The FORGOTTEN GOD - Is Magic Fading? - Elder Scrolls Lore 

Mages got it tough in Skyrim, I can't even count how many times I've heard guards say to me "Go cast your fancy Magic somewhere else"

Tsun the guardian of Soverngarde said, "The (current) Nords (Stormcloak vs Imperials Era) may have forgotten their Forefathers (Ancestral Ancient Nords) respect for the Clever Craft (Magic). Here in Shor's house, we honor it still... Many of your comrades (mages) throng this hall."

No wonder we lost some spells... R.I.P. Levitation...

Magic will fade cause Bethesda keeps reducing the number of spells

Fun fact: Julianos is actually named for Elder Scrolls creator Julian LaFey.

When you cast healing hands on someone because they are hurt and they say “go cast your fancy magic someplace else”

The Oblivion Crisis is what happened to Magic, basically mages were blamed for it by the simple folk, because they couldn't find a better reason for portals to Oblivion just opening out of thin air.

Magic will always be here I hope 🤔 where's my levitation?

Funny how the nords hate magic, but have deep respect for the Dragonborn who has the ability to use the Voice without training despite it being a form of magic.

Reminds me of Dragon age. Everyone loves magic when it’s being used to shove their guts back into their sliced open bellies or as weapons of war but every other time? Lock them in prisons

They won't actually remove magic from the Elder Scrolls it's the most popular way to play the game besides stealth archer.

Julianos:*god of magic* Magnus: hold my beer

I wonder if the vilification of magic played a part in the diminishing of the Empire during the 4th era and the Empire effectively losing the Great War to the Aldmeri Dominion

Absolutely loving the series keep up the great work ❤️

Used Heal Other on the Breton guy that can follow you to Eldergleem Sactuary after he was roughed up by a werewolf. His words to me: _"You think you're better than me because you can cast that?"_ Felt better than the typical guard dialogue about _fancy magic._

"The Forgotten god" Oh Jyggalag is finally getting his own video!...............no wait still not here yet.

BGS should make a game taking place back when ayelids(sorry if I slaughtered it) and dwemer still exist, and magic is widely used and popular. It'd be so interesting to see how the culture's used it

curved swords

2:00 there's a dead spider on the wardrobe

Curse the common folk of Tamerial!!!! Magic is a High Art, and it can do such amazing things, not just evil that they make it seem to be. I hope that Julianos worship and Magical practice never stops!!!! :)

"'Magic is powerful and dangerous, a tool to be used or be used by, it deserves our respect and veneration not fear and distrust'' arch mage of Skyrim

Following the teaching of Julianos Just becuse a few country pumpkings dislike Magic in the most Magic hated land (Skyrim) dose not meen other lands dislike Magic......... Magic is far to big for the Breatons etc....

Julianos fall in Popularity is understandable yet tragic. He's one of my favourite Aedra but I do get why a lot of people are afraid of Magic due to The Oblivion Crisis.

I honestly think of Magnus when I think of magic, always thought Julianos was just intelligence and wisdom and stuff.

The fall of the ayleids, dwemer and years of research by the mages guild has the same impact the burning of the great library of alexandria have on us

Man I love the way he makes his videos. 👍 good job

How poetic that the god named after the father of the elder scrolls whom no longer works with Bethesda, is fading from existence

Is it bad that this also explains why magic seems so much weaker from Morrowind to Skyrim where you went from being able to fly and fire massive 50ft Fireballs(Or you spell choice.) To poorly casting magic that does little damage with one or two hands. (Great video by the way, Both my son and I very much enjoy Lore series like this.)

I feel that condemning the study of magic in tamriel would be similar to condemning the study of physics or maybe even all sciences, in our own world.

Don’t worry the Thalmor will make Julianos and Tamriel great again. And make the Nords pay for it.

Magic fading? What is this A Song of Ice and Fire?

i hope magic comes back strong in es6 its what makes the games fun

I hope mages won't be hunted like in the witcher =(

I wonder if there’s a tie between Julianos and Hermaeus Mora? Given how the nature of Aedra and Daedra can change based off of human perception, I can’t help but wonder if there’s also an overlap in their very being?

it is not magic that is fading, it is the natural cycle of all societies that relly on magic. if magic is the thing that leads to greatness, it is also the thing that leads to decadence and therefore to the eventual downfall, the candle that burns twice as brightly only burns for half as long. just look at all the great magical empires, they grew fast and died even mroe qiuckly. the alyeds where whiped out. the snow elves where enslaved and twisted into beasts. the dragon cult was whiped out. the dwemer disapeared. the mages guild was ended. house telvanni is only a shadow of it's former self. winterhold crumbled. those magical societies and institutions that remain are the proof that the only way for them to avoid destruction is to humble themselfs, the grey beards, the psijic monks and the moth priests are the only groups that will forever stand the test of time.

