The Definitive Way to Play Sonic 3 (And More) 

Just gonna say, for Carnival night zone, some elements of MJ's Jam was used, having an identical sound of the word "Jam" used in the MJ song. In act two there is a window smash sound, its noted to be the same as the window smash used in MJ’s “In the closet” Also if one wants to know more about the music's history in-depth here is a really good vid ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-_Uko0fCp86c.html.

Yeah you can play sonic 3 & knuckles with Steam. But What about sonic mega collection?

@@Wrench55154 Casino Night Zone should never have made it into a Sonic game. Maybe 3D Blast but not a fast paced Sonic game. A complete cluster fuck maze with those God awful bouncing and floating things everywhere. Music or not, that zone and Metropolis Zone are by far the worst in the 2D Sonic games (Labyrinth from Sonic 1 was bad too but not as bad as those other two.)

@BlazeHedgehog Or, you know, you could just explain that this video was created and scheduled before _Hidden Palace_ dropped that bomb on us, and you (and your editors?) didn't feel like adding an in-video addendum. Which, honestly, would have been a really good idea? But, whatever.

Your vaguely hostile comment has been noted and applied to the credits sequence of this video.

Exactly! xD

Why steam only, they could just put it on the console e-shops

Just use an Android emulator. It's completely legal if you don't pirate.

Illford Official Legal problems

sonic games on playstation:chillax guys!

As he should

I just don't want links and discussion to pirated materials pushing out the real discussion, when that could harm the viability of my RU-vid channel. I'm not telling people not to pirate stuff, as I say in the video "you do whatever you want," just keep it out of my comments. Actual morality is not a factor to me. But the ability to keep my channel safe *is* a factor to me.

Lots of yakkity yak in that section of the video.

@@Kokomadeta Agreed. It was entirely unnecessary.

It's a legal defense. Technically he was not telling you to do it, therefore he is innocent if you do it.

Sneak 100

Yeah, how about NOT telling the world hints about how Sega could be sued...ffs

This comment hurts like a knife

At least BlazeHedgehog can actually upload regularly.

@@mmgmagic ouch

Ouch....

@@mmgmagic I give this insult a solid 5/5 on the cuntometer

true

Sonic Orgins : ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

I love seeing other sonic youtubers commenting on sonic youtuber's videos lol

If that were the case, I'd pass on it. I heard Launch Base Zone on the prototype and those jams it ain't it.

I heard even those original tracks have legal issues.

@GenesisGems They don't even the rights for Sonic 1 and 2's music, although contracting the music for those games are way easier since both of those game's osts are owned by one guy.

you mean the songs they ended up using in the sonic and knuckles collection?

They could do that, and while the fanbase may be okay with that, SEGA might not want to release what they perceive to be a sub-par version of the game.

Yeah, that never made sense to me either. Dude had a bunch of old Sega arcade games, he knew fully well how his stuff would sound on a Genesis.

The Moonwalker Genesis game was based on the arcade version though, right? So... I'm not sure if that counts?

Yeah, and the sound quality in the arcade version isn't bad. A little scratchy, but coming out of an arcade cabinet speaker, it probably sounded pretty good.

I grown up playing the classics

I always assumed he was comparing the sound quality of Sonic 3 to that of Sonic CD. In that case, ya, the difference is huge.

Your wish is granted, you're gonna love Sonic Origins :)

This guy predicted the future

would never happen

Wish granted

Sonic Origins is a kinda

@Keoko Murdock Chess: What the f#*@ are you talking about?

Same. So satisfying

Yup

Agreed

yea and you can use shaders like anti-dither to blend the colors, Sonic 3 AIR should use that also

@@gamerxt333 Why the fuck would you want to emulate composite?

@@bardhi09 Probably nostalgia purposes? The same reason people still use old film cameras.

@@bardhi09 Because certain games were visually designed to take advantage of the quirks of old composite video and these quirks are gone in clearer and more modern video output methods. For example.... You may have noticed that in some genesis titles, you'll see clouds that are made up of white dots with 1 pixel gaps between them in the foreground. On old composite CRT displays, the white pixels and the gaps blur together, to create the illusion of transparency. Since modern displays are much clearer, and in much higher resolution, the illusion is ruined.

