The Best Performance Cruising Cat!?!?! A side-by-side comparison with pictures

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On our quest for the "best cruising cat" we looked at several models that fell squarely in the Bluewater Cruising category. In this video we share why we ended up with the Outremer and take an in depth look at the other boats we considered. We include competitive pricing and our perception of the pros and cons of each boat. All pictures and data were pulled from YachtWorld.com
Please note this video is not sponsored by Outremer. What we share here is our honest feedback.
Regarding money, we also realize how lucky we are to even consider sailing on such nice boats. We are not uber wealthy and required a bank loan to buy Archer. However, we felt it worthwhile to stretch ourselves financially (we borrowed to the max, sold everything we owned and rented out our house) to get into what we thought was the safest boat we could buy. We do not share the purchase price of our boat out of respect for the previous owner, who we know personally, but you can find used Outremer 49/51s between the $500k-$900k range.
Also, we probably should mention that we wanted a 4-6 year old boat to minimize the depreciation impact of our purchase. Thus we did not consider the new Balance or Seawind 1160 boats (although in 5 years they might be amazing)!
Okay, with that said, we hope you enjoy this video. And please comment and subscribe!
PLEASE NOTE: Because we are a family channel, we actively monitor all comments for the protection of our children. Please leave a comment and we will approve it as quickly as we can!
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ABOUT US: We are a family of five sailing around the world on a performance catamaran named "Archer" and sharing our adventures in family-friendly episodes on RU-vid!
OUR ROUTE: We departed the Boston/Cape Cod area of the United States and sailed down to the Caribbean and through the Panama Canal. We have dealt with massive repairs in the South Pacific, the Coronavirus lock down in New Zealand, a Category 5 Cyclone in Fiji, and now we are cruising in Australia.
OUR PAST: You may remember us as "SV Honeymoon?" Ten years ago ("before kids"), we sailed a Lagoon 380 named Honeymoon halfway around the world to Sydney, Australia. Along the way we shared our experiences via RU-vid and, by happenstance, created one of the very first "sailing channels." We also realized what an incredible experience we were having and that someday we wanted to do it again, only this time with kids.
FAQ: More questions? Check out our Frequently Asked Questions page on our website or answers to many of your questions in this 40 minute episode:
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PLEASE COMMENT!: As a channel with kids on-board, we are required to actively monitor all comments, but we still want to hear from you. Tell us what you think!
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8 сен 2024

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Комментарии : 278

@MichaelBuck 3 года назад

"I didn't like going slow", that about sums it up. There are two sides to Cat cruising, those that want the space and comfort and are content going at an even pace and those that have the need for speed, lol. Basically, there are two cruising catamaran mo9dels for performance, Outremer, and Seawind. I am of the first group of Cat cruisers as 90% of cruising is at anchor at a destination. Sailing is a very small percentage of what we do as cruisers. With the high-tech navigation and weather onboard its no issue to avoid the storms, and when a rough squall comes it's nice having a wide beam that can stabilize and ride it out. Deck clearance is an issue as on the faster cats they want the deck closer to the water for a more streamlined approach through the water, so you tend to get a bit more thumping on the bottom of the deck. Also, the faster performance cats are going to be lighter and you will FEEL it more during rough storms and seas. As I said, two sides in the Cat cruising community and BOTH seem happy with their decisions. Best of luck to you and look forward to seeing more adventures.

@Hotzenplotz1 3 года назад

That's just wrong. Many cats can go faster than 10 knots. But the ride becomes very bumpy and uncomfortable at higher waves. So just in the case when you want to get away from bad weather in higher seas than usual, you have a light boat that gives a even more bumpy ride and you're reefing the sails for crew comfort. Or you're endangering your relationship.

@MichaelBuck 3 года назад

@@Hotzenplotz1 You seem to agree with my comment but started out saying it was just wrong. Has a bit confused my friend, lol. But glad you SEE the predicament I was referring to with light and fast catamarans in rough whether they are trying to stay away from and rough anchorages. Better to be smart and save your relationship versus playing games with the weather.

@pioneer_1148 2 года назад

While I largely agree with you I like to mention that the light cats sail against the wind drastically faster than comfort cats. The downwind difference is negligible over any kind of distance (a guy even did an analysis of trans pacific crossing times and found that Outremer 55's were only about 10% faster than lagoon 620's). However, the difference in against-wind performance gives you significantly more freedom in where you want to go. While I can't speak to it myself I have also heard that narrow hulled boats bob considerably less than their wide hulled counterparts when sailing into seas (although this is a pretty negligible advantage as it only applies when you are sailing upwind which you hopefully won't be doing much) Note: Dagger boards alone do not make a boat sail upwind (whatever someone may tell you). The angle at which you can sail upwind is determined by the ratio of power to sideways resistance (resistance to slipping), that means you want a light cat with a long, deep hulls. Daggerboards provide lift is the opposite direction to that in which the boat is slipping, this helps, but adding daggerboards only improves upwind performance it doesn't guarantee it. In the same way you can put a spoiler on a van but that doesn't make it a racecar. # I am a physicist not a sailor, however this is pretty basic physics and Chris White says the same thing.

