row croping. I then lay drip tape in the sub soiler groove and plant next to it.
Looks like a real "winner" for your soil composition/conditions. Might be able to get a better initial results by driving in one direction (back and forth) then crossing it at 90 degrees. But, strap in and hold on! I wouldn't hesitate to say that it did a terrific "sod-busting" job at least sitting here in my RU-vid seat!
Thanks for doing a video on one of these, I've contemplated one for awhile. Most people I've seen that plow use a disk after to make it finer like a tiller would.
I'm a rototiller guy myself; but the advocate a little bit for the chisel plow: I would argue; mr. Host of this video, what is your gasoline consumption with the rototiller versus me, the chisel plow? Operating costs such as the belts to run the tiller or the gears and the oil changes in the time sharpening the tiller tines. Also, which is harder and works the engine more, a rototiller running the PTO but relatively easy draw bar or very hard drawbar with no PTO? It all has to be putting a hopper for me to see what's up. I agree with you at the end of the video that that ground still looks too rough for the plant anything close to a row crop. With multiple passes required with the chisel plow, is the fuel-saving shot in the ass because you only need to make one pass with the roller tiller? These are questions I would like answered so I could form a better opinion.
Thinking about it more, I could see using it for last year's food plot with turnips in also to get them loosened up while ground is drying and let deer have at them. I know Deer have been visiting my plots all winter and spring trying to get in at the roots. This implement would be much more aggressive and desirable for new turf and existing root plots I think. I know gardens and bare soils benefit with a landscape rake scratching that top inch or two of crust to help dry out for a good tilling any time of the year. Its got me thinking about adding another tool to the arsenal. Here in Central Wisc the ground is still pretty froze and wet yet compared to last year, I think we'll be a month behind.
The ground is too wet, the shanks are too far apart, the springs are too weak, the tractor is too small, the frame is too flimsy and it definitely needs coulters ahead of the shanks to slice through the trash BUT, other than that, it’s great!
We all like to play with our tractors, but when it is wet, find something else to do! When it does dry out, good luck breaking up those clods you created.
I see one very, very valuable use for this. I lie in an area with a tremendous amount of shale to the extent that a digging bar is needed, not a shovel. For this reason, running a tiller feels like the rear end of the tractor is going to snap clean off because of all the bouncing every time the tiller hits a rock the size of a cutting board. Something like this, plow the field a couple times to pick up the rocks, grab the ones bigger than a shoe, and then disc. No damage done, no real significant disruption to soil structure. Handy little attachment!
I think the 1025 would pull a 3 bottom plow. You might throw one of those in the mix. Have you ever seen the "plow days" where 20 or 30 small tractors show up with one bottom plows and turn a hundred acres? I'd like to do that with my 430 Diesel, but I don't know of any in Missouri. I like my compact and tiller. but I think it would be a blast to bring the old girl out. I restored it a year or two ago back to new, all options. $$$ and searched the planet for parts, but was a good time and its a little beast! lol
I believe that verticle tillage is for reaching down to break up soil compaction. If you want the entire top turned,then a disc would work. Also, I have a JD subcompact tractor and use it almost daily around the farm but I never use it in the fields. The tires are so small that every bump is felt. Taller tires help that. I was impressed with the way your tractor preformed
Courtney, just a word of thanks for being an inspiration. After watching your channel over the past couple of years, I recently decided to purchase about 25 acres of land here in Upstate New York. The property was an old farm with varying terrain, a barn and a few outbuildings - all in HORRIBLE shape. The property called to me though, so I bought it. Seeing the wonderful community that has sprung up around your tractor projects, the use of your varying equipment and more recently your land-use efforts.... and realizing there is a wealth of talent out there who love to contribute thoughts and ideas to these types of projects, I started my own RU-vid channel to follow my efforts on the property. I'm hoping you will take a look (don't be too critical though, it's my first attempt at RU-vid), and hopefully some of your followers may also like to take a look and possibly contribute suggestions. THANKS for being an inspiration, Courtney. I only wish I had a budget for some big equipment which would make some of this work faster. It's all rentals for now. This is going to be a lot of work, but so much fun too. :-) -Dave
You might watch "Tractor Time with Tim" he has a small business helping his neighbors take care of stuff. He has a number of smaller tractors and he does a great job of explaining the ins and outs of using them.
