That is a solid laptop. Between Tuxedo, Slimbook and System76 we have a nice selection of Linux machines out there these days. Of course we can't count out Valve with the Steam Deck either. Now if only we could buy these machines at the local electronics store. That way we might actually get some big adoption going.
The problem is it took WAY too long for current CPUs & GPUs to reach Linux laptops. I mean, I still can't find Intel 13th gen CPUs in any Linux pre-installed laptop!
I really want something like the Razer Blade 14 but with Linux. I don't like numpads on my keyboard but I do want a discrete GPU. This basically rules out Linux-first OEMs.
Really sad to see those with NVIDIA GPUs instead of AMD or anything else. NVIDIA GPUs and their closed source drivers are just a disrespect to consumers and I really can't support that. Good review either way, it's nice to see more out-of-the-box linux computers around!
To be fair, this year it doesn't seem like AMD Radeon GPUs have what it takes to compete with Nvidia at the top end. With Radeon RX 6000 & RTX 3000, the top end of each were both great (and I have an AMD Advantage laptop so I can attest to that), but not this year. I absolutely agree with Nvidia's 💩 proprietary drivers. Let's hope they keep open-sourcing their GPU drivers...
My thoughts exactly! Though, to be fair, I think it's an AMD supply issue. I mean, they're rarely seen worldwide. And I don't think it's because of lack of cooperation from laptop manufacturers. Hopefully the 7000 series will be much better at this, they need to, if they actually want market share.
Nice review! I am actually considering buying a Tuxedo. I do live in Europe. I'm currently rocking a 6 and a half year old Asus V752VM. Also 17.3", weights something like 4 kg, and the power brick another 1 kg. Seeing this as below 3kg is like "this is so easy now". And yes, I do use it as a desktop replacement. Before the pandemic I carried it daily to work, because I work on it, and at home I also game on it. It has a DVD drive, it has an USB type C port, DP port, HDMI port, I can literally do everything on it, as I wanted. I put 64 GB on it, because I like tabs and when I work I do have a lot of things opened. I also LOVE RamDisks, so much performance in some situations. Now, since my current laptop is starting to show its age, I do want a replacement for it, but with the same idea - powerful (though it doesn't have to be insane/maxed, especially on the GPU), able to do everything (though I can drop the DVD requirement now, I rarely use it anymore and I think I'll simply get a external USB one at one point). I do wish to eventually get to 128 GB of RAM, and preferably at something like 6000 MT/s. Which currently is not possible and I don't even know if 13th gen Intel or Ryzen 7000 series will be able to do. I might have to settle to 64 GB at 5600 to 6000 MT/s or 128 GB at 4800 or even 4400 MT/s. Or wait another full year (like Q2-Q3 2024). Sigh. I'd also like a model with an AMD GPU. Even if NVidia gets better support on Linux, for ethical reasons it's still a no-no for me. Other than that, I can't wait for the next Stellaris and Gemini models! They're the closest to what I want. I like the care for repairing too. To be frank, my first option, if it would be one, would've been Framework, but a) the only ship in UK and b) they have only one model right now which is VERY FAR to what I want/need. P.S.: the performance between 1080p SotTB and 2540x1600 is quite weird. It should be bigger. Something's off. Still, 100 FPS is still very good for that game. Oh, and I second that only one USB type C is too few for today. The ports in general, were at the bare minimum for a 17". They could add a couple more. And Thunderbolt or USB4 would be good to have too.
I love their products. I have my MacBook pro 2015 alive, but I will need to switch after a while. I hole Tuxedo will have an OLED option soon. Just don't want to downgrade my experience.
This looks great for high end gamers. For VFX (which is what I would most likely to use something like this for), colour fidelity of the monitor is paramount. 99% sRGB isn't great. Would expect p3 or at least full Adobe sRGB for something with these kind of specs.
On a 17 inch laptop, I disagree; many Windows OEMs have done that, but only Razer has been able to actually have good speakers on their Blade 17/18 from 2022 on.
while a laptop is kinda okay... mechanical keyboard on it is quite interesting... also - screw other people around xD hmmmmmm... now I'm a bit wavering in aiming for desktops only
Weird...but I think the buisness model is quite faulty. Why would I not buy a cheaper laptop (maybe with windows also) then install a Linux distribution in it for free or donating a amount I want directly to the distribution?
