Subboor Ahmad is a Whiny Toddler Coward 

As an Ex-Muslim myself I’d so love to see this debate happen. Having watched your 3 hour annihilation of everything they said I really can’t even begin to imagine how they’ll try to feign scientific understanding in an attempt to save face. There is actually no way out for these people. I don’t understand how he can challenge someone to a debate in something that he himself is so uninformed in.

I'll bet my kidneys they'll not reply and pretend to ignore

Eh, wouldn't expect anything from them if i were you, Dave, thats not how this type of people work.

They will pretend this video never existed and keep reverberating to their echo-chamber.

I would love to see another live debate with you again. If they do contact you will you accept??

Absolutely.

I’ve got that shirt

need that in a shirt

Funny thing about D-K is that it’s starting to become a really good example of D-K! Especially by theists, I noticed.

Dunning-Kruger club...DKC! First DKC rule, IDK! 😶

Well if you have to lie about science, it is fully natural to make lying your primary nature. Just like Kent Hovind and his ilk.

These people are just idiots, and they know their audience will never check - they're just that gullible.

Yeah, more like James Tour humiliated himself.

MISTER FARINA!

And he gave support to Behe - the same one a judge admonished in the Dover school trial! How far from being science literate do you need to be to support Behe?

To let science "justify" their crackpotteries.

It's like they are in an abusive relationship with science, they constantly willify and attack it while simultaneously being obsessed with it and wanting validation from it.

Great line.

Because they know science > cult.

There are these typical fundamentalists which are more along what you mentioned, and then there are the more devious bunch, ones that conflate and abuse/misuse philosophy, these are the real devious ones. When you go on a philosophical word-babble, sheep get fooled easily and its easy to grift. All of Subboor's smug/arrogance you see in the video comes from that very perspective. I have nothing against any religion (more appropriately, I look down on all religions equally) and don't have any problems with people believing what they want, but these devious ones are the most damaging and that's where I divert from my usual position of indifference.

PhD to debate high school stuff 😂

What? He did debate multiple people with PhD. Get a life.

​@@seeker_of_knowlage3568so?

It would be like stepping on an ant. You wouldn't even know you did.

@@seeker_of_knowlage3568 I highly doubt he has debated a PhD biologist given he fumbles 9th Grade Biology.

If you are brainwashed enough it warps your perception of reality and we call it "to have *god-glasses* on"

A lot of religious people side with him just because he has PhD and believes in God.

He did something, just nothing that supports his point

Just read some of the comments on James' video about it. They're such morons that they legitimately believe James "owned" Dave in that debate.

@@Crowbars2 Christians actually think that the one who citated more good stuff from the Bible - wins anywhere on any topic, this can be seen in numerous debates with them

A wild Anton appears

What da hail

Anton! I’m a huge fan. Please have a wonderful day.

Hello wonderful person

Hello wonderful science RU-vidr!

He will never recover

All that reject evolution and OOL support each other. Except the flat earthers. They are too stupid.

Well, the vast majority of Muslims are creationists… so they must love him.

They're part of the same Dunning Kruger club.

@@alphauno6614 are you going to pretend that Islamic Theology doesn't teach nonsense like getting 72 virgins when you reach heaven, or Mohammed splitting the moon?

Well all of they argumensts is from discovry institute and other christinan creationists but most of them doesnt even understand their own arguments

Cathartic lol

Its nice. It used to rub me the wrong way but after thinking about how little respect these types have for "mainstream science" ie hardworking people who have made all of our lives better - I decided that they deserve it. It is tit for tat. Can't claim earnest committed scientists are all liars or fools then cry foul because you got called out on it.

No mercy 😂

Either it's "Return to Sender" or "Taste of his own medicine". That's the only way to get these people attention.

Same

Shh! If he wants to bankrupt himself, don't stop him.

He probably actually believes that Dewey defeated Truman.

“According to my degree from the University of Reddit, we’re actually living under an Emperor right now!”

@@chriscasperson5927 Well ... there was a headline ...

Subhoor probably thinks Han Solo shot first

Well it seems they aren’t really good at figuring that out either

Great context!

I'm in the US and it's like that at my university too (sort of)...we have "Professor" and then assistant prof, associate prof, adjunct, instructor, lecturer. I don't even know which is which. If my student calls me "Professor W." I don't explain the technicalities...I answer their question.

I feel like you're giving them too much credit. I doubt they even knew this much. They're just barking out based on their assumptions.

@@jeremysmetana8583 Even if the context here did make complete sense, it doesn’t detract the fact that they’re still talking out of their ass and having to pick on the most trivial details because they don’t actually have a real argument

Some subtext sounded like he was threatening Dave, though. (At least that's how it came across to me, doesn't mean it is so.) I know Dave is not scared and that's commendable, but I would be.

