The Four Horsemen: Hour 2 of 2 - Discussions with Richard Dawkins, Ep 1 

Was thinking this today. Hitchens was way ahead. Death awaits you and I. Only a short time to tell it like it is.

haha yep. A contrarian even amongst friends.

Your comments pack more punch without the lol. Have confidence in your words.

@@dudeeronomy3805 love to argue i think Christopher could not see at peace because riligion is faith in so many

he would then become a christian just to argue lmao

Two of of four now. Time takes its toll 😊 RU-vid is forever.

​@@TMK1450It fills me with dread to know that my personal favourite horseman, Dawkins, will likely be the next to pass.

watch the devil and father amorth trailer. That can keep you fascinated too that's the sort of thing christopher hitchens needed to box with when he was alive.

Many a night with a glass of whiskey, a cigar and the horsemen.

Same :)

Tearfully agreeing! 💜💜💜

2 years later. Not a whiskey, but bourbon and the 4 horsemen. Enjoying my evening.

Four legends, four horsemen of reason fighting against the evil and childish anachronisms of religion and God. RIP Hitch. Phil.

Lost yes, not forgotten by video. Stay Free

amen@@tinaa9231

HA!

IT'S BECAUSE HE HAS A LONG WHITE BEARD LIKE SANTA. HE LIKES THE FESTIVAL ASSOCIATED WITH SANTA BECAUSE HE SHARES A SINGLE COMMON PHYSICAL TRAIT WITH SANTA. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA *breathes* HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

alexander I would like to thank you for your contribution to the discourse. W*nker.

@@mikekane2492 Hi Mike, are you on drugs perhaps?

*LOL* The celebration of xmas is fun for most people.

i see you commenting within the armwrestling community a lot. i’m glad i could find you here as a fellow armwrestler and philosopher alike. i was also at the high five practice with devon lol. good day

his smoking belied his intellect and it killed him. A person that smart can read the label on the pack of cigarettes or other tobacco and deduce that 1) it [the tobacco warning] is a joke, 2) it is the truth. I suppose he either, 1) thought the danger was a joke, 2) too stupid to quit, 3) lived in a magical world where cancer only affects others 4) Straight-up addict, who happens to be intelligent, except in the realm of his self-preservation. I'm stupider than him. yet somehow I was able to quit the legal substances that are known killers, alcohol & tobacco.

And having ppl to argue with 😂

What makes you suggest he was a mere layperson without a title? He was an author, social commentator, polemicist, etc.. And to be fair, he wouldn't dare trespass into neuroscience or evolutionary biology beyond his limitations... perhaps philosophy. It's not like they just picked some random guy off the street.

@@Hexon66 lol the last sentence

not really. He just loved whiskey and drunk people tell the truth 🤣

Hardly a breath of fresh air as Christopher keeps stinking the joint up with his cigarettes.

Oh Glen, get over yourself. Yes, we all know cigs are bad for you. I'm sure Hitch did too. He was an adult choosing to live his life as he saw fit (and a great life it was).

I still use one of Hitchen's quotes as my assertion, from a debate or discussion with Tony Blair. "Once you assume a creator and a plan, it makes us objects in a cruel experiment whereby we are created sick and commanded to be well; I'll repeat that, created sick and then ordered to be well. And over us to supervise this is installed a celestial dictatorship, a kind of divine North Korea, greedy for uncritical praise from dawn until dusk and swift to punish the original sins which it so tenderly gifted us with in the first place. However, let no one say there is no cure; redemption is offered at the low price of the surrender of your critical faculties. "Religion" it might be said, must be said, would have to admit, makes extraordinary claims but, though I would claim that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, rather daringly provides not even normal evidence for its extraordinary supernatural claim. I am asking you is it good for our world to appeal to our credulity and not to our skepticism? Is it good for the world to worship a deity that takes sides in wars and in human affairs? To appeal to our fear and to our guilt, to our terror, our terror of death, is it good to appeal? To preach guilt and shame about the sexual act and the sexual relationship, is this good for the world? And asking yourself all the while, are these really religious responsibilities as I maintain they are? To terrify children with the image of hell and eternal punishment not just of themselves but of their parents and those they love? Perhaps worst of all to consider women an inferior creation, is that good for the world? And can you name me a religion that has not done that? And to insist that we are created and not evolved in the face of all the evidence? Religion forces nice people to do unkind things and also makes intelligent people do stupid things."

