The Megadrive (Genesis) Sound Challenge: FM vs PSG

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like sound challenges? Why not try my Sample vs Midi challenge too: • Retro Gaming Sound Cha...
Did you know the the Sega Megadrive (Genesis) featured two separate sound chips? Not only did it feature the fancy YM2612 FM synthesiser chip, it also included the original PSG chip from the Sega Master System.
Both chips were available to the composers writing music for Megadrive games, and you might be surprised to find out just how much of your favourite Megadrive music was actually being generated by the Master System's sound chip.
To illustrate this, i've created a little game. Can you guess which sounds are generated by the Megadrive's Synthesiser chip, and which sounds
are being created by the Master System's PSG?

Игры

Опубликовано:

2 ноя 2016

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Комментарии : 214

@lesterrr12312 7 лет назад

yaaay)) that was fun!) i thought psg was ONLY used for percussive sounds, but now it makes sense! those lead lines from SOR intro certainly sound more "analogue" when soloed out.. it's usually hard to tell in context and i thought that YM2612 was good at making these types of sounds as well.. now i have to wonder how did they make those "echo-y" sounds in some songs, that sound like stereo delay? was it PSG chip as well?? because wasting precious channels on just identical instruments seems like such a waste, haha) oh, it's always so fascinating to study the tricks they used.... i've so much respect for musicians who really embraced the power of that chip during that time, who were also technicians in a sense..))

@TorutheRedFox 6 лет назад

a lot of the time it's a duplicate channel with a delay

@YourIdeologyIsDelusional 5 лет назад

Take a square tone from any sort of PSG, write a melody. Duplicate that melody, have it played by another, identical or near identical channel, delay it by something around a sixteenth or an eighth note, and reduce the volume by somewhere around 25%. Boom, there's your echo. I composed this little Genesis synth test with some emulation VSTs a while back, and I use the trick extensively towards the end: puu.sh/hVFH6/32376890a4.mp3 By the way, none of the synth in the Genesis is analog, It's all digital. It's just different types of digital. I almost want to call the PSG "subtractive" but that's not right either, since the PSG doesn't feature any kind of modulatable cutoff filter. It is just a very basic digital tone generator that produces a pleasing, hollow square sound. I don't believe that it could even be pulse width modulated without some hacky interrupt shenanigans. (Such as this: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-08Sm8BL-BF4.html )

@danielmccormick700 5 лет назад

@@YourIdeologyIsDelusional Can you repost the mp3? The push link is broken.

@YourIdeologyIsDelusional 5 лет назад

+Daniel McCormick Well, that's a bit of a problem. Unfortunately, I don't have another copy of it sitting around, and I'm not sure where I put the project file. I know I saved it *somewhere* but ultimately I was just having a little mess around with the synth so I wasn't paying it much mind.

@GiordanDiodato 4 года назад

PSG was used a lot in the Turbografx-16

@martinefrensoquigomez7835 7 лет назад

Hmm. It was pretty obvious on most of the cases. That square wave is undeniably iconic.

@Raven-626- 7 лет назад

I usually look for a square wave like sound and 8-bit level synths to deduce the answers.

@myh6274 3 года назад

i got all right even the tricky last one

@DissociatedWomenIncorporated Год назад

@@myh6274 hooray, me too!

@BuzzaB77 6 лет назад

interesting fact, the reason layering the 2 chips sounded thicker was because they we're both slightly out of tune with each other, achieving a primitive chorus effect. . not on purpose though, the psg had less bits to calculate pitch so was often out of tune compare to the YM.

@Octo4533 5 лет назад

The FM has that, 'twang, dang Wang" noise to it, the Master System chip has a *shff* and a *bleep bleep*

@Lordy-Lord 4 года назад

And when combined, you get a groovy badass track.

@vittosphonecollection57289 3 года назад

Also it has the typical Waaaoooo waooo trumpet

@chinossynthesizer705 3 года назад

Jesper was like I'm only gonna use Yamaha2612

@Octo4533 3 года назад

@@vittosphonecollection57289 And those compressed Sonic 1/2 drums that go *KUWAK* *BAP* BOOM*

@vittosphonecollection57289 3 года назад

@@Octo4533 Yes. It can be a classic famous song like Sonic or a modern song made on the fly: you'll always recognise the sound of a Yamaha FM soundchip.

