The Holy Grail of Load Development 

If you are wanting to learn about load density, you can learn this from our 1 on 1 course, not the beginners course. We’ve had a few people get confused about this.

I am a retired deerstalker. I handloaded for many years, always chasing better accuracy. I eventually decided that constantly testing loads was wearing out my expensive custom barrels. I did not need to shoot better than a half inch at 100 yards, and was never going to headshoot a deer further than 200 yards. For me, consistency was more important than velocity. This is just an observation from an old fart, not intended to be a criticism of someone much smarter than me. I'm just saying that you don't need shoot the nadgers off a gnat accuracy for hunting. Use fieldcraft to get closer, so if there's a problem you can resolve it. Good luck and good shooting to all shooting folk out there.

This is reloading 101, and I've been doing it for years. It's why Black Powder in big bore straightwall cases yields much more consistent results than smokeless, because of the high load density. I always choose a powder that gives me the most amount of case fill for a reason. Keeps you from constantly chasing your tail.

I started handloading 40 years ago and developed some very accurate handloads for .270 Winchester, .284 Winchester, .303 British, 7.65X53, 6.5X55, and .308 Winchester among others. All the loads I worked up were for hunting or milsurp rifles none of which could be misconstrued as target rifles. I did all that without knowing a thing about velocity nodes, barrel harmonics, shooting ladders, or which G model to use in calculating the BC of a bullet. What we knew back then was just about any rifle will shoot 1 to 1 1/2 MOA with a quality bullet, a full case of an appropriate powder (load density although we didn't call it that back then), and good shooting habits. The loading manuals had tables of MRT's in the back and we chose one appropriate to the area we would be hunting. I usually sighted my hunting rifles for two hundred yards which was virtually point blank range for any large game animal out to 400 yards. Later on, when I got into shooting milsurps accuracy was still important, of course but even more so was reproducing the same load as the military ammunition so you could use the original iron sights. Take the .303 British for example which I shoot in competitions. The MkVII service round developed 2,440 fps with a 174 gr. flat based spitzer bullet which is what I attempt to reproduce to stay in the iron sights classes.

Outstanding information!! Thank you for sharing this with others!! This concept should not be new to people but they like to chase their tail and go around in circles over and over trying to reinvent the wheel. Outstanding information!

This method has gotten me the closest to my final load, much quicker than all the other methods.. Its worked wonderfully for subsonic and supersonic loads. Its funny, whats old is new again.. ;D

I've done so many different kinds of load development in 12 years of reloading and a class with Reloading All Day was literally like pushing the easy button. I'm able to pick a load and run it now. Highly recommend signing up and learn. Your wallet will thank you.

Anyone that knows anything about statistics realizes that the sample size is the most important thing there is.

The urge to splurge is so strong. I’m not a comp shooter, but a hunter. I want to achieve the most confidence in my loads that any given time afield I will yield the same consistency. That being said, I have worked up a load and tested the charge and the depth on different occasions but not since temps have fallen below 65°. I will run 2 more 5 shot groups and if my ES/SD falls short, I do believe I’ll be signing up because I definitely don’t want to go chasing my tail again

I'm in the middle of deciding how I want to start load development for a new combo of powder and bullet so I've been exploring RU-vid University for different takes on it which is how I found the video. Your info does make a good amount of sense. From information I've picked up on other channels such as Bolt Action Reloading, when he's looking for nodes, he seems to favor those that have 3 shots in that node landing somewhere in the middle. Seems that would help account for those temp changes that can fluctuate your velocities. Having said that, I've taken much more your approach to reloading in the past when components have been hard to find and haven't been disappointed. Glad to know there's an actual reason it worked out for me. ha

Good stuff . I agree 100 % . Burn rate and case fill works .

It would be easy to fill a case with slow powder (too slow) and have garbage results. I agree that looking for a node in the traditional method is like a dog chasing his tail, but load density is no more a holy grail than "finding a node" is. The real key is efficient combustion. It is kind of like fine tuning a race car engine.

Great information Blake!

Now if you could just let us know how to obtain the preferred powders it might be worth looking into. But right now I have to make what's available and close to the perfect powder work.

Winning in the wind just came out with a velocity node doesn't work video too. However, his take on achieving SD isn't the same. Love the video btw.

I'd like an explanation why many custom rifle builders are offering and demonstrating 1/2" MOA group to 1000 yards using "quality factory ammunition." I've been handloading since the 80s and have used numerous methods to get groups to my satisfaction using custom riflles. In my experience, handloading rendered superior results. I know it's a change of topic but falls under the umbrella of good shooting. Thanks

Litz research into case fill percentage clearly showed that low SD can be achieved with low case fill percentage. Indeed the lowest SD in his testing was at 80% case fill. There are no shortcuts to load development.

Thank you.

Ok I'm a believer in what you have presented... I also noted that the ES of all three data groups only varied from 34-40 fps. So is Chris Long's "Optimal Barrel Time" a real thing or not? Thanks for sharing your knowledge... So smart & so young --- I'm impressed

I chased my tail a LOT until i learned this.