For implements like these, best hp to use is "drawbar hp". Subcompacts have trouble putting hp down due to their light weight and small tires. In Nebraska tractor tests, a Ford 8N can develop 20 - 21 drawbar hp. To do so, they ballasted the tractor to 4100 lbs, where it developed 2,750 lbs of drawbar pull in 1st gear. Highly doubt a 1-series can come close even in 4wd. Therefore actual drawbar hp may be closer to 10 - 15hp, a bit low for a 3-chisel plow.
I think it would be nice if you had 2 additional rippers that could rotate out of the way for the fist pass and then down into place for subsequent passes after the sod is busted. I believe at that point you would have sufficient HP and could keep from tracking in the same grooves. Product improvement??
Excellent video showing a ripper in use in virgin ground. Cheap alternative to a tiller but as the video shows, very rough and requires multiple passes. Might work better in dry ground. Love these learn as you go videos. Keep up the good work. Len from Kalamazoo Michigan.
Thanks Len! Yeah, I will have to try it again in the summer. The ground out there turns to concrete when it dries out. Not sure if that will be better or worse.
I have an old all purpose plow 6' wide with 9 rippers and pull it just fine with a 2wd 32hp fordson dexta. Keep up the good work. Would still like to see a video on how one of your manual off set flail mowers fit on an older ford tractor
It appears to be a nice little ripper for people that have a need for that. Ground did look a little wet. Were you using 4wd at the beginning? Normally you would take a 2nd pass at a different angle but not sure how rough that would be using the little 1025. I would then probably follow this up with a small disc or cultivator or both.
Many years ago when I worked for a farmer in Oregon we used a plow like this to break ground. We called it a chisel plow then. We would make a pass in one direction across the field and then make a pass in a perpendicular direction cutting across the furrows from the first pass. This worked a lot better. Those furrows made the ride rough. On a John Deere 4020 I would stand as I worked across the furrows.
Hey, I recently bought a new John Deere 2025R based in part on your reviews. So far the tractor is better than I thought it would be. At 6' 3" 350 I'm about the size of your average bear and the John Deere is perfectly comfortable for me. I ordered a Speeco quick hitch from you and received it yesterday. It's a game changer. Thanks to your vids I didn't waste time or money on the other quick hitches. Be well, and thanks for the informative vids.
it would probably be the ticket to use this or a subsoiler first to break up the hard ground, then go over with the tiller. i dont believe that one replaces the other in this situation, rather they work together
Just an idea, no clue if that would work, but what about criss-crossing. Do the whole field up and down, then again left and right? Or would you spin fighting the ruts?
You need to use a disk behind a plow. Whether a chisel plow or a turning plow. A plow is used to break ground and a disk to level and make a seed bed. A tiller does both at the same time, just not as deep as a plow, but finer than a disk.
The small size of the tires and the short wheelbase of the 1025 is a handicap when plowing, especially on rough or previously plowed ground. I like subcompacts for lots of uses but imo they are best used with a small tiller on small plots such as gardens. A great machine for market gardening. Also the all purpose plow is not a finishing implement, it is for breaking up hard soil and improving water penetration and drainange. Should be followed up by a disc or roto tiller before planting.
This looks a lot like the results I see over on "How Farms Work" when they're running their chisel plow across their fields. Those shanks and the curls of soil they're throwing up are a dead ringer for the ones and the results on and from their 9 (?) shank. Of course, they're tilling farm fields, not breaking sod. Their chisel plow also has a row or two of disks at the back that helps to break up clods and smooth things out to prep the seed bed. To hear them talk about it, they chisel plow to break up compaction of the soil and VT / disk only if they only need to prep a seed bed.
My neighbor deep chisels his fields before he uses a disc plow. His chisels are about 36" long so he really breaks up the soil compaction. After he discs the ground with a roller of some kind on the backend, he'll level the entire field so when he flood irrigates the field he won't have any high spots left unwatered.
Looks like a kid with his new toy. I think you would have better results if you let the ground dry before you play. This tool is on my "want list", don't know if I need it, but still want one.
