Kudos to Swapan da for hitting the nail right in the head. No conversation could have been complete on conservatism of both Anglosphere and India without mentioning of how evangelicals funded by the USA are subverting social dynamic of India
@@songaesthetics8543US based evangelical churches are a pan asia pacific problem. South Korea is a late stage evangelical society and see how their society is heavily US influenced and trying to implement everything western into it whilst being a completely diffrent society.
Good to see swapandas sir speaking in various platforms, BJP should promote more people like Swapandas, Sundanshu Trivedi , Alok Sharma , Shehzad poonawala, Jaswinder Singh and get rid of crap like Sanju Verma, RK Sinha.
They won't. We had Jaitley,Sushmaji, Rajeev pratap Rudy, chandan Roy, Ravishankar Prasad as spokesperson for BJP. Sadly, few of them left to heavenly abodeand few aren't on the scene ad they are sidelined.
@@ayushmankar4100 these gatherings will never allow Indian nationalists like J Sai amd Ranganathan to even come close. 😂 They want docile pets from India like Ram Madhav etc. This is a good cop bad cop routine to fool gullible Indians.
Woah, NatCon is bringing some of the big guns in Conservative thinking from India. I am glad to see some recognition of free thinkers from India that is not cut from the same cloth as OxBridge Lutyen elites (aka India's liberal elite).
@@AKumar-co7oeI don't think they are a good fit for a conference like this. Neither of them are party members - Swapan and Ram Madhav are both card carrying Sangh members.
Conservatives around the world could never be united under one banner unlike liberals who have a common global agenda, conservatives prioritise their respective national interests. Each nation has it's own national interest and at times it may clash with the interest of other nations. Another point is, it's a futile exercise trying to get validation to earn a place among the Anglo-Saxon world. India may be an English speaking nation but it never was and would never be accepted as a part of the Anglo-Saxon world. Instead of that India should work to form a union with its neighbouring countries of the Indian subcontinent, most of them unfortunately are hostile to eachother. India is closer to its neighbouring countries culturally, ethnically, linguistically and historically, it shares nothing in common with Anglo-Saxon countries. India's neighbours unfortunately are unable to realise that and they keep letting themselves be used as a pawn to the big powers like United States and China. This never ending hostility between the Subcontinent countries is diminishing the potential of all the nations in the region and keeping them poor, backward and belligerent.
Tolerance has a limit thereafter intolerance becomes a duty - Lord Krishna. Dont push hindus you have no clue what they are capable of and America cant afford to have India as an enemy @@AnthonyTolhurst-dw1nc
Every converting evangelist doesn't've total faith/surrender to either Christ or Christianity. Their motives are ulterior. Ultimately in course of time, Sanatan Dharma will win over them all
Islam & Christianity survive in West; once Nature withdraws fossil fuel, Islam will vanish; without violent Islam, Christianity will fade out. Both don't've key to rebirth/Karma/Atmic Vichar. Eastern regions will survive on Sanatan Dharm/Rebirth/Karma..
Glad to have listened to Swapandas. He gave very good education about India to the US and West. He nailed head on the evangelism of West and it honestly need to be addressed. He also too head on about citizenship amendment for non-muslims in India. Thank you for posting this.
More importantly the anglosphere relies only on the comentry in English which again is a grave injustice to the comprehension of Bharat and her civilization. Truth be told, its extremely complex.
Great speech and it is a long time coming. As we all know the American founders thought ahead of our time so much so that they defined the nation and lived by it in their times .that's how important they viewed the coming age where material sciences & technology blurred fact from fiction that we may need 3 lines of measure to find our way home. The shining capital on the hill wasn't just a metaphor or a white house. ❤❤🎉
Swapn, you know why Jewish population in the US has a different influence on the US politics than Indian-Americans. One can write an essay on this subject.
The Jewish people in the USA have excelled due to their perseverance, sagacity, and in-bred or innate desire to prove themselves and their existence. They were treated abominably; their very existence was questioned! Naturally, they fought to survive, and despite their stellar accomplishments, they are still being “targeted” ! Our India was the only nation that welcomed them, and treated them with warmth and open arms ! Indians, now face similar disconcerting treatment in many parts of the world, simply because they work harder, live with an open mind, and excel!
That’s correct. My comment wasn’t meant to mean otherwise. I’m an admirer of the Jewish community. We Indians have to work our way to achieve similar success. I think we have an uphill task though, because economically successful segment of the Indian immigrants has a different ideological inclination. Their upbringing didn’t educate them about India’s civilization contribution to the world.
