[TF2] Why Dustbowl is Hated 

I think its because when you put cereal on your bowl it turns into dust i guess that's why its hated

fun fact: dustbowl has had its really long timers since the open beta, valve never thought "hmm, maybe we should make the timer shorter"

Dustbowl lobbies go like this: 1st area: The 1st cap gets taken quite quickly, unless Red team is spawncamping. In which case, Blue team has effectively lost. If the second isn't capped immediately afterward the 1st cap is capped, the Blue team has effectively lost. 2nd area: No matter how good Blue team is, it will always be a walk through hell just trying to even leave the small mines at the start. Even if Blue speedrun cap the first point, Red will still have time to respawn and set up defenses on the final cap. This is where many Dustbowl games usually end. 3rd area: If the Red team has a phlog and/or kritz demo, then Blue has lost. If Red isn't doing this then Blue still has to chew through heavy defenses and sentry nests just to get the 1st cap. Final cap is hell no matter what side you're on, Red has to fight for control of the bridge connecting the control point to the rest of the map, while Blue has to maintain control of the corridor just outside of the CP's viewpoint. If Red pushes them out, then Blue has effectively lost all staging power and has to burn time getting ready again. TL;DR: The map is basically Stalingrad for Blue team

Dustbowl: The Worst Best Worst Best Best Worst Map

Want to feel true pain? Play Dustbowl with training bots. They haven't been updated since 2008 or something and boy does it show.

In tfc we played dustbowl all days long. That was 20 years ago.

I really wish this wasn’t the ONLY map that was run on class wars server.

Dustbowl: the Stalingrad of TF2. Brutal CQC for every meter of space.

"Dustbowl is hated" **People proceeds to 100% vote it on map votation**

I know that Dustbowl may be objectively bad but it's honestly one of the maps that i have the most fun on. It was even the first map I played. The majority of the community hates it but the people that you meet on there makes it one of my favorite maps.

I really like dustbowl because of how bad it is, it's a great map for when you want to turn off your brain and just enjoy nice long rounds without worrying about objectives. just run in a straight line and kill what's in front of you

10:23 You forgot to mention that the building here has a window specifically for bouncing Demoman pipes in. It doesn't work *much,* but it's there on purpose. It was probably more useful when every class had grenades, since they definitely did when this map was designed. Edit: Now that I think about it, this map makes a lot more sense if you imagine everyone having grenades. Still sounds terrible in my head, but that would help with some of the choke spots...

I remember the other team taking forever to make the first cap in dustbowl and once they did they got 20 minutes to make the second ca, some guy in chat was like "that was only world war 1"

I have good memories of Dustbowl. When I bought this game in 2010 all I played was Dustbowl.

You have finally discovered what min viewmodels are. I'm glad.

This map on TF Classic had a different objective: carry the flag to the control point. Most TFC servers used to have 16 players at most (think at the connection speeds back in late 90's), so it was good for what it was designed for.

As a dustbowl lover all I have to say is its broken, unbalanced, bs, but it's home.

Never have i been so offended by something I 100% agree with. This is actually my third favorite map, after Goldrush and Harvest. But i understand why people hate it. 😅 Edit: this is my first TF2 map and the reason i main Medic.

I've been playing on uncletopia recently to avoid all the bots, and people keep voting for this fucking map since dane made a video on it Life is pain

I won't accept this dustbowl slander it's the second best map in the game

Monkey's Delivery Service is a symbolic music track because the level of animal abuse in Mother 3 is comparable to the mental abuse of players forced to play Dustbowl.

Dustbowl is one of my favorites especially as a start Something about holding a defense on third point for 20 minutes as engineer or medic is just intense

In responses there are going to be people who also need to understand this. Well designed maps may or may not be fun maps. 2fort and Turbine are terribly designed maps but are super fun for that, like how playing a bad game with your friends may still be fun. See this mostly through a competitive view, I can only assume Space Guy also knows this. He may already have put it in the video, but I haven't watched it all the way.

Dustbowl is 3rd favourite map below Upward and Badwater. I fucken' love how dumb it is.

"Alright, yeah that's a pretty good job" - Scout TF2

This somehow explains why I always uncheck dustbowl when searching for a match in half the time it takes me to explain to another human. Good job.

