Me, a Royals fan: "oh boy a KC team finally made it onto Urinating Tree, I hope its good!" Urinating Tree: "you cant really make fun of this team because they cant compete with larger market teams" Me: "oh no....the worst insult of all.....crushing reality" *cries in the corner*
Well to be fair before that happened it literally WAS almost 30 years before they had last made the World Series....so you aren't wrong in thinking like that
I will always support cities like STL, Kansas City, Cleveland, Buffalo, etc when it comes to sports. Even though they get less attention than the biggest cities, they have incredibly dedicated and great fan bases, and all of these cities truly deserve the teams they have plus more honestly
RobbyBurrito this is true, but that is definitely a trend for baseball in general. Most teams can’t fill the stadium in general unless they’re the Yankees, Cardinals, dodgers, cubs, etc.
It doesn’t help that many people were predicting that the Cubs were gonna win the WS; thanks to Back to the Future. All that’s remembered is the Mets ruining that prediction.
Right now, Kansas City sports fans are spoiled by having the Chiefs (with a British actor who played a comic book superhero among them). Try being a fan of most Ohio sports teams.
"There are rich teams and there are poor teams. Then there's fifty feet of crap, and then there's us. It's an unfair game." I love that scene from Moneyball. Also, I believe that a hard salary cap is the only real way to remedy this. But, as you said Tree, the players would never consent to it.
nope..MLB players would never allow it nor would any of the top spending teams...imagine tell LA or NY they have to dump half their team in order to meet the cap requirements....
@@georgeprchal3924 agreed. Dont blame your market size blame your ownership. In a day and age where you can stream games anywhere your market can be as big as you want it to be if you are willing to invest in your team and lets face it most small market clubs dont care to invest more than they have to despite the long term benifits
@@georgeprchal3924 these low spending teams probably wouldnt be so cheap if revenue was shared like the NFL.....Green Bay, where the packers play, only has a population of 105k people..but yet they can compete for the same free agents that a team in NY, Boston and LA does because no team, regardless of market, can simply outspend another...
@@carsonc29 Green Bay hasn't had a big free agent since Reggie White and market size doesn't matter in the NFL, whether or not you have a QB does. When people say big markets they only mean LA (NBA) and NY (baseball).
@@rodneydonaldson4097 I'm referring to when Jefferey Loria was their owner (he also fucked up the Expos, hence why they're the Nationals now.) And it seems things haven't changed with Derek Jeter as part-owner.
The points Tree made in this video are still relevant today. The smaller market teams may think they have a shot at basking in the glory of a World Series championship, but without such things as a hard salary cap and a seemingly unlimited budget to work off of, their windows can slam shut in a matter of minutes.
I used to read Deadspin but then Tommy Craggs took over and it got real bad. I went to SB Nation but it got preachy in the same way. I don’t bother with Barstool because it’s frat bullshit. It seems like this channel is the only oasis in the world of sports commentary.
That's not the case cause teams like the Arizona Coyotes, Ottawa Senators and even the Carolina Hurricanes still have a hard time maintaining success too. Carolina seems to have switched it up but it's been like 20 years since their last successful season. Carolina right now is what the St. Louis Cardinals have been for MLB, a small market team that seems to be getting it right but won't be competing with the Big Market teams like Pittsburgh or Washington
As quoted from the movie Moneyball: "The problem that we're trying to solve is that there are rich teams, then there are poor teams, then there's 50 feet of crap, and then there's us. It's an unfair game. Now we've been gutted, organ donors for the rich. Boston taking our kidneys, and the Yankees taking our hearts... We got to the think differently. We are the last dog at the bowl. You see what happens to the runt of the litter? He dies!"