@angela1984a Год назад

Balance and Marsaudon Composites also seem to fit the performance criteria. As does other brands.

@gerritgovaerts8443 3 года назад

You forgot to include the Marsaudon Composites TS5 or as they are now called ORC 50 (Ocean Rider Catamarans) . 50 foot long but weighing only 8.6 tons (vs 11)and having 20 square meters more sail area than an Outremer 51 . They lack some of the nice wood trim (hence the low weight) but they are a lot cheaper (and faster) at only 780.000 euro new including taxes for a base model . As for their speed , a TS5 won the ARC rally in 2019 beating even an Outremer 5X by more than a day

@jackcardin8710 5 лет назад

The BEST explanition of why it should be Outremer.

@dougcard4311 4 года назад

My favorite is the Balance 526 their helm is the best. Carbon in all of the high load areas and near a wind speed boat with dagger boards or performance keels. They are building a 482 also,

@AJ-zn8fp 5 лет назад

Love the Outremer but a couple of comments. Hard to put Seawind in the same category as the top 3 charter boats as they are really well built and seaworthy. Also Chris White is a designer and not a builder, his designs are fantastic but the quality of the build would be determined by the individual or company building the boat.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Two excellent points. I think the older Seawinds are more coastal cruising boats (IMO), but I am impressed with the new 1600. I have to admit I have not been on one yet. I wish a few more were available to consider!!!

@SailingLifeonJupiter 4 года назад

Nice video guys. Great to see clearly described the specifics of the design that make it go fast, such as hull width, streamlined, bridgedeck clearance, dagger boards. It makes all the difference in performance cruising catamarans.

@TheSailingFamily 4 года назад

Our pleasure!

@Clackamasone 3 года назад

The first thing I thought of watching this video was your Cyber 48!

@nicsaliou4118 5 лет назад

Outremers are the best! if I were to actually buy my own boat and I had the money, I would by an Outremer but if I was really wealthy I would for sure buy a gunboat 66 H2O. that boat is a DREAM boat. Love your content! keep going!

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Yeah. Gun Boat is my dream too. But that’s a whole different category: The “money is no object, I need the best Cat it can buy” category was unfortunately not in our price range! Maybe next time? :)

@chad914bantner 3 года назад

We recently bought an Atlantic 42 and every day I am just blow away by the thought and design Chris White has put into these boats. We have two daughters, 4 and 10, and we too moved from a Lagoon. Beam winds.

@TheSailingFamily 3 года назад

Great boats!!!! Congrats.

@swapode Год назад

Hi, if you don't mind me asking: Did you have much issue with spray in the Atlantic? I don't think it'd change my adoration, it's a single hander's dream - but it's a concern I've heard and would like to hear some owners' opinion.

@pmorph 5 лет назад

Agree with pretty much what you said, the Outremers are amazing. We built a 11.7m Pescott, smaller version of the Outremer, daggerboards, light and fast. would sit on 10 knots upwind at 32 degs--as good as any mono except the out and out racers. Having sailed on various seawinds, yes they can go offshore and do, it's just that you have to be patient... and use an engine to go well to windward. I have video of mine going to windward in 40 knots of wind, she could handle more than we could. Btw, have a look at SACAR anchors, the SV Panelop youtube comparisons show them better than Rocna--I sat out a 60knot gale (that swung 170 deg) in NZ on one, would not have any other type of anchor

@BenMossIsHere 4 года назад

That should be SARCA anchors. Agree they are great. Regarding the Seawind comment, that would be for a non dagger board version because the 1160 lite and 1190 and the 1600 all sail to wind extremely well. Having looked at an older Outremer 55 recently I can only say they must have improve the build quality a lot because the inside of that thing was like walking on cardboard it was so cheaply made. Junk comes to mind when I think of it.

@chasingthehook779 5 лет назад

We recently purchased a 1993 Catana 411 hull #1. She’s been clocked doing something crazy- upwards of 27 knots. She was extremely neglected so we are bringing her back to life! Great video for comparing other cats! They all have their pros and cons for each individuals preference :)

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

I agree! We really like the Catana boats. You made a great purchase! Best of luck and fair winds!

@kubevoid3977 4 года назад

Thanks for the education. I am learning as much as I can about performance cats to live aboard.

@hogey74 3 года назад

Thanks for this. I like the comparison and I reckon my priorities are similar. I am currently looking at trailer sailers and there really are two choices: comfortable, slow sea caravans or planing hulls that you camp out in. Option B is the choice and I think it's influenced by reading about pogo 30s etc - French designs with speed being the focus and adequate comfort being up to your decisions. This French design seems like an even better balance - real cruising comfort with speed. Nice.

@angels814ever 5 лет назад

VERY INTERESTING, THANKS FOR YOUR INPUT & HONESTY... =]

@Tigersmundo 5 лет назад

*The Original sailing couple on RU-vid! Your opinion comes with great authority on it. Stuck between Leopard or Outremer both solid but do different things.*

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Thanks! Love your comment. But I’m no wizard, as several people have pointed out! :) The Leopard is a great coastal cruiser (we bareboated on one in the Seychelles - check a back video). Very comfortable but it couldn’t sail upwind at all. I had to have a sailboat - thus the Outremer. Good luck!

