Kurtz Trek is a reflection of him, the writers, the actors, the whole rotten staff. That's why substance abuse isn't glorified at all. It's normalised.
Berman-Trek: Drugs are bad, their effect is addictive and it can ruin your life and hurt the people around you. Kurtzman-Trek: Gurl, weed, LMAO Oh god that scene from Picard when they all start clapping as Raffi gets more and more intoxicated. One of the most inhumane things I've ever seen on a "Star Trek" show.
"Oh god that scene from Picard when they all start clapping as Raffi gets more and more intoxicated. One of the most inhumane things I've ever seen on a "Star Trek" show." Yes, for me that scene is right down there with the Icheb torture scene and also the "clean-up on aisle five" scene in STD's "Far from Home". Each of those three scenes is revolting in its own way, but each made me ill.
It's even worse. It's not just that they are kinda supporting her with drinking, the reason they are clapping is already misguided. IIRC in this scene Raffi just lost an old friend when she wanted to get a favor from her and when she didn't get it was forced to blackmail her. The old friend responded with never wanting to hear from her ever again or something. After this transpired, how can anyone clap? Imagine you just lost a friend for the benefit of the people you are with and they start CLAPPING. I'd want SUPPORT, like emotional support for my loss, not cheering for what I won the group. I remember that this scene left we seriously confused. I watched it several times because I thought that I misunderstood the plot. No, it's just that the writers have the empathy of a stone it seems.
@@trailersic Star Trek is not addictive, nor does it have harmful side effects. As for it being artificial, I'm not so sure. Ultimately I think Star Trek's optimism is correct. For thousands of years, humanity has made astonishing progress. We have made many mistakes, and there are real threats such as nuclear war, but our lives now are so much better than in ancient times. If that wasn't true, why wouldn't we just switch back to living the way people did in some pleasant ancient community: we don't do that because we are better off in the modern world, and we really know that. (I realize that there are some groups, such as the Amish, who follow a simple life style, but their numbers are quite small.) I don't think Star Trek is artificial, not in general: I believe in its overall optimism, its ultimate faith in humanity. Live long and prosper.
@@dandeliondown7920 there are malevolent actors in the world who don't want the betterment of humanity's lot in life. Unfortunately they win the battle for world domination, if my predictions are true it may be soon with a worldwide surveillance system and social credit score. They don't win the war, however. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Ephesians:6:12 King James Version The people in power are Satanists. When you question "are their actions all a big conspiracy, or are they simply incompetent?", They take their marching orders from Satan, all these steps towards a totalitarian state and one world government are intentional. Watch the documentary films "After the Tribulation" and "Babylon USA" for more information on this subject, available free on RU-vid by Framing the World. Check my channel for a clear Gospel presentation reuploaded from a trustworthy pastor. You can be 100% certain you're going to heaven when you die because salvation is the free gift of God, we absolutely cannot earn it with our "good" works. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. 1 John 5:13 King James Version
the irony is that while the writers are trying to promote drug use, their actual writing is the best anti-drug PSA ever created. "don't take drugs or you too will be unable to write coherent stories or relatable characters"
@@stuartdriedger9989 i'd wager the volume of incoherent ramblings and post-modern pseudo-art created on drugs is greater by at least a 50:1 margin. '1000 druggies on a 1000 typewriters will eventually write shakespeare'
That lecture from TNG was OVERLY preachy and kind of annoying, but at least it came from a good place, so to speak. Discovery is horrifying. It's like finding out a worker in the nursing home where your grandparents live has been taking selfies of themselves smiling while they abuse your grandparents.
People who are bored with life and need to fill their eyesight with something colorful and crazy in order to escape from their deeply held unsatisfaction with their lives.
It was created to demoralise. It's part of the plan. The same destruction was put on Star Wars. I don't even care about Star Wars, but watching the downturn was educational.
They aren't making Trek for us fans of the classics anymore, its for the new crowd. Its a fact that while 1 of us got tired of seeing Trek going through the mud and left, other 3 start watching this NuTrek and enjoying it. Their ratings are booming. Its making them money and money makes the world go round.
