Surely a two time Overwatch League champion knows how overtime works Socials: / supertf / discord.gg/supertf / super_ow Editor: stefayylmao / stefayylmao1 Intro & Outro songs are from the Catherine OST: Thus Spoke Brooks & Lost
Hi, so I’m no expert, but I don’t see how he’s right. Like, if he had said “you can be at 98%, so long as the other team is at 98% and has triggered ot, and then ot won’t trigger again and the game just ends”, but given the context of the game he played, and his testing, what he said just seems wrong. And I’m saying this as someone who had no fucking idea how ot was triggered. But after the testing, and explanation of the 3 second = 96.5% thing, it just all seemed to prove him wrong. No hate or arguing please, just understanding lol
@@endk.3500 He's human just like anyone else and we all have biases. The situation he was in was different from the one at the end. If OT isn't triggered first, then if you cap back with a percentage starting between 96.5% and 99%, OT is triggered, I guess?
i love how super is one of the most widely known and recognizable content creators/streamers in comp ow but whenever he tries talking to his team nobody responds like he doesnt exist
@@apocalypseap I used to play a lot of Widow HS custom games, and some times streamers/owl players would join, and back then being a plat scrub you can’t believe that “the real X” joined, (especially when once Muma joined and everyone in the lobby would destroy him time and time again). But you can always check their profile to see if they’re “the real X”
I remember having a ranked game where the score was 3-3 on kings row. The game only allowed us to play 1 tie breaker as attack tho and we lost the attack but we lost the whole game instead of a draw. Can someone explain?
I guess Bap died on point, so its that bug where you got beat in spawn, because you spawn and then get teleported. He spawned on point, contested for a millisecond and then went to spawn
you have to be on point for 0.5 seconds in order to contest, therefore the death spawning bug doesn't trigger contest. If it did it would probably be more noticeable
pretty sure its just the 96.5% thing chat was talking about. happens to me all the time at 97% and if its passed 96.5% it probably rounds up to 97%. its been like this forever and i hate it
If you think about it, if the 3 second rule was in place, it would actually be BETTER to be at 98 than 99. Here’s why: If you had the point at 99% and capture it back, it ALWAYS triggers OT. Everyone knows this. Standard OT lasts 5 seconds, which is how much time the team has to contest. However, if you capped it back at, say, 98.9%, and OT DIDN’T trigger, then that would be the 3 second rule + ~1.2 seconds of capturing progress, giving a grand total of 3 + 1.2 = 4.2 seconds, which means that having the point at a LOWER percentage is actually an advantage. I know that there’s still gonna be a lot of people arguing in this comment thread, regardless of whoever explains it, so we should all just wait for someone to make a video on how this mechanic works and how it should be fixed.
I've lost a game to the enemy team having 98% then re-capping after killing our team, we didn't get OT. My friends have lost games for the same reason too. He's not crazy, Overwatch is inconsistent BS.
I’ve had this happen countless times, both to myself and the enemy team. I think Super is right, it doesn’t make sense why it would work in the way chat was saying.
Ok so here's how I think it works : In the game's code, instead of having percentages, it uses a timer just like in 2CP. In 2CP if you touch the point when the timer is at or below 3 seconds you get overtime. However in KOTH you use 2 TIMERS, one for Blue Team, one for Red Team : When Blue Team has the point, its timer decreases and vice-versa for Red. First team to deplete its timer wins (btw going from 0 to 100% takes exactly 120 seconds so it wouldn't be impractical to use timers). Let's imagine Blue Team gets to 97%, that would mean they have approximately 2.5 seconds on the clock left. Red Team caps point, so the game registers that at 2.5 seconds on Blue's clock, someone touched point. Then Blue's timer freezes and Red's timer starts going down. If Blue cap back, the timer goes down to 0 seconds and then the game is like ''Oh but wait, at 2.5 seconds someone touched point, okk I need to trigger overtime'' And that's what happened, you don't need to touch point 3 ingame seconds before it reaches 99%, you need to touch when the TIMER is below 3 seconds, which could have happened 3 ingame minutes ago. In 2CP this isn't a problem because the timer never stops and represents actual ingame time. I can't know for sure if that's actually how the game is coded but it seems to be the only explanation. Additionally the game would work like this if Blizzard just took 2CP's timer and overtime mechanics and just pasted it on to KOTH (which is the smartest thing to do). Anyway thanks for coming to my TED Talk and I hope I was clear enough in my explanations.