Maybe watch Saboor's other debates in an academic setting before you make that statement. Unless you are willfully ignorant, you should see his arguments hold merit even among other athiest/secular scientists.

@@cuttru8041 I'm not ignorant and his arguments are garbage. I'd suggest everyone go watch Subboor get totally embarrassed by skydivephil in November of 2018. Dave will not be as gentle as Phil was...

​@@uNiels_Heartthis comment is kinda fishy, there were no threats of violence or anything

​@@cuttru8041please don't set yourself up for insults

it's people who argue dishonestly who I have no respect for. You can believe anything you want. Just don't lie about it.

Laughed at creacrap 😆

@ ReidF: creationism pretends to be science while it rejects science, so it by definition is a lie. That's why almost all creationists lie; in 25 years of internet I have met two exceptions.

Treating it with every molecule of respect it deserves. Not our fault that just happens to be zero.

they think that's some sort of smoking gun aha moment because they genuinely cannot see the difference between creationists and the 90% of religious people who are normal. to everyone but them it sounds fucking stupid lol

that's kinda the point. misinformation is the exact opposite of the stuff he does on his channel

i'm a teacher, same way

No way, I love your vids dude

I want to learn

Me and my homies hate missinformation 💪🤓

​@@alphauno6614 it's just a name!! Get over it 🙄 Dave started his channel when his students used to call him "professor David" and the name just stuck 😒

It's true, calling people out is not normative so Dave automatically gets called "rude." What's rude is confidently denying reality for money and influencing people dumber than you who will aggressively push this noninfo on others because it's easier.

I think it’s more he calls people dumb, and stupid, and morons etc. it’s not calling out their science it’s the fact that he is an actual asshole to people. This entire video is attacking the person just like he’s complaining about. He calls him a toddler in the name of the video. Let’s count how many times he insults him with names in this video alone, shall wed

Ill have to say Dave can be mean, sometimes to people who he misunderstands in the comments if the comments arent entirely clear. Then again, its usually well deserved and he clearly has 0 patience for BS anymore.

I mean he is a bit arrogant but usually right

because they KNOW that 99% of their sheeple never watch the other side, and thus never know that no challenge was made.

I mean.. debating is a fine way to advance science though. But it has to be in written format and the whole thing needed to be public, refereed and peer reviewed. Otherwise it is completely useless to have people talking over each other, except for entertainment of course.

It's exactly like "debating" the amazing ex-pat Taffy.

This will never get old 😂

GO GO GO GO

@@faelheavymetal YOU CAN'T DO IT YOU JUST TALK TALK TALK

MR FARINAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!! HERE!!!!!!! GOO!!!

*looking away from the projector*SHOW ME THE RESEARCH

Sir! How very dare you. I am speak like this

owright guvna! I spose I betta clean yor chimney!

You're from London ? Why do these motherfuckers talk like they own London ?

Bo'oh Wa'ah

gor blimey, apples n pears mate. jolly hocky sticks.

Twice. One time at his own university, one time at Cambridge round table. Lol

This was genious.

Ah, glad that I'm not the only one who heard this subtext. It's likely they were just bluffing in regards to this or at least I hope so.

why not

​@@T.E.S.S.It usually ends with someone "getting the point". In the most literal sense possible.

​@@TheDarkSide11891exactly. Its a subtle threat, wrapped in a bluff.

@@TheDarkSide11891no it doesn’t stop fear mongering

The response by"professor" Dave was three hours. The original video was about 20 minutes long. Gg

@@ryuzaki5491 that's just a straight up lie... "Muslims Scientifically And Rationally Dismantle Evolution! Muhammed Ali & SubboorAhmadAbbasi" uploaded on "The Muslim Lantern" is 1 hour 41 minutes and 24 seconds long. It took me about 15 seconds to find that video

@@kemicalhazard8770 My bad. It's still not close to 3 hours.

@@kemicalhazard8770 Now watch it.

@@ryuzaki5491 i did.. Dave showed the entire video while reacting to it Just the part in the beginning when Subboor is claiming that “these papers disproves evolution” and he simply flashes some papers and *doesn’t even read the abstract* shows he has 0 interest or capability to read the primary literature. He also outright lied about deletions, insertions and duplication events, which are mutation events, not scientists changing the genetics of animals to make them similar to humans. If you actually watch the debunk, it becomes insanely obvious this Subboor guy knows less than nothing about evolutionary biology.

this one's islam

@@shreyvarad same shit different guy

@@___Bruh__ well... yea

It was a bit too nice to Subboor Ahmad but I guess Dave have to comply to TOS and the swearing rules to get this video monetized.

