@@FrankitoGotti Mp5 and 7 are very good on long range aswell as on short. UMP has damage falloff so big it causes only 30 dmg on headshot from long range and its unaccurate.
Depends on the situation. The Famas/Galil definitely offer more ranged utility, and so, are still technically an upgrade over the UMP. The biggest drawback to the Famas/Galil IMO is their pricing. Again, they're not " bad" weapons, just not as good as other primary rifles.
valve needs to make shotguns great again. i cant recall a single statistic being changed with any of the shotguns, save for the xm1014 being reduced from 2200 to 2000. making a weapon which is already situational even more situational is a recipe for disaster because for every change that pistols and smgs have gotten the shotguns have been ignored. as the smgs and pistols form and reshape the meta, the shotguns are, as far as i can tell, the same as when the game was released in 2012
Scoja The shotguns hasn't had any significant changes since the game released, except a few small changes to the sounds, the XM's price reduction and the removal of the Nova's wallbang potential back in (was it 2013 or early 2014). So yes.. the shotguns really need some love. I've always liked shotguns in shooting games, but the ones in CS:GO are extremely disappointing to use
CS:GO update 23. May 2017: Reduced the UMP45 damage at range to bring the weapon more in line with the SMG category (rangemodifier reduced from .85 to .75) Maybe now will Famas, but more likely Galil have more "value" for medium to long distance compare to UMP... but who knows, we will see. And I like to use Famas, from time to time it is good choice, but never use the burst.
Robert Stegmann Either way, one thing is sure overhere: Famas seriously need a buff to be a weapon, what we could surely call as an assault rifle. Any nerfs of other weapons won't help Famas at all!
I use the famas primarly for its burst fire. I am glad to announce my opinion on how the famas should be changed: change the famas damage falloff from 4 percent, to 2 percent like the m4a4. It is because I hate dealing 95 in 2, and while the enemy thinks the famas is trash, the 95 in 2 scars him, but doesn't kill him sadly.
How dare you insult the FAMAS. I've gotten so many sick spraydowns and other kills with the FAMAS. The FAMAS made me FAMOUS. Not really, but I just wanted to add that.
I use Galil or Famas if I win 1st round. It really isn't that bad :/ I sometimes even use it until 4th round and still win fair gun fights. I don't know why only few people use it :(
I'd say buffs over nerfs. If the Famas and Galil just had a bit less sucky accuracy, less awkward spray patterns or maybe a higher ROF, they would be much more viable.
When you said "Imagine if it was like the battle rifle from halo!" I was just sitting here like "They did that already in Source. Burst mode had zero recoil and holy hell it was OP."
I think it's interesting that they still have some real life inspiration for the FAMAS, the first generatiom FAMAS had the wrong rifling design for heavier bullets and suffered from keyholing with heavier bullets. Maybe this is the reason why it has double the damage falloff of most of the rifles? Judging by the grip-length trigger guard though, it seems to be a FAMAS G2, however in CS 1.6 It was the FAMAS F1 Also, the bullpup design of the AUG and FAMAS might be in part the reason for their long reload times.
Even then, historical realistic elements shouldn't balance game design; especially since Bullpups aren't reloaded slower, that depends entirely on the user's capacity at sleight of hand.
I think you forget that CS at its inception was never designed around competitive play and there may be a few odd balance numbers that are still there. The MAC-10's oddly high ladder accuracy for instance.
New Recruit Secondly, considering that the M4 has the magazine release at one's fingertip and the AK's mags can be popped off by a preceding magazine, while the AUG and FAMAS must have the empty mag removed by hand before the other mag can be inserted, I think we can safely say that they do indeed take longer to reload. I don't think you wish to imply that an IMI Negev can be reloaded just as quickly as an M4 by someone with sufficient dexterity?
How is the CZ not disappointing to you? 24 bullets, reload time is awful, headshot damage is alot lower than other pistols vs armour, costs 500$, 100$ kill reward, pull out game is weak too... You need to get an Ace with 24 bullets and at best 2 shot kill w/ headshot, not to mention, getting 5 kills iswhat is required just to pay for itself if you buy it, where a p250 is superior in almost every single way. The only good thing about the CZ is that its automatic, but if you do use it for that purpose you will most likely run out of bullets before you can kill 2 people, unless you''re really accurate. Therefore not worth paying 500$ for $200 outcome unless you win the round.
