The Defiant's Failed Successor | Boulton-Paul P.92 [Aircraft Overview #93] 

F.A.Q Section Q: Do you take aircraft requests? A: I have a list of aircraft I plan to cover, but feel free to add to it with suggestions:) Q: Why do you use imperial measurements for some videos, and metric for others? A: I do this based on country of manufacture. Imperial measurements for Britain and the U.S, metric for the rest of the world, but I include text in my videos that convert it for both. Q: Will you include video footage in your videos, or just photos? A: Video footage is very expensive to licence, if I can find footage in the public domain I will try to use it, but a lot of it is hoarded by licencing studies (British Pathe, Periscope films etc). In the future I may be able to afford clips :) Q: Why do you sometimes feature images/screenshots from flight simulators? A: Sometimes there are not a lot of photos available for certain aircraft, so I substitute this with digital images that are as accurate as possible.

Always loved the look of the P-61 BlackWidow.

"Specialized high explosive bombs to be used against bombers" *Japanese naval air service takes notes*

Now the Beaufighter fitted with a turret makes a bit more sense to me. Not that the result was ever likely to work the way the Air Ministry wanted, but at least that Beau does not look like such an outlying oddity. The installation of 4 Hispano cannons right alongside the gunner reminds me of one of the stories in John "Bob" Braham's book "Scramble". In it he told of one night a Hisso gun exploded when he pressed the "fire" button. That was a bad night and a fair bit of fuselage damage in a Beaufighter, but it would be deadly for the gunner in this design.

You really should've named this video "This turretfighter was CRAZY", that wouldn't just be clickbait, it'd be the truth. So glad I watched this.

06:55 - half scale replica but no half scale pilots? I am sure they could have trained up one of the cast of the 1939 Wizard of Oz movie. A few of them were British, you know.

A twin-engine turret fighter with 20mm cannons seems like a excellent night fighter concept. But a gigantic quad 20mm turret is a bit much. Far more sensible would've been a twin 20mm turret (still should be quite sufficient for downing bombers) and another pair of 20mm in the belly or wing roots, with a wider fuselage so that you can have better crew comfort and safety. Along with more room for adding a radar in the nose.

Hell yeah a new video to start my 13 hour shift Thanks

There was a cheesy but fun arcade air combat game called Heroes Over Europe that came out in 09. One thing I always remember about it is that you could unlock the P-61, which came complete with its turret working independently from the pilots guns. You could just fly around letting that quad turret rip enemy planes to shreds automatically. It has always made me wonder about how turret fighters (or planes such as the P-61 which had the capability of essentially being turret fighters if they wanted to) with late war tech would have done if the war had continued as well as how they would have functioned had the tech been up in the air sooner. addendum: The game Heroes Over Europe is average as far as gameplay goes (it is competent, functional and in working order though nothing special), but has a rather entertaining campaign due to excellent voice acting. Worth playing if you like that style of game.

It's easy to see turret fighters as a strange dead end in military aviation history, but the turret was there ready to go for the new bombers. Without the highly developed turret technology already available, bomber defence may have been a much bigger problem than it already was.

I think the air ministry was potentially on to something here - the Germans demonstrated the value of oblique fire with their Schraege Musik installations and what is this if not an aircraft purposed designed for that form of attack (with twice the oblique firepower into the bargain). In theory it would have made a fantastic night fighter - so long as radar could be fitted in the airframe. Considering the cramped proportions of the cockpit area, I have my doubts that radar could easily have been accommodated, but there was at least space for a navigator who could have been given the task of operating the set.

I live just down the road from where Boulton Paul was made always great to hear about other planes they made, the factory is now a furniture distribution centre.

I thought I knew one or two things about Airplanes from my early modeling career, but everytime Rex pulls out another rabbit out of the hat, I know in a very delightfull way that I don‘t! Go on with your excellent work and may it pay off for you!

My mother worked on Defiant turrets during the war and I served my apprenticeship there during the late sixties.

I consider myself a decent airplane nut, and I had never heard of this, awesome channel and thank you for the interesting video.

Wile E. Coyote put glider wings and a needle point on a load of dynamite sticks and dropped them from a sling under a balloon. You can guess how things went. Apparently gliders sound like harmonicas. 🤔

5:32 The same method of escape for the pilot was planned for the Ta 154 "Sprengstoffträger" or explosive device carrier...

