That Game Engine Fork... 

sometimes you are such a troll Mike, and i am here for it.

"read between the lines" - vertical spacing: 48pt

This has got to be one of the most creative ways I've ever seen to say "Let him cook, I want to see where this goes"

Kudos for running your channel the way you do and also clearly explaining why. Good stuff

I like how you handled this. Very classy, fair, and balanced. Well done.

Pygame... Not gonna lie, you had me in the first 30s of the video. Now go-do-the other vid (or not XD).

I got Mike rickroll before GTA VI. This is hard.

The most click-baity title on this whole channel, and yet, still relevant to the actual video content. Well played, Mike.

Seems like we could all learn a thing or two from pygame, actions speak louder than words and sometimes its best to hold your judgement and see how things play out.

This reminds me of back during the BlitzBasic framework era when there was a game programming framework called Monkey X made by a guy named Mark Sibly. Well, Mark Sibly had a habit of creating projects like game programming libraries (which were always EXCELLENT). But then, he'd just abandon them out of nowhere. Thus, game developers got tired of him doing that, so they forked Monkey X and now it's called the Cerberus X game programming language.

i forked godot so i could make 1 tiny change, i dont remember how long ago it was but that change got added so i deleted my fork

Clickbait, you say Game Engine Fork in the Thumbnail but it's a game library fork... tsk tsk tsk

Can't wait until we're past the recent news and we can get back to, I dunno. Game development.

This is Peak RU-vid and Peak advice at the same time

Thank you for waiting to see where things went instead of farming drama content in the moment. I appreciate how classy you run this channel. 🌟

Lol, Got me. now I'm waiting for the new game engine fork...

I'd argue that B4Artists is more of a blender distribution than a fork. (Think Debian vs Redhat. Netiher are forks, but distributions)

Everybody talks about forks, I just want to know more about spoons

There is another fork of Blender called Goo Engine (I think) that really changed the render pipeline under the hood to create anime visuals in their workflow. It's very interesting, and not free unless you build it yourself from source. I don't recall if it has gaming capabilities, as the anime aesthetics are the core of the project.

All the most successful forks have a technical motivation. The only example I can think of of a purely political fork is when Gimp got forked by people fed up with the stupid name and ugly branding. They created Glimpse which, appropriately, didn't last long.

This guy made a 11 minute video to troll his audience

This is the beauty of open source. No mather the reasons, new forks are always valid. If they'll survive or not is another debate, but forking a project is ALWAYS a valid move.

I'm always happy to see you cover software that isn't widely known. Especially when it comes to open-source projects.

Git hub forks are also created just to submit pull request for developers that are not on a repo. For instance, if you want to submit a patch to Godot, you can't just create a branch on the main repo. You need to fork it and submit changes upstream.

You had me SWEATING with this one man LMAO

🤣🤣Nice! I actually somehow didn't know about pygame-ce, even though I was a professional software engineer for half a decade using python, and though I haven't done really anything in the way of gamedev for a long time now I do still follow it a little (primarily through this channel!).

Why are we always talking about forks? What if I want to spoon a game engine instead?

really good way of making that video

you actually covered without mentioning it, damn. Just said a little too much at 9:40 :D And I am looking forward very much to the day you will properly cover it, I believe in the project.

how many of those 21k forks are github users doing it completely by accident and not caring enough to delete it?

Is the fork of a Python library a Hydra?

Massive respect for keeping this channel classy and not hopping on the drama bandwagon.

Not what i thought this vid was gonna be about 1000IQ clickbait. You got me😂

You had me in the first few seconds, not gonna lie.

Not a game engine but another fork that is doing well and is game dev related is LibreSprite which is a fork a Aseprite from back when it was an opensource project and has slowly become it's own thing (but still keeping everything free and open source)

You've gained my respect, more of it at least, with this video. Specially the message not said, well done

Once Redot gets popular features that were rejected from Godot (or unlikely to be accepted into it), then it has a chance of proving itself.

