Six Flags / Cedar Fair: WHICH Parks Are SAFE & New Coasters Coming! 

The Six Flags History video that you must watch... Will we see this type of new coaster expansion going forward? ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Cjmi3-ASoSY.html

Cedar Fair is still in charge of the new company, I believe they're using the SixFlags name because its more recognizable. They have also said that they're not changing anything name or operations wise, the meger is meant to keep the companies afloat and allow them to save more money every year.

For Branding, the Cedar Fair parks are likely to be named: “Cedar Point: A Six Flags Theme Park” “Carowinds: A Six Flags Theme Park” Not bad at all! Edit: didn’t realize Brandon says this in the video until I just watched now. Glad we had the same thought LOL

I think this is a brilliant move for both companies. We've seen similar success in 2017 when Bass Pro Shops acquired Cabela's, so I don't see why the same thing can't happen here either.

Season pass prices will definitely increase. Cedar Flags doesn’t sound bad and HQ will be in Charlotte

We live in the Charlotte area and Carowinds is our home park. We are taking a wait-n-see approach for now. We love how Cedar Fair operates its parks, specifically here at Carowinds. Six Flags is known for not taking care of their parks and I would hate to see our CF’s parks start getting run down. With CF’s owning 51.2% of shares, it makes me not worry as much. I’m praying that any changes that take place will be for the positive.

I hate parks using IP as a crutch. Its so lame especially the super hero stuff. Sad that people are so conditioned to sacrifice uniqueness and atmosphere for generic familiarity

Thanks Brandon, I appreciate your positive outlook on this merger and I think it could be a good thing in the end. Hopefully Cedar Fair protects their name brand and reputation.

I think Carowinds and SFOGA will become the two new experimental parks. They have the land, the flexibility and they both are in cooperates backyard. Not to mention these two parks are located in between Dollywood and Sea World and the Universal properties.

As long as the prices don't go up too much, I think this is great. I think Six Flags could use an upgrade in food, so here's a great opportunity for improvement.

Cedar Fair is in control of this entire merger they will be the captains of the ship, Richard Zimmerman The CEO/President of Cedar Fair will be the CEO/ president of the new company. Also the majority of the upper level financial, & executive positions are remaining in Sandusky Ohio for their headquarters💯

I think, in my opinion, the reason that Six Flags and Cedar Fair are merging is to better compete with SeaWorld, Herschend, and possibly Universal. SeaWorld has been putting a ton of money into their SeaWorld and Busch Gardens parks, and with Universal opening up their new Epic Universe park in a year and a half it will bring a lot more attention to thrill seekers. Now I do believe that Universal is the in-between when comparing amusement parks like Six Flags and Cedar to theme park destinations like Disney World.

Kings dominion better be safe. It’s my home park and my place of employment. I’ve been going to KD since I was a baby.

I cant wait for SixFlags Cedar Point Resort. Or 2 SixFlags Great Americas or SixFlags Kings Island.

Agree with the assessment on Over Texas. Its my home park, and while its far from a bad park, a little tlc from cedar fair management could take the park from good to great. It has a lot of good going for it (the original rmc and, in my opinion, the best coaster Schwartzkopf ever created to name a couple) and with a little love I think it could become one of the premier parks in the country. My only hope is that the upgraded experience doesn't increase prices too much. I'm a college student so one of the huge benefits of SFOT being my home park is the lower six flags price point. I guess we will have to wait and see!

Maybe too soon but... does this mean that we might see renewed relationships with coaster manufacturers? Especially those that may have fallen out with Cedar Fair or Six Flags?

Man I hope six flags gets some of that cedar fair money and use it to buy a giga. Whether it be from RMC or B&M. Having a giga coaster that close to my home would be a pipe dream.

Still competition: Bush Garden parks, Sea World parks, Universal parks, Disney parks, + many independent parks like Dollywood, Hershey, Silver Dollar City…. Etc. The competition is strong. CF + SF is going to be fine, IMO. I think your assessment are spot on, and I'm looking forward with some optimism!

I believe Over Georgia will be safe and stay in the new chain. They’ve been on a roll by getting 2 back to back coasters in a single year and has been getting a lot of love from Six Flags recently.