The P61 is something I would certainly love to see covered!

I wonder why they didn't go for a .50/12mm BMG style gun? a useful compromise between a machine gun of rifle calibre and a cannon packing a lot more punch than .303 but allowing the carriage of a lot more ammunition than a 20mm?

Rex, thanks for this great vid. It is an example of why you are my favourite aviation channel. On thing I love is that you work with great still images that are 100% relevant, and overlay this with well researched info. Thanks again. ❤

I never even knew this plane existed, and I love turret fighters! Like the battle tanks of the sky, but less effective.

375 mph with four 20mm seems a tall order in itself to me.

Don't let this distract you from the fact that the AM thought the .303 was suitable for turret defenses on the Lancaster.

The fact that they even contemplated housing 4 20mm guns in a single turret makes me think nobody at the time had much experience with that caliber of gun in a warplane. Side note: One of those photos of the Defiant made me think that it shared a lot in common with the IL-2. Change the turret setup to a standard rear gunner position and viola!

As a designer at Boulton-Paul I'd have thought conservative and envisioned a Defiant equipped with two 20mm Cannons in the strengthened and (possibly) slightly enlarged turret, two fixed 20mm Cannons in the wings and a Rolls-Royce Griffon Engine. Perhaps with this idea the development of Griffons would not have been temporarily stopped in 1939? Wondering if half-size Gunners would be available? 🙂

Hope you feel better soon. Imagine if this aircraft had been successful.

There could have been a RAF unit piloted by persons of restricted growth initially flying the mini Sterlings and later moving on to the mini Victor and Vulcan V bombers. They might have had short range though.

Never heard of this one, looks like a Defiants cooler cousin. Real shame it never got a proper prototype.

Did the designers at Bolton-Paul ever consider adding two or four forward firing .303 mach guns in the wings? If the Defiant had the forward firepower and a more robust engine, it might have been somewhat of a success.

My mother was a riveter on the P61, so I look forward to a video about it. Don't wait too long, however, since I am 81 years old. I would like to enjoy that video while my mental faculties are still working(lol).

4*20mm cannon... That would ruin anyone's day.

Hi Rex.... if you read this! During the Second World War, Marshal of the RAF Charles Portal said that the single most important piece of airmanship of the entire war for the the UK was not by a RAF or Fleet Air Arm pilot pilot flying a powered aircraft, but by Staff Sergeant Jim Wallwork of the Army's Glider Pilot Regiment who put his glider down just 25 meters from the end of the Bénouville Bridge over the Orne Canal Bridge a few minutes after midnight on the morning of 6 June 1944. He, his co-pilot and the 28 men of the Ox and Bucks Light Infantry were the first men to land on D-Day. Would be great for you to do a video on the Airsead Horsa they landed in and the other gliders of that war. A specific video on this action - Operation Deadstick - would be great to. Oh, and if anyone from the BBC ever reads these - as a follow up to the Rogue Heroes about the public schoolboys of the SAS, a film of Operation Deadstick would have virtually all the main players on the operation being from working class backgrounds.... surely something the BBC should applaud!

Haven't even watched it yet and I'm thinking to myself "Oh you sweet summer child" when I think of B-P

Another very good one. How i understand you Rex. Take some rest.

What was up with the British reasoning of either .303 or 20mm and there is nothing in between? They were quite familiar with .50 cal as they used it for AA, but seemed dead set against using it for aircraft of their own design. I would imagine that a much smaller remote controlled turret with 4 .50s aimed by the navigator, rather like the P-61 Black Widow, would have been a better solution.

This video was incredible, great photos for the whole thing, and amazing information

Am really waiting for the P-61 story,it's my favorite WW2 aircraft.

The idea of upward firing fixed guns was in the Sopwith Dolphin , a successful fighter of WW1. The Germans used the strategy of dropping bombs onto the formations of American bombers with mixed results .

The drawings look like an art deco-era architect was told to design a starfighter

Forever thumbs up and support for your great content that has fantastic subtitles/captions

Oh, please do a P-61 video. Always been my favorite twin-engine fighter.

