The Books of Ayn Rand: November Fall Break 2023 TBR 

Yea the treatment of "big-business" as an oppressed _biological_ "minority" and _not_ in their _material-economic-relation_ of ownership of the banks, factories, governments, armies and police forces... is indeed a little bit on the nose, or so very tiring social-Darwinism.

Very interesting. I know Rand refers to herself as a "Romantic Realist" seeing humanity, or specifically the emergence of individuals within it, as they could/should be, and art is supposed to relay that, I suppose to inspire and instruct us, so perhaps she is putting the subject of art into the category of the "heroic"? I think my constant issue with Rand is to try to see her as "focused" instead of the more critical "limited." Because I think art can certain play the role of the heroic. Rand and her absolutes, though.

@@philosophy_schilling lol I hear you.

Thanks so much! I had seen these just before posting my question, and they are great ones. I love that we have record of this. I also wonder how feminists saw Rand, if they attempted to utilize her for the movement regardless of Rand's rejection of it? I suppose it makes sense, even going beyond gender, because Rand was so suspicious of "group think," not seeing rights as belonging to groups, but only to individuals. But do you see her statement that "women, just like, men, should strive for the realization of their chosen purpose" and "I would never vote for a female president" to be contradictory? Or is there some logic I am missing? To me, it seems the latter is ridden with bias, perhaps her tendency to want to see a particular male heroic individual that she should be romantically inclined toward even if she didn't practice this beyond a superficial fantasy with the men in her life. Thoughts?

​@@philosophy_schilling I, personally, have never heard Rand being celebrated in any feminist circles. I suspect her critique of group think, like you said, is why. Modern Feminist goals are very much defined by anatomy not ability and the demand of power/position conceded rather than earned. I don't find her statements about women and men striving for purpose and her refusal to vote for a female president contradictory. 'Purpose' and 'desire' are not necessarily linked. We assume that our passion oriented in a particular direction is the evidence that that is our gifting but that can get cloudy. There is intellect and there is nature. If butter knives begin intellectually envying hammers they may organize a hundred rallies about how a knife can do what a hammer does which will birth a generation of knives that consider 'Knives Are For Nails' a matter of social justice. And perhaps a few clever and determined knives are successful at building a bird house but thousands fail and blame it on the historic bias of hammers rigging the construction game in their own favor... Meanwhile everyone's peanut butter and jelly sandwiches are garbage and the mayonnaise industry has disappeared. This sounds silly but honest discussions have revealed that many women of a certain age went for the 'career woman/she can have it all' mantra and discovered they missed the window to have a baby to their regret. Now they are spending thousands of dollars a year on their Pomeranian’s seasonal outfits because they must nurture SOMETHING. We now see feminists ridicule women who desire domestic life even though they preached that the highest value was choice. Nursing, pre K thru 8th grade teaching is predominantly female- yet no feminists are insisting on the dismantling of that power imbalance (nor are they marching to be coal miners or oil rig workers…). I like Marianne Williamson as a Presidential candidate but her granola spirituality had me concerned. When questioned she did state that if it came down to it, after exhausted diplomacy, she would use the launch codes. That was important to hear. I think we’ve intellectualized ourselves away from human nature. Equality under law. But sensibilities do vary. Left alone many roles DO emerge in regularity for the sexes. During segregation, African Americans had to start their own businesses because they couldn’t shop in white stores. This gave the black community a stable economy. When segregation was done away with it was black people who rushed to integrate with white society. White people did not migrate to working for black bosses and the black community slowly eroded financially. Feminism in word is about equality but feminism in practice is largely about being like men while men have not made significant efforts to to fill the roles formerly experted by women. I think we are in a ‘experiment/observation’ stage with women’s freedom. Now that they have it we see many of the same behaviors that men were historically criticized for now being ‘brave’ when a woman goes down the same road. Men were castigated for exploiting women in the porn industry but Onlyfans let’s girls put their own sex content on the web for money and it’s applauded. Women working excessive hours ignoring family to get to the top is now ‘courageous’. And many women in the workforce earning more than their husbands have had affairs with their boss who is a higher earner and more powerful than her because she ‘wants to feel feminine’ and be taken care of. We are all witnessing this. So, yeah, equality is a must. But we are different. Acting as if that is not true, especially in grave situations, is not progress. Everyone knows what 'boys will be boys' means but saying 'girls will be girls' is taboo.

Some really interesting thoughts. Thank you for writing them out. I think this is a well thought out and helpful critique and inquiry of some lines of feminism. There are various categories of feminism, such as essentialist feminism which depends on recognizing gender differences. I'm not sure that identity movements always want "power conceded instead of earned." That might, though, be what ends up happening in some cases. We definitely have to make sure we acknowledge that not all women regret the decision not to have children and not all women support sex work without understanding how it might be problematic and harmful. But I get you are pointing out the double standards that happen sometimes. It's hard, I think, because women have internalized sexist ideas, and so we may have a double consciousness or conflict between what we feel we rationally should want (in relationships with men, let's say) and what we feel. There have, ultimately, been certain outcomes of feminism that I'm quite thankful for. Education, clothing options, and property being some of them.