CZ75 is bad? Time to take your trigger-happy finger outta Tec-9, friend. First, the CZ is obviously stated by both Valve and Micro as a "mag dump" weapon to get the enemy main one, so it's acceptable that it will have much less reserve ammo. Second, even if CZ is not the best option compared with 5-7 or T9 in all-range combat, it still the best option for close-range because of the full-auto. Third, you always have single or burst fire as an option. Remember that and you can deliever a serious blow to the enemy team in the right circunstances. And last one, git gud. CZ isn't even usable in current meta anyway, you looks bothered that you can't counter it ;)
exactly my confusion as to why the CZ is in the same spot as the 5-7 tec-9, they are so easy to use and have virtually no draw back to them where the CZ has many different factors which make it inferior
The FAMAS could use a slight buff and fix the burst fire mode. It could use a little damage buff to better match the UMP in competitive gameplay. I use the FAMAS from time to time as a strategic weapon. But I do believe that the FAMAS could've been a better weapon.
I find that the FAMAS is a good gun when you don't know what the enemy team is going to do. A place the FAMAS does well is on short cat on Dust 2. When playing this position, with a FAMAS you can hold close to the corner as though it was a shotgun, and pulling back to the stairs when the enemy pushes. Why the FAMAS does well here is that the enemy may get stopped at top mid, and a longer range weapon is needed. Alternatively, they may push up, and you need a good shot to mid ranged weapon. Or the enemy may push from lower tunnels, this scenario would need a medium to longer ranged weapon. Those scenarios would mean that you still play the cat position, should you need to rotate to B or A site, you gun is never completely shit. (though it probably isn't the best either)
Shiny Mega Rayquaza No, we dont need to have nerfs over good guns and left broken guns like that, the Galil and FAMAS need better ROF or better accuracy and stability
TLDR: Famas costs way too much in a force buy situation compared to the UMP, which also has double the kill reward and therefore can keep CT's out of the viscous cycle of save, force, save, force.
To me, the FAMAS feels like the thing between UMP and rifles. Accuracy for long ranges, while still having manageable recoil. It also seems to recover faster from short bursts than the UMP. For me, it is the perfect gun to go for a 1way smoke on Cache A on the second round.
Famas has lower inacuaracy from firing BUT also higher recovery time, making its shots way more inaccuarate to the base spray pattern that m4/ak, this is why is mostly close range, unless you burst, but also keep in mind that m4 and ak mean to have an easy to control spary patern while the galil/famas are more random, which makes the best thing of recoil the simple fact that the pattern is smaller and very easy to control, at short ranges
I think the Source famas, was fantastic. And should be implemented in CSGO, if you were a good burster who would go for headshots, the famas in Source rewarded you for your good aim. there should be a payoff for being a good burster. The burst in CSGO is not useable.
If it had the burst recoil from 1.6/CZ, it could have been a very powerful weapon for long range engagements indeed, even with lacking AP values and quick damage drop-off.
The burst fire is best used to peek and fire the first accurate bullet and then go back to cover, then wait for the cooldown and peek again. You can even take out snipers like this.
The famas is incredibly underrated. Firstly you have a gun which close up plays out very, very similarly to an M4. Same shots to kill, similar spread, good against armour. The biggest downside is its 25 round mag which is far more of an issue than you represented. For example people tend to reload part way through a mag amplifying the 5 round deficit. If one feels comfortable with 15 bullets its a reload after only 10 fired. In practice people will tend to want more than 15 leading to a reload every kill with the FAMAS, like you said its a slow reload. So dropping the gun is common but its served its purpose. Another major issue is the recoil pattern. People don't get completely comfortable with it which is the main reason for its poor performance. In the longer ranges the FAMAS is arguably better than the M4. Sure it takes 6 shots to kill but then again it is significantly more accurate on burst mode. You don't seem to like it due to vertical recoil but its far less of an issue than you assume. After some practice you will learn to compensate for the recoil fairly well by pulling down the right amount, just the same as using the Glock on burst but without the spread of a shotgun. Now like you said the bullets are vertically spread meaning they will either hit the body, hit the head, with a tiny fraction which isn't covered by the head. So a FAMAS burst has more accuracy on the first shot than the M4 followed by a far higher chance to get a second tag than the M4 making that 6 vs 5 hits a lot less of an issue. In fact used properly you will see a lot of double headshots in a burst. And your biggest drawback suggested, your inability to press the right click? If you want spray select spray if you want burst select burst, you aren't locked into the choice through the entire game. Think of it like the CoD gun's zoom if you wish, if someone pops round the corner take it off burst and return fire. It might be difficult to do in the heat of the moment but trust me its a lot easier than learning the Glock 4 shot burst was, and with far more gain. Now as my hardcore era was playing CS:S I still have more of a lean towards spray than optimal so I would still take the M4 over the FAMAS with a strong preference. However its still incredibly underrated and only a slight drop in capability for the near-1k price difference. It is particularly a strong cheap option for the longer ranges where opting for the P90 is simply ridiculous like an on-site position for A long or sitting at