I’m excited to see what comes of this! Let’s stay positive!

3:50 MM actually had all coasters open for most of October for the first time in years.

This change might be a success story for both Six Flags and Cedar Fair, or could end in total disaster. Positives and negatives will be encountered along the way. Let's hope the best. I could see the Cedar Fair parks being mentioned as "a Six Flags Theme Park" or "a member of the Six Flags family", similar to the now-defunct AstroWorld in Houston, Texas from it's purchase from 1975 up to the mid to late 1980's.

😂😂😂 he's just joking about the "Six Flags Cedar Point" name he knows they will never put Six Flags in front of Cedar Point 💯

Six Flagging the Cedar Fair parks just sounds awful

I thought the day would never come, but its here and we have to accept it. I definitely am curious going forward what changes will come over the next few years, but it definitely gives early 2000s vibes, minus the overspending (hopefully)

This news is crazy. So the cedar fair name will be gone. Rip cedar fair name 1987-2023. I think this move will turn out good. I know there’s so many parks that people think that will just get abandoned in all of this but I would like to believe that wouldn’t happen. Also I still have my six flags legacy membership from years ago which I’m worried I might lose since the cedar fair guys are taking over. It’s so odd that six flags will own the cedar fair parks now.

Scrap the name top thrill 2 change it to the flash vertical velocity 😂😂

I agree with virtually everything you said. Regarding competition, at first I was also thinking that because of reduced competition there would be less investment. But then I realized that these parks don't compete against each other so much as they do the rest of the world in general for your entertainment dollar. Thinking of it that way, the competition remains the same. The biggest mystery as far as parks that are going to stay or get sold off is Six Flags America. That park has amazing potential. If the right investments were made there, It could become a major player in the theme park industry. But would it being so close to Kings Dominion, In this instance they actually would be competed against themselves. I think rather than being sold, one of these parks closes and their rides are distributed through the chain. And if that happens, I'm not convinced that SFA is the one that will close. SFA has by far the better location, in a massive population, whereas Kings Dominion is in the middle of nowhere with almost no supporting infrastructure nearby - Not to mention it's proximity to Busch gardens Williamsburg. However SFA would be much easier to clear out and sell off the land versus Kings Dominion. So to me this is completely up in the air

Omg the millennium force to Goliath joke dropped at the end of the vid was toooooo goooood lolololololololololol

Cedar Fair does as many bad things as Six Flags does? What? No. Other than that good video.

Great analysis. Thank you for adding some context and positivity to this for the people like me who are nervous about the whole thing.

The La Ronde will remain in the chain because the City of Montreal has experienced a population and economic growth and the La Ronde will potential to become nearer the top-tier park in the chain.

I can see some pro's and cons of this merger: Pro's: - This new corporation will now have much more buying power when dealing with coaster manufacturers on total costs of coasters, they will be able to negotiate multi coaster deals at the very least. - The ability to have a universal season pass for both parks. - This is something I consider a pro but something that SF has done (not for some time but still a possibility) is transfer coasters to other parks in the chain, I think this is a great idea to transfer less popular rides from main parks to smaller ones, the smaller parks still get a new ride and the coasters get to have another life. - The use of IP's from both parks - I would like to see SF/CF really have 2 large kid areas in each of there parks "Camp Snoopy" and "Bugs Bunny land" seems to be a great for families. - Hoping CF invests time to improve the SF operations and care of the parks in the SF chain. Con's - I really hope that CF is going to avoid the heavy use of Clones that SF seems to love doing, and considering this merger was to save money, I don't see this type of business stopping. - Since they are now are the main dog in town I will not be surprised of raising overall park prices . - The overall lack of competition - I just think rides like Kingda Ka and future rides like this will not exist in the future. What I mean is their is less likelihood of the these parks trying to one up each other with the same ride type. Neutral - The overall sale of some parks within each of the chains, what ever prediction you have I pretty sure there is a guarantee that some parks in both chains will be sold off in the near future. this is neutral in that if they are sold to a company that will actually have more of a focus and care to them it may be for the best. Please let me know of any others you people may think of pro or con would love to hear others thoughts.