What powder are you running for your GT? Due to siz of grains of powder itself, I've noticed something like staball 6.5 when filled to around 90% or so case capacity yielded the best results in my efforts.

THANK YOU for pointing out the faulting reasoning behind the velocity node crap (and more generally the absolute garbage reasoning that most reloading sources pander). That said, your example data is kinda extreme... it should jump out to everyone that the two groups of velocities are themselves quite spread out (es of 125fps on the left and 85 on the right). BUT that's not unrealistic and your point stands -- folks often just look at the averages to find a "flat spot" and forget that, in this case for example, you'd need ~350 shots in each group to confidently measure a 10fps difference in averages. The application of statistical reasoning in the reloading world is frightful.

Trying to make gunpowder weapons shoot like lasers. Chasing the one hole group. The struggle is real. However unless you're trying to win competitions, or guarantee first shot bullseyes on targets a mile away, half MOA is perfectly fine for most people under most circumstances. Anything tighter than that you're splitting hairs and the juice may not be worth the squeeze.

Velocity nodes are a thing, but not necessarily the way some think of it. Usually in competitive discipline circles where everyone is shooting a similar profile barrel, same weight bullets, same brass, powder, etc. people find a load for them that works around "Speed X". So when you take the same components to work up something for your rifle, many people find their load shoots very close to the other guys setup at "Speed X". I used known velocity nodes for my 1st Fclass setup and had a working and now proven load within 4 different powder weights and a couple of sessions at the range. It has now proved itself in competition as well. I was literally right in the middle of what was stated to be the velocity node for my setup. i.e. A 6.5 CM will shoot 140gr. bullets well around 2700fps with H-4350 out of a 22" barrel. That is a known "velocity node" for that caliber, tell me that's not true.

I wish more fclass shooters would watch these reloading videos. What's your best guess on how much ADI 2208 ( you know it as varget) should I put behind a Berger 210vld in a 308 palma case. I've got 0.308" of freebore to play with at the front end so I don'tneed much pill in the neck. And how much in a standard LR winnie case. Love and kisses from Oz

Question: What is a proper sample size?

Makes sense

Does your load density theory work with 45 Colt? Only thing I have found so far is to use a little bit of toilet paper to keep the powder at the primer. This is because of the volume of the case is so large that no smokeless powder could fill the space and still get the job done right (so they say). And being this is the only round I ever expect to hand load I would hate to spend $100 on info that will never benefit me. I already have all the tools and bullets I will be using so I see no need for the beginning coarse. I only need to know if a smokeless powder could be used to fill the case volume of a 45 Colt and work right. I'll be using the Lehigh 250 grain solid copper Xtreme Penetrator bullets in Star line brass with CCI large pistol primers, being I already have them. As far as watching for signs of pressure there is no need, being if there was any over pressure signs they would be laying all over the place along with parts of the pistol. After all the 45 Colt has a straight walled case that can handle 44 Magnum pressures as well as the primers. So the gun blowing up in my face would be the first sign of over pressure as far as I can see. I know a guy that says he knows a guy that pics the powder according to the burn rate and then works up a non-published load from there, but every body else says never ever do so unless you have pressure testing equipment. And as far as I know there is no published load data for slow burning powders for the 45 Colt, so without knowing what you know, is it really possible to find a powder that would fill the case volume of a 45 Colt and work out? or not? Cause if not I would rather spend my money on toilet paper to solve the issue than blow it on none relevant information.

Where do you teach reloading?

While I do not contest the veracity of this content (personal experience tends to support it), it seems to me that what happens at the target trumps SD. I have had many 10 shot strings yield a sub 10 fps SD but they grouped terribly….and some with “unacceptable” SDs that grouped great. I will concede that a sample size of 10 is not large, but my experience is that poor groups do not get better after more shots (and, yes, good groups generally get larger). So doesn’t it make more sense to adopt your approach but to make load selection based on what the target says instead of SD? Doesn’t target consistency trump all?

QUESTION... You say don't use Quickload to determine load density. Is it not accurate?

Why I’m I 60 years old and hearing this for the first time?

Is a velocity node even a thing...if flat spots don't exist? Makes it sound like, after powder issue, load Dev seems to be just seating depth?

I have a couple of hoppers that always have the same powders, mostly CFE pistol and CFE black. My reloading room is conditioned all year round. So I stopped reloading for 6 months and now back at it. What are your thoughts on using the powder in the hoppers after prolonged storage in hopper?

Interesting you Load Density topic. I am guessing that your referring mainly to pistol loading? It's rare that a rifle case would ever be less that 90% full to the base of the projectile. What say yee?

So if you cant trust load density information on something like GRT are you saying to just buy every possible powder and see which one fills the case the best? This isn't a sarcastic question or anything like that I truly want to know how to pick a powder that will give me a good SD/ES.

