I’ve yet to see the light. It’s more of you feel the dark side and when you think the light side is tapping you on your shoulder from behind, it’s just Batman there to punch you
So literally, the advice to take a break when you lose a game isn’t just to help you relax, but it could actually signal the mmr bot to adjust its matchmaking to put you with a better team so you don’t churn
Yup, that's why challenge players dodge a lot of matches, they always check opgg and usually they already know most players that troll matches so they can dodge whenever these ppl are on their team
@@ramontavaresdacruz2256 makes sense, honestly. Also, I wonder how Riot would react if everyone started trying to work the system like Challenger players did
first of all we have to distinguish between off meta picks, and trolls; if you didn't seen a darius or mf support that doesn't mean if lock them i gonna troll; second this is becoming a skill that players have to learn dodging the games they think unwinnable based on some stats.... so longer que times, I've been in 10min straight que time +5 dodges in a normal draft game, normal where i just wanna play 1 game for a day and done with it, things like opgg for players and dodging shouldn't exist for better health of game; we need more players coming in not getting out cause they think it is waste of time which it is when i que for a normal and i end up in que for +20min so i wasted 20min not playing the game see Neace argument about this stuff;
@@bahramchoobin16 I'd argue that the option to circumvent the rigged matchmaking by looking up your team mates is healthy for the players. Why should I care about the game if it wants me to lose (not have fun).
@@lilyliao9521only copers and hopers are deluded enough to believe a multi billion dollar company that’s sole premise is to turn profit would not manipulate matchmaking to maximise profits. People like you are the same people that denied there was scripting/momentum on fifa which later came out as being true in the form of “dynamic difficulty”
This is one of the biggest reasons I quit league. I can have fun losing, it's whatever. But between everyone in a match making a game miserable cuz they all wanna try hard and just win, not have fun, and the fact that they do very obvious stuff like this, it's just not fun. In fact, nobody I know, no one on my friends list, even plays the game anymore. The game is an unbalanced, unfun mess on a good day. But systems like this just make it that much worse. And it's quite literally manipulation. Nobody should allow that. It's disingenuous, and predatory. It also screams, "We don't know how to make a good game, or a fun game, or anything that actually sells, anymore, so we're just going to psychologically manipulate you to make you stick around."
Yeah i hate that. A few days ago me and a few friends got qued up in normal with grandmasters when we are silver to platin. Riot is destroying one of the most fun games i know.
@@westenev i mean yeah but it's easier to take down one fed solo laner (presuming no one else is fed) than it is to take down two fed players that synergize off of each other
@@reginaldmustardbacon5866 BS... I've been banned over 20 accounts... The LoL system report system match system is utter dog shit, mostly cause of the snowflake generation
im at 100% max churn risk in overwatch, funny how they made it 7 wins or 20 losses to rank up or down. I won 14 games and went from gold 2 > Gold 2 LOL . I still don't understand why i keep queueing up. I wouldn't even play this game if there wasn't ranked.
@@gabrielnedev8898 no, the research says that they sprinkle in some free wins so you dont ONLY have L's they state themselves winstreaks are bad for player base
Then stop playing No, actually They DON'T want you to turn away, so do it. Make the robot that's watching your every move think "Oh, if they keep losing they are going to turn away, and that's bad, so let's put him against bad players"
Not only do games sometimes feel unwinnable, but a lot of times, I get into a game, and it feels absolutely impossible to lose. Like the enemy team is just so bad that there is no way for us to lose
Do you sometime too get the feeling, the game WANTS you to win? Like your divine sunderer AA healing outheals the enemies qwe combo and you dont even got conqueror stacked up, and the allied full ap kata is the tankiest fucker you have ever seen? I havent figured this game out in the 8 years of playing it...
@@dos1195 Old, but I relate to this so much. There are games where you are fighting the same champ with the same level/items yet you're doing less damage and feel squishier in the same patch. I'm not saying it's actually that way but it boggles me sometimes.
I was confused for a plot second when he said “we’ll respected” and “EA” I’m the same sentence. Then he started to chuckle at the mere thought and I once again became certain that not all is lost.
Is that how that one dude got a high rank by playing until he lost a game and then quitting for the day? I think I remember Skooch talking about something like that.
I remember a strategy one pro uses (or used). I think it was Faker or someone from korea (I might be wrong). They're playing until they lose, and then switch to the other account, there they're doing the same thing. I also remember a pro who was playing 3 games in a row and if he lost 2 of those games he would stop or switch account. The point of theirs strategy is to divide your games into a small chunks, in this case a small chunk of 3 games, (or 5 I don't exactly remember) so when they start losing it's easier to notice, and stop before they're trapped in losers que or in bad mental. (I'm aware I'm using word "or" extensivly here, sorry abaut that. I'm still learning english)
The actually kind of make sense... If the algorithm detects that you quit the game as soon as you fire one loss than I would assume it would attempt to restart the mechanism that allows for losers Q... Then again I might just be talking out of my ass.
To the players, an ‘engaging’ experience in a competitive game is a fun, worthwhile competition. To the publishers focused on “churn rate”, an ‘engaging’ experience is simply the one you spend the most time on, whether it’s fun/enjoyable or not. No wonder people feel like their matches are fixed.