@UhrwerkKlockwerx 3 года назад

I make chiptune music, particularly Genesis (with extended channel 3). This video is not a bad introduction to the world of the Genesis’ sound for anyone interested in trying out chiptune. FM is somewhat difficult to make instruments for (the FM instruments are four operator with 8 different algorithms, the possibilities are endless!), but you get the hang of it eventually. For me, I’ve worked around the Genesis so much that it’s pretty easy for me to pick the different channels apart. The PSG is no sweat.

@chinossynthesizer705 3 года назад

Do you use deflemask no real hardware right?

@AzureQuality 5 лет назад

Over all, combined with all the audio enhancements that the add ons brought made the genesis have 22 channels in total

@Doomsday17died 5 лет назад

It was easy to distinguish when it was the Master System sound as I find it sounds similar to a lot of music in The legend of Zelda: Link's Awaking. The Gameboy and Master System have that distinct eerie echoey kind of sound to them.

@Mentalbox52 Год назад

Here's a fun fact, the samples are actually processes by the mastersystem's cpu, which is directly connected to the FM chip.

@retrosoul8770 7 лет назад

Wow, impressive, I have more respect for the PSG master system chip now after seeing this. I used to think the PSG held the Genesis back in its sound quality potential, but I was totally wrong...I thought the FM chip did all the lead work in the SOR and Whirlwind tracks. But the PSG can project a clear distinct sound as well when it's channels are combined into one, fantastic.

@autumnbrushtail 7 лет назад

with Whirlwind, with close listening, you can actually hear a slow decay on the modulator' volume level, giving the square wave a sort of pseudo filtered sound. pretty impressive and to my knowledge, something that isn't oft done in many MD soundtracks, but I might be misremembering.

@pietrotino 6 лет назад

3:16 the Master System had 3 square wave channels, not 4. The 4th is the noise: yes, it could produce square waves, but using them disables the 3rd square wave channel, so the total usable square wave channels are 3.

@marcosmelo9844 5 лет назад

Mega drive sound is wonderful

@galacticzombie1942 7 лет назад

Cool stuff. I've always been interested in how the two chips work together to create the Genesis sound.

@Mechafatnick 7 лет назад

Thank you! I was surprised at just how much the PSG was involved in creating some of the more complex sounds emitted by the chip.

@usagijojo 7 лет назад

You forgot the bass line of GHZ in your YM2612 demonstration, it's essential to the track and why Genesis music, even tracks which heavily use PSG, sound richer and more complete than Master System PSG music.

@Mechafatnick 7 лет назад

UsagiJojo That's precisely why I left it off. Fm bass lines are so rich and distinctive I didn't want to make it TOO easy :)

@thedrunkmonkshow 7 лет назад

It's criminal how often people criticize or dismiss the Genesis' sound but will give glowing praise of the Super Nintendo's SPC700. In most cases I agree that the SNES overall reproduces a much more realistic CD type of sound but the richness of the FM sound in conjunction with the DAC and SN76496 from the Genesis can do some really impressive stuff with it's up to 10 layers of polyphony. I think another issue is that I grew up with the "Sonic" Model 1 that had the high quality headphone jack. So whenever I played mine I would wire the sound from that jack and into hi-fi stereo speakers to where I could hear all the sounds at their best as opposed to the muffled mess you get from the later Genesis models or the god awful sound from the RF Switch. But overall this video was fun and good job on it :)

@Mechafatnick 7 лет назад

Yes! The SNES sound chip is a really clevervpiece of kit, but when push came to shove, a lot of the soundtracks were just downgraded Roland samples.

@BottomOfTheDumpsterFire 6 лет назад

Which is a shame because you could do some amazing work on the SNES sound chip, like how very few games used the Genesis to its full advantage, same with the SNES.

