I still respect them, they are very beautiful and awesome. My neighbor collects mustangs, terminator, gt500, and two older fast backs, they are indeed super quick, crazy that a 1998 Cobra can still keep close to my 2016 Camaro ss.
I own a Procharged Vette but would love to have a Mystic Chrome Terminator sitting next to it. I'm not a Ford or Chevy guy or whatever brand. I am a car guy if it's cool I'm about it
Chicago1 I own 4 fords, 1 Chevy, and an infiniti. I enjoy each for their own reasons. It’s good not to close out other options or you miss out. It’s good to see another enthusiast
Yes, exactly- and caused other manufactures to up their game. It’s because of the Terminator that you have the Hellcat and other supercharged cars (ZL1, CTS-V,)
I will bless Colletti to my dying day for sticking to his guns vs Ford and creating the Terminator Cobra...my dream car! Imagine what the early GT500s would be if Colletti had stuck around to run the project! I never realized how weak the bottom ends are on the Shelbys. With what Ford charged for those cars brand new, they could have easily afforded to stick with the beefier connecting rods instead of cheaping out and hurting the power potential that could have created another legendary mustang like the Terminator! Great video Danny! I hope the fans of Mustang Lifestyle are watching this. LOL
@@taylorc2542 he didn't "trail the fbodies in the 90s" the na cobras was more than an lt1 could handle stock for stock and was not far off an ls1 car ecsp an early ls1 fbody (in the 90s before they had ls6 intakes they were rated the same but the 90s ls1 didn't make the power the later ones did). The na cobras were fairly close competitors to the gm fbodies being quicker than the lt1 but just a tick behind the ls1 typically. The 99 cobra was casting issues on the intake manifolds and an issue with the exhaust that was restricting flow causing power to be down. Once you port your intake and get an exhaust they will make the same power as an 01 cobra with the same mods people make this way more of a big deal than it was. Ford actually did this for you as part of the recall.
The 07 up gt500 is pretty stout. They aren't "weak" by any stretch especially by 07 standards the connecting rod just isn't as stout as the ones in the terminator but they can still make 700-800 easily many many people have done this. The gt500 is stronger and better in just about every other way outside the connecting rods. I love both cars the cobra is legendary but i think some of the cobra guys are extremely biased to the cobra and exaggerate how "weak" the gt500 engine is.
@@midnight347 Agreed but imagine the Gt500 with Cobra rods! What a total killer it would have been. Shelbys are better than Terminators in many ways but also way more expensive. Considering their age Terminators are not doing bad at all for being 20 years old. Still raising eyebrows and getting thumbs up everytime I take mine out...not to mention gapping Camaros and Hellcats! lol
Terminator for sure. Those rods coming stock with the car is amazing. Would love to have a Cobra in my garage next to my E55 AMG, another supercharged beast.
Chevy guy? Lol that is so gay you will buy anything Chevy puts out? What a sheep. Can't people just like cars? Do you really have to be a "Chevy guy" lol. 🤡
they were badass cars! but then again i raced a few with 600+ hp and whipple blowers in my 2002 corvette z06 bone stock.. other than driver mod lol and never had problems pulling on them especially off the line. Thats the day i became a hardcore chevy fan. after owning a z06 for less than a year and it runs strong today still with about 190k miles
@@user-ci7cg7tf3o ,In your dreams will that stock 335rwh Vette pull on a 600rwh Terminator.Stock for stock the Vette will easily win a track lap.On the drag strip it's a driver's race.We had bone stock ones at an SVT track rental(US41 Dragway) turning 12.4-12.5's with tires.Pullied cars at 430-440rwh turning 12.0's and afew Kenny Bell 2.2's at 490-500rwh turning low 11's.Vettes are much lighter,and the rule of thumb is Terminators need about 100hp more to pull on one.I used to do lots of 50mph pulls against all manner of cars on the bridges of Tampa bay late at night,and my car at 549rwh would pull the hell out of an 06z06.That's why you see so many of those heads and cammed,to keep up with the 600rwh forced induction cars.
