Excellent video, James. I am no naval architect or laminates engineer but I am a 200-ton captain and marine electrician with over 50,000 at sea in small craft. I built three glass/plywood multihulls in the early 1980s, two Pivers and a Wharram. We were real novices back then and knew little about stresses, direction of weaving, special resins, etc. I doubt any of the boats I built are still afloat. Your commenters are making some interesting observations. From my 40 years in the boat business, many of those years in multihulls, I would conclude you could have gotten another 20-30 years out of this boat if you had remained in near shore waters. That is a lot of service out of a glass/ply catamaran. I think you and the boat have done very well. The butt kicking you got south of Hawaii took a lot of years off the old girl. I am glad you sailed her as much as you did and applaud your outstanding seamanship in getting Zingaro ashore.
No-one is talking about the rigging being part of the reason. Dyneema has no stretch and in past videos James is often tightening the rigging more and more. If you over tighten the rigging then either the mast goes down of the hulls come up. I've seen it on a 2 year old Lagoon 62. Add in old wood and continual torsional stress of large seas and this could be the result. Stoked to see the new boat.
not a conventional mono/cat different reaction to the loads. Plywood and glass, the beams and stringers looked undersized to me for offshore work, just an uneducated opinion. If you look at Wharrams after offshore work they need to be tweaked back into shape...same forces apply to ply boats. Just old and clapped out I think was the reality of this episode..still saved them though.
I completely and respectfully diagree!!! Zingaro had a 25ft breaking sea on her side...she got her ass kicked repeatedly by this sea state. Over tight rigging would have displayed in many ways, and James is an astute enough sailor to catch them.
You sailed a 40 year old boat 25 thousand miles and got back to Hawaii safely. I think you get a trophy. Good job. I’m sure you will be back out on the water soon.
Built light for speed, it didn't have enough strength or integrity to deal with the conditions it met. Home built boats don't really have a lot of failsafes built in, when they reach their limit they fail catastrophically. Boats built in shipyards have a lot of careful planning to deal with stresses and rough conditions and cats need to be super stiff to retain their integrity. It was already past it's best and you had been pushing it fairly hard, changing the rigging may have affected the tension on the hulls or it may have already been too late before you did that. As others have said, strip out what you can sell and walk away, it requires too much structural work to be viable again.
Just glad you two are ok. When you went silent I told my wife I was worried about some RU-vidrs.... I hope this new plan works out well for you and glad you are sharing what is going on.
Thanks for the video, James. IMHO, being in the middle of a synthetic re-rigging of my Irwin 46, the learning curve has been extensive. Since you asked for our thoughts, I believe the biggest cause is the size of your Dyneema standing rigging. You once wrote to me that the one thing you would have done differently was to use heat annealed Dyneema. I completely agree. But there is another issue of even greater importance, and that is the removal of the stretch of Dyneema. From what I have learned, non-heat annealed needs to be stretched to about 20% of its breaking strength before the majority of the stretch subsides. ⅜" has a breaking strength of almost 20,000lbs, and 20% of that is 4,000lbs of tension. Multiply that by the rest of your rigging and you will see the amount of torque all that tension placed on your deck and stringers, just to remove the stretch. I see tears, cracks and splitting, all in an outer hull upward direction, twisting in the direction of your rigging tension. Therefore, the numbers clearly show that oversizing Dyneema for standing rigging is a no-no. Case in point: If your boat came with 5/16" 304 stainless steel standing rigging, it has a breaking strength of 8,200lbs. To match that breaking strength, Dyneema ¼" is 8,600lbs. 20% to remove the stretch is 1,720lbs. Your point about using heat annealed is absolutely correct, because once most of the stretch has been removed, it doesn't need to be tensioned as much to remove the remaining stretch. Personally, I'm using 5/16" (7mm) heat annealed on my main mast and am actually concerned that it may be too big. However, it has a breaking strength of 18,700lbs, but it only needs to be tensioned to 10% of that to remove 90% of the remaining stretch. 1,870lbs is ½ the tension needed for ⅜" regular Dyneema, while it is 2.5 times stronger than the 5/16" stainless steel I replaced. What happened to Zingaro? After numerous tensionings, I believe there was so much tension on your standing rigging, that when the wave slammed against the inner hull as the other hull slid down into the trough, it was the straw that broke the camels back, and it tore your boat in half. From what I have learned, when it comes to using Dyneema for standing rigging, I agree that heat annealed is absolutely mandatory, ...but that bigger is not better. Again, that's my humble opinion. (BTW, love the new boat! May even see you in the SoPac later this year.)
