Sorry everyone, had to add one more riff and reupload. The list just didn't seem complete without Dyers Eve. Thanks to whoever mentioned it on IG. Check out all my videos at: www.the-art-of-guitar.com Patreon: / theartofguitar
It gives it sort of a "being pushed forward" feel to it. It's basic syncopation. A lot of music like faster Jazz or ragtime use exactly this. You can also do it in reverse, start the line on the up of the final beat of the measure *before* and it will give it sort of a laid back feel.
The cool thing about Blackened is that it uses both the on and the off beat. The drums pretty much reverse themselves right after the solos, definately the most challenging bit of the song.
If I recall correctly, blackened is the one where the drums and guitar become misaligned, and they mess with the timing slowing one down until they reconcile, right? Or is that in AJFA?
@@mmdoof At least in the guitar riff, James change the accent playing the E note on the 7th fret of the A string instead of the low E. The riff itself start to match up at the next compass
I always have trouble playing to these grooves. After all the years, I finally figure out how to play the off beat snare pattern better by playing dragonforce's through the fire and flames. Because they accent on the 1 more. Then I started can listen to the off beats.
If Lars learned to count before kill em all then their music would actually be easier. And I’m glad he didn’t learn to count right until black album because all their stuff in the first five albums are really really good and weird I love it
I love the story of how they got with one of their first producers, and he asked Lars "why do you always start on the up-beat?" And Lars said "what's an up-beat?"
james is a beast on rhythm guitar. i forget what really good guitarist was showing how he played a song, the interviewer is like, why do you change the picking technic in the middle of the riff, he's like "i do what?" the interviewer shows him what he does, he's like, "idk, i just do it that way."
There´s no such thing as "time correctly" when playing Metallica though, There´s so many stuff in Metallica that shouldn´t work, theorically speaking, yet they do, and is awesome Awesome video too.
Hehe the reupload was worth it. Dyers eve, on my first listen years ago, the intro, made me question my entire sense of rhythm. Oh and that part in blackened after the solo, and the harmony in fight fire with fire. Like what were they on.
Same here, and now I wonder if trying to learn it on a new beat would be even MORE confusing for people. But then I mostly play alone so what do I know :P
I guess never learning to count properly helped me out here I was always able to just hear the riff and kind of sink in with the drums without too much trouble
I agree. I think anyone who had formal music lessons might have a little trouble with it. I learned these riffs before I had any formal lessons and never had any issues.
Same here, i cant count all really. I just get in the groove with the drums. Been playing since 1990 and still own and play the crap out of my 1990 mij ibanez rg550 i got then.
@@TD-bq5bo lars and cliff were both well known for playing in weird timings to the point they confused the studio workers while recording. knowing the song well enough before you start playing also helps. I was listening to songs like blackened and master of puppets for years before I picked up the guitar so when it was time to play I already had the whole thing figured out... minus the ludicrous down picking speed
4:32 they play this standard beat version of the blackened riff in the song itself (around 5:41 in the song), it's what made me realize that blackened was entirely on the off beat otherwise. great video! edit: haha ok i just realized you talk about this yourself when you get to fight fire with fire 😅
Exactly, just wanted to say that. I really like that switch in the song, off and on beat part. Never thought about it, I just played along them and heard something is little bit different at 5:41, strange how it changes the feel of the riff.
The offbeat gives it more of a sound of chaos and dirty thrashiness that makes it more aggressive. The guitar riffs don’t feel as powerful and punchy with the standard beat which takes away from them. The offbeat also makes it where the drums are filling voids and acting more like a complimentary lead instrument sound, more than just keeping rhythm and timing in the background.
This dude keeps giving THE Best, most coherent, most logical, and to-the-point breakdowns and explanations on youtube. AND does so with the most pleasant personality and attitude of any guitar-channel. Perfection.
@Phillip hanna That's not actually true. In a d-beat the kick drum is played twice before the snare hits. To you get two 16th note hits on the kick drum and one 8th note hit on the snare. You can hear this on ANY discharge/ d-beat song song. The normal thrash beat leaves out one of the kick hits. So, you get one 8th note for the kick and one 8th note for the snare. You can hear this on EVERY thrash metal album ever released.