An excellent talk by #SwapanDasgupta. One aspect that he touched on towards the end needs further attention, reflection, and better understanding - that conservatives all over the world basically describe a wide swath of people. It starts with nationalism (as he described), but essentially draws on the wellsprings of civilization, culture, religion, and identity. To that extent, conservatism anywhere would have a religious segment tightly embraced and this segment itself is not likely to be uniform, but exist on a continuum - from extreme religious affirmation (and its supposedly ordained practices) to the "liberal" religious affirmation. This is worthy of note as the extreme religious segment in the Christian belief system - present in the American movement and hugely identified with it because of its omnipresence - such as with abortion has no equivalent counterpart among Hindus. So there is the evangelical element that Swapan pointed out that does not exist in the Hindu tradition, but also the sociocultural beliefs that basically characterizes fundamentalist Christian beliefs that do not exist in the Hindu tradition. The last point is important because a lot of facile conversations about conservatism do not distinguish between the Indian expression of it (based on its essentially Hindu construct) and the Western expression of it. Being a conservative in India is certainly not equivalent to the American conservatism as epitomized by fundamentalist beliefs that are often front and center in contemporary American debates and the cause of much acrimony resulting from courtroom battles and Supreme Court pronunciations.
The tldr of it is that conservatives from different countries/cultures are natural enemies not natural allies. No matter how hard both sides pretend to play along, ultimately the Sangh/BJP are on a collision course with the CPAC/RNC crowd.
Good that in India today the ither side that is right is also getting intellectuals. It still in very initial stages BTW. It needs to expand and evolve fast in days of internet
Right side always had intellectuals . But the problem is our Indian deep state and left-islamist-missonary lobby which follows Gandhi-Neheruvian ideology rejected them , boycotted them and done witch hunting against them from last 75 years
Just wanted to add this !😊 Today even if you look at the social media , far away friends are much dearer to you sometimes better than your family members! One of my social media Guru just advised , " You have to look inside or introspect, why your family members are preferring outside company? You have do something better or more interesting for them , so that they remain attached with you ! " This is a natural human tendency! Very few people can make a compromise in this basic expectation and in today's context of patriotism or nationalism! So everybody is just making a choice, whether to work overseas or serve our country irrespective of its present status or you can say changing their religion, based on the available opportunities or options presented before them! Hope we can get above our sentiments & provide the real conditions , so that our people accept the right alternative which is available with them , if we want to maintain our cultural heritage! Hope, i am not getting misunderstood here!🙏🙏🙏
Kudos Swapanda for highlighting and mentioning and raising this issue in sn American setting and an American audience vThis is indeed one of the issues of friction and in exactly thevsame manner that you highlighted. We are Hindus. We don't go around preaching (or even believing) that our God is true and others are false. I wouldn't have thiught a people like that would be accused of religious inltolerance because we don't like being told either thay we are wirshipping false Gods either.
Swap Das Gupta is well known fr his thread bare analysis of any subject. To-days talk on conservatism he has driven in the salient points for the west to ruminate.
listening to Swapan Da is always knowledgable. such a import figure among us, we need more like Swapan Da to churn out of message of Indian core value and cultural value. Its a civilisation not a nation state.
The bottom line is quite plain and simple and that is The West does not want India to develop and progress. India needs to wake up and understand the behaviors of these Countries. India needs to become Industrialized and Military strong and in so doing making its own equipments especially Military equipments. India needs to become better in diplomacy and to play the same game as those that do not wish it well.
I m sure the Indian govt gets it. The worst part of the situation isn’t the Anglo sphere /America but the traitors within and the people who vote for them and support them .
@@wonderworld7721 When you play the great game, you become what is necessary to continue playing it and you pray to continue standing with Dharma, righteousness, when it really counts.
I like independent lines in the foreign policy of the Modi government, but at times, it seems arrogant and on the face. Maybe the current government is playing its hand too hard. We need to grow economically more before comparing what China can afford to do now. It is better to build the strength a bit quietly for a few decades before trying to play over smart. America has a lot of flaws, but it can be beneficial to us. Wait to play the spoiler.
Realpolitic is a hardball game played on the ground. It is like the jungle law. We are now clear about playing the game as it should be played. There is no need for defensiveness or tentativeness in our approach. They jolly well understand our positions and will do business with us as long as it suits them. They know we are doing nothing to hurt their interests.