Hey... Brilliant look through at the damage. Remembering the bow quartering seas, thumping into the forward sections of the starboard hull prior to the break. I see on the deck failure along the beam, forward area, and the failure along the starboard back of cabin deck beam. That I believe was as a result of impact to the forward starboard hull on that point of saling with the wind from the starboard side. The port hull would have been the solid grip in the water, amplifying the pressure wave through the hull... The main support beams would have snapped, most likely at the holes drilled into the beams. Subsequent to that, the torsion of the not rigid structure would have stressed the skin covering the load cells of nthe beams and plywood bulkhead overlap to beam sheet ply overlap. Just not strong enough in these conditions. Add to the break of the beams, with the breeze up at the time, the pressure from the rig would have amplified the distortion across the deck to finish off the damage to the level of catastrophic... Looking at the supporting beams and the method of attachment in cementing the hulls to that stress area, I'd say the cat was designed for coastal work, and not structurally engineered to handle the rigors of off shore work as you were doing. I would say the cat is salvageable for rig, deck gear and personal items and a bulldozer through the remains... Sorry... Built my first model sail boat aged 7, Just in the last 10 years, 3 more liveaboard yachts, including a James Wharram 30 footer, off shore cat... Now building a house boat out of a commercial barge, so I have a life time of experience in stress, build strength and observation on calamities... She's toast I m afraid ... on the up side, she got you both into harbour... that's a huge epitaph for the old girl...
Dan221075 I built several houses and this boat would never pass a house inspection and that boat should have been built much stronger than a house! I thought they were all steel I beam reinforced but good grief I didn’t even see a 4x4 beam! Floor joists are 2x12! Never buy a wood boat guys that art died when fiberglass was invented!
@@peterscherling9000 Hi Pete, structurally wood is great, strength for weight rivals carbon. When used with epoxy can be as low maintenance as glass. My guess is polyester not epoxy was used in construction. The glue failure in the ply might indicate a non marine grade.
@@MrRourk In that video it was never clear about what he was going to do with the boat, he just mentioned that one component could be repaired, but at the end they offered a week on Zingaro 2.
if you know the youtube story.... they got their money out of that boat. it went the distance for sure. thanks to James and his ingenuity. but its time to find that next home. cheers to Zingaro. From Upstate NY
After watching this, I am even more amazed that you were able to keep that thing afloat, much less get it to a yard. Quite a impressive bit of seamanship. While other “sailors” often abandon their boats for relatively minor reasons. You and Kimmi got the stuff!
She was rode hard an put away wet...one to many times be4 u!!! Love y'all an am glad you all survived....my house just burnt down Thursday nite an when trauma happens in the end ur just grateful to get out with ur life.....sending love an light to you 2❗🤘💪😊🌞⛵💯❗
Hi Kimi, hi James! I'm Matthias from Hamburg / Germany. First I want to apologize for my bad English, it is a mixture of rusty school English and google translater ;) What you showed in the video is really incredible! I don't want to imagine what could have happened to both of you if the boat had collapsed under your ass on a longer passage with lots of wind and waves. What happened to you is also a warning for others, for boat owners, for boat designers and builders, for example also for me. I am not a professional boat designer, but I have studied construction technology and have been working on a plan for a 45 ft catamaran for about 3 years now, which I would like to build or have built at some point later. Right at the beginning of my construction, I thought about how to connect the hulls to the bridge deck in a stable manner. Even then I came up with a completely different solution than you can see on your boat. I can agree with your analysis of the errors in the construction of your boat on most points. Wet plywood, bulkheads and beams that are too thin, holes in beams (who makes such a shit ???), beams that are interrupted and carried on elsewhere, and in my opinion too small-sized beams and too thin GRP laminates are reasons for the breakdown. But in my opinion, the boat would have broken apart at some point, or at least would have suffered fatigue fractures if the components just mentioned above had been dimensioned correctly. I see the problem in the small radius at the 90 degree angle between the hulls and the bridge deck. This connection is too weak. I mean the area that you can see in the video at 1:00 min and that is filled with foam under the laminate. The radius is much too small or a 45 degree support is missing between the hull and the bridge deck. And PU foam has no business at this point. This area should have been filled with glass and resin. In my design I chose a 65 degree support, which has a hypotenuse of 1.4 m compared to the right angle between the hull and the bridge deck. If you are interested, I would be happy to send you a few pictures of my construction. I wish you the best and good luck and I am excited to see how it goes on.