@@johnrunion7258 02 z06s put down more than 330 hp to the wheels......and not just a few horses more. I'm sure a 600hp cobra would be having traction issues though if a stock z pulled on one though. Those c5 z06s hooked up pretty good on the street with just stock tires. He did say he mainly pulled them off the line
@@terrybates5509 I attended many dyno sessions in the Chicago area after I got my '04 terminator and and some of our SVT members were also owners of Corvettes and Camaros including a rare (I think '92 ZR-1 twin cam).They also brought these cars to our SVT track rental days.The highest dyno # I saw on these stock(air kit only) LS6's was 350rwh.A couple others were in the 335-340rwh.Maybe someone is fudging.Without DR's and suspension mods,you had to leave the line almost off idle due to the supercharger's torque characteristics,dumping 450# of torque at 2000rpm.Then if you got into it too early it would break loose again.You needed a lot of seat time to get under a 2.0 60'with stock tires.Mount some stickies and bag the springs to keep the ass from squatting,and you are in the 1.7's.Those ZO6's would slow walk my 04(378rw stock) from a 40 roll,but a pulley,exhaust, and a tune pushed mine to 437rw and that was enough to turn the tables.These engines are capable of 1000rwh without touching a valve cover screw.Chevy will see the light one day and make big power without sounding like a AA/F'er.When I was at 550rwh,I got pulled by my friend's 12.50 Lightning five cars off the line,at 1,000ft I flew by him like he was parked.Without extensive drag set-up,these cars never see their full potential at the dragstrip.
The GT500 has more potential. Much better flowing cylinder heads (and physically stronger cylinder heads, better material and more deck thickness) and more displacement. Blower to blower, the GT500 slaughters Terminator on power. The stock GT500 rod is good for ~850 rw and 7000 rpm if you keep them off of the rev limiter. The GT500 is also otherwise dead reliable. They have next to zero cooling or valve train problems (guides, valve seats), unlike the Cobra. The GT500’s 5.4 was just a much better executed power plant that happened to have powered metal rods. Rod to rod, the GT500 is a much better power producer and is more reliable than the 03 Cobra.
Terminator Can Handle 750 h.p. W/ Right Spchgr.(2.8.KB) ,Before Wrist Pins Get A Little Shaky.A Stg.2 or 3 Porting W/Eaton + Few Bolt Ons Can Handle Early GT 500' s
Long time Mustang fan here… I found this video incredibly informative, and really interesting to watch. Thanks for the detail and thoroughness! You definitely gave me something to think about when I get my next Mustang!
I own and track an 08 GT500. I would have GLADLY paid the additional $472 (if Ford just passed off the cost with no profit margin in the MSRP) for the forged rods. That was a stupid compromise on their part, especially given all the bad press that resulted from it
My 03 Cobra with a hi-flow X pipe, magna flow cat-back, and K&N filter with a tune dynoed 428 to the tires. Bad ass car back then, ran 12.00@118 on stock F1's at Cecil County.
I owned an 04 Cobra for 10 years and traded it in on a 2014 GT500. The sticker on my GT 500 reads base MSRP of $54,800 and $59465 with options. So I don't know how you get one over $67k MSRP. A $35k MSRP 04 Cobra, adjusted for 10 years of inflation would be around $52k in 2014. For the extra couple grand I think I'd take the 662hp job. I saw some glitches with my 04 - squeaky steering rack, excess drivetrain slack, and a droning, out out balance driveshaft. Heat soak and power loss was noticeable after a couple of runs due to the iron block. I did get 386 RWHP bone stock. I loved the 04 but my GT500 is a tighter, better built car and I have experienced no issues in my 8 years of ownership other than Takata airbag recalls. Also, according to one of the tech articles of the day, the SVT engineers said they decided to use the 3:31 axle to help control wheelspin at highway speeds as much as attain 200 mph. I banked on SVT putting to use their 10 years of cumulative knowledge in building reliable, blown modular v8s when they engineered the Trinity 5.8 engines.
Really enjoyed this video, nicely done! The Terminator is the benchmark car that kicked off the second golden age of muscle. Someday OJC will get the recognition he deserves.
This is such a great video Danny, you did a great job, I’ve watched many many time and find myself always learning something new .. You did a great job representing both cars. The Termi will always be my favorite car, and mustang of all time!