There are league players seeking professional therapy because of the stress this game causes. The people behind the matchmaking algorithm will burn in hell
The way that the situation presented at the start of the video was so incredibly specific and relatable at the same time, actually sends shivers down my spine
Skooch: don’t let losses get to you, it’s just a part of the game, what really matters is that you do your best to have fun Me: *vibing to the Celeste background music*
That and consider that this is definitively not true because he won many games in a row and then lost many games in a row.....that wouldn't happen according to the research? Now will Riot try to give you a challenge on both sides as best as it can no matter what? Yeah that seems to be that way. I had around an 85% winrate up until gold 1 because that was how good I was with the champions I was playing. Games being unwinnable has to do with smurfs not being found out in time, boosters suddenly appearing, and lastly comp. Then individual understanding and skill that isn't picked up by Riot can affect it in certain ways as well. I lost to a nasus as darius when I was silver because I didn't know proper wave mechanics and he did. Now I know wave mechanics and am much better for it which affects my rank but doesn't mean my rank ensures that I know that. There are quite a few people who seem to not know anything about wave mechanics or optimal gank paths, back times, ward placements etc. The game is a hot mess as well right now since the new items basically ruined everything about balance in the game. Overall I feel kind of bad for saying it but I hate these kinds of videos. I like listening to you and even watching your gameplay but it is starting to feel like you are just pumping out a video each day to feed the algorithm, which, to be honest, is real and isn't nice for creators to deal with. But I would much rather you continue to do stuff like bronze theory crafting, trying new games, watching you play the new game modes or even TFT etc. Again sorry for coming off real harsh like this but the video really struck a nerve and reminded me about how selfish and just....ignorant or.....childish I was about ranked back when I was a hardstuck silver player. Now I am "hardstuck gold" but I really don't give a shit about going past gold since it becomes a fucking drag in my opinion compared to any other game I am playing AND there is NO other incentive for me to do so.
There used to be this theory that CSGO would place you with people who used their mic a similar amount of time you did, thus placing you with people who encouraged or discouraged teamwork
It's not that I think that every loss is my fault, it's that losing really hard and feeling helpless is incredibly unfun, and so is a long game ending in an anticlimactic loss that feels like a pretty big waste of time
even tho you have good teammates that good teammate can have a bad game too and he gets the blame for it and gets thrown into a losers que as a punishment to not do that again. :P childish and dumb. just get us fair games and shouldnt be talking about this topic in the first place
Reminds me of a really good streak of games when I was nearing promos to another division with around 67% WR on my main, just to get slapped by 18 defeats in a row or so and dropped from promos to Plat 3 0 LP. Suddenly you are left with feeling you do not even know how to play the game anymore and really consider just quitting. This artificial keeping of "50% WR" is disgusting when you are deliberately matched with much worse people in order to carry or drop rating.
I have always noticed that when I get off of league for weeks straight or just a week generally, the first about 5 games I get insanely good teams, I had a feeling it was connected but this only confirms my suspicions lol
Ye me and my friend just won a buncha games in a row cause I carried super hard like 15 kills a game and then we just started getting 3 people on our team who would go at least 10 deaths each and a buncha smurfs on teh other team making the game completely unwinnable. I'm done with this stupid ass game till they get rid of this BS.
@@EroticOnion23 that's what I wonder, a lot of times it someone that happens to play first time in years in ranked.. like why?? I'm a support main too, the adcs are fucking terrible my god it's like they aren't human
For me it's just the opposite: My first game of the day has a < 43% chance of winning. I have tested this on my 9 accounts. Keeping score (excelsheet, win/loss) for about 30 days. One account had 25 % winrate on the first game of the day, another 67% !!. Sometimes losing 3 in a row (on the same day that is). I play this game for about 10 years now, Played 7622 games (Normals), and an average winrate over 9 accounts of 48.1% (still only Normals) Can't get my head around this thing, why your first game most of the time is matched with people with a big skill difference. I'd rather have a longer queue time in favor of a better, fairer match ... skill levels. Done ... this is off my chest now ;-)
Skooch, I appreciate these 8 minutes of your time explaining something that isn't brought to light as often. Matches in league (or in any game really) are a lot more winnable with people who know winning isn't everything, you won't win every game, and there is some games that you will lose and you just have no control over it. When games are too prioritized on making money and attracting and keeping the numbers up, they tend to disregard genuine player feedback with the state of a game. This kind of stuff needs to be brought up more, so that in the end, the only thing you should REALLY stress about is life-threatening stuff. On a side note, that's how I feel about the game Paladins right now. The game company really listens to their community, communicates with them, and are actively working on improving the game. And I definitely find a lot more friendly players on there as well. If you read all this, I genuinely hope you all have a great/better day :]
I can confirm this is probably happening, recently I had an S+ game as support Diana, then I proceeded to go 0/7 - 0/10 against people who seemed to be a lot better than any players I had faced recently
I think the best tactic that feels good for the players and it looks like it decreases churn risk is draws, or in League's case a close game. Close games are what I want. Even though I prefer winning, when it's so one sided I think it's a lot less fun.
Close games are more like games that puts you on a timer imo. I mean, if you have a teemo top that constantly int, but you doing good with 10-0, you are still on a timer. That means, you are forced to push with your lead to finish the game asap before teemo feeds not only your top enemy, but the rest of your enemies which then turns your game impossible to win.
I climbed from gold 3 to plat 4 in literally one day, went to sleep, woke up, lost 10 games in a row, playing the same champ in the same lane. Every. Single. Game. If there isn't loser's and winner's I must have some serious issues.
