The Donner Party: What Really Happened? 

I’m related to the survivors and I didn’t know some of this.

"Your wife makes great soup" "Yea, but I'll miss her"

I had a good friend named Rick Donner. We were radio DJ's at a station in Texas in the 1960's. His eponymous ancestor survived the disaster and opened a popular _restaurant_ in San Francisco.

After watching this video I wanted to know more about the Donner party, so I went over to Google. Typed it in, and my phone autocorrected it to "Dinner party"... Freudian slip? 😂

I seriously thought that the Donner party was just like a family of like 14 who got stranded in a mountain cave in Colorado for 3 or so months, and went insane and killed each other and ate the bodies as both part of their descent into madness and as a survival tactic. I had no idea that it was close to a hundred people who only cannibalized when they believed it was absolutely necessary to their survival. Edit: Autocorrect changed Donner to dinner for some reason, had to fix that.

I just can’t get over how accurate and chillingly beautiful the title “The Indifferent Stars Above” is.

As some who legit often struggle to just get out of the bed some mornings, I can't even begin to appreciate how difficult it would have been just to survive, let alone attempt to keep trudging on, or even just digging out the snow.

I watched a documentary way back in the '90s called "the Donner Party" with my parents. The irony is it was on a VHS with a very poorly hand written label - We thought the tape was called "The Dinner Party". o.O

My archeology classes taught me that if one finds poop one can test for proteins that only are found if one has engaged in cannibalism

**suggests eating a person and draws the shortest straw** Me

Caitlin because of your advice when it comes to having control of funeral and what things I can and can’t do I just want to thank you because of your channel I was able to make arranging my father’s funeral easier and I managed to inform my mother that my father’s corpse does not need to be embalmed Thank you

Please do a video on the Andes Mountain plane crash next!! Great video!! Im so happy i found your channel!!

me, brazilian, not really knowing much about the donner party: just woke up, it's a nice morning. look at this interesting year old video from caitlin, let's watch it. caitlin: butchered bodies, skulls sawed open to get at the brains, human flesh... me: 👁️👄👁️

Your black humor never ceases to amuse me. I always find your videos informative, educational and highly amusing. Also, finding another historian with insatiable curiosity I highly respect !

Our body fat is also stored more efficiently, hence cellulite

I recently wrote a VERY in depth paper about the Donner Party, and it was nice to see it treated with such respect. I don’t mind that you made jokes about it. With things like this, jokes need to be made to keep the full reality from overwhelming us. I also think that, whatever people say when they are will fed, in Donner Party conditions, most people would turn to cannibalism.

I've often thought that if time travel were possible - you'd be with people that had gone through something like this and just say "oh yeah, in my time we can travel to California from Missouri in about 2 hours or so" - how quiet everything would get, and not just on account of being amazed at our technology. We really do take our times for granted!

Let's not forget the real tragedy here. That snowman.

Thank you for reintroducing historical events. The way you do it is a great way to teach history.

I've been to the Sierra dozens of times as ( we are only 2 hours away) and I have to admit this lake is absolutely beautiful.

This is a good summary, though there are more details to the story (as always). If I'm remembering correctly, they were already hungry by the time they reached Truckee Lake because they had already started running low on supplies thanks to the Hastings Cutoff (and some of their previous delays). Several wagons had gotten stuck in the salt flat and had to be abandoned. They were traveling with a large herd of cattle, but the herd essentially evaporated thanks to either dying of thirst in the desert, running away to find water, or by being stolen at various points in the journey. So they had few of their cattle left to eat. Even when they were still in what is now Nevada, they had to send someone to Fort Sutter to get additional food and provisions, but many of the families were low on money, due to not having many resources and to having to abandon what little they had to get out of the Great Salt Lake Desert before dying of thirst, so they quickly ran out of whatever provisions they obtained. I don't think they were in great condition when they reached Truckee Lake, and because most in the party were city dwellers, they didn't have much experience hunting and couldn't catch many animals in the poor, wintry conditions. It's really a tragic story the more you read about it. As Caitlin said, it's not just one bad thing that happened to them, and it's not like they made one monumentally stupid decision. They put their trust in the wrong people, made decisions based on misleading information, and started experiencing setback after setback...the situation snowballed into a tragedy. It's quite sad.

this was strangely beautiful and poignant at the end. caitlyn's humanity will always touch me. when she pointed out that those who think they'd never ever do such a thing might act differently if they and their children had been starving for a few months made me tear up a little for some reason.