Uncle Dane: hold my bear

Fun fact: I managed to win Blu Round 1 of Dustbowl singlehandedly in the space of about a minute. When I spawned, after my latest death, playing Scout, I managed to get behind enemy lines to the first point where, oddly, there were no Engies set up. I capped that point before Red knew I was there, and ran all on my lonesome to the second point where, again, no Engies. Since no one was around thanks to the entire Red team being up by my spawn, I capped that point in seconds. No one, not even my own team, figured out what had happened until we were on the next section

i love dustbowl

i love the style and feel of your videos, very well done

When I hear that some maps in tf2 are too long my first thought is about Dustbowl, and I compare this map (and 2fort) to maps like Blood Gulch, Derail, and other large scale fps maps. My thinking usually makes me think of one map as the whole map pool in a broad term, when really, it isn't, I just played it a ton as a new player and expect the other maps to be this tight, closed, claustrophobic experience with a lot of chokepoints and not many advantages to the other team. I can type about how trying to get last point is like trying to play Silver Surfer for the NES, but I had this thing to get out of my mind.

This video was really entertaining and a serious take at the same tame, hope to see more like this

Hey I know the server at the beginning of the video! It's called Nemu's Stomping Ground, and it has a fun gamemode called "Engineer Fortress" where the entire RED team is engineer bots.

I play Dustbowl since TFC times. It's supposed to be incredibly hard for BLU to win. The spam is by design and it was toned down A LOT in TF2. It was also one of the most popular maps back then, which is why Valve ported it to TF2.

"What is a *king* of defenseable areas, to a *GOD* defenseable areas?" Me (Pyro) and my Heavy + Medic combo: "What is a *god* to a NON BELIVER?!"

mate you deserve way more subscribers, it's the second time you've appeared in my feed and the second time i've clicked on a video of yours. You're going to make it big bro, trust me

Ya know, I’ve stumbled upon a handful of mapmaking guide videos and playlists, but almost all of them are incomplete and leave out the part I’m most interested in: the macroscopic and microscopic details and philosophy of map design.

Honestly, I love your originality and unique style with alliterations at the start of evey episode and your running joke at the start of a video of the commentator replacing a certain character with numbers. It's very refreshing and unique. Really make you stand out, plus its funny.

2:37 "fuck this tunnel in particular" That one backburner pyro from hell who's about to take out half your power classes: insert troll face here

Great video man, I’ve never been able to oaky the modern version of tf2 on pc and most my childhood was instead on the orange box ps3 version and the only maps we had were like 2fort and dustbowl. I used to get so frustrated at the poor way these set of maps were designed and looking at it from your clever point of view has really put it into perspective of what makes good map design ! Thanks mate

Dustbowl was the biggest casualty of instant respawn/increased population servers, which only got more prevalent with time. Skial servers were being played on in a lot of this footage and to my memory they implemented both at one point or another (certainly increased capacity just from watching some of this). Typically, both of those features will benefit RED in a map with close quarters, since (1) adding further pressure to a bottleneck is never going to be as effective as its counterpart's resistance in tandem and (2) they can Zerg-defend the final cap in a pinch. The same is true in reverse with open maps, which is why BLU tends to get such insane momentum on Gravelpit if there's >30 players. Sometimes I'm in the mood for a deadlock but on the whole I always wished there were more reliable servers that didn't mess with the game's balance.

The music for this video is a throwback to my childhood, thank you

One of your best videos yet. I loved it!

Nice level design breakdown - don't see a lot of those on RU-vid. Cheers!

you should do a five minute video of why turbine is bad the map is small, makes for a good filler while youre doing greater stuff

Dude I love your videos. Keep up the awesome work!

The thing with Dustbowl is that it's an old map from an era where online multiplayer was more organized and less open, dating as far back as the original Team Fortress. You could get away with map elements that necessitated the use (or disuse) of classes because the people playing were generally friends who played together regularly and were willing to make class changes as needed. I feel like matchmaking has massively changed TF2's team dynamics, not for the better or worse, but just to something significantly different from what it was originally designed for.

the way you read the script in this video was really good, keep improving 👍

I love your content man, please keep up the goos work!