@@abnnizzy I wouldn't worry too much in the long run. As you say, it's made for the new crowd, and the new crowd are a bunch of ADHD Vicodin fiends with the attention span of a cat chasing a laser pointer. It's keeping a few people sitting in front of it for now, but it will age like cottage cheese on a radiator and be forgotten faster than a hummingbird fart after it's gone. OG Trek might well be over for good but it'll never be replaced by this inch-deep dogshit.
Remember, the characters reflect who the creators are. No wonder Kurtzman and his gang needs drugs and alcohol to escape their sad and miserable lives.
Exactly, coping with miserable existance Kind of Rick and morty/Bojack Horseman Stuff, "life is miserable, do substances, they help to cope with depression"
**ST:TNG* _Inspired_ us, and to stop our addictions **Star Trash: Disaster and Star 'Tard: Picard:** _Depresses_ us; we want to start taking drugs to forget this clusterfuck.
@@MichaelPohoreski Star Wreck: In the Pirkinning is actually better than the new official ones. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-0GOoMowFpZs.html
As I’ve said in one form or another, the writers of Kurtzman Trek have never indulged in any of the forward thinking, science fiction literature that has been the foundation of Star Trek. They just watch CNN, MSNBC, Fox News, and whatever dimly lit, washed out, whisper dialogue, “prestige” drama is hot and copy that. Ask them who Heinlein, Bradbury, Asimov, or Ellison is, and they’d tell you that they were the names of some dead white guys they had to read in high school English but blew off anyway, if you’re lucky. That, or they were the names they saw on the books they slapped out of the hands of people like us.
They don't have a fucking clue what makes **good** Sci-Fi: _Exploring the social implications of Technology._ Something Asimov, Clarke, and Heinlein mastered.
If you haven't read anything by Cordwainer Smith, try it. He wrote one book and the rest were brilliant short stories. When Ellison hated what others did to his work, he used the pseudonym Cordwainer Bird.
NuTrek:drug is cool and savage!Action and violence is frenetic, psichedelic and gory!Dialogs are useless: we just need camera and ship spinning, laser beams, old Minority Report (2002!!) sci-fi future imagery and some random hugs!
Yeah, I've wondered how people like Major Grin could get through them in order to create videos about them. I watched half of the first season of Discovery and the first one or two episodes of Picard, and that was all I could take. I feel annoyed just thinking about those shows. I can't imagine sitting through more of them. If I did, I'd have to be either impossibly bored or being tortured by someone.
@@vaska00762 I did say "mostly"😜 besides, I'm mostly basing my joke off a sketch that Mashed did where a disney trilogy fanboy and a hater were both accused of being toxic jerks and that both sides should be acting more like the star trek fandom. I just joked that Kurtzman decided modern trekies weren't as devisive as modern star wars fans, and decided to "fix" that.
I find this offensive. Star Trek fandom is not divided and it is not toxic. We don't like STD and PIC and we are united and civilized at that. Kurtzman wanted to make Star Trek for someone else, not us, although I am unsure who he had in mind and most certainly those he had in mind, did not get on board.
@@vaska00762 But very few actually liked Enterprise at the time and, unlike Kurtzman, the producers made changes to the show that began to bring the fans back. Unfortunately, the same perverted sex pest who would later go on to hire Alex Kurtzman never liked Star Trek and ensured the cancellation of Enterprise just as the ratings began to recover.
4:54 Did the words "space broke" actually come out of his mouth? "Space broke"?!? No wonder they glorify drugs on this crappy show. Constant inebriation must be required in the writers' room.
Kurtzman wants to write big summer blockbuster films but no one has given him the keys to star wars, DCEU or MCU. The utter contempt that he's got a lowly Television show is palpable.
I have a theory that he thinks a cartoon like Star Trek Lower Decks is beneath him. His style doesn't seem so prominent in it and I'm guessing one of the other writers is taking over for Star Trek Lower Decks, a better writer that he usually doesn't allow to have as much influence in Discovery and Picard. That's why people seem to like Star Trek Lower Decks more. My second theory is that he noticed the popularity and he's gonna have a much more active role in Season 2 so I expect it to be a big disappointment.
Yeah Modern Trek forget that Star Trek humans are not humans, not 20th century humans but people pretty much alien to modern us. That's the one of the biggest mistakes of all those new age Treks.
the old Trek shows always showed humans with flaws who make mistakes , but they always learned something from the mistakes and became better etc . the shows often had educational messages . now it's the opposite most of the time
It's akin to Marvels, 'world out your window' approach to storytelling, where any world of superheroes, or evolved humans with technology to remove hunger and provide for their most basic needs, is ignored to focus on what isn't special about that setting. Not s surprise considering JJ is getting into comics now he's managed to escape the stigma of ruining Trek over his fall guy Kurtzman.