@tonmasboy 6 лет назад

Yep...snes sounds is a bunch of muffled string/brass with over echoed samples...Only games that samples few instruments it shows "clear" sound due to its highly compressed format

@BottomOfTheDumpsterFire 6 лет назад

Actually, it's just really shit samples. The SNES can do very clear samples, including brass, but high-quality brass samples take up A LOT of space.

@tonmasboy 6 лет назад

FUTURE10S Sega genesis could also do clear samples, including string and brass...But keep in mind that technically nothing is clear on snes because they're build up from adpcm and echo everb and wind up with muffler filter...samples on snes is compressed in 2kbytes but are 16bits allowing beautiful 3d effects and sega genesis dac is locked in 8bit depth

@rockmanhunter 5 лет назад

The PSG square waves are very peculiar and unmistakable.

@ThatHeatedBread 6 лет назад

I got them all! I guess I may be a true SEGA addict....

@chinossynthesizer705 3 года назад

Jesper kyd was punching the yamaha2612 when he was making the adventures of batman and robin Soundtrack with out the sn76489

@gtrzdaddy 4 года назад

That was rather easy to tell as PSG has that distinctive echo. That was also the reason I preferred PSG sounds in Master System games over FM-enabled games. The PSG tone of Streets of Rage 2 sounds very similar to the tone of Golvelius

@metarotta 6 лет назад

PSG itself is just 3 square wave channels and 1 noise channel, and the range of sounds produced by square wave channels wasn't very large alone it isn't exactly a good chip for music, but it works really really well as a support chip for the YM2612 FM chip

@sunnohh 6 лет назад

Nailed it, super fun, really pit my knowledge of sound generation to the test!

@djlobb 7 лет назад

I got all right except for the last. That was a curve ball... I would have thought the more simple sound was the PSG

@SA77888 Год назад

Once ya know PSG from FM its pretty easy to tell, even on the more difficult ones.

@johneygd 4 года назад

It’s interesting to hear how fm & psg sound can work well together.

@okchannel2756 6 месяцев назад

Composer's counterpoint talent also matters.. else it will be a cacophony

@gamezvideos2 5 лет назад

Streets of Rage intro song actually combined only 2 of the PSG channels. We can hear the same sound in the SMS and GG version of the game. One last thing: the 4th channel only generates noise. Edit: look at this oscilloscope view on this new video I found: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--Jm11887pv4.html

@SuperJet_Spade 5 лет назад

Making and listening to Genesis music for two years had gotten me to correctly identify which one was FM and which one was PSG. This was quite a nice challenge.

@chinossynthesizer705 3 года назад

Hi jet

@SuperJet_Spade 3 года назад

Hello 👋🏽 (I forgot I even made this comment)

@elektrikhd 7 лет назад

This is pretty cool. Knowing something about sound synthesis, I have an easier time, but it's still fun!

@AmberShort 6 лет назад

Did an article about the sound chip. And you learn so much from all the research. It's more trickier to program and have the sound come out the way you want it to sound. As in my case when I was trying to replicate that "tawngy guitar" sound.

@Mechafatnick 6 лет назад

Amber Short i found your article! It's a really interesting canvas of opinions. One of the things touched on is the sound circuitry quality/ signal to noise ratio. Did you know that it's posdible to have megadrives and have 3 different sound circuitry configs? Its nuts! There's a handy guide over at sega-16: www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?7796-GUIDE-Telling-apart-good-Genesis-1s-and-Genesis-2s-from-bad-ones

@Mechafatnick 6 лет назад

Amber Short also, i need to finish this, but here'sca snapshot of the sample quality you can get from Sega's box of tricks when space isnt such an issue: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-GXGUZd_IzWU.html

@SuperballsSupervidsOnYT 2 года назад

In isolation, it's easy to pinpoint which chip is doing what, if you owned a sega master system. It's audio quality is as iconic as the NES and C64.

@muizzsiddique Год назад

That last one got me because I thought they were using the Yamaha chip for delay effects, completely forgetting the Master System chip has potentially 4 channels of square waves, that could have used two of them to play the same melody but at a delay. Nice.