Easiest way to plow up a field/area with a multi plow/chisel plow is plow on the diagonal to your first pass. Will stop the tynes wanting to pull back into the previous pass. Also they are generally used prior to discing or rototilling
If I remember well enough from my youth growing up on the farm we used a turn plow to roll the dirt over and then a double set of disks with cultivators to make it a fine seed bed. Of course this was South Georgia black dirt with no clay. Think Vidalia onions. We use to pluck them out of the dirt and eat them like apples. Sweeter than some apples you buy today! Love your work here! Oh, btw, our tractors were way bigger than yours! 🤪
Whether I am right or wrong I don't know, but as I grew up, I was always told use the right tool for the right job. The Plow you are using is really more for digging deep and aerating the soil. Pulling the compacted dirt from way down deep. You would use a disc type plow for making furrows or rows for planting. The tiller is made for braking up the soil and allowing for the opportunity to get the weeds out of the way and also aerating the soil, but not as deep as the first plow.
A little weight on the front end helps keep the front tires producing traction, too. Sometimes the resistance on the three point can pull hard enough to take some weight off of the front end causing some loss of traction.
I run a APP 5 shank 60”. It’s a 66”, 7 shank I dropped 2 shanks off. In the right conditions, it’s an unbelievable tool. I’m the wrong, it is less than ideal. Chisel plows, at least this size, hate thatch. Cut the field short (the field in this video was fine there), burn the vegetation with gly, let it be at a minimum of 2 weeks. That little chisel will turn your field deep, one pass. Your times were just too far apart, the vegetation was just a bit too “green”. I made the same mistake using it last year. About put it on marketplace. Spoke with a farmer who chisels large scale…he gave me those tips (above)…I would t trade the thing for the world now. You also needed the soil a little bit less moist. Don’t be discouraged, this is a great tool. Just need a few tweaks. I’d say 8hp per shank is a bit closer to the need though. Great tool.
Why is it that moldboard plows for these subcompact tractors aren’t more prevalent? They are way cheaper than a tiller. Even though I have a beast of a tiller for my 1025, the Frontier 3049, and I love it, I would still love to have a moldboard plow. The cat 0 Brinley’s were really popular for all the garden tractors of the past, and I love seeing them in action. If nothing else, just for good old memories sake. Even most of those garden tractors had the option to mount a tiller, and many did, but many had plows too. Was it just a cost thing or is it because of the way farming has changed over the last two decades? I’d love to hear someone else’s input, especially if you have and use a traditional moldboard plow.
To a lot of us, plowing means using a moldboard plow to turn the ground over and bury what is on top. Then, if it is sod, or grass, a set of disc harrows to break it up. Makes a better mix of biomass and dirt.
We would call that a ripper with straight shanks or cultivator if you put on shovels. use the ripper to break up hard/rooted ground before moldboard or for moisture penetration.
I have a 7 tooth cultivator I used to use with my ATV. It worked pretty well but now I have tractor and tiller. I thought one day I may modify the cultivator and build a 3pt. It worked the ATV pretty hard. Tiller still wins.
Are there extra holes in order to install 5 "plows"? That would help in not having to make so many passes. I realize that the JD you were using might not have the power (or traction with those turf tires) but I have an L3901 with industrial tires and 4-WD so I should be able to pull 5 bottoms.
We used plows like this after the land had been traditionally plowed and disked. Basically using it for semi deep ripping or subsoiling. I have been looking for one for my 1025r as the 10 shank I have in my old equipment is a bit big 😂
You should be able to remove/unbolt shanks from your older model field cultivator to make it able to be pulled by your 1025r. Remove the outside shank on each side, to keep the pulling resistance even. Test it, and if it is too much for the tractor, drop 2 more, and try again. Mine has sets of holes acfoss the full width to allow me to reduce spacing between shanks too. The tool is able to be customized.
@@larryhasard3989 it’s possible to remove the shanks but the 10+ foot width of the frame and the fact it’s a category 3 - 3 point hitch precludes the 1025 as an option. I made the comment in jest.
I have the 9 shank, Cat 1, 84 inch wide version of this field cultivator and it only weighs about 500 lbs.. The commentor has a 10 ft, Cat 3 ripper. Thats a much heavier implement, and way too big for the 1025R.
@Kevin Too wide, too heavy and too tall as well. The 1025r rockshaft arms don’t have enough clearance to lift the implement. It’s amazing how many folks on here can’t discern comments made in jest. 😀
That implement is not designed to be a final seed bed preparation tool after you run it over with that you would want to go over it with a disc and break everything up and level it out a little bit better. I'm not sure if you could pull it but that would be better with two more rippers on it for the size it is that way there you wouldn't have to make so many passes. Is the spring tension adjustable on those seems to me the springs are a little weak.