Hello Matthias, your comment is very comprehensive and analytical, but I do not think that this is expedient for the two. The two need a resilient cat to continue the blog without a year or two interruption. I have no idea how far your design has been realized but I see the future in art like this: volt-at-sea.segelnblogs.de/ or similar constructions. Doing it yourself in the field of plastic is not feasible.
@@albertfunk1176 I only gave my design as an example and as a comparison for another solution on how to connect hulls to the bridge deck. Of course, it now takes far too long to build a new boat now.
With you since before Kimmi, James. Since your first accident. Your content has grown and so have you! I’m enjoying your progress! It’s super exciting to see your Kickstarter campaign has doubled your target!?! 🤪 I bet you’re stoked with the support - just goes to show that people will always resonate with real people full of heart! Your channel is about to go huge - I’ve got a great feeling. You’re way more interesting than some of the bigger sailing couples (no offence to those guys). I bet you’re excited to ramp up another level! Keep it sexy, informative and dramatic my dude! 😎
Thanks for the tour of Zingaro 1. Take lots of pictures to remind u of that last wild ride. Here is believing that Zingaro 2 will bring many good times, and Z 1 will fade into history.
There's nothing of substance that ties the hulls to the deck bridge, the fiber glass tabbing is not wide/extensive enough and the stringers don't tie into the deck bridge. A bunch of people have suggested the dyneema rigging as causing the issue but that may have just exacerbated the design flaw. It also could the quality of the resin that was used during the build. You guys are just lucky to have the incident happen where and when it did. Really glad you guys are safe. Can't wait to see Zingaro II. Fair winds to you both.
Zingaro was a great boat! She did really well for her age and size. But any boat can fail... New, old, wood, steel, GRP, design, engineering, maintenance, there's so many variables. We are happy you arrived safe! And we expect to see you soon in the water! Fair winds
Stress crack due severe dynamic loading caused the failure. Stress crack occurs at every bulk head opening/hole, very similar to BOAC DeHavilland Comet plane window caused by metal fatigue (constant bending & debending). Literally, every hole has crack failure, on this video. Solution is smaller rounder hole/opening or reinforced the crack areas on both sides. Meaning both hulls need similar reinforcement to fix. IMHO dyneema rigging contributes 3% due to less forgiveness. Dynamic load = pounding storm waves.
Total respect to you and your crew that you were able to bring it in with that damage in those conditions. Amazing seamanship. Can’t imagine how harrowing that was.
I see that your Kickstarter will be over subscribed. Do not use the overage above the downpayment to simply pay down the loan. Put the excess funds in a dedicated interest bearing account to pay the boat mortgage payment and insurance. This will give you about a year of flexibility on your monthly loan payment -- you do not want to subject yourself to foreclosure if you have a short term cash flow problem. This is very important.
@@thelastpirate *_ James, that's the hull that you flooded some time back.... what did you do.... Just drain it and Carry on?? Did you ever consider that various factors were already setting into a Ride of Desaster?? No, be honest! _*
Those main beams were really wimpy to begin with. They looked like 2x4s and they had 2 inch notches cut into them. They were basically 2x2s at the notches. Hope you're back on the water soon, on a strong boat.
I saw that too. Those two large bolts did not help. Looked to be built lightweight to be fast coastal cruiser. Not built for 25 foot waves in Hawaiian waters.
Viewing this video of Zingaro on the hard, was a good educational experience on boat construction and the hull failure. Thank You. Good luck on Zingaro II
Fascinating. I’m amazed you were able to keep it together on the trip back to Hawaii. I had a 1986 powerboat that had rot in the main stringer. You just are not aware of it until you have a problem because it’s all hidden under fiberglass. And once the wetness sets in, you may not know it for 10 to 20 years later. And its very hard to repair.
After seeing this damage we are glad that the two of you are safe and on to the new adventure. We were worried when you guys went silent, glad to have you back in our lives. Fair winds my friends! And good sailing with Zingaro II!
