The Downfall of Storytelling in Call of Duty Zombies 

Holding a community's hand through a simple 'Good Vs. Evil' story. A community that literally deciphers morse codes from random flashing lights and a hidden piece of paper in less than a day

As a zombies veteran I laughed out loud at how good some of your points were. You should be lead story developer lmao

Milo’s been going crazy this last few weeks and I’m so here for it

You nailed it 🎯 Part of the zombies charm was for the community to talk about theories and figure out what’s going on… it’s the mystery that’s lacking now. The main quest Easter egg was the second thing that brought the community together… again involving mystery and figuring it out together.

Milo has been killing it with his videos lately. He is single-handedly keeping the zombies community alive. This man deserves to be the official zombies community manager.

The way you opened this vid with describing the mystery of early zombies was incredible. It doubles as a way to convey how to explain how to paint a mystery for the player, and I can draw similarities to other experiences I've had when exploring games

Just the downfall in general…

I miss the cryptic stuff of the old story. The cyphers, the obscure EEs, the radios scattered around the map that posed new questions, etc. It feels like the new story is just babying us

Thanks for saving my family from that fire the other day milo, real life saver you are. I'll never forget it.

Very well said! The way that info is given instead of left as a mystery takes away from the player's experience in the end

What bothers me the most, is the fact that we probably wouldn't have this discussion if Treyarch (and i guess Activision) kept their promisse and continued/finished the Chaos Storyline. They said "fuck it" and revived the Aether Storyline for no reason. Which in my perspective completely disrespects both storylines.

I can tell Milo has started leaning more to doing videos he enjoys making rather than just focusing on what he thinks we want to see, which I hope he taps into even more Milo isn't crazy, (probably) just a fellow human being like some of us here

This is so sentimental man. So much time spent watching zombies theories, even tried my hand at some. This is a true walk down memory lane, I feel like I’m at my mommas house again, even though I’m in my apartment and she’s been gone for one year now. Thank you Milo for continuing to do what you do.

You put it into the best words possible, the zombies community is so lucky to have big voices like yourself to speak up for it and actually be talking the most sense. Keep up the great uploads Milo 🔥

I would love to see a new zombies storyline in the future but the aether story will always be the best!

This might get a bit abstract but bear with me. Essay incoming… Environmental storytelling was utilized a great amount in the earlier zombies. I think it's interesting how a shocking amount of writers or directors think you need to tell people everything. I think personally the reason there's so much telling instead of showing nowadays is linked to propaganda and how these things are made (they are also not viewed as art pieces but products) but also lack of faith in the audiences intelligence or just plain conceitedness in their own intelligence. Part of the fun of being a reader, player, or audience is putting pieces together. Not to mention it feels more organic that way instead of having exposition dumps, even if exposition can be a valid tool if used properly. Zombies alludes to many things and actually rewards exploration and player curiosity. Basically the mode rewards you for using your brain which is an amazing irony in a mode about zombies. The storyline was also great and tackled many heavy themes, and even if it seemed like some schizo stuff, it amazingly had historical backing. I don't know about you, but the stuff I learned about the nazi regime from researching stuff due to zombies was way more interesting then anything I learned back in high school. Like the Vril-ya, Die Glocke, the Black Sun, Argartha, Wonder Weapons, the search for ancient artifacts. It seems like some wacko conspiracy stuff but a lot of it is real. And I believe it ties into what zombies really got right. It married myth and history. It leaned more into myth and fantasy later on, mostly departing from the horror mad scientist vibe, in turn becoming less grounded, which some people didn't like but I'd argue with the help of the occult references it was always there as an undertow. The existential horror was residually still there but instead it tackled existential themes with various references to mythology. I think it also reveals the genius of zombies in a way. Inevitably in its depth and existential stakes you find mythological and religious themes in its narrative. The zombie itself can be seen as a metaphor for a nihilistic person. I think it's why the idea of zombies has made a resurgence in recent years. But the symbolism in zombies inevitably emerges. And I think it may even make the claim that mythology applies to general history. Which is why I think zombies transcends simple militaristic narratives in most Call Of Duty's. But a basic gestalt is there is an underlying hidden order in the chaos… Which I think people loved to explore and is true for many aspects of life. And maybe it even revealed a profound meaning that emerged from the chaos of the narrative. Another problem with modern zombies is a feel like the characters are not memorable. But let's be honest, will the old characters ever be topped? Probably not. But old Treyarch did a fantastic job of making us interested or invested in characters in one off maps. I'd say Mob Of The Dead comes to mind (Victus is a mixed bag). Also an underrated point is difficulty. People weren't great back then since we were all new players, but the round counter was a measurement of skill and the natural inclination of many players to get better was there, whether to get to a higher round for egoic boasting or just the satisfaction of growing in skill. Not to mention, the small RNG aspects of the mode that give it replayability, and the satisfying growth in strength as a player alongside the increasing demand of the strength and ferocity of the zombies. All of it was a recipe for a masterpiece. I feel like with this new mode it doesn't do any of that. If you enjoy it and have fun with it, more power to you. But to me, its just more generic, bland, and boring. Admittedly, I haven't played anything past BO4. But instead of moving on in a different direction they cling to the past to cash in on nostalgia and their old golden egg. Do the mystery box or wall Weapons make sense thematically anymore? Is that really all the veteran players mean to them? They want to catch lightning in a bottle again, and I would honestly go so far as to say without understanding what made zombies so great. They're kicking a soulless dead corpse that won't reanimate… A song comes to mind. You know the line lmfao.