This was something I actually wanted to add, but not only that, but you can get whatever ROM hack (or "mod"), or worse, pirated ROMs, without even needing the game pirates are using to illegally distribute games. Users can go into where they downloaded their Steam Workshop content are found and get the ROMs that way, so that means what Blaze mentioned about how people can pirate games like the Genesis Aladdin game by using Ristar could pirate the game for free, which is even worse. I personally never used the Workshop to abuse or promote piracy, that and I was also strongly against and called out people that were condoning it, but I did use it to try out actual ROM hacks like Rouge in Sonic 1 out by getting that ROM hack and sticking the modified file into something like RetroArch, Fusion, or even the "Simple" launcher (which is actually DRM-free unlike the shoddy Mega Drive & Genesis Classics emulator) and use a program to pack the ROM hack to a file the "Simple" launcher can use.

@Frizzurd that's the biggest cap I've ever heard. Literally everyone and their mother considers it the best genesis game hell, the best sonic game ever made. That and mania imo for me

I prefer Sonic 2 more

Frizzurd no 3 trumps the first 2, and when were we talking about the 3d games?

I rate sonic 3 and knuckles 10/10

@@Blueflag04 try sonic 3 and knuckles sir

It can do much better than that, too ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-KsMRe_QenvU.html

it's not the soundchip that is the issue it's the programming

@@TorutheRedFox fair enough, but the video didnt say that at all.

I never said it did

@@TorutheRedFox just to be clear, I meant no disrespect with my last comment, my apologies if it came off that way. I honestly had no idea it had anything to do with programming, but this video makes it seem like its just the chip all together.

the beta leak had official vers of the pc tracks in the SG sound chip

Yeah that was pretty recent though he might have started making this video before it was known. Definitely further supports the idea though that MJ, and Buxer were involved in the music late in the project. My guess is they started replacing the tracks. MJ pulled out of the project for whatever reason towards the end. And in the mad rush to finish the game on time they left the music he worked on in it. Later when the PC version was made they used the original beta music instead.

The beta came out as he was editing the video. It's in the credits sequence @ 27:30

Thing is, lets say they can't release due to the beta versions music not being fully finished and sound bad. Well the PC version already did that, so it's literally already done, if not without a potential remix. It just sounds like sega doesn't understand or doesn't want to do the work. Despite that Sonic 3 on it's own is perfect for a standalone release if they include all the feature the game could have. For example the PC version of sonic 3 and knuckles lets you choose which of the 3 games you want, sonic 3, sonic & knuckles or sonic 3 & knuckles. Then we have the option for either 2 games or the pc/beta soundtrack, the original or official release level layouts (like launch base being after carnival nights), the option for big arms to be added or removed in sonic 3 and knuckles along with many more! Sounds like good value for 1 game right? That without those crazy ideas of adding things like the dropdash back into the game (yes it was in sonic 3); maybe adding mania graphics, sonic 2 sprites and more!

@@WakoDoodle ...so pretty much Sonic 3 Complete with the drop dash?

You can do the same on Fire TV, which is much cheaper and simpler.

I won't buy an Apple product just to play one (two games) Ditto for Chuchu Rocket despite my love for the original Dreamcast game

ikagura That’s fine, just wanted to state that this was another way of playing the Retro Engine versions of CD, 1 & 2.

@@vincells does fire tv support xbox one controllers wirelessly?

@@quamsta Yup

Nice PFP.

I still say Sonic 3 Complete is the best version I've played.

The definitive version was released in 1994.

Hotobu Well it was until (somewhat) recently.

Honestly AIR is the most similar to a retro engine version of 3&K.

👏

@@youtubeadmin1588 Sigh... random guy: -"What did the 0 say to the 8?" ;^D random nerd: -"Excuse me, sire! But numbers do not talk!" B^| Those lo-fi sounds aren't "HEE-HEE's" and "SHAMOANA's", anyway... ¬_¬

But he's able to put "WOOO" in there. Check out the Sonic 3(Not and Knuckles) Miniboss theme, that's something. By the way, I love your comment, really funny :)

@Frizzurd I'm sorry but stfu plz

Bluestacks is nice n all but lags a bit

An actual steam version would really be miles better tho

Sonic 3 air is awesome however it has a bit of controller issues, the sega mini USB controller works in gameplay but not in menus so u must use the keyboard for menus... And if u have a original sega controller with a usb converter cable it workd in menus but not in gameplay because for some reason it controls tails also and that leads to issues... Having that said i havent tried any input translator but "Joy to key" so mabye it works better with another program that can decode controller inputs better.

There's a podcast he did talking about the proto :)

@@TailsGuy72 that's the reason why he never mentioned the proto in this video, he wanted to save it for the podcast.

@@thuongbuianhhedgefishsuppo7550 Actually, i think he started writing this before the proto was revealed, so the podcast was made to talk about that.