I’m glad you guys weren’t harmed in the storm. I have to agree with other commentators, that cat is toast. Not worth much but maybe you can auction off all the good stuff. That’s very sad. You two made a lot of great memories on that ⛵️. Take care.
When I told you to keep breaking shit I didn't expect you to go this far. I'm glad you and Kimmi are okay and will sail again. Congrats on the new boat but I will miss seeing Zingaro in her battle worn condition. All the best 1YC..
Congrats on the successful jury rig to get it and yourselves to land. It's nice to actually see the forensics. All too often the damaged boat is abandoned at sea. Thanks for taking us through that. It's Great info for boatbuilders. Apparently, the builders back then depended too heavily on plywood glues holding together for the long-term.
I am just glad Zingaro got you home. Boats have a lifespan regardless of what they are made of. Steel, wood, fiberglass, whatever. Zingaro was nearing the end of her lifespan before she failed.
I have worked on alot of fiberglass boats. I believe most of them are made of Polyester resin and Glass Mat. It is the cheapest material available. Polyester does not like to stick to wood. Epoxy is the best and more expensive.
I love you guys and I'm sorry that your boat broke, but the journey has always been about the people operating the boat. I'm glad you will be getting into a new Cat and I can't wait to see your new videos and travels. Be safe and we'll see ya on the flip side.
I think it’s a combination of glue failure over time and maybe putting a lot of stress on the outer portion of the hulls pulling up from over tighten the dyneema rigging
Pitched in a little to your kickstarter. I sincerely wish you all the best with your new adventure! Can't wait to see a tour of your new boat :) Safe travels!
Thanks for this video. I thought I had problems with just a dusty boat on the outside. You have inspired me to just clean up my boat and be happy. People don't understand that boats not only can leak from the bottom but it seems most of the damage to a boat is it leaking from the top! Also, the ocean must be really respected. It can take your boat and you in the blink of an eye. Thanks for the vid. I'm gonna start cleaning!
James thank you for “the destruction rundown”. I know it was heartbreaking for you and Kimmi. But, I am so thankful that you were able to make it as far as you did, safely. Will look forward to Zingara II, and more adventures. Sorry Kimmi must move on, she will be missed a lot. Much love, prayers, lots of well wishes! My opinion- Das Boot, - Ist Kaputz!
This is a great lesson for would-be boat designers and builders, as well as anyone else trying to assess a used boat. She really looks like she ought to be taken apart and put back together.
So happy you guys are safe and made it into the harbor in Hawaii !!! Because of the extensive damage, I gotta say I wouldn't take this boat if you gave it to me!! So glad you guys are getting something newer and should be much safer and comfortable!! Looking forward to following along on your coming adventures !!! Cheers!!!!
So glad you two got out of that okay! It could have been so much worse. At least you’re back in the states and should be able to get any supplies you need relatively easily.
I think there were a few amendments to the Crowther plans. Those doorways for example seem to be very narrow at the tops--I think someone cut part ot the top away to get easier passage through those portals.
Great run down video James! I agree with others, just move on and get a different boat. I often wondered if zingaro was designed to be a blue water cruiser, She’s more of a racer/performance boat.. Stay Safe and just start over 😎🍻
"All ships are safe in a harbor, but that's not what ships are for." -proverb Glad y'all are safe and sound. That's all that matters. This is just Poseidon telling you it's time for a new ship and a new adventure, one you can both share from the start. We'll all be sure to stay tuned. Fair winds...
@@coffeefish James even said this a couple of months ago in a live chat, rebuild from the hulls up. Those stringers were way under sized and configured for an off shore boat.
Daniel Oliver ...that, and the structural laminations were a little too thin to be structural imho. But what do I know? I’m not an engineer! I’ve done major hull repairs to 14-to-18/20’ boats that a) had more ‘glass thickness from the factory and b) got at least that much from me for the repairs.
We felt so bad when we herd what happen because everyone knows that’s you guys house and way of living, we wish you well and new comings , I wish we be rich so we can buy you a new Sailboat ⛵️
I think it's not really a fault in the boat, Zingaro just became a victim of the ocean. It's a lot to ask of a cat, huge forces are transmitted to two hulls. Even a glass boat can be destroyed given the unlucky placement of waves.
I don't think so. A real blue water boat wouldn't have been destroyed. The conditioms were harsh nur not that harsh. Zingaro was very light built for speed not for offshore cruising.