@@glennwashington5365 Four highly intelligent men having the deepest possible discussion - and the only thing you can comment on was a cigarette.

Tony England I could comment on the fact that Hitchens is now in hell and you will soon join him, Tony

Me too ... it's an absolute highlight .. and there is much to be learned from proper debate (conversation) rather than the childish point scoring and rubbish arguments to be found on social media .. But it suits our polico religious leaders that on the whole we've been manipulated into being dumb &*$£s

Why wouldn't they?

@@patrickkirby7612 If I were seated at the same table, I would be apprehensive about expressing disagreement, or receiving it, knowing their cumulative reputation. Each of these men has an astute command of the subject, the language, and debating skills, and therefore enough confidence to both disagree and more importantly, accept disagreement. More simply put, they regard disagreement as an instrument for progress, not rivalry.

I've never seen him back himself into a corner. No one could out debate him.

I see what you’re referring to. I think it’s incredibly refreshing to see someone refine their beliefs and answers to difficult questions in an organic conversation. I believe it was his hope his arguments would stimulate the same in religious discourse.

@@edwardrhea58 _"No one could out debate him."_ Well, that's not really fair. ..Selection bias, ya see.. Hitchens didn't debate what he didn't _actually_ believe in.

@@Dr.JustIsWrongwhy would he debate something he didn’t believe in?

@@willpolr _"why would he debate something he didn’t believe in?"_ I don't think he did.

watch the devil and father amorth trailer.

gurus? That is all about the Hindu religion!

Who are the 3, which one was missing

@@Rico-Suave_ George Carlin is missing Richard Dawkins, Daniel Dennett, and Christopher Hitchens

Nope.

Yes, and I say it as an anti-communist. He truly got what islam is all about and wasn't afraid to say it, which makes him the opposite of a islamophobe, if there ever was one who irrationally feared to be beheaded by religious zealots.

Not happy he's dead but I don't miss him and did not like him

@@zenodotusofathens2122 Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, at least you dont defame him so cant complain on that stance.

@@gerritkruger4014 Defame is only if you lie. There were misrepresentations in his book the Missionary Position. I believe Hitchens defamed Mother Teresa. Strange how you are a valiant warrior protecting the moral integrity of Hitchens while he wrote a rag of a defamatory book (without one footnote) attempting to demolish the reputation of Mother Teresa.

They've also influenced me a lot. And still do. I just rewatched the two hours. As I mature, I find myself getting more insights from rewatching the same videos and love it. Peace be upon you and godspeed 😊

such class!!!

Damn you are so right, I'm a nonsmoker so I didn't notice something so badass like that until you said it.

Sounds appalling! How did you every get comforted without an invisible friend that never talks to you? How did you get morals without being beaten into a soul-crushing, sobbing stupor several times a day? How did you ever feel safe and protected and loved without an all-powerful God lurking over your shoulder, watching every move you make, reading every thought you have, ready to instantly kill you for *_any_* perceived imperfection and throw you in an eternal fiery pool of red hot magma? How did you ever feel 'secure about the future' without a fundamental world view that this life is meaningless except as a test of hardship to be worthy of an unobtainable afterlife? How did you get a job with a Supreme Being giving it to you? /s

Lol 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Ha ha. He’s got a gray beard

Brilliant humour.

Lolol

I think I came about the same way. I always confuse dawkins with Darwin Hahah but thats irrelevent. Hitchens ..idk if its his voice..or his tempermatn ... Idk what it is that he just truly captivated me. It was my desire to find someone that did to me what he did- is how i came acrosd the others. Which i love the work of all of them . but hitchens had something else. Still cant identify it, and if be surprised if the othet 3 at that table didnt agtee with me that hitchens somehow had something extra to add

I think personally, I needed Dawkins brashness to really wake me out of my religious slumber.. so I suppose the differing methods are useful for differing believers.