@mcflyboarder9537 5 лет назад

She’s a lovely boat. I’d be so happy with an Outremer, looking forward to seeing so footage of your travels.

@beachcomberz 5 лет назад

She's a sweet looking boat. I never would have thought that having beamy hulls could like to suspect integrity. Good to know. Also, nice use of text to keep the masses at bay while skirting around the sailability of regular production cats. Dont apologize Man, pump them kicks.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Thanks! I was worried about posting this. I don’t want to upset anyone, but at the same time wanted to be honest. I feel our first season on the Lagoon might have led people to believe that the Lagoon was a global cruiser, but it’s not. Now I know, so wanted to share my experiences. Take them or leave them, of course!

@kevsworld69 4 года назад

Thanks for your thoughts on those four boats manufacturers specifically. It's interesting how fast interiors are evolving each season, and how little hulls and sail plans change over the decades. Looking forward to your insights during your cruise. Bon voyage!

@colinleblanc6260 5 лет назад

Thank you for doing a good comparison of the performance cruisers. Helps me make my choice in the future!!!

@katlovicharters6682 3 года назад

You purchased a great boat sailed with her and her pervious owners in the BVI good luck and fair winds.

@327365hp 3 года назад

Nice to meet you. I've seen your boat in Narraganset Bay. Congrats, I think she's perfect!

@en8581 5 лет назад

Nice video- as a person who has a boat with a typical mainsail I really like the idea of the Chris White mast foils with essentially 2 roller furling sails (head and mizzen) in their Atlantic 49. The main sail can be such a pain in the but and is a constant source of worry. Also like an ICW friendly rig if possible, eg Antares and Atlantic to provide safe options to go “inside”. But love your boat too! Always choices and compromises!

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Well said!

@roberttenbrinke4079 4 года назад

Love that you made this video - answered many questions I had prior! Love the colour!

@tagemanbagem9736 5 лет назад

Love archer great looking boat for sure!

@Pat92346 5 лет назад

SWEET choice captain... No worries with the Outremer, almost positive you'll be completely satisfied. My choices include Gunboat[if money were no object] Balance w carbon fiber[again, pricey] Schionning makes great cats, Seawind makes nice cats, McConaghy MC60 Performance Catamaran is SICK!!!!........ oh if I could only get serious about tiny house living in luxury...lol...I totally get where you're coming from too.....I want performance w comfort/cruising... life is too short to go slow....

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Well said!

@jjl499 4 года назад

Subscribed bc of your t shirt! Miss Sox! Bostonian here hope all is safe and well. My retirement is to sell it all in 14 yrs and sail! Never sailed always boats 50’ plus so I love the ocean never sailed great video!

@ddddd1666 5 лет назад

Best choice from the 5 of them,congrats. p.s. schionning next time

@jhk8513 4 года назад

I truly enjoy your explanations. There is one brand new catamaran, the TS 5 from marsaudon composite, you can't find it yet on the second hand market cause they launched it in 2019 but it the ideal tool to sail fast and far.

@TheSailingFamily 4 года назад

Yes, I have since learned about those boats. Same designer as our Outremer. I love them!

@leojoseph6385 3 года назад

This was a great compare/contrast of some high priced used cats! I learned a lot, and thankful you shared your perspective and insights. It looks like you made a wonderful and deeply pondered choice for your family's needs. The ability to Sail upwind is an acid test that others falter on, and makes sense to put a high priority on it when looking for a Bluewater Cruising Cat. Is your solar/wind power generation able to run a washing machine for full time living? If so, what is the setup?

@ehabelshami2687 4 года назад

so nice , now , i understanding the type of these Boats , thanks friend

@TheSailingFamily 4 года назад

Thank you too

@clayfarnet970 5 лет назад

Haha, I think I remember watching you flying west across the Atlantic at 20 something knots. 😜😂👍👍✌️

@WillN2Go1 3 года назад

Good video. Great that you shared your process. I've been reading Gregor Tarjan's book, in which he emphasizes build quality. I've seen a few videos of a famous monohull boat type with busted keels. One of them looks like they glued the frame to the gelcoat on the hull, so no surprise the entire frame separated from the hull. Sure a keel strike, but none of the keel bolts were bent, it just broke the entire frame loose. And the layers of glass mat etc on the frame peeled off like a layer cake. The other boat grounded, the keel area broke out of the hull and came right up into the saloon. The question I have to answer, because I want to go multi-hull, is what does a good cat build look like? So your pointing out the bulkheads is just the kind of thing I'm looking for. (In a boat form absolutely follows function. It's easier to get used to turning sideways every time you walk through a hull then to get used to drowning.) Outremere's 30 year history is also an excellent point. thanks

@yeyepp 5 лет назад

I believe the Outremer was the best choice. The production of the Antares are in Argentina, not in Brazil as I recall.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Oh. Shoot. Thanks for the correction!

@ApprenticeGM 5 лет назад

Great job on this comparison video - thank you. Definitely agree Outremers are performance bluewater cruisers and you made a good choice. I think you have to have at least one daggerboard (Tim Weston "Tokyo Express" did the research and experimentation that shows one large is better than 2 medium from a cost, performance (less drag more lift) and build-time + lost interior perspective) to be considered a performance cruising catamaran so I reckon the Antere model you showed isn't up to "performance" levels even though it's better than the Lagoon / FP / Leopard sluggards. From a sheer safety perspective you want the ability to point high and go fast upwind with little slippage, in case you need to, plus the good cruising benefits.