Given they are doing this to save $. The parks that are not safe are the ones that currently are performing poorly and the new corp deems would not have a good ROI if they tried to bring them up to the level of those performing well. For use of the the IPs my thought is no reason to do one off renaming or even naming for new coasters. Makes more sense to continue the Cedar Fair trend to theme park areas. So I could see them retheming Kings Island action zone to DC Universe and retheming the rides to DC IPs while adding a new coaster and or rides also with the DC name.

so if you have a bad day in Cedar Point, do you called it “having a six flags day”

Michigan's Adventure will almost certainly stay in the chain so that Cedar Fair can prevent it from building up too much. Nearly half of Cedar Point's attendance comes from the Detroit area, and it is so much easier to market Cedar Point as a destination (therefore, more multiple-day stays from large families, which means extra moola 👀) than it would be for a park that is in the middle of nowhere in western Michigan. And as for the issue about lack of competition, most Cedar Fair and Six Flags parks are pretty darn far apart (with some exceptions). I don't think the investments they've been putting in have had much to do with pulling attendance away from other parks, since so few of their markets actually overlap. Rides are simply added to capitalize more on local population attendance rather than bring people in from other markets.

It'll be interesting if they change the name to Cedar flags as the company. Allso if they do sell off Six Flags St. Louis. I could see busch gardens coming in and buying it considering Anheiser bush factory is right there

I can also see St.Louis remaining with the new company as it's one of the original three but you're right Six Flags neglected it and the potential this park can bring.

Great insight as usual & now looking forward to more predictions. Your predictions have always been my favorite part of the channel.

One think I think they should do that will save money on re-theming especially for the smaller parks is rotating visits by the themed characters. So like month of June Peanuts Gang, July Justice League, august Loony Tunes. It could help boost attendance at smaller parks but still keep it fresh.

I disagree with Six Flags St.Louis not being safe!! I believe it is very safe and the reason why is the investments the chain has put into that park this past year and the upcoming new season!! I just don’t see them selling this park!! I do see them renaming the park back to Six Flags Over Mid-America though

I'll admit i was wrong, and the merger does seem to be going through (though the FTC could stop it). I am still concerned about this merger because i like to say competition breeds better products/services, while consolidation breeds lower (initial) prices. This merger isn't likely to give the main benefit of consolidation (lower prices) as CF and SF already have some of the lowest prices in the industry. The one cost saving feature i could see is a mega pass for all parks, but that is such a minority user base benefit. I will say, in terms of pros, the big one is SF parks getting major operational overhauls. Over the next 5 years i see the big focus of the new company being raising the SF parks to Cedar Fair quality standards in terms of staffing, food, park cleanliness etc. The downside being, i feel the Cedar Fair parks will get a little less investment in those next 5 years as the big focus will be on salvaging the SF parks. Which if feel will hit KI and Canada's Wonderland hardest as they seemed lined up as the next parks to get major overhauls. So i unfortunately don't think a Mach Extreme spinner is in the budget for Vortex's replacement. Which sucks.

I could see Six Flags New England, Frontier City, ValleyFair and Michigan being a package deal. I think New England would be the Piece to intise the offloading of the other three Darren Lake, SF America, Discovery Kingdom and St Louis easily manage once again by Primier Parks. My prediction Seaworld: Discovery Kingdom, New England Herschend: Frontier City, ValleyFair and America and Possibly Darren Lake or St St Louis. It would give them 3 parks close to Metro Area.

I guess this shows that Six Flags was on the way to failure and this was a way to keep afloat. Now that there's an apparent mega company between Flags and Fair, I don't know if this is going to prove to be the best move totally. **

I honestly don’t see them selling parks off, at-least not initially. If they’re smart, they’ll use this capital cushion and enhanced resources to first go in and overhaul the parks that have been left behind. Some of them have too much potential and local populous that need to capitalized by this merger. They’ve clearly maxed out the draw of their big parks and can’t compete with Disneys and Seaworlds of the world 1 to 1. Rather by owning parks in every market, they can act somewhat like a sports league and generate local revenue vs. the travel destination parks. For example, my home park is SFSL, the local market size and location should warrant a bit more effort. Rather they left that park behind ~2011 and only invested in top parks hoping they could compete. It didn’t work.