Are velocity nodes real? Why would they occur?

more of a SMP guy myself.....😅😅😅

There is no flat spot. Hornadys podcast on sample size showed this. Sample size is too small. You need 20rnds each to get reliable data.

Velocity nodes aren't real

Loads developed naturally over time, and there are pills that can increase density, velocity, and even volume. It's all about a healthy diet and...... wait.... sorry I misunderstood the topic.

Ok you said you were ready for the roast. Your links to your paid lessons don't work. Boom. Roasted.

So just fill the case all the way????

I was a young kid back in 1975 when my dad taught me how to reload. He was forever chasing new loads without any real plan or methodology. The information available was minimal at best. It did not help that his main reason to reload was to save money. I have heard a lot of different theories over the past 49 years and I have learned that internal and external ballistics are... well complicated. One needs to be careful in stating absolutes as there are so many variables. In general the information you have given is old time and good. Fill the case and minimize the variability. One grain variation on a 70 grain charge is 1.4 % of a load. 1 grain on a 40 grain charge is 2.5%. Powder charges depend on weight and not volume. Powder can expand and contract with different levels of moisture or humidity. So it is important to try to load in a stable / consistent environment. Very low charges can be dangerous for the very reason you showed where the powder from a low load slides to the front of the cartridge a much larger surface area of the charge is exposed to the flash of the primer. All the powder burns from the side all at once instead of a controlled burn from the back of the powder column. This ties into your recommendations of a full cartridge as the burn rate of a full cartridge is consistent from the bottom up. A low volume charge can have variable surface areas of exposed powder and burn rates and pressure can vary accordingly. Neck pressure can vary and cases with variable neck tensions can cause different bullet release pressures. The Lee load manual and other sources comment on how a crimp can standardize bullet release pressures and may lead to better accuracy. Finally, no bullet is perfect and all will cause the barrel to wobble / create harmonics. The speed and weight of the bullet will cause the harmonics or vibrations to change like a finger on a guitar string. So there are harmonics and thus there are nodes. The trick is to pick the right spot on the harmonic cycle. Think shooting a swinging bottle at the end of a string. The apparent movement of the bottle is at the slowest and actually stops at the moment of direction reversal on the far left and right of the swing. Choosing a load in the middle of this barrel swing will allow for the greatest absorption of other variables (think hot / cold, elevation and humidity) without affecting the the zero of your group. As a hunter this is what I am after. I could care less if after 3 fouler shots and a number of other shots, I can finally hit a plate out at 700 yards. I want a gun that can fire a round that can then do its job on the first shot. So, you may know all of what I have stated, just be careful that you do not oversimplify. What I have learned over the years is this. 1. Identify what you want to accomplish. Is it realistic and doable? For deer hunting, I use two guns, a Marlin 1895 45-70 that is capable of 0.75 moa with a 300 grain hollow point. I use it inside of 200 yards. It is zeroed for 75 yards has a 1x4 powered scope with a lighted dot. It handles like a shotgun with an Aimpoint. Both eyes open and on target instantly. The 300 grain hollow point will cut through grass and some twigs without excessive deflection. But it has accuracy to shoot through the gaps and inside of 100 yards and the trajectory is flat. For the fields and open areas, I have a 300 win mag with a Bartelin barrel with a Vortex Strike Eagle 5x25 second focal plane scope. It shoots 168 grain Barnes TTSX bullets at 3200 fps with a 0.375 moa grouping. That is a good round out to my 400 yard limit. My point here is that I do not believe that there is such a thing as the perfect one gun solution. As someone wiser than me once said, Better imperfectly done that left imperfectly undone. So strive for perfection but don't let perfection mess you up. Also, there are not perfect solutions, only tradeoffs. Work to get the best tradeoff you can that works for you.

SD is 8.1 but shots 89-90 was 16

Hi there Reloadingallday, I have a burning question that I hope you can help me with. I'm from oversees and the shooting sport over here is totally different that with you guys. Let alone reloading. We have a few ranges all set distances so there is no way we can practice working with our scope. Setting it is a one time thing. As is reloading. When a load is good it's good and never to be toughed again. I'm fairly new in the art of reloading and have a lot of questions but 'nobody' has answers because of the above. "When it's good it's good, so why bother ... why analyse, why question, why think about it any further" seems to be the mentality around here. So maybe you can help me out I hope. I chronographed my load at the barrel : 6.5 creedmoor Hornady Match 140 gr N150 34 gr Vihtavuori Barrel length 24" Twist 1:8 The outcome was after 30 shots: Hi 2568 Low 2531 ES 37 SD 8 So far so good you'd say but now comes the kicker...I really have no idea what these numbers are telling me😂 I tried to find out but there are no references I can find or people who can help me out with that. Is there a simple way you perhaps (or anybody from your subscribers) can explain these numbers and how to put them to work for a better load? I truly hope you can. All the best, John

I want to see you go dick to dick with Primal Rights. Similar styles and delivery. Love it man

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