That exact scenario is why I think Skooch is wrong when he says we ALL have the same ranked experiences. Because that bot lane you described genuinely walks away from that game believing you griefed them and that they tried their best but YOU threw. I get those bot lanes too, and they usually have 50% WR. They literally live and die by coinflipping with no individual impact. Yet those players take to the forms online and comment on videos with stuff like "omg ItsComboz griefed my game last weekend, insane, I cant climb with these monke's" Thats why theres this idea in the community that were all having the same experiences when we talk about the ranked ladder. Godspeed, I hope you keep climbing.
Don't know about you but i just can't take anyone seriously who types "lose" with two o's. Like what the fuck it even looks and sounds so wrong holy shit.
Do what I do: > Lose game > 30 minute break with the client open > Hover over a skin in the shop > Queue up again This always seems to trigger a win streak of about 3 games, then I get a loss and repeat the steps again. I genuinely think that it tracks everything you do on the client, so tries to give you wins in order to make you buy a skin. If I do buy a skin though, then I always lose the first game and the second is a stomp. It happens every. Single. Time.
@@senrign Yes, it should, if this theory had any basis at all. Here is what is really happening: Bam. You got the skin. You're excited/anxious to use it and you inevitably will think about the reaction of your enemies. ...And then you get anxious and int hard af lmao ff 15. Next game. In this next game you're kinda sadpepe: you already accepted that you got ez clapped with your new skin, and you play with it again, this time with no immediate presumption to play perfectly or anything like that. You got a kill in the early game, things got easier. Bam, you stomped..
If you actually put it in your head that it’s a bot overlord messing with your queue’s quality, it gets much easier to digest cuz U won’t blame others/yourself as often
That makes a lot of sense. I flame my teammates so often, even tho I know it's a bad habit. I should channel my hatred on Riot instead. This is the way.
@@NahrAlma Yeah I’ve read something about riot actually has like a treasure that contains all the future matches to happen. Meaning all games are predetermined lol
@@VileCAESARB when You do 0/10 it can be a loser mentality but when people tend to make the game harder than it should be cause they don't know anything about how to play lategame when they should cause of your high ranks. it's better to blame riot than the other player they don't belong the rank they are and it's not their fault if the game allowed it it should be harder to climb. Tho the solution of all this for me should be no LP loses. They got Score system so they already did an algorithm to tell you if u do good or bad based on millions of games. if u do really better than people at your rank well , take some extra LP if u do shit or trolling hard in 0/10 when your champs is supposed to stomp early it get nothing and u just wasted your time. it just don't have to ba based on the KDA only cause people would play pussy and ks mates to get more points.
"Loser's Queue" absolutely exists. It's even present in MMORPG's PVP situations. I cannot count the times I get into a battleground on WoW, arena on ESO, what have you, and one team is just drastically and objectively BETTER than the other. Whether by one team being comprised almost entirely of undergeared "just hit level cap and queued up" people versus the other team of seasoned veterans in maxed out gear, or a team that doesn't have a concept of communication and teamwork versus a literal military unit of cooperation.
I had this happen a few days ago. I was playing with a silver 1 friend and I'm currently bronze 3. Matchmaking put us up against a pair of plat 1 laners and we were both immensely outclassed, the difference in skill was absolutely astronomical.
Yes I strongly believe there is a losers queue, as you said in the beginning you can one day have the best ranked games of your live and then the next day you’re stuck with a group of players where it feels like they are actively throwing the game
When you realize you are fighting a battle that you will never ever going to win no matter how good you are, how hard you play, it's like you enter a battlefield only to be stomp, slaughtered, and insulted by the winning team. That's okay ... but when you being force to lose because Matchmaking purposely put you together with a bad team .... that's when you need to decide .... continue to play to become a puppet of Matchmaking, grow white hair, and become a toxic man which will ended up erode your soul and possibility hurting people you love, or just say i quit uninstall the damn devilish game and just be at peace playing single player games.
@@lynarisevershadeshadowfall1684 I once played a normal game that matched 3 silvers, an unranked, and a plat vs 4 diamonds and a challenger player. Shits whack yo.
@@lynarisevershadeshadowfall1684 Yeah, the fact that normal games COUNTS to mmr is the biggest bullshit, it's the only way smurfs can climb so fast back to challenger but it makes absolute no sense
I definitely think losers queue is a thing. A few weeks ago, I started winning more than usual which was kind of surprising to me but I appreciated it nonetheless. Then, the moment I hit a new division. I ended up in a 10 game losing streak and not being able to win again until the first game I was demoted. Fortunately, I was able to promote again with ease but the games suddenly felt unwinnable again the moment I got back. I didn't even let it get to me, if anything it gave me full confirmation that something fishy is going on with the league matchmaking that Riot would never blatantly tell us.
Happened to me too, came back to league after a 4 year hiatus, got a handle on the mechanics, hit the ranked queue and won almost all my games. Had tremendous fun, and it placed me silver 3. After my placements I haven't won a single ranked game and I'm too nervous (shouldn't be but whatever) to pick it up again and drop to bronze
"I'm not gonna fault companies to keep us addicted to their games" You absolutely should. This is what makes the environment so toxic in the first place.
yes im sure if riot stopped trying to make people play there game, all the lol players will form a peace ring and stop all the blood shed. the reason people are toxic online is because there is no threat of physical violence unlike face to face.
@@skiffyjoes8586 The reason people are toxic is twofold: 1) Games themselves are often frustrating, either you know you're going to lose but some cunts refuses to ff an obviously lost game, or you're getting inted in the first 5 minutes and you're kept hostage by the afk system punishing you if you leave even if you're justified (typical games where your comp is both early game oriented and bad, all lanes feed 2+ kills in the first 4 minutes, people display terrible macro, and there is already massive flame going around) 2) Direct agression is not tolerated, which means everyone is a passive-agressive bitch, spending far more effort on crafting work-around insults or willingly disrupting gameplay by flash-ulting your farm or letting you die or ragesplitting...