Everyone making dust bowl videos now Uncle Dane, Octo, now you

I honestly love Dustbowl, it's intense as fuck The map being chokepoint hell means no matter where you go there's always 6 or 7 enemies in your face, it being so easy to defend means Blu team has to go all out to make progress, and the sheer pressure being applied by both sides means that there's hardly ever a dull moment on either team, as any second another 6v6 could break out

Big ups for including the names of the songs in the video

yooo i just remembered running into you back in october on condemned lok great vid loved it

Ah another great underrated TF2 video Keep up the good work!

I got a huge nostalgia kick once I heard the pikmin music. Good Review.

I've never played or seen a game of Dustbowl that didn't last 3 rounds. But personally I like that, me and my team started this sisapheian task together and there's no way in he'll were stopin now. It's a weird sort of comradary thing.

The music gives me so much nostalgia

The defenders and attackers alternate between being straight up advantageous, and the loading times + setup time in between levels is just annoying. Usually games take way too long

well, dustbowl exists as a memory people about the first team fortress and old stuff never change (unless meant to)

Dustbowl is so defensive I’ve seen red defend against double Uber heavy pushes on last before

your description is funny cause me and most of my friends play turbine a lot

Dustbowl maybe hated, but is the most played map. That's why everybody likes Dustbowl.

I think it's fun because of how long the matches are, when you play a full one it's like having the community server experience condensed into an hour of play

>implying there's anything wrong with dustbowl

Dustbowl is definitely better in TFC because the chokepoints were built with player grenades in mind and the cap is instantaneous and flag-based

I like to think that Dustbowl, and every other old map that has been there since the launch of the game, made sense only in the early days of TF2. I mean, if you count that demoman grenades would explode on contact with every enemy building/player even if they bounced on a wall back then, pyro had no airblast, engie could not move buildings nor upgrade anything outside sentry, and kritz medic didn't exist to make spawncamp the monster it is now, and beta had grenades for classes too, I think with all that in mind the map makes way more sense. Also this shelter in 3:59 is perfect to build a dispenser and make spawncamp even more hellish :V

I absolutely love this map the way it is, one of my favourites and I regularly play it to this day

Bro this is the first time Iv ever heard spirit tracks music in a RU-vid video amazing job

I haven’t heard the Legend of Zelda : Spirit Tracks audio in so long, thank you for reminding me of the good days

It is always an good feeling when you get a fast round of dustbowl (only happens when you play scout and the enemy team does not know where to put their sentry's)

really poorly designed maps are actually really good for players, because it teaches proper lessons in how to handle similar situations

'First map that comes to mind for hate' turbine:

I used to love playing on Dustbowl back in the day on the Orange Box (mostly because only 2Fort/Dustbowl were only ever available), and after all of the countless updates and balance changes I played maybe 1 game of this a couple years ago and vowed never to touch it again

scout and spies tend to make very good backcappers on these maps, as well as forcing the enemy team (defense) to be more wary of the control point and not overextend

Just a reminder that dustbowl was a map for tfc a game where most maps has on average 0 health packs outside of spawn and spawn rooms has undestructible lvl4 sentry gun but to be fair you have to somehow get in the enemy spawn to trigger it wich was possible btw before the round ends

🎶It’s beginning to look alot like dustbowl🎶

Noticed the music at 6:15 Great taste!

Dustbowl feels like the D-day landings only the D-day landings was balance

Oddly enough, I can't seem to win on this map even as an Uber medic on the RED team. Whenever I play BLU, we can cap until the last point and NOTHING will break their defenses, but then when the tables turn, by that part of the map, SOMEHOW a pair of scouts managed to BONK their way by everyone, and even when I saw and called them out, NOBODY would go kill them, so when we all due and they cap the first point, OOP, there's the two scouts instantly capping the final point cause NOBODY chose to turn around.

I like dust bowl because it gives a sence of fighting for every inch of land, specially last cap, you get to see your entire team all at once seeing them as you come back from respawn getting to the front lines and doing everything you can to keep the team pushing into you

love the spirit tracks music

That final area is always absolute hell for the attacking team. The amount of times you can get Spawn camped until the clock runs out is ridiculous.

Going as a Spy for a backcap on the last point is actually pretty effective. I've gotten a couple wins on Dustbowl using that strategy.

