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So We Had a Chat with Colossal Order & Paradox About Cities Skylines 2 

Biffa Plays Indie Games
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Let's talk about the meeting that myself, Biffa Plays, City Planner Plays & Overcharged Egg had with Colossal Order & Paradox about Cities Skylines 2. I think you'll find this one very interesting! In attendance were:
Luca Kling (Business Manager at PDX)
Sebastian (Producer at PDX)
Mariina Hallikainen (CEO at Colossal Order)
Hans Zenjuga (Creative Director at Colossal Order)
Many thanks to CO & PDX for organizing this very informative and productive meeting :-)
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➤Cities Skylines 2 - New Brewburgh Modded City:
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➤Cities Skylines 2 - Everything You Need To Know!:
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👓OTHER PLAYLISTS:
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20 май 2024

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Комментарии : 1,2 тыс.   
@VerTk23
@VerTk23 24 дня назад
if the simulation, the core game, is not fixed, no matter how many assets and detailing mods are added, the game will continue being a great-looking city painter, not a city simulator
@benhoffman8264
@benhoffman8264 24 дня назад
Exactly! That's why any talk about needing "more content" like biffa said here does not sit well with me at all. Content creators want more in game content but normal players just want the base game to not be broken
@JeffreyOller
@JeffreyOller 23 дня назад
Yep. It's just not acceptable for them to say it's gonna be a "deep simulation" if it's just going to be a city painter.
@marekkos3513
@marekkos3513 23 дня назад
I dont want to play a city painter.I want to play a game with good looking simulation , and economy system that is challenging
@jpbm4330
@jpbm4330 22 дня назад
@@marekkos3513 exactly, I want a challenge and be so good at it I can make it good looking. Also i was playing Manor Lords and came back to see this video and omg cs2 looks so bland. I thinks that another game will take it from here. Like CS took it where Sim City left.
@mkspind3l
@mkspind3l 22 дня назад
agreed meaning I will continue to not play its not why I bought it I dont care to just paint
@adarkerstormishere
@adarkerstormishere 25 дней назад
It's weird seeing rooftops and trees covered in snow but vacant lots and backyards devoid of it.
@Lilianne8
@Lilianne8 25 дней назад
Yeah, it's catching my eye too. Being a native of a snow-covered country for sometimes six months running (cough, Finnish winter 23-24, RIP), I was hoping for more realistic snow situations - and gameplay-wise problems to solve - as well. A really good winter theme, a DLC, whatnot would be the selling point for me. I've put in endless hours on CS1 but have never moved onto the new version because it just wasn't enough somehow. Enough ✨magic✨, perhaps?
@Lannachi
@Lannachi 24 дня назад
In my city where I was playing with snow I found myself just deleting large grass surfaces in parks and larger buildings so that they would get the default ground snow texture. It is a bit jarring the way it looks in the base game.
@sacb0y
@sacb0y 24 дня назад
@@Lilianne8 Any kind of dynamic snow accumulation for a dynamic scene is quite the challenge. It means every asset needs to be configured for it. I'm sure they'll keep working on it. It's improved a bit as it is.
@jaredlash5002
@jaredlash5002 24 дня назад
There are also the cars driving around with snow-covered windshields.
@gunnarragnarsson9563
@gunnarragnarsson9563 24 дня назад
@@sacb0yall the other indie games like manor lords, fabledom, sons of the forest and many other don’t seem to have problems with seasons. If you can’t do it properly they shouldn’t have made it an official feature in their trailers.
@mechtechpotato4249
@mechtechpotato4249 25 дней назад
I am glad that the Paradox team is engaging with the community to get the game into a state that it should have been in when it launched, and not just shutting down the studio. *Cough cough* take two *Cough chough*
@user-wq9mw2xz3j
@user-wq9mw2xz3j 25 дней назад
not the community. just some content creators.
@burtreynolds8030
@burtreynolds8030 25 дней назад
@@user-wq9mw2xz3jnot even just some, just creators they know they can win back over, biffa is only a few changes away from going back to promoting the game like before, I really like biffa but that’s just how these things play out
@brandongeltink
@brandongeltink 25 дней назад
@@user-wq9mw2xz3j are they not part of the community?
@nomadkeller8612
@nomadkeller8612 25 дней назад
The EMPORER still has no clothes! Cities 2 is simply just a painting program. The guts under the hood are still broken and the simulation doesn't react to infrastructure and mass transit and shipping in a logical nor meaningful way......still 7 months after release and the modders can't fix that, only painting details.
@toddblankenship7164
@toddblankenship7164 25 дней назад
@@user-wq9mw2xz3j the community simps on the tubers so it's where they need to focus
@aboriani
@aboriani 25 дней назад
I had CS:1 sitting in my library for a couple of years, but Biffa's city fixing videos are the reason I reinstalled CS:1 and for whatever reason, I was addicted like never before. To see him dealing and fixing with the same troubles I was running into in my own cities, made me want to get back into the game and test all of his ideas (yeah LANE MATHS, I'm looking at you). And then other youtubers came with their ideas, I learned about road hierarchy, how to build crazy interchanges that ACTUALLY made a difference in overall traffic, I learned how to use rail to move and spread goods to the rest of my city, the traffic mods, the assets... It was a sandbox where you could TEST your creativity rather than a simple city builder. And then CS:2 came along and NOTHING of the above makes a difference. You cannot test stuff, because you can hardly fail. It doesn't matter if a major intersection is clogged because the industry is going to function as nothing happened. CS:2 reminds me of one of those strange dreams, not a nightmare, not a pleasant dream either, where anything makes sense, you think you are controlling the story of it, but in the end it just a distant mix of memories of your past experiences stitched together by a sleepy brain.
@MatteoBucci95
@MatteoBucci95 24 дня назад
I had a very similar path to yours, cant agree more on everything you said!
@krokodilov00
@krokodilov00 24 дня назад
Yeah, exactly the same with me too!
@PlayaWebDesign
@PlayaWebDesign 24 дня назад
Yes, yes, yes, and yes.
@PsychoWedge
@PsychoWedge 23 дня назад
Yep. Biffas City fixer videos are what got me into CS1 too. And I bounced off of CS2 the moment I realized I can't really fail.
@unclespongehead
@unclespongehead 22 дня назад
I'm a Mac user and don't have CS2 as an option. I went back to CS1 after a long binge of Civ VI. I'm good at CS1 and I enjoy it very much.
@der.Schtefan
@der.Schtefan 22 дня назад
It's so sad. In 2013 they rescued us from the Sim City 5 debacle, just to become the villains themselves, in the very same way.
@speedbrake22
@speedbrake22 20 дней назад
I think they just got lost in that they wanted to do everything and the result was a whole lot of nothing. Not really a city painter for those who like that, not really a hardcore city simulator for others. It is as if they had too many meetings and then they wanted to satisfy everyones opinion. Like how a camel is a horse designed by a committee
@johntaylor2433
@johntaylor2433 20 дней назад
Two words…. Scope. Creep.
@jonleibow3604
@jonleibow3604 20 дней назад
With C:S1, they made some changes to their already-existing Cities In Motion series to make it a city builder. With C:S2, they decided to reinvent the wheel for some reason and bit off more than they could chew.
@theatheistpaladin
@theatheistpaladin 20 дней назад
At least there is no online only drm for single player.
@TheCloudhopper
@TheCloudhopper 20 дней назад
At this point I'm fairly certain that CO aren't the major issue here. Is the project more complex than they anticipated? Probably, yes. But the driving force behind the debacle here seems to be Paradox. Look at their recent track record, Vic3, Lamplighters League, ST:Intinite (and frankly my hopes for V:BL2 are low as well). C:S2 falls squarely into that pattern. Rushed out the door to meet quarter report goals or something like that. Paradox's focus has clearly shifted away from good games, sustained by regular DLC releases. Something that i loved about their games for over a decade.