not attacking you or anything but only 1 team can win every year. it bugs me how people expect a team to be good every year in a league of 30 teams. there WILL be teams that are bad. its part of sports
@@shannonmurray34 true. baseball is like that. pure luck sometimes. I just wanted to leave that there cause he got all those likes, and my comment would bet buried otherwise lmao my point is that if true parity existed, you would have to wait 30 years for your team to win the title , if the title rotated on a yearly basis to every team. is also impossible for every team to have a winning record. I hate to say it, but teams will suffer in sports. its part of it. although I agree fully baseball needs a salary cap asap
This was SO true. As a Cardinals fan I completely get that we are like the only smaller team that is pretty regularly in contention and I would say it’s heavily because of how ingrained our entire city is the team. Going to Colorado, Kansas City, or any other small market area I quickly realized that we are unlike other cities. EVERYONE in St. Louis loves baseball and it just isn’t like that elsewhere, that’s the biggest reason we, as a small market team, are pretty good
@@alexandergilles8583 I'm a royals fan and I felt bad for Indians fans when Brantley left. I've actually been rooting hard for you guys since we started sucking again because you have a pretty likeable team.
I live in st. Louis and it never feels like the cards are in a small market. The dedication in this city is insane, and I wouldnt trade it for the world
Anoctuary and Jalen. The Cardinals are basically the regional team for much of the Midwest, Plains states and even the Mid South i.e Tennessee for their fan base. I think the Cards are among the highest in all of MLB with the amount of local radio affiliates broadcasting their games as well. This is Despite fact St Louis is in the lower tier of smaller populated cities in the US with a MLB team. They are more accurate a higher tier revenue making club in MLB similar to say the Green Bay Packers. Thus they got "regional fans" from Louisville to Nashville, and as far west as say Omaha. And fans across the US and dozens of countries worldwide as well. Just shows the huge importance of dedicated and excellent owners in pro sports who spend well on drafting and developing players as have the Redbirds have done in the past 25 years or so even as a so-called small market team. Not counting their previous great extended period of success of nearly 30 years from say 1964 to the Mid 1990's. The Redbirds are a model club that the Royals, A's Reds, Pirates and Rays should be following.
@@Jamer767 You mean spending money "wisely" and making excellent decisions in drafting and signing prospects as well. With many of the prospects both homegrown in the US and internationally often not top 5 prospects since the Cards are often drafting in lower rounds because of their frequent playoff berths over the past 25 years or so.
Nicholas Garcia So, the unlimited money of the Illitch Family just doesn't exist? Don't kid yourself, the AL Central can spend a lot of money when the teams in question aren't complete ass.
What I expected: my team getting shit on What I got: a great explanation of why my team sucks and why MLB sucks for small market teams Pleasantly surprised but disappointed with MLB in general
Thats why it's my least favorite of the 4 major American sports. Between slow pace of play, lack of scoring, and the fact that the team I support is a small market team with no hope of winning anything most years I really couldn't care less about baseball.
Nikolas Johnson lack of scoring? You can hate MLB for all other reasons but you can’t say you hate baseball due to lack of scoring. There have never been as many runs as this year. Never as many HR’s. I personally think too many HR’s and a juiced ball are boring and burn out fans who like good balanced pitching and hitting. Bad for small markets? Fair enough. Corrupt as fuck commissioner? Fair enough. Lack of offense? You’re just not watching baseball in 2019.
It’s really depressing...that’s why those World Series runs were so amazing. My favorite part was the All Star game being completely full of Royals! Everyone complained about how KC fans stacked the online voting, but somehow we were able to surpass all the big market teams 😂
A league with such top-heavy money imbalance is asking for the smaller market teams to fail and fail miserably. If you think it’s bad in baseball, just look across the pond for a second. Soccer in England and across Europe is so top-heavy that lower league teams are not only never able to truly succeed, but often times are doing nothing but circling the drain. All it takes is one bad owner and a team could go completely bust (as was the case just yesterday- Bury FC, a team with 120+ years of history, liquidated, and another team, Bolton, just barely escaped the same fate thanks to a last minute sale of the team.) Sports without hard caps are always going to become pay to win and create a hard divide between the haves and have nots.