So Bharat should just roll over and accept American demands (not requests but demands) visa vis Russia? Making your own choice as a country instead of being a puppet is never going to be liked by America…and being independent will only come across as arrogance to people or entities who think it’s their birth right to rule the world ( directly and indirectly)
Americans like 2 kinds of people/nations 1. Those who spit on their face - you'll be surpised but yeah its true. 2. Those who can look into their eyes and do what is right for their country Being pliable doesn't help. I fully understand what strategy you're proposing, but it won't work - it would make us hopelessly dependent on USA without any "real" benefits. e.g India was a huge importer of Iranian oil which we stopped(playing by the strategy you're proposing) because USA wanted us to stop. What did we get in return? Indian airline companies have ordered billions of $ order worth for Boeing and AirBus(Europe) - that hasn't changed USA supporting Pakistan. I can quote 10 more, but you got the point.
The Brits understood india way better than their American counterparts . The Britishers however , had a vested interest to know this continent , i,e looting it's civilizational wealth . And themselves getting richer and powerful on their world dominance .
Very well done Mr. Dasgupta. You can talk this type of highly intellectual International subject when your Bengal is burning. You may say that it is Bengals problem Bengalies voted for TMC but the question is - are they?
Why India Suspects American Intentions? Well it is only LEGITIMATE and VALID to be so. Should it's intensions based on historical acts of U. S. ever since to India and the word, not be questioned. It is highly disturbing for Indians to see the current admin in India is not only pooh poohing U. S. but taking all the dictated about all policies from U. S. No nation in the word, how small, poor or weak takes such orders and dictates be it bankrupt state like Zimbabwe or tiny nation like Singapore.
Well done Swapan! I feel exactly the same coming from elite Indian schools and Ivy Leagues, my WhatsApp chatter is full of shock and heart attacks at what’s happening in USA, Gaza, and India. But I find myself aligned with Western conservatism.
Nehru Gandhi family tree for 70+ years on was put on India by British. So the divide between India and America is essentially British 'divide and rule' policy. Any president normalizing relationship with Asia has met consequences because European and loyalists always wanted to use America on demand
The best way Christian conversion desire ends is when the dollar ends as the reserve currency and they can stop printing money out of thin air. And it cannot come fast enough.
The Indian diaspora especially the folks who are waiting in the Greencard pipeline for years, if converted and given a chance to assimilate into the American society will absolutely support the conservative movement here in the US. These are law abidding, tax paying people whose values align greatly with the conservative values of USA. It is frustrating to see that American conservative politicians are not able to take advantage of this opportunity.
American conservatives should not be welcoming immigrants. They need to conserve the demographics of their own nation which is majority white and Christian. Indian conservatives would do better ti stay in India and improve it. And the same goes for American conservatives
Soft critisism of evangelicals will not make the cut. We cannot work with religious conservatives of the Anglo saxon world. We have lot in common with economic conservatives and capitalists and even some aspects of libertarianism. It is enough for us to work/collaborate with these groups and small portion of "true" liberals . Then Indians can be the king makers. 🧐🤔
Dasgupta Sir has hit the nail, the liberalist America does promote missionaries for conversion, firce African countries to accept Lgbtq which is a societal taboo there. The Ameeicans have got their maths wrong for a long time.
Conservative positioning from philosophical identity is a major basis of Indian identity, that is a dominant aspect of the Indian/Bharatiya psyche ... in fact it is more than identity it is the entity, this the West still don't grasp... but the behavioral or utility aspect of of Indian Hindu psyche (eg political & social) can learn a lot still from the West. Though it is because of the West (to a very large extent) that we developed these handicaps.Yes, Mr. Dasgupta generally echoes a pan Indian perception that West has very little idea of real Indian root ethos. But the political fallout of Conservative politics of India lately demands a more close analysis & scrutiny. I leave it at that. Since this talk is more addressed to a US audience. But we can always have developed some acharyas/professors who are conversant enough, say in French/spanish/German along with english, to open branches on Indian studies attached to consulates or reputed organisations Like RKMission ect. or may have funded even a few seats in Ivy League collages or university. Now, that funds are available Bharat can afford to turn into a patron State, I guess 🙏
Agree, even though the Christians have cleansed more humanity from the earth (who did not accept their political superiority), currently the lzlamic radicals due to their intolerant teaching through their Skybook) are a bigger threat to humanity.
Every knows english language in india jobs are all from american and western nations but not Chinese and Russia so hence along with western countries and US must getbalong with them.