Yea I kinda feels like the priority of overtime logic is 'if the non-cap reach 97 or higher' -> 'If the non-cap team touches the point 3 secs ago' -> 'If the non-cap team touches the point before it reaches 97' , blizzard probably did this overwhelming logic to avoid latency issues since timer should proceeds on server's side - therefore local touching point event might happened slightly later than the 97% when it ticks on super's screen.
This doesn’t explain the end of the video, though. Super does the same scenario, except he just waits till his bar is 99 before handing over the point. Theoretically, the red timer should still “know” that he touched the point at ~98% and trigger overtime if that’s how it actually works, but it doesn’t trigger.
@@willowpets I honestly don't know for sure why that happens but I do have a guess (Again, no actual proof that this is how the game works, just the best answer I can offer). In all other scenarios overtime triggered but in the last one, it didn't. The only difference with all the others tests is that overtime triggered for Blue Team then Red capped back so I guess the problem should be there. My guess is that since Red capped in Overtime the game doesn't apply the usual ''3 second'' rule but instead just says ''If someone is on point when the timer reaches 0 trigger Overtime, if not then just win''. This mechanic would actually make sense to prevent infinite overtime scenarios. If OT were to trigger then Blue has a chance to cap back, then when they do Blue's timer goes in overtime, which gives time for Red to cap back etc... This mechanic makes it so that if both teams are about to win, it hard punishes the team that gets off point for too long. I actually don't think that's exactly it though, at least, I'm just missing something, at worst, I'm completely wrong lmao.
Probably one of the greatest steams I've ever been a part of, I was howling. You have to give it to Matthew, he's the OWL golden child and plays this game as a career being one of the most top tier players to ever play OW. The fact he could post this with humility is respectable.
Theres a video by Marblr released on May 19, 2022 explaining that OT happens earlier than you think, titled "Overtime Happens Sooner on Control Than Other Modes".
Call KarQ! He should know, although his video doesn’t talk about this specific situation. Also; when a player respawns, their “body” first respawns and then immediately gets teleported to spawn. This means there is a split second where the body “exists” where it died. KarQ once accidentally nano:ed a body like this, and made this interaction more known. I think in the real comp game, the Bap who died respawned on point and “touched” it before getting teleported back to spawn. That’s what triggered Overtime! Hopefully this PHENOMENON gets more known in the future. Love everything that you do, it’s really true what Cavalry said, you kinda saved OW❤️
Super actually had this mechanic trigger in one of his previous videos where he respawned as Rein on Rialto and got shields from a Lucio Beat that had been used across the map.
I actually slowed down the footage and it seems that the lucio is the person who triggered it, his outline shows up just before he goes to spawn and right before OT
It seems likely to me that within this game's spaghetti code, the capture percentage is treated as a clock that lasts for 99*1.2 seconds and gets paused when the other team has capped the point. Therefore, if OT is programmed to happen when the other team touches the point when there are 3 or fewer seconds left on the clock, when you flip the point past ~96.5%, you touched the point with
He’s actually correct though. The only thing he’s missing is that the 3 second timer stops when he caps the point. For example: red team has 98% -> is approx 2.5s away from winning -> blue team caps -> red team timer is stopped at 2.5s. When red team caps back, the timer 'remembers' that blue team touched 2.5s ago -> OT is triggered. That’s totally independent from the real in game time. That last example is somewhat special bc (I guess) the game overrides both timers as soon as one OT has been triggered. If it didn’t do that, it would have to swap between OT indefinitely.