I have allot of stumps and would love to till the ground. Any tips or tricks? Can I till the ground and try to dodge these stumps. I want to smoothe the earth some and eventually establish pastures not row crops. I feel like I would bend or break something. My box blade sacrifices are already bent up.
Looks like it can definitely get the job done. But it's going to be a lot of work and a bumpy ride. The products look like they're getting better and better. Another great video.
Excellent camera work. Watching from above it looked like if you had the three tines or shanks mounted on front loader and pulling a disc would be a nice set-up. It just looked like it was getting a little bumpy. Good luck, ps what drone and camera was used? Thanks 👍
May want to try decreasing working depth and increasing speed and possibly waiting for the ground to be a bit drier (but not completely dried out either) to get better results with the chisel plow. Personally I use a moldboard plow and follow that up with a disk harrow to break up the larger clods and how well each works can vary quite a bit on soil moisture levels and the working speed I can maintain. Haven't really used a tiller much since from my understanding breaking the soil/dirt into too fine (or too uniform of size) of particles can also cause problems or at least in the finer/clay-rich soils - which is I have to deal with so have a mix of clod sizes can be potentially be more helpful even it it doesn't look as clean/neat.
if you were to take the tiller to it first, or some sort of implement to break up the sod, then that tool would work really well. it would shatter the soil deep and allow for maximum root growth. the problem is all the sod on top rolls out in clods due to the grass roots. a moldboard plow is about all youd be able to get across that without disking or tilling it first.
Why would you plow a ground out of curiosity? I’m trying to learn more about farming just for educational purposes. This looks like its destroying the ground? Is it to help give the land nutrients or something?
The dirt dog would work a lot better in a more square field. Chisel plows work best if you can make your second pass at an angle to the first pass. We generally make our first pass at 30 degrees to the final rows we want to plant at.
do you ship to Alaska 99654, i can see that i would rather use the tiller for a field, but it looks ok for using it in the arena or for loosing manure in the field to clean it out or spread it
Personally, I use a 2 bottom plow (Craigslist ftw) then I come back with a JD 655 tiller for a nice seedbed. I did some testing and math which with my JD 4044M used less overall fuel as well as I used less seed to achieve great results
Ive never used a plow but NOT impressed. I till gardens for a side job, and if i left a plot looking like that, I don't think id get paid. Now I think a good comparison would be between a plow and disc. That would be a better match up in my opinion. Still looks kind of rough to run say a corn planter/seeder thru. Good video topic, i love seeing comparisons between different equipment.
My experience is those work really good with a disc harrow and a drag ,it's definitely not a finishing tool in my opinion. Still awesome video looking forward to the next one. I don't have a tiller yet but you'll be hearing from me when I do get one 😁
Man patience is a virtue and you probably should have waited a couple days for that field to dry a bit more and the results probably would have been a little differento
I'm not a big fan of plowing with the homeowner size machines. I have 60 HP tractor with 49 PTO HP and I am thinking of the 7 shank but only for food plots. You only need to turn the top few inches. That 21 HP is like the same size motor as my snow blower!😝It looks like your struggling as you start to rut the ground. Need a larger tractor. Try more shanks with that Kubota from your last video and i'm sure there will be a world of difference. These plows are great for turning in lime when you don't want to take the time with a rototiller. I always use my tiller towards the end for that smooth seed bed after I lime in the earlier months and I'm ready to spread some seed.
Courtney why didn’t you try a turning plow? It would have done a better job, smoother ride, and easier on the tractor. You then could use a tiller or disc to finish it out.
Probably not the right tool for breaking up virgin sod. Those big clods will be very difficult to break up if you allow them to get very dry. I would call your tool more of a field cultivator than a plow, field cultivators are not usually used as first tillage tools. A moldboard plow to turn the sod under to decompose would be better solution(old school) Adjusting the top link affects depth. A disc over moldboard plowing while dragging a harrow or rolling baskets to help with moisture retention. Usually moldboard plowing is done in fall, because of loss of ground moisture and to allow everything turned under to breakdown over the winter. Tilling may be your best bet with the tools you have available. It's a learning experience. When tilling you might even rig up a water lawn roller to a hitch on back of tiller to break up clods and develop a better seedbed.
the spring tooth plow does not do well in a sod type of area, never will. Going over it several times will help, but it will always be pretty rough and never become a good seed bed by itself. However, it is an excellent tool when used on previously tilled ground like last year's garden.