​@@Gottamr if they REALLY wanted to send him an email, they would've checked his socials to see if it's there. I checked, and found it in under a minute in his FB page that's linked in his profile here. He's not hiding it.

@@Gottamr It's the description section of this video.......😆

if they had anything concrete they would sue. creationism has already been PROVED false in court in the dover trials. the hamzas den mob are just that, a mob.

@@cuttru8041 so you didn't watch the debate with Tour then, did you?

Now it will be interesting how they're going to respond in video (if they dare to respond at all).

they did invite your prof tho. unfortunately your prof chicken out

@@ateyzero Oh really? Did they show any proof to you special fans?

Which makes sense considering what they said about Dave. They just twist everything around and pretend the opposite is real.

Thats the whole goal of religion in general. Get people on your side so you can exploit them and get all the power and/or money.

it's always sad and funny when atheist know more about an aggressor's religion then them, and has better morals then them.

@@TheMessage2022 What belief?

@@TheMessage2022 I don't know of any atheists that believe that. I don't. It's weird that you believe that we believe that.

They are ashamed of nothing and offended by everything

Proof?

@@Belayet_says the proof is right there in the videos they make, hamzas den has had a variety of atheists - pinecreek, tjump, jack angstrietch and others and folks like suboor never listen to what has been said, never answer the question asked and all fail when it comes to science. even here all we get is a string of denials and personal attacks - no science at all and no actual invite, flight tickets, hotel booking - just the hot air of god as always. and creationism has been proved false in court, it was a hoax set up to get another hour of god taught in schools that backfired, the dover school board all quit before the verdict was in, it was prosecuted by a catholic believer who was sick of lies about god and the ONLY people who keep creationism going are religists -when 3/4 of the religions in the world are okay with evolution anyway. it's a dumb thing to fight over, fought over by dumb people.

Correction. He is not calling scientists dumb. He is refuting the darwinian theory of evolution and highlighting his flaws that people LOVE to take as fact.

@@bilalhasan6660 right he's not calling them dumb he's just saying the overwhelming majority of them are wrong and they, science illiterate morons, know better

If I may add a bit; Even if some people decide to be willfully ignorant, they can be so. Sure, I, you and others may disapprove of it, but it is their right to think and believe what they wish. However, it's an entirely different category of people entirely who dedicate themselves to spreading misinformation and actively fighting against human progress, like Subboor, Kent Hovind and the Discovery Institute. Those are the people who should truly be looked up with scorn, mockery and ridicule. Which is what makes me love Dave's content so much. Even if I fail to understand half of what he says, despite my best efforts, I can only applaud and admire his dedication both as an educator and an anti-misinformation-ist.

Agreed!

Best comment lol

You cannot afford London! 😅

I'm not a British person so I did enjoy London a fair bit. National Gallery, Natural History Museum and Science Museum for t3h win.

I love London! I mean I don't live there but still, I love it!

over all too quick

Oh I dunno what that is

@@ProfessorDaveExplains It's just a really popular game.

@@ProfessorDaveExplains So, there is this cool game that's popular where this skeleton beats you up if you kill a bunch of his friends, his name is Sans, and he's form the awesome hit game 'Undertale' when the text on the screen appears at 8:15 the sound it makes is Sans' speaking sound for when you interact with him. Anywho, I just think that's interesting that it got included in the video.

"So... i've got a question for ya. Do you think even the worst negationist can change? That everybody can be a good science communicator, if they just try? Alright... well... here's a better question: *_do you wanna have a bad time?_* "

Professional religious excusologists can weasel their way out of anything with a new bunch of lies. It's just what they do.

@@Gottamr 1 week old troll account

@@Gottamr It's in the video description....🤣

First, disclaimer: I'm 100% on the side of facts and reason. I could watch Dave clown on these fools all day. Once or twice, I have. With that out of the way, hate to say it but this is 100% a win for Subboor. He knows exactly what he's doing. Notice how he lied by not lying? He got the ego boost of blustering in front of his sheeple. The sheeple will conclude Dave is a coward and refuses to debate, reinforcing their indoctrination and loyalty to Subboor. The kind of moron attracted to folks like Subboor is therefore more likely to hear about him and come to his channel. If Subboor is ever called on his lies, he can say that's not what he said (technically true), not what he meant (which his idiot followers will take to mean Dave is acting disingenuously), or couldn't find the time (which he could if it was important but his followers will take to mean he's too busy doing all the other work Allah has for him), or he wasn't able to find the money (which his sheeple will believe even though GoFundMe exists and believers are so bad with money they'll send it to megapastors). He doesn't have to do any of the work for a debate but still gets to act like there was one and he won it. If the world weren't stuffed to the brim with weak-willed, emotionally crippled simpletons, guys like Subboor wouldn't have much traction. Unfortunately it is, and they do.