@@TailsGuy72 yeah, that's possible.

well shet. Good thing I still own the Steam version

Welcome to capitalism

TheHumanSonikku the government doesn’t care much about Rom downloads as much as they do movie and CD downloads, because Hollywood has always had the government in their pocket.

@@STRONTIumMuffin rather have an inconvenience in my life than be in jail for wanting the game

@@corpsemachine6949 you will not go to jail trust me

@@STRONTIumMuffin "Hey! Piracy is theft! That's illegal! You better not do it or else we'll... we'll...uh...huh."

No offence because it's probably just his accent but he sounds like he has a testosterone deficiency or something.

Sounds like the voice you always hear in audio book

Wish I had all those in rom state at least

All points considered here, how did the mega collection and Sonic Jam on the Saturn escape the legal ire. At some point there has to be a new collection. I would gladly pay for a new legal retro engine version.

@@luissantos2727 the same reason S3&K is on Steam--they didn't realize that it was a legal issue until pretty recently

@Kailem the Hedgehog Angel Island too, kinda

And the elemental shields

Good comment!... Looks familiar though... ¬_¬

F

F

F for people who want to play sonic A.I.R but they only have a phone (like me)

@@mattok101digitaltamer9 F

@@Skellotronix oh damn calm down

It’s not compatible with Xbox one

TylerrYun Yes it is. I’ve recently beaten the game on XB1

Mariann Mariann So Sonic 3 Complete is usable

@@NativS2002/playlists/playlists - Probably not. The checksum and header for the Complete ROM may be different to a S3&K ROM file, as they are very different internally. For AIR I don't use the Steam S3&K ROM file, you can point it to any S3&K ROM file, i use one that I archived years ago from those Rom sites before Nintendo declared war against them. (Sorry about the /playlists thing after you name, i don't why it's happening and don't know how to get rid of it)

Why Sega released so many other versions of Sonic 3 with the Michael Jackson soundtrack intact is one of the great mysteries surrounding this game. Music licensing is a complex thing. It was long rumored that the music licensing for Sonic 1 and 2 were held up for a while, too. The musician behind those games, Masato Nakamura, was part of one of the biggest pop music bands in all of Japan. The rumor was that he was charging Sega huge licensing fees for using his Sonic music, but Sega had a loophole where as long as they left the music in its original format (the Genesis FM synthesizer) then they either had to pay reduced fees or they didn't have to pay any licensing fees at all. The way I understand it is, when it comes to music, you license the song itself and the PERFORMANCE of the song separately. So let's say you want to use Queen's "We Are the Champions." First, you pay to license the song itself, which is the notes and the lyrics. Then, on top of that, you also license Queen's actual performance of the song, meaning Freddie Mercury's voice, and the band members playing their instruments. In some cases, each band member is a separate performance you have to license individually, making their songs very expensive. It's possible that Sega thought they were safe as long as they left the music in its original, untouched Genesis FM Synthesizer format, because in theory, they own the performance. With Masato Nakamura's music for Sonic 1 and 2, he would compose the music at his studio, and then send the recordings to Sega, where Sega's sound engineering team would translate Nakamura's music to work on the Sega Genesis. In short, Nakamura owned the notes because he created the song, but Sega owned the performance because their sound engineers translated the music. This prevented any new versions of that classic Sonic music being generated. Sega could only use the original 16-bit versions. No remixes, no remasters. That seemed to change, as Sega apparently buried the hatchet with Masato Nakamura for the announcement of Sonic Generations. They had him on stage and that game was one of the first times Nakamura's music had been remixed possibly ever. Since then, Sega seems to have a much easier time using those songs in new projects, so maybe they bought the rights or something. We don't know if any of this is true with Michael Jackson's Sonic 3 music. If the people that worked with Michael are claiming that Sega owes them money, there's clearly some legal problem happening behind the scenes and it's tangled up the release of any new versions of Sonic 3. The Sonic Classic Collection on DS was released in 2010, and these legal threats are from 2012, so Sega released it before realizing there was a problem.

BlazeHedgehog oh, that makes sense. You seem to never half-ass anything, not even comment replies.