It would’ve been cool if Cold War continued the theme of featuring an old zombie map as part of a much bigger map. Like how Die Machine had Nacht, it would be cool if Mauer had Kino and so on giving us a completely expanded experience and fresh perspective on maps we’ve known for so long

Man these videos are such a breath of fresh air as a zombies player. It feels like I'm chilling with an old friend playing old games. ❤

milo i just wanted to say this is one of my favorite videos this year or maybe even past few, and i would love to see more stuff like this. your the reason i love zombies in the first place and why im so passionate about it. i hope the new zombies is good for the communitys sake, but i will always watch anything you put out. my man keep up the fantastic work.

Milo man, i gotta say how nice it is to see your videos popping up so much recently, I grew up with your channel and i'm really digging your new video style, feels like my own personally tailored podcast.

for me, it went downhill when the apothicons were brought in. All the conspiracy stuff and real world events like the great leap forward made it juicy. It was a great time :)

The whole Zakhaev vs. Richtofen comparison had me thinking about one of my favorite cutscenes in Zombies: the mind-bending end to the Shadows of Evil easter egg. You just finished exploring this new map in this new time and place with all these new enemies, and out of nowhere this familiar face jumps out of a portal and is like "Hey, I need this important relic. I literally don't have time to explain. I need to fix the universe. Thanks!" Like that was mind-blowing to me. I miss those days when a few seconds of showing a particular character or object could generate hundreds of questions. That's why I'm not interested in new Zombies content. I don't need my hand held going through a REVEAL TRAILER of all things.

It’s so damn awesome just hearing Milo’s passion for Zombies. Feels like the BO3-4 days

A classic call of duty commentary, god it feels so fresh to have these back Milo

love seeing milo making a lot of zombies content again and it doesnt feel forced

Milo was so real for the "dumbing it down for the noobs" to where it's painful like I get introducing new players to the story, but leaving leaving it open ended is a must- I swear they forget that the hardcore fans have been solving symbol cyphers over nearly a decade too lmao

RIGHT! milo hit the nail on the head. this is exactly why the new mode is unapealing to me. its not just the gameplay. the marketing tells me theres nothing for me to do in the game. This also reminds me of the reocccuring concept that is being brought up online of the internet managed to reinvent the cable model. But in this instance i feel like its similar because now every game wants a disclaimer on everything, a sanitization of everything, and frankly also a subscription for everything.

another example is in the GK trailer we saw the mark 3 and everyone had a “what is that” reaction while they straight up told us everything about the new wonder weapon

That's great you came back to make a few videos every week. Have a nice day, Milo!