Thank You!...I have been watching just about every RU-vid video I can find on the Terminator Mustangs (even bought a hardback copy of the “Iron Fist, Lead Foot” book) but I have to acknowledge that your video is one of the most detailed and accurate that I have seen so far!..Awesome job! 👍😉
I’m really glad you enjoyed the video! I also have many videos on maintenance and repair. If you haven’t already done so, please subscribe and check out my playlist. ru-vid.com/group/PLIjr-uSYDZi7hBrphoRniyYjb707PpPTu
FANTASTIC video man! I learned a GANG of knowledge from this video, that otherwise would have forever left false assumptions tattooed to my car enthusiast certificate. With 25 years in automotive as my profession AND passion, that’s priceless. You’ve also managed to change my mind on a decision I made over a year ago, to get another C5 zo6 when it’s time to scoop up a new toy. I’ve owned a C5z before, and so far it’s been my personal all time favorite “driver experience” platform I’ve owned so far, that doesn’t boast 35inch tires & a wench. After learning so much about the Terminator (had no idea there were mustangs in existence with IRS...nor the cool back~story that birthed another engine, on a very short list, that is way over~built enough to earn the “Legendary” label engines like the 2Jz and RB lineup have earned), I’m almost obligated to hunt for my Terminator starting TODAY! Super informative & well~researched! Thanks!!!
Audio Engineer They are very awesome, hilghly respected and sought after cars- and even carry SVT heritage that is no longer around (it’s now “Ford Performance”
I have owed an O3 & O4 Cobra and currently have a 2007 GT500. I enjoyed the Cobra's but prefer the GT500. The suspension and brakes are weak on Cobra's. The cowl shake was terrible on both Cobras. Even with sub frame connectors it was still there. It is a suspension set up from 1979 when the cars were making less than 200HP. The cowl shake is better on the GT500 but is still noticeable. The brakes on the GT500 are much better in my opinion. The IRS was an issue if you wanted to go drag racing. The engine could handle big power but not that rear end without some major mods. All of the bushings and axles had to be replaced or the wheel hop was awful. My Cobra's were fun but to me the GT500 is an all around better car. My GT500 has about 700rwhp and I have not had any issues but I am not beating on my GT500. The Cobra engine can obviously hold more power but there are other drive line issues that hold it back. You will not go wrong with either car. I just prefer the GT500.
Michael Ward My question (as other stated, but I want your opinion) is do you think the better brakes actually make a difference, or simply compensate for the bigger mass of the GT500 and therefore they are equal?
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage The GT500 weighs 300-400 pounds more. The Cobra has 2 piston calipers with 13 inch rotors while the 2007 GT500 has 4 piston calipers with 14 inch rotors. To me they feel like better brakes when going from one to the other and you need them with the extra weight. The stock Brembo pads on the GT500 are junk with way to much brake dust. Everyone always talks about their RWHP. I am a big believer with big HP you need better brakes. My GT500 has the 13/14 GT500 rear brakes and the stock Brembos upfront. Hawk pads with stainless steel lines and DOT 4 fluid. The GT500 stops very well but not a fair comparison because you could do similar upgrades to a Cobra. The 13/14 GT500's have much better brakes than the Cobra's and 07-12 GT500s. Just my opinion...
@@michaelward7517 terminators have twin piston 40.5mm front calipers, not 4 piston... you were right in your original post... front brakes on my 04 GT are off a Cobra.
Great video! Just bought an 03 DSG Terminator myself! Dream car... took 11 cars and 3 states to find a good one. Paid 25k for it... no mods with 27k on the clock!! Can’t wait for spring to start the mods!! These cars will only go up in value!
Mark. Nice find! i just found me an 03 ebony coupe, 3,200 miles on the clock! and i paid 33k. Im in love. My dream car as well. Took me 16 years 4 trade ups to finally get it. Cooling mod 1st thing for me. Exhaust next. Good luck with your build!
1967 stroker Great find yourself Sir!! Crazy seeing a car 16/17 years old selling for retail prices!!! But worth every penny!! Head cooling mods on the list as well here....👍🏻
@@markd-man3279 i did the evenflo gen 2 cooling mod with a 170 stat, so i didnt have to remove blower or tranny. That dang casting plug kicked my a$$! It took me all day. And it didnt come with the 3" of 5/8" Hose (had to go and buy from local parts store). But other than that pretty easy install i guess. I got my stock midpipe off now, going with bassani off-road x pipe. Should get it this week.
Right on! Thank you for the comparison. I had a yellow 03 cobra. The SC whine and acceleration was Crazy! You don’t know it until you drive it. Hope to get another 03-4 cobra in the future.
Thank You very much for this video, great breakdown of the 2 cars. I was thinking of going that route but this convinced me to stay with my 03 cobra, thank you for this class. Class in session.