In my mind this recent rise of the classical right position is akin to a final death gasp, I envisage the birth of a new progressive right stance on the horizon. A new right would synchronise the conservative position with academic revelations rather than tradition.
you're right....Geert Wilders, Meloni, and Vivek Ramaswamy and perhaps Nigel Farage (I'd trust Tommy Robinson more than Farage) are the new right with common sense.
People who does not have practical exposure to that particular field should stop giving intellectual lectures. India has two many people who talk too much but none who can act in senseful manner.
He is jumping from point to point... You are talking to Western audience, pls be concise and to the point. Western audience don't know about CAA You are blabbering incoherent sentences to audience who don't know basics of Indian politics.... Last 4/5 minutes were very very good though. This should be our message, US UK.. Are J Christian civilisation India js Hindu civilisation. Simple.
Not just don’t know, they genuinely have hatred that was built over centuries towards d pagans/natives. It’ll take decades to fix it if they started today.
India must not suspect America and its intentions however none prevent India to be independent, cautious and take none for granted as Democracies have election periodicallly and every next Govt. could change its vision, expectation and hopes of next Govt. Change is a key of future.
American history has proven from the last 100 years to be treacherous bedfellows. You seem unaware of American history or what mischief American foreign policy is still causing.
Sir it's not abt suspecting US. The govt and foreign ministry work and take decision based on data and institutional memory. Afterall india has all the right to secure its Interests too.
Sapanda yea kya hey. Deska izzat ka faluda karrahey ho. Why should anyone try to find the difference between friends. You should rather focus on more common ground. Why are you talking about Hindu religion.
Pandering to a fringe element. Mr Dasgupta, you are better than this. A good formulation of his position and his ideas, but he is addressing the wrong crowd. Why is he sharing platform with the likes of Suella Braverman and Jack Posobiec? Why? But then again Mr Dasgupta is the right person in the wrong party. I would have understood if this was just a Heritage foundation event but it not is it? More than half of this crowd are quite open about their Christian nationalist views. Even for all the grifting BJP does, why is it trying to emulate these grifters is beyond me. Mr Dasgupta, you are better than this sir. Your conservatism is nothing like the populist reactionary movements that your party or even the other speakers are associated with.
@@AmitSharma-sc9gg The prime minister's dog whistling in the election is a very good example that showcases the populist reactionary politics that is now associated with BJP. Swapan Dasgupta is a conservative. He came from the legendary time when RW people were the ones who asked the questions and talked about accountability. Whether it is Ramnath Goenka, Arun Shourie or Swapan babu or Chandan Mitra. Went head to head with Dhirubhai Ambani when he was at his peak. Unfortunately, Mr Modi took that legacy and threw it into a dustbin. Most people left or are dead except Swapan babu.
@sena3941 Well, i didn't seem to dispute what u said on stand alone basis, but ur narrative is totally one sided. Conservatives in india are a misnomer, they were defiled and their existence was derided by so called leftists and liberals who always turned a blind eye to the islamic violence and missionaries fraudulent conversions. If a mere look at gyanwapi mosque is not sufficient to know it's origin and a technical review is required then i would say we hide from truths.
I disagree that Hindu religion don't convert. Hindu monks used to go door to door to bring people into their religious fold by making them their disciple and given guru mantra and guidance about how to live family life. These monks would also encourage them to build a temple or donate to help build temple. These monks encouraged their disciple to do Gita, Ramayan path and various types of hawan Puja through which they would introduce hindu ethos and culture. My request to Hindus is stop lying that Hindu religions don't have concept of conversion.
Nonsense. Dharma is a way of life. Values based on dharma are universal so if Brahmans and their Brahmacharis went from door to door asking for alms and preaching it was part of that value based way of life that all would adhere to and in fact all Indians regardless of religion adhere to culturally evem today.
O, no sir. Brahmins and their Brahmacharis, Sanyasis that went and go door to door asking for alms and who preach in return are not doing this to convert. Who gave you that idea? Dharma is not religion it is about universal values. When Brahmins, Brahmacharis, Sanyasis are teaching society's children and advising people generally to uplift them in order to help society function optimally - it becomes the duty of householders to give these noble people alms. Many people of different religions do this who are culturally Indian as they have grown up in a dharmic eco system that is based on universal values. It is understood that the advice you would get from such teachers would make you a better human regardless of which cultural background you come from. Cultural Indians of all affiliations do understand this, which unfortunately judging by your comment you don't. Dharma is not religion but is instead a value based universal way of life.