I am sure that 3 finger cultivator would have a use somewhere but honestly for plowing it looks like it just made a mess I would think you'd be better off with obviously a rototiller or is a cheaper option a set of discs or cheaper still a one or two bottom plow
Courtney, I believe you would have had an easier time with a mold board or bottom plow. You were ripping, a slightly different function than plowing. Plowing, you would have accomplished that in one pass. Love your videos. Keep up the good work.
Most farmers now use no till as plowing destroys the soils structure plus it turns up weed seeds. If you want to make a garden area just layer the soil with some type of organic matter like leaves, rotted manure compost, or wood chips then just add to it each year. The idea is to build on the top layer of soil similar to what is found in a forest. This is an organic way to farm as each year there will be less weed issues no chemicals are needed. For fertilizer check out making your own with the Jadam method. Have an organic farm and have not used any plows or rotavators in years they are just sitting in storage. Just saying done the plowing thing and found a better and more efficient way which uses less fuel, time, and better for the soil and environment.
Not sure I would say most, but it is definitely growing...that and minimum till. However, for small tractor owners, no till drills are an extremely expensive tool. Lightly working the top 2-3" works well for me. However, if it's a heavily compacted area, then deeper tillage may be required to loosen the soil.
No-till requires pesticides and herbicides! My farm is organic so I moldboard plow in the fall, rototil in the spring then cultivate in the summer with no chemical top spraying.
And another thing, it’s NOT meant to replace a tiller but if it went deeper, it would be great to use in front of the a tiller to help avoid creating a hardpan which a tiller does as the tines slide across the soil.
Correct, you'd need to disc or cultivate after plowing. It doesn't leave a prepped seedbed. I've never noticed any compaction or germination issues caused by the skid runners on my tillers.
Tillage 101 lol breaking sod will take multi passes and when going over something like you did you should start on a different swath or bit of angle so that way your tracks are not in the same place . Best thing for that sod now is to let it air out and get some sun to dry on the clumps of sod . I would even go over again with that ripper once its dried out good . Best way i break sod is to use a no till program and just knock down the sod with fall application of Roundup before frost . That ripper tool would work great in dirt thats been rotated and would do wonders where you rototill a lot since tillers will create a compaction layer .
Different angle would have been great if it were more than 16' wide. It got tilled, will be shown in the next video. No drying out this time of year. Rain, rain, and more rain and then it will not rain and turn to concrete :) This field sat idle for over 10 years, previous owner thinks it may have been closer to 20 years. Not sure how compacted it is, but drainage is poor.
A good used tractor (pre mid '80.s JD, Ford, MF) with 50 hp, ballast in the tires, and a two or three bottom plow using the same financial investment would tear that field up fast, one pass, 14-18 inches deep, put more weeds below the ground, and leave the field ready for disc harrowing or rototilling.
Field cultivators are not designed to produce a seed bed ready for planting, from a field with eastablished sod, even with multiple passes, each at an angle to your prior passes. I make passes at 30, 45, 60 and 90 degrees to my first pass, both to the right and left, when breaking new ground. Its a quick way to cover a big area. It will certainly break up the soil and sod, but the spacing between the shanks is too great to bust up the clumps. Needs follow up disking, likely several passes. On previously planted areas I use an X pattern, of 2 crossing passes. Field cultivators may be your only option for "plowing new ground" with a compact tractor, because the wheel spacing of compact tractors do not necessarily coordinate with moldboard plows. My NH 45 hp Boomer doesnt. Old row crop tractors had adjustable wheel spacings, to do this, new tractors dont. I would drive on top of every just plowed row, while plowing the next row. Compact tractors need towed plows, like the ones you see in vintage tractor plowing day videos, that can be offset. You should compare how deep the soil is actually broken up by each implement, after each pass. Ive never seen that reported anywhere, and that would be useful information The field cultivator can reach much deeper than a rototiller, breaking through deeper compacted soil layers, pulling up deeper roots, and improving water infiltration into the soil. The field cultivator can also break up rocky soil that you cant roto till. Think of the field cultivator as replacing the back breaking 4 tine digging fork, used when making a small garden or a flower bed. You cant make a new seedbed with that tool in an established grassed area, with just once over turning. Every gardening book tells you to remove the sod, before digging to prepare your seed bed, just for this reason. Once the sod is gone, and the soil dry enough, its much easier digging.
Correct, you need to run a tiller, disc, cultivator, etc over it afterwards. Not wide enough to criss cross here. Will do so on the next area which will be more square-ish