Is this the reason for the more streamlined magic system?

Julianos isn't forgotten and magic isn't universally shunned. Magic isn't fading, either. People may be wary of mages after the events of Oblivion, that's really it. Skyrim in their old traditions blame mages for it and have since come to distrust mages, but you seem to be forgetting that magic isn't all togther shunned in Skyrim, either. The common folk are perfectly fine w/ restoration and I shouldn't have to tell you, but restoration magic is still magic. Just because they're wary of magic doesn't mean they universally shun it like you present in this video.

I don't know if anyone else has pointed to this yet but WHY, oh WHY, is there, yet again, the confusion about Julianos and MAGNUS? Everywhere I look (UESP, ElderScrolls Wikia, The Imperial Library, etc) Julianos is noted as "the God of Wisdom and Logic (or Learning)". Magnus? Always, always the God of Magic (or Sorcery). The Ayelids worshipped Magnus as the God of Sight, Light and Insight. What was light to the Ayleids? Magic. The purest form of it in fact. In that case, Meridia is more magical than Julianos fod goodness sake. In Daggerfall (source: The Imperial Library), Julianos' Schools are noted as being like academies and you even quote the lines. "[...] we advocate literacy and education for all Tamrielans [...]". Does that sound like magic to anyone? Because it doesn't to me and I always prefer magic and being a magic wielder in all my games, hence I do like to dig into its origins and related topics. You even mentioned the Schools and the Mages Guild. Why would there be TWO of them? The Bretons have BOTH Julianos and Magnus in their native pantheon and the difference is clear: the former is about learning, knowledge and logic while the latter is about magic. And this line pops up everywhere as well: "Cyrodilic legends say he [a/n: Magus] can inhabit the bodies of powerful magicians and lend them his power." Is magic logical? No, I would certainly say it isn't. It's mystery. You can't apply logic to something like that. That's why, in TES, it comes from a realm far beyond Nirn (as noted: Aetherius). If Julianos was Jhunal and he was the god that gave mathematics and langauges to mortals. What are languages and mathematics ruled by? Logic, strict patterns and rules, everything that magic isn't ruled by. Why do I see magic as not ruled by logic and rules? Because it comes from another realm: Aetherius. It's highly arrogant and illogical to think that the rules that apply to OUR world would apply to even a neighbouring world. And in this case, there's Oblivion between the two. At most, I could agree on that Julianos/Jhunal is the heir/apprentice to Magnus but THE God of Magic? No, that he'll never be to me with so many sources quoting Magnus as the God of Magic. At most, I would say it's similar to how religions in our world have cannibalised rituals and holy days of older faiths in an attempt to make the transition for the new converts. But we're all allowed to agree to disagree. I WOULD have given this video more credit if it'd brought up the case of Magnus vs Julianos though. Especally since Magnus, the Architect of Mundus, holds the title of God of Magic that this video bestows Julianos, the Scholar.

Can you imagine an Elder Scrolls game where restoration became the only valid school of magic?

"and whose number reset the sum neatly at Jhunal’s delight, for no march of the Sons and Daughters of Kyne can be ever ended..." the Five Hundred Mighty Companions of Ísgramor

As an amateur chemist, i feel great resonance with this and the fear and hatred that is directed at the mages of Tamriel. For we amateur chemists experience the same, people continuously looking at us as criminals and outcasts, often asking why we do what we do without coming to realize the true beauty in the physical nature of our universe and the desire to shape and change pieces of it just for the mere enjoyments and satisfaction in observing such changes.

Here is just a thought. What if magic isn't fading but it's just weaker in certain locations. Skyrim is full of ignorant warriors. Their lack of worship of Julianos could make magic weaker in Skyrim or seem to be fading. Just my thought on the matter.

Great video love your channel keep up the great work

Whoa whoa whoa, watch the magic!

Meridia, Malacath or Mehrunes Dagon next? really interested in your view on Meridia