That quick little bit at 9:40 about airborne radar, that would have been genius for the time. Imagine an AWACS system in the 1940s. No matter how rudimentary it would be, that would have been a HUGE advantage, especially for deep penetration bombing missions.

Germans then went on to prove that dropping bombs and Schräge Musik were both exceptionally effective at bringing down bombers

outstanding video!! Great work sir thank you

Great video, hope you can rest well now

Thank you for another very informative video about an aircraft that I did not even know existed before viewing your video. Keep up the Good Work!

Can not wait for the p61video

I'm looking forward to a P-61 video.

Rest well! I love your work and seriously look forward to every offering. To that end I pray you are able keep on....

Rex time.

Bolton Paul sure had some crazy aircraft.

Hahaha "as on the Thunderbirds tv show." We remember it well!😊

I get that feeling ! Cracking video

You should check out the Vickers 414 design proposal which was to carry a nose mounted Vickers 40mm cannon and powered by a pair of RR Griffon engines. One was design to fill Air Ministry Specification F.6/39 and had a fixed mounted. A second was fitted with a moveable cannon (with an elevation of 45 degrees, a Depression of 10 degrees and 15 degrees to left and right) was to meet Air Ministry Speicifation F.22/39. The gunner/loader sat besides the pilot and used a predictor fire control to operate the gun. Provided the gunner kept the target in the sight the gun would remain pointing at it. This system was tested on a Wellington (serial no. L4250) but no hits were recorded on the target towed by a Hawker Henley but it was estimated that 50% came within 4 feet of the target. The F.6/39 was dropped from the 1939 by the start if Nowenber 1939. The F.22/39 design by April 1940 was being proposed to have fixed forward firing cannons in a tandem seated fuselage with the gunner facing aft. This version had either 2 40mm cannons or 8 20mm cannons. This new design got a new specification - F.16/40. By January 1941 the number of 20mm cannons was reduced to 6.

One of those photos of the Defiant made me think that it shared a lot in common with the IL-2. Change the turret setup to a standard rear gunner position and viola!

I always enjoy your vids,and look forward to the next. I really appreciate your presentation and research. Thanks for ditching the music. Kind regards Ben.

Regarding the Defiant," I wonder if the designers ever considered installing a larger, more powerful engine, a lighter two gun turret and forward firing cannons?

Ran out of PaperSkies videos and was hungry for more historical and educational aviation videos. You sir are the ConeofArc of Avation videos. Looking forward to more content, keep it up and I'm sure you'll gain keep gaining a good amount of subscribers.

So, to see the actual flying effects of drag created by having the guns facing outboard and elevated above 45 degrees , they built a 1/2 scale version that didn't include the guns? Am I the only one that sees an issue with this thinking?

The more I watch your very informative videos, the more I am astounded at the gross incompetence of the Air Ministry. Did they ever actually employ anyone with any knowledge of aircraft or air warfare? The mind boggles that they actually thought that all fighters and bombers should be armed by 303 calibre machine guns. As a school boy we use to shoot the Lee Enfield 303 rifle and Bren gun. It was obvious to a fourteen year old that the 303 would have been a total pea shooter against metal aircraft. As for the Turret fighter concept, one can only shake one’s head in dismay, that this was actually thought to be a valid idea..One also thinks of the poor young men, expected to go to war in these ungainly contraptions agains very capable enemy aircraft. Thank heavens for the American aircraft in WW2

Great channel. 😎

What a deal dropping on another Aircraft.....Thanks for the awesome video my friend...... Old Navy Flying Shoe🇺🇸

If you’re ever gonna do a vid on the P-61, you NEED to come over to this side of the pond and see the one that’s under restoration at the Mid-Atlantic Air Museum. It’s in the final stages of restoration to airworthiness

First of all thanks for all your great content. I am not sure if this is the proper way of making a request for a video, but here goes: Fiat G.55 "Centauro". Apparently a more than ordinary capable Italien fighter plane with the let down, that it was very complex to build. I hope you get around to it. Thank you again for a great channel :)

Don't laugh, but the first F4U Corsairs were equipped to drop air-to-air bomblets onto enemy aircraft. Small windows were placed in the cockpit floor to facilitate this.

The idea of dropping bombs on the bombers from above would be interesting for the people on the ground dealing with the ones that missed. You would be getting bombed by both sides.