The premise is that this would be cheaper than a Windows laptop because of the proprietary operating system costs. If that premise doesn't hold true, then it is a problem. One advantage though is a garantee that your system will work as intended on GNU/Linux, without many issues you'd tipically encounter on some other manufacturers that don't even support coreboot natively
Would love to see you look at one of the current Thinkpad workstations (P series), some of which now come with the option of Linux pre-installed, in comparison with these Clevo-chassis-based heavy-duty laptops from Tuxedo, etc....
Lenovo would have to send him a review unit, which is less likely, I think. Smaller, specialized companies like Tuxedo are happy with channels like this, because it's the intended target audience and subscriber base is big for them. For Lenovo, not so much, but I may be mistaken.
@@michadybczak4862 I think Lenovo would be wise to try reaching Linux users on personal laptop markets though - ThinkPad's already work great with Linux and many love them for... not being crap. Sending some laptops to some top Linux RU-vid channels would be nothing to them, bigger investment would be to marketing them - and making it easier for end users to buy them. Just as a sidenote, I have an old 486 IBM ThinkPad I want to restore it to it's "original condition". Quotes, because I'm simply talking about OS it came with, and not the one that specific unit came with - it was available with Windows _or_ OS/2 and it gives me an excuse to have at least one working PC with OS/2, which I haven't had since '97. It's the famous "butterfly keyboard" ThinkPad, really cool.
For what it offers its still very expensive, also considering it has so much competition for lower prices, but yeah in case you want to help a company supporting linux and u got the money why not!
@@mrcvry macbook are a real competitor to this in terms of price, in terms of quality I personally think they exceed this by a margin in most tasks except gamming.
@@rey6253 True, and I have a few. The new M CPUs are great, but I need a fast Linux machine now. The fact that you can't boot Linux with the M machines anymore, and also Apple's new direction to monetize user data too, made me decide against a new Macbook.
Does the nvidia gpu limit you to only using X11 on a tuxedo machine? I don't use Wayland on my nvidia machines, because multimonitor just does not work.
Why "Linux laptop" companies don't do anything with recent AMD dGPU (RDNA2 or even 1)? I know that NVIDIA GPUs are generally dominant in the market, not without a reason, but it's also known that this doesn't necessarily go well together with Linux due to lackluster drivers. It's like they are missing their target audience.
For a while, I am looking for a laptop where I'd install Linux on. 2022 models it boils down to ASUS ROG Zephyrus G14, Legion Lenovo 7 Gen 7 and HP OMEN 16. However, the OMEN has mixed reviews (there are better choices for the price), Legion 7 has availability problems (and is not released in my country at all, despite neighbor countries do have them) and the G14 is small factor (y no network port?!). Sure, choice is a little bigger with older models - though no DDR5, maybe no MUX switch, and generally older hardware. All things considered, there's barely any choice. Missed opportunity by Tuxedo, Slimbook, System76 and alike I say.
Yes, I need a workstation laptop with good CPU and a decent GPU, I don't need beefy GPU for laptop, I hope I could find good AMD workstation laptops in future
@@cameronbosch1213 Good for you. Gen 8 is around the corner, so they might as well skip Gen 7 altogether, though Intel variant did show up few days ago.
This looks like the XMG Neo 17 (XMG I think partially owns an investment in Tuxedo) and the Eluktronics Mech-17, all of which use a Tongfang chassis. Just a heads up.
It's not that people don't like keypads, they just don't like _those_ keypads that are smaller than standard, spaced narrowly and are hopelessly useless.
It's a nice machine, but the price ain't. It's an impossible price to pay and absolutely not worth it, much like you hinted with a lower desktop. The keyboard loudness and lack of keyboard light are both instant deal-breakers either way. The single USB Type C can barely be forgiven cuz it's a 10Gb (1.2GB/s) one, for which you can buy an externally powered hub (technically a docking station, it seems).
I hope to see OLED screen options in Linux laptop world and PCIe 7 SD card reader. But how do the Tuxedo screens compare to Lenovo 1600p 500nit screens in Legion 5 pro g7, Legion Slim 7 g7, T14 g3? The Asus G14 for sure has better screen.
The price and... specs are a problem. Tuxedo had some cheaper, older model that was below 2000 EUR and I could max it and still have it below 2000 EUR. Now it's gone, and we have this Stelaris model, which is... too powerful and too expensive. I would be happy with 1080p and a bit older GPU. Now, we simply have no reasonable options. Either this super expensive one, or some way weaker ones. On one side, it's great that there is a model with best specs one can get, but why the cheaper one was gone when this one showed up? I currently have an old Alienware R17 and hoped to buy the 17-inch model under 2000 EUR once my current laptop will reach its end of life (still holding up, although after 2 battery replacements and one keyboard replacement). Now I have nothing to look for, because this Stellaris 17 Gen 4 is just too pricey for me and the previous model was pulled out.1500-2000 EUR is the sweet spot for me, but needs to have 17 inch display, good GPU, but not the newest one, and the screen 1080p is more than enough. I just don't see the lure of higher resolutions: they drain battery quicker, are more expensive, require stronger GPUs and CPUs, need scaling which is oftentimes problematic and offer ZERO perks. I had a laptop at work with 4K, 14-inch screen (ThinkPad) and wasn't too impressed. I quickly set 1080, because scaling, even on Windows was a nightmare and saw no real quality gain.