@Ketraar
@Ketraar 25 дней назад
Games are hugely complex and while I understand Biffa's "priority" as someone that does a lot of city landscaping, I hope Colossal Order doesn't get the wrong impression that the management part of the game is less important. Personally much rather have their focus be in game mechanics then assets. Sure assets are great to make beautiful cities, but I need the management side much more and CS2 has a lot of potential on that side that still needs a lot of love. I guess this is where it gets hard, as everyone and their dog may have slightly different consideration what they think is important. I'd argue that the simulation part, which includes the challenges mentioned in the video about traffic and production chains, etc. are crucial for the city build part. But again I recon my manager heart bias.
@TheIrishAlchemist205
@TheIrishAlchemist205 25 дней назад
Same - it's city sims that I miss, not the diorama of it all.
@glennmiller1290
@glennmiller1290 25 дней назад
I agree I dont really care yet about new assets until the core simulation has been sorted and working correctly as I dont want to play a city painter like many of these CC.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
Don't worry, we discussed that there are all sorts of players and the sim side of things, including more of a challenge and things working as they should do was very high up the list. As much as I can sort of ignoe the sim being what it is at the mo, I 100% want it working correctly so I can enjoy the game even more.
@Matt-sl1wg
@Matt-sl1wg 22 дня назад
Ya every time I hear commentary about adding "more content" I shudder a little bit. The "simulation" as it stands right now is just an aesthetic demo while all the actual mechanics continue working as if the city was a well-oiled machine. I'm particularly a fan of the traffic management, and I was hoping they'd clean up the traffic simulation. I remember my city getting demolished by a corpse pile-up because my hearses couldn't get around the city until I fixed some intersections and added some alternate routes to get around. Instead the visual traffic is pretty much exactly the same (janky lane changes, anyone?) and if you have a huge traffic backup it doesn't even matter. It's just a visual representation while the mechanics are handled in the background as if nothing is wrong.
@darkhymn
@darkhymn 19 дней назад
The first game wasn't really mechanically interesting, except in all of the ways you had to work around its failings. The water flow was broken, so you had to work around it. Traffic was broken, so you had to work around it, but systems depth? Absent. Surface level abstractions. This game is just a direct continuation of the shallow, slipshod mess we had before, but shallower and more slipshod.
@muhi4u
@muhi4u 24 дня назад
I don't really see what the sense of this meeting was. They now have like 8 month of community feedback on steam, reddit, etc. You said yourself that none of your feedback came as a surprise. We want to see change, big fixes and content. To me, it sounds like a playable CS2 is still years away. It was just oversold way too much before release. If it was released as a beta the community would have been more understanding. But man, look at the snow that is just pure white colour and then look at the snow at Manor lords. Look at the way it dissolves in spring. Why can one guy do such a better job then 30 people?
@stuffofnitemares6161
@stuffofnitemares6161 21 день назад
From my take on the meeting, this was about priorities. They’ve gotten firehosed with negative feedback and they’re trying to put it in order of priority so they can fix the game issues in the correct order.
@einarcgulbrandsen7177
@einarcgulbrandsen7177 20 дней назад
Manor Lords is impressive even if it's only in early access.
@aaronhedgesmusic
@aaronhedgesmusic 20 дней назад
Sometimes it’s the fact that 30 people are involved. It’s. A publicly traded company. The precious paradox Release was also not successful so it’s clear that the ceo was probably under a lot of pressure to bring a financial win so he rushed to releases. We also saw it with lower quality dlc for stellaris as well. I hope that they can turn it around. Otherwise another firn will have to create something better
@christopherr.561
@christopherr.561 20 дней назад
To get 3 large content creators doing free advertising for them.
@wck
@wck 18 дней назад
@@stuffofnitemares6161 the 'correct order' should not be dictated by content creators. Their priorities are different from the wider playerbase, because they are focused a lot on making aesthetically pleasing content. The regular players want a game that is engaging to play.
@nealjroberts4050
@nealjroberts4050 25 дней назад
Thank you kindly. It sounds like a productive meeting. Especially as they included people familiar with both city painting and city building styles of play.
@Muspellheimrr
@Muspellheimrr 17 дней назад
is this a joke? did mommy drop you?
@nealjroberts4050
@nealjroberts4050 17 дней назад
@@Muspellheimrr How much attention have you missed kid?
@TheAurgelmir
@TheAurgelmir 24 дня назад
The biggest setback I think the sequel had was indeed in the parks. You'd think they'd pick back up the idea of parks being zones from the first game, and improve on it. Instead we are back to "square" Heck, the "industries" things you can draw out. They are a good basis. Just let us populate those with special buildings inside it more. To make it look like it's not just a ground texture.
@arturbuchhorn
@arturbuchhorn 14 дней назад
I personally hated the zones. Including all the other DLC that they later added that used the system.
@vincewilson1
@vincewilson1 7 дней назад
Amen to that!
@Nicuju
@Nicuju 25 дней назад
Thanks for the update on whats going on Biffa.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
You're welcome :-)
@Chartranos
@Chartranos 24 дня назад
What I understand listening to you is that they are doing the research work that they should have done way before starting development.
@kaboodlefish
@kaboodlefish 22 дня назад
Not really, because as Biffa says, they knew everything that the three of them told them. So the research had already been done. Buuut, it was largely worthless for the devs, some weird excuses were made, and there's no concrete output from it. So.. mostly just seems like a PR exercise to try and made everyone happy by just wasting a few hours, before all going on a big summer holiday for no apparent reason. Dub.
@chegu071
@chegu071 21 день назад
This is why I don't have any patience for any of this. Great that the RU-vid guys want to do something but the developer is only doing this because they've been called out trying to flog something they knew damn well was dogshit for a crazy price. Cities franchise is dead.
@2639theboss
@2639theboss 21 день назад
@kaboodlefish Oftentimes when dealing with bloated corporations, its not enough to just know what needs done and how. You have to pitch it, justify it in a war that it convinces numerous layers of management it will create a financial return, and then once theyve signed off on whatever bastardized version youre left with, now you have go back from the beginning and convince all the departments to actually implement the idea over all of the other things they already have to worry about. Its not enough for the art department to say "We know players want more map biomes and building variation." Even if theyre right. That seems like its going on here.
@findle70
@findle70 21 день назад
@@kaboodlefish In the EU summer holidays are mandatory for companies, esp entertainment companies. Usually not a option.
@stuffofnitemares6161
@stuffofnitemares6161 21 день назад
The holiday is mandatory by law. They have no choice.
@dpaws6325
@dpaws6325 25 дней назад
I agree with the traffic fixing and turning vehicle despawning off. It's one of the things I really enjoy in CS1. I'm glad you brought that up.
@iGoosE
@iGoosE 24 дня назад
I think you nailed it when you said "the challenge is gone", referring to traffic and industry. That's definitely what made the game not last for me since there's no way to fail. I really liked the challenge of building but that broke traffic somewhere and then you had to figure out a way to make it work. For me detailing has always been secondary. Like, when you have a district that's working properly and you know you don't have to fix it for a while - then I'd do detailing to make it feel nice.
@Zemalf
@Zemalf 24 дня назад
Now that you listed the things, I realized why I didn't feel like playing CS2, but loved CS1 - traffic and solving traffic challenges. That's it. My cities look the same, I rarely detail anything, I just make them functional and optimize traffic (including pedestrians and cyclists, and public transportation). I get the fulfillment from having "perfect" traffic in a city of 100000 cims. When CS2 gives me that feeling, I'll be playing it.
@Baulderstone1
@Baulderstone1 24 дня назад
On a related note, when I played CS1, I tried not to plan to far ahead. When I started with a small town, I built it to be a small town rather than laying it out in preparation to be a sprawling city. Not only did it give more realistic cities, but the "mistakes" I was making in the early game created interesting challenges to overcome as the city got bigger. Whenever I began optimizing for a big city from the start, I often got bored.
@dandomine
@dandomine 25 дней назад
They should have a mode where stuff costs as much as in real life. So to build a mile of highway, you'd have to spend 5 million credits... I'm sure this will be quite the challenge.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
Welcome to episode 456 of my let's play. Today we might even see our first road finished 😅
@Limskjordan
@Limskjordan 24 дня назад
I agree with this actually. This sounds like a fun challenge. Makes the loans worth using.
