The Finnish Language - Foreigners in Finland Podcast #4 

Great podcast guys, I'm an aussie in finland as well. Been here 3 years but still remember the time I tried to order a hot chocolate in finnish and accidentally asked for a kuuma kakka instead of kuuma kaakao. Got a good chuckle 😂.

Great discussion! Glad the algorithm pointed me here. I too have a ½ Finnish ½ American background and moved to Finland almost two years ago. I didn't learn as a kid, just from what I overheard from family and visits to Finland. Now going about it the hard way. It's defiantly an uphill journey, but I don't think it's so much a hard language to learn, most of the rules are pretty clear, it's just really very different from most others (Hi you lucky Estonians!). For me speaking, esp. trying to use proper puhekieli has been the hardest part, but this video has inspired me to keep trying!

Thanks again guys! If I can offer anything to this topic, I would give one advise; Don't boil your brain trying to bend word properly. Just use the base word and say to your companion "en osaa sanoa" or "en osaa taivuttaa sanaa" and I bet he/she/it 😄who you are talking with will probably help you. Of course this is for people who already knows some words and some of the basics of finnish All and all great episode again and really good advises to everyone that plans to learn this tricky, but very rich language. It can be a lifetime learning curve, if you are willing to dig deeper. Like literature, poetry, lyrics

For some reason I never thought that the finnish pronounciation/spelling thing made any sense for foreigners but im glad to hear it does. :D Once you learn the letters and few rules youre good to go, no more guessing how to pronounce/spell something because theyre almost 1:1

One of the major ways I spent time conversing with people, when I was in Japan for a year, was forcing myself to say everything in Japanese. Whenever I encountered things/words I couldn't express, I tried to ask how/what in Japanese and in desperate situations use the English word for something to ask for the Japanese one. Then I'd immediately try actually saying that thing which would then get corrected if the person I was talking with was comfortable doing that (it all depended on how respectful they wanted to be). I believe that is one of the greatest tools for getting comfortable with speaking. In terms of actually learning a language, input is king. TV shows, movies and reading are the best ways to learn new stuff. If children's books feel awkward, I suggest looking for "Graded Readers". They are books/stories that are written in a simplified way to transition from barely reading to reading native texts. Selkosuomenkieliset uutiset is good for subject matter but graded readers come with clearly defined difficulties that offer a way to progress methodically. No need to waste time reading something you understand 100% instead of 95%. 95% is apparently the sweet spot for learning a language by reading. You are also meant to read them without the use of external aids like your phone/dictionary.

Hungary has similar structure and it is read same way and the word-endings annd stuff works similarly. If you instead want language which has some same words or similar words, you want to be listening Estonian. About "se meni kauppaan". When I was kid (I'm 32 this year) it was considered rude to use "se" from a person. It was only for animals and objects. You were always supposed to say "hän meni kauppaan" about humans. But kids rebel against parents and language changes. Nowadays if someone uses "hän" from person I just think "oh, there's extra polite person". 😃 I still try to say hän, when talking to elderly person and also call them "te" instead of "sinä" if I don't know them. They usually love those "good old manners". 😁 Also weird/funny thing is that because people want to tell that their pets are part of the family as much as humans, some insist that their pets are "hän" instead of "se". Same people that use "se" about humans all the time 🤦‍♀️😂

As a foreigner learning Finnish, I really appreciate this episode! I'm learning it in uni and it is not an easy task for sure, but it is feasible, I reckon. What makes it especially hard for me is the spoken language and slang. Of course any language taught in a classroom is going to be different than what people use daily, but with Finnish I feel like it is almost too different. I watch a lot of TV shows but it's still very difficult because often I just can't find the word. Also, thanks for the resources! I didn't know about kielikoulu, I'm going to use it everyday from now on!

It's widely known that Finnish and Hungary are relatives and several in this thread have mentioned Estonian to be close relative to Finnish. It's often forgotten or not known that Sami languages, Karelian languages (not to mix up with the dialect spoken in eastern part of Finland) and other minor languages in Nordics and Russian are part of Uralic language family and therefore more of less close to Finnish. As someone who speaks only Finnish of those languages I can understand quite well some Karelian (depending on the Karelian language) and some of the smaller Uralic languages. Just fyi. :D

It is a good advice to reset your brain for Finnish. As long as you do not compare things to your own language it gets easier because it is so different to anything else except Estonian and Hungarian.