@brotherbryan2414 5 лет назад

Video was very well done. Very professional

@karlhansen635 3 года назад

Nice commentary for Outremer.

@kimdoss1868 4 года назад

Great comments etc, very down to earth thanks Regards Kad.

@chazman4461 5 лет назад

Thank you for explaining how you are paying for the boat. I liked the video just for that. I can not believe the prices of these things.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

It’s crazy expensive. But using a loan just feels like rent to us. As city types, we’re used to that. In fact, the “rent” is far cheaper than our places in NYC! But I appreciate your comment as I realize these boats are expensive and we count ourselves lucky to be on one. Dream boat!

@sailinggrace9647 5 лет назад

Very good information. We are trying to decide what kind of multihull we want for bluewater cruising

@HomesBoatsTravelbyJoseTorres 5 лет назад

Thank you for the great video. A couple of things you mentioned. Headroom and comfort. I am 6' tall is there enough headroom in the cabin on this boat. Also on the speed vs comfort. Does that mean that the boat rides rough? How does it perform on right weather compared to your lagoon? Is it a smoother or harsher ride? Thanks for the videos and the comments!!

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

I’m 6’4”, so I am outside the norm. I can stand straight up in the middle of the galley and in the forward sides of the two hills, but I have to tilt my head to stand in the main stateroom. I’ve gotten used to it, but I wish the rooms were taller (but that’s more windage and more weight!). As for roughness, the 51 smooths things out big time. We don’t hobby horse as much and 10 knots is very comfortable. I have a video tittles 15.4 knots in and Outremer and my water bottle doesn’t fall down off the Bimini during that speed. It’s so smooth you sometimes can’t believe the speed you’re going. Definitely try to get a ride on one. It’s very different!

@HomesBoatsTravelbyJoseTorres 5 лет назад

The Sailing Family Thank you!!

@bortyOne 4 года назад

beautiful boat!

@1BADGT500 5 лет назад

Great vid! My choice would be a new Balance 526.

@mustafaoshaughnessy3198 4 года назад

Good, brief review. Thanks

@TheSailingFamily 4 года назад

Thanks for watching!

@MrBillFletcherr 4 года назад

Straight to the point. Thank you.

@TraneFrancks 5 лет назад

Small correction: It's spelled Antares and the new shipyard, Cuarenta Grados Sur, is based in Argentina.

@bowhunter8235 2 года назад

Thanks for th thought process. I've been watching you for mm, maybe 2 weeks now. Kinda got started in the (middle) of your sailing...then just this morning saw your 'departure' about 2yr ago...boys are really young. (Saw one yesterday...I think one of th lads is a teen) So I'm trying to catch up without binge watching...great productions btw. I'll stop here. I tend to be verbose. (I'll watch another and let you talk lol)

@TheSailingFamily 2 года назад

Thank Bow! Welcome aboard!

@glennwatson1176 5 лет назад

Nice vid guys! We are currently building a Nautitech 542, we pick it up in the Med in late July. We looked at the seawind 1600 and the outremer 51....both nice boats but ultimately liked the extra room onboard the Nautitech. It’s also a semi custom so you can build some level of customisation to suit your needs. The polars are nearly identical to the seawind 1600....not sure about the outremer polars but we opted to not proceed with the outremer due to super long wait on build ( circa 2.5 years).

@SV-DEDICATED 5 лет назад

Good comparison. I believe you have the nicest boat of any sailing channel that is currently uploading content.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Well thank you! Much appreciated!

@jorgenvanseters7092 5 лет назад

She looks great!

@acfon7369 3 года назад

Mumby 48, brand new around $500,000. Low maintenance cost. Good average speed.

@AORD72 3 года назад

And a long wait time for construction? Hardly any built so none second hand? But super light aluminium hull ~6 tonnes and some nice features. I wonder how compares for performance. Outremer looks far smoother shape and stylish. Plus Outremer is well tested, designed to never sink. Would Outremer be safer?

@dannyboyspace 5 лет назад

Looks like a great choice! Well done. And greetings from the SF Bay Area!

@automobilestories7200 4 года назад

outremer doesn't mean overseas , that's the google trad . traduction , outremer is a part of France , the islands like the Antillas and Polynesia or some lands like Guyana i reply like your videos and this boat is a great choice !

@wildcaver1 5 лет назад

So very happy to see you and your beautiful family back in the water. We followed you on your first journey. Looking forward to this one. Be safe and for winds!

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Thanks for watching (and remembering us from a decade ago)!

@jaybird4915 5 лет назад

Nice looking boat! Congrats!

@williamlarkin1503 5 лет назад

Thanks for the info

@Jakfilm 5 лет назад

Pretty nice boat.

@lkmb1717 5 лет назад

Tks very usefull!!!! Safe winds

@jmb1805 5 лет назад

You chose very well. Bravo.

@portercamping 5 лет назад

Awesome Vid!! Was wondering why you picked a outremer.

