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My friends play a bit of 2nd edition, what version of the battle bible has that ruling about the shokk attack gun being treated as a support weapon? It's not in the one I have 1.6.5. Edit: The change in targeting comes from the website of Ed Etkin back in 97ish where he'd email Jervis Johnson and Andy Chambers rules questions and they'd reply with what they thought were the right way to play. Only a select few of these questions made it into White Dwarf and are therefore "official". Thus whoever compiled the Battle Bible used the PDF summery of Ed's questions and answers in clarifying anything they found odd.
I find it fascinating that rules for a gun designed to shoot small goblins through hell at your opponents also incorporated logistical mechanics like ranging shots.
The 'Ere We Go era Ork rules for Rogue Trader were insane, I saw a Shokk Attack Gin in action once but I can't imagine what a game that used Weirdboyz, Mekanaks, Madboyz, Tinboyz, etc, all together would have been like. Possibly somebody tried it once and the game is still going on today...
The madboyz are funky. Random behaviour, I think. WFB continued to have random orc nonsense. Orc magic was often random. Orc units would suffer animosity between them if they had to stand and walk without anything to fight. They could decide to randomly start throwing rocks at another unit or start a fight within their own unit. I think ork torpedoes in Battlefleet Gothic stood out by having a random Strength. They have no idea what they load in the tube.
@@SusCalvin it wasn't just the randomness, it was the pages and pages of rules and tables that were necessary to run these units, even in a game as crunchy as Rogue Trader could be it was excessive and looked incredibly time consuming.
We have Bryan Ansell to thank for the glorious unhingedness of Rogue Trader Orks! Ansell was much more of a roleplayer than a wargamer per se and so leant hard into the wonderfully weird thematic elements with practically zero concern for game balance or ease of play. Also he was in charge so if he said that Orks would get three army books then they got three army books! Much of this wildness got ported into 2nd ed and the rest is history.
WFB had some randomness as well. Orc spells were often random in effect and magnitude and direction. Orcs who had to stand around or walk about without anything to fight rolled to see if they picked a fight with the nearest orc unit, started a brawl in their own regiment or decided to get the enemy first by running ahead madly. Units like night goblins hopped up on shrooms with a giant ball and wagons manned by a horde of snotlings at pumps existed.
@@OldenDemon Warhammer Fantasy had snotball in Middenheim. A snotling taped up with leater strips into an immobile but wiggling ball used to play some old-fashioned early modern period bri'ish football. The kind where goals are loosely defined spots on the street and the rules are unclear about how you can punch or wrassle the opponents or where the game field actually ends.
@@SusCalvin You telling me Night goblin Ball and Chain Fanatics and the Snotling pump wagon were phased out?! Seems like the aggressive corporatism really drained all the fun and colour of the IP, just sad
Having once lost an entire squad of teleporter-enabled Terminators to a single shokk attack volley, I can say I didn't, at the time, regard the weapon as over-powered; orks were the comic relief in 2nd ed and playing against them was consenting to arrant tomfoolery. I sat out 3rd ed so I can't say if toning down the silliness changed gameplay much.
@@mildlyderanged There's nothing wrong with playing competitively, or building a strong "meta" army. Just got to communicate with your opponent if you want to play like that. The only bad way of playing is not meeting your opponent's expectations. :) Personally, balance is a good thing. I want to be able to take any army, and have an OK chance of putting up a fight. Getting curb stomped because your opponent's army is just better was a bad experience. I didn't have the joy of 1st/2nd edition 40k, but I kinda want to play some games. Even if my beloved Tau are excluded.
Ahhhhhh my most favourite thing of the Ork tech in 2nd ed. I will never forget the game where the snotlings killed Bjorn the Fell Handed, hijacked the dread and then blasted a long fang squad to pieces. Such fun.