@jdjenk04
@jdjenk04 24 дня назад
I think there’s a mod specifically for increasing difficulty where the money cost for things have been increased a substantial amount.
@MerkwuerdigerHannes
@MerkwuerdigerHannes 24 дня назад
reinvent the zone demant systtem in that same breath. - not a colored bar is rising with time but you get money from investors to build housing, industrial and commercial areas. make contracts with the cable company and stuff :) the next level of the "finance district dlc" in cs1
@nekophht
@nekophht 23 дня назад
In that case, they'd need to have an "apply for grant for " option to pay for that type of thing. Something that you don't have to pay back, but is only spent on stuff from that category. :D
@JenMaxon
@JenMaxon 25 дней назад
Interesting Biffa - I'm indeed hoping that the game is going to improve like CS1 did. Thanks to you, Egg and CPP for doing the interview
@toddblankenship7164
@toddblankenship7164 25 дней назад
CS1 Vanilla is trash, the mods are the only reason its playable. I learned that lesson with CS1 so I'm still waiting to buy CS2 and it's almost there.
@caneighdianjake8439
@caneighdianjake8439 24 дня назад
@@toddblankenship7164 I wouldnt say trash (especially when you consider its city-building predecessor was SimCity 2013), but the vanilla definitely pales in compariaon to a modded version. That is why I am surprised CO didnt prioritize mod tools and mod support. PDX, asset editor and map editor should have been available on Day 1.
@AEB1066
@AEB1066 22 дня назад
Paradox can't sell 100 DLCs if modders provide the content for free.
@caneighdianjake8439
@caneighdianjake8439 22 дня назад
@@AEB1066 Oh, Im well aware that Paradox revels in its DLC-heavy business model; I do own Stellaris, HoI4 and EU4. I still think that for CS2, both dlcs and mods can coexist. It worked with CS1.
@UrbinoZokin
@UrbinoZokin 21 день назад
@@caneighdianjake8439many of the mods and assets I loved about CS1 were QOL type mods. The dlc should be there to add new mechanics (industries, etc) that would be difficult to impossible for a modder or small mod team to implement.
@essexexile
@essexexile 24 дня назад
The way Biffa speaks, putting things into categories, his ability to absorb information and pass that on to us and that he had a spreadsheet for traffic fixes, I’d say he was definitely a manager or senior manager in a previous life.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 24 дня назад
Well... ☺️
@nicrademeyer3576
@nicrademeyer3576 25 дней назад
Thank you agreeing to take part in this, it is good to know knowledgeable people took part in it. One thing to add to the list, while fixing the zoning, add the tool to manipulate zoning as well (Same as in CS1), basic add/remove/one side/both sides.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
That was mentioned too, by CPP iirc 👍
@BootedTech
@BootedTech 25 дней назад
I'm waiting for node controller, and traffic manager. Intersections in this game need a mod to not only make them look better, also to build a better traffic network. I hate seeing vehicles travel in one lane and then switch the other lane right before they make a turn. It ends up with all vehicles doing this blocking both lanes when they cant turn.
@jeffmiesen
@jeffmiesen 25 дней назад
There is a lane connections mod available.
@pudd1nG
@pudd1nG 25 дней назад
Sadly it seems like the traffic, or at least their destinations are so random or illogical that using lane connections mod just brings to light how broken the simulation is and how often traffic is de-spawned or how terrible peoples houses vs workplaces are determined.
@jakecole7447
@jakecole7447 25 дней назад
@@jeffmiesen Do you have one that also is able to manage roundabouts ? the TMPE successor (i think its Traffic manager) doesnt allow it currently and tbh everything but roundabouts works pretty fluently after the updates. no more do cause a 40 km traffic jam cause i used a left hand exit lane.
@jakecole7447
@jakecole7447 25 дней назад
@@pudd1nG see my other comment, not really no.
@troyskolrood8144
@troyskolrood8144 24 дня назад
You just described real life traffic in Vancouver!
@charlesingram9471
@charlesingram9471 25 дней назад
You just reminded me of something else. So the crosswalk situation. The remove crosswalk function removes crosswalks from an entire half length of a road if done at a junction, removing the crosswalk at the other end removes crosswalks from the entire road, then you cant place a crosswalk in the centre because the remove crosswalk function overrides you trying to. This is because the node lengths are now longer so you physically cant in built up areas remove crosswalks from junctions and have the crosswalks in between junctions like you would have sometimes irl. This is a simple fix just allowinjg path crosswalks to override the remove crosswalks function, or somehow make the remove crosswalk function only remove the crosswalk itself instead of banned the entire road from having them.
@salty457
@salty457 24 дня назад
IF there was one fix Paradox could make immediately for me it would be to have my cims use my parks. Play soccer, run the track, bring their dogs, walk through the plazas, watch a show... instead the only activity is a trash can fire and some tents.....
@Matt-sl1wg
@Matt-sl1wg 22 дня назад
Sounds like a realistic representation of a city park these days, actually.
@TheAurgelmir
@TheAurgelmir 24 дня назад
To be fair. It was - for me at least - mods that made C:S1 fun playing. Which is why I find it odd that they didn't go through the most popular mods on Steam Workshop and go "okay, let's make sure these are part of our base game" And then also include at least the highlights of the expansions from the original game. Like industry. The current C:S2 industry feels like it's a placeholder for something they'll sell us down the line... at least C:S1 industries was "something" that felt intentional at release.
@Dethflash
@Dethflash 23 дня назад
I wanted moved it mod and traffic manager built into the base game for C:S2.
@jonleibow3604
@jonleibow3604 20 дней назад
I would have been happy with C:S1 with the best mods incorporated, and optimized for better performance.
@michaelconroy315
@michaelconroy315 19 дней назад
They did not carry anything over from CS1 because then they could not make that content into a DLC to charge us later. As for workshop mods, why put in the work when they know the community will do it, hell why even do the work on the base game for that matter just put out a POS and then just talk about fixing it but never actually doing it.
@mehowme
@mehowme 18 дней назад
​@@michaelconroy315And yet, the game didn't have official mod support on release. TBF, what we have now mod-wise is still terrible. The idea seems great, but doesn't really work. Now that I think about it, that's the perfect description of CS2
@konrad1428
@konrad1428 25 дней назад
Thanks for being community's ambassador and articulating our problems.
@Jake88193
@Jake88193 25 дней назад
Seconded, thank you Biffa!
@gihanprabash
@gihanprabash 25 дней назад
Biffa is the worst person to be a community ambassador for this game. This is the guy who said they're underselling the Beach properties DLC lmao.
@Jake88193
@Jake88193 25 дней назад
@@gihanprabash I wasn't aware he said that but nonetheless, Biffa cares about the game and the community and is doing all that he can to move things in the right direction. He isn't the *only* ambassador to the game/community and is free to have his own opinions. I appreciate his work in gathering the community's desires, presenting them directly to CO/PDX and then making a lengthy detailed video on what occurred during the meeting. Cheers!
@jim99ful
@jim99ful 25 дней назад
took him a bit of time to get there but glad that the penny finally dropped
@Percebob
@Percebob 24 дня назад
He isn't doing that for you, it's his way to make money.
@thasr81
@thasr81 24 дня назад
I truly hope they add bikes as part of the base game and not as a DLC, cause at this point they ran out of good faith to pull off something like that.
@mrgooglethegreat
@mrgooglethegreat 17 дней назад
Most of us couldnt care less about bikes and bike lanes. It should be a DLC. We're building New Amsterdam ....not Amsterdam lol 😉
@ValentineC137
@ValentineC137 7 дней назад
@@mrgooglethegreat "Most of us" 0 likes
@2KXMKR
@2KXMKR 24 дня назад
In my brutally honest opinion the game should still be early access at a reduced price. Sorry, but if they're still talking about patching this and fixing that seven months after release then simply the game wasn't and still isn't complete. Long gone are the days that you bought a finished game on a CD that didn't need fifteen patches to "fix" something. The gaming industry at the moment, to be perfectly blunt, is on its arse. Developers have become so comfortable with "Release now, fix tomorrow" and it's a complete joke at this point. To quote someone that I've long forgotten: "You wouldn't buy a car today and have them come out to fit the seats next month"
@mikey22355
@mikey22355 День назад
I don’t understand why more people don’t understand this. It’s almost like they like paying money for a broken product just to follow along with their favourite youtuber. Or its younger people who have never known any different as it seems to be the norm now. People saying they’re doing a good thing by trying to fix it, but that’s only so they can push a load of dlc that could of put into the base game anyway.