You are mentioning your opinion. I have had both and the gt500 is a better in every way. You downplayed the issues to make the terminator sound amazing. Valve guides falling out, I had wrist pin issues, intercooler pump issues. Ect.
Yep, lots of people who obviously have not owned enough cars yet. We can all get attached to something and lose our perspective. I was the same way with my first few cars.
I have told people all these things and they act like I’m crazy…excellent video that backs up what I’ve told some people I know.. the terminator was the last true SVT mustang
Rock Diesel Thank you. I’m glad you enjoyed it. Here are more of the videos like this I’ve made if you’re interested ru-vid.com/group/PLIjr-uSYDZi5Kwoue3b-_M_qWpQbiQ-KX
Awesome video Danny.. I lived through the street racing scene in the 90's when a stock for stock ( or even modified most of the time) stang absolutely had no chance against a F body. That is until Ford changed the game and added a factory blower to the 4v 4.6 which needed forced air induction to feed those air-starved massive cylinder heads. I had mentioned before, that I would get spanked all day with my new to me new edge GT. Back in 02, there was no Mach 1 or Cobra and I had to settle for a Torch Red GT 5 speed Premium. When I heard that Ford was going to bring back the Cobra for the 03 year with a built short block and a blower to boot, I knew that my days with my GT were numbered and eventually the Gt was going to get traded back in for it. 2004, I finally traded in my GT and got a Competition Orange 04 Cobra. The pony wars finally had shifted back in favor to the Mustang, after years of Z28's SS's and Ws6's annihilating just about anything in sight in my area.. This is why I will forever have a soft spot for the Terminator! Cheers!
@@tylerkulchinsky2167 yes the 01 cobras wasnt far off from them stock for stock and the na cobras really like gears...456 gears and a few bolt ons and you got a mid to low 12 second car...sometimes high 11s that's no slouch for a light modded na 4.6. They have the ls1 more of a fight than Chevy guys would like to admit.
I love my Terminator! When I purchased it in 2005 I had no clue that it was so over built. After reading up on the forums I realized what potential this car had. My '03 is sitting at ~600 rwhp on pump gas with 17psi and right at 700rwhp with 22psi and race fuel. It is a blast to drive!
Wow, that’s so cool. This should have shown Chevy and Chrysler that they could do the same to their sports cars and kept the cost down to out sell their competitors. So even to this day, the terminator motor is still the best
Mr Mike I love my Boss. I think it’s the best all around mustang before the GT350. It even out ran the mighty GT500, Audi R8, M3 at laguna Seca back in 2012. That’s heavy company their.
Thank you Danny for this great video. Now I feel that I made the right choice when I bought my 03 Cobra vert last year with only 4k miles, now has 6k. I try to drive it only in the good days to keep the miles low. It’s a great car even my 80 year old mother loves the terminator. Thank you again!
Cars are to be enjoyed and driven. Shame on you. You cant take premium mileage to your grave... Start enjoying the car and quit being an old fart with a diaper
I thought about getting a 11 to 12 Shelby but then i remembered that i didnt like the sophisticated technology those cars had when i had a 13 5.0. Much rather have my bare bones 04 Cobra. Hardly any technology to control its power. And its just brute force. Great video Danny.
'07-'14 GT500 has the same tech as a Terminator. No VCT, just timing chains, cams, and blowers. The Coyote has much more tech, which is probably why any Modular motor will outlast them.
I’m a corvette guy through and through , ive had a few procharged cobras and they are a force to be respected. I did not know the termi could hold over 1,000 hp on stock block ..amazing
Great video. Being a Pontiac/Chevy guy I only knew so much. Those 500s did seem like, not a dud but nothing so epic at all. They were thought to be epic on arrival but no. I see why damn.
They was much faster than the stuff from the others that was competing with them. They are also faster than terminators stock for stock not by alot but they are in fact faster by few tenths and like 3 mph. The early gt500 was restricted stock. They wake up big with mods even more than terminators do you can gain well over 150 rwhp with fbo and ported blower.
The Terminator Cobra is without doubt the best car you can buy for the money... And that's the fact that nobody else could argue.... Where you going to get a car they can run a 12 second quarter mile bone stock for that price..