Okkk... What should a person do to get converted to hinduism? For conversion, people pledge their allegiance to some holy book and an exclusive god. What is that for hinduism ?
Swapan Dasgupta would have an unfulfilled swapan (dream) of ultra conservatism ( scarry when he reiterated with a sarcastic grin, possible regime change in the USA ). The Brahmins and upper caste Hindus made Bengal partitioned ( Dr. Joya Chatterjee of Cambridge ) and migrated to West Bengal by their own choice leaving behind the poor, lower caste and NamoSudra Hindus in East Bengal but forcefully deported them to remote, deserted Andaman/ Dandayakaran if they crossed the border later, played victimhood and looked for a false pretense to become an elite religious conservative.
@@mayankindian3750 Partition of Bengal was orchestrated by Hindus.Bengal Divided: Hindu Communalism and Partition, 1932-1947 (Cambridge South Asian Studies, Series Number 57): Dr joya Chatterjee.
Bengal was first partitioned in 1905 by Viceroy Lord Curzon based on the demands of AIML. Bal Gangadhar Tilak led the INC in a civil dis-obedience movement and forced Curzon to reverse this. No muslims were part of this movement. In 1946 - 47 , when it became clear that the Muslims of British India overwhelmingly wanted a Muslim majority Pakistan the question of East Pakistan came up. AIML and their leaders like Sehasrawady wanted entire Bengal ( and by extension Assam / present day North Eastern India) to become part of Pakistan. Shyama Prasad Mukherjee ( of HMS ) led a movement to prevent the Hindu majority West Bengal and Assam/NE India ( which also had significant Budhist/Animist/Christian population) to remain as part of India. In this he was backed by the entire Bengal INC. This is the entire crux of Joya Chaterjee's book. So the Ghazis were not able to conquer and murder millions of Hindus in West Bengal and Assam. This is what you are sad about. In 1947 East Bengal had 40% Hindus. Today that is about 6%. All the Hindus have been ethnically cleansed. Chittagong district of Bangladesh was majority Chakma tribe Budhist. They have all been ethnically cleansed from there and now live in refugee camps in NE India. And you are then showing concern for Namosudras ? If Shyam Babu was not successful all the hindus in W, bengal would now have been ethnically cleansed to Bihar and Orissa and NE India would probably look like civil war torn Northern Myanmar. By the way the people who forced the Namosudras to Dandakaryan etc were Marxists like Jyoti Basu , Pramod Das Gupta etc. The Marxists also let in millions of illegal Bangladeshi muslim infiltrators and gave them ration cards &citizenship while denying the same to Namosudras. This policy is continued today by the Trinamul Congress. The leadership of the TMC and CPM are all Bhadra Lok. The Hindu nationalist base in Bengal is Namosudras and other Dalit communities. So if you are a Bengali Ghazi dreaming of having West Bengal and NE India as part of Bangladesh, you should be considering Bhadra Lok as your allies. Swapan is an exception.
@@petermathews1515 Full of distortion of historical facts, biased and prejudicial mindset. Hope you carry on these delusional, unreal world views and it would be a futile exercise to spend time and energy to focus on "other" views.
Yes india is semi socialist nation. We have come out of hardcore communism just in 1990s and for such massive population to adopt principle of capitalism free market atleast 2 generations r needed. Also with such low per capita some of the services will always be present with the govt apart from pvt sector like education health etc
India even has price control enforcement in place! The principles are anti-liberty and anti-economy. Remember: Any time the government provides the services, they will be the most expensive and with the lowest quality!
@@anonymouslyopinionated656 your whole ideology can be summed up with "The real multi-racial society has never been tried". Unless you're of the same provenance as the founder of this whole thing. Then it's much more insidious and hypocritical.
There are three different "Rights" in America - Populist Nationalist right, White Nationalist Right and Christian Nationalist Right. This is obviously a conference of the first , otherwise they would not have people from the Indian right here. As far as the true right goes, that is like an exercise in finding the true scotsman.
@@petermathews1515 There is kosher-right and right, that's all. Who does Hazony think he is to come from Israel and throw out Brimelow and Nick. He did that precisely because he saw the true, nationalist right rising. There are no "3 right wings", that's just their obfuscation. You can't be a nationalist without being rooted on a sense of peoplehood. A nation for everyone is a nation for no one. This has been happening with the right all along. Remember Bill Kristol's neocons, former Trockyists who did the same thing?