@Gesteppie
@Gesteppie 25 дней назад
One thing I've noticed about the different style of gameplay with people is that it seems to be City Painter versus City Simulator. CS2 seems to be *currently* the base for a City Painter, because as you mentioned, a city can just grow with only a single pedestrian access. The income flow is hand held by government subsidies, removing money management. Traffic doesn't matter, it's there, but has no economic impact. CS2 should be capable of both, because both are fun!
@nomadkeller8612
@nomadkeller8612 25 дней назад
The EMPORER still has no clothes! Cities 2 is simply just a painting program. The guts under the hood are still broken and the simulation doesn't react to infrastructure and mass transit and shipping in a logical nor meaningful way......still 7 months after release and the modders can't fix that, only painting details.
@rodimcgeesums633
@rodimcgeesums633 25 дней назад
Absolutely! It’s still primarily the reason I have SC4 still on my steam library. Because it was an engaging and challenging simulation to realistic growth and expansion. CS1 definitely did better with traffic, supply, and logistics management.
@TheIrishAlchemist205
@TheIrishAlchemist205 25 дней назад
CS has _always_ been a city painter (maybe a traffic manager sim) sold as a city sim. There just isn't enough simulation in it to make it so - like @rodi said above, look at SimCity. Maxis did SO MUCH (check out some of the deep dives into how the simulation works!) to make crime, education, healthcare, wealth, land value -- all the things, mesh and work well and create a complex, in-depth simulation. So much so it often broke at times because it was so complicated (like the infamous commercial demand bug iirc). THAT'S what I want, and I DO think CS, especially CS:2, is capable of that! It just seems like they don't want to do that - which is fine, if so. But don't sell it as a city builder/manager/sim. I definitely want to do both, but it takes a lot of WORK to do a simulation right, which is the thing I don't think they want to put the time into. I miss Will Wright. :/
@MaddJakd
@MaddJakd 24 дня назад
​@@TheIrishAlchemist205 not sure what you mean. All the later DLCs for CS 1 made it clear they were testing the waters with how hard of micro/macro managing folk were down for. Don't confuse "the current state of the game" with "they don't want to." This isn't just the first game with a few settings tweaked. The version of Unity this is built on =/= the version the first game was built on. This all takes work. Far more than most of the community has any interest in grasping, as well as more than most publishers these days seem interested in either, even though their precious bottom lines depends on a resonably finished and proper product being delivered.
@nlmnx5763
@nlmnx5763 24 дня назад
i dont know what you all mean by single pedestrian access. i tried to make a town without road access and nobody can move in, and no businesses can grow because it gets no employees.
@tosspot1305
@tosspot1305 24 дня назад
Genuine question.. If they said they were really not happy in the condition it released, then why did they go ahead and release it anyway?
@jaubury
@jaubury 22 дня назад
Because the publisher told them to.
@AEB1066
@AEB1066 22 дня назад
Paradox had just released a different disasterous game and needed to boost its quarterly revenue to assuage investors and so they pushed CS2 out months if not years early.
@aaronjohnson2215
@aaronjohnson2215 21 день назад
Exactly. Million dollar question.
@Sw4lley
@Sw4lley 24 дня назад
I will keep waiting on that game until I can get mods and play the game without having to do a paradox account just for them to be able to siphon data they just do not have a right or need.
@marshalljones4928
@marshalljones4928 25 дней назад
CS2 needs to have modular building mechanics. This can be utilized into service buildings, supply chain and factories, consumer buildings such as shopping malls, airports and stations. Can have different styles and shapes cater to different peoples tastes. Modders and asset creativity can jump on this idea and flurish it. Thx
@japes7
@japes7 25 дней назад
They have modularity.. I think it's something that can with time be expanded, like you said with a shopping mall, maybe signature building, but then have upgrades, but maybe this should be based on maybe customers or profit instead of just money you have in the city.
@Sabamonster
@Sabamonster 23 дня назад
I think they need to completely stop worrying about 'adding' anything. They need to fix the simulation - full stop. As it stands right now, none of your decisions matter, which removes the entire point of playing for a vast majority of the people that enjoy these games.
@Leon-zc4ef
@Leon-zc4ef 25 дней назад
I'm posting this with no hate and please take it as the constructive observation it is intended to be. I bought, pre-ordered, CS2 because you, and CPP, were so positive about it in the build up to its release. There was no indication despite hearing how you'd got to experience the game play ahead of times of the problems we've since had. While I'm sure there are lots of very valid reasons for this, the state CS2 was shipped has in my eyes tarnished yours and CPPs impartiality of the game and while I really do appreciate your content and the updates in this video I hope you can see how their delivery or lack of, undermined your status as a brand champion of the game. I really do hope that the game improves so I can feel you're more than a paid voice piece. (I use that phase very loosely but hope you understand where I'm coming from. To give a little more insight, recently you played Manor Lords. Before the CS2 release just watching you say it was good would have been enough to toggle over to the Steam store; this is how much I valued your opinion. This time I spent several hours looking for other creators to see if they'd had the same opinion of the game as you before buying it.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
I appreciate how you feel and thanks for explaining in a reasonable way. I do have a pre-written answer to this. I'll paste below and hopefully ammend it in a way that fits your nice comment 😀 "Prior to release, we were told we had a beta version. Beta usually means feature complete but not 100% bug free or final performance. We expected a lot more to get fixed and better performance before release. Our initial 3 videos were all in the beta version, and we were told not to discuss performance. Why would we as we were told it is the beta version. Also, once it was released, I personally didn't have performance issues, until weeks later, when I tried to fix a viewers 250k pop city (and it was all in the video). But by then, CO had already publicly admitted performance issues and that they were working on them. I didn't hide anything and I've spoken about performance and bugs as they come up in my videos many times." Hope that makes sense. 👍
@Leon-zc4ef
@Leon-zc4ef 24 дня назад
@@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines It does make sense and thank you for taking my comment in the way it was intended. For your British city, please try and find an asset for Luton's football ground, Kenilworth Road. The world needs to see how wonderfully eccentric our love of football (soccer) and town planning can be :)
@raymondrogers3929
@raymondrogers3929 22 дня назад
​@@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines I hope you brought this up with CO/paradox. Their conduct puts your (and others) reputation on the line by being dishonest. 1. People were excited about this title. 2. RU-vid creators fannned the hype. 3. Consumers became the bag holders. Luckily I waited. Ive been burned too many times with disappointimg purchases. Heck, I had a Chimichanga today that was sugar laden.
@pcsproshop8972
@pcsproshop8972 24 дня назад
I'm super glad you were involved in that conversation! These past few years, I have dedicated a lot of time & money into gaming. Games that I loved~ only to be met with disappointment after disappointment. I'm sure I am not the only one, as evidenced by the community's response. This can be a learning experience, the unfortunate, down-side is that, no matter how companies try to "smooth things over" it all still "feels icky". Like we are in a perpetual state of being taken advantage of. That feeling will not just go away by talking about it. Where money is involved, there is very few second chances given, if ever. I can forgive a friend, how can I forgive someone (thing) that tells me, they understand, yet would make me pay for another chance??? What chances could be expected??? So, yeah, you're right. apologies are no longer an option. that would be just as useful as complaining about a community reacting horrifically to a highly anticipated thing, that was as broken as CS2 was at launch. This is the way things have been for a while now, while CO & Paradox are not to blame for these trends, they ARE culpable for following suit. That is an NOT innocent "aw shucks" moment to us, it is the trend that makes all customers tools & all business good as long as both are profitable. That is what we are all angry about. AS we should be... CO/Paradox, if you are honest with yourselves, what IS your goal here??? To make customers a product that will make them happy, or is it to make money on a product that you KNEW would NOT, to meet financial goals? This has been asked before, and there is still no answer, which generally indicates more truth than fiction. I dunno, I really don't like feeling harsh, and have a very low threshold (these days) for consistently feeling more exploited than gratified. there is never going to be a dollar amount that will erase that feeling. It seem too much to expect that there are still companies left that actually build a product that isn't about profit over function. anyway, more wasted time writing to an para-social entity that can effect my mood. on to the actual lawn... Thanks again Biffa, for the forum to express these "feelings". We appreciate your commitment to CS2 & to change.