You know what, respect dude. I know you have your opinions on matters but that doesn't mean you can sacrifice your journalist integrity, so keep up the good work.

Well played Mike... Well played.

Now this is something I can get behind, while yes it might divide development efforts, in case of a fork that was sprung up by drama they won't be contributing to the upstream anyways, nor will the upstream devs want to spend time to a fork. For the users otherwise they got more choice, but again, that is assuming the fork proven itself to actually stand on its own, great video, and respect for showing your points without getting into the deep end of the jungle.

1:54 small nit: Python 3.11 is python three eleven, not three one one. The latter would be 3.1.1

Thank you for touching on such the important subject, that affects us all.

thank you for not feeding back into the Twitter drama

Gamefromscratch is classy as always. Wish I could say about the other news.

Absolute Cinema

7:00 Just the UPBGE part of the video is more than satifying me xD thanks pushing this to my attention, going to have so much fun

This was fantastic content. Well done, sir.

I actually didn't know about Pygame CE ! 🤖

I remember UPBGE already existed when BGE was still around, and at that time they hoped to merge back one day and become Blender's official game engine.

This video explains quite well why Redot will not take off. Virtually no Developers interested in switching to it, and it's entirely fueled by the Godot Controversy that'll blow over, because it wasn't something that's ACTUALLY important, like was the case with Urho, or pygame. Redot simply has nothing of substance to offer compared to Godot, all they've got is "We aim to not be political" which they failed at by releasing due to a political controversy, and the other the intention to Merge Godot's PR Backlog without review (as they don't have any manpower required for review, Godot itself struggles with this massively and they're much better organized and with much more manpower behind them) which will fail thanks to a ton of bugs that'll inevitably cause and actually be a massive negative for them.

Yeah, forking is easy. Pulling it off is very hard. There have been some successful forks during the years: Calligra (fork of KOffice), LibreOffice (fork of OpenOffice), MariaDB (fork of MySQL), but making it work is very hard.

I thought this was gonna be "Due to drama with Godot, here is a fork of that"

Ooh. I think I know what conversation inspired this video. 🤐

Today, we're talking about ̶J̶e̶f̶f̶ Gef.

I think you kind of overstate engine forks there at the end. There's Github forks and there's _real_ forks. Almost all of the _github_ forks of engines are just people working on features to upstream. (or just playing around for their own entertainment) To be clear, _I_ have a fork of the Godot Engine, and gamesfromscratch absolutely should not cover it because it solely exists to experiment with optimizing some of the math functions of GDScript... and that's more then what's on the agenda for the fork that the public is talking about is planning.

Quite simply ahead of time... brilliant!

LOL nice. This is the best response to a certain event I've seen in a while.

Axmol engine noticed by Gamefromscratch ! Lets goooo :)

As least there are potential for alternatives, yeah those alternatives may be very difficult to get off the ground but the beauty of open source is that if you don't like the direction the original is going you can (with enough effort and teamwork) take the project in a different path. You might not like the fork but you should always encourage people to choose freedom to take a forked project in the direction that best suits the group involved with it. If you are actively trying to shut the fork down then there is no way you can consider yourself as "the good guys"

Well played, sir

Thank you for the Rebel Fork info! I did not know about that!

Well played, Mike.

what the forkk

Most forks are probably just people not knowing how github works and trying to download the project.

I was thinking about game engine forks yesterday. Weird.

Ah okay. I guess its not time yet.

I see what ya doing! 👀Nice video!

Very funny! 😂 also thanks. I was wondering when the pygame thing would be covered. Good video as always.

I never liked the content manager for XNA/Monogame. Also note there is no content manager in FNA.

When is your video titled " game engine from scratch" coming out :3 ? i am waiting.....