Soccer doesn't pride itself on handicapping teams and I appreciate it. Look at almost any sport and you'll find it's certain groups that dominate. Are you going to handicap them as well? Are you going to punish Federer, Nadal, Djokovic for dominating Tennis? Are you going to punish Lewis Hamilton for dominanting F1? Are you going to punish team USA for constantly shitting out gold medal swimmers and so on. Also, the money differs depending on the league. Bury were languishing in the equivalent of an single A league, of course they are going to struggle. Clubs going bust more often than not is because of bad ownership. Leeds spent beyond their means which is why they suffered, same with portsmouth.
This was a surprisingly cathartic video as a Royals fan. I'm just glad I got to see them win in my lifetime and their success in '14 and '15 really ushered in a new era for the city as a whole.
From a proud lifelong Royals fan, thank you for this. All of the points are valid, especially the fact that small-market teams are at an inherent disadvantage compared to the big teams. At least we got 2015. BTW David Glass is considering selling the Royals, and I'm cautiously optimistic that he will, the value of the team has skyrocketed over the past few years because of the team's recent success.
Sterling. Good luck. Even though I am a Yankees fan, I always had respect for the Royals especially their early 1980's playoff contending teams(capped off with a 1985 title) with the legend George Brett.
I have been a baseball fan for as long as I can remember, and a Royals fan since their beginnings. You have summed up one of the biggest problems in Major League Baseball: small market teams will follow these patterns, as long as nothing is done to make it a level playing field in this area.
@@sominboy2757 I could've sworn that either his contract was to much or he was not very nice in the club house, then again our replacement for him during the time was Kendrys Morales and Hosmer since he was only a DH/1B. Right now our DH is Soler I believe, which even tho his Batting average is low, he drives in a lot of runs with lots of homers (more than butlers) and our 1B O'Hearn still has time to shine and reveal his potential
The Rays and A’s are the best of working with what they got. They are by far the smartest teams in baseball. Somehow competitive every year despite having the smallest payrolls is incredible to me
Also, this video sort of sums up why I've been falling out of love with the MLB in general. It always seems to be the more or less the same big teams making a splash. And having two of those "big teams" in your division certainly makes progress towards contention that much tougher to come by (I'm a Blue Jays fan referring to the Yankees and Red Sox).
The Blue Jays are a big market team they're just owned by Rogers a very cheap company that is more interested in fucking you over on your phone bill than putting together a winning team for more than 2 out of the last 10 or so years
St. Louis is very unique compared to other small market teams. While it’s smaller the team is a lot older and has a more established fan base then other small market teams. During the early 1900s St. Louis was the main hub for radio broadcasting in that area of the country. which allowed to the team to establish a fan base in areas like Arkansas Kentucky and southern Illinois and not just the STL area. The team also had complete access to the south for several decades until expansion into Atlanta and Texas. Playoff Success and good management have also helped keep the franchise more relevant then other small market teams.
St. Louis has been a baseball city for a hundred years and it used to be one of the most populous in the US. Kansas City has always been more invested in NFL.
This is literally the story of the entire AL Central. That division probably has the best farm system, but they're really not allowed to sign key free agents. Imagine if the Twins were able to sign Gerrit Cole. Or if the Indians could've signed Bryce Harper a year ago. MLB should set a salary cap at 160M. It doesn't make sense that the Yankees can consistently spend 3 times the Twins/Rays/As/ and most of the other teams they beat up on in the playoffs
As someone who is a fan of a large market franchise (Dodgers), I support a salary cap to create parity and a salary floor to prevent tanking, although I get that neither are likely to be achieved in the short term future or at all. Although I would love to see the Dodgers win it all this year, I won’t help but think of their accomplishment as less special than, for example, my Rams winning a Super Bowl, because the Dodgers are the beneficiaries of such an uneven playing field. On the other hand, when a team like the Royals wins a World Series, it should count as two championships because they have to start from an undesirable, disadvantageous position relative to (at least) half of all baseball teams. 2023 EDIT: About one year after posting this initial comment (and picking up the small-market Orioles as another one of my favorite teams), the Dodgers spent over one billion dollars on two generational Japanese players in the span of twelve days. Most other teams could not possibly dish out such a sum of money. Baseball is fucked.