Not the best comparison, but at a much lower price point, I could buy an M1 macbook and run Asahi on it...which I think I would rather do. I'm definitely not the target audience, however, as I have many older devices I still use on the regular, including a laptop from 2008, and can't see myself ever paying anywhere near this for a device...
they have laptops for cheaper than the M1 (not sure where they lie on performance but they definitely have more compatibility), this laptop would be more reasonably compared the the M2 max, which while drawing significantly less power would not beat the performance of this machine nor even be capable of the primary function of this laptop... gaming
An excellent review, but... will they launch any models with the new AMD 7040 series? I'm looking to replace my laptop with a AMD 7040 series CPU laptop and I would love to have a Linux compatible one. I'm hoping to do this in the next 1-2 months, as soon as these CPUs will be launched.
Hopefully the stellaris 17 or 18 Gen 5 comes with a 7945hx and 7845hx options, More USBC ports that are USBC4, Both Nvidia and AMD options. (Since Linux could use some more 6800m's or 7800/7900m's ) and a Mini LED or OLED 1600p 240hz panel and maybe they'll also do a GAN 300w power brick. May just be 7945hx or Intel and the 4090 and down though
Great laptop. Now try do to one to compete in the low end market with the big OEMs,because by hitting the broader market of people who want a just works system for basic use and are tired of all the Windows problems,the Linux kernel can finally become popular enough to be a viable option.
I don’t like the nvidia gpu but I also understand why they used one instead. I much prefer the plug and play friendly aspect of amd, the open source nature of it and the significantly better price to performance ratio. However one negative of amd gpu’s is that, unlike their cpus, they tend guzzle power especially compared to their nvidia equivalents. For desktop gpu’s it’s not that big a deal but for laptops with their limited power budget that’s really critical, especially when go for anything high mid range or above. Because of that I only recommend amd integrated gpu’s on laptops and you kinda are forced into nvidia if you want a high end dedicated gpu. Amd is just too power hungry to compete on performance or battery life.
380 Nits for display brightness is a total dealbreaker. Anyone looking for the kind of performance wouldn't compromise on such a *literally* lack-luster display. Overpriced in my opinion. I'd wait for Clevo to update their chassis/display combos before spending that much.
Nothing in the specs matters, if you have this unusable keyboard. How this layout could be for productivity? They simply should stop using those strangely positioned arrows on the keyboard.
Seems a good machine. But I stopped using anything less than 4K many years ago. It would be a downgrade for me. I wonder if this would be noticeable on that screen.
I experienced the joys of slipping water over a laptop two months ago when that happened to me at work with my ThinkPad X240. I know, Nick, you suggest to buy native Linux laptops but picking up a replacement X260 was super cheap and I can keep using all my accessories. Still, that big chonker you show here looks cool... except for nVidia Graphics.
Hmmm for some reason I dont believe in the use case for these types of devices anymore especially for work and with the cost. I like to carry something slim around and if I have a high performance task you simply RDP onto a high performance computer in a data centre or at home run the task then go back to normal.
Re: Thunderbolt - its a shame that this laptop doesn't have a USB-4 port. Granted - not many Zen 3+ devices do (I think there's one Asus laptop and a few small mini and desktop OEMs), and even the new Zen 4 devices (that are still few and far beween) don't all have USB-4 ports, but the platform is capable and the drivers are there, but you can't use these without a certified USB-4 port, which this laptop doesn't have. Now about Thunderbolt: there's a lot of confusion there, but as far as I understand, a USB-4 port will connect and feed basically any Thunderbolt 3 device. Thunderbolt 4 devices are a bit more picky, but if your USB-4 is 40GBps and you use certificate Thunderbolt 4 cables - it should also work. The USB-4 port is basically Thunderbolt except that Intel (after releasing donating the Thunderbolt 3 spec to USB-IF) released Thunderbolt 4 as a set of required specifications that exceed the minimum USB-4 requirements, but if your device has USB 40GBps and just doesn't have a Thunderbolt icon because certification is expensive - it should work with all devices.