@@JT29501 I came across him after I began doubting. I had always ONLY read/listened to believers refutation of science but once I realized their bias I began listening to these others. While Dawkins harshness was a little much at first, and I can still see how it would be ineffective to convince a believer...as someone already doubting his razor sharp analysis did help me

I'm glad you have all come over to the dark side lol sorry poor joke.. But honestly the beauty of all that we see we can appreciate because of are understanding through science. All the best to you all for the future 👍

I made the switch after reading Harris's books. I had always sensed bullshit in Christianity but it's hard to explore that when the mere mention of doubt is seen as a character flaw. You're not alone, keep learning.

same

I used to love this interview until I had a supernatural encounter with Jesus

​@@Hannah11235No you didn't.

I would need prostitutes and spirits for my party

watch the devil and father amorth trailer.

@@terrytibbs5678 That is because you are a pleb.

Bruh Hitchens was so drunk in the by the mid of 1 hour and in last omg

Why ISLAM??? For a religion or any ideology to be true it must be 1.Mathematically consistent 2. Scientifically consistent 3. Philosophically consistent Therefore consistently accurate ((Truth)) 1. How is Islam mathematically consistent? Answer: The fundamental belief in Islam is ((The ONENESS ☝️ of Allaahh) Mathematically that is 1=1 1 is 1 Not 3 like Trinity (1=3) Or Atheism (1=0) Or other ideologies (1=X) Or Satanism (0=1) Therefore only Islam is mathematically consistent ☑️ 2. How is Islam scientifically consistent? Answer: Quran talks about many Scientific Facts e.g Embryology, Big Bang, quarks, photons etc... But mainly it talks about an ancient house(structure) Known as The kaba and Allaahh commands the Muslims to orbit around it ((( وليطوفوا بالبيت العتيق )))22:29 Atomic structure=Kaba NEUTRON = kaba ELECTRON=people orbiting for purification from negativity(sins) PROTONS= people in prostration facing it Mentioned in a Hadith(narration) of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon Him: A person is closest to Allaahh in the state of Sajidah(prostration) Thefore in complete positive MoDE(proton effect) And so scientifically consistent throughout history from generation to generation till today Muslims perform Hajj. 3.How is it philosophically consistent?? Answer: Science and philosophy or any other ideology Fails to answer The Question (How can something some from Nothing???) a scientific impossibility The fundamental CREED taught by all the Prophets Adam, Noah, Abraham,Moses, Jesus and Muhammad (peace be upon them All) was لا اله الا الله There is No GOD (worthy of worship) except Allaahh -translation) PROPHET Muhammad peace be upon Him said who ever testifies his faith in this he Will enter the Heaven (To the effect) Now Word for Word In Depth Analysis لا=Nothing(both are negations) اله=(who’s partnership is Impossible Therefore worthy of worship) الا=Except الله=Allaahh “Nothing is impossible except for Allaahh having a partner” So.. Anything is possible for Allaahh ((والله علي كل شئ قدير) This is the answer to the scientific impossibility Further ANALYSIS.. “Nothing” is either 1. Impossible 2. Misplacement of something 3. A value of something (0) If 2.(misplacement of something then it could be anything especially 💀 DEATH Except Allaahh) Because If Death was in it’s place we would all be dead (Everything would seize to exist) 0 multiplied by anything =0 But Death is an inevitable REALITY (Can’t be NOTHING) & Since Allaahh is (The Infinitely INDEPENDENT (((1))) He is above and beyond Time, Space And MaTTER 1/0 is impossible (check your calculator) Result will always be 1 (Infinitely (undefined independent 1) Now if 3. (Value of something) It is The DEVIL 👿 SataN was rejected by Allaahh So has NO value or worth (👁‍🗨)zero Since everything has a common denominator of 1 Satan is also a being that exists 0/1=0 Therefore Satan can’t Be Nothing rather is something. Who is worth nothing.(mathematically 0) and it serves a Purpose therefore exists. So we can conclude with confidence that without the 1 everything is 0 but with the 1 nothing is 0. And since everything exists therefore the existence of nothing is impossible.