One of the first models I ever bought! I never even owned an Ork army, not did I have the game or know the rules at that point. Just bought the model because it was cool 😀
The delight GW had for oddly detailed rules about a very specific thing would show in Warhammer Fantasy RP as well. In the densely packed text or expanded in WD or half-official fanzines like Warpstone there could be between a page or a half, sometimes two, detailing something like surgery or busking. Rules that were situationally tacked onto the existing rules.
@@OldenDemon This is the same people who released the WFRP 1st edition when they hadn't figured out Chaos completely yet, and wrote "We know we only have two chaos gods, but we will fill out the other two later" in their core rulebook. Which they did, a bit later the two chaos books were released. It was detail in a little thing here and there which the players might not need more than once. Like the cleanliness of the barber-surgeon or the gunpowder weapons of Araby.
@@OldenDemon Fun fact about the gods in WFRP 1st ed, they toyed with the idea of making an Elric-style pantheon of cosmic Law that stood counter to the Chaos pantheon. Most proper people in the Old World don't care for either and prefer their local gods like Shallya, Sigmar, the different elf/dwarf gods or Stromfels if you're a twat. But for a little time they had named Law gods.
4th-6th edition shokk attack gun was still pretty fun. You rolled 2d6 for the weapons strength, but any doubles would have you consulting a chart of silly events that would happen instead. Imperial Armour 8 (raid on kastorel-novem) also introduced a custom vehicle called the 'mekboy junka', a generic vehicle profile without an official model similar to the looted wagon that would let you mount the shokk attack gun on a vehicle
The Shokk Attack Gun was fun in 2nd Edition, but tbh nobody was really worried about it being broken, because the Pulsar Rokkits were so much worse. For 50pts you got a single shot weapon that would prevent all enemy infantry & artillery from moving or firing in a 2D6 radius and prevent all vehicles & walkers from shooting. You didn't have to make a to hit roll, you just had to roll how far exactly it flew in a straight line. However, with no limitations on their number except max. 50% of points for support units, in a small 2000pt game you could easily take 16, fire 4 each round and render the complete enemy army useless for the whole game.
@@OldenDemonI am the one who suggested to kirioth we raid you. He was doing a stream where we were going around raiding a bunch of different channels. I apologise for all the girth I brought to your comment section.
Man, I love this channel. I played 3rd, and I played Orks, but I didn't really get into the faction until I came back to the game recently. Thinking back, I did miss some of the silliness.
Still have my 2nd edition shock attack gun in the attic. Was only looking at it a few days ago. Evil Sunz clan, paint job not bad for a 14 year old, but put my all into it! Cheers for the memories!👍
I don't remember which edition it was, but i loved the version of the Shokk-attak gun where you rolled two dices on a table and see what happened. Favourites of mine were the 12, a literal warp rift where a horde of demons poured into reality, and so everyone around the target suffered a lot of damage, and i think a 4, in which case, the MEK was teleported against the target in direct contact. Being him a big mek, this wasn't always a bad thing, but when you shooted at a dreadnought, it definitely was.
Over my decades of which there are many I have played this game. I only rage quit one tournament. Fooking pulssa rokkets I was running a damn near all skimmer Eldar army. He had enough rokkets to destroy pretty much everything I had. A couple years later I worked at GW and ran the tournies for the Americas and to this day they still bastardize many of my scenario & tournament designs. Bastards.
True story: The Shokk Attack Gun was invented in in 1985, but it took 5 years to write up the rules, hence why it was released 4 years after Rogue Trader.
These existed in Epic 40K as well. I recall the rules saying how disconcerting it could be for a terrified, screaming, defecating snotling to suddenly appear down the left leg of your terminator armour.
I like to think that there was some bogey flicking primary school child somewhere in the UK during the 1970s who is clearly the inspiration for the name, if not the concept of, the Snotling Attack Gun. (Its in everyone's interest to not try to imagine the inspiration for the Snotling Pump Wagon from WHFB!) I seem to remember most Ork guns were as much a danger to everything around them as they were to the enemy (assuming that they got on target)
Was it Wayne England who drew the snotlings?? Loved that artwork...and thanks for reminding me where I bought the Ork Codex...Edinburgh! The codex was brilliant! The weekend even better but the records of that are under Inquistitorial seal...
