Not one normally to comment .However the professional quality of your videos is astounding . The lighting , soft focus behind, the close ups, animation, stills, and content is on a par with any TV show. The audio is the best I hear on RU-vid ...But most of all I find your instruction, commentary and gems of information a treasure trove. Thank you Mick you are very talented and your humble attitude very endearing .
Totally agree. Even if I already knew every bit of information in it, I would still watch the whole video just for the visual joy and appreciation of its quality in general
To avoid the back-and-forth process of balancing the spring tension I like the method taught in the StewMac book. Start with the springs loose which means loosening the claw a few turns. They suggest cutting a block of wood that keeps the trem stationary while the strings are brought to pitch and then you tighten the springs until the block releases and then it is balanced. This is a very quick and accurate method. Highly recommend getting the StewMac book on electric guitar set ups. It has changed everything for me.
A couple points about the blocking off part. I experimented many years ago with different woods, and the harder the wood, the better the sustain was. So I found that an oak block was the best, didn’t have anything harder around the shop. Also, if you remove the springs, you also might sever the ground lead to the strings, as it’s soldered to the claw, so if you pull the springs and the claw, you need to connect the ground lead directly to the bridge.
When you block the trem and remove the springs you also remove the connection from the strings to the ground wire. You might want to clamp a wire between the sustain block and the woodblock to reconnect it to the ground wire to prevent your weird noise. (Especially when your neighbor is a radio amateur)
This is a really important point, far more important than body cavity shielding with either conductive paint or copper foil. Serious geeks can look into shock stopping resistors and the like... Have fun.
There may be a ton of these videos online, but very few of this quality and patient detail of explanation. The graphical representations were a huge plus. Kudos for once again making high quality content.
I agree, and would add: the information in this video is accurate. I've seen videos where the presenter lacks an understanding of balancing strings and springs, and makes incorrect statements. Mick clearly understands the physics, and puts it across well.
Tuning tip - when you’re tuning a floating vibrato, it’s easier if you alternate from the outside in rather than tuning sequentially from low to high (or heavy gauge string to lighter gauge strings). So instead of tuning low e, then moving to the a string - go from the low e to the high e string, then the a string, then the b string, etc. I believe it’s something to do with balancing the impact of the heavier string gauges with getting the lighter gauge strings closer to their end point earlier. I think I read about this back in Dimebag Darrell’s column in Guitar World back in my Floyd Rose high school metal phase, but it’s a really handy trick and it works!
For Floyd rose- Put a block of something under the rearward end to hold the bridge at your preferred angle without the strings. Tighten the claw a bit. Change strings. Stretch, tune & lock down. Remove the block and let the strings go sharp. Loosen the claw till it’s back in tune and that’s where you had it before you started. May sound complicated it’s quick and simple and always works. I don’t use anything like a Floyd anymore but I did for years and this procedure cured me of many headaches. I could do it in 5-10 minutes.
@@michaeljarvis5489 maybe a bit less pointless… but yeah before I figured that out it was always a painful and frustrating not to mention protracted exercise. :-)
The method which I've used when setting up a floating bridge (and that also helped with Floyd Rose): 1. Block the bridge going backwards with something at a height at which I prefer it set. 2. Tune the guitar (with strings already stretched) 3. Remove the thing that's been blocking the bridge and then adjust the screws in the claw (tighten or loosen them up) so that the guitar goes back in tune. This method significantly reduces the time needed for the string tension to match the tension of the springs.
You have the correct method to set the tremolo to equalize ore perfectly match the pull of the strings. Using the vibrato arm after this setup the strings should always return to correct tuning.