9:25 when you do a pull request of anything you're creating a fork, so going by "how many people forked it" like that is completely useless and painting a really strange narrative. To see how many actual "forks" in the sense you're using there a project has, simply click the number sort by "Most Starred" and have it filtered to Active + Starred, then observe if there's any project with a signficant amount of stars (typically 1000+ at least, more if the parent project is super special or very old). It should be obvious what the forks are and what the pull requests/experiments are. But I get it, this isnt about that or whats worthy to be a video. Its completely possible for either side to pull changes from each other if they want to, at any time, so there's no tangible loss of any effort involved unless one side decided to be against the other as some political statement. This is about gossip/shaming tactics to discourage people to think for themselves, let some group think for them and defame all opposition to get a point across. I personally think peace of mind when developing is very important. If I thought it wasnt high on the list why would I have given godot the time of day to begin with? If its about performance, maturity, etc then even if you hate unity there's unreal. If its about business you're going to lose more money from reinventing things already avaialble, assets and bugs, that more advanced engines already solved (and thats ignoring porting costs related to godot-to-consoles). And if its about things like "how it works" you get better experience from built-to-purpose specialized engines. Trust and peace of mind are the bedrock of open source, but thats just my point of view, everyone should think for themselves (and by that I dont mean with their twitter brain, but the other one).

i like how subtle your message is. i like it. i know who to show it

Very classy xD Tbh waiting for that redot video for next year

To be fair, Godot could go down the same path as pygame ce. Its under similar circumstances. The other news you are referring to.

This is got to be the most high brow troll I've ever seen.

I should really make a video about my Fork... but I never have time to edit my videos well, and now that I'm working on my engine, I have even less.

I'm so glad they pulled the game engine from Blender.

You had no problem listing forks of Urho3D a week after them switching to Russian happen.

I thought for sure you're talking about Redot

This is not april fools, Mike xD Well played...

I would argue that an open source project could be carried by a single person, but that it's the users who you really need to develop a community of for a project to thrive. In fact, regardless of how many devs work on a project, without a community of users, it will die. Take for instance Crystal Space. It wasn't the best game engine, but it worked and even had a few commercial games that used it. It was pretty much the only useful open source engine at the time, but it just couldn't get enough users to stay alive. It's even difficult to still acquire a copy of it. However, I would like to suggest that you at least try Linux on a second computer. You could buy a secondhand computer for super cheap and play with it with minimal risk.

Cocos2d-x is in turn a fork of Cocos2d, and there are some other forks and ports

This was a top tier troll post.

He makes a pretty good point about Redot; even though I think the rot within the Godot core exists, and affects core development (due to personalities and leadership styles more than politics), I'm doubtful that forking it will produce meaningful results, especially on the technical front. It depends on whether Redot can incorporate performance and feature improvements that Godot's core team will be / has been unwilling to, and to what extent Redot's commitment to upstream Godot compatibility will render its existence moot.

Personally, unless the fork has features that I need for a project, i tend to stick with the original software. If i were to have a major disagreement with a software company, I'd sooner use one of their competitors rather than stick to the same company with a paint job.

speaking about forks, o3de 24.09.0 just released

Upbge is a great project! It's also possible to put python code into your upbge game

Simply perfect

as a pygame-ce github member, 👍

Brilliant 👏

Checking on Pypi seems Pygame is still getting updated. Is there somewhere I can find a comprehensive comparison between the two forks? (I don't mean like a raw diff, but someone that understand things reviewing the differences targeting an audience of game creators)

FNA wasn't a gentle fork. IIRC, Ethan Lee wrote a new renderer for monogame and MG didn't care so he forked.

Game dev FRAMEWORK... the title and thumbnail says Engine... bruh..

UE5 has 51k forks. That's a lot of proprietary cutlery!

I was looking forward to hearing about crablang until I remembered it is a language, not an engine. Also no idea on its community status

Beautifully said buddy 👏👏👏🎉

I'm fine with the fact that you don't want to get involved in the Redot drama. Just as you said it is too early to really know if it will work out in the end. I'm personally keeping tabs on it, but I really haven't commented on it much myself.

No redoot?

Nicely done!

If you come to a fork in the road, take it.