The Drumhead and A Taste of Armageddon disagree with your assessment. While there are Trek episodes that support your view there are also plenty of Trek episodes that that say it's a continuing process to achieve and maintain the utopian aspects of the 23rd and 24th centuries.
@@robm6645 If "The Drumhead" was remade by Alex Kurtzman, it would end with Admiral Satie getting hopped up on coke and beating the crap out of Simon Tarses while Picard sat there looking mildly annoyed.
@@icemachine79 If Kurtzman made The Drumhead Admiral Satie would be coked up like Gary Olman in The Professional and Worf would secretly kill people on her orders then all would be forgiven by Picard and the crew.
To be totally fair, Yar's speech seems to indicate there is still some drug use in the federation, just not in the core worlds. Smoking is definitely not a thing anymore though. I hate that there's a cigar in Picard. And the Raffi clapping scene is horrifying.
she grew up on a failed federation colony. the government collapsed and things fell into some kind of half-anarchy half-civil war state and never recovered. it's no longer part of the federation. her parents were killed and she raised her sister in the chaos until the age of 15 when she left, and then joined Starfleet Academy.
It seems like Star Trek Discovery is just a favor to Sonequa Martin-Green (Burnham). The whole show is about her. It should be called Star Trek: Michael Burnham
TNG: Captain, I found an addictive device on board. I'll start an investigation immediately, Thank you Ensign. STD: Captain, I found an addictive device on board. Thank you ensign, I will make sure enough is replicated for the entire crew.
@@robm6645 Yeah. It doesn't change what I said. Picard was mind controlled at the time by the device and said what he thought Wesley expected to hear. If you meant the Discovery episode that was a joke. Although, If Burnham brought back the substance from the trade station maybe they would have shared it.
You know, I had never watched Star Trek until this year, then I binge watched everything from TOS to Enterprise in a few months. Haven't watched anything new, the critics drowned my interest. But seeing these clips, it just doesn't feel like Star Trek, I don't even know the plot or characters but the audiovisual elements might as well have come from another franchise.
Its called write what you know. Kurtzmens greatest points in life must of been drug highs. Also in tng it was pointed out the earths armys had become completely drug "controlled?" By Q. Doesnt this imply they went past drug addictions?
There was a dark period of human history Q points at during Encounter at Farpoint. I think it was also looked at during a DS9 time travel episode. Based on the really bad state of human society post-Eugenics wars I can completely believe there was rampant drug use among military forces as imposed by those in power.
I think Kurtzman never got past my college level of “woah, weed, ecstasy and acid are really cool”, and his personal philosophy never developed beyond the most basic level of what’s required for extremely average yet passable scripts. I’m still in college but if I’m still in that mindset by the time I’m 40 I’ll know I won’t be the right person to be writing for Trek.
@@sarahtorgerson9658 in the ep with q when the soldier is being killed he takes something from his wrist and sprays drugs into his nose. I think this implys combat drugs like psycho or jet from fallout. The soldier even smiles as he dies. So i think they had drugs to remove fear as well.
TOS: We had a black woman as a starship bridge officer on mainstream TV in the 1960s. NuTrek: We've made sure to include scenes of Women of Color(™) getting completely blitzed on drugs in all three of the Trek series we've made in the last four years.
God, it’s like a little child trying to appeal to “adult” sensibilities wrote this show. Being so concerned with looking adult only makes you appear childish.
This series promotes drug use. This is a series written by drug addicts for drug addicts, and is of drugs. If Kurtzmann was a Mandalorian, he would say, "This is the way."
@@justtheaverageone3840: what is fair is fair, that's why not so good directors, writers and actors shouldn't go over the top... It's like walking on a tightrope under the rain.
When I was growing up, I would depend on the positivity of Star Trek to cope with the real world. Now I depend on the positivity of the real world to cope with Star Trek.
I remember having that “why do people start drugs?” conversation with my mom. She pretty much told me what Tasha told Wesley, but in less preachy terms. Immorality seems to rule the Star Trek writing room now.