Only just started the video but I have to say the Frudua method from FruduaTv channel was all I ever needed to get my american strat to stay in tune. Not only does it stay in tune or reset easily with the trem bar, but you can adjust the claw a bit to get the Carl V intervals. Or you can lock it down and enjoy a serviceable guitar just with less personality. On my american I like it "free floating" except it can only be tightened by a tiny bit, I can divebomb down in pitch but I can raise pitch just enough to keep interesting wobbles that strats are known for
A note on intonation and action when using a fully floating setup: Firstly, regardless of how you set your bridge-plate, the design of the strat bridge means that the pivot point is where the screws meet the back of the plate, and any adjustment in saddle height is not a perfectly up and down motion, it is a radius. This means that when you are adjusting your saddle height be mindful that you are also making an adjustment to your intonation (a small one but still). Ok on the topic of fully floating bridges... Since your bridge-plate is not parallel to the strings, any change in intonation will change your action; As the saddle moves further forward or back on the bridge-plate, it is also going up and down that "ramp". Just be mindful if you are setting up a fully floating bridge, that you will need to go back and forth, balancing your intonation screws and height adjustment screws until both are set correct, as changing one changes the other :)
That's why setting the bridge plate parallel to the strings is the recommended method for setting up full floating bridges. When the plate is parallel to the strings, changes in saddle height do not affect intonation and vica versa.
Bear in mind a blocked trem does NOT sound like a true hardtail; you may not hear the springs, but you'll still hear the cavity, the block and the bridge hardware. I'm certain that Eric Clapton blocks the trem on at least SOME of his Strats, but once that's done, WHY leave the arm dangling? But I'm sure he does it for sonic reasons. Making the 'floating' tension adjustments as shown will NOT be accurate; the weight of the guitar is on the neck cradle. It matters, if only a little. Adjustments should be made with the guitar in the vertical, playing position, same as when setting the intonation. I'm sure it was shown this way for educational purposes, the better for you to see what's happening. LAST thing, a minor point you've missed is that along with the trem arm spring, there's a ball bearing that needs to go in first; some blocks have a hole at the bottom of the arm well, and the bearing prevents the spring fouling and getting stuck. DO NOT toss in a spring from a ball point pen; you could ruin the whole damned thing, please don't ask how I know.
Mick, great video. I too have played Strats for over 35 years. My 1964 used to stay in perfect tune no matter how hard I dive bombed it. Then one day it started going out of tune and I was totally bewildered. I then went on the "how does this darn thing work" quest. Long story short, most of the sticking is at the top of the saddles. The tremolo was definitely originally designed by Leo to float 1/8" off of the body like Fender recommends. This puts the saddle tops at more of a perpendicular angle to the string/saddle contact and the body. Highwood Vintage Contour saddles completely solved all of my tuning issues because the groove is a perfect place to store some Teflon grease. When you deck your tremolo, the tuning stability decreases (when dive bombing) mainly because the break angle of the string increases on the top of the saddles and that last little movement of the saddle when the plate finally contacts the body, increases the friction on top of the saddle and the string sticks and pulls the string ever so slightly sharp when the saddle tilts backward (away from the nut). Wear grooves on the top of the vintage saddles definitely exacerbates this friction. It happens more on the plain strings because the winding on the bass strings tends to prevent the string from sticking. The groove and the grease completely eliminates that friction. Also, the groove in the Highwood has slightly more contact area where the string contacts the saddle top and reduces the sharpness of the contact area that you get on a vintage saddle. Some don't care for changing the tone by using the Highwoods but they do increase sustain slightly and I personally don't notice any tonal change, albeit ever so slight.
@@ThatPedalShow Mick, take a look at your patent application schematic (Fig. 4) and you will see what I mean. Notice that the saddles are perfectly perpendicular to the guitar body. This is by design and not just for good looks. You can see the full float which actually looks a little more than 1/8." It was designed for a nice, gentle 1956 warble. Leo didn't realize what his invention was capable of until Jimi Hendrix came along and broke all of its design barriers. I think Leo even commented something like "it was never designed to do that." Also notice that the string block is just about centered in the block route (Fig. 2) which restricts the amount of up and down movement possible when it is floating as designed. There are three places in the patent that mention "limited pivotal movement." That also kept the strings from sliding too much on the top of the saddles and kept them rolling gently over the crowns of the saddles. He must have had a heart attack when he saw Jimi jumping up and down on the whammy bar, lol. Nowadays, after Hendrix broke all the rules, we have excess string sliding, more friction, more string breakage, more string sticking, and more out-of-tune notes. I'm not sponsored by Highwood but they certainly made a saddle that addresses the friction problem and they weren't even designed to do that. It was a serendipitous side effect. They were originally designed to keep the height adjustment screws from sticking up excessively above the saddles and cutting your hands.