As far as the names of the parks go, I can see them dropping Six Flags completely when appropriate. Fiesta Texas, Magic Mountain, Discovery Kingdom - makes sense just to drop Six Flags. Now, for the parks where it's not appropriate (e.g. Six Flags Over Georgia) - maybe they come up with a new name entirely. Like Chattahoochee Park.

Sorry but I disagree about Dorney Park. The Feds will NOT allow two parks in the Philadelphia Metropolitan Area that are widely known as each others main competitor. They would much rather have Great Adventure, the second largest theme park in America, and of course with King Da Ka.

Cedar Fair and Six Flags were rarely in direct competition. Their main competition for most of their parks was always other regional parks and as always other non themed park entertainment options for people. People have limited time and money, so other entertainment options is always part of the competition. They aren't going to massively cut Capex and not give the most profitable parks the top 5 for Cedar Fair( Knotts, CP, KI, Wonderland, Carowinds) and the top 4 for SF(Magic Mtn, Great Adventure, Great America, Fiesta Texas) stuff. KD will also get its proportional share along with Over Texas and Over Georgia.

I'm still having a hard time with this, I think I'm gonna cry... 10 years of YT comment bashing on SO many channels about CP vs. MM, Top Thrill vs. KA, and I'm supposed to just "throw it all away"...omg.. After STEVE, The Boardwalk/Pavilion, the new Dragster...The AMAZING job they did with the new parades and "main stage", all the things they did to celebrate the 150 anniversary (which rivaled something even DISNEY would do), omg...If I come up to that Causeway, and I see a SF logo of ANY kind, that car is turning around.

Im scared about ka, that one of a kind roller coaster might get reimagined like dragster. Since we all know that Cedar Fair hates unreliable rides. All I hope is that El Toro and Ka stay.

I'm excited for my home park of SFOT...we haven't received a new roller coaster (Besides the first RMC of Texas Giant) since Titan in 2001...come on...SFOT is the original Six Flags park. They have the Cowboys, the Rangers, and all of these new hotels and attractions 10 minutes from the park...SFOT SHOULD be a destination park.

Cedar Fair took over Dorney Park and we're getting a new ride. They seem to take care of the parks.

Great, they have a monopoly on regional theme parks in North America. This is totally going to be great for enthusiasts 🙄

BAD...THIS will take me a LONG time to process...So with Cedar Fair having better rides and parks, the 150 anniversary of CP, (not to mention TT2), IT'S ALL supposed to ride under the "Six Flags" shingle(?!?!????)?? F that....Why couldn't they have AT LEAST called it Cedar Flags??

just a question, but how do you think this will affect the company's reputation with RMC and Intamin. Obviously Cedar Fair has distanced itself while Six Flags dives in head first on any project they can get from these companies. According to google Cedar Fair will own 51.2% giving them a majority vote. Does this mean Six Flags will no longer get along with these companies too? If so then we might see a huge change in companies like RMC and Intamin because they would have to satisfy the merger. Without the business from the merger, those coaster companies would go out of business!

They aren't going to randomly pick 1 ride to change to DC name. They would make an entire DC area with multiple rides and DC if it happened and that doesn't at all fit into Carowinds. A park like Carowinds has a regional theme that a lot of time and effort has been spent recently in enhancing, that won't change.

I'm not too sold on this idea. This eliminates competition

SFOG(SF owns 31%) and SFOT (SF owns 54%) They are partnership parks. The option to buy the remaining stake from the partners comes up in 2027 for SFOG and 2028 for SFOT. The cost to buy the partners out is about 281M for SFOG and 242M for SFOT. Under the partnership deal has to pay about 48M distribution to the partners, which is based on the parks performance, SF received a 38M distribution form the ops and gets am additional 3% of gross revenue fee for operating the park . Point being these antiquated deals SF had to make b/c of the bamkruptcy are something CF management which are the CEO and CFO in the merger don't do. I think they will buy out the partners.

Six Flags Over Texas Six Flags Over Georgia and Six Flags St.Louis are always going to be in the chain because they are the original three parks

I could see the six flags logo being redone to show that this is not the same six flags. Maybe even into the style of cedar fair’s logo to keep the parks on brand with each other

Corporate being in Charlotte will help Six Flags Over Georgia as well.