Literally me rn the night before work!

Yes, when I discovered Muslim apologetics a few years ago I was shocked how bad the arguments were. I became genuinely concerned about the educational level of the majority of the population of Earth.

Yeah, when i see science communicators or atheists mention lenski's long term experiment, at least christian apologists spew bullshit about the experiment that might be believable for avarage person. But the usual shit i see with muslim apologists is just them completely ignoring the topic or resorting to "why didn't they turned bacteria into reptiles hmmm?" Moderate muslim apologetic arguments are at least one and half centuries old.

Arguing is plan B for them

This only serves to illustrate the major disparities between the islamic world and the christian world. Islam never had to face things like the Reformation and the anticlerical deist movements, hence it never had to put a sustained fight on its home turf.

Ya it’s an eye opener I incorrectly assumed ppl were just being prejudiced but it’s actually that bad. no sht flat earth level bad

London is enjoyable as a tourist. I wouldn't want to live there again though. 10 years was too long, Amsterdam is way better.

No, Saboor's strategy is to point out that scientific theories aren't actually "fact". It's true, but oversimplifies science. He's a sneaky and slippery fellow using philosphy to attack science.

@@iiddrrii6051 changed it to fit lol

@@iiddrrii6051 exactly muslim apologists are experts in liquefying everything but their faith moving every knowledge source to the "maybe or maybe not" region while claiming that their brain gymnastics are the only source of absolute facts 💀

“Is creationism science?” “No”. Why did I fly to the UK to answer that?

No, evolution has not been proven, through science it currently sits as the most likely way that chamge happens in living organisms. Im not against science, or evolution, but there is a reason it's called a "theory", and its not the reason apologists give.

i haven't been keeping up with this beef, what are they arguing about? - a muslim med student

"I'm still able to comprehend the importance of these topics and retain my faith" Ah, so you're an expert on cognitive dissonance then... 🙂

The line “it’s not hard to comprehend evolutionary science and retain my conservative Muslim faith if you have a surface knowledge of both” I’m assuming includes some form of typo, but even if it doesn’t… I‘ll always be in the corner of people who are willing to let their point of view evolve over time instead of clinging to something and rejecting everything that doesn’t match.

@@JGM0JGMNo he’s a rational person keeping his faith and learning what he loves I say kudos to him

@@andybeans5790Islams position on evolution is quite ambiguous so his positions and Subhoor’s position are alright they can both exist with their different views

They did that, I just used it back at them.

​@@ProfessorDaveExplains Hi dave!

​@@ProfessorDaveExplainsi died of laughter when you did that outro. The shade was so thick that you gave the planet a worldwide winter storm 😂😂😂

theres no more sagan, dawkins, or hitchens with enough energy to do what hes doing anymore, i hopemore people like him are on youtube and i just cant find them.

You mess with Dave you get war. He's coming for your head. This is oddly analogous to the Kendrick Vs. Drake beef.

@@durden91tyler there's Aron Ra.

@@durden91tyler Gutsick Gibbon is a lighter version of Dave too. She is more subtle and refined but her insults are cathartic as well. She speaks mainly about human evolution, in case you dont know her.

​@@durden91tyler Try Logicked for a more intellectual approach, and Sir Sic for a sarcastically humorous take-down angle. Both brilliant.

I think their primary concern is to discredit Dave to their viewers, to hope that they believe them and that they never go to the actual video and check.

Tour's video comment section is literally the same as daves, except all his followers talk about how stupid anyone is that thought that Dave won. Point is, The facts dont matter, its all about deception.

I think the probem is that sensible people like you and I think that winning an argument means presenting supporting facts, and being able to highlight the problems with the opposing view. But for James Tour's supporters, winning a debate means being louder and angrier than the other person.

@@h14hc124 They missed the "the first person who shouts loses" rule of debate?

This is accurate. Only i would insist on using the term 'pseudo-philosophical' instead. He doesn't actually understand the philosophy.

Don't forget "Deletion and insertion" used wildly wrong!

Would that be like how james doesnt understand theology (see: him calling babalonian gods "trash from the primordial soup" and dave showing how hebrew mythology borrowed lots of ideas from it)

"the term did not come from you modern day OoL researchers, it actually came from the Babylonians. And from that also came their gods. It's trash" actual quote

You can have a master's degree and be a high school teacher... A bachelor's of science is enough to get a person hired as a science teacher here (assuming they have the degree in education).