@octagonstride491
@octagonstride491 24 дня назад
Great video Biffa! For me, the way the emergency vehicles work when responding is odd. One problem is that my city has great fire coverage, but still other city fire trucks are responding. Also, if 2 houses are on fire, the 2nd house burns down cause the fire truck won't go around to get to it. They also always get stuck in traffic, making the lights and sirens pointless.
@mrgooglethegreat
@mrgooglethegreat 24 дня назад
This game just needs to run like water with 2 million sims on any system. It needs the train station assets. A little more land still. Differing service buildings ....i agree. And a new improved Airports DLC. Then im quiet and playing everyday for the rest of my life
@noname-lp3mu
@noname-lp3mu 25 дней назад
An idea for making the progression more challenging or better realism (with differing settings that affect cost multipliers and or when government funding starts to run out), you could have federal funded buildings that provide a basic coverage but it gradually gets more expensive as you level up (for power water and sewerage, it could have a base to cover excess at a cheap rate then ramps up so you can’t just rely on outside sources), to prevent that you can upgrade it to one of the related basic unlocked service buildings, i.e “Rural practice” upgrades to the “Clinic”, “Sherifs office” upgrades to the small police station, “volunteer firefighters” upgrades to small fire station, “Small refuse station” could upgrade to the garbage, “Funeral home” could act as a storage/ export instead of having to place so many crematoriums (leaving the option open to level them up/ upgrade them for higher capacity), i also feel there should be a basic council office that lets you have some control over lower level edicts or such and maybe they get upgraded so they are placed and have influence over suburbs/ districts (naturally on a more “realistic” and/ or harder setting). Not sure how hard that could be to implement but it could help.
@SynthLizard8
@SynthLizard8 24 дня назад
Well you know what game studios are like when they say they "Hear the feedback" and "We're listening", it doesn't necessarily translate in to action.
@MsBabyProducts
@MsBabyProducts 24 дня назад
Biffa's Fix it series is the reason I started playing Cities Skylines
@nickcoles518
@nickcoles518 24 дня назад
The “we only have 30 devs” argument really drives me up the wall. I do 100% understand that, but they took some huge sales on release. They want to continue to support those 30 devs through DLC’s right? In that case, if they want to secure future revenue they could at least hire in 20/30/50% increase ( 6/9/15 people) in devs on a temp contract basis to, at the very least, bug squash. That would at least show some proactivity, and using the money we gave them to accelerate the product to a state we expected on launch. It would then release the experienced game devs to work on features and core game.
@_nixxie_
@_nixxie_ 22 дня назад
To add to this. Having 30 Devs, they are in a better position than the solo Dev. They have people they can dedicate for bugs/fixes while still working on content & updates. This sounds like bad management/utilisation of their resources
@edwardduda4222
@edwardduda4222 22 дня назад
@@_nixxie_ A large chunk of development teams are artists, animators, etc. There are usually only a handful of programmers. A team of 20 might only have 1-2 programmers who do all of the optimizations and implementation of features. I only know this because I'm in college for computer science and wanted to go into video games when I graduate until I realized how stressful it is and how much pressure there is. Also, a large team isn't always better. If they don't have good practices, a large team can actually be less productive than a smaller team.
@raymondrogers3929
@raymondrogers3929 22 дня назад
​@@edwardduda4222 That is where good management comes in- establishing scope, prioritizing goals, and managing time. Marinka strikes me as someone who was outside of her skillset. Both cities games are terribly optimized for the hardware used at the time of launch, with Cities II being attrocious.
@nickcoles518
@nickcoles518 22 дня назад
@@edwardduda4222 There’s pressure in every job. Everyone has to do there job and hit deadlines otherwise they end up being asked not to come into work. If I was the CEO I wouldn’t be sleeping at night knowing the product I had shipped to (reportedly) 1.6m users was fundamentally flawed unless I was doing everything in my power to rectify it. And that would include investing the income from sales in people and processes to dig myself and the company out of the holes it’s dug itself. I wouldn’t have cried about people being toxic or releasing a half arsed poorly planned and developed beach properties pack. Oh, I forgot. That too came with an apology! Cool thanks. Anyway, I have heard lots from @biffa etc about what they want to happen. I have yet to hear what CO are actually doing and how they are doing it and what they have changed to achieve it. Because quite frankly, if they just continue with the same team and processes that resulted in what came out on release, they may as well just pull the plug on the game now. Beach properties showed that they aren’t learning from mistakes from the release version.
@MrGi3rt
@MrGi3rt 22 дня назад
Thirty people, not devs. At most, half of them are devs, each with different responsibilities. Adding more staff or contractors is not as easy as it seems either, a complex project like this, properly onboarding could take months. Not to mention that you'd be lucky to even find someone with previous experience from game dev at all.
@stefanik2725
@stefanik2725 22 дня назад
I am happy that you are still keeping up with your Cities Skylines commentaries. I also watch your CS2 comments. Content (assets) is probably the most important quality to me. As one once said, variety is the spice of life. Keep up the good work!
@DisrUptuSVerRB
@DisrUptuSVerRB 22 дня назад
Scenarios might not be popular amongst the player base. But they're an essential tool in providing content for creators. Creators are the glue that hold the community together. Every player that views a scenario streamed by a content creator is participating in that content and Colossal orders analytics having accounted for that.
@ConfusedRaccoon
@ConfusedRaccoon 24 дня назад
Something I'd pay for is the ability to draw a park. Kinda like in CS1 but on a smaller scale. Have a small metal gate, UK people will know what I mean, as the anchor on the road/footpath, then draw the waist-high metal/wooden fence to define the area. This would allow us to use those awkward areas at the end of streets/behind buildings that you would often see a small urban playpark built. Being able to build a park on a bend would be amazing. And once built, let us place a few things in it, slides, swings, seesaws and whatever. Those Shin destroyer sprung ride on animal things. I'd also LOVE it we could get proper UK-style roads. With proper hazard lines and giveaway/stop lines from side roads right up inline with the main road. Not set back a few yards with a cross walk. I was pretty disheartened to see American style junctions again :(
@BierPizzaChips
@BierPizzaChips 24 дня назад
Sounds as if the CS/Paradox Management successfully delegated listening to players away and had the door shut.😮 Coz all you guys explained to them is just basic player stuff which is on the wall everywhere.😂
@arthurl5280
@arthurl5280 25 дней назад
The other thing I loved in CS1 were the scenarios. If you are not a detailer it gives you a purpose to play and achieve certain results. I also used to create scenarios which I enjoyed making You even played my snowy mountain one in one of your videos :) P.S. I just got to the part of your video where you mentioned their feedback on scenarios! Disappointed they don't feel this is needed as there were a huge number in the workshop and I loved them
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
I loved Scenarios and I spoke about them with CO too 👍
@fireknight8839
@fireknight8839 25 дней назад
I use CS to calm down after the day. So I need problems difficult enough to let me forget my day but light enough that solving them makes me not feel more stressed. Most cs1 scenarios were too difficult for that.
@lkohtala
@lkohtala 25 дней назад
I was also thinking why I get tired with the game quite quickly and you said it. It's the lack of challenge, that makes the game bore me after a while. I don't care much about detailing I like games where I get to optimize things.