When you said, “moving to California is hard” at the end, it made me remember January 1986. We started on our move from Cadillac Michigan to San Diego. We had my mom and dad in the Ryder truck, pulling my car, while my sister and I drove my parents’ station wagon. My 3-1/2 year old daughter rode with us. She had a big teddy bear that sat in my car’s driver’s seat, just for shits & giggles...and because the rest was PACKED! Winter weather and a 3-1/2 year old, what fun!! It actually wasn’t that bad. Our first morning waking up in San Diego, I turned on the television before heading to the pool, as I watched and was filled with excitement over our new adventure, I watched as the Challenger blew up. That whole memory was triggered by your comment at the end.

your presentations are so informative, ascerbic and witty...truly a great pleasure to watch. donating now!

Hi, love your channel. There is another RU-vidr by the name of Wonderhussey, who did a series about the Donner tragedy. If they had made it though the area a day earlier the group would have made it.

Wow, almost 2 Million subscribers~! You deserve every one, your videos are always ( morbidly ) interesting and informative.

The fact that you were in public talking about cannibalism with a bunny and mountain lion puppet is everything! 😹😹😹

I really like your shows. So much information about what happened. Thanks for the explanation.

Wow. With every one of your videos that I watch, my respect for you grows. And I would definitely have a night out with you. Your hilarious, intelligent, interesting and compassionate. I love the way you bring those qualities to each of your videos. Thank you. 💀🏛⚱⚰🪦

25 minutes? Oh Caitlin, you spoil us silly.

Living in Reno for many years we still hear the joke when eating out at various restaurants. When the establishment take names for the waiting list to get in, someone always gives their last name as Donner. When their table is ready the hostess calls over the PA system, "Donner party of 6, your table is ready." I still think it's humorous.

If anyone wants an excruciatingly well researched dive on this, Last Podcast on the Left did a two part series on the Donner party. Also, the book "Indifferent Stars Above" is amazing to read.

If a shortcut worked, it would be called the trail.

I think it’s kinda nice that the actual camp where it all happened is a quiet place of reflection rather then swarming with tourists taking pictures. After knowing what happened and all the context around it, that travel back then was rough but people managed to build amazing cities in the west but not without tragedy. The donner party was a tragedy in some sense because it was people being forced to do what they needed to survive.

I particularly love the Donner Camp Picnic Ground sign at Tahoe National Forest... I shouldn't laugh, but I can't help it.

I grew up on the Nevada side of the summit so I got all the stories and jokes from my dad every time we drove across the pass. To the point that it got boring.

When I was 12 my family drove from WA to CA and I saw a road sign that said, Donner Lake. I asked my dad if that was "The Donner" Donner Lake and he said , "yes, the party that got stuck in the snow and had to eat each other. Seems lazy of them with the highway so close". I'm embarrassed to say I thought about that for way too long.

I'm descended from the Donner Party so I'm pretty juiced that they survived by such icky means. 😁👍

I'm really surprised this hasn't turned into a film. Or like, a dozen.

14:20 What you'd expect to find is human bones with cut marks from knives as we see with some of the corpses from the Franklin Expedition. What we'd also find are sever cuts to hand, feet, and skull bones; this is often done to remove the humanity from the individual that you're about to eat. It's a defense/coping mechanism.

Caitlin, thanks for the fascinating video! I am always impressed by your on-screen presence, and I love how "involved" you are with the audience. You speak so clearly and eloquently. I've been a viewer of your channel for a few months, and I do not regret it! The topics are fascinating, and your style of commentary is both informative and entertaining. Thank you for all the hard work you put in! I really appreciate it, and can't wait to see what you have in store for us next!! (muahahahaha)

What's wild is that if you live in central or northern California when you're in school (like I was), in elementary school there's a decent chance you get to go on a fun elementary school field trip to learn where the Donner party ate each other. Like, in 4th grade. And then you have a picnic lunch near their graveyard. So.... yeah.

1800-1850 had a huge technology boom, which resulted in alot more printed literature, not all of it accurate, but some very well illustrated via soft metal plates used for engraving. One of the reasons for this westward expansion, was the printing boom, which sometimes was more concerned about selling stuff, rather then accuracy.

I was in the hospital a few weeks ago and wasn’t allowed to eat for two days. So, yeah, I’m not judging bc I was ready to chew my own arm off after TWO days.

Colorado's infamous cannibal was Alfred Packer. The cafeteria at the Colorado School of Mines is named "Packer Hall". Many people named "Packer" changed their names to PARKER because of the stigma. Alfred Packer ate his people in South Park, Colorado. Trey PARKER, of "South Park " animated cartoon fame, which is based on the real South Park in Colorado, did an episode on Alfred Packer. Ironically, Trey PARKER is a distant relative of the real Alfred Packer, whose own family changed their last name from Packer to PARKER. Alfred Packer DID go to prison for his cannibalism.