Thanks for clarifying the Atheistic position further The left brain 🧠 vs the right 🧠 brain The debate will never be resolved since The fundamental premise of Atheism is (1=0) So it seems that Peterson Was left brain(1) and Harris(0) Since they couldn’t agree completely so Not (=) That’s true mathematically (1=/=0) Now at one point in the debate even Harris said “that I can even accept that” on God Thefore only once for a few seconds they both become fully rational (1=1) I feel sorry for Jordan he had to try so hard to make it happen(Respect him for that) He sure is an open minded guy who can pull you out of your Extreme point of views (In this case Harris’s denial of God) Why Jordan is 1 in(1=0) Jordan 1:27:00(Reading ) “God is how we imaginitivly And collectively represent the existence and actions of conscienceness across time” “As the most real aspects of existence manifest themselves across the longest of time frames but are not necessarily apprehensable like as objects as in here and now.” (His explanation) “What that means in some sense is that you have conceptions of reality built into your biological and metaphysical structures that are a consequence of evolution that occurred over unbelievably vast expanses of time. And they structure your perception of reality in ways that, it wouldn’t be structured if you’d only lived the amount of time you are going to live. And that is also part of the problem for deriving values from facts because your evencient and you can’t derive the right value from the facts that portray themselves to you in your life span. Which is why you have a biological structure which is like 3.5 billion years old. -god is that which eternally dies and is reborn in the persuit of higher being and truth. That’s a fundamental element of hero mythology. -god is the higher value in the hierarchy of value (That’s another way of looking at it) -god is what calls and responds to the eternal call to adventure -god is the voice of conscience -God is the source of judgement and mercy and guilt -God is the future to which we make sacrifices. into the trancedental repository of reputation. Here is a cool one if you’re an evolutionary biologist -god is that which selects among men in the eternal hierarchy of men (So you know men arrange themselves into hierarchy and men rise in the hierarchy, there are principles that are important that determine the probability of their rise and those principles aren’t Tyrannical/ Power they are something like the ability to articulate truth and the ability to be competent and ability to make appropriate moral judgements and if you can do that in a given situation then all the other men will vote you up the hierarchy so to speak and that will radically increase your reproductive fitness And the operation of that process in the long expanses of time looks to me like it’s codefied in something like the notion of The God the Father. It’s also the same thing that makes men attractive to women because women peel of the top of the male hierarchy and the question is what should be at the top of the hierarchy??? The answer right now is tyranny as part of the patriarchy but the answer is something more like the ability to use truthful speech in the service of let’s say “well being” So that operates across tremendous expansions of time and it plays a role in selection for survival itself and it makes it a fundamental reality.” 1:48:08 Sam Harris (where he also admitted (1) therfore they agreed (1=1) even though only for a second then back to (1=0) “To call that thing god, fine that’s the god I have no problem with but that’s not how most people most of the time are using the word “G-O-D”

Sam is the closest we currently have to a successor for the other three

@@mohsinakhtar7876 No need for "evidence" ;). I prefer hell over worshipping a indescribable personality ... even Hitler + Mussolini couldn't beat the level of his brutally "creativeness". history should not repeat itself. thank you my friend for your enlightenment effort.

@@mohsinakhtar7876 Thank you for this illustration of confusion. Please note that numbers cannot be "equated" to anything other than other numbers. To suggest a meaningful link between numbers and mind states ( eg, belief systems ) is to make a fundamental error of characterisation. We can use numbers as metaphor for mind states but this step opens the door to " interpretation "..... and I fail to make sense of your interpretation.

You and I are still early to other parties that are going on right now! Science, philosophy, even art and music are always coming up with new things and ideas to experiment and reminisce about, not to say they will be nearly as good as this . similarly how thinking of things I used to experience in childhood will always feel better than how it is now. " The grass is always greener than where you stand right now". I kind of rambled on for too long ;) but I hope to have made your day better stranger.

@@relentless5275 thank you kind person!

Lolololol

Sad ... I dread the day I see of Richard's demise .. I've read so many of his books and seen so much of his teaching amazing man .. and as for Hitch .. well ... :-( So sad he's gone .. what a giant among men

I wish atheists would update this conversation, with more women involved.

@Benjamin Park black :)

‘Johnny Walker Black...breakfast of champions, accept no substitutes’

I clicked on hour 2 (midway through hour 1) just to make sure.

Agreed. I feel peace knowing that people are leaving the church in droves (20% in the past 30 years) and the numbers continue to increase.