@@skiffyjoes8586 no shit Sherlock. This is why moderation is needed. So you can weed out the idiots that spew toxic shit because there's no repercussions. If these idiots got local ban the issue would be so much easier to control.
This just comes from the game genres of mmo, fps and so on, which are highly competitive. Sure you can have fun if you have friends to play with, but solo is just a rage fest. On the other hand, playing an mmo or a single player (story focused) game (e.g.: detroit become human) is a fully different experience.
As times goes on a lot of my friends including myself are going more and more in the direction of coop-offline games because competitive games feel so toxic these days
I agree with this. In Hs, I used to play with my friends and they were fun times. But I mainly stopped because we were all silvers and bronze but we had one friend who was diamond and he carried all our games, which made it kinda boring. After, for two years I just played league by myself. When you do solo, the only thing you care about is winning norms or not. Since there was no one, the only goal that was set is to win and get better. But that’s just not fun. Especially since I’m a Viktor otp, it was just a toxic fest for two years
I whole ass quit mobas as a whole because I experienced this. I despise stomps, both ways, because there's no honest challenge in it. It was so hard to find a match where both teams were evenly matched, and that was the only time I could have fun and improve, the only time I didn't feel like it was bullying rather than a fair fight one way or the other. Learning about the existence of this algorithm is revolting. I thought the matchmaking was just shit after half a decade, but this rings true and seems highly likely.
Well too bad that huge companies like Riot have never heard the word ethics. They will do what ever they can to make money. And unfortunately Theres morons/bootlickers who defend them.
The existance of this research implies that the consumer will spend more money on a game they play more off regardless of how much they enjoy the experience, which is quite unsettling
That situation Skooch described at the start of the video is terrifying me, yesterday I was on a huge win streak and now I’m about to get into my platinum promos, now I’m scared to get on League today!
Yea you basically have to just play and anytime you lose more than one game in a row, stop playing for a good few hours or even that whole day. Maybe even not play until the day after.
last week i had a 90% wr over 15 games, i was plat 2 91 lp. THEN, i kept losing and losing and i could do NOTHING about it. Afks, inters, trolls, boosted accounts, bought accounts, depressed people like myself. I must have something like 40% wr over my last 20 games now, for absolutely no other reason that "I can't play the game". I didn't get any better or worse honestly, but i just found myself unable to have any impact on the games i played, even though i was stomping my lanes or stomping early. That's just how it is, i would prefer to believe that its my fault and I wasn't focused enough. But I hear the same story from all my friends, and I clearly see that I"m the same player that I was yesterday, and that my mates clearly are the purest garbage toxic players. And as long as you can accept that soloQ is rigged for any average players playing in his elo, you will be able to have at least some fun. Because if you really wanna climb, you need to have at least 1 league difference in term of skills, and no luck will help you in your journey.
Amazing video, so happy to see someone talk about this, I'd love to see more, people need to know what's going on .This is real, there are definitely forced losses and forced wins. The matchmaking has been contaminated with greed and ironically it's actually made me stop playing games because it's so gross. Losers queue is real, so is winners queue.
I play league, and yes, I totally believe loser's queue is a thing. i go back and forth between easy games and unwinnable games, usually the unwinnable games come from awful teammates though, not from better enemy players
"that you wouldn't wish upon your worst enemy" idk skooch, I'd love for Riot's balance team to actually go through this shit before they buff Irelia and divine tsunderer again.
God bless the newest irelia's nerf. It was broken, in one of my games a full build irelia could easily take on a full build yasuo and a full build ahri at the same time, even if they actually did their best. I was the irelia btw.
I’ve studied behavioral addictions in video games in some of my classes (and addictions in algorithms in general) and given how many other addictive models are in LoL (daily login rewards, random champion shards that are basically loot boxes, changing the game every 2 weeks)I’d bet a fat wad of cash that riot implements similar algorithms, because if they are as blatant and bold about the other addictive mechanics they’d have to be staffed by vegetables to not be fixing matches to increase player engagement
This is so fucked up. Leauge is such a great game in theory. I stopped playing csgo for similar reasons when i discovered that litteraly all pro player are cheating. It never ends. Its over. I think i have to go back playing fucking age of empires 2....
I think there's a way to manipulate the system, tho it requires a lot of work from your part You have to play in "bursts", a week of play then a void of multiple months of silence, in and out in and out This way the system will try to hook you in by giving you slightly more instant wins, than instant loses or fair games
I don't know for sure if it works that way. I think the game will just look at your recent wins and recent losses no matter how long its been. Unless a new season has come around during that time, of course.