2019: The year of the Small Market Stanley Cup: St. Louis Larry O'Brien: Toronto World Series: Washington (Not really a small market, but compared to all other big market teams, they are the smallest) Super Bowl: Kansas City Man I miss 2019.
I grew up around the Kansas City area, so I've been a lifelong fan of the Chiefs and Royals so I have been used to mediocrity. Tree definitely brought up a good point about the lack of money, another problem is that when they might have some money to spend on a good free agent, they are still at a disadvantage because Missouri isn't usually a high destination for top tier free agents like a LA, New York, or Boston. Part of the reason why Patrick Mahomes has been elevated to almost deity status is because Kansas City teams have rarely acquired transcendent talents like him, he offers something fans of these teams aren't used to: hope.
I'm a Cardinals fan, but since I live in KC I see a lot of love for the Royals and especially a lot of loyalty. I've gone to more games at Kauffman than Busch. Such a beautiful park. I wish everything well for this team.
Actually they were competitive for about a 5 year window, barely missing the playoffs in 2013, then getting there in 2014 and winning it all in 2016. They were contending at points in 2016 and 2017 before everything went to hell last year and this year. So, I disagree.
@@joeomalley2835 they didn't win it all in 2016, they did in 2015 then in following 2 seasons they were mediocre, then they decided to blow it up and try to repeat their success again.
This video highlights why Tree is such a great sports youtuber. Behind the jokes and the snarkyness is a hardcore sports fan who cares about fairness, tension, and competitive balance. He doesn't just focus on the big headlines, but dives deep into every team in every league. This allows him to see the value of parity and the salary cap. I believe the all-around insight also makes his humor effective. It's funny 'cos it's true.
9:01 God bless the DeWitts. After Budweiser got out of the game one could’ve been concerned at the Cardinals becoming Royals East. However, even with the stumbles, we’ve seen four WS appearances and 2 chips in a ten year span in St. Louis. Really puts things into perspective.
No one EVER in stl, or from stl, that I know of would ever even consider Cardinals becoming "Royals East". No one in STL would ever even think about the royals. You are definitely not from STL and I bet a transplant KC person doing weird voodoo sleight of hand stuff.
The Cardinals are the example every other small market team should be trying to emulate. Excellent player development, draft selections, managerial staff/front office/ownership, and a diehard fanbase. Now that’s organizational competence if I’ve ever seen it #GoCardsGo
I'm a Mets fan who lives in Kansas City. Watching the two world series runs--even one at my beloved Mets expense--was amazing to see what it did for the city.
Hey Tree, I know the chances of you seeing this are low considering how dated this video is, however I would like to let you know I plan to use this video as a source for my English paper in which we have to write a research paper with four sources. My paper is on how much of a disadvantage small market teams are at currently in the mlb. Thank you for this golden video my man :)
The important thing to remember is that the big market cities are the big name cities. LA, DC, New York, Boston, Chicago are the biggest names of cities in the US. They always have a lot of crowds simply because of the popularity of the area and that’s how it’s easy for teams to grow big fan bases and gain good, consistent attendance numbers. Nobody is gonna say “Hey, when we go to the USA, let’s go to Oakland, or Kansas City, or, Cleveland.” This is part of why the Cubs and Nats have only become relevant so recently, and both won 1 World Series yet have strong pools of money. Also dedicated ownership is a big part of it too. The Rays and A’s are young, up and coming teams that can be as successful as they want but if ownership won’t spend, it won’t mean anything in a few years. And those two are teams that need owners to spend badly if either want those new stadiums they’ve been begging for.