Basically my take on this video is if you want over 700rwhp, either mod your terminator 4.6 long block or heavily mod your 5.4 (rod replacement among other changes). Both engines are beasts properly modded, with the recent standing mile Ford GT as proof.
Tons of guys are making over 700 wheel on stock 5.4s. Both Lund and vmp consider 700-800 wheel the max safeish limit on a stock gt500 engine 07-14 they've tuned and been around hundreds of these cars Lund even has 14 gt500 he has raced since day one it's built motor now but he raced it alot prior to the build without blowing it making some big power. If you use good fuel and don't Rev much behind stock 6250 redline and have proper supporting mods and such you're good up to and over 700 wheel. They hate rpm much more than all out power (on stock rods). The rods were weaker on the gt500 but still pretty good stock rods and they are more stout than a terminator in literally every other area on the car.
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage Btw great video man, keep it up. My dad had a 07 Shelby GT and I've always known because of him how the GT500 wasn't a true Shelby car. Most people don't know it.
I think you did a great job bro. This video is highly informative, I learned from it. Nowadays ppl have flashy videos and we get into the routine or "norm" of, if this video doesn't capture me in the first 30 seconds I'm out, but if you have the time to listen and watch, this is a great video. This phenomenon has been going on in the music industry forever and now it's caught up to RU-vid for some time now. For the everyday Joe Shmoe like me who is a car enthusiast who likes to learn about different cars and manufacturers and does some in-depth but light research (compared to you) this is an informative issue.
Thank you for the feedback. I have about 20 videos like this if you’re interested in seeing them as well ru-vid.com/group/PLIjr-uSYDZi5Kwoue3b-_M_qWpQbiQ-KX
Being the owner of a GT500 and being on the two biggest forums for the GT500 I can tell you there is a ton of guys making 750rwhp and up and no issues. One guy who is very well known on the Shelby Forums is BJ McCarthy his Shelby 07 was a test mule for the longest time for himself and then he started working for VMP Tuning and they beat on that car all the time with bigger blowers, pulleys, etc. Well over 100 passes at the drag strip running low 10's and NO ISSUE. Are the rods weaker compared to the H-Beam YES...but the Shelbys out there are taking a beating and staying together. So not sure 3 steps back it a true statement but hey everyone has their opinion.
2007 with 64K miles makes 733 rwhp I would say the rods are okay. Are they the best NOPE but they have taking a beating and no issues and mine is tame compared to 85% of GT500's so no reason for anyone to shy away from a Shelby. In fact since your video did some research and found the pistons in the 03-04 term are the weak link. The GT500 has better pistons but worst rods go figure LOL
Given the option of being able to get one or the other I'd take a Terminator every day of the week and twice on sunday. IMO they just have way more appeal than a GT500
Hands the terminator is the black sheep that still in my mind is the best of all mustangs and is still a powerhouse that is unheard of! Great video Dan thanks
THESE are the videos I like man!!! PHENOMENAL job you've done with this video. I can tell a lot of work and time when into this. Thank you for these awesome videos. Very cool.
I've always been a stang fan .I like a lot of other cars out there but I liked the stangs just a bit more than the others.I would love to take both of them out for the weekend just to see which one I would rather have.That terminator would have looked pretty good under the hood of my old 83 lol.
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage I just bought my first terminator cobra and you have so many great videos on how To that it's been such a breeze on getting it up to par. Cant say how great your videos are and the knowledge you give out is great!!!
So an almost 15 year old car has a stronger and healthier engine then a 5 year old car. (2013-2014) Get a terminator and throw 10k in parts and get a 600+hp?
Danny Johnson i also love the fact that it was the first stock supercharged car. Which Many cars after it become supercharged like the hellcat, and ZL1. Love the GT500 but if you have me the terminator and gt500 I would take the terminator every time. Bad ass looks and bad ass performance.
@@tristyn1124 the gt500 is faster than the cobra stock for stock and the gap widens once mods enter the equation. Mod for mod they pick up more power they're more restricted in stock form. The gt500 is stouter in every way other than the rods and even with the rods they have 800 wheel is considered their safe limit. The tuners all say this who've been tuning them since the beginning. It's well known have respect to octane and rpm and they will live at big power levels. This is a bias video from a cobra owner lol. The gt500 has a better trans, better stock input shaft 26 spline not 10, larger motor with better heads, better blower, better brakes, better heat exchanger, better, better fuel system, stouter rear end being solid axle that needs way less to handle big power, etc. The rods are the one thing that is weaker but still plenty capable.