@charlesingram9471
@charlesingram9471 25 дней назад
You brought up some great points and if your explanation to us is anything to go by, i can assume it was as well structured to them also. Great job, thank you.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
Thank you @charlesingram9471 :-)
@JW-hd2rl
@JW-hd2rl 25 дней назад
As a console player I'm waiting our version to come out. Thanks for taking the time to speak to them.
@PingMe23
@PingMe23 25 дней назад
Concerts DLC - that was one of my favoriites in CS1. I loved that sudden population magnet to one place and then planning for that surge. Good challenge, and it was fun to see the three different performers. I hope we get something like that again. And yes, bring back the BIKES. I don't care if they are "pocket" bikes like in CS1, just bring them back.
@vscagliusi
@vscagliusi 24 дня назад
big yes for everything you said on the industry and production chains, this (and more assets that will come with time) would make the game pretty good for me. thank you!
@Franimus
@Franimus 25 дней назад
The answer to releasing hot fixes is to always be testing release candidates, and release whenever they pass muster. So you take a snapshot with whatever fixes are ready, test it, determine whether to release, take the next snapshot, test that, etc. If Paradox were competent as a publisher, they'd be coaching CO how to do this.
@Franimus
@Franimus 25 дней назад
One of the big advantages of this approach is a rolling regression testing, so you are much more likely to catch something you didn't expect to break from a previous patch
@jms4989
@jms4989 25 дней назад
I mean Biffa explained how the process for fixes and updates at CO is? What you say is exactly the problem mentioned in the video and why it is done the way it is.
@Franimus
@Franimus 25 дней назад
@@jms4989 I'm a professional software and release engineer for similarly-sized teams and programs. This is the difference between having some random person handle the process versus having someone educated, trained, and experienced in the processes. Bunching things into large releases is fine for platforms that need to be extremely stable, such as safety-critical, where you spend months fully regression testing a release. But it's not appropriate for gaming where introducing a bug that you can hotfix within a couple weeks is not going to kill anyone.
@Franimus
@Franimus 25 дней назад
Consistent hotfixes are more important for gaming because it shows the community you're invested and not abandoning the game. I'm much more likely to play a buggy game if it gets patched regularly than a game that gets updated only yearly, because in the former case the bug that's bothering me might be fixed in a few days so I put up with it. But if it's not going to be fixed for months then I'll go play something else.
@Ketraar
@Ketraar 25 дней назад
@@Franimus This is not accurate at all. Ask any game dev what happens if they get negative reviews. Releasing a hotfix hoping it doesn't break things and if it does "oh well" it a way is just silly. The amount of backlash and possibly money loss is not nothing. Pushing devs to make rushed fixes and then bashing them for adding more bugs doesn't seem like a healthy approach at all.
@Corbs3
@Corbs3 24 дня назад
Sounds like a clever PR exercise
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 24 дня назад
Yep, you've found us out...we're all in on it together to fool everyone and force you into buying more dlc. The whole thing was scripted too! Darn it, well have to try harder next time 😅
@BierPizzaChips
@BierPizzaChips 24 дня назад
Excellent humour, Biffa. Of course it is PR, but it is also also about Biffa's income and CS's existence. With such, it is actually pretty serious and good seeing all parties in this coming together, constructively. But one line about CS1 made me nervous: If they update CS1 again for making some bucks for their CS2 works, then I am seriously out of all CS - coz breaking all mods faster than I was able to re-arrange them pushed me away from CS last year. I only returned to CS1 hoping it being now stable since they work on CS2. In short: Playing CS1 is the only thing that keeps me looking for CS2 from time to time. If CS1 breaks again, you will never see me in CS2 for sure.
@raymondrogers3929
@raymondrogers3929 22 дня назад
​@@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines He didnt necessarily include you with CO/Paradox. Both of these companies have PR issues. CO with the game state and Paradox as DLC obsessed, the later seemingly chasing after EA's upstanding reputation.
@Dysert91
@Dysert91 25 дней назад
Kudos to you, the other streamers and devs that were involved in this meeting! Especially for them reaching out to those that actually play the game. The three of you are genius at this game. Love watching all your videos.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
Much appreciated!
@elimpro9408
@elimpro9408 24 дня назад
I think the biggest complaints I see are always that the simulation is "broken..." Where I think the real problem is, it comes across like it's pretending to be a game, then not actually doing it. There's no good or bad to anything you do, so what's the point? Wait for money to come in, buy the next square, paint some roads and it all just works. Not having the essentials needs to break the city! It should be hard to get everything right - the fun comes from figuring out how to fix it when it's wrong! If the city is rubbish, people need to not want to live there. If there is a service that you can build, that service needs to function in a way that failing to provide it penalises you in some way. If there's sliders to change tax rates, or funding of services, there needs to be an incentive to actually go in and change them. People moving out because tax is too high, not enough funds because costs are high and tax is too low. Bad road layouts should cause jams. This is the basic functionality I expected from the game. Not more assets, or more control over traffic lights. No game has all the content these days without DLC so totally expect there to be less than CS1. But the base game needs to do the basics instead of just pretending. It needs to provide the platform for the DLC, Mods, extra content to be built on top of. That to me is where it's failing.
@WoNCrawler
@WoNCrawler 24 дня назад
The only chance i see for Cities Skylines 2 is proper mod support for mods on Steam workship and nexus. Something outside of their fenced garden.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 24 дня назад
Why? Pdx mods although beta, is working OK. And it'll only improve.
@WoNCrawler
@WoNCrawler 24 дня назад
@@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines It requires an additional account to downloads mods, completely unnecessary, when people are already on steam. Devs should focus on getting their games in a good state instead of burning time on recreating the wheel.
@EddieGonzalez
@EddieGonzalez 25 дней назад
The dev / test / release process they described to you is normal. There is nothing novel about it. That does not preclude the idea of hotfixes. A short window of about 2 weeks the dev / qa / release for a "fixit" op is completely reasonable. They could pull one person out of general dev work each quarter (on rotation) and make them the fixit runner; no standard work unless there is nothing broken that falls into the minor task category. I hear the "small team" excuse a lot. It's BS. I've run small teams and core + regression / QoL work can co-exist.
@RLJIM
@RLJIM 23 дня назад
I really miss the football stadium filling up on match day, the green pack which included the cycle lanes etc. The traffic mod would make the joy of solving traffic jams much more pleasant, at the moment sometimes there isn't enough tools to sort. I also want public service annimations back
@jaswats9645
@jaswats9645 24 дня назад
I agree. There are huge fundamental changes to the game mechanics I wish to see before additional content. Performance is not an issue for me.
@Ubi2447
@Ubi2447 22 дня назад
I know it's not the biggest deal in the world, but I was so disappointed that they couldn't make buildings/lot geometry be anything other than a box. It's so frustrating to have curvy or odd angled roads and intersections and still have to abide by a preset box shape. While most building faces are flat, not all buildings are rectangular. To me that's one of the reasons all cities look the same right now.
@Da__goat
@Da__goat 25 дней назад
Unless they use the Steam workshop I just don’t see the modding community doing for CS2 what they did for CS. That alone isn’t a dealbreaker but what is for many people, is how paradox treats the fans of their games so there is negative trust in the company.
@leftcoastfunk
@leftcoastfunk 23 дня назад
I consider myself mostly a "city painter" but there were two challenging things I absolutely LOVED figuring out in C:SL - the traffic (using TM:PE with no despawning) and the industries DLC. I loved the challenge of getting my road layouts just right so that traffic flow was just right, without being too overbuilt. And I loved the challenge of getting my different industries raw resource extraction, generic and specialized processing, storage, and distribution all tweaked perfectly. I am very proud to say that my main city build in CS:L was 100% self-sufficient with all importing of raw resources and goods turned off. My oil and ore industrial areas were massive and they felt like they did something. They felt like entire parts of the city existed solely to support the industries. Entire residential neighborhoods and commercial districts existed in certain locations only because the industries were thriving. And all without unreasonably heavy traffic These are things you just can't even BEGIN to do in C:SL2 and I sorely, sorely miss that. I do still enjoy painting my city, but it's just missing so much. I feel more like I'm just along for the ride, rather than I'm the one actually creating it. I have these tiny little distant isolated neighborhoods that require a MASSIVE elementary school. I have these specialized industrial areas that really all they are is just a building or two on top of differently colored ground. That's it. As far as I can tell they don't actually do anything or affect the city in any meaningful way. I get a little traffic here and there but it doesn't feel like I have much say in how they get from place to place or how the roadways interact with each other And overall, the FREAKING ZONING is so incredibly frustrating I can't even breathe while thinking about it. The zoning tool (mod version, not the one they added in one of the very last updates) in C:SL was so clutch, and is exactly how zoning should have been handled from the very beginning in C:SL2. I can excuse some of the other things they didn't include at launch just due to the scale of it all, but I just can't excuse their poor handling of zoning. They said they were under the impression that most people were city painters, but they they gave us NO control over how the zoning is handled?!?!?! How are we to "paint" the city we want if we can't even make buildings spawn facing the correct road?