I think one of the main reasons why zombies became so good was that Treyarch actually listened to the community, not to mention the whole mode was a giant mystery until you completed the campaign. You can watch KrazyRabbits 40 minute video on random facts about the mode and theres clips of the zombie devs talking about the mode. The communitys speculation about the story is also what helped the mode become better seeing how someone thought the zombies would swipe you and say Sam which helped create most of the storyline along with some other random theories in the community.

Fantastic idea for a video! The early zombie maps reminded me of Outer Wilds in a way. You repeatedly go through the same environments, and try to connect dots from different areas, whilst constantly fighting a force that always wins in the end. Environmental storytelling at its best!

just wanna say i love the type of content you have been putting out lately.

This is the first CoD im not buying but i will be here for every single video you make Milo. I love listening to you to talk to us hardcore fans like adults

Milo is speaking on the behalf of a lot of us tbh

The piece at the end about the storytelling went crazy and really is a microcosm of the entire storytelling strategy at large since cold war began.

I felt this, homie just brought me back to the good old days when I didn’t know a thing about zombies but still trying to understand the story as to why they exist. It was a fun mystery and experience.

You know, you make an excellent point about the whole "zombies being something completely alien, something completely unexpected" thing. The more I think about it, the more I realize just how DIFFERENT zombies was to the campaigns and multiplayers - and how much we needed that. The campaigns were fantastic and the multiplayer was always a ton of fun too, but there was just something about zombies that was so different and off the rails when compared to the rest of the Call of Duty content that made it so special.

I hop on my PS4 to play OG Zombies from time to time and nothing compares. New zombie's just doesn't hit the same. The music, weapon sounds, atmosphere, sounds of the zombies. It was all so much more creepy and immersive. Ive been playing OG zombies since 2010 and I won't ever get into the newer zombies until they stop trying to bury their roots. Need to get back to the fundamentals and realize why zombies did as well as it did connected with so many people.

Cool to see you play the old zombies maps again, would love to see more!

This is the only element of Zombies that made me infatuated. I'm a filmmaker and have seen a lot of stuff, nothing in media has ever resonated or fascinated me like the decade of Zombie story-building. The ever evolving premise, characters and world hasn't been reached by any other format of media imo. This is why one day I believe it has a chance to be one of the most successful TV shows of all time, but even a long running series would comparatively be a movie to the book that Zombies is.

a new mrroflwaffles era has begun and im loving it

Therapist: Wide Milo isn't real he can't hurt you Wide Milo: 20:06

When they crossed zombies storyline into multi-player is when it went to shit

People grew so accustomed to full on opening cutscenes for maps but I do love and miss the days of the comic book style loading screens for maps like Nuketown, Moon, Ascension, even Buried. This left it up to you to try and decipher what you think the meaning of it was. A lot of times you don’t even know in Black Ops 1 why our characters are here on this map.

One of Nikolai’s quotes when walking up to the PaP’s closed door is “Pack-a-Punch? Oh my god, I think it makes vodka!!” One of my favourites haha 0:52

milos american accent will forever haunt my dreams

Idk what it is I normally didn’t watch Milo except for his no nonsense guides but lately I’ve been clicking on every notification of his and I’m all for it!

i remember when ascension came out looking at the forms (i think it was like game faq or something) while currently everyone was trying to figure out what to do for the easter egg, and everyone was stuck on the part with the gersh device - that was top tier zombies

I think a lot of it comes down to gaming difficulty and accessibility. Back when WaW came out, gaming in general was less popular and games were a lot more difficult. With gaming getting a rise in popularity, gaming companies want to make their games more accessible to gather a larger market share. Therefore Games have in general (in the mainstream) become easier. Because there are also so many more competing games, players are generally spending less time in each game. Storytelling has therefore become more streamlined, and things like Easter eggs and secrets get neglected in favor of mass market appeal and handholding. It’s such a shame!