I think most names might not be changed. I think Darien Lake, La Ronde, Great Escape, and Frontier City might become more "Cedar Fair"-ish, mostly becuase their names don't contain "Six Flags"

I really hope they don’t sell off six flags St. Louis. As it being my home park they have probably the fastest operations I have seen on attractions. Hopefully if they don’t sell, they can put some new big coasters in which the park has been needing for a very long time. If they do get sold, I don’t really know who would wanna buy them. It’s not a big enough property or populated enough for universal or Disney to attempt to buy them. Herschend already owns a park a couple hours away so I would have no clue who would buy. In the end hopefully they don’t sell and start to invest more in the park

What will happen with Intamin? Because what I've heard is the Cedar Fair manager is in charge.

Apparently the new complany will be called "Six Flags" and Cedar Fair will hold 51% and Six Flags will hold 48%

Frontier City under Herschend makes a ton of sense and I would definitely visit that park if it happens.

I do feel concerned about the future of the smaller parks of the merged chain (Dorney Park, Six Flags America, Michigan's Adventure, Frontier City, Great Escape). Moreso Six Flags America because it's only 2 hours from King's Dominion and seems to be prime land area; being not that far from Washington DC. That and the operations at SFA are not that great from what I've seen/read. They are also surrounded by protected land so they really can't expand; but they could buy out a paintball place next door and expand.

Carowinds should leave Intimidator alone theming considering it’s Charlotte.

I think you keep CP KI KF CW With their current names just update the logos to include Six Flags Signature “flag pole”logo or just put “A Six Flags theme park” like with Great Escape. But others will be changed to Six Flags (Six Flags WOF, Six Flags Kings Dominion, Six Flags Valley Fair, etc…)

I’m very nervous as a Six Flags STL ride operator!! Be an interesting coming year!!

I hope New Englands safe

Zamperla's Kinda Ka 2 is coming

This just made me cry. I grew up in southeast Michigan and we regularly went to cedar point. Obviously it was awesome. Then we moved to Georgia and I quickly realized that not all parks are like cedar point! Six flags over georgia is awful. I just recently went back to cp this year and had a fantastic time. A few weeks later I decide to revisit sfog thinking it can't be that bad. They did their best to prove me wrong. I have had 2 miserable trips to sfog this year. Everything is poorly ran, food, rides, fast lane is horrible, costs are high, and general cleanliness is bad. I pray cedar point isn't ruined because of this.

Hope Michigan Adventures gets some love, they haven’t had a new coaster since Thunder Hawk

SFNE is my home park, i dont see it going anywhere. Its' a smaller park by cf and sfne standards, but given it's location, it draws crowds from ct, upstate ny, mass and rhode island. From an attendence standpoint, its actually considered a tier two park and is one of the most profitable in the chain. I always thought that it has such a charm to it that Six Flags does not exploit and unlock. I hope it gets the attention it needs.

I think this change will be massive. The reason is because people would by six flags passes for all parks, and another they would buy a cedar fair pass for all parks. The combined companies now I’ll have the tallest coaster in the world and tallest and fastest multi-launch coaster in the world. Now u get a pass to both.

Didn’t they say that the ips wouldn’t be crossing from the six flags parks to cedar fair?

Two separate cooperate cultures merging this is going to be bad

0:09 and even some parks outside of those chains

Frontier City can't be sold, it is a lease park from EPR just like Darien Lake.

I know that spooky szn is over but... could we see scarowinds for example become fright fest????

Nobody's answered my question yet... What if I have already pre-purchased the 2024 most-expensive Season Passes with all the benefits, meal plans etc for both Cedar Fair and Six Flags? Will this merger not affect 2024? Since the merger isn't expected to close until next summer. Will the season pass stuff for us enthusiast not be affected until the 2025 operating season, Brandon?

Maybe I'll start a go fund me to buy Cedar Point myself...

I’m optimistic on this move. I’d rather they work together than compete. There’s not much incentive to go to regional parks for your average consumer, and I hope this helps them create environments like the pre-COVID Cedar Fair.