@felipepuerto4713 5 лет назад

Hey guys! Great video!! Congratulations, incredible boat!! I just feel the helm is a bit exposed to the elements... how do you feel about this, is it an issue at all for you?

@bayanicustodio3998 5 лет назад

Nice Choice 👍

@robertlaird6746 4 года назад

Did you consider a Schionning. If you did, could you share your thoughts about that? Also, what's going on with the repairs?

@jamesnguyen9033 3 года назад

Can't sail upwind without daggerboard? Brent & Ana of the Impi cat sailed up wind like a monohull. They have done it for 11 years.

@clayfarnet970 5 лет назад

Btw, great boat, you did good! Fair winds!

@toddparsons5780 5 лет назад

What have you averaged over the course of your journey? Seems like most cats get anywhere from 8-10 knots. You also made a great decision when it comes time to sell. Outremer has a great brand name with a ton more exposure. I am thinking of making the jump over to a cat when it comes time to go. I've got a full-on traditional monohull cruiser. Awesome boat. But now with kiddos, looking at that back "patio", the trampoline, no heeling, all the natural light, easy dinghy up and down off the davits, faster passage making time… Seems like a no brainer with a family. Keep on!

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Hey Todd, we used to play for 150nm days with our Lagoon. Now we plan for 190 mile days with the Outremer. That’s a big difference over time! If we’re on a be reach then it’s easily over 210nm a day. She’s fast!

@toddparsons5780 5 лет назад

@@TheSailingFamily Yes. Huge over an ocean crossing. 150 is what I plan for. I've got a 40' waterline, and it seems to pencil out that way. 180 mile days are great, but you feel it in a mono. Thanks!

@anjingtvsofficial3594 5 лет назад

Wow Amazing Boat! Awesome!!! New Subscriber Thnks...

@venomguysydney 5 лет назад

great vid, and a very good decision

@alexanderkulikov4593 4 года назад

I love Outremer, but a couple of comments. It is difficult to put Seawind in the same category as the top 3 Charter boats, since Seawind does not cause me even the close feelings that Outremer gives out. The quality of boat Assembly is determined by the person or company building the boat. Choosing a boat, people are guided by a compromise between speed, comfort and the price of the boat.

@CrescentMoonCountry 4 года назад

I love this boat. My wife and I are seriously considering taking the family and setting sail. This is a very personal question, but how can you make it work financially with an $850k + boat? Did you guys buy this with savings prior to leaving, or did you just save enough to make the payments for x number of years?

@TheSailingFamily 4 года назад

After saving for years and selling everything we owned, we took out a loan from our bank using our retirement investments as collateral (about 90% of the boat is technically owned by the bank). We'll pay interest on that loan, but we think of it as "rent," along with the eventual depreciation. Yes, this is an expensive boat, and one we could never afford to "keep," but for 3-4 years we thought it worth the expense. This is particularly why we bought a 5 year old boat to help limit the depreciation vs buying new. Hope that helps!

@CrescentMoonCountry 4 года назад

@@TheSailingFamily thank you very much. That makes sense when you view it that way. Glad you guys are out there. Your videos have helped me convince my wife to take this idea seriously. Have a great year and stay safe.

@madisonian50 3 года назад

A penny for your thoughts about the “cruiser-racer” cats, the Marsaudon TS-5 and the various Dazcats? Too Spartan and too little safety margin? They look fast as hell though.

@TheSailingFamily 3 года назад

Yes, those boats are incredible, but more a race boat and less a live aboard. I really don't want to worry about flying a hull with my family aboard, but how cool is that?!

@madisonian50 3 года назад

On the pro side: speeds regularly above 15 knots. On the con: an anti-capsize sheet release system generally needed...

@addictedtopussy69 3 года назад

Did you look at or compare the Marsaudon, Bieker boats, Dazcat, Schiooning, or Cygnus? Wonder what your thougts are on those five very fast cats.

@TheSailingFamily 3 года назад

Okay. Great question. Here goes: Primarily we did not look at boats that were carbon as it pushes the cost well outside our budget. So that eliminates the Bieker and Dazcat boats, and some Schioonings. I have a friend with an older Schiooning but since they are all built by different yards or at someone’s home, I worry about ease of resale. Some are amazing, but unless you build it you never know. The same is true with Chris White. I am very impressed with the TS5 (or ORC boats as they are now called), but they are too spartan inside. We wanted a cruising boat that had a good mix of performance and comfort at anchor, and I think the TS5 goes too far for our liking to performance. Cabinet doors are nice. So are steering wheels. The Cygnus Ocean Explorer is just way too complicated and heavy and big. We went on that boat. Plus they had only built one. It’s not really in the same category. Of these mentioned I am most impressed with the Dazcat, but again, it’s all carbon. We wanted the cost efficiency of a fiberglass boat with carbon elements, but didn’t really need to fly a hull. We wanted one from a respected brand so that resale would be easier. And that eliminates it to those we considered. I’m excited about many new boats out there right now. There is a wave of development happening and it’s exciting to see. Maybe someday I can afford a used all-carbon boat? Let’s see??? Hope that helps!? ~Seth

@addictedtopussy69 3 года назад

@@TheSailingFamily Yes that helped gave me more insight on those models. My favorite cat is the Gunboats with the sheltered center helm and tillers in the rear with room in the back and up front. This seems like the ideal layout which i don't know why more cats aren't like this. Gunboats are pricey even when i looked for them on the used market if they ever stay on there long enough which seems out of reach so i didn't include them in the list. Even their old design which is made by Kinectic is pricey. I hope one day you'll get your used all carbon boat! Thank you for the fast response. Love your sailing videos.