I’m not sure why it is sad to think of these four as free thinkers. That is high compliment. Mainstays are the tooth ferry according to you. Who is teaching your kids about the tooth ferry beyond you or some random commercial or some television program u are allowing ur fam to be indoctrinated with? The magic of the tooth ferry isn’t so large as the santa clause, where u have to live in an igloo in the north pole to maybe assuage ur children against myth, tall tales, a slightly more giving spirit, jingle bell songs and lesser bullshitty c-mas songs, ya know, the season finale of our capitalistic greed. Or maybe, it’s the little baby jesus in a manger u take issue w/...a harlmess situation u have had 20+ years to figure out, like the tooth ferry...to come up with some way as to prepare this next generation with some defenses...against babies and ferries. Of course they have have all kinds if different names for all the different kinds of snow, ya know, the igloo people, which is kinda sad, all that free thinking about the different snowy types. These four should not be questioned. The tooth ferry? Yes. Jeez. Did u get demoted from preschool, and have to repeat day care for that kinda indoctrination? What was ur initial reaction when u realized u couldn’t make money off ur wisdom teeth? What happened next? Let me guess, independence day became less about freedom and more about wars u didn’t know anything about, and still don’t. Cryminie!

Fds I wish all this 4 men in this video would've met annelise michel in germany in 1976 that would the greatest thing ever.

@@jmags2586 Just because people leave church does't mean they leave jesus christ.

@@jmags2586 Google The 6 voices of annelise michel. Listen to the 6 voices of annelise michel. Google the translation of annelise michel. Listen to the translation of annelise michel.

Thanks for clarifying the Atheistic position further The left brain 🧠 vs the right 🧠 brain The debate will never be resolved since The fundamental premise of Atheism is (1=0) So it seems that Peterson Was left brain(1) and Harris(0) Since they couldn’t agree completely so Not (=) That’s true mathematically (1=/=0) Now at one point in the debate even Harris said “that I can even accept that” on God Thefore only once for a few seconds they both become fully rational (1=1) I feel sorry for Jordan he had to try so hard to make it happen(Respect him for that) He sure is an open minded guy who can pull you out of your Extreme point of views (In this case Harris’s denial of God) Why Jordan is 1 in(1=0) Jordan 1:27:00(Reading ) “God is how we imaginitivly And collectively represent the existence and actions of conscienceness across time” “As the most real aspects of existence manifest themselves across the longest of time frames but are not necessarily apprehensable like as objects as in here and now.” (His explanation) “What that means in some sense is that you have conceptions of reality built into your biological and metaphysical structures that are a consequence of evolution that occurred over unbelievably vast expanses of time. And they structure your perception of reality in ways that, it wouldn’t be structured if you’d only lived the amount of time you are going to live. And that is also part of the problem for deriving values from facts because your evencient and you can’t derive the right value from the facts that portray themselves to you in your life span. Which is why you have a biological structure which is like 3.5 billion years old. -god is that which eternally dies and is reborn in the persuit of higher being and truth. That’s a fundamental element of hero mythology. -god is the higher value in the hierarchy of value (That’s another way of looking at it) -god is what calls and responds to the eternal call to adventure -god is the voice of conscience -God is the source of judgement and mercy and guilt -God is the future to which we make sacrifices. into the trancedental repository of reputation. Here is a cool one if you’re an evolutionary biologist -god is that which selects among men in the eternal hierarchy of men (So you know men arrange themselves into hierarchy and men rise in the hierarchy, there are principles that are important that determine the probability of their rise and those principles aren’t Tyrannical/ Power they are something like the ability to articulate truth and the ability to be competent and ability to make appropriate moral judgements and if you can do that in a given situation then all the other men will vote you up the hierarchy so to speak and that will radically increase your reproductive fitness And the operation of that process in the long expanses of time looks to me like it’s codefied in something like the notion of The God the Father. It’s also the same thing that makes men attractive to women because women peel of the top of the male hierarchy and the question is what should be at the top of the hierarchy??? The answer right now is tyranny as part of the patriarchy but the answer is something more like the ability to use truthful speech in the service of let’s say “well being” So that operates across tremendous expansions of time and it plays a role in selection for survival itself and it makes it a fundamental reality.” 1:48:08 Sam Harris (where he also admitted (1) therfore they agreed (1=1) even though only for a second then back to (1=0) “To call that thing god, fine that’s the god I have no problem with but that’s not how most people most of the time are using the word “G-O-D”