It was made in 2010 right? Maybe there was less risks for an handheld console

@@BlazeHedgehog I would just like to mention that numerous sonic 1 and 2 themes did appear in games remixed long before generations. Examples here would be Green hill remixes in Sonic advance 3 (2004), Sonic battle(2003) and Sonic adventure 2(2001)(and I would also like to mention that in 1996 huge parts of Green hills them were used for the song "Marry me"), Scrap brain zone ,Starlight zone and Sonic 1's and 2's boss themes in Advance 1 and of cause the by Masato Nakamura band performed song Sweet Sweet Sweet which was used as Sonic 2's ending theme for Sonic Story end theme in Sonic the Hedgehog 2006. (and technically did even every track from Sonic 1 gets 2 remixes in Sonic Genesis on the GBA) And in fact did Sonic in Lego Dimensions not have any of his actual classic tracks because Travels Tail simply didn't had the right to them because unlike most tracks from 3d Blast and up does Sega not own any of them and as such aren't there included in the sonic License.

@@BlazeHedgehog didn't they remix green hill zone in sa2?

AtGames usually contain Sonic and Knuckles, but not Sonic 3. AtGames even expain the reason why they're not able to include Sonic 3 is because of music copyright issues. which that's referring to Michael Jackson and his sound team.

Menu be like:

And sonic 3 a.i.r

The only way to play sonic 3 air is to download the steam rom for sonic 3& knuckles Companys hate pirates then let us buy to games easier don’t put them on just a few consoles its annoying

That's what you get for using the horrendous piece of trash known as steam.

I used to have the original Sonic Mega Collection back on the GameCube and Sonic 3 + Sonic & Knuckles and Sonic 3 & Knuckles are included in that collection too and was a great way to experience that game, but sadly those collections are super expensive nowadays.

ViperAcidZX I got sonic mega collection plus for £5 for my Xbox 360.

And the Wii Virtual Console. And the Xbox 360 store. And the Xbox One store. And the Sonic Classic Collection for DS. He missed a LOT, dude.

I guess it's just not easy to wholesale replace the music like that. I doubt they have Sonic 3's source code anymore, so it would have to be hacked in to the game's data. Not impossible, but it requires a specialist. Even if they took it out of the prototype, you'd need someone Sega trusts to do the job, who could pull the data out of the old ROM and put it in to the new ROM. It would also require them to revise the game's credits, and that requires tracking down who composed those tracks to begin with. As for buying the rights to those ten songs, assuming the artists that composed them are angry at Sega, they may not be willing to part with the license for cheap. It will always be a nightmare for Sega to fix, no matter what angle they tackle it from.

I’m kind of mixed on those songs anyway. I kinda prefer PC Carnival Night due to it sounding appropriately bouncy but without the generic circus jingle of Jackson’s version. Prototype Icecap is just awful. The Hard Times Instrumental fluctuates between dark and intense, then mysterious and enchanting, appropriate for the dangerous caverns and beautiful landscapes. The PC/Prototype track is really generic upbeat music that draws attention to the fact I’m playing a video game. Launch Base PC is about on par with the final game, it fits in its own way. Less energetic than the Genesis version, but the sort of marching rhythm works for a base area. But honestly losing Buxer’s Icecap is enough to make me iffy on the idea

Robin Ashenor Prototype Ice Cap, awful. PC Ice Cap I think is ok. S3C Ice Cap is also ok. That being said, Brad Buxer’s Ice Cap is fine too.

Josh. I do kinda prefer Jackson and Buxer’s contributions, but in some areas that’s more personal preference. Launch Base I’m fine with the original song, but I prefer the more catchy song from the final Genesis ost. But looking at what does or doesn’t fit the atmosphere, the Hard Times instrumental just nails the mood and look of Icecap. I feel like the prototype tune was too chipper for a stage where you’re avoiding crushing and icicles and being frozen, etc on a regular basis in a cave. I’m sure it sounds a tad better in the outside sections

No lol

Just like Driver San Francisco

I have it on my Nintendo

@@bigreimu1878 how is that possible?

@@thuongbuianhhedgefishsuppo7550 it's called sonic classic collection on the dsi

JG Gaming Channel fuck off mate

Or, you know, via an Android emulator or something.

Nah, I'm sticking with scrcpy. It's a good, lighter alternative to emulators if you only play like 1-2 mobile games at a time. I only play S2 and TerraGenesis atm. And I can easily play the same saves while away from my PC. It's also a phone remote control that lets me make calls and messages or check for messages and notifs w/o having to leave my keyboard. Haha.

Origins has much more problems than the music

It is going to change because of sonic origins

Doubtful. After a creator is dead the heirs want cheques. Big cheques. And an old platformer could make some money, but not that much. Steam takes a meaty cut, so that $2 game means Sega gets $1. And if Michael's estate wants $2 million and a percentage, there goes any profit.

Euka is making an android port, but it will take some time, it now has a Mac Port. And a linux port is also in the works.

It's true, we've never been in the same room at the same time