window on B site to cover mid and B. And whilst the Galil is also underrated due to no familiarity with the gun the FAMAS has some particularly interesting options to make it at times irreplaceable at that price point. The ability to play at all ranges proficiently is what made the M4 so popular and on defence often you don't have the choice to pick an engagement distance, unlike attack. Its incredibly surprising to me that the gun has never had any real popularity with its wide toolbox, especially during the dates the UMP and CZ75 didn't have their popularity either. As for the guns, neither the FAMAS or Galil need any changes. They are fine as they are, great guns with solid capabilities but not as strong as their more common counterparts for a large cash saving. The problem with CS:GO is entirely in the performance of cheaper guns. Pistols should never be as insane as they are now especially with their skill level. SMGs were only buffed to compete with the overpowered pistols which is such an ass backwards way of doing things its unreal. Eco rounds were a huge part of the game and have almost been eliminated entirely. Back then an Eco round might involve getting a few kills and a bomb plant along with a round lost as a successful eco. These days you are able to force buy every single round with the easy to use pistols or very powerful UMP, grab a few rifles and turn the entire momentum of the game instantly in a single force buy round. Basically the economy has become a joke. In the days of old the deagle used to be the force buy pistol of choice and it required a massive amount of skill. The only pre-rifle gun able of 1 shotting through armour, 7 rounds, massive recoil, very low rate of fire. It could get kills but even the very best players would find it enough of a challenge to get a bomb plant that a force buy of only deagle and grenades was uncommon. The old days found all of the SMGs incredibly weak against armour, the shotguns useless, and the P90 as the only semi-cheap gun besides the deagle and the FAMAS that one could use against armour. Perhaps a single SMG with a full team of rifles but that is about the most. Fixing the pistols and all the changes made to compensate for the overpowered pistols would fix an absolutely incredible number of problems in the game right now. I have no idea why they haven't actually tried that approach and am stunned that they persist in pushing the pistol armour zero eco metagame even after admitting problems like the SMGs being entirely uncompetitive with the pistols. Having a different game is fine, I'm comfortable with my favourite spray gameplay being replaced with burst gameplay. However CS was built on its economy based gameplay and did very well for it and simply unbalancing the game and wiping out half of the strategy has lost far too much.
In its current state i wouldnt suggest the Famas in any situation over the UMP as the UMP with 35 base dmg and 65% armour pen does more dmg vs armoured opponents at close ranges, until the dmg falloff drops it below the Famas in mid to long ranges. The problem is the Famas has such a high inaccuracy that its a liability at mid to long ranges. The problem with the UMP is, in its current state it is far too good for the price. It should cost more, say $1400, and have a base dmg of 30, slightly reduce the damage fall off. Famas just needs its inaccuracy dropped to 6 or 7ish (coz right now at 10 it is literally a spray and pray weapon even if you perfectly master the spray pattern).
I don't think the nerf of the ump is necessary, before the buff, no one played with smg's and shotguns or very rarely... With a buff to the famas, you could have more choice depending the situation. If it was only just more precise, or with a burst mode of 5 bullets, or even with a unique feature like grenade launcher (only one grenade per round for example) I think the weapon could see more plays.
Valve has shown time and time again that they pay little attention to the opinions, suggestions, and reactions of their player base unless the reaction is severe.
Well, I personally accompany the FAMAS with a favourable, tight position (e.g Forklift on Cache A site), or a flash so I can get close to the enemy and spray'em down. M4 fits this route well too, but the FAMAS is easier to use at this. So SOMETIMES even if I have the economy to buy an M4, I would still opt for a FAMAS.
I think the answer in the whole question was in the start of the video: Its a budget Rifle! You cant easily expect it to have same statistics as the "main" rifles (this grouping is better noticable in galil/ak), but its good at its own category. Very interesting in-depth video though man! Bonus Tip: You can fire the 3 bullets of the burst fire mode, and before the burst ends quickly change to the fully automatic mode so you can have a first-shot-accuracy shot while keep shooting.
Nice. The Famas really should cost much less. Maybe somewhere around 1600-1700$ to make it a better eco buy. I would love to see your take on the Galil tho.
When the Famas was first introduced in 1.6 the burst fire singlehandedly replaced all other rifles. At any distance it was the anti-awp with one quick burst. Now, I drop it when I see a Mac-10 laying around...
I think you missed something about why you will pick a FAMAS over UMP, because if you're good with it you've got a better chance in more situations to kill someone with an AK with the FAMAS than UMP, and you can pick up their gun either immediately or at the end of the round. So when you say ''even if you win the round you're broke next round if you upgrade'', but you can upgrade from enemy guns.
I remember the good old days when the only pistol that could kill you in 1 shot was the Deagle. when there were only 2 shotguns and they were both shit. The only reasonable Smg was the mp5. When famas was a beast in burst-fire mode. When the "I have $16000" gun was over $5000 not $2000 and still was worse than a glock. When granades were bigger then my head. When it took 5 smokes to really SMOKE a position . When Defuse Kit was $200 . When we had RIOT SHIELDS.