Thanks for making this video Milo💙. Been feeling for years even during Cold War that trearch no longer care about US “veteran players” 😔 I wish there was two separate game modes now zombies and the new zombies stuff for the war zone crowd

Storytelling shouldn't have been so obvious and in your face when it comes to zombies, it's what defined the mode

This is incredibly put together and you explained and articulated every point so well (just like they’re doing for zombies lore 🙃). Totally agree. It’s sad to say, but we will never reach the peak that was bo3 zombies again. I don’t think we’ll even come close. It may sound harsh, but we’ve lost all creativity in the mode with the likes of blundell, Ross etc. all leaving their respective studios, and the modes feel like (and mostly are) a total cash grab now that relies on fan nostalgia to rake in pity bundles. I remember taking a ‘sick’ day off school to dedicate it to solving the GK Easter egg and figuring out all the lore. Watching along to countless livestreams from you, pizza, lex, Noah, pretty much everyone lmao, and getting so hyped when we thought we found something. Nowadays, everything is spelled out and it panders to casual players and non zombie players by making itself too simple. That was the last time I was THAT invested in zombies, coming up to a decade ago. They followed the same pattern with zombies through WaW - Black ops 3 and it got increasingly better, to the point where ZC became (if not, one of) the best selling dlc of all time. They changed the formula for BO4, and things started to go downhill. They changed more and more, until now when it’s a completely different game mode to what it used to be, numbers are at an all time low for zombies, and the vast majority of people are upset. They didn’t listen to the community, and tried to one up themselves by ignoring out wants and focusing on making unnecessary changes we didn’t ask for in a hope to “freshen” a mode that didn’t really need that much freshening. I could go on for triple this long, but I don’t have the time or patience. Good video Milo, these conversations that involve the lesser talked about things such as the way things are told, and the ignorance to the community need to be talked about if we have any hope of getting zombies even remotely close to what it should be. 👍

you have been on fire with the daily uploads thanks milo

I forgot about the counter culture feel zombies had. In bo2 I used to always refuse to play multiplayer and exclusively play zombies

What I loved about the way COD zombies used to tell stories was that there wasn’t a lot of exposition, the story was mostly told in the background and was built as an emergent quality of little tidbits you gathered from radios, map details, and character dialogue. It was up to you to gather up evidence to figure out the story, it wasn’t spoon fed to you. It’s a lot like how Fromsoftware games do storytelling via item descriptions in aggregate. I’d say this continued up until Origins.

I remember reading Reddit post after Reddit post about the mountains on Shangri la. Those were the days.

The great thing about the way the zombies story use to be told is that it scratches the same itch as Analog Horror. Piecing together story and lore based on environmental story telling, puzzles and ciphers was always the most fun way to receive and interact with the story and characters. Basically leaving us to figure it out rather than just giving it to us.

man milo really is pumping out these great videos lately

Old zombies maps always felt like there was so much more outside of the map. I loved exploring and imagining what was beyond the barriers

keep posting Milo! love these past videos from you

im the most interested in stories that make me question things. i want the story to give me bits and pieces so that i can put them together myself. thats why i like from software games so much. explaining why when and where like this dude did in that reveal was bad cause it takes away any interest ive had in the mode. the best stories are the ones that create more questions than they answer. its an important thing to make your fanbase actively interact with each other to find a common ground on those things. thats the main reason the zombies community got so passionate in the first place. cause blundell knew what to say and what to keep secret. from software games are so vague in storytelling that all the things you hear around the world surrounding god like beings and higher purposes feel like legends, myths and folktales that could actually be true. it increases the believability by a factor of 100 in comparison to games that just straight up tell you how it is. vagueness is one of the best tools in storytelling but its sadly not used very often.

I used to do these CoD Zombies animated videos just out of pure love for the storytelling methods Treyarch followed and how much room they left for our imaginations. The surface level was always the story of soldiers from WWII and, at the bottom of the iceberg, you had all of these occult elements like the Vrill, Illuminati, etc. I genuinely think someone should do a CoD Zombies remake that is a lot more focused and back to basics. I miss the old days when this franchise inspired me like it did.