Brandon, thank you for getting this information out there so soon! You were on top of this breaking news last night. I always enjoy your content. I was a wee bit surprised that they moved the HQ to Charlotte, NC instead of say KI. Carowinds is a pretty solid park though, and I would imagine they looked at geographical appeal and COL. Charlotte seemed to me to be a fun place to be when I went there earlier this year.

Effectively, this merger puts Hersheypark in the drivers seat of coaster competition in the Northeast. And apart from markets where Herschend and SeaWorld have major properties, there isn't much incentive for other parks in the combined company to spend $15M+ on a new coaster.

I don't think Knotts is safe. Or it is not safe as a thrill park. It has 2 working thrill coasters right now and a gimped ghost rider. That plus the delays in Montezuma, no signs of the giga, and the lack of up keep this year are pointing to being sold off like CGA was or it being pushed as a family park.

My predictions... 1.This shouldn't get antitrust approval, but it will. 2. Higher prices and less ride innovation from the new company. 3. Several under-performing parks will get the Geauga Lake treatment. 4. Intamin and RMC lose a major customer. 5. Universal, Sea World, and Busch Gardens will be the parks with the best new coasters in the next decade. 6. Zamperla Ka. Can't wait to look back on this in a few years.

I don’t think they should rename the bigger rides in parks like Cedar Point or Carowinds, Like Intimidator 305 or Intimidator at Carowinds.

Cool maybe they’ll rename Top Thrill 2. And if we’re lucky maybe reprogram the LSM to give us a respectable first launch.

I hope they improve the six flags parks, not ruin the cedar fair parks,

I have a question. If I memebership at six flags will be able to go all the cedars parks now? My girlfriend has a season park pass. Will that work all parks? I’m really curious about that at the moment

Will intamin still work on rides for six flags.

They aren't going to randomly pick 1 ride to change to DC name. They would make an entire DC area with multiple rides and DC if it happened and that doesn't at all fit into Carowinds. A park like Carowinds has a regional theme that a lot of time and effort has been spent recently in enhancing, that won't change. FYI, DC is a haggard IP, people are over it. SF has veeb figured that out as they have had less and less merchandise with DC stuff on it, while they still are foolishly still naming rides with DC.

They have a huge opportunity with SFA and KD in the same region, to ensure they get the people who would not drive to one or the other.

Cedar Fair has majority control. So cedar fair will still keep their names. As well as 6 flags keeping their names. There is not going to be mixed names. Cedar fair shareholders will get 1 for 1 shares from the old company. 6 flags shareholders will only get .58 shares for every 1 they owned of the old company. Cedar fair is the big boy on the block not six flags.

SF has gotten themselves into a bunch of antiquated deals that are not what CF really doesn't. Ideally they 1) EPR lease deals for Darien Lake and Frontier Ciry and for 4 other separate site water parks ay Oklahoma City, Spring Tx, Phoenix AZ, Concord CA These will likely be gone if they can get out of the leases early. These are low attendance, low pass price parks with low profit margins according to SF in the past, lower than the legacy parks. Lease Expire 2033 to 2037 depending on parks 2)LaRonde is leased from the City of Montreal, very low price point park--- Lease ends 2065--needs to go 3) Rockford Illinois leased water park from the city of Rockford---needs to go, adds nothing-lease end 2029 4)SF Mexico is leased,----they will likely keep it, lease expires 2024 5)Oxopaotex Mexico Water park - leased from Mexico government expires 2037/ 27 theme parks and 15 waterparks is too many mouth to feed,. Getting it down to around 20 parks and 10 waterparks would make it more manageable to give parks the Capex they need to thrive. Eliminate low price point parks with low margins and the lease parks except SF Mexico. Also parks like Escape & America should be sold.

Hopefully they reopen Geauga Lake! 😅😅😅

I see them combining being the only real way for them to compete with what Disney, Universal and SeaWorld are doing. Cedar fair did a pretty good job but they need to up it even more if they want to compete with the big dogs.

I actually don't like the idea of the overuse of DC names on Six Flags rides. It makes different rides seem like they are the same. And in your other video, you said that the DC, Looney Tunes, and Peanuts properties will remain. I have my doubts, and I wouldn't be surprised if the Shulz family eventually ends the arrangement once current contracts expire. And that would be unfortunate. This merger will just lead to less competition and higher prices. And yeah, some parks will be closed or sold.