@TheSailingFamily 3 года назад

You should check out the HH boats. They are a direct competitor to Gunboat but much more affordable (being built in China). They use to made Gunboats before they went bankrupt and moved to France. Very similar boats.

@addictedtopussy69 3 года назад

@@TheSailingFamily Thanks. I've read about HH boats and the disputes between Gunboat and HH regarding warranty claims among other issues. Read both sides of the claims which basically each side pointing the finger at the other. They had a falling out, now HH builds gunboat like cats with gunboat molds with some changes. Questionable build quality when they were building for gunboat and questionable chinese hostile business practices regarding intellectual rights which i don't agree with so i rather stay away. From the outside, it has the layout that i like. The closest thing to a more affordable Gunboat that i would consider is the Kinectics. Thank you for the suggestion!

@TheSailingFamily 3 года назад

Every story has two tales, but I think the more believable one was that Peter Johnstone was not a good business man and he was not paying his bills. There were not many warranty claims until he moved production back to the US, and that's what finally put him out of business. He was delivering boats that were way over the contractual delivery weight and performance was suffering. Especially on the new 55. It's a shame as I'm a fan of Peter. He was a true visionary, and still is, but sadly not a good business man... HH has done well over the past decade. Their boats speak for themselves...

@slipmaps 4 года назад

Awesome reviews. Thanks

@BFCOT 5 лет назад

It might sound strange, but one of my 'requirements' is a catamaran that does not squeak and creek - only the stiffest boats are quiet as it takes significant reinforcing in the right areas, and light weight to achieve this - How is Archer in this regard?

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Wonderful. I know what you mean. Out Lagoon made a lot of noise underway. The Outremer is very stiff and pretty quiet.

@elonbaartar9468 5 лет назад

im also an Outremer 51 owner in socal, I really love our boats, at the same time im considering what my next boat is going to be, I have my eyes on the HH 55, designed by the same legendary navel architect as gunboat was, and knowing him personally he told me that he put all lessons learnt from designing gunboats and built the HH better. I just wanna ask if you had spent some time researching HH55 and if so what are your thoughts on them. thanks

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Glad you like the O 51! No, we never considered the HH or Gunboats. We wanted a boat with some depreciation and the HH boats were new. Plus crazy crazy expensive. I can’t justify paying that much for a cat unless I’m racing it. But I respect them and admire them for sure!

@elonbaartar9468 5 лет назад

ok second question =) how fast have you gotten her to? in calm water no surfing? the best I did was 19.8 knots GPS speed in calm water, with 26 knots true wind gusting 28. apparent wind angle was 90 from the beam, she was not flying a hull but I felt like she came close to. la vagabond has gotten theirs to 24 knots, and ive heard stories of around the same speed, I was never able to achieve it without surfing though. thanks for sharing.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

We hit 19 knots sustained on Archer, but it was unintentional. We got caught with our Spinnaker up in a squall and that’s when we hit it. The boat was very comfortable downwind at that speed.

@nedworthington7436 5 лет назад

Sailing La Vagabonde I have a hunch we will be seeing the 3 of you in a Gunboat soon 😉. I've followed your story from the beginning and it is the logical next step! It would also be a great move for Gunboat.

@TheSailingFamily 2 года назад

I have to change my answer now. The HH boats are now much more affordable. You can get an OC version, or the new HH44. After speaking with Paul (who builds them), I think they are the best boats on the market now. Did you buy the HH55?

@axelmartinez152 4 года назад

thanks 4 sharing Nautitech!

@mark2000715 3 года назад

You forgot to put, what was the listing price on Archer.

@helenbollinger3764 5 лет назад

Something we've been wondering about purchasing a 5 year old boat due to depreciation, are the loan rates as good? For example, brand new cars have better loan rates usually and the monthly payment can be similar to a 5 year old car who's loan rates are higher.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Hi Helen, it’s very different. Most boat loans don’t come from the dealer, but rather a bank. They don’t care what kind of boat or how old it is, but rather how much I want to borrow and what interest I’ll pay. So a five year old boat that has been cared for is the sweet spot, IMO. Good luck!

@nobodyhome8637 5 лет назад

I saw the statement at the end of video did you leave out any catamarans. Put in my comment then looked up and read ur statements under video about 4+years and leaving out new companies like seawind which is another one that is great. Every time someone starts talking performance cats my mind goes directly to hh catamarans sorry I got blinders for a moment. I do agree with u if someone is looking for a used performance cat outremer would be at the top of list.

@VERTICALWisdom 5 лет назад

Fast is safe. Lots of evidence that Outremer really supports its owners globally.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

You’re right. I didn’t consider that as very important but the support I have received, even as a second owner, has been amazing. They stand behind and support their product. Even older models. Probably the best in the business in regards to owner support. That’s a big deal!