Excellent content but also 5/5 tech.. lights, video, audio. Many tubers should learn from you guys.

tule - tulee - tulle - tullee tuule - tuulee - tuulle - tuullee kisa - kissa; lika - likka There you have words that are true and correct and that I have used abroad when presenting the wonderful character of the Finnish language! PS. Finnish is not objectively a difficult language - it totally depends on your first language.

Finnish vs. swedish.. They are hole other language families.. Fin = The Uralic family of languages, of which Finnish is a member, are hypothesized to derive from a single ancestor language termed Proto-Uralic, spoken sometime between 8,000 and 2,000 BCE (estimates vary) in the vicinity of the Ural mountains.[17] Over time, Proto-Uralic split into various daughter languages, which themselves continued to change and diverge, yielding yet more descendants. One of these descendants is the reconstructed Proto-Finnic, from which the Finnic languages developed,[18] and which diverged from Proto-Samic (a reconstructed ancestor of the Sámi languages) around 1500-1000 BCE.[19]

A good teacher will definitely help. To have someone to explain the grammar the way it makes sense etc. Learning spoken Finnish simultaneously with the standard Finnish might also be beneficial and increase motivation to learn the language. To actually be able to use the language the way the locals do will also effect on how the locals relate to you. Spoken Finnish in general ought to be easier, since that's why it's used. Keeping in mind, that there's not only one spoken Finnish, but all the different dialects and slang words. Funny thing about the "it" thing is that often the third-person pronoun is used to humanize pets. About the compound words I'd say, that they are problematic, if you don't know the words they consists of, but once you do know, they are easy, since in Finnish one entity is always one compound word. One thing is that it's pretty easy to read Finnish without understanding any of it, just by learning the Finnish alphabets, the hyphenation rules and those rules that lead to that monotonic speech pattern. Then you can just read through also those long compound words syllable at the time. And also read E.g. Italian and Japanese.

I feel like the whole written/spoken language is one of the main things making it hard. Do you think it'd be better to teach the spoken language for this reason? The written language is mainly needed for any formal emails or documents, reading news etc. What makes it even more tricky is all parts of Finland have somewhat different dialects, so even if you learn one style of spoken language if you then move across finland you might have to learn a lot of new words again

Could you do a video about the different cities and universities? Awesome info guys, thanks!

Hi guys! Great content and lots of it! I'm one of the Swedish-speaking Finlanders and luckily I learned Finnish already at a tender age, because as an adult it would be almost impossible. I just want to add a few things here. Easy points in Finnish: Pronunciation and Spelling. -- You pronounce every single word exactly the way it's written and the emphasis is always on the first syllable no matter how long the word is. Just learn how the letters of the alphabet are pronounced in Finnish. Compound Words. -- There are lots of compound words, just like in many other languages, in Swedish, Norwegian, Danish, German, Dutch. So that's nothing unusual. You just have to get used to reading the entire word at one glance before you speak it. No Genders. -- No 'der, die, das, no he, she, no han, hon den, det, no le, la, and all their conjugations. No Future Tense. -- A future action is indicated by words like 'tomorrow', 'later', 'next week', and so on. Borrowed from the Swedish way of indicating the future, the use of the verb 'kommer att', that is, 'tulla' followed by the form 'tekemään' (to do) may also be used. It's best to forget how other European languages are constructed and think of Finnish as some really exotic language like Japanese. "Vesi, vede/n, vet/tä, vesi/en." (water) All you have to do is choose the correct stem for the suffix that you want to use. Easy! 😂

You have it so right about the difference between written and spoken Finnish, i.e. kirja-/puhekieli. Interestingly enough, it is not just about shortening words - it is also about grammar and regional words: Lähetääks huomen dokaan? In correct Finnish it would be: Lähdemmekö huomenna juomaan (alkoholia)? Yes, huomenna has been shortened, but the correct first plural active has been replaced by the passive, the interrogative suffix has changed, and the last word is very regional. When I studied at Turku University in the 90s, a lecturer told about her first experience of speaking with someone in Finland. Her level of Finnish was good as she had done several courses in the US, so she went out on the street full of confidence, and spoke Finnish with the first person she met. That person clearly understood her and replied... There, however, the communication ended as the reply was in spoken Finnish 😁. Personally, I also had this experience as a "tutor" of foreign exchange students in Finland - I simply had to spek very bookish.