Honestly this made me realize a few things. Mostly why I am addicted to League, while I have no problem with being addicted to other games, alcohol, smoking, or anything whatsoever. Also I fully believe this is a thing, and mostly in the last 1-2 years. I don't know whether it is because of mental tactics, or because the game is dying, but whenever I queue up (in silver 2 - gold 3) I feel like the majority of the games are just sh*tty matchmaking. Either I'm: Being Sh*tstomped: which is NOT Fun Shitstomping: Which is NOT Fun It's not fun waiting and having to play for 15-25 minutes, when the game is already predetermined after 5 minutes/in picks/in queue. Either my opponent in lane is so bad, that I cannot learn anything to improve myself and they don't pose a challenge OR my opponent is so good that I yet again cannot learn, because I get punished for every little mistake I don't even know I'm making, and my best chance of winning is trying to not lose a "fixed" 15 minute fight, while not falling behind. When I fight my opponent and one of us is dead in seconds while the other is at 80% hp it is boring or infuriating. I am a really calm guy, and can keep my cool pretty easily, if I lose because they beat me fair and square. But nowadays I rarely get matches that are actually balanced and fun, when both teams are so equally good that we fight multiple 5v5s and both team dies. When you and your lane opponent are the only ones alive and brawl it out but neither of you can quite kill each other. When both teams clutch up and come back, so you have 2-3 comebacks a game, and they last 40-60 minutes. These moments are the ones I love(d) to play for, but they are getting rarer and rarer. After having enough of the game and noticing myself get too toxic, I have decided I will NEVER play another game of League, and as of writing this I have not played for 3 weeks which doesn't seem like a lot, but it's the most since a year ago when I wanted to go from iron to gold. I am sad. I am sad that the game I actually love is getting torn apart from every possible angle. When the devs are coming up with bullshit champs and abilities with laughable powercreep, when there are literally 150 champs, and instead of fixing one, balancing it, or fixing its bugs, they put in the effort to make an entirely new one. They do this 6 times a year. When instead of improving matchmaking, the report system or the client, they decide to flip a coin, roll the dice, and create a patch that feels more like it's written by monkeys with a typewriter rather than actual humans, every two weeks. The game that taught me a lot, becoming something I don't recognize. Thank you for coming to my TED talk / Rant.
I mean that is right. The majority of the players are garbage. And if you want to climb you need to get better. And if you're better you will climb. That's why there is not a single Challenger that is stuck in low elo. Look at Tyler1, he got Challenger on three different roles and now got to Masters on his fourth role. That means that he is objectively better than 99,9% if the playerbase even if it doesn't seem so. Loser's que exists, but it doesn't exist to keep you away from reaching your actual ranked skill level. Also skill is a spectrum, and not a fine line of the spectrum. Some times you just play bad and lose because of it. Statistics show 80% of the games are out of your control, half of that amount you will lose regardless of your personal performance and half of that you will win regardless of your personal performance. Meaning that only a fifth of the games you play are decided by your plays. If you are better than your environment then you will climb cuz you'll have positive winrate and you'll demote if you're worse. The more you play the more accurate your rank is. Simple as that. Loser's que affects everyone equaly(I assume) so it evens out in the long term and assuming that you're in low elo simply because of it is foolish.
@@Fr33mx Tyler plays a billion fucking games a day, plus dude is insanely fucking lucky in terms of the teammates he gets. He plays like ass and gets carried most of the time. HE HAS to climb eventually. Solo queue is fucking bullshit and this game should be dead already.
@@Fr33mx exactly so basically elo hell does exist you just have to be good enough to get out of it. I climbed from iron to gold and am working on platinum and usually have yo carry on a macro champ like tf.
I remember one time back in season 4 my friend who didn't play league came up to me and said "why do league players hate league" and I responded with "bro they're just inside jokes, it's actually a pretty decent game". Season 11 rocks up and so does another friend asking a similar question but this time I seriously and unironically said "because it's a bad game" and then realised that I had been making so many jokes about league being a bad game when it wasn't that I didn't even notice when it actually turned into a shitty game.
I was literally thinking about this like two nights ago. I spent all night winning and ended almost two placements higher in gold. The next night I started up, lost repetitively over and over. Typically with mates who just seemed to have zero mechanical understanding for the average gold / plat player. It happens often.
@@EroticOnion23 elo inflated, riot constantly brings em on teams that have smurfs/carry players and let them win with them, or they let the smurfs/carry players lose with them. so since riot admited to having a smurf queue and therefor the best players are accountent u know that the opposite must be true aswell, so the worst players are also getting tracked wich then makes em eble to match the trash garbage bozos with whomever they decide to force to lose now, and that is made to bring the bozo to a 50% wr, and u down on a 50% wr. at least thats what i think but i never took record of my games but after so many lol games i just know something aint right
I am a hard stuck gold 3 Katarina One Trick. I get really decent teams till I hit Gold 2 and then i just get inters over and over again and this has happened more than 10 times I easily climb to gold 2 and then cant even win 1 game because matchmaking gives me 3 or 4 inters in team. I am really lost and not sure how to climb at all. I want to get plat asap but I feel like riot doesn't want me to hit it.
I play league incredibly infrequently, I always have, my win rate when returning is through the moon, my win rate when i keep playing for a few days drops (and then i get sad and swear of league for a month) I might just be feeling confirmation bias, and i never actually put stock in “losers queue” or loss streaks being anything other than having just a bad vibes day This does make sense though, and matchmaking manipulation is exactly what i have grown to expect from every single corporation
I have said this ever since I started and stopped playing this god forsaken game and I will continue to say it: Riot knows that most players will quit or play dramatically less after they reach their desired rank hence why systems like this exist it literally is to keep better players from climbing because once they climb they play less. Most of the people who 'climb' are level 900 and most challengers have played since beta and constantly express their love and willingness to 'never quit the game' so Riot knows these people are never satisfied and gives these players their desired rank because they will never quit until they literally die.
nahhh, individual skill matters in most all games, even poker ffs. The systems described in the above video apply to everyone, people who can consistently make new accounts and hit challenger within 2 weeks in league aren't just lucky. Sometimes you don't win games of baseball even if you are the best player on the field, but thems the breaks.