@normancook4620 3 года назад

Like your review of underwater appendages but it was limited in scope of review of the THREE basic types dagger board, centerboards, keels However, there is a 4th type called SCABBOARDS. which I would love to expose you to at sometime. Like to meet you , if you are ever back in RI ( Bristol/ Newport) give me advanced notice so we could have a sit down Norman

@danaparedes5613 3 года назад

Mine is a Dolphin 460. Have had Vida Libre for 14 years.

@TheSailingFamily 3 года назад

The Dolphins are a great boat. Any reason they stopped making them? Probably the best value performance cat you can buy right now.

@danaparedes5613 3 года назад

@@TheSailingFamily They made 25 of them and then the 2008 recession hit. They've recently started up again. Love your show.

@TheFosterJourney 4 года назад

I feel the need for speed 🛫

@butchkrasniqi 4 года назад

Great Video, hopefully your safe out somewhere. You have pricing for all but your boat? How much did you get that beauty

@stevenwright6573 4 года назад

I'm just a fantasy wanna be sailor someday but what's the cruising speed on one of these compared to the others?

@TheSailingFamily 4 года назад

That's a tough one to answer, but from we can tell, the Outremer and the Chris White boats are the fastest, with Catana in third. The Dolphin Cat would probably be next and then the heavier Antares. It's really all about weight and sail area!

@qatarsailor7727 4 года назад

Congratulation good choice

@jaydubb747 5 лет назад

Great channel💫. What do you think of the Balance cats would love your expertise.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

You know, I am not super familiar with them. I definitely think they are worth looking into. I went on one at the Annapolis boat show but have never sailed on one. They look like a good balance, but to me that means they're not particularly fast or particularly comfortable. Boats are a trade off, so I feel they might fall a little short on the performance side, but I could be wrong...

@Simon-gt6vq 5 лет назад

Great video, hope you enjoy the sail. Do you have any thoughts on the balance 526?

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

I like the balance catamarans but we were looking for a used boat with some depreciation so we couldn’t consider new builds. I also think they’re more about comfort over performance (and we crushed one sailing down the coast of New Jersey). But they look very comfortable inside. Time will tell if their build quality is up to the task of a true Bluewater boat, but definitely a cat to consider for the future!

@suhan8382 2 года назад

Can we have same kind of comparison for 40 foot range please?

@daviddonohue665 5 лет назад

Seth! I just stumbled upon this. I enjoyed a few of the honeymoon series. Glad to see you back and in an outremer! If you end up going by Long Beach,CA message me I would be happy to help with a mooring if you want to stop. I still captain charters for Marina Sailing and can direct you for a quick and easy temp mooring for your stay. Subscribing now.

@mikea7942 5 лет назад

Are you the former Honeymoon couple? Welcome back!

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Yes we are! Thank you! It's good to be back!

@Steddywelly 3 года назад

Hey mate love the boat it’s an absolute dream 🙏 I’m wondering (if it’s too personal then that’s okay) how do you afford to have a boat loan on a boat if you are travelling full time with a family and not working ? Do you fly back to the states and work for a month or two ? Or do you work from the cat Cheers

@TheSailingFamily 2 года назад

We have rental income from our home in California to help provide some additional funds coming in. We are also digging into savings. It's a 3-4 year plan and we want to spend that time on an adventure with our kids. So worth it. I can go back to work after and perhaps work longer, but worth it. `seth

@Steddywelly 2 года назад

@@TheSailingFamily thanks for the reply Seth! 100% worth it, got limited days in your lifetime

@brando750 5 лет назад

Nice video! You mentioned Archer's low headroom as a "con" in the pros and cons... I'm 6'6" and I know I'll probably be ducking in any performance catamaran, but is it pretty noticeable in the Outremer? Cheers!

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Yes, it is. I'm 6-4 and can stand in the middle of the Salon, but not on the sides where we cook. All the other boats I mention have higher headroom, but the Outremer is faster than the others, so the question is what trade-off can you live with?! I choose speed. :)

@alinaalbertovna8030 4 года назад

Forgot balance 526

@greenbubbleh2o437 5 лет назад

I how you can make videos with the use of the dagger boards which will make you go upwind.

@CEOsario 5 лет назад

Did you look at the older Outremer's?...Like the 55LT?...Thanks again for sharing...

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

To be honest, we did not look at any boat older than 10 years old. I did a (geeky) depreciation curve using broker sales data and it was clear that the best value was a 5-6 year old boat that didn’t need new sails, running rigging, electronics, engines, batteries, etc. The older boats usually need a bit of a refit, and when I included that in my model the best “value” was in that 5-6 year range. I could be wrong, but that was our thinking.