Coming from Ecuador (with my spanish background), It was really interesting to hear the monotone way of speaking of some finns 😅. I can confirm that it's not the same with everyone, but it's funny when I mentioned it to my finnish friends here. Thank you guys for the resources you shared, I'm just starting to learn the language (wish me luck 🤞). I've been here since January, and I absolutely love the country (and the winter). Thanks again! :D

I enjoy listening to you, I start in spotify and then come here to make sure I did not miss anything haha

My German teacher gave an example of double vowels and consonants in Finnish language: Tuli, tuuli, tulli (fire, wind, customs) He made me to pronounce the words in a row and asked a French exchange student could she tell the difference. 🤷🏻‍♀️ She couldn't. 😂

You make interesting content and you both pronounce Finnish well and clearly! Keep up the good work. I think that in a few decades Finland will have doubled its population with immigration, the northern climate in Finland will feel agreeable in comparison... People will come to stay for the long haul...

Estonian has a lot of similar words with Finnish..but they don't usually have the double consonants or vocals :D

Allso in south Finland we speak in diffrent dialects so shortend words but in Pohjanmaa everything has extra letters. Some dialects are hard to understand for normal Finnish people

Finnish is tough for Indo-European language speakers. Swedish is very close to English (both Germanic languages) so muche easier to learn for English speakers. One difficulty is that written, formal Finnish is different from everyday spoken Finnish (or many dialects).

Hahaha, that was an invitation to learning Finnish... Not! But how you described the difficulty of reading in Finnish is exactly what I've been saying for years (section on passive learning). Now, I'm a native Finnish speaker, but I want to read my books in English (I've done all my academic studies in English and lived for a decade in English speaking countries), because it is just much quicker, be this something academic or just a book I'd read for entertainment.

Finnish sounds more like Estonian than Hungarian. But then also sounds like Sami. The language and culture is something of a mystery. Most theories are just speculation.

I think the main reason finnish is difficult for foreigners is because the finnish language is so different from other european languages. Finnish isn't even an indo-european language, it's finno-ugric. Finnish language also prefers to use its own lexicon than use loanwords for new words, so there are only a few similar words to english.

Some say the Finnish language is the Japanese of Europe

So nice comments!😊 Hyvä jätkät!😂

When you said to give your finnish friend advice to speak finnish instead of english to help you to learn finnish i felt like i couldn't possibly speak finnish the way you could actually possibly understand what i'm saying because i am from oulu region and i speak finnish in a very strong northern/oulu-dialect, so i think you would not understand a word i said since it usually feels like even the finnish people in the southern finland struggle to understand what i am trying to say.