@@Destroyer2150 well when it comes to music a banger for one guy will be disgusting for another. I love "here comes vi" "get jinxed" ect but i gotta say i find the kda shit and "rise" awfull
I was playing league for months straight, then got Senior (a single player game for those who don’t know). Even though I struggled at times and got frustrated, I couldn’t help but think how much happier I was playing it over league.
It's so bad that if you're predetermined to lose that next game it doesn't even matter whether or not the game seems to be in your advantage or not because "comebacks" are now part of the titles and a feature in the game. I lost games/won games with 3 vs 5 players before and to sit here and suggest to me that maybe the players with the most team should have played better when they were clear winners by sheer numbers if the matchmaking was truly fair is not even going to be entertained as an option for me.
In Diablo 3 Vanilla early days with the RMAH (Real Money Auction House), Legendary drops were very few are far between. You could play all weekend long and maybe not get one. But if you didn't play at all for about a week or so, inexplicably within 30 minutes of playing, you'd drop one and get a "ding". Something lower tier but still a "ding". I believe they wrote it off as confirmation bias, but many people reported it happening to them after not logging in for awhile. It happened to me as well, and it felt odd because I was use to playing long sessions and not getting one. Playing 4-5 hours after work each night for a week while dropping maybe one or none, then going out of town for work and when I login again over a week later I almost get one instantly. Almost assuredly, Blizzard had some sort of "engagement" lever where they'd give you the small slot machine "win" and dopamine to keep you hunting for the real prizes. Data probably showed that people who took a break from the game, and came back and didn't get at least a breadcrumb drop in the first hour, just didn't have the drive to keep grinding and had low retention rate. But if you play everyday regardless, then you are "engaged" anyways
I can say that I’ve gone between D3 and D2 like 7 times in the past month and its always been 5 game winstreak followed by a 5 game loss streak. Of course some of those losses I will blame on my garbage macro. With that being said, last month I was parkouring between D4 and D3 constantly so if you do get better (which I have), you’ll climb eventually.
The hardest thing is to control yourself in the middle of blind rage. You can keep this thought of "winning doesn't matter" for sure, and It indeed helps to have more fun. But sometimes, the hardest thing is to think straight, if humans were capable of doing that without practice, there would be so much less toxicity and such harsh opinion on matchmaking. But I hope that this video indeed spreads the word out there, great topic to cover man!
If i start to get that mad, or if i get the rare game that actually tilts the hell out of me, i simply close the video game because I am upset with the video game
@@Archeronus I've had winnstreaks where I stomped. Was bored out of my mind after the first 3 games of stomping. No, winning isn't everything if it's too easy and you don't feel challeneged. It doesn't feel good to constantly stomp, as well as being the one who keeps getting stomped. This is why even games are my favorites.
This is all sadly true, people underestimate how easy and simple it is to create a matchmaking algorithm that rigs your games in a way you keep playing, especially when they have a huge player base to pick and choose from. Just look at the gambling industry, they have been using the same methods and ideology for almost a century. Now I ain't telling anybody to stop playing the game, all I'm saying is stop paying the game. Only vote they care about is your money and they have shitty staff and servers to run.
I was a hardcore FIFA player, and just by your description of the article I know it's based on FIFA, because that is one of the saddest things about the game. The matchmaking is beyond chaotic. I could write an essay about how EA manipulates the game to make you become more addicted, and matchmaking is just the tip of the iceberg
I had this thought the other day with my friends, we will go on massive streaks and do flawlessly, then we will play the same comps and way and go on loss streaks that would make anyone cry. It feels like whatever I do doesn’t matter anymore in league
When I figured out this was the system in place, I got rid of my account. Imagine having a losers queue in fighting games. Ranked doesn’t put you with higher players unless you specifically ask for it, and matches are solely based on knowledge and character picks. THATS how matches should always be, and shouldn’t be determined by a power you can’t control
You are sadly right, I've been having this feeling for over a year already. People tend to not like it when I say it because they consider me a fucking deluded piece of crap. Though, it is so blatantly obvious that it happens, since there have been games that you feel are lost before you even get into the rift. That's why losses can hurt much more than the fact that you lost; because it was a game that had to be played because the matchmaking decided it would be your turn to lose, and you could do nothing to prevent it other than not playing the game. Riot follows this principle like gravity pulls things to the object that it comes from. They want player engagement and will fuck you up as hard as you allow them if that's what they gain. They have found and keep evolving the balance between hooking a player on the game and torturing them for it.
I uninstalled league for the second time in a row just over 3 days ago, I feel like playing again but I know I'll have to wait 40 minutes for installation, and that I'll find myself uninstalling the game again because I got angry at the unfair matchmaking Fuck, there are games that we can't do anything to win, if I can't do anything, then I don't do anything. In the Solo Q I would sit around my tower ignoring confrontations and goals hoping my bad team would inevitably lose. I'm very sad with what this game has done to me over 2 years, I've turned into an apathetic individualist who plays with chat turned off and muted pings doing immoral builds to win... In the end I know it's no use winning this or that game, defeat will always find a way to catch me (by defeat I mean sabotaging matchmaking) I feel like an orphan child, because I wanted the company to follow an honest path, is it so hard for the game to succeed by being fair to its players? that's just what gives me shivers down my spine, the possibility that league would die faster if the matches were fair
so the main point I make is if they try to keep you at a 50% wr, then a. how could they do that without a way to increase your probability to lose, AKA losers que, and B. imagine you have a coin and hitting one side over and over again. with them admitting they try and keep you at 50%, how is it possible that you are hitting one side 4-5, even more times in a row. what are the chances? and I can't tell you how many times it happened to me. no way at all. I could go on if you want, but I think you get my point
It's like drugs or something... I like to play but I get so mad and frustraded at the same time. I am starting to think lol it's just good to watch but tilting to play for me.