Damn this is my favorite map imagine how much i would like the other good maps i didnt even know

Every thing until the final push is pretty cool

Yknow that part on stage 2 where you said good for health packs, really got me thinking, ok so yknow how you see your construction pda on the engie loudouts? BAM new construction pda, replaces teleporter exits with small health packs for 25 metal, teleporter entracnes with large health packs for 50 metal, and the dispenser with full health packs for a hundred metal. Idk how good tid be, but itd sure be an interesting mechanic, being able to essentially carry health with you at all times.

I've watched this video more than 20 times it's so good

this video is the exact length of the time for dustbowl

Are we not gonna mention the nostalgia-inducing mystery dungeon music in the background?

I was an admin on a Dustbowl only server for years, and I have more hours on it than most people have in TF2. It can be difficult for BLU to push, but many times it is because of the way some people play. The key advantage BLU has is that their spawn time is always 3 secs while RED's can be three or more times that depending on some hidden mechanics in the map code. BLU players overly concerned with K/D ratios will drag their team down. To break the spawn camps on the beginning of the stages, BLU has to be very aggressive and willing to sacrifice for the good of the team. On stage 2 , for instance, I've seen players start to push out of the cave at the start, take a little damage and spend 10 seconds running back to the spawn cabinet to fill their health. It is faster to keep pushing and go for a kill on a RED player. If you live, you may be able to get to the health packs in the shed. If you die, its only a 3 sec respawn, much faster than taking 10 secs to run back. While you run back, RED is doing the same thing with health packs closer than the spawn cabinet. Better to stay and try to finish them off and force a long RED respawn. No one but you cares about your K/D, and no one will remember it when the next game or round starts. No one is going to Dustbowl servers to recruit for their comp team. Push out and risk dying a few times at the start. Eventually you will make progress and the caps will come easier. The longer you give RED to build and gel as a team, the harder that push gets. Be aggressive. The first guy running out will draw most of the attention of RED players and their sentries, if other BLU follow out, they will get opportunities to get kills and take down sentries. Follow your ubers out. Teleporters are also very important to pressing the spawn time advantage that BLU has. Teleporters need to be built as soon as possible and they need to be built as far forward as they safely can when pushing for second points to maximize that respawn advantage.

I have 7000 hours on TF2. And I'm positive at least 75% of that time has been played on DB. Both my best and worst memories from TF2 come from this map alone, and I regret absolutely nothing

Those 3 teleporters at the very first seconds tells a book's worth of story lmao

I would just like to point out that the original intended use of the shed next to blu spawn was probably so that when blu is pushing their way through, and red is further back near the point, blu can use the shed as a temporary safe spot, plus the full health kit being there in case someone takes too much damage and there isnt a medic around that can help at tne moment. Sometimes you have to look at these things as how they can both be utalized by each respective teams standpoint, because only then is it really okay to determine a clear answer.

Man I love the Spirit Tracks soundtrack choice. The music in that zelda game was fantastic and i dont see the ds games get enough love

Dustbowl 3rd stage tunnel feels like its a flank route alright. For RED. Cause it leads straight behind the usual enemy forward hold, letting anyone slip behind to go take care of their tele's or just suprise em with a pocketed phlog or demoman.

It’s beginning to look a lot like dust bowl everywhere you go.

i love dustbowl it reminds me of the times i got tf2 and would only play offline with bots for some reason and it was the only map i played on its such a chaotic and hellish map but i think thats why everyone likes to play on it because not many maps can really give you the Dustbowl Experience, it's also very satisfying to win on blue because of that. i try to limit my time on it now though i used to want to play dustbowl matches back to back but now i can only take 2 games where i have to deal with dustbowl 3rd or my sanity starts to drain lmao

On the last part of Dustbowl I was on a team of 5 medics, 5 heavies, a pyro, and a soldier. It was one of the most fun experiences I've had in TF2. It embodied exactly what TF2 is. It's about fun. It's about playing in the park. It's about absurdities overcoming even flubs on Valve's parts. Even when and where it fails, we overcame it with fun. There was no deeper strategy thinking that heavy was the best bet, or that it'd really work, it just seemed funny to roll out like that. It was very funny, and very satisfying.

You know when you’ve been pushed into too many dustbowls when hoodoo is looking functional.

best map