For magic to be fading wouldn’t that mean the sun would be disappearing

Best way to start of and otherwise shity day 💯

Science and logic are not in conflict with faith (Christianity to be specific). "The Bible played a positive role in the development of science. Had it not been for the rise of the literal interpretation of the Bible and the subsequent appropriation of biblical narratives by early modern scientists, modern science may not have arisen at all. In sum, the Bible and its literal interpretation have played a vital role in the development of Western science " Harrison, P., The Bible and the rise of science, Australasian Science 23(3):14-15, 2002. "Here is a final paradox. Recent work on early modern science has demonstrated a direct (and positive) relationship between the resurgence of the Hebraic, literal exegesis of the Bible in the Protestant Reformation, and the rise of the empirical method in modern science. I’m not referring to wooden literalism, but the sophisticated literal-historical hermeneutics that Martin Luther and others (including Newton) championed." Snobelen, S., Isaac Newton and Apocalypse Now: a response to Tom Harpur’s ‘Newton’s strange bedfellows’; A longer version of the letter published in the Toronto Star, 2004. "It was, in part, when this method was transferred to science, when students of nature moved on from studying nature as symbols, allegories and metaphors to observing nature directly in an inductive and empirical way, that modern science was born. In this, Newton also played a pivotal role. As strange as it may sound, science will forever be in the debt of millenarians and biblical literalists." This is contrary to common (mis)understanding, yet it is well documented. Don't buy into popular myth. "The “Enlightenment” was conceived initially as a propaganda ploy by militant atheists and humanists [e.g. Voltaire, Diderot and Gibbon] who attempted to claim credit for the rise of science [through promulgating] the falsehood that science required the defeat of religion" Stark, R., For the Glory of God: How monotheism led to reformations, science, witch-hunts and the end of slavery, Princeton University Press, 2003. “Science was not the work of western secularists or even deists; it was entirely the work of devout believers in an active, conscious, creator God. Stark, R., For the Glory of God: How monotheism led to reformations, science, witch-hunts and the end of slavery, Princeton University Press, 2003. James Hannam, who recently earned a Ph.D. on the History of Science from the University of Cambridge, UK, pointed out: “During the Middle Ages, the Catholic Church actively supported a great deal of science, which it also kept control of when speculation could impinge on theology. Furthermore and contrary to popular belief, the Church never supported the idea that the earth was flat, never banned human dissection, never banned zero and certainly never burnt anyone at the stake for scientific ideas.” “Popular opinion, journalistic cliché and misinformed historians not withstanding, recent research has shown that the Middle Ages were a period of enormous advances in science, technology and culture. The compass, paper, printing, stirrups and gunpowder all appeared in Western Europe between AD 500 and AD 1500. Hannam, J., God’s Philosophers: How the Medieval World Laid the Foundations of Modern Science, 2007

I love lore videos. Could you guys do some on the Aldmeri pantheon? I am curious how Julianos fits into their pantheon, although I've heard he is basically replaced by Magnus.

Amazing content as always! You make me fall in love with the Elder Scrolls series over and over again

Really insightful and well orated. Your channel is one I always look forward to. Whether it be the relaxing Elder Scrolls music in the background or a refresher into one of the many facets of this wonderful world, it is always a pleasure to listen and watch.

Julianus, Jul i anus, that LITERALLY translates to ”Christmas in anus” in Swedish.... what a GODLY NAME

Nah, Skyrim just made it to weak

I love your style of talking, I've rarely enjoyed a voice this much before.

The most powerful military and political power is a magic focused race. The reason magic is less prevalent in Skyrim is because they associate it with the elven races, thus it becomes a reflection of their racism and xenophobia. The Mage's Guild did not dissolve entirely, it split into two groups due to discourse over the study of necromancy and conjuration. Both splinter groups are recognized officially by the Empire. Basically...I have no clue why you think the way you do. Skyrim has always been anti-magic and it's no surprise that they reacted the way they did, but that doesn't mean it's a reflection of the state of magic throughout all of Tamriel.

It's fairly understandable for Skyrim. Outside of Winterhold every mage you encounter is kind of sketchy, abducting people for experiments and betraying eachother. What did Orthorn do to get locked up?

For a moment I tought you were going to talk about magnus.

Julianos and magic will never go away for one simple reason people are ambitious.

MAKE TAMRIEL GREAT AGAIN! WORSHIP JULIANOS!

Years later and I'm still in awe of the amount of lore and detail The Edler Scrolls universe. It's really incredible.

Make Magic Great Again.

I don't think magic will ever truly be forgotten, as there are many aspects of the world that involve magic. Healers and priests use magic to heal the sick and weak. So there will always be Restoration Magic. Battlemages are far too invaluable to a military to get rid of, so there will always be destruction magic. Thieves and assassins will always be needed, and those thieves will need invisibility and quiet feet to slip away. So there will always be illusion magic.

Julianos God of NPCs

Even tough I'm an avid follower of Stendarr I also hold Julianos in high esteem. Just wish my fellow Vigilant can get you can't fight off Daedra while being a dumb sack of bricks. Also Julianos can really help us in understand Stendarrs teachings more well, especially when it comes to being more M E R C I F U L towards others. This Vigilant will alway venerate Julianos just as much as I do Stendarr.

I think it’s possible magic will end. Ppl will forget not only the gods but the old ways and the mages guild the college and even the psjic order. The telvani wizards were great but they must have been gone too dut to the eruption.

Moth priests founded by Tiber Septim. Serana knows of them. Mhmkay... sure...