I was on my way to plat along time ago and as soon as i got to the promo i whent on a lose streak all the way back to gold 5 so that was fun, aaaand that happend 3 times every time i got up they pusht me down, i knew then how mufasa felt
Had the same thing but managed to climb a bit higher, got up to plat 3 something like 80lp with a decent winrate (like 55-60%) and then riot just flipped a switch. I got into loss streak after loss streak after loss streak (with maybe 2-3 wins in between), until I just stopped playing. It wasn't fun anymore. Didn't demote out of plat though but it was close, actually got the "demote shield about to expire" warning as I had too many consecutive losses at p4 0lp. My winrate was all the way down to 40% and I gained maybe 10 or 11 lp for a win but lost like 16 for a loss by the time i called it quits.
I only seriously tried playing ranked for one year in my 9 years with this game I did an okay job, I climbed up to gold 3 which might be nothing to some people but I never reached that far ever, so I was very happy. I was really excited to go even higher next season, and when I tried playing as the next season started... I have never experienced anything as heart breaking and will shattering as these first (and definitely last) 30 games. I seriously think I will never ever touch ranked again, you have no idea how bad it got. I even made a new account just to refresh myself after this whole experience, I genuinely felt defeated.
Kinda reviving the discussion here. It gets even worse than that, i also tried climbing once in 10 years, almost got to plat, went through gold like butter, before i reach G1 90 LP and the shit hit the fan. Diamonds and even Master tiers on enemy team, while i have silvers and gold. Can you imagine? Couldn't even get to promo, was close like 5 times.
I did 70% winrate to Diamond on a fresh account, but on my main I can't escape plat 4 mmr. The matchmaker is 100% fixing games based on some set of conditions to the point that once you play more than 10 games without going up a rank you might as well just delete the account and start again from scratch. Your choice literally becomes "pay for a new account or quit the game" smile.
Loser's queue exists, but hell I'm not gonna let that affect me. I try my best, I tell the trolls to please stop and I satisfy myself by knowing I did my best. I also stop playing when I'm tilted. It all comes with the game, and you bet I'm gonna do everything I can to enjoy it
I've always had loser's que. Usually 1 day where almost everything is wins and than the rest of the week is nothing but the most iron player on my team.
This kind of stuff is EVERYWHERE, whether it be on our phones, on the computer, any app you use, even youtube. Thats how this stuff works and honestly, it sucks because we are constantly being manipulated whether we know it or not.
And what i think is most important that riot gets is that (when the player base becomes aware of the system they are using) every time someone experience the same system designed to hook them to the game and realizes it's that system's fault for a lot of their loses and bad experiences, players will immediately quit the game afterwards. Which actually raises the question does the system even work, if people become self aware of it's existence, and i think no it doesn't.
This matchmaking system has been obvious to me for months, and I'm fine to accept the unwinnable games as unwinnable and just move on. What pisses me off is how every single time, my team is oblivious to whats happening here, and forces the game to at least 30 mins. That really frustrates me.
Cancerpatients at Riot, claiming its a competetive game, when they just straightup rig the games. So yes losers q exists, and it has gotten worse over the years.
@@SiMeGamer if you played the game enough, you know that its there, sure we cant prove it, but im not gonna sue them over it, so why does it even matter. Anyone with enough time in this game knows it exists.
@@SiMeGamer Then you either never played solo/duo in those 8 years and i mean really play , like at least 500 games a season for multiple seasons OR youre completely ignorant and casual player.
I had an insane losestreak playing solo queue recently so I started playing some flex (p4 on both queues). I went 13-0 and as I was playing my teammates went from the best to increasingly worse. On my last games even when we were ahead everyone was toxic, spamming FF 15 and we only pulled through bc I kept pressing no. At last, the 14th game had the worst possible teammates imaginable. No vision, mispositioning and toxicity beyond comprehension. My point being, thanks to winstreaks like these you can really see this being put into work. It became apparent that I was being matchmaked with worse and worse players until the winstreak was over and that this system does exist
Dont forget just because some machine learned robo overlord assumes you'll lose in certain conditions doesnt mean you cant pull a win out of your ass. Dont give up just cos youre in losers queue. If youre gonna keep playing always play your best and you never know you might prove robo overlord wrong
This... I just did this yesterday, I'm almost 80% sure it was a loser's queue, and boy let me tell you it feels so fucking amazing to win a game the system meant for you to lose because you carried... fuck you algorithm! I then went ahead and lost the next game lol
No, When you are a bronze being matched against 3 golds and 2 diamonds you can't. I don't get this "Never give up" NA mentality, we are not proplayers trying to win a Prize, if the Matchmaking Buttfucked you just FF and go next and pray the stupid RNG will let you have fun
Waste of time. The matchmaking system is far from good. It's not worth to try to win every game. When the game starts with 10 deaths onnyour side and 2 teammates flaming and tilting in chat, you cannot win this. I bet you 10 k, that they most likely even have some bots in your team to make it harder for you to win.
Honestly, that was something I figured out in Lol for a long time. When we called our really good friend to play with us and carry us, enemy ranks kept getting higher and higher. At one point, a bronze-silver-gold team was against a plat-diamond team aaand... You could guess how that ended. This instance happened multiple times. Also... power play. Buffing new heroes to infinity and nerfing other not so popular heroes to oblivion... Lol is getting more and more capitalist.