@zionosphere
@zionosphere 24 дня назад
Thanks for representing. Choosing you three is probably one of the quickest ways to get broadest spread of information to them and each of you are a good balance between city fixer and city painter. Perhaps the next groups should be with modders and then the biggest critics of CS2. I'm saddened by the lack of scenarios so far, but I understand as I usually only played them until I beat them, but there were great in teaching specific mechanics of the game or new DLC. They need something to increase the replayability. I do concur on the list of 4 free updates packs for designers, networking and such. I hadn't thought about it that way, but I want all of them. Putting aspects from the more popular mods would go a long way for console players especially.
@cparks1000000
@cparks1000000 24 дня назад
The lack of content shouldn't really be a problem since these should come in the future. The lack of features should definitely be a problem. I expected traffic manager and other quality-of-life mods to be fully integrated into the game. Plus, more interesting mechanics.
@Meeesa
@Meeesa 24 дня назад
I agree. The things that we all flock to the mod site for is the most important: Some kind of Move It, Traffic Manager, LINE TOOL(!), Find It, ect... They should have been in the base game. It baffles me that they weren't. Assets will come. But the base game needs to function in a way that makes it fun to play. When you can't be really nit-picky about lane usage, or when a building needs to be moved around, or placing trees in a gosh darn line is basically impossible...that needs to be fixed.
@Matt-sl1wg
@Matt-sl1wg 22 дня назад
You don't need a traffic manager until the traffic actually means something.
@einarcgulbrandsen7177
@einarcgulbrandsen7177 20 дней назад
So at the current: Cities: Skylines Current players: 13,631, 30 days avg.: 9,881, 30 days gain: +522.4 / +5.58% Cities: Skylines II Current players: 4,969, 30 days avg.: 4,604. 30 days gain: -630.3 / -12.04% Seems we can safely call this an expensive failure.
@natedagreat6704
@natedagreat6704 12 дней назад
Crazy
@NikoleiBellic
@NikoleiBellic 24 дня назад
Biffa, thank you for taking the time to be a part of this conversation with CO & Paradox. It's the best news about the game we've heard so far.
@hurrah1eqe892
@hurrah1eqe892 21 день назад
They need to hire more devs. They think they’re saving money by keeping the staff costs low, but they’re losing 1000s of customers as result. You gotta spend money to make money, and in this case, you gotta spend money to not lose half your fan base
@Vandassar
@Vandassar 23 дня назад
The amount of work they need to do and judging by their current/past amount of workflow. This game isn't going to be fully playable for at least another 2-3 years. I'm not sure they can weather that.
@RacingTheo
@RacingTheo 25 дней назад
I feel like when i build a city it feels empty in between the building's. I want to build a city like Prauge, instead of those open cities in the base game. I really hope The region pack's wil be like Prauge and other european cities, where the city is packed in. Try looking at google maps and then look at your city, you see a huge difference.
@dbzfreak2
@dbzfreak2 25 дней назад
It's good to hear that the are listening to us in the community, I think bringing on others for those meetings would be cool. I do find it funny how you mentioned they read all the feedback which makes me laugh that they have definitely seen what I want in the game lol
@anthonylogue7909
@anthonylogue7909 25 дней назад
Thanks for the up date. I have stopped playing it but might go back look at the mods and see. Loved CS1.
@arthurl5280
@arthurl5280 25 дней назад
When the asset mods start coming, I will return. There are great fundamentals but we soooooo need these for variety The modders have made some fantastic code mods that I want to use but need the assets first
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
Exactly, as I mentioned in the video, we really need more assets in the base game :-)
@arthurl5280
@arthurl5280 25 дней назад
​@@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines The thing that really disappointed me was there was a trailer that CO released about Christmas showing 6 amazing country packs made by modders and I thought "wow" - when we get these we are starting to rock. But this has disappeared and no mention since. That was a real let down as the content looked fantastic
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
They've spoken a lot about them. Delayed until the assets thing is working. So hopefully not long 👍
@goldeneagle87dy
@goldeneagle87dy 25 дней назад
Well it makes sense I love CS2 I can't wait till this game is 100% but I know it will take time and I'm willing to wait to get a great game.
@jackychanmaths
@jackychanmaths 24 дня назад
I would like to have a larger map so the districts can be more dispersed. Also, I would like to have a mixed commercial and office zoning so that the ground floor or the first few floors are for commercial and the rest are for office~
@Liam_Oliver
@Liam_Oliver 17 дней назад
Appreciate you engaging with Paradox on behalf of the community, and not forgetting us poor buggers that play on console. Have to admit I've been somewhat frustrated at the inability to mod on console, but what you've suggested (shall we call it 'mods light'?) sounds perfect! Thanks to your videos I've understood the mechanics of CS1 that had helped me build bigger, better and more functional cities, so thanks a bunch!
@Franimus
@Franimus 25 дней назад
Scenarios aren't played as much because they have no replayability value, you beat it once and it doesn't feel like there's any reason to try again. Scenarios need some sort of randomness or progressive challenge modes.
@zionosphere
@zionosphere 24 дня назад
I realized this as well. I enjoyed the scenarios, but I usually played them only once. Never did complete all of the disaster ones though. I think I've seen a mod that will build out an area automatically. This would definitely help with the randomness part.
@lesdmark
@lesdmark 21 день назад
Seems to me the takeaway to "people don't play the scenarios" should be maybe we need to make better scenarios so people will play them. Not that they are not important. I think a full blown campaign mode would be a good idea personally.
@Zadesniper
@Zadesniper 25 дней назад
Haven't played much since launch/Christmas. I couldn't deal with the insane flickering. Guessing the last patch + driver updates somewhat fixed the issue. Reducing the game to 1920x1080 60hz instead of 144hz seems to have fixed it completely. Still haven't played it yet since that little test
@RitaBaumann
@RitaBaumann 24 дня назад
With the state of the game where it is, and its importance to this company, I'd rethink taking the summer off.
@MrGi3rt
@MrGi3rt 22 дня назад
Can't change the law, it's mandatory to allow employees the time off during summer. And it's mandatory for them to take a certain amount of time off during the year. Having them take the time off at the same time is just more efficient than people randomly being away for weeks through the year.
@AnnBoylen
@AnnBoylen 24 дня назад
For me it's the airport and university that needs to be more like the last CS. They regressed way too much for a new game.
@captainsirk1173
@captainsirk1173 25 дней назад
Personally, I don’t regret buying Cities Skylines 2 even though I don’t really play it right now. I think there’s some good groundwork, and would hate to see the game get dropped before it can surpass cities 1 because it’s just not profitable enough. Maybe Colossal Order could have handled the release better, but making cool stuff is hard, and I want to give the developers the benefit of the doubt and assume they’re doing the best they can. I doubt anyone goes into that industry wanting to make a crappy game.
@BritishTrainspotting
@BritishTrainspotting 25 дней назад
Its always the publisher or those who are in charge of the developers who are the reason for crappy games 9/10 of the time. Developers are always held back by deadlines and by not having enough creative control.
@DronesClubMember13
@DronesClubMember13 25 дней назад
I think there is an industry wide problem with quality in recent years. I'm ok with devs fixing stuff but a human truth is that you get judged on first appearance and you have to live with it.