@brazilmugenteam 6 лет назад

Awesome video. I was able to guess all the sounds correctly :) maybe because I am a keyboardist and I am a Big fan of FM synthesis. Loved the Yamaha sound chip. Good old Dx7 days...

@segat-800 4 года назад

What a brilliant video of the Megadrives unique sound capabilities. Excellent stuff.

@MurrayFlashy 5 лет назад

YES!!! NOW ITS TIME TO FINALLY MAKE SEGA GENESIS MUSIC WITH THE GEMS!! THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!!!! :D

@Mechafatnick 5 лет назад

GEMS is better than legend would have it, but personally I prefer something a touch more modern like Deflmask 😁

@solarflare9078 5 лет назад

You can definitely make good sound with GEMS if you know the thing well and are able to work out with the bad patches with the various things you can do with it like pitch-shifting, but yeah. If you can, use Deflemask.

@tomypower4898 Год назад

Yes pun intended, but re-reading this line did make me smile

@discolegend2000 2 месяца назад

Great comparison vid.

@clonefighter1996 Год назад

Working with the SEGA Genesis's hardware for my covers helped me a bunch. PSG - Pulse Sound Generation - essentially means square waves, after all. > all 4 actually 3, the "fourth" channel is the noise. That last one nearly got me. There ARE FM patches that sound like squares.

@Mechafatnick Год назад

You have to have one trick one :D PSG actually stands for Programmable Sound Generator, btw

@clonefighter1996 Год назад

@@Mechafatnick ...Huh. I must have misremembered. I do remember square wave generators being referred to as pulse generators too, but that might be Mandela again.

@michaelromeo9567 Год назад

Great video.. 😍. Thank you so much you made my day.

@PrimitiveBaroque 2 года назад

Mindblowing how best use of square waves could sound majestic.

@FilippoBeckPeccoz 2 года назад

Cool video!

@bqgdcdm550 6 лет назад

I've noticed that all of the PSG examples you used sounded like they were from Sonic 1 on the Master System so, I got all of them right first try.

@NerdNoiseRadio 6 лет назад

The redemption here in my mind was the final comparison. FM and PSG are generally so very different sounding that they're generally incredibly easy to tell apart from each other. But where it does get interesting - and where I was pleased to see you did arrive at - is when you consider PSG "real square" vs FM "fake square". Using a two-operator FM voice in a 2:1 ratio, you get what sounds like a square wave, even though it's actually two sine waves (or more accurately, a sine wave manipulated by another sine wave). But there are still subtle differences in sound between the real thing and the approximation, that given time spent developing an ear for, one can get it right most of the time. I was hoping this video would be a collection of fake square vs real square trials, where even I occasionally get it wrong, and was disappointed by how easy you made it to tell the one from the other. But as I said, you redeemed yourself on that last one. That last one is a simply fantastic example of real vs fake square. :-) Funny enough, about two and a half years ago, back when I was still writing actual articles on my blog, and not just using it as yet another means to re-broadcast my [video game music] podcast, I wrote an article delving deep into "real vs fake" square. In light of everything you and/or your viewers might find it an interesting read. Here's the link: nerdnoiseradio.blogspot.com/2015/04/geekspeak-u-real-psg-square-vs-fm-fake.html Let me know what you think! :-) Cheers! p.s. at some point, I'll get back to writing real articles again and turning it back into [quote unqote] "a real blog". :-)

@Mechafatnick 6 лет назад

Ha yes sorry - this was aimed more people who may not have realised that the PSG was used beyond MS compatibility, rather than people who know the ratio to fake a square wave ;) Thank you for sharing your blog post - absolutely fascinating stuff (as are the comments too. I knew that the FM was affected by different MD motherboards, but i didn't realise the PSG was as well. Egad!)