The end credits song about Hank Scorpio is going to be playing in my head for the next few hours. _He loves German beer!_

@@mjjoe76 You Only Move Twice is my absolute favorite Simpsons episode.

Now that I think of it, the Frank Grimes episode is my next favorite.

how is it still on the wall then

@@markblacket8900 🤣🤣🤣🤣 Dads everywhere just sat up and slapped their knee, bewlidered by what that odd impulse was that suddenly came over them.

Maybe they meant "humiliation by secondhand embarassment?" 😉

@@NeutralDrow That's the only possible way that statement could be true

Dumb people think that the louder a persons scream, and the angrier they look while doing it, the better their argument was.

There is a difference between the academic understanding of evolution and the average person. Watch Saboor Ahmed's debate with Aaron Ra to gain better perspective in which he accepts evolution as valid scientifically, but makes you understand what that actually means.

That is the dumbest fucking thing I've ever read.

yes

@@ProfessorDaveExplains How do you cope with it?

@@mcalkis5771 shitting all over apologist frauds and watching their followers squirm and cry

@@ProfessorDaveExplains Guess I should try it some time lol.

​​​@@user-rc7fr4ut2eghe fuck are you talking about? The verbal ass whooping Dave gave to these radical pseudoscience apologists is justified. And this is coming from me who is a PhD student.

Honestly? I actually suspect it isn't projection and more of a threat. They don't care if they're wrong, they don't care if people think they're wrong, they want to stack the audience with their most radical supporters to threaten and intimidate those that argue against them. I've not seen the exact same thing happen before but I've seen very similar things happen before. People like us, or -James- Dave, or a genuinely curious audience, are not their intended targets, it's their own audience. They want to be seen striking down the opposition to reaffirm the faith of anyone in their own audience who might be having doubts or wavering.

@@jmaitland5709 Interesting comment. But Im arfaid I dont understand it very much. When you say threat, you consider them saying that dave would fold in a debate is a treat or you meant another thing? When you say people like us, who do you mean, Prof Dave audience or ? and Who is James ? James Tour? is James part of the us or is more like in general " all people in agreement and opposition" that dont agreee with the dude on the video ?

@@leonxpc1 Not quite. What I mean by it being a threat is for when they're actually at an in-person debate. The whole "Why won't you debate me in person? Why do you just say words from behind a screen? Scared?" already kinda has the underlying hint that he would have something besides just words to be fearful of at an in person debate, but more explicitly, it goes like this: "Come debate me irl" the guy demands, if Dave says no, the guy goes back to his audience and proclaims victory, saying Dave is a coward. If Dave says yes, then he does as I said, stacks the audience with his most rabid supporters to try and heckle and threaten Dave during the debate to hopefully make him back down or fumble. Also yes, by "us" I meant Dave's audience, cause I seriously doubt that either of those two guys either hopes to or cares to convince any of Dave's audience that they are the ones in the right. As I said, it's performative for their own side. (I meant to type "Dave" before but flubbed and wrote James, I was typing while listening to the video and they were talking about James Tour while I wrote that I guess lol, brain fart, my bad)

@@jmaitland5709 OOoh I got it now. Thanks for explaining. I think you might be correct.

That's exactly how I see it! Please convince all the naysayers who whine about how mean I am.

​@@ProfessorDaveExplainsLet them cry and rage against the dying light of their irrationality.

@@samk5367 u want a discussion? Let's see if I'm a fake ex-Muslim or not 🤣

@@CyclingAMP I love how they delete their comments😂😂

LOL, needed to read twice.

Eh, two is too many.

Right. You have two brain cells. That’s why you think that dumb thing.

​@@ProfessorDaveExplainsIt's a joke. And you literally explained how it's a joke.

​@@ProfessorDaveExplainsit's a joke. Read that again 😂😂😂

I saw! Yes it is obviously evolution. And observing endosymbiosis is obviously much more rare than any old example of evolution.

Oh man what threats?

@@ProfessorDaveExplains it was a few years back. It was with his interaction with Mohammed Hijab. He ended up taking his videos on the topic down. I think they said they knew he lived in Oxford. He seemed pretty shaken up by it. Maybe reach out to him. Just wanted to give you a heads up.

@@ProfessorDaveExplains ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-z2JLLIb6A2M.htmlsi=1YOtJe3outBgcXaz

@@essencelost2884 T.Y.

...even a high school *student* would know more

I have a degree in Philosophy with a comparative religion angle, and I know more science than these two do. Of course, I wanted to be an archaeologist and an astronaut ...