At least Heroes of the Storm is pretty honest about this. It's always incredibly obvious when the matchmaking has decided to screw you over. Also, Jenkins made a video about breaking the formulas these games use to avoid huge losing streaks, and although he specifically is talking about DotA and I don't think he even knew or talked about the "churning" issue at the time, I feel his solution perfectly "counters" the churning algorithms.
One day I was casually climbing through Gold 1 on my way to reclaim Diamond 4 and drop the game until the next season when I reached promos after a streak of good games not too easy or too hard with teammates ranging from chill to mute, but the moment Rito detects I get to Plat promos, the sheer instant I dared not to be condemned to solo queue hell for longer than I should, Rito decides to send one of their hitmen to troll my game, playing Tristana adc who literally missed the first 3 minions of the first wave and proceeded to afk while still moving around the map so the game wouldn't count it as an afk. Then the 3rd game I had a duo whose partner was taking forever to connect but he said he "totally" would be back so we didn't remake, motherfucker took 20 minutes to come back, but miraculously through the power of friendship and disdain for those idiot duos we pulled off the win. I am inevitable Riot, you can't stop me!
Yes, Riot Games uses this to keep you addicted. I started playing League of Legends almost 10 years ago and I can assure you that every time you stop playing for more than a month and then come back to League, the algorithm will do whatever it can to hook you up again. After a big pause, it usually places you with people who are nice, polite, untiltable, etc. but when you start playing every day for 2-3 weeks, the algorithm knows that you are now addicted again, so it starts matchmaking me with the most annoying, teammates who say "ok, I go troll" the second they go 0/1. Why? Well, it needs to get other people addicted again. But don't they risk losing you as a player? Yeah, they do. However, they know that one day, something will remind you of LoL, and because people usually get nostalgic and are judging the past more positively than the present, chances are that you will eventually come back to LoL.
Honestly, This is definitely something I've been struggling with and Ive been taking a lotta time trying to calm down and look at losses and stupid deaths on my part, cause tilt affects gameplay. Definitely think Loser queue is very real
dude! you're a 100% spot on. the last few games the people on my team had win rates in the 40%s. The enemy team? 56%. How is that fair? We got stomped and rightfully so. I checked the games where I won and again, the team I had were in the mid 50%s. This is totally setup to be addictive. Makes me just want to troll their game on purpose.
Having streaks of games where lanes just go an average of 3 kills to 20 deaths on my team is common, and it's hard to believe that the Riot algorithm cannot detect someone who is hard running it down for the last 3 games they played. This is why Blitz and similar apps are so insane, because they just show you when you are in loser's queue and give you a fast way out.
First lets start by giving some background. I've been playing league of legends since roughly 2011, I started playing because WoW Cata was so horrible I had to find a new game to get addicted on. Didn't play ranked until roughly 2012. I was bronze then, became silver 2013 and later gold that year. I've basically been gold 3-1 for 8 years without playing consistently. I would play for 1-2 month twice a year and then quit as it was just to toxic and hazardous to play for prolonged period of time. During this time I have never dipped below gold (not counting season reset). Safe to say I KNOW how to play the game and I've seen system change over time. Recently I purposefully got my account banned by scripting because it was TOO addictive to play and this forced me to eventually buy a 10 usd NEVER ranked before smurf so I could play with my friend who had started playing ranked for the first time in 6-7 years. I started my journey in bronze 1 and in less than 6 hours became silver 3. Unfortunately I main support with over 7000-8000 ranked nami games and 1000+ yuumi ranked games. Safe to say when I play against silver and low gold players, I in theory and practice absolutely dominate players....untill the mid-late game when my role becomes less important. This leads to a lot of losses even though I am WAAAAY beyond silver. After losing like 5-10 (Non-Consectuively) the LP gains went from 25-14 in the fastest manner I have ever seen in the 10 years I've been playing this game. Now I can barely get 9 LP for winning and I lose roughly 15-18 per game. The MMR system is more harsher it has ever been and it is so overturned to lock people in their ranks. The past year I have noticed the algorithm almost perfectly placing me in a set mmr (I am a mathematician, I can see when there is one fucking with me). before I got banned I could win 11 games in arow and my MMR would barely increase, but it would also make sure if I lose to many, it would pool player from low silver to even me out. The shit Neural Network algorithm can do nowadays is terrifying and its safe to say that I was detecting how games we're pre-determined loss before champ-select started. Now that I have been playing on this new account, I cant even get past silver 2 and as I am writing this am in silver 3 with the smurf account. This doesn't make even sense if you take into account that due to the smaller player-pool, the game has a more shifted player base in terms of division. (If you were gold in 2012, odds are you have the skills to be diamond today (with a little practice)). If any of you have ever played SC2 ranked, you know what I mean. When I played SC2 during 2011 I was hardstuck silver and I never in my wildest dreams thought I could be plat let alone diamond, I suck at SC2 and just got diamond because the general player population is soooo New/bad, which shifts me towards the higher ELO population of the ladder. My account: euw.op.gg/summoner/userName=SKT%20Malware TL:DR I havent been silver in a decade (previously gold 3-1), but the MMR system is so fucking broken that I cant even get with a smurf account beyond silver 2. I have over 10k ranked games played, skill is not issue, the algorithm/mmr system is. This shit dosent even make sense if you take into account that the lower player population should lead to it being easier to get higher elo than silver (if you are old school).