@niclaslinden8608 5 лет назад

I like your videos, but it is not fair to say that Lagoon etc are not open wate catamarans, because they are. That they are not is just a myth that many pople unfortunately still believe. It all has to do with the size of the boat. Yes a Lagoon 38 for example may not be a good open water boat, but a 50 foot may be absolutely perfect. But then on the other hand no 38 foot boat is a good open water boat. And one does not measure how good or bad an open water cat are depending on how fast it sails. Just wanted to point this out for those looking and reading. 😊

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

I agree, length adds to more comfort. But my point was about the design and the build quality. There is a reason boats end up in charter and it mostly has to do with cost. But you need to pay a little more for a boat with thicker hulls, or carbon reinforcements, or Kevlar rigging, or redundant steering systems, or extended bows to bring weight aft, or all the other small improvements I see in our Outremer and the true “blue-water” category of cats. Just my opinion! Thanks for commenting!

@hoofixrman 5 лет назад

Ive spent a lot of time on a newer lagoon 450s, very nice catamaran.

@angela1984a Год назад

@@hoofixrman Are those the ones with all the cracked bulkheads?...

@angela1984a Год назад

I wonder about the bulkheads on those Lagoon 50ft...

@lindathomson5386 4 года назад

Thanks for your video! I am just travelling down the rabbit hole of looking to get a catamaran for my family of 4 (with another one on the way!) and am a brand new subscriber (patience whilst I binge watch you guys!) It's such a big question - performance vs comfort and we are leaning towards comfort given people say you spend 90% of your time at anchor. Can you comment on how much comfort you feel you may lose when opting for performance instead? Outremer seem to be outstanding boats but I find myself being drawn to the wider hulls and roomier berths. Thoughts?

@LoanwordEggcorn 3 года назад

@Asim Ayyubi The Balance Catamarans seem to be a good balance of performance and comfort, but are a bit pricey. Their rigs are huge, so may not be great for everyone. Also seem very sensibly built.

@angela1984a Год назад

Anther plus for performance multihulls seems to be safety. And also resale price.

@victornewman901 5 лет назад

👍

@bunyipdan 5 лет назад

Archer is a beauty.....from your title and that you had made a decerning choice for a lightweight performance cruiser thought you might provide a little more insight. Looking back under the hulls of Archer, thought you might step a little further back comment on, bridge deck height, water line to beam ratio, bruce number, rig. Frankly would have liked even a rough idea of how high you could/couldn't point your old Lagoon compared to the Outremer (quite a difference I suspect), why was fast a consideration, with comparrison etc.... These broad terms you used with no details are quite obvious, no one gives the numbers or describes the pros and cons of light weight performance over lazy cruising comfort, rather than choice of colour.......a little dissapointed with the missed opportunity and limited comparisons (Schoinning, Dazcat, Oram, Seawind......). Well delivered presentation, just a little light on the detail I was looking for, cheers

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Great comment. Agree completely. To answer your Lagoon vs Outremer comment it’s pretty simple. The Lagoon COULD NOT SAIL UPWIND. Not at all. The Outremer stays with a basic monohull in upwind performance. Pretty good for a cat! But the video was never to compare Coastal Cruisers to Bluewater Cats. I hope it’s clear that there is a big difference there. You pay for that difference, and the sailing performance change is significant. But you are right, I probably left out Schoinning. I’m not familiar with Dazcat and Oram. Seawind is a Coastal Cruiser in my book, but I like the new 1600. I should have included more maybe but they were not available at the time of our purchase.

@bunyipdan 5 лет назад

@@TheSailingFamily Thanks for your reply, I have sailed on a few of the more "cruiser" cats but have not yet had the oportunity to take an Outremer out for a spin, guess I would apreciate a little more insight regarding the pros and cons of a live aboard light weight performance cat. Like a comparison on how much has the weight compromise effects your cruising lifestyle, luxury vs essentials vs toys vs performance vs comfort. And some actual experienced numbers, how close are you getting to wind speed under normal cruising weight, a real polar chart would be phenomenal.......anyway, looking forward to future episodes, cheers.

@davidsmith2074 5 лет назад

Nice vid. but not sure I agree with you making a general statement that cats. like lagoon, leppard, Fp etc are costal cats. Many of their owners who put them into charter do use them for coastal crusing, however there are many owners who do use them for worldwide cruising. Not because a cat isn't the fastest in the pack doesnt mean it can't cross an ocean. Just tell some of those ARC rally participants that have done the various legs of the world circumnavigate that their boats aren't ocean crossing worthy. Many people who purchase cats. from the other boat builders do trade speed for comfort and space. Just my taughts and great journeys on your outremer with your family.

@arumrunner 5 лет назад

Further, if you review the ARC data, you will see that the Lagoons are almost entirely in the back 1/3 of the pack. So I guess being comfy is more important than making a timely passage! Cat Impi seems to have found a good balance with their Lagoon, after much improvement on Brent's part.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

Yes. We sailed our Lagoon 380 halfway around the world. I think coastal cruisers can certainly do it, but in my opinion it’s not what those boats were designed to do. We had, and have seen it in other new boats too, lots of stress related problems to the hull, bulkheads and rig. Yes, they can do it, and a lot of people are buying those boats due to price, but they don’t sail upwind and I worry about their build quality. That’s all. It’s a talking point I did not appreciate enough on my first voyage so I’m trying to share what I have learned. But, it’s just an opinion! :) Thanks for commenting.

@TheSailingFamily 5 лет назад

You’re right too. It’s all a trade off. Comfort or performance - and cost! I think we found a good balance between them, but it’s again just our opinion!!!