IMO magic should start getting weaker overall. Not in actual Power but in the level of skill the Magi have. The Colleges should fade form the public, Becoming small reclusive organizations away from major civilizations. Most cities would have at most 1 or 2 families of mages and lone magi not counting court mages and librarians. While smaller minor villages and town have none, even forgetting mages exist at most may have an Apothecary or Healer. Witch Hunters would begin coming more into power. getting more business and recognition as they hunt the Plentiful amount of Rouge and Hedge mages out in the wilds, sniffing out magic and abominations wherever it may hide. Places like High Rock become bastion for Magi as they are built as magic. In other provinces Magicks become more restricted, a typical Magi being pressed into military service or being forced to study in secret. Great noble houses becoming reclusive and mysterious with rumors of them being secretly powerful mages down to the lone hedge studying out in the wilds in hopes they can avoid the Hunters.

You know what would be great? If fear spells and effects made opponents exit combat. Why use a fear spell in combat if it just makes them run away, forcing you to chase them down?

22 like!

So, basically... Magic is fading because someone cried out "OooOH... mAGiC! iT'S MAgIC!" at the sight of a fucking OBLIVION gate.

#First

I have a feeling that Julianos would have had a shrine in Winterhold before the collapse, but afterward people stopped trusting him.

Hello Daddy I love you and your videos.

It's also interesting how badly the imperials damage themselves with this policy, the Thalmore were doing so well in the Great war because of their excellent magic, and also probably didn't abide by the imperial ban on flying magic, thus giving them an airforce.

That's the lore reason for why magic is lame in Skyrim, without mods of course. Add mods and magic is sexy again! No matter what all of my characters use some magic. Usually only 1 school. Except for my assassin build, which uses illusion and alteration.

People are so quick to point fingers, blame, and criticize things beyond what they view as natural. Or in this case, what their former view of natural, has changed on due to the negative events of history. No matter the race. This proves that evermore, via a beautiful game universe. The hatred being directed toward magic in the Elder Scrolls universe nowadays from the commonfolk and any non mages. It's quite sad, that the good is never recognized, only the bad. And that a deity that wishes only for the good of mortals, suffers because of it.

If magic is fading it would provide a lore-friendly reason for why Skyrim’s magic system is so awful.

Hey are you guys still doing skyrim builds? I have a build I've been working on that I'm interested in sharing with you guys, if you're interested in trying it out. I couldn't find a way to message you here

8:41 Dragon break? Quantum physical aftershock, the force of quantum energy. Shaking through dimensions of spacetime fabric. To cause events to happen years later or into the past.

I disagree science and magic can be one, alchemy is the bridge in the gaps. I as a battlemage would know ive seen it, plus, who doesn't like a little frostbite benom in their skooma... woah.. moonsugar rush

It's kind of like how in real life, people stop being spiritual and more into materialism.

You guys should upload you’re videos to a podcast platform, keep up the great work.

What if in elder scrolls six u have to save magic by opening the eye of Magnus

Caught a massive whiff of pretentiousness and over exaggeration in the first two minutes of video

In The ElderScrolls Magic and faith IS science. IMHO

In elder scrolls 6 there will be even less magic because the way things are going there would only be alchemy

It's really interesting to me how magic fell out of favor after Dagon's attack, but in response to Molag Bal's planemeld, if anything, the Mages Guild got more well-reputed. It's all about how they responded to it, I suppose.

Literally my favorite RU-vid channel also being a mage is the best play through in Skyrim.

I hope that ES6 has a well rounded magic system but with lots of variety yet not completely overwhelming

Jullianos is my Aedra of choice. Skepticism and knowledge? Sign me up.

julianos is the history channel. hermaus mora is the history channel at 1 am.

Magic shall never fade, so long as there are those who wish to learn and teach. My Breton brethren and I shall uphold Julianos and his teachings as well as spreading our knowledge across Tamriel.

Hermaeus Mora is so awsome.

Magic is what makes fantasy worlds awesome. Stop killing off magic in your fantasy worlds

I guess an intersting possible theme for TES6 could be the resurgence of magic. Like, how inBethesda overhauled how power armor worked and introduced settlement building as new gimmicks for Fallout 4, maybe they could roll out a bunch of new magic-based mechanics for TES6 to get people excited, and they could of course make magic more pivotal to the central story of the game.

Thought the thumbnail was who wants to be millionaire related

yeah, the magic of these fucking games is fading...

Thing is, the reason for the Mages Guild's collapse was because Hannibal Traven decided to, in the name of "progress", stop "problematic" magical practices to avoid triggering the Muggles.

Hopefully in Elder scrolls 6 we can make magic favored again and or make the Gods like mages I guess idk. Does anyone think that lore wise the Dragonborn from elder scrolls 5 is actually one of the best fighters/mages because it's the only game where we can max out all trees?

Dang if magic goes then Tamriel could end up being just like our world, and I already know I wouldn’t enjoy that