As a percussionist I hear it so differently than a guitarist. The snare is “answering” the guitar not driving the beat. Its more like a fill I guess you’d say.
@@GreatOne0815 yes me and my dad had this discussion the other day. It really seems like the rhythm section of Metallica is James Hetfield and whichever bassist they have that would embellish on James' pocket. Then you have Kirk and Lars playing solos and leads through out the songs.
So true, I feel the off beat snare makes is so much more easier to play than standard. Standard beat requires the guitar to stay off while the drums are not.
Lars has said in interviews that back then he was upsessed with making weird and complicated drumming and time signatures. As a drummer myself trying to learn Metallica songs off of RTL MOP or AJFA can be hard because you have to learn the changes and weird cymbal hits. An example of this would be Ride the lightning Fight fire with fire( I can play) The call of ktulu Trapped under ice Battery(I can play) Disposable hero’s Welcome home (sanitarium)(I can meh play but I kind of change lars stuff out for mine not the whole song though) Damage inc( I can play) Blackened (I can play) And justice for all(I can play) Frayed ends of sanity To live is to die
Blame LARS! Tees now available. Take your anger out on Lars AND support The Children's Hospital of MN at the same time. :) www.bonfire.com/blame-lars-tees-now-available/
Good lesson to really demonstrate how James and Lars managed to create their Metallica sound, together. It’s really obvious that James and Lars are focusing on Their accents and James’ super fast right hand meant that unlike every other band, they got a down picked accent to finish the riff very often. Lombardo is the same era but was different. Danny Carey would do a similar thing with a completely different band as well. But I also didn’t learn to count as a drummer, I just kept time. This lesson really shows you why it works best this way.
Mike you're the best and most relatable teacher. But I'll just speak for myself. Thanks for all your informative vids. Everyone of them 4seems to always teach me something. Anyway; once again, thanks Mike@ Art of Guitar. You got the most beautiful guitars, equipment and Studio/Practice space. So I know you'll keep up the fabulous informative & relatable video's. That blk & wht Gibson Flying V you got is golden. Pure gold in my eyes! And the white custom shop USA Jackson too! Oh man! I wouldnt take 5 Ibanez's for for that V and that Jackson. You deserve it brother. Peace.
I freaking hate trying to learn Orion, the real and proper way that isnt taught online or on tabs, it's not fast or off beat or anything it's just weird to count and nobody plays it right
I've noticed this too, people doing covers and lessons on youtube aren't getting it right. It's honestly super clear on the recording and you would be better off just trying to learn it by ear. When I was learning it years ago I found just tapping it out with my hands made it much easier to grasp. ie right hand for down picks and left hand for up picks. I also learnt a lot of other tricky stuff like Bleed this way.
James is the greatest metal rhythm player period lol. He’s a machine. Thanks for this great video. Makes sense when u break it down. Keep it up please. I’d love to hear you break down king diamond. Pete and Andy are amazing players with great tunes.
They actually play off of that. Like after the solo in Blackened, the snare comes in on the down beat for the riff, then it slides back over and it’s a glorious moment.
Great video! My brain still listens to some of these songs with the snare on the downbeat and it changes how you perceive the song which is trippy. Happens with Enter sandman intro oddly enough. If you start the song with one mindset or the other you can hear the other riff (depending on where you brain is placing the beat). Also: What are you using in your signal chain, the Tone is godly!
Metallica is so engrained in my ears that Fight Fire with Fire and Battery sound really funky with a standard beat haha Thanks so much for this though man! Blackened blew my mind! I always thought it kinda had parts that were off and parts that were on the down beat when it turns out the riff kinda alternates as one big section!
Devin Aschenbrenner I’ve found “upbeat” to be equally as popular. Also the “and”. But “off beat” is prob the most common. People that are self taught vs people that went through a school system also use different words to often mean the same thing. I dunno, I think it’s interesting. I’m a drummer too. Go drums!
What didnt help a lot of players was they thought the Cherry Lane tab books were right back in the day so we learned the riffs wrong and now I'm almost 40 trying to get them right. Man they were good at that off beat stuff! This video helped me alot thanks bro!