I always love "you might die with no saves of any kind" type weapons. Truly 3rd edition was horrible. If it never happened then maybe i would never have lost interest in GW for a decade
I love Shokk Attack Guns! They’re one of the Orkiest things in the game, and I hope they get some wacky rules when the full 10th edition codex comes out. Whenever that is. 2030, perhaps.
If I might humbly request the Squig Katapult for one of your videos - I would be ever so grateful. My time with 2nd edition was brief, but it always seemed kinda ridiculous at the time. Was I just a whiny 12 year old, or was it actually crazy good?
Orks really did get much more dull and less fun after 2nd ed. Just turned into shouty generic alien yobs really, haven't yet recovered as far as I can tell
I really like the Shokk Attack Gun. I have fond memories of taking down my friend's Eldar Dreadnought with one. Frankly I miss the Ere we go/Freebooterz era Orks. They were fun in a way everything since has been a pale imitation of.
@OldenDemon yeah I could have understood there was a slight chance against the most impervious armour. But the damage table it had made it overpowered and making my favourite minis not worth taking when facing the orks. Wow That brings back some memories almost 3 decades old.
I started Warhammer at 5th edition (coincidentally, Orks) and even in 5th Shokk attack gun was looking like a whole essay of rules and a bag of things that could potentially happen. But that huge rule was nothing compared to what is shown in the video about old Shokk gun.
I used to hope and pray I would get the malfunction strat card in 2nd. These things messed up up Dread's and Leman russ tanks fairly often. Good fun though.
The fact that 8th edition was only 8 pages was the warning sign to me that the dream was dead. This wasn't a game for people to enjoy anymore, it was an excuse to get people in the door.
A: I am so glad I found your channel. B: I genuinely think 80s (and perhaps on into the early 90s) Warhammer was just the lads getting drunk and writing whatever came into their collective imagination.
the Scanner wargear card rules text really tickles me. "Hidden troops are automatically detected if they are within 24." Okay but better immediately re-emphasise it. "Detects hidden troops within 24." And then a final summary line at the bottom, oh hey btw, "Detects hidden troops within 24"
With the inconsistency in the other videos, I'm surprised it didn't say detects hidden enemies, then troops then vehicles, all with three different ranges, one including a stat test.
My mate played with orks during the RT era and as if the actual rules weren't bad enough he also claimed that each base has 9 snotlings so thats 9 shots per base :(
Shokk Attack guns are just one of those things that made 1st and 2nd edition Orks the best faction. Sod having 93 different flavours of Space Marine, give me pages of rules for bolting miscellaneous weapons together, and random tables that will either make my Warboss the Prophet of the Waaagh, or turn him into a drooling moron with a monowheel instead of legs.
Ah, yes, the old shokk attack gun rules. Honestly, while I don't want to go back to 8 pages of rules I do wish they got a bit more flavor nowadays. Even if it's just using snotlings as ammo again. They feel so boring nowadays, even if they are still very swingy. Do absolutely adore the model though. Talking about models, I liked your little dig at Stormcast. I must admit, I personally don't entirely hate the first, or second for that matter, wave of Stormcast. Paladins are pretty cool and I conceptually like some of the characters. Still, they got it so right with Dominion that somebody at GW has to be kicking themselves for not launching the game with those designs. Even if Vindicators are a absolute nightmare to transport compared with Liberators.
Yep, still peeved about what they did to my beloved Orks in 3rd and that goes trebly so for the wonder that was the Shokk Attack Gun. It was too beautiful to be allowed to live when the boyz lost their orky souls.
Due to being in love with my box set of 30 Beakies i had to beat up several none geek wanna be giiga chads during my school years. i was every ones mate in chess club ^^
