This is the best no nonsense advice I've seen regarding preload, spring rate, clickers and especially rebound DAMPING (+slows down rebound and -speeds it up). It's taken me 20 years to figure out what you've said in a few mins. LOL. Going out on a limb here but general rule of thumb, run as little damping as you can depending on terrain and how fast you are.
Yeah. That's pretty much true in all motorsports. Suspension is all about tractable power, and having just enough damping to keep from bottoming tends to be the way to go. Some riders/drivers will prefer stiffer settings of course but you basically start at the least.
OMG the rebound comments by paul are so freaking true! I have the same problem with my riding buddies maxed out on there rebound that they are packing through the whoops and want me to valve more rebound in.
I give race tech 2 thumbs up. Having race tech in my kx500 has probably saved me from taking expensive ambulance rides to the hospital. It is well worth the money and it would be the first investment for any new or old bike.
I’ve had it installed in my Street Glide front forks. Worked vey well. Night and day difference compared to stock forks. But, I think I want try Legends in my new street glide next time.
I want to put stiffer springs and re-valve my front forks on a 96YZ 250 but I cannot seem to figure out how to get the inner damping rod apart to access the valves any help would be greatly appreciate it
Get this man's book and read it. Even if you don't end up doing the work yourself you'll at least have an understanding and will better know what type of setup you want to go with.
when you say a car it doesnt matter, usually a car driver may not feel it like a rider but the ability to get on the power or brakes is noticed by the driver and the spectators notice the one car be able to leave the corner faster than the other, tractive effort is the result of suspension
I think he was talking about the difference between vehicle weight and rider/driver weight. So a 30 lb heavier rider on a dirt bike makes more difference for suspension settings than does on a car. I took 18 years off riding and got back into it about 40lbs heavier, and boy, did I have a lot of work to do on my suspension.
Off road suspension gets to be worse than a rubix cube when you factor in: spring rates, oil level, oil viscosity, shim stacks, rider weight, rider technique, clicker settings, where the fork sits in the tube, offset in the clamps, all things handlebars, how far back your rear axle is, then consider the amount of time it takes to change these things, placebo effect, whether your physical fitness has changed over the period of time you have made changes and made notes, and also how your engine is tuned and delivers its power... Each one of these points is a whole nother chapter on its own and in the case of dampening valving, thats another book. Mechanical engineering and hydraulic knowledge required. GOOD LUCK!!
Or you could have your friend pull out his phone and record you. Watch it frame by frame and see simple things like is the front tire slamming vs slow launching vs not returning to the ground, the rear wheel kicking then 2nd bouncing when it lands? None of that takes a masters degree to understand. It's pogo stick stuff that I could teach a 10 year old.
@@SLP-eb1wp I don't generally race, not my style. I'm more of a trail rider and have fun dabbling in other things (eventually I will learn to drift my street bikes). When I race, it's just for fun with a group of friends at an endurance race. But the friend I've been helping does race MX, *and yes, he does have a lot of trophies.* (riding skill sufficient to overcome poor bike setups) But why settle for poor, when it's not hard to learn how to improve things? And even at my low off-road riding skill, the differences between the adjusted bikes and before was immediately noticeable (eg, you can cut a new line in the corner and it just bites and does it vs skittering or mushing wide). And yeah, even at my timid lack of skill, I almost doubled my speed on the tiny track we were tuning on. Before, every corner entry was sketchy, it wouldn't bite in the front and it wanted to bounce out of ruts. Powering out was always kinda easy on that bike. Afterwards? The bike would stay where I put it, wouldn't get sketchy on the braking bumps, so I could enter much faster and not almost blow it, could set my own lines, I wasn't getting bounced or climbing out of ruts (just missing them from my own mistakes) and I could just dump on the the throttle carelessly and keep on it. If I was racing myself, I would have lapped myself in about 2-3 laps, so yeah, about doubled.
Something that has always bothered me is that the valving response seems to me to be back to front to what is needed. So the faster the wheel needs to move the more the shims need to bend. this means it needs more force. So faster movement = stiffer. So hitting a root at high speed would make the force higher which is what seems to happen. But we want it to be softer not stiffer. When you hit the brakes the movement is slow which means less force so softer but we want stiffer. So it seems to me the response is back to front. We want soft at high speed and stiff at low speed. This would make square edges soft (what we want) and braking stiff (what we want). It seems if we want low dive we have to accept harsh on square edges. If we don't want to deflect on square edges we have to accept diving under brakes.
Try stiffer springs, very little preload, and less compression dampening. Let the stiffer springs hold the front end up, and compensate the stiffer spring with lighter dampening for good bump reaction.
Race Tech sucks. They tried to sell me stock springs for my bike, not springs for my weight. They then asked how much I weigh, how I ride, etc and said they have "perfect" springs for me. When they arrived....stock springs. Ugh...anything for a quick sale. Someone must be trying to meet a quota.
What we used to do if a mistake like that was made, was call them to talk about it, send them back and get the right ones. Race tech is an awesome company. I would suggest you don't do business with them again, to do them a favor. I have actually told a customer of mine, (who acted like you), that I did not want to do business with him ever again, and I gave him my competitions phone number. :)