Very clear and useful video. Glad to see someone explaining stuff well, concisely and doesn't try to make you feel a zero by saying "why you suck". New subscriber deserved!
@@TheArtofGuitar Not specifically to him, though I frankly don't like that approach. Way better "how to improve [...]" or "useful exercise for [...]". There're too many people around pushing their sales with that kind of anxiety-inducing wording. C'mon guys, we should play for pleasure and learn out of curiosity, without the "not good enough" mantra stamped into our ears and lobes all the time. There's already enough stress in life! THANKS again for your excellent videos!
Interesting that you point this out. When I was a kid and these songs were new to me, there was always something that bugged me about the timing. It was especially obvious to me on Dyers Eve.
It's quite amazing how different this makes the drums sound. With the guitars on beat, it basically sounds like your basic pop beat on 2 and 4 that's just kind of there because... reasons, whereas these very same beats drive the song forwards with the guitars off beat
Thank you very much for this video, I seriously had trouble playing these riffs because I did not understand them as easily as you explain! Greetings from Peru
i always find the timing switch in blackened a little tricky. i get it a second or 2 later but im always a little off right when the main riff comes on after the intro riff. could you do a video on how to get that switch right? theres always the chance im not practicing enough but maybe theres a trick to it.
To me the off beat version just sounds way faster, since the beat and the "chug" isn't in sync so it's almost like it's double the bpm (if that makes any sense)
I’ve never had an issue with the offbeat throwing me. But it is cool hearing the drums played two different ways back to back. The offbeat definitely makes it sound faster than it is.
Hi Mike! You give us loads of good tips, but now I have one to share with you... On Dyer's Eve, James is actually actually alternating between holding B with Index finger and bouncing on C with middle finger on the A string in the upstrokes of the 16th notes on that speed riff. I'm a huge Hetfield fan, and you showed what I was doing wrong on MoP on another video. Keep it up! We appreciate these tutorials
There's a huge debate about that. The official TAB book agrees with you but many have told me the opposite, that it's just the way he's palm muting that makes it seem like it's the 232323 way. I'll do some more digging. Thanks.
Watch their hands on this video, looks like straight 2222222's to me. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-WUD61SWwxvc.html Let me know what you think.
Ah, I see what you're saying. You get a glimpse around 3:18 of Mexico video, and he's clamped down pretty good with no movement of the middle finger. That alternating 232323 is really hard to get it to sound tight, for sure. I like playing it that way too because it helps me stay "ramped up" and focused on staying tight with the rest of the riff. Plus it really does sound like the notes on album to me. And, yeah, I have the books, lol. Hey, thanks for reaching back out so quickly. I see your vids all the time in my Google feed. I'm about to subscribe here and make it official! 🤘
ever since this video dropped ive been trying to listen to battery correctly, im never able to put the snare on the and. I always hear it on the down beat when i listen to it. Its weird though, because i can play it perfectly normal and when playing it im able to hear the beat correctly, i have no idea why and its so annoying whenever i listen without my guitar to play along
The Who would do some of this, accents on the upbeats that make you feel like it's on the downbeat. It's a great rhythmic tactic for bands that can pull it off. I have my issues with later years Lars, but his prime day was filled with a lot of really creative drumming. He was never the full blown technician that some of his contemporaries were, but he still wrote some really interesting stuff. I love the vids where you dig into these speed metal riffs. BTW, you sound pretty darn great playing some of the toughest riffs in metal, well done!
You can listen to the shortest straw riff two different ways. The beginning is E, F, E and it can be spaced evenly or have the F closer to the first E. So for years I listened to it with no extra pause, then I heard it live and noticed there was a pause on the F. So now I can change between the two timings of that riff when I listen to the song now... hope that makes sense So like the way I hear the riff is: E, F, E *pause* E, F, E *pause* E, F, E, G etc. But the way they play it live is: EF, E *pause* etc etc.