Why ISLAM??? For a religion or any ideology to be true it must be 1.Mathematically consistent 2. Scientifically consistent 3. Philosophically consistent Therefore consistently accurate ((Truth)) 1. How is Islam mathematically consistent? Answer: The fundamental belief in Islam is ((The ONENESS ☝️ of Allaahh) Mathematically that is 1=1 1 is 1 Not 3 like Trinity (1=3) Or Atheism (1=0) Or other ideologies (1=X) Or Satanism (0=1) Therefore only Islam is mathematically consistent ☑️ 2. How is Islam scientifically consistent? Answer: Quran talks about many Scientific Facts e.g Embryology, Big Bang, quarks, photons etc... But mainly it talks about an ancient house(structure) Known as The kaba and Allaahh commands the Muslims to orbit around it ((( وليطوفوا بالبيت العتيق )))22:29 Atomic structure=Kaba NEUTRON = kaba ELECTRON=people orbiting for purification from negativity(sins) PROTONS= people in prostration facing it Mentioned in a Hadith(narration) of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon Him: A person is closest to Allaahh in the state of Sajidah(prostration) Thefore in complete positive MoDE(proton effect) And so scientifically consistent throughout history from generation to generation till today Muslims perform Hajj. 3.How is it philosophically consistent?? Answer: Science and philosophy or any other ideology Fails to answer The Question (How can something some from Nothing???) a scientific impossibility The fundamental CREED taught by all the Prophets Adam, Noah, Abraham,Moses, Jesus and Muhammad (peace be upon them All) was لا اله الا الله There is No GOD (worthy of worship) except Allaahh -translation) PROPHET Muhammad peace be upon Him said who ever testifies his faith in this he Will enter the Heaven (To the effect) Now Word for Word In Depth Analysis لا=Nothing(both are negations) اله=(who’s partnership is Impossible Therefore worthy of worship) الا=Except الله=Allaahh “Nothing is impossible except for Allaahh having a partner” So.. Anything is possible for Allaahh ((والله علي كل شئ قدير) This is the answer to the scientific impossibility Further ANALYSIS.. “Nothing” is either 1. Impossible 2. Misplacement of something 3. A value of something (0) If 2.(misplacement of something then it could be anything especially 💀 DEATH Except Allaahh) Because If Death was in it’s place we would all be dead (Everything would seize to exist) 0 multiplied by anything =0 But Death is an inevitable REALITY (Can’t be NOTHING) & Since Allaahh is (The Infinitely INDEPENDENT (((1))) He is above and beyond Time, Space And MaTTER 1/0 is impossible (check your calculator) Result will always be 1 (Infinitely (undefined independent 1) Now if 3. (Value of something) It is The DEVIL 👿 SataN was rejected by Allaahh So has NO value or worth (👁‍🗨)zero Since everything has a common denominator of 1 Satan is also a being that exists 0/1=0 Therefore Satan can’t Be Nothing rather is something. Who is worth nothing.(mathematically 0) and it serves a Purpose therefore exists. So we can conclude with confidence that without the 1 everything is 0 but with the 1 nothing is 0. And since everything exists therefore the existence of nothing is impossible.

@@mohsinakhtar7876 so much bullshit in a single comment. Truly fascinating!

@@mohsinakhtar7876 did you really go through the trouble of creating a bot to post this shit all over youtube or do you go yourself to each and every one of those videos posting it? jeez, the idleness. go pray to Allah to get your virgins or something.

@@mohsinakhtar7876 I don't care about your stupid argument, because it already starts with a false premise "The fundamental premise of Atheism is (1=0)". And even if that premise were somehow true, you'd still have to prove the existence of 1.

That’s one of the first things I noticed. Ever the contrarian! 😂

Yeah, I wish Dawkins had talked a little more. We know what Dannett thinks already

And how Hitchens gets more and more pissed

U DA MAN

u the men

Was trying to find an argument and you made it a lot easier, thank you

Thank you for your service good man

You are the person

We all missed an opportunity to force these four gentleman to run planet Earth.

also For truly great human beings!

Me too, with a scotch on the side. This was brilliant. Sorry it took so long to find it.