I loved the autocannon in the Tsetse Mosquito variant, just the thing for low level maritime strafing and sub hunting.

Half scale pilot....brilliant

Could indeed have made an interesting night fighter if it'd been around when radar got small enough. Swap the navigator seat for a radar operator and go have fun.

Actually (according to Caliban Rising) the Defiants battle honours do not make for nearly as grim reading as one might expect.

I love the weird, obscure stuff. How about a look at the twin Hotspur glider one day?

I've had a few weeks where everything goes wrong, so I feel ya bud!

A vickers Wellington had a huge turret like that I'm sure I've seen a picture of it.

I want the alternate history where Boulton-Paul built everything.

The German's DID at one point drop bombs on US bomber streams. As described in Heinz Knoke's autobiography "I flew for the Fuhrer". Whilst a short lived experiment it did apparently have some success.

More canons! And bigger!

P61 Black Widow: 4 x forward firing 20mm Canon and a turret with 4 x .50 cals. Not that far off from this bird in concept.

The theme with this airplane seemed to be "to solve this problem caused by trying to test a solution to another problem"

imagine though, a turret fighter bomber interceptor, with the B-29 turret computer and gunsight? Being able to parallel (above, below, or co-altitude) a bomber formation outside the bombers' own effective gunner range, and just pick off targets one by one.

oooh. The P61? That will be an interesting one.

There is a 'missing link' to this story, unmentioned in the video, although it may be closely related to the P.92 turreted fighter project. Much closer than Northrop P-61 mentioned at the end. A bizarre, oversized cupola-shaped turret, armed with a single Vickers S 40 mm cannon, was built and flight tested on a single Vickers Wellington Mk.II prototype L4250, dubbed also "MK.VII". It was supposed to be equipped with a computing sight - a 'fire control system' of sorts. Explanations of the purpose of this program seem to differ whether it was an experimental self-defense system intended for large, four-engined bombers, or a heavy punch version of armament intended for the Boulton-Paul P.92 fighter itself.

I think the Defiant was one very good looking airplane , this one not so much

One can never have enough snacks. Interesting concept

Hilarious video. I enjoyed. 👍😁

Would love to see your analysis of the P-61one of my favourite Airfix kits

It's surprising that nobody suggested something similar to Germany's Schrage Musik.

Imagine such a turret on a 4-engine bomber 😎

The P-61 is one of my favorite obscure planes

I can see the employment ad now "Half-scale pilots wanted. Children and jockeys welcome!"

cool!

Thanks for this video. However, you mention that the 20mm would be fed by drums, of 120 rounds each. Or, to my knowledge, there never was a drum containing more than 60 shells. Was it supposed to be of a new kind of design, or is it just a mistake ?

Could you make a video on the V-Bombers?

The P-61 gave rise to the R-15 Reporter.

Quasimodo....the Hunchback of Notre-Dame..interesting feature 👍

One idea prior to the actual start of the blitzkrieg was interesting. Some of the exercises with hurricanes and Spits were demonstrating alarming problems with the turret fighter idea. Some were calling for them to be scraped along with the flying suicide booth known as the Fairey Battle. From this came an idea to remove the turret from the defiant and add a single Vickers K/GO and have the defiant drop bombs instead. It was thought that this would be faster and more manoeuvrable and carry a similar payload to the Battle. Problem was that the removal of the turret was expected to knacker the aerodynamics and centre of G. Interesting idea nevertheless. I’ll add a citation when I remember where I read this Great vid. A plane I knew nowt about.

“Aerodynamically unique.” that’s one way of describing it.

On book of Tony Butler British Secret Projects: Fighters & Bombers 1935-1950 are included projects of bombers with same type of turret: thanksfully they remain projects ! 😅😅😅

Merci .

Throughout this video, I couldn't help picturing the far more effective De Havilland Mosquito, which in one version mounted four 20mm cannon quite comfortably in its nose. No nonsense about turrets here, as the Mosquito could float like a butterfly, enabling it to point its nose guns where they needed to go so it could sting like a bee.

Wow, when I saw the title, I thought “Who in their right mind would even try to create a successor to such a fundamentally flawed concept as Defiant?!”. What did I expect?