I work with both wood and composites and what I see happen often is boat builders not fully understanding the value of grain and fabric weave direction. The grain direction and weave directions are key to the overall strength. A bais direction "S" glass patch over that high-stress area would have done wonders. Twas all the little fibers that were in the right direction that held her together in the end.. Just not enough of them
Firstly, I am glad you are both safe and sound. I am always amazed that the fiberglass boats have so much wood in them and that that wood, surrounded by the so called impermeable fiberglass, ends up rotting. My theory is that wooden boats are not as high maintenance as people fear and fiberglass boats are by no means the waterproof maintenance free structures they are purported to be. I hope your new boat is wood.
I just want to say I am thankful you guys survived that storm! I am impressed with your actions taken while under duress! I'm no structural engineer, but you have to trace your damage from the point of contact, keel to top deck and the pressure was dispersed upward and outward from there. That boat doesn't look, to me, to have ever been seaworthy but rather a coastal cruiser. Unfortunately you found the limits of your vessel. Thanks for the follow up and for sharing your adventures with us.
This is an early design, and was meant for sailing fast up and down the Australian coastline, I think the construction on this particular boat was a bit "lets get it done" rather than attention to all the finer details. The fact that it has lasted so long is a testament to the quality of the design. It was/is well past it's used by date, so has done well to get this far. It's time for a Viking burial. I actually can't remember the last time I've seen one of these in Aus, I think most of them have been retired long ago. I commend you on your choice for the next cat and I wish the two of you success in that endeavour . Cheers Rustie.
Dyneema is no joke. For it to cut threw like that. Crazy. James.... Did you find another boat. I am young guy with not enough money to be donating. But i defiantly support you and watch the videos all the way thru. You and Kim are my first realization that I too want to get out there and live the boat life. I'm working hard to one day be out there with you on the ocean. Please. Stay true to your goal of finding a new boat and getting out to making more videos and content for us Mainlanders. Cheers from Upstate NY.
Wow you guys are very lucky to made it to land. It looks like that boat could have just fell apart the rest of the way with one more big wave. Great think on your part James putting the rope all around the boat to hold it together. Glad you guys survived your boat accident . Good luck on your new boat purchase.
Good video! You and Colin from Parlay Revival should compare notes and share with everyone - many similarities in the structural failures from different era and construction boats. Great to see your new Oyster - excellent choice!!.
4 года назад
Wishing the Very best for you guys and a New boat.... i still think YOUR skills saved that boat and your lives... Your a Hell of a Sailor 07
Mm as a boat builder the ply is not rotting and still fine what has happened is the little cracks over the years that haven't bien looked after have let water in. The glass is still good with wood fibers on it and the ply is not rotting. Lack of keeping a timber boat strong. You didn't maintain her property as you can see by the mould on the walls. Epoxy glue joins don't brake
My guess the the mould happened in the yard after the accident, the boat didn't seem mouldy when they were living on it. It's now march and the incident happened before Christmas, so plenty of time for mould to form in a boat, if it were me, I wouldn't be cleaning mould on a boat that broken.
@@daveamies5031 if fiberglass is done right when pulled away from timber it usually takes it with it. Unless water gets involved. As per his video. Lack off care and maintenance. Water ingress that delaminated the glass glue.
Glad you both made it safe... Hope your new adventure is everything your dreams are made of....but PLEASE do me a favour.....Cruise at a RELAXED pace.....All most all the good things in life are more enjoyable when your cruising along & smell the roses , so when you push/over stress rigs the loads are ENORMOUS & SHIT WILL SIMPLY BREAK Remember , your going remote....ENJOY...cheers
James in the spirit of paying it forward I wouldn’t sell Zingaro. I would strip her and sell what you can. The things that have meaning for you and Kimmi and those that can be used on the new boat ship to Australia. Zingaro is gone. Your hard work and her spirit got you two into port under her power and safe. Be thankful and proud of what has been accomplished and say good bye but don’t let someone else inherit her broken hull and maybe a tragedy later.
Maybe when you trashed the dagger boards, and banged up the hulls back in 2017, you did some damage, that wasn't noticeable, and that plus the age and structural oddities conspired to finish off you boat. Is it possible that necessary rigging adjustments were an early indicator of future failure, given you were using Dyneema.