9:34 Percentage increase on a KOTH map is one second. For example, the increase from 71 to 72 and so on takes one second. With this in mind, if a team recaptures the point and they have 97-99% of the objective completed, OT will still trigger, because 97-99 is within the three seconds of the given time frame needed to trigger OT. With the exception of 96.5%, if a team recaptures a point at 97%, OT will still trigger because it is within the final three seconds of the necessary objective capture. The game recognizes that someone has at one point during the game, touched the point at 97%, causing OT to activate, since 97% is within the last three seconds of point capture.
It’s because it’s based on time, as soon as you capture the point the “ 3 second timer” that decides whether or not overtime triggers will kick in. Because the game thinks their was an opposing team member on the objective right up till the point the objective is turned over to the opposite team it won’t start the 3 secs until that switch over, thus creating the triggered OT due to the game thinking the enemy was touching it . Because 96.5% is exactly 3 seconds away from the 100% capture it will always trigger OT. This will not result in OT only if OT was already in progress as the game would continue to keep triggering a new 5 seconds of OT making the capture even more difficult.
They get ot if they touch after 96/97%. Since the point was theirs when you capped at 96% they got ot. I'd usually say it happens only for 97%+, but apparently it was late 96%, so it still counted. The 3 second rule counts even when you cap back when the point is 3 seconds before or closer from being secured, because the opponent did touch it 3 seconds of less before (since it was theirs). It is weird that it triggered on 96%, but I guess it was late 96% so because of how the game counts time it worked. 11:55 "But I didn't touch it" Yes you did, as the point was yours. KarQ says that 1%=1.2, and he also says that it'll trigger ot as long as you touch after 96.5%. All of this makes sense. The confusion was caused by the fact that you didn't realise that team A capturing the point counts as contesting, so when team B capps it back ot triggers if team A had captured when team B progress was 96.5% or more. Repeating myslef here, just making sure it's clear. I haven't played the game nearly as much as super, and I trust his judgement, so a plausible theory may be that this particular mechanic (triggering ot or not if the point is capped back when it's a 96,5%) might have been changed. I don't believe this is the case, as it probably would have been in the patch notes and would have been covered by creators, but it is a possibility.
The simpler explanation is that it just assumes if the other team is gaining percentage it means someone is on point. So it assumes someone was on in the last 3 secs. This seems like some wraparound logic that has no reason to be in the game. It's be really easy to just keep track of both teams ot. Edit: could also just be that the game has a "contested" state for the point and that's what it uses to track if someone was on point. One of the things that sets that state is capping. Since you were on the point and capping it the game thinks it was contested, so someone was on point in the last 3 secs, ot triggers.
@@lot8113 On pc now so I can write some pseudo code while percentOne < 100: if opposingPlayer in peopleOnPoint: secsSinceLastContest = 0 if percentOne == 99 and secsSinceLastContest
@@shiverian5970 the 98/99 thing comes down to the discrepancy between seconds and percents. As for the rest, your code is exactly how I would write it, except that programming in a game like overwatch is far more complicated. The amount of things to keep track of forces Devs to optimise the code to a much greater degree, to the point where most amateur coders would struggle to understand it all. I think your argument makes sense, but I also struggle to think that ow Devs would write code similar to this to manage the ot trigger in game. Their code probably looks much different, and that leads me to avoid conclusions (on why the game behaves the way it does) based on my own programming skills and knowledge (or - likewise - based on the ones of someone I can understand the code of). I don't know how good you are at programming, but unless you are a dev working for big company or making big games I think my point stands. Rather, I would approach the issue basing myself on game logic. I can't come up with a coherent explanation now, but I think that either you're right conceptually - as in, it has something to do with the way the game processes the ot trigger on both teams, but on a more macro level I'd imagine - or, more likely in my opinion, it is a somewhat intentional mechanic, surfaced during development and then left in, or added intentionally for reasons beyond me. Again, I do not know what your level of programming skills is, but mine is certainly not sufficient to come up with a sound explanation of such a phenomenon. I cannot even begin to wrap my head around my own wilder interpretations of the whole thing, so I suppose I'll live with the doubt. I really hope this video from super sparks further investigation from KarQ or other creators, as now, with this eternal doubt, I will struggle to sleep, for my mind will endlessly wonder in a riot of variables, constants, ifs, whiles, zeroes and ones. Sorry bro, really got into the writing there somewhere, I hope you don't mind.