Y’all, as someone who frequents the Sierra Nevada’s, the snow isn’t 20 feet tall for 2 months, it goes from November to April

"short cuts make long delays"

“A bunch of pioneers got lost and did a cannibalism” -Me 10 years ago

Man, literally laughed out loud when that picture of that Hastings guy started talking.

Tbh I know the kind of person that I am I'm a quitter. And I would've killed myself once everybody started getting desperate.

Knowing what I know about the Mormon migration west, it's kind of amazing that more of those little handcart companies didn't resort to cannibalism out on the plains. Their one saving grace was that the folks in Salt Lake City knew they were coming, knew they had started late and were likely stuck in the snow, and sent rescue parties out to gather up as many of them as possible. Even so, many of them died.

I’ve heard of Donner pass, but I’ve never actually heard the story behind it until I watched this video. While it is horrific, they had to survive, even if it meant eating their dead. Cannibalism is frowned upon today (in most societies anyway), but when it comes to survival, sometimes there is no other choice. Native Americans, however, have a totally different view on this. In Native American culture, you will turn into a monster called a wendigo if you dare to eat human flesh. The two natives in the Donner party knew this which is why they refused to eat human flesh. Some of the Donner party survived, but a lot of them died.

Excellent video. I love her personality. History is fascinating!

I am a descendant of one of the Donner party and founder of the town of Marysville Ca. Our family doesn’t openly talk about it.

I heard a line about this on “The Golden Girls”: If these had been offered to the Donner Party, they still would have eaten each other.

Wait until me and mine have been starving for a couple months? Lady, I had to not eat for 12 *hours* for a medical test *in the morning.* I didn't even drive myself there, my dad did. I sat in that waiting room about ready to gnaw on the furniture and looking at Dad's arm like a chicken drumstick. I'd either be one of the first to drop dead or the first in line for manburgers.

You might also want to research the story of the whale ship ESSEX that sailed out of Nantucket. A similar story of cannibalism. It’s well known by the residents of the island of Nantucket, but not talked about very much.

My first introduction to the Donner party was Museum Mysteries, showcasing a pot supposedly from the Donner party. The show spun the story as a “Did they? Could they have depraved themselves? It’s a great historical mystery!” Then I saw the Puppet History episode and went, “Oooohhh. No, there was definitely human consumption.”

is it bad that this is a comfort video for me, like ill be kinda sad and then ill watch Catlin's series on cannobolism

my favourite historical fun fact is that this was the same winter that the Erebus and the Terror got stuck in looking for the Northwest Passage … didn’t work out so well for them diet wise either

When me and my dad went to Scotland, we were surprised to be offered "Donner-kebab"... We thought they were teasing us, because we're from Northern Nevada, not far from where the tragedy took place; it's part of our local folklore and "heritage", in a strange way... We didn't know it was it was just a Turkish sort of meat-thingy... Everyone had a laugh.

Well done.I live in Northern cali and learned more detail

When I was 14, my sister, dad and I, got stuck on top of Donner pass while driving to Susanville. The whole freeway was stopped, we couldn’t move, and there were people outside of their cars playing in the snow with their kids... MY dad took it upon himself to tell us this sweet story while we were stuck in the snowstorm for 4 hours. 🙂🙃 *Carson City! Not Susanville*

I love how she handles these topics. She makes jokes throughout it and keeps it funny but she also takes the time to look at it from a serious perspective and teaches the real history and psychology behind it

Eating establishments named after the Donner party? Welcome to McDonners, you want fries with him?

I clicked "save" so I could add this video to my "Watch Later" playlist. RU-vid saved the video to my "Cooking" playlist 😬 dear god no why

Patrick Dolan: “Lets draw straws to see who gets eaten!” Patrick Dolan approximately 3 minutes later: “lol jk dudes that was a v crazy idea right?”

I'm an American history teacher. My class recently finished the westward expansion unit. I'll show them your video during our enrichment period next week. The kids will love your mix of comedy and historical accuracy. Well done, lady!

This was a sad story until we got to Nancy. Young child, cold and starving, eating her own mother but not knowing bc at least the adults around her had that kind of courtesy. But finding out later....I can't imagine. I really got emotional then, and when seeing the large rock memorial, it broke me. I really appreciate your videos on these subjects bc you understand where the humor should be placed and when we should be respectful.