Dawkins is the closest to God status 🙌🏾

9 years too late. Interesting thought. I play drums for a church occasionally and am a Dawkins/Harris style Atheist. I enjoy music and the occasional sermon as well but the music enjoyed is the secular sounds of the band/orchestra and most certainly not the ridiculous lyrics. The best sermons are the same, life lessons, poetically done, thoughts to think about. None of this though requires the belief in specific gods or even a god. If a God must be believed then there is nooo reason whatsoever that it should be any of the three big God religions, these have dangerous little tidbits that could be interpreted. Of course there is nothing wrong with attending church but prescribing to the notions is a dangerous game IMO

My pleasure. :)

Brilliant, that was my most outrageous laugh of today... Thank you.

You're very welcome - glad to be of service. :)

It really is so very enjoyable to hear such clear truths uttered in such calm intellectual ways. This is something very rare in our times. And I take particular enjoyment in Hitchen's refined use of language.

Hitch is dead. Sam isn't. I wish they'd been burning one, passing it around the table. That would have been interesting. Alcohol is toxic (root of "intoxicated." It's only medicinal purpose is sterilizing wounds & instruments. Whereas, the human body (and canine, other animals) evolved a cannabinoid system to take up the compounds found in cannabis. I didn't think there was anything great about Hitch slugging whisky and smoking cigs (who extremely unhealthy habits). Taking years off his life.

Www as sacral and profund area? Is it really what satisfies you enough? I don't know whether to laugh or cry if it is really the only place left for human spirit...

***** Not the whole thing... just parts of it e.g. the wiki, and many other knowledge resources. Not to mention, yes, talking about things like philosophy and even, in this case, atheism.

Kon Berner it is all wonderful but modern society rather needs something like real temple, which combined sacred space, word, artistic experience and feeling of unity- i don't see any analogy with www which is a mixture of atomized content, the nobility, intelligence, entertainment, time consuming mockery and highest possible stupidity-not to mention anonymous nonreality, lack of responsibility, lack of real meetings etc... the library maybe would match this analogy better, but given that there were some kind of "masters", real teachers, who we need today more than ever

***** I really do hear you, but ultimately, I think this is a matter of taste. When I walked into that bookstore every week, it was a powerful spiritual experience for me... that is uplifting, inspiring, and having that sense of awe and wonder that is indeed so wonderful and kept me going through the week. You may not believe I feel the same about e.g. wiki, but I really do. I totally agree with you that this will *not* work for everyone, but I'm that sort who finds well structured information to be... well, "holy" for lack of a better term. All that said, if I had a center for Einsteinian "religion" down the street from me, you bet I'd pop in on occasion.

On Sundays I used to go to The Church of the CleveLand Browns until it got corrupted

And fuck Christmas trees! Wasteful ass mfrs!

Tal Moore 1=0(Atheism) 1=3(Christianity) 1=X(others) 0=1(satanism/Hypocrisy) You can try all you want and be as skeptic as you wish I’m sure that one of them in his grave is sure by now That (1=1)Islam

Typical of a theist to arbitrarily apply values to things, and present simplified explanations for everything. Don't you realize that it is because you cannot prove God = anything or even exists you are like a dog chasing its tale? There is no room for make-believe in an room full of serious thinkers.

@@mohsinakhtar7876 not a particular compelling metaphor or valid argument. Let me put this in terms that are less accurate but easier for you to understand. You=idiot

@@garethbaus5471 lmao 😂

@@garethbaus5471 I was expecting you to go all in. And you did 😂👍

The latter does not require any true knowledge. The majority of people do not want to engage in anything which requires effort, rather they want simple things that create the impression of being enlightened (as well as other instant gratification), and so because more people will want these superstitious rocks, they will make more money, so the shops will sell them.

I’m a rockhound myself, I used to sell rocks, minerals and fossils on market stalls. It took all my reserve to control my verbal filter whilst new agers spent up to an hour concentrating with their palms suspended over a tray of crystals. 9 times out of 10 they were drawn to silica dioxide probably because it’s shiny. When asked the esoteric properties of each I handed them the “Crystal Bible” which I always kept on hand, let’s face it a sale is a sale.

@@dorothymelia2569 Oh man, I couldn't imagine being subjected to that for work. But I too buy things because they are shiny. Monkey like shiny. And not to be pedantic but just in case you didn't know. The word 'silica' is already a reference to the oxide. It would be 'silica' or alternatively 'silicon dioxide'. It's the same convention as in 'alumina' ie corrundum.

There's also a martini glass in the mix. Probably the good stuff.