Bruh, HOW MANY VIDEOS. IS THIS EARLY CHRISTMAS!?

the bags under milo’s eyes deepen every mw3 video he makes

something that i really wish you got into, was Dark Aether Zombies being 100% canon to the events of Modern Warfare and Black Ops Campaigns now. I liked this at first but now that i've thought about it more, Zombies will never have that hard hitting storytelling that affects the world again, something as big as blowing up the Earth in Bo1, or Apothicons invading and destroying worlds in Bo3 can't happen anymore because TF141 need to go on there boring adventures in middle east and they can't do that if the there's a global outbreak of zombies. I fear all zombies will be moving forward will be very small outbreaks like we see in MWIII or Cold War, with the entire outbreak being resolved within that map, and that just sound so boring to me. I know i'm in the minority here but I really am not excited for the future of the mode i grew up loving anymore.

Which cod zombies game had the best story telling 🤔

I started playing zombies heavily in BO3, and what kept me in that game was the mystery of the story and the zombies community passion towards finding out what was going on. I wasn't even that deep into the story like Milo was, but it was still interesting to load into a game and do the Easter egg, progressing through the story each map. In Gorod , when Dr. Monty revealed himself, I lost my shit cause I personally didn't see it coming and we only had 1 map left, and so many questions to be answered. These things are what makes the maps so amazing and interesting. If you look at fan favorite maps like Origins, Mob, or Shadows, there all great lore wise. Yeah, they might have the most fun gameplay, but the story aspects are what truly makes those maps amazing. At the end of Origins, where the Samantha and Eddie cutscene happens and you see the characters as dolls, that shit blows your mind and keeps you thinking. Hope we can get something like that again!

Honestly the change to changeable operators in Cold War killed it for me. Didn’t feel like it connected to me at all

Please keep these videos coming Milo. They’re so well done and what you present is so important for the future of the mode.

It stopped being good in BO3 imo. It was much more interesting when it was grounded in historical fiction rather than the fantastical elements they moved towards

I would never buy the door to the left, simply because of how OP that original camping spot was near that window. 👌🏼

The devs really want to make it easy for new players to understand and play the story. In the past new players would kill zombies and die and get over it because they didn’t want to put in the effort to learn the story. Now they just hold your hand and that makes it so much easier and “fun” for the casual player. Which I hate. I truly feel that zombies will never go back to that because at the end of the day the higher ups just want more people to play and the only way they can do that rn seems like Is to hold ur hand thru the story.

Absolutely. Been following you since maybe black ops if I'm not mistaken. The dissections you've done on the environment designs and radios and bringing the threads together gave me such a love for the storyline. This video is it man.

I thought the video was going to go in a different direction with talking more about the internal stuff within the game and game world only from the title name compared to the video which included a lot of the external things with Jason Blundell and Cod Next. However I still agree with a majority of what was said. Externally away from the game, I don't feel like there's much mystery going into MWIII as answers were questioned and did feel talked down to a little. I never really thought about how other audiences would see that information and just assumed it benefited them without really thinking about it. Internally in game , I'm not a fan of the "new" direction of learning stuff in lore. Yes I love the Intel/Notes system but man make 4 operators (similar to WWII) have actual Zombies Dialogue that can have interactive conversations and talk to us. I'd love the interactions in Blood of the Dead between Primis about there emotions and thoughts. I'm someone who has a pretty strong imagination and so I love putting myself if possible in the characters shoes in situations because it makes myself feel more emerged into the game world. In Cold War even with the notes, I couldn't get emerged into that game world because the interactions of what was happening were with Weaver, Dr Grey etc. all of which weren't me as the character and all of which aren't physically dealing with the danger of the game world. I love going back to Ancient Evil and putting myself in the shoes of a member of the Chaos Crew and work out what I'd be feeling and doing after the end of the main quest EE. Even still in Ancient Evil, I may learn a little new thing here and there from a conversation between characters. Do I think storytelling is "dead" in zombies. Of course not. I'm just not as emerged into it and therefore my interest isn't there as much. That's why when at CoD Next, when I felt like I had no real story interest besides the Weaver Situation and I only cared for the gameplay aspect. Sorry if this doesn't make sense or waffles too much. It's Midnight when this got released and I'm tired lmao

The BO1 & 2 events were the playground for so much storytelling. You could genuinely take any place on earth and build up a fully original map with unique crews and objectives. Also no interdimensional galactical alien space war.