@NerdNoiseRadio 6 лет назад

Sorry I'm seeing this so late. Glad you liked the blog post! Yeah, everything seemed to be at least a little bit impacted by each mobo revision. It's so strange, because on the one hand, that there's so much variance, it results in a great big mess. On the other hand, it makes the whole subject so fascinating. On balance, I think the whole affair ultimately does more to endear the Genesis to me even more, rather than the opposite. What a fun system! I don't remember including this in the blog post, but I apologize if it was, and this is a redundant share. Here's a link to a Sega-16 Forum thread detailing all the mobs revisions and the complete list of their impacts, to sound, and beyond. It's a fantastic read: www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?7796-GUIDE-Telling-apart-good-Genesis-1s-and-Genesis-2s-from-bad-ones My main Genesis is a TMSS VA6 model 1. After reading this, that'll tell you everything! :-) I do have a handful of spare consoles, and they are VA7 model 1, VA 1.0 and VA 1.8 model 2. Of course, in this age of emulation, we add even more complexity to the matter, as Genesis is notoriously hard to emulate faithfully for sound. Check out DustinOdellOfficial's video for Mega Turrican, which is done on real hardware, and compare Stage 2-3 to other Professor G's video of Stage 2-3 and marvel at how different the two sound. Here's Dustin's video - with the proper timestamp start time: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-70DLsXjGE4I.htmlm35s And here's Professor G's video: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-w2qnIsHKzBM.html In any case, what a fun subject, the Sega Genesis - particularly its sound! Though objectively I think SNES vs Genesis is too give and take to ultimately declare a real winner, on the subjective front, I've definitely become a Genesis guy over the past decade or so. Cheers!

@RWL2012 6 лет назад

Another tell tale sign of emulation is incorrect hi-hat pitch in the Streets of Rage games

@tansquirrel 3 года назад

Awesome video idea

@okchannel2756 6 месяцев назад

That is counterpoint .. most underated technique 😢

@Automatik234 7 лет назад

Well done video!

@Scripture-Man 6 лет назад

I really enjoyed that. A really fun game, thanks. :) I got them all right but I should know this stuff as I've been listening to (and making) square wave music all my life… on the ZX Spectrum :)

@ELSAHACK Год назад

Sweet video!

@Mechafatnick Год назад

Glad you enjoyed it

@ccateni28 5 лет назад

So the master system helped make the best game music of all time? Good to know.

@JamesnLollify 5 лет назад

There's a reason it's the _Master_ System.

@chinossynthesizer705 3 года назад

Texas instruments

@johnrickard8512 2 года назад

The Genesis would have been quite incomplete without the Master System. It would have lost half of its PPU and its entire sound system.

@DarkPuIse 5 лет назад

I got them all right, but since I'm one of the guys who co-founded Project2612, I probably have a better ear for this stuff than the average Joe, having listened and knowing the details of these chips to death :P

@Mechafatnick 5 лет назад

heh, yeah i'd say you're a bit of a ringer ;) On a more serious note, Project2612 is an absolutely amazing resource. I hope you guys know how much effort you've put in is appreciated! You might be interested in some of the other stuff i've done on the megadrive music front (there should be a rom-based album coming in the not too distant future): ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-vVo6jHVsPiE.html

@DarkPuIse 5 лет назад

@@Mechafatnick Thanks for the kudos. I'm glad the VGM format is even more expanded past what we've done. Looking forward to sound driver rip formats eventually replacing the VGMs as well, then stuff will sound even better than the (expanded) limitations of the VGM format could provide. :)

@diegocrusius 4 года назад

very good video

@AlimkhanOV_A 6 лет назад

Its very cool! thanks!

@okbruh 5 лет назад

Great! I remembered the "Palace Gates" and "The Pit" from MK1.

@bangerbangerbro 3 года назад

All of these are pretty easy. Only the last is hard as always with FM square wave construction.

@RetroHawk 7 лет назад

Awesome video the mega drive is one of my favorite consoles :) I subbed your channel i shall check out more of your stuff in the future.

@Mechafatnick 7 лет назад

Thanks matey! Glad you like it. I like you collection of retro gaming vids as well! (I've just uploaded a full stream of my Megadrive-based Jazz Fusion album as well, if you're interested.)