Alexthesniper19 heck, living in KC as a Cards fan, we turn the K Red constantly. The Cardinals have a great fan base all over the state. Cardinals are an outlier.
MrBlue3rd yeah, STL lost the Rams. Personally, I think the city was set up for failure in that regard. Kronke ensures that team was bad, had a horrible coach in Jeff Fisher, and didn’t do anything to try and save the team. But, it is a good hockey, baseball, and soccer town. So, the MLS coming is good for the city.
TpXd8bXqT I am, but it’s likely bc, even though I grew up in stl, my parents grew up in a time when the chiefs were the only missouri team, so they were fans of them. As a result, I am also a chiefs fan now even though the rams were here when I was a kid
I always feel really bad for the small market teams, like being a Yankee fan I know I’m spoiled as hell when it comes to players, money available and championships and probably a million other things. Small market teams have some of the most loyal fans on earth though and I have such a respect for yall. We all love this game even if it isn’t always fair
Video really hits home. Being a Brewers fan I feel for any small market team. Once every 20 years your team has a chance to win something and it's usually stomped on by a team that spends 2 times as much on players. After that it's back to obscurity for another 2 decades waiting for your chance to get your hopes shattered again.
Ryan Randone as someone who is from STL, but has been a life long Chiefs fan, the Rams didn’t leave bc it’s a small market. The owner was a douchebag that didn’t want to fund the franchise, and the stadium was probably one of the worst, if not the worst stadiums in football. Also, the physical location of the stadium was in a bad part of the city. Busch Stadium and the Enterprise Center are much closer together and are in a much better part of the city. If these problems were fixed, football would definitely survive here. Though, I’ll just be a chiefs fan anyways
Boyder6 the Rams left St Louis because they should have never been moved there in the first place. Their owner at the time Georgia Frontiere only moved the team because she inherited the team through the death of her husband, wanted a team in her hometown, and threatened to sue the NFL after they initially blocked the move just so that she could get everything her heart desired. As soon as she died the writing was on the wall for the Rams to move back to LA, especially considering the Rams were bottom 10 in attendance for the entire 2 decade period they were in STL (excluding the Greatest Show on Turf years from 99-01, which just proves how nobody in STL cared about them unless the team wasn’t garbage. Unfortunately for the Rams, they were almost always a garbage team)
It’s not just about getting high draft picks. It’s about scouting and development more so. The big market teams are getting later picks than the royals but the big markets are developing them better and also buying expensive free agents. The royals currently can’t seem to find the word “pitching development” in their dictionary. We also don’t spend much in free agency either. It’s very frustrating. At least we have the chiefs. Sherman our owner wants a downtown ballpark when the team is dogshit right now. Good luck with that.
Honestly the Orioles have probably been screwed over the most from this, used to be a medium good sized market before the MLB brought in the nationals which took half or more of their market, completely screwing the team.
This video is so true. As a Rockies fan, its so frustrating seeing Jeff Bridich do nothing to build around Arenado and Story, but at the same time I understand that its hard to make any significant additions, especially with Nolan's new contract.
Awesome video!! Have been a Royals fan since 1988 when moved to the MO/KS area's. Yep - I remember those abysmal years the Royals had during the 1990s-2000's. Those years reminded me of the 1970's-1980's Cleveland Indians where I am from - literally could NOT even give away tickets. Finally, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016 were great years for the Royals!! Finally a competitor. 2 World Series and DOMINATING the 2015 season - nobody wanted to those that team. Then the death of their star pitcher which, in my opinion - sucked the life-force out of this team which it has never recovered from, and the return to mediocrity.