@@vaska00762 Scotty is a better one, but it's only him, and the single episode I remember him being hammered, was so that he could weaken his captor (it's green).
@@vaska00762 Old Trek did not promote Alcoholism,it just shows who drinks it. Oh and did I forgot Old Trek killed tobaccos and put drug use to minimal?
When the only thing that interests you is money and the number of people viewing your show, it looses all meaning. Such a damn shame that Roddenberry's vision is being disgraced like this. I always knew that Star Trek was meant to be what humans could become, before I even saw the Gene Roddenberry interviews where he states that.
What disgusts me is that it's not just ignorance of the TNG era having moved beyond such things, it's an actual effort Kurtzman & co. are making to show drugs as cool. Like the shots of them lighting up in Picard, it's meant to show how badass they are. I mean, jeez, it's not just the star trek universe that had moved on from that mentality it's the actual world we live in now were most people realise smoking is stupid.
Wow, Lower Decks barely showed drugs or alcohol, and even then it was shown as bad. Lower Decks, I'll miss it, as it is the only new Trek made by a fan for fans.
"damn" "oh man" plus all the disrespectful things 'janet reno' said to/about "Gene".... The colloquialism and diction are modern... just like what they had the characters sound like on STP. These are not the shows to watch with kids. These are not the shows to inspire people to better themselves or the world. The truth is, you'd need drugs to get through watching these shows - so that's a real non-starter. Despite what some of the preachy actors have said to the contrary, Trek always had traditional conservative/libertarian style values of respect, tolerance, privacy and the ability to pursue your own destiny. Judge a person by the content of their character, and not the color of their skin, or how many forehead ridges they have. (That could've been the original quote.... MLK was a fan of Star Trek.)
@@vociferon-heraldofthewinte7763 _plus all the disrespectful things 'janet reno' said to/about "Gene"._ Oh, man, I didn't even cop to that. Jet Reno = Janet Reno? Did they _seriously_ just do that?
Kurtzma and the rest just want to makes sci fy action and dont bother with the history or nature of TOS, TNG, Ds9 etc. Because they are interested in their own mainstream popular garbage that noone will remember in 10 years. But TNG, TOS and DS9 will still be watched in 20 years as long as we still exist
Come on everyone has a case of scotch, romulan ale, Kanar bloodwine and Andorian ale. But yeah smoking is a bad idea. DS9 got it right, nothing wrong with enjoying a glass or two of Kanar, but when you are drinking the whole bottle to forget your morals, you have a problem.... Damar.
If ONLY there was a drug that made you tell the TRUTH with OTHER side EFFECTS for DIFFERENT people. And if ONLY substance abuse WASANT A THING, Trek would be the perfect show in the whole world. So start realizing this is your world and do something about it.
This current 'Always Sunny in Philadelphia' morals variation of Star Trek leaves me feeling dirty and fatigued . TOS and TNG always made me feel optimistic in the end. These shows are made by try hards that forget the entire premise in the name of flash and Myspace level eye candy.
A reflection of times, some of the quality and depth of writing came from men that saw the horrors of warfare and were humble enough to warn us about the excess. The writers now are a bunch of pompous, pampered, virtue signaling, self centered hedonists.
Picard glorifies drugs as cool? Discovery may do that, but Rafi in Picard is simply depicted as a drug-addicted wreck whose addiction cost her her family. I can't see any coolness or glory in there.
I don't think that Discovery does that either. Burnham didn't take the drug willingly, it was forced. The same goes for Stamets, he didn't take the drug voluntarily. That thing released the drug, he recognized the problem immediately and initiated an antidote.
her drug use helped her see the truth behind the romulan conspiracy . people thought it's paranoia from her drugs but it turned out she was right all along . Picard's dying words to her were "you were right" . and he never once criticized her drug use throughout the whole show
@@NitpickingNerd No, her drugs did not help her. She already believed in a Romulan conspiracy in 2385, but no one believed her, including Picard. That's exactly why she lost her family and her place in Starfleet, that was the reason why she started taking drugs. Picard was sorry that he gave up then. She was right, but he didn't believe it. Picard hasn't criticized her drug use, of course not. Do you think everything would be solved if he pointed out that she was taking drugs? That she should stop? After all that happened? That's not how you solve problems. Why do you think everyone applauded Raffi in that one scene? Because she needed that, Picard knew she needed it.