I’m cool with people eating my dead body. hope I’m tasty, been self marinating In garlic dipping sauce for years lol

Death Mama has uploaded, her children are fed

If I was with a stranded group and I was dying, I’d totally be fine with the rest of the group eating my body to survive after I died. I mean, would I rather have them leave me for bugs and wildlife to decompose or would it be better for them to use my nutritious organs to stay alive possibly in time to be rescued. I’m dead, doesn’t change anything for me!

i was listening to LPOTL's coverage of this story, and what john stark, an unpaid rescuer in the last group, did actually made me cry. he saved 9 people when the other two (paid) people with him just wanted to take one child each and leave the rest to die. he picked up a couple of the kids, moved them down the trail, went back for more, and did this over and over and over and didn't stop, rest, or eat until they were all safe and out of the snow. stark and the 9 people he rescued all made it back alive.

"If you're starving and you know it, eat your friends" 👏👏 If you're starving and you know it, eat your friends " 👏👏

Someone get this woman a netflix show

Years ago I worked with a Donner family member. She said to me, “Well, if you can’t beat em, eat em.” We all laughed.... I never forgot.

Thank you for discussing the Donner Party. It's a compelling story to actually read, and goes far beyond the cannibalism parts. Most intriguing of all the emigrants is Tamsen Eustis Donner. Simply an amazing gal, educated, a herbalist, a woman who'd already suffered personal loss, an interesting letter-writer. She kept a journal--which has never been found. When you read about Tamsen--who warned George: Let's don't take that shortcut--you have to admire everything about her. For instance, she sent her children ahead with one of the rescue parties while she stayed back at that grisly campsite to care for her mortally wounded husband, George. There are many good books--perhaps none as well written as Smoke Gets in Your Eyes--but the story itself is simply unforgettable.

“Would you eat a person?” I’m not really in the *mood* for person... how about pancakes?

Yes. I knew. But I am a native Californian. (born here, not First Nation) Elitha Donner is buried about 2 miles down the street from my house. I travel 80 regularly and have seen snow depths similar to what the Donner Party experienced. That fact never fails to cross my mind. Even in the summer I think how they didn’t have a lovely highway to cross the Sierras. Elitha was a teacher here and now has a school named for her.

"Do you kill the skinny guy because he can't fight back? Or do you all gang up on the body builder because of more steaks and chops? These are decisions people have had to make" -George Carlin

A Donner party themed restaurant? That's just in poor taste 😉🤣

You definitely don't know how you'll react to a situation until you're in it. My sister was fiercely judgemental of women who got abortions and women who had sex before marriage in general. And then she got pregnant at the age of 17 and suddenly her view on these things changed verry quickly Edit: just to clarify, she didn't actually end up being pregnant (faulty pregnancy test) but the lesson she learned certainly stuck

The saddest part for me was that the final rescue party had to leave some people behind because they had become catatonic and couldn't assist in their own rescue.

It makes a ton of sense that they would have resorted to cannibalism so quickly if they thought the people dying had starved to death rather than died from the cold. That would light a fire under anyone's behind if they have genuine fear that they're going to be next if they don't find something to eat *right now.*

The best content on RU-vid! Intelligent, coherent, funny, informative, fascinating... Love you!!!

Here's a fun fact: Starvation makes you go crazy before it kills you. If someone goes with minimal food for long enough, they start to show paranoia, hysteria, depression, and other kinds of psychological distress. In one of the first studies of starvation (in the 40's) one of the participants cut off three of his own fingers and couldn't explain why.

Cannibal Caitlin has a nice ring to it know ? Cannibal Caitlin carves corpse for consumption in California (Try saying that 5 times fast)

24 minutes?? caitlin has blessed us 🙏🏽

I’m related to the first survivors that traveled through Death Valley by way of covered wagon. They survived by eating their dead, including infants. I’m literally alive today because my family ate my family.

Louis and Salvador: "these white people are crazy" lol

This would be the BEST season of AHS

99 times out of 100: Wow the actual story isn't nearly as bad as the legends. This time: Wow, the actual story is so much worse. So... much... worse...

I can't imagine living with the knowledge you ate someone you knew, my great grandfather is a holocaust survivor and he often goes to high schools and talks about how he survived, but cannibalism is the one thing he won't talk about, he acknowledges it happened but refuses to speak of it

That is THE saddest looking snowman I have ever seen lol.

The Donner party story has been sanitized for the history books. I’ve never heard a lot of this and definitely didn’t hear about them killing the natives and eating them.

You should do a video about Chernobyl

to heck with 'desperation' and 'starvation'- if you slow down ahead of me in Walmart when I'm hangry, I'm liable to eat you

Came back to watch this again. "Donner Camp: Picnic Area" Just now got this, no clue how I missed it before. Thanks for making such great, educational content.

You forgot autocannibalism! It's like a depressing meal for one.

The people who are like "ew, I would NEVER resort to cannibalism" are probably the people who would resort to it first.