@vittosphonecollection57289 3 года назад

Also this is my 2nd favourite 90s soundchip (In this case soundchips). The 1st is SNES' and the 3rd is Amiga's

@nimnone 2 года назад

Got them all! Shinobi was trickiest 🥷

@ruzkbthenon-sider2834 3 года назад

Mega Drive does what Super Famican't

@xVGAmusicPlayerz Год назад

1: PSG - FM #1 #2 2: FM - PSG #1 #2 3: PSG - FM # 1 #2 4: PSG - FM #1 #2 Answers!

@camulodunon 4 года назад

Got them all right expect for the last one.

@rhodexa 3 года назад

Spoiler alert: What gave it away in the last one was the envelope. The PSG didn't have a hardware envelope generator (it couldn't automatically control the note volume over time) The first sound line with delay has a distinct pluck sound when a note starts playing, while in the second one, some notes ramp up their volume as they start playing. It makes sense to do this in a single channel in the FM, as it has envelope generation, while the echo will pass unnoticed in the background using the PSG, without wasting FM channels. You could of course use the Z80 CPU to simulate envelopes in the PSG, but now you waste CPU time in doing envelopes instead of playing music. Neat decision indeed. That was fun! sad RU-vid recommended me this after four years... i didn't knew anything about the Megadrive four years ago, anyway. (I never had one, nor i lived the megadrive era, I'm from 2001 xD)

@TransistorBased 7 лет назад

I got all of them except confused the drums. Guess I haven't done much messing with the DX7's noise generation

@dqwno4900 2 года назад

The SNES was no doubt impressive for its time, but the Mega Drive isn’t bad. I grew up with SNES, but lately i’ve played some Mega Drive, and i like it. Both consoles are great. Although the SNES is superior in every way, the Mega Drive had a faster CPU and two sound chips that allow for a total of 10 voices on the Mega Drive, more than the SNES. Games on Mega Drive tend to have more effort put in due to less resources from the console. The Mega Drive surely made some sacrifices, but it was rewarded with more voices, faster speeds, and perhaps cheaper in cost as well. The graphics, sound and overall hardware is decent, and with effort, developers can do amazing things with hardware that is technically inferior to its competitor. I heard the Mega Drive outsold the SNES in the USA. Not sure if that is true. The Mega Drive is capable of more than some people think. unfortunately, some developers (yes, i’m talking about you, Capcom.) programmed the voice samples incorrectly, which causes the samples to be lower in quality, which can be easily heard. some people falsely believed that this is all that the Mega Drive can do in terms of sampling. Certain ROM hacks have corrected this issue and made the samples much clearer. The ROM hacks prove that the Mega Drive is capable of more, with a little more effort. The Mega Drive is a neat console.

@luizfeliz1999 7 лет назад

In the SoR I noticed an more complex echo effect mix on the yamaha chip, althought the psg has an very simply but almost clear sound.

@thecannedslap 4 года назад

Green hill sound 2 would make a good song of its own.

@xashmak1892 6 лет назад

interesting i always thought the genesis had some kind basic wave generator i could the square and noise waves that could not be replicated perfectly via fm synthesis so i figured it had some kind basic wave generator

@fevermario 4 года назад

Got all of them right except the last one...

@jacklazzaro9820 6 лет назад

Fun fact: RU-vid channel, strafefox, has a video about Genesis music, and apparently, the Genesis has one channel exclusive for sample sounds.

@Mechafatnick 6 лет назад

Not quite - the only way to use the Megadrive's DAC is to sacrifice the sixth FM channels. On top of that, it could only play raw uncompressed PCM data, which effected the quality of the sounds MD developers could use.

@jacklazzaro9820 6 лет назад

Wait, really? That's how it works? Then I must've misunderstood the video, my mistake And what do DAC & PCM abbreviate?

@Mechafatnick 6 лет назад

PCM = Pulse Code Modulation. This is the standard way converting analog signals to digital. PCM encoding basically looks at the shape of the analogue wave form at regular intervals and stores its height as a digital value. (When people talk about 16-bit sound and 8-bit sound, they're referring to how much data is stored each time the PCM encoder takes a peek. 16 bit = more data stored = better production of the original sound. When people talk about 44khz or 33khz or 22khz sound, they're talking about how regularly the PCM encoder examines the original sound. 44khz looks at the sound more frequently and generates more accurate sound reproduction at the expense of bigger files) DAC = Digital to Analogue converter. This takes the digital data the PCM encoder recorded and then turns it back into an analogue wave form that can be played through a speaker.