I'm genuinly confident that most storyline guys, or the hardcores that breath CoD:Zombies, could provide a better story for the players, if you gave them the chance, than what Treyarch brought to the table the last few years...

This is a really important video, I hope zombies can recover but i'm not so sure anymore. Glad that you still care!

To me the zombies story started at Nacht and ended on Moon the rest is just bullshit

the simple issue is this: they want to achieve black ops 3 level hype in a single game, like black ops 3 was not a culmination of 4 games of zombies buildup

Your forehead boutta have some heavy wrinkles later if you keep raising your eyebrows like that

Everyone praises FromSoft’s storytelling in games like Dark Souls and Elden Ring for being so groundbreaking and different. I personally first experienced that type of storytelling in WaW zombies and it was amazing. It was so mysterious and all the community theory crafting was great to follow. I miss it

yapfest 2023

learned so many tidbits about der riese from this vid like the zombie hazard sign. pls make more like this on other maps

Treyarch fan boys ruined zombies. All innovative maps are shunned

I love how you start raving about the thompson and then you see the ppsh and just trade it without hesitation xD

Loved hearing him talk about loving the flame thrower and then immediately cutting to the round end screen 😭

I feel like the Treyarch devs we have today need to watch this video to understand the essence of zombies and that maps like Der riese (reused mp and campaign map) can be aesthetically changed or worked on to make the map have a certain vibe instead of just porting mp maps in, barely changing anything.

To see you playing Der Riese in WaW and changing to The Giant in Bo3 was emotional. Aether has been such an important part of my youth. You were part of that, thanks so much Milo

Milo your uploads lately have been helping me get my mind off a lot of adulthoods trials and tribulations. Thank you for keeping this community alive

I’ve always loved how detailed and well spoken Milo is at explaining the zombies storyline, even way back 10 years ago

Facts! I also want to say that while I hated Ghosts... but the Alien mode really gelt like unique classic zombies.

Fantastic video milo. Absolutely nailed it ❤ zombies is a very simple formula to me, "You don't know what you don't know" works so well and it feels since Jason's departure treyarch just don't understand anymore. They're so out of touch

The reason i love milo is that he will make a video pleading for the devs to listen and revert zombies back to what it used to be, other than someone like lex who would prefer to give up on the future of zombies and focus on making remasters of old maps (not to say what lex is doing is bad, its just nice to see someone who has hope for the community.)

I loved the early style of zombies so much, mainly gameplay that anyone can enjoy, with enough actual "easter eggs" and story hints through map design and character dialogue for people who wanted to speculate about what the story could be. I really feel like it lost its way around CotD where the EE turned into the "main quest" and the mystery started to get lost

This is why the best zombies EE came from BLOPS1 and 2, after that they leaned way too hard being vague and cryptic where for me i couldnt figure out most easter eggs ever on my own. A nice mix of fun challenge with rewarding story bits or powerups or changes in the map

As an og WAW player after bo3 the feel of zombies changed, the story, the gameplay, maps. Never were the same. I stopped at bo4 and all i want is bo3 experience again....

How is posible that milo is still creating original content about zombies in 2023, he is just a special type of youtuber, the GOAT of zombies

What's crazy is us veterans will literally except almost anything story wise if the mystery is there and the gameplay is good. Proof is in the fact we accepted the multiverse idea and even leaned into it ourselves. It's such a hard thing to mess up and they have done it consistently.

This content is everything

The one point that was not brought up in the early part was the fact that it felt like such a bonus finishing the campaign for the first time and then you boot into Natch for the first time