Just if you didn't know, the FAMAS burst has a spray pattern. 1 bullet straight, one slightly above, and the last way above. Compensateable, but it's not feasible to compensate in several bursts after each other, as you have to yank your aim pretty hard to compensate for the last bullet, due to the extreme difference between bullet 2 and 3, and the very high fire rate. If you don't compensate for the third bullet, though, you practically always lose a bullet of each spray.
Raise the cost of the UMP to $1400 and make pp-bizon $1200. Nerfing the UMP too hard would be detrimental to CT sides whose economy would become more shit than it already is. If the CT win the first gun round after losing pistol with two or less player then a nerfed UMP might guarantee a round loss and a reset.
FAMAS before-headshot hunter and also a possible comppetitor of the m4 FAMAS a few days later: *welcome back to the shitty guns club here with the UMP*
Just an FYI if you weren't aware, at the start of the game open console and type "record xxxxxxx" and you'll have a demo with the same tickrate as the server you played the match on.
The old FAMAS in Source, the burst fire put three rounds nearly on top of each other even at range. It was a budget, slow fire version of the AK. It could headshot with one burst. Now the burst sucks. Which is why I dont use it in GO.
Famas is probs my favourite assault rifle, I can spray with it very effectively and at long range manual bursts work well for me. It's all preference, and having famas+p250 is really nice
Sometimes I actually prefer the famas before the m4. My recommendation is to use famas on long on de_dust2 and also short on de_dust2. I don't know why but the only weapon I can play better with in those situations are the auto noobs
Got say, from my experience as a casual 5 man Cs go player, I find that guns like the famas and the Scout, they are guns of pure choice and person preference. As I personally can't stand the ump, the famas is often a go to force buy weapon or a good drop weapon for a teammate who would rather get nades + armour
To be honest I think it's both the FAMAS needs a buff and the UMP need a nerf. Before comparing it to the UMP, compare it to the Galil, as that is its main competitor, so to speak, as it's the same slot, but on different sides. Think about how the AK and the M4s compare. The AK is cheaper and does more damage, but the M4s have higher accuracy (and in the case of the A4, a higher rate of fire). The Galil/FAMAS comparison is almost completely inverse. Compared to the Galil, it really has no redeeming factors. It could use to have it's reload time shortened and it's damage drop off reduced for sure. Some other changes could be, but not all together, making its full auto inaccuracies on par with the Galil's, increasing its magazine to 30 rounds, and/or lowering it's price tag to around $2050. The UMP I think could use it's base damage reduced a little, probably to 30. With it's armor penetration value taken into account, that would bring it's base damage against armor below 20 damage. It would still be the highest damaging SMG in the game, but not by as much. Or, if not that, it could have its price increased to $1600. It would make it more of an "investment" SMG like the MP7 and P90, as well as give more reason to buy the MP7, if it doesn't have it's price reduced (but I digress). I wouldn't want to see it's reward cut in half really, as I don't think that would really solve the issues with it. Its issues stem from its core mechanics and not just the reward you get for getting kills with it.
I happen to love both the Galil and the Famas, but I feel like once I get better at the game I'll like the AK more.. but im terrible with spray patterns and accuracy atm
Make the FAMAS great again. Oh, the good old days, where I got a Famas, went to cover long, burst fire... Sniper killing machine. I believe CS:GO should either buff the FAMAS to all hell, or drop it altogether. Maybe change it for the AN-94?
Famas is made for the CTs and CTs are supposed to camp, so if you know hiding spots in the maps you play in, this can be really good, why not get the M4 well if you win the first round it is really good to use because if you die on the second round and you bought the M4 the enemy will be able to pick up your M4, and it will be really hard to comeback for the few upcoming rounds because, you are gonna have to save after or eco for a few rounds, but if you use the famas and you die with it they won’t have a a huge advantage because it would be really hard to rush with it the next round, because you would have saved more money and you can get better options to counter the famas this is why the famas is not really that bad
Famas burst mode got a nerf from CSS to CSGO that's for sure because in CSS Famas is a beast on range with burst mode on. Crouch for near instant headshot on range. I used it a bit too much and to the point I got banned for aimbotting by server admins. I took down several AWP users as well and they where not too happy about losing to a rifle. Otherwise the normal fire mode with famas is just fine for me.
UMP didn't need any nerfs. Up until these last changes with the release of Canals (May be getting the timeof change wrong) the UMP had effectively been unchanged for over a year. You'd see it in competitive play quite often, even if they had a UMP, the instant a rifle came available (Even a Famas) they went for that instead. The Famas probably should get some love though, of this I am certain.
If you just ignore the 2nd and 3rd shot the burst mode is usefull for 1tapping, which isnt possible with normal fire mode over long range in my opinion.