@@NitpickingNerd Rafi seeing the conspiracy always struck me as an "accidental" hit but even if with that success her drug taking isn't cool. She remains a wreck and that other people do not take her opinion seriously because she is a junkie emphasies that point. What good is that gained knowledge if she cannot make use of it? From the perspective of the show it is often said that writers should "show, don't tell" - nobody has to critizise Rafi, her state is telling enough. Insofar I have no problems with no character openly critizing her drug use and telling the audience "drugs are bad" - for me that would be stating the obvious.
@@OrbinHD _I don't think that Discovery does that either. Burnham didn't take the drug willingly, it was forced._ And it's clearly played for laughs rather than her being forcibly drugged. Fine, they did something similar in OS/NG Trek with 'The Naked Time/Now.' It did not go well in either case. _The same goes for Stamets, he didn't take the drug voluntarily._ No, he just dipped his finger in it like an asshole and rubbed it across his gums like he was in a buddy cop movie testing for coke. I mean, I thought they had tricorders in the 22nd century, but apparently not.
Many many years ago, average Americans said that weeds are bad. Now, many Americans are saying that weeds are good. Discovery and Picard are just evolving with the real world.
One the silly aspects of Star Trek was the idea that drug abuse and despair are exclusively linked with poverty. It's a materialistic idea that simply does not mesh with human psychology.
I'm honestly surprised that Kurtzman Trek has never revisited that failed colony that Yar came from. Seems like "Planet of the Rapes" would be the kind of thing those writers would love.
NuShit Trek: "Let's not concentrate on stereotypes, let's create meaningful stories with believeable characters". NuShit Trek: shows Black women taking drugs.
Becoming intoxicated is not just a human trait, animals go out of their way to get high as well. I don't see why this would change in the future -it would just get safer.
The reason why the messaging is so different has to do with political differences in the 90s compared to nowadays. In the 1990s television everywhere told people to not take drugs. It was even seen in video games with the infamous "Winners dont do drugs" screen. In the 2010s though the messaging was different, more like "the govt shouldn't be regulating drugs they're not so bad".
Gene roddenbury didnt want humans to still live in tralier parks in 2340. It was assumed we would go past drugs. Like if you dont enjoy life you can change it and do anything with out going into massive debt. You dont need to do drugs to escape real life. But that was only earth and other high end federation planets. I assume other aliens in the ferderation still used currency sometimes.
@@robertbogan225 The Federation has the credit, but it isn't in common use internally anywhere in the Federation. Economic concerns and unity are part of the criteria used to determine Federation membership. In TOS "The Cloud Minders," when a greater-than-previously-known degree of economic disparity was discovered on a Federation member world, this had been hidden so it wouldn't endanger that planet's membership.
Interesting bit of trivia about that scene with Wesley and Tasha talking about drugs. It was put in because the government had a program where they paid TV shows to do anti-drug episodes. That's why so many TV shows during that time had such shoehorned in preachy scenes and episodes about drugs.
Discovery lost me after episode one. But I gave it a chance. I watched the first season. I should be given an award for suffering through it. It was absolutely awful. Whoever wrote the show, never paid attention to high school science class. Very first episode walking around in the desert to make a federation com badge symbol that supposedly the ship could see from space. Sonar in space. "We have been viewing a red anomaly 500 light years away that we need to investigate, we are going to confiscate your ship to go check it out" They have no idea how light years work. Science is cool! Homosexual mushroom internet in space. Just a few gripes.
I see no reason why a tobacco-like substitute wouldn't have been developed without the damaging effects, similar to synthehol. Synthehol did not displace alcohol, as bartenders like Guinan and Quark kept real alcohol on hand. Picard's brother preferred real alcohol, therefore we can assume he was producing traditional alcoholic wines at his vineyard. I do wonder if a tobacco product without any addictive qualities would be nearly as popular, but I imagine some would enjoy it simply for the physical act and the flavor. So the real message of humanity's advancement is not necessarily that we abandoned the chemical vices of old, but that we overcame them through technology and moderation for our own good.
I dont care that they make shows that are crap - I can easily not watch them - but what really hurts is that they've dragged Picard and company down to that level after decades of us wanting the character back.