I never knew battery and fight fire were like that at all.... I thought the snare was the down beat and they would just throw in or take out extra beats randomly. That's gonna be really hard to try to train myself otherwise. Incredible video
0:40 Being a jazz musician for quite sometime (Double/Electric Bassist) I actually see this as the norm. It's called a back beat, and in jazz the hihat typically does it through (highlighting 2+4) but if it's heavy swing and it's in say, the shout section, then snare also accompanies it. Sing Sing Sing, recorded by Benny Goodman's Jazz Orchestra can highlight this snare backbeat, but its definitely not the only one.
I recently discovered that in the Battery riff, the part at 3:04 isn't a 6th fret on the A string, but it's actually a 5th fret along with the 4th fret on the D string.
@@janugur2241 ok so i got curious and went and looked it up, this is pretty accurate if you can read sheet music - www.onlinedrummer.com/drum-beats/the-shortest-straw-metallica-intro/ the intro starts on the last count of a bar (the pick-up note), which i didn't realize, but what was REALLY throwing me off were the rests. after the first da-dun-dun (for lack of a better way to articulate it), instead of three counts before the next da-dun-dun, you have two counts and a dotted quaver (which is basically an eighth note + a sixteenth note). kind of hard to count so i imagine i'd just count three quarter note rests but start the next da-dun-dun just a touch before the last quarter note ends. sorry if that doesn't make sense, i'm not very eloquent when it comes to explaining music, but i hope it helped
being in band has helped me a lot with learning these kind of riffs. marches help a lot because the have the steady beat where the snare and bass alternate
This is a great video. Blackened has always been the most confusing for me... As far as Fight Fire with Fire goes, I'm okay with this verse here but it's actually the part right before the chorus that always baffles me...
great sound you have . Speaking about off beat...........I learned this 20 years ago from my drummer , he just explained me that I should play with kick drum rather than snare
Some Sepultura's stuff from back in the day, like Arise and Beneath the Remains, always gets my...I can sometimes hear it correctly but my ears keep it pulling it back to the wrong tempo
i hope you will help for once...i just startet ekspiriment whit feks. drop d.- d.standard og half step down...i got the first to,but dont know to turn down half step...i play bass"akustik bass" normal tune-e,a,d,g...but can some help me and name the tones the string are in those tuneing. i know drop d. that is only the e.string,that becomes a d. but in d.standart. i think we start whit an d. next string most be g. and then h. and then e. is this right and what is the name order off the strings in half step down. hope this make sence,not good at english...
I always thought of this as being double time feel, is that incorrect? (Absolutely love the moment they use the normal beat in blackened though. Such a powerful use of rhythm)
I don't think it's off-beat as much as it's just a double-time beat. Also, I'm pretty sure during the Dyers Eve chugging part they're going back and forth between the second fret and third frets kinda like this: 5\4. 4 32323232 3\2 0 2
Mike, what you're describing is referred to as "double time". That is, the beat is going twice as fast as its BPMs. "Dyer's Eve", however, is _actually_ at 204 bpm, and "Fight Fire With Fire" is actually at 240 bpm. "Blackened" (also actually at 180 bpm), when coming out of the solo, starts on the high E (5th string, 7th fret), instead of the E pedal (sixth string open), because Lars threw in an extra snare/tom hit, and is in half time (the drumbeat goes half as fast as the BPMs indicate).
4 года назад
Could you do this with Meshuggah's Combustion? I struggle a lot with that one, and it's like, their only 4/4 song lol.
I've always heard Fight Fire with Fire wrong, always heard the snare as 1 2 3 4 when it's really the "and"s. And I still have to concentrate real hard to hear it right. Also, the vocals on that riff are so confusing when it comes to hearing it right. Great video btw.
On dyers eve you gotta go between fret 2 and 3 on the 5th string while palm muting the b shape just keep index finger planted and use middle.finger to go 2-3-2-3 etc
When I was in high school my friend Mike had the hardest time with the Verse riff of master of puppets. He kept adding parts and playing it longer than it supposed to be
Great video! 👍🏽 I've had this same issue figuring out the timing on these exact same Metallica songs for ages now... Also in the case of Damage Inc. And it's all because of the snare and kicks... Upbeat or downbeat??? Can never tell!...