@@lot8113 Oh yeah my programming skills are not even close to the realm of making games. I learned some python and im happy with it for the small things I do. I also don't know why the devs would have something like this in game but I assume it stems from them not differentiating between different teams enough. Why that happened i dont know. Thanks for taking the time to have this conversation lol, usually this doesnt happen on the internet
Hey stefayy, im pretty down bad with Covid rn, and while I couldnt enjoy Christmas with my family, I just wanna say that these daily uploads and edits always cheer me up. Thank you bro, much love.
Karq was agreeing with Super. They were both talking about the window of time when someone needs to touch point to trigger overtime, but in Super's game, nobody from the enemy team touched point. That's why Super was confused. So the scenario that Karq and Super were talking about was: -Team A has point -Team B touches 3 seconds before Team A hits 99% (In Karq's words, Team A is at >96.5%) -Overtime is triggered. But the scenario in Super's game was: -Team A gets point to 96% -Team B captures point, gets it to 60% -Team A captures point back -The important part: Nobody from Team B touches point! Based on the 3 second rule that Karq and Super discussed, someone from Team B should have had to touch at this moment. -Overtime is triggered anyways tl;dr Both Super and Karq were talking about the window when someone from the opposing team needs to touch, which is 3 seconds before 99% is reached (about 96.5%). But the confusion was that nobody on the opposing team touched within that window in Super's game.
Nono. Look at 2:00 at .25 speed. The right side of point, Cheerios(their bap) get's respawned for one frame before he's transported across the map back in spawn. Must have been transported across the point as well, triggering OT.
Nono. Look at 2:00 at .25 speed. The right side of point, Cheerios(their bap) get's respawned for one frame before he's transported across the map back in spawn. Must have been transported across the point as well, triggering OT.
@supertf It was because your teams percent was at 96 when it flipped, so 3 seconds till overtime. The game must have thought that they were on point until it flipped.
Nah, it's because the team with 96 is the attacking / non-controlling team. It seems the "bug" occurs when ot is already activated and then a team caps back with 96.6 - 99.9% which probably happens a lot in comp and owl games and that is almost more likely than capping back prior to ot
I think that it happens because there was an overtime less than 3 secs ago and it was not 99% so it caps instantly and skips the overtime but if u have 96.5% or more and no overtime in the last 3 secs, there will BE an overtime
Dear lord this was too funny. For probably 10 mins I was wondering when this will switch to the usual gameplay and it never did. Its just 15 minutes of Super having a breakdown. Amazing.
The point has two states of being capped and it treats those as two objectives, so if you were there for the last 3 seconds of the enemy having point (state 1) and then change it to yours (state 2), it saves the conditions in state 1 while state 2 is active and then when it goes back to state 1, since you were there in the last 3 seconds of that state, that's why OT triggers
The reason this happens is cause there’s no double overtime in ow the first ot trigger prevents the 2nd from having its trigger unless it has the hard stop of a player being on point
the reason he didn’t get overtime at the end is because it was already triggered on his team capture. If no overtime has been activated, it will almost always become overtime after capturing at 96-97%. Some examples are, if the score is 50% against 96% and you have just recaptured 96%, that will become overtime no matter what. If it is 99% against 99%, overtime will ONLY be triggered again if you touch within 3 seconds.
Idk how super has played the game for this long but doesn't realize that every percent on control you gain is 1 second each so when it's at 97% it will garentee say overtime
When you touch the point within that last 3 seconds of the cap it tells the game to trigger overtime. Once you get to the trigger it stays that way no matter how long after the other team stays off the point.
I love how he got pissed at the guy for killing him and capping too fast, and then explained that they had to wait 3 seconds when Super had 8% on the board
Could have something to do with lucio applying beat to someone as they spawn. It’s as if the moment a character respawns the game acts as if they are in the place they died for a brief moment. Beat touches your death place as you spawn you get beat. You die on point and contest when you spawn?