@jacklazzaro9820 6 лет назад

Wow. You know more about this stuff than I do. And I've been trying to study video game history with introductions to certain parts & functions.

@Mechafatnick 6 лет назад

Thank you! That's a kind thing to say. I need to know a bbit as I've written music for the megadrive (open.spotify.com/album/3GnXqPdVmE1cvRIVzX7i1s) and also produced some Master System rom hacks (mechafatnick.co.uk/2018/01/23/hidden-fm-collection-1/) so it's important to know a little bit about what's going on in the background

@johnbewty 6 лет назад

Great video! I learned a lot, and I've been enjoying the sounds produced by the Genesis ever since it came out. One question - what's the song from the intro and outro of this video? It's killing me... heard it a thousand times, but I can't remember which game it's from. Edit: AH! Just figured it out. It's "Hidden Palace Zone" from the Sonic 2 sound test. It's NOT used in-game, which explains why it was tough for me to remember and associate with a particular game. =)

@Scripture-Man 6 лет назад

Yeah, it's a great piece of music. Easily the best tune from Sonic 2.

@JMConteudos 3 года назад

For the noobs: Beep sounds is PSG (Master System) and Wah sound is FM (Mega Drive).

@vittosphonecollection57289 3 года назад

It was easy for me, since of the iconic sounds of both chips. The last one was tricky when separated, but when put togheter is easier cuz the you-know-which-chip has more sustain. But I'm not goin' to spoiler it!

@zalternative1 3 года назад

Master system was pretty undiverse because of its sound chip

@Gianp789 2 года назад

2:15 could someone tell me what the song is called please?

@Mechafatnick 2 года назад

It's just called 'The Streets of Rage' its even on Spotify/youtube and everything

@TheBeeshSpweesh 7 лет назад

There are 3 problems wrong with this video. One, the SN76489 PSG chip only has 3 square wave generators and 1 noise generator.(3:16) Second, you are using only one track per YM2612 sound part. Third, some games used the YM2612's channel 6 digital sampler, while some didn't. It's not only for drums, but also for speech and certain effects.(4:31)(Remind you at 0:00 and 0:44)

@TorutheRedFox 5 лет назад

the DAC* also in some very rare cases is used for the whole song (Toy Story for example uses it to play Amiga MODs synthesized on the CPU) *not actually a DAC but more of a format converter

@myh6274 3 года назад

i got all right even the tricky last one

@RWL2012 7 лет назад

Sound #2 on Outrun was PCM, not FM (the YM2612 can do both)

@Mechafatnick 6 лет назад

erm, which is exactly what it says in the video? ;)

@RWL2012 6 лет назад

Yeah I realise that now, but the chip is not only an FM chip if it can do both FM and PCM, right...?

@ConnorR.mp3 6 лет назад

Well, by that logic, the video chip in the C64 wasn't only a video chip. And the SID chip wasn't only a sound chip. It also handled the paddle inputs, RNG, and more.

@nydiasanchez5515 6 лет назад

Oh my i just got my birthday present happy birthday and happy new year i got it right! Your perfect i got cell with sonic 2 as my rington am going to hit the like perfect

@nydiasanchez5515 6 лет назад

No question about it!

@tommybranca8800 6 лет назад

FM = Pitch -4PSG = Pitch - 7Can anybody guess what this represents?

@1985dossantos 7 лет назад

Great video. But most compositions of Mega Drive has a FM with various channels(generally 4 from 6), a PSG and a DAC (responsable for drums and some samples).

@dmac7128 7 лет назад

This would explain why a dedicated CPU, the Z80 was used to control and coordinate all of the sound chips.

@RWL2012 6 лет назад

Not all games use the Z80 as a sound controller. Sonic 1’s sound driver runs on the 68K which is why the drum samples are higher quality than on the later games in that series. But they needed to free up CPU power for the sequels as they are more complex games so those do use a Z80 based sound driver.