@jorgeya2036
@jorgeya2036 24 дня назад
I play a few other paradox games and im pretty sure its paradox the publishers fault. in the last 2 years they started setting very strict schedules that developers just can't seem to meet and they are being forced to release things anyway. Most recent ck3 dlc is another perfect example of this, so rushed and incomplete doesn't add anything meaningful.
@SourCat420
@SourCat420 24 дня назад
@@jorgeya2036that’s every game ever now, it’s sell stuff on top of buying a game, when ppl take there time with a game it pays off, but we live in greedy world
@charlesingram9471
@charlesingram9471 25 дней назад
Also to add to what you said about bug fixing, as we all know fixing a bug sometimes breaks 2 or 3 other things, that is coding. So doing it the way they are they can run the game themselves with a bunch of bug fixes and if there is any conflicts they can address them then before releasing the patch, if you didnt do that each hot fix could break many things that they end up spending all their time trying to fix them and getting those certified too. Also Consoles have their own certification process you have to go through before it can be released too.
@Franimus
@Franimus 25 дней назад
The more patches you lump together in a release, the more likely you have hidden bugs. You'll inevitably miss some in any round of testing.
@TrebleNotes
@TrebleNotes 25 дней назад
I appreciate hearing this update. The long time without much communication felt a bit lackluster, but this has helped me excited again. Really looking forward to having to fix traffic again.
@andywest1788
@andywest1788 24 дня назад
Most interesting part was people not working in the summer in Scandinavia! I need to move.
@karatekan2182
@karatekan2182 25 дней назад
I really hope this game doesn’t turn out like KSP 2. It’s definitely rough, and never should have been released in this state, but there’s good stuff there and I would be sad if it goes to waste.
@iidrvskyline
@iidrvskyline 25 дней назад
I feel like Cities: Skylines 2 will have an awesome future and the final game will be super good! I love the communication, how they ask what the community wants and that they see their mistakes!
@cparks1000000
@cparks1000000 24 дня назад
It's already the final game...
@iidrvskyline
@iidrvskyline 24 дня назад
@@cparks1000000hey i meant after all the updates and dlc release :D
@canadianmooseplays
@canadianmooseplays 24 дня назад
Absolutely amazing video biffa! I’m so glad they asked you to be a part of this and very grateful for the I for you shared here today. I am really optimistic for the future of this game. Thanks so much for this video it’s really sparked some hope for this game!
@arthurdent5357
@arthurdent5357 24 дня назад
I'm critical. Haven't the same content creators been testing the game and giving feedback since alpha release?
@kineuhansen8629
@kineuhansen8629 24 дня назад
one major thing i for sure would love to see in city skylines 2 ismore flad maps inspired by river delta maps buildings i love to see smaller versions of buildings we have in game like school for 50 students train stations like a small village station or elevated small local airfield for short flight planes and above ground metro station i love to have seen a option for ban cars for parking on streets so they will use the parking area
@ryancomfy
@ryancomfy 25 дней назад
Thanks Biffa :)
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
You're welcome 😊
@richardtabor8686
@richardtabor8686 25 дней назад
I hope this was productive for everyone. Ty for sharing and for the content.
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines
@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines 25 дней назад
It was, worth the time for sure :-)
@papaHeriox
@papaHeriox 24 дня назад
I loved fixing traffic issues in CS:1 although I wasn't that good at it, but when I made a custom interchange or crossroad and it worked it was really satisfying.
@coolidani
@coolidani 24 дня назад
It's so crazy to see how this all story went so far... Remember last summer all these videos paradox did with the Devs explaining all these fancy features for CS2? I had big expectations on cs2 and hearing and seeing that this is still not fixed makes me feel so disappointed and sad.. But I hope these talks will help them to improve the game and then I'll buy it
@TrevorD19
@TrevorD19 25 дней назад
<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="2315">38:35</a> replace your batteries in the smoke detector
@delroyclarke1989
@delroyclarke1989 24 дня назад
awesome episode, glad that the paradox team are finally listening to the community :)
@Pthreemby
@Pthreemby 22 дня назад
Challenges: things that pop up on game to give you focus on a particular thing in your city, give a time bound and some benefit to completing it. Thinking like subsidiaries in OTTD
@Pooter-it4yg
@Pooter-it4yg 6 дней назад
I wanted to thank you for revisiting CS1 and publishing your curated Brit collection. In the course of a recent hardware migration I chose to jettison my previous huge collection. I became a serious CSer back in the day, even got involved in procedural objects and detailed design. I even modelled real places (including my own gash London - with great inspiration from a magnificently ambitious YT soul). Then something happened during a patch update to render CS1 unlaunchable. Believe me, I'm no stranger to troubleshooting, but I just didn't have the heart to do it again. Besides, CS2 wasn't far away so I thought I'd wait. Tried it, performance wasn't too bad for me, but the experience just wasn't enjoyable. To be fair to the devs I knew it had (and still has) a future but it was a long way off. So new PC now and CS1 isn't spannered for me anymore. And that's where I'm staying for now - I'll keep an eye open of course, but I'm sure I'm not the only one who's bitten and shy. It's only a personal observation but I think that with CS2 the devs have strayed too far into the simulation side and neglected the fun bit. I didn't mind that the logistics were rather wonky in CS1, it was just the world's best trainset...
@Nicuju
@Nicuju 25 дней назад
We need hardware specs update that can actually run the game especially how much cores are required for high population and simulation.
@rodimcgeesums633
@rodimcgeesums633 25 дней назад
Computational load is exponential with an increase in realtime agents so better hardware specs won’t really help with simulation speed, there’s just too much detail to simulate too many agents.
@peperoni3140
@peperoni3140 24 дня назад
So after 8 years since cs1 launch and 7 months after cs2 launch, they are still trying to figure out what to do by doing a focus group with youtubers? Not a good sign in my opinion
@vongodric
@vongodric 23 дня назад
This is all very well and good. Doesn't change the fact they released a broken game and it still requires a lot of work. Industry in general seems moving towards "release early & fix the game afterwards" model... Maybe in a year or two it will actually be playable and out of "beta" phase.
@XandarbFinland
@XandarbFinland 25 дней назад
Thank you for doing this Biffa!
@BenRK90
@BenRK90 25 дней назад
Honestly, just them getting any official mod support into the game is what saved CS2 for me. Happy to hear they will keep working on the game and they think they can turn it around.
@munster355
@munster355 24 дня назад
well theyre never going to say its a failure until they stop working on it
@GimbleOnDew
@GimbleOnDew 24 дня назад
They added steam workshop?
@jdjenk04
@jdjenk04 24 дня назад
I enjoyed it prior to the mods but holy hell do the mods make the game 100x better. The modding community is a godsend.
@jdjenk04
@jdjenk04 24 дня назад
@@GimbleOnDew Paradox Mods. It’s like steam workshop but the workshop is implemented right into the game. So you can access it from the game menu and while playing the game to install/uninstall mods. Granted, coding mods still require you to reboot the game for changes to take but I think the goal is to allow players to install/uninstall asset mods without ever closing the game.
@Basedmistergeneral
@Basedmistergeneral 25 дней назад
What other company engages with youtubers in order to better the product? I don’t regret buying the game at all. I play it almost on a daily, sure there are bugs but still fun, if they do bring it to CS1 standards, it will still be considered the best in its genre.
@SarahIlayda
@SarahIlayda 25 дней назад
I agree, i know it was a very problematic release but I'm glad they're not just releasing and ghosting the community. I wish they would've just released it when it was ready, but I'm excited to see what it is going to be.
@Franimus
@Franimus 25 дней назад
Coffee Stain and THQ Nordic for two
@Creative_Expression
@Creative_Expression 24 дня назад
Thank you for representing us and for publishing a new CS video!!! ❤
@Chrissie113
@Chrissie113 22 дня назад
I would like to see two types of industry zoning, Heavy industry and light industry. Not all industry pollutes if you can have light industry like warehouse and small scale manufacturing that doesn't make pollution and can be put closer to residential as it is irl
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