Hi Nick. I understand that this laptop seems solid, but as you've been using Tuxedo and Slimbook laptops for a while, which brand would you recommend as strength and durability are concerned? How do the hinges (for example) age? Thanks!
They both use the same base chassis, so they age in the same way! The oldest laptop I have is a Slimbook Pro X 14 from 2 years ago, and I have 0 issues with it, the hinge is still super solid, it only has one minor scratch on the lid (I lugged it around every day for a full year in a bag with cables), and no hardware problems at all!
I really need to cover this in a video. Nvidia support on Linux is good these days, these preconceived notions must be explored, because in my experience they don’t hold up today
@@TheLinuxEXP It's decent except for RTX 4000. I have so many issues with my 4090 desktop on Wayland. One of which is that Plasma used to work on Wayland, but now it black screens if I try to use Wayland after an update. Literally makes my desktop unusable on Linux.
@@TheLinuxEXP use a laptop 3070 and it’s a significantly worse experience than AMD. The kernel drivers suck and sometimes don’t recognize the GPU and making nvidia drivers work with secure boot is really tedious and inconsistent. Also Wayland support is pretty bad since you can’t do something as basic as pick GPU power profiles. It’s definitely getting better though. Edit: Even if you get everything working you have to taint your kernel in the best case scenario, so that’s annoying as well since it messes with GNOME’s security page.
Clevo chassis? Looks like it has the same unique design features as clevo's PD series but I cannot find an AMD version on their website (which has always been bad). Clevo are the main OEM for most "custom" laptop companies. EDIT: Seems to be a Clevo PC70HS.
@ Yeah, thats whats holding them off for being a real option for me, most likely will end up with a laptop from System76 or maybe even just a Windows laptop with linux on it
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@@SimisearOfficial I think System 76 also uses Clevo cases but not sure.
There's no option for ANSI? BTW, what's the difference between US ISO and US ANSI?
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@@cameronbosch1213 US-ISO uses the uses keylayout for 95% of the keys but on an ISO physical keyboard layout. Imagine it like buying a Nordic or German keyboard and changing the keycaps.
The new Stellaris with Intel 13th gen does have Thunderbolt 4 with a direct dGPU connection on it and the HDMI port, but the laptop still only has one and still no USB-C charging for quick trips to the local coffee shop! 😬
I think he's comparing it to MacBook Pros from late 2012 - 2020, which literally had batteries glued to the chassis. They've reversed that, but at the cost of soldering everything else.
Id love one, but Im over here in Australia & the idea of sending it back in case of warranty Im not so sure. I also enquired about the brick power supply for a previous model & they were not about to confirm the brick would handle 240v 50hz we use here. So for the price & uncertainty, Im holding off. Having said that there doesnt seem to be anyone here in Australia that does Linux laptops & they certainly dont stock these units
I didn't see you review the bios selection. Does the stellaris sleep function work with the modified bios from Tuxedo computers? Does the wifi/bluetooth shutoff and also the selection of fan speed curves works well in bios/uefi?
@David there is and it's called RISC cpu group but in order to boot the system every modern systems uses standartized instructions (of course every manufacturer has it's differences) and the point of a standart, a protocol is make things easier to work. Intel manufacturers uses their assembly not any third party OS and then if you know how to process assembly you can make your own OS etc. like windows, linux or mac. of course you cannot gain full control of newly released intel specific cpu (if manufacturer wants only closed source) and there is a compatibility issues as well this is why there are recommended linux hardwares to use..
@David oh, plus the topic is bios programming which is related to motherboards and that is something a small firm can handle on its own even make their own cards..
Just ran GB6 on my old 2021 M1 Pro... and I've still got an advantage with about 2230/11600 on single/multi. And that's not even trying (I left about 20 browser windows, multiple IDEs, Slack, etc. all open and didn't bother to do anything beforehand). I don't have an M2 Pro/Max to test, but my M2 iPad Pro got even higher (over 2450) on single core, and still managed to hit about 9000 on multicore. AMD's got to step up their game on high performance portables. 😏
This company literally makes my dream leptops imagine a leptop with both windows and fedora, perfection. it's really unfortunate that they don't ship to Turkey, I do have some relatives who live in Germany but yeah.
Pure distilled water actually does not conduct electricity - but that's complicated and a bit more maintenance than most people would entertain. I have seen 3.3 kV systems that used water cooled busbars.
Hopefully you’ll get your hands on the new Pangolin at some point. I gotta know more about that display and build quality, I’m a fan of the specs at least.