I have always had issues calling Cleveland and St. Louis small market teams just because their histories date back to when those cities were huge, St. Louis fell out of the top 10 in the 1970 census while Cleveland fell out the following decade
And really, the only reason it did is because of it’s independent city status. Most people don’t realize that if it was a consolidated city-county like every city (except Baltimore and cities in Virginia) it would currently have the 10th largest population in the US
To be fair, being a former large city doesn't really make them less of a small market team. Fans don't last forever, and a smaller population is a smaller population to gain new fans from. And less fans mean less of a budget for players. The Cardinals don't even just buy the best players; they are actually very good at initial team-building (Albert Pujols took until the 13th round to be drafted), allowing them to maintain a strong and dedicated fanbase, which, in turn, allows them to have a more stable base. While they do have a bigger budget, they also cannot just throw money around like the Yankees.
This is why I can’t respect Major League Baseball, the smaller teams have no chance and nobody cares. In football and hockey you have teams rise and fall over the years. In the NFL for instance, the Chiefs, Colts, Seahawks, Bills, Packers, Bengals and Broncos are all small market teams and have had plenty of up times and down times. But look at the Rockies, Mariners, Royals, Pirates, Brewers and Marlins, most of the time they completely suck unless a total miracle happens and they get good for a year or two, but then BAM, right back to the basement. If there is anything humans are good at it’s finding patterns, and when the same pattern keeps repeating, ad nauseam, for decades, it breeds apathy. Apathy is death. (Edit: And it's a real shame too because I think baseball is one of the greatest sports ever devised. A game that is impossible to win by being selfish, yet is forced to rely on an individual at any given moment to make it happen.)
@@ulikemykungfu3995Credit the M’s for making a postseason two years ago, but I would agree that a better run front office could’ve gotten more out of the team they’ve had of late.
Also such a great analysis of the competitive disparity in the league and in a way, economic disparity as a whole. It's been cool to see the way your content has evolved over the last year
I knew this but I didn’t want to face it. I’m saddened by your analysis. I also appreciate your honesty. I absolutely love baseball. I wanted to comment because acknowledging the flaws of something you care about is never easy and I wanted to display my reluctant gratitude to you for having the guts to be truthful.
I think I speak, not just for us Brewers fans, but for all fans of "small-market" baseball teams when I say, "Thank you," for shedding some light on this. It's an issue that needs to be addressed and talked about more often.
I still remember when the crown blazed in gold. Now they blaze in dumpsters. Every home game, the visitors would torment them by constantly mentally vandalizing the crown on the giant logo in the home stadium to look like little penises. It's a sad thing to be amused by.
Let's be real, Yelich was a real Chad for signing that huge deal with the Brewers, even if he's playing poorer now. The normal guy like even former teammate Giancarlo Stanton sign with the Yankees or whatnot.
Actually that's my dead uncle who grew up a giants fan until age 18 left the house told the 9ers and Giants to fuck off and rooted for the cardinals since 1980 the man leaves heaven in his custom Blue Cardinals Jersey to root on his team.
@@UHOH_415 as a giants fan I'm excited for the future but when we're not in the playoffs I root for the cards to honor my uncle and the Stros to honor my early baseball playing days at 14 15 16
Thank you for sharing the plight of the Royals fan UT. It may be dark now, but if I had the choice between 2015 never happening with us staying frustratingly average, and the current timeline, I’d still keep the current timeline.
Baltimore's Metro Area is still bigger than a lot of metro areas in MLB, and about the same size as St Louis's Metro Area. If they can't thrive off of that, than it just shows their incompetence.
@@bigdc202 Orioles Market is 24 of 31 they rank on the bottom anyway you slice it. Yes the Royals and Ray's have had success in the past but to act like it doesn't matter is foolish. And I pointed out their incompetence with the Davis contract remark. FYI Cardinals rank 19, the Os are 24
Not much of a baseball fan, but with KC, we’re so back and forth. We’ll do well in baseball, yet horrible in football and vice versa. Since the Chiefs started winning, almost no one I’m around pays attention to the Royals any longer.