@TorutheRedFox 5 лет назад

the use of the Z80 isn't the sole reason why the samples are lower quality it also depends on how often, and for how long, the Z80 is stopped for data transfer

@adilsonenes 7 лет назад

amazing, could you Tell me how did you take every sound apart? thanks

@Mechafatnick 7 лет назад

A player called Audio Overload is your quickest bet.

@alexwood711 7 лет назад

How were you able to dissect the tracks like that? I'm trying to sample/recreate the lead voice in green hill zone- the one that plays the signature tune (C, A, C, B, C, B, G) for my video game covers band ABXY. Can you help at all? :)

@Mechafatnick 7 лет назад

Alex Wood the quickest way for you would be a player called Audio Overload, which plays the original vgm files and lets you turn the individual channels on and off.

@alexwood711 7 лет назад

FatNicK I could kiss you sir. Great video btw!

@Mechafatnick 7 лет назад

Alex Wood thank you! and no problem. are you revording a cover?

@RG7621 6 лет назад

I got them all right apart from outrun.

@exactspace 5 лет назад

The percussion sound on the third game isn’t the “FM”. It was the channel that could play audio samples.

@Mechafatnick 5 лет назад

And which chip is the DAC located on? ;)

@DeskoDev 4 года назад

@@Mechafatnick One year later and they still haven't replied

@T3KNUG3T5 5 лет назад

Afterburner wouldve been harder cause the PCM samples are played through the PSG!

@austinreed7343 5 лет назад

Were there any WESTERN games that used the PCM chip?

@TorutheRedFox 5 лет назад

there never was a PCM chip

@jju00 5 лет назад

It is interesting but the final two tracks were dishonest becuase unless you already knew how those tracks were made it was imposible to know that the FM chip was used to play 8-bit sounds.

@DeskoDev 4 года назад

If you pay close attention, the FM synthesis has a bit of a different sound compared to the PSG with the latter, and the former, if you know how a PSG chip works, will be obvious by the fact that the PSG is just white noise whereas the FM chip actually has a more distinct, realistic sound (despite the noise).

@nfernandes2254 Год назад

Wow, that's a cool vid! Question, though: wouldn't this be possible with the SMS if it had both chips as well? I mean, didn't the Mark III had both?

@Mechafatnick Год назад

The Master System FM chip is slightly different. The Megadrive provides 6 customisable channels of more complicated sounds created with 4 sine wave operators. the Master System chip could actually generate more sounds simultaneously, but only one was customisable - the rest were instrument/drum sounds hardcoded into the chip. Theoretically yes - I believe the FM hack for Master System Sonic could use both. However, in the real world Sega were (not for the last time) hamstrung by their variants: The Japanese Master System had the FM chip built in and could use both at the same time, Mark IIIs with the FM sound add-on could only use one chip or the other.

@nfernandes2254 Год назад

@@Mechafatnick Thanks for the thorough response! Honestly, if I saw this applied on a SMS, my mind would be blown away! Sega rocked.

@chilidog2469 6 лет назад

I want to make a Sonic game that both works on the Genesis, and is as modern as possible (I however, am the Artist and don’t Know ANYTHING about making music)

@martynas5076 6 лет назад

I got all of these right, but i didnt get the last one right.

@Isoquant 5 лет назад

4 for 4!

@Sh-hg8kf 11 месяцев назад

3:15 There's only 3 squares on the SN, not 4

@LoganOnTheRun20 6 лет назад

1:24 I having some Sonic GBA flashbacks and boy o boy they aren't pretty

@albertodiez4215 4 года назад

Pasote de vídeo. A veces me ha sonado mejor el pwg. Impresionante ver lo que se puede hacer combinando los canales del psg

@GENATARi 7 лет назад

5:35 you can tell from attack

@Decidetto 5 лет назад

No you can't. PSG supports advanced volume envelopes just as well as FM.

@TorutheRedFox 5 лет назад

the YM2612 has a very specific attack, which only goes from where the last note's decay left the volume at, making the attack instantaneous if you go from one note straight to the other

@martynas5076 6 лет назад

3:15 *All 3 square wave channels