Language learning is to 80% about psychology, I'd say. Especially as an adult. One has to come to grips with feeling awkward, feeling stupid, feeling "unauthentic", feeling insecure, feeling laughable and unintentionally comical, feeling inferior, feeling vulnerable, etc. Be ready for the listener to laugh at you and laugh along. But most Finns don't laugh at other people's mistakes, that is a very nice Finnish habit. Maybe it helps if you reflect on how long time it takes for a Finn to learn English? That even Finnish kids spend hours and hours to produce the difference in "th" in words like "thing" and "there", and even then it tends to come out wrong in fast speech, anyway. In my Finnish school, when learning English we had to bring small mirrors with us, so the teacher could explain how English sounds are made, what to do with our tongues, lips and muscles in the mouth, face, and where to place the sounds. We felt so ridiculous, but we had to! It is useful to train with exaggerations and humor. Also look at people in slow-motion in a video. Work with contrasts. Like how would Finnish sound with an English sentence "melody"? How would English sound if with a heavy Finnish monotonous "melody" (remember stress on the first syllable of every word, and to use long and short syllables all over the place)? What is typical for a Finnish accent when a beginner speaks English? - That's the Finnish accent to use when speaking Finnish "native style" - it is not funny to Finnish ears. And then also play with contrasts within Finnish - for example: look closely at a Finn shifting her/his whole facial expression, when shifting from "tie" to "työ". "Tie" looks like a smile, but "työ" looks like a trumpet. No Finnish sound is pronounced with the tongue sticking out beyond the teeth. Especially: be grateful for long Finnish compound words, because only the last part in them has to be conjugated. :-) And think about the Finnish cases in daily use, as prepositions glued onto the end of words. In my English grammarbook the part on English preposition usage was about 50 pages long, and no logical explanations! So listening and reading with intention helps, but I guess one will forever make mistakes. Eaves-dropping is great in this context. ;-) It can't be denied, that languages use irritatingly small distinctions to carry huge differences in meanings, but it's like that in every language. It could make one crazy, but don't let it! Before too long this channel will have lots of listeners and likes, then let's repeat some topics! Ask questions about Finnish! Tell about every day episodes.

Sick good pronunciation of Finnish Language, Both of You! Kudos!

and there is also the Eastern Finland dialect what is a little bit different than basic Finnish

I use "hän" for dogs ;-)

Wait hang on, (17:14) you are ACTUALLY taught (or conditioned) to only read the start of the word and guess the rest? That's been like my top complaint when watching foreigners try to pronounce Finnish words, where it seems like they often just give up before even looking at the whole word. I didn't know it's actually almost a subconscious thing for you guys. >_>

Not bad pronoucing att all , keep it up :)

Olen pettynyt että englanniksi... En katso

Estonia is closest to Finnish, you can understand Estonian if you speak Finnish, but normal words in Estonia, in Finnish they sounds dirty a lot

The word hän (he/she) is made up word by the father of written Finnish, Mikael Agricola. He decided that Finnish language should have a pronoun to separate people from animals (and other objects) just like Swedish han(he)/hon(she). Before that, the word se (it) had been used for anything between the mightiest gods and lifeless rocks. The word se has remained in spoken language, but people use the word hän when they are speaking more formally.

Swedish is closer to rest of europe

”Se me kauppaan” is bad Finnish. You need to say ”Hän meni…” if you want to be more polite.

que Nelabarbyy.Uno encantan tus videos. Bendiciones hermosa Celina que Dios te cuide donde quiera los mortaless abian apreciado tan hermosa mujer

Written language and speaken language are difrent here ass like anywhere else

Alemao

Some make memes to joke about Finnish being so totally different from other languages, but one could also make long lists of thousands of words that have the same stem in Finnish as in some other European languages. Let me give some examples: auto, linja-auto, akku, moottori, mekaanikko, tekniikka, kuula, kaasu... kaupunki, katu, kartta, kortti, muuri, vaunu, pankki, kauppa, tori, halli... atomi, virus, korona, pakkaus, neula, sakset, sali, tuoli, lasi, ikkuna... parta, villa, lammas, leninki, pöksyt, housut, hattu, tyyny, lakana, liina, kaappi... baari, tuoppi, olut, mallas, viina, viini, suola, kappakka, tynnyri... viineri, munkki, kurkku, salaatti, appelsiini, banaani, kiivi, torttu, piirakka... pappi, kirkko, tuomio-kirkko, kappeli, alttari, torni, risti, urku, penkki, matto. ... leipä, lusikka, suopa, saippua, pahvi, muki, pihvi, kahvi, tee, sokeri, hunaja... koulu, rehtori, diplooma, maisteri, insinööri, kanslia, sihteeri, paperi... politiikko, ministeri, presidentti, laki, pilari, euro, kruunu, kuningas... armeja, kivääri, kapteeni, luutnantti, kenraali, pommi, pyssy, kanuuna... musiikki, sinfonia, piano, viulu, melodia, sopraano, tenoori, basso, kitara, valssi... The more languages you know, the more of the thousands of loanwords you'll recognize.