They are somewhat different classes. The GT500 is a true Shelby influenced by the man himself. The Terminator was an SVT extreme success. I've had a Termi and currently a 2007 GT500. I sold the Termi for the GT500 but I'd love to get a Termi again one day :)
Donald Ellis As stated in the video, “anything more than 725rwhp is rolling the dice.”. When the GT500s fail, it is usually from throwing a rod through the block. It wouldn’t happen if they had H beam forged rods like the terminator or ford GT supercar. Period
The 03-04 cobra was better than the gt500 until 2011. 12.4 1/4 Mile and better performance in every test you can put a car through. The 2013-2014 was and still is a beast .
I’d say 13/14 starts to be very competitive, but then price comes in, so even at that I’m not convinced it’s a good value unless you need the shelby for other reasons (interior space, etc).
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage depends , a good terminator is over 20k for a 15 year old car but I agree , I dont think a 2014 gt500 is a good bargain but not anything behind an 03 04 cobra . I dont have a terminator any more but I actually thought my 2011 gt was way better overall ,was the same price and rock solid as far as chassis is concerned. I now have a 2015 gt love it but it's still stock ...only 8k miles on it.
I personally think the 03 04 cobra are true muscle cars. They look meaner, sound, and drive like muscle cars. They lighter quicker and they look mean as hell coming down the highway. The 13 14 gt500 is a luxury car that has power. They look nice. Not mean. Interior look awesome drive quality is better. I had a 14 gt premium convertible. It was awesome. Jus did not feel like a muscle car. I would not get rid of my cobra, I jus add a 14 gt500 to my collection.
Even smith (magazine editor) was the man, and I hear they did a lot of runs with “negative density altitude” at sea level on cold days to make it all happen. Check this guy out ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-6Ny3zlcFURw.html
I still would honestly rather have the gt500 I just think it looks better in my opinion and is all around a better looking car and resembles the classic look of the mustang but still like the terminator new edge look does look good
I'm all about the Terminator, but I still prefer the S197 chassis, no matter what level. Very rigid and a panhard SRA. Check out my 2016 Fusion RWD converted and Coyote powered :)
when you say the Camaro versus mustang war was going strong you got to remember the normal 2 valve 4.6 has got bumped up to only 260 horsepower in 99 compared to LS1 underrated 305 horsepower it's probably more like 335
Neil Brown Yeah, it was basically the cobra vs the LS1 since all trims of the Camaro and firebird were basically the same engine. Ford should have done the 32V in all V8 mustangs as well.
The Mustang GT was never meant to be a performance car, that's what all the other specialty models are for. Seriously a 70 Boss 302 would take a 70 GT 351s lunch no ifs and or butts about it.
That blue one wasnt 1100 wheel it said 1000 hp shelby doubt it had that at the wheels with the stock blower it had. Im sure it was 800+easily at the tires it had cams plus a fully built engine...negating what was said in this video. Hes saying from the factory theyre not as strong which theyre not. I have loved the terminator since 03 when they came out and was debating between those and an 07 up gt500 (preferably 11-12) in 2 years when ill be in the market. Needless to say im firmly in the 03-04s corner after learning this stuff. Never really paid close enough attention to gt500s before when they were new because they were so far out of my price range didnt really do the research. Come to think of it i do remember seeing alot more failures with higher hp shelbys over the years so it makes sense.
@@michaelharris748 I'm sorry, 1000, not 1100, but my point still remains the same. There's a big difference between the 724hp limit that's stated in this video, and 1000 hp It would be respectable if this guy would just say he prefers the Terminator. I don't understand why anyone would think that you can do the same modifications to two different engines and get the same results. That's just a question, I'm no mechanic LoL!! I'd take either one, because they're both amazing vehicles. They both were better than their competition at the times that they were introduced....
@@donpido6023 some gt500s can live at 700-800 its all in the tune and the combo etc. Running good fuel helps which the one you're referring to was on e85. They say 725 wheel is the confortable spot known to be reliable anything beyond that is a toss up. Some engines can go with less power its usually fueling related ppl cheap out on their fuel system (big no no) and try to squeeze out every last hp on 93 pump which i also dont recommend. If you wanna really push it with bigger power either do e85 or race fuel. Too many try to push pump gas too far which is what alot of failures are due to imo.