An oft ignored way to address the angle of the high strings over the nut is adjusting the height of the string tree(s) with spacers. I see a lot of "strats" where the tree(s) are screwed flush to the headstock, pulling the sharpest angle.
I have (and love) a 6-screw vintage bridge Mexican Strat... replacement vibrato bridges are difficult to find that drop in (because of the MIM screw spacing). New flat saddles from GraphTech are much more comfortable than stamped steel with exposed pokey allen screws, and a Tusq XL nut (and string trees) are also fantastic for nearly eliminating friction. Great video!!
Just to mention, because it wasn't mentioned: If you block the vibrato with a piece of wood and take out the springs permanently, the strings are not grounded anymore, so you'd have to attach the grounding wire to the vibrato-block.
@@Healcraft you got my comment wrong: if you want to block the vibrato and take out all springs, then the strings won't be electrical connected to ground anymore, so you'd have to re-wire the grounding cable to have your strings electrically connected to ground...
of course you can tight the vibrato until nearly no action, but blocking it with wood also has a better soundconnection to the body and also no issues when changing strings. PS: I personally use my vibrato, if I did not want to, I'd block it and remove all springs @@Healcraft
FULL FLOATING! The cons about string bending can be easily overcome by holding the bar still as you bend. Its a technique that takes a bit of getting used to, but once you get it, this technique can be used in other ways that can be extremely dynamic and interesting.
@@GregorHoul you CAN just bend with the bar but it sounds different. If you want to bend one string while other unbent strings are ringing then you can't bend with the bar. The problem with the trem is that when you bend that one string the other unbent strings drop in pitch. This is why I hold the bar still. This bend should operate the way it does on a hard tail if you do it right. The best of both worlds.
Now adopted by plumbers for sealing joints, PTFE "Perfect Trem For Everyone" tape was developed in Leo's laboratory as a solution to whammy bar thread issues.
PTFE was discovered in 1938 by a DuPont chemist. It was used in 1942 to make corrosion resistant components for the atomic bomb. Leo's big claim to fame was bringing Ford assembly line type manufacturing to the guitar building business.
@@Les537 Yep, I do as well, however in some trem equipped guitars, (Squiers, some Pacificas), the block is drilled through at the trem bar channel, so you can't use a spring in there. What really annoys me though, is why we should have to resort to remedying an inherent fault in the threading of the block/bar ratio. I mean when you screw a bolt into a nut in any other situation, the resulting union is rock solid! So why are trem units so slack!!! Aghhh...
Just on the decked vibrato versus a hardtail, there is still a bit of that spring sound that you can't get with a hardtail. I've been playing my Strats with a decked vibrato for years, but still love that vibe that the springs in the back give. And regardless of how decked the vibrato is, it's never completely fastened to the body like a hardtail, so it always has a tiny bit of movement and give in it. I personally prefer the vibrato decked because I'm often changing to different alternate and open tunings on my Strats, and I can bend or capo anywhere or anyhow with no concerns. But I'd never go for a hardtail. There's still a vibe with a decked vibrato and springs banging around in the body. Plus, if I just deck the bridge then I still get to pick the Strat I want without being limited to hardtails. Great video though Mick, I enjoyed that!
I have my trem fully floating. String changing is easy as long as you are happy with the original set up and are changing like for like in terms of string gauge. All I do is use a set of feeler gauges to wedge the bridge into position. Then I slacken off and replace the strings. Tuning to pitch is then quick as the springs in the guitar are pretensioned and the feeler gauge usually falls out when the strings are at the correct pitch.
I can answer one of your questions... in my city across twelve different musical stores... There is a total of one hardtail strat available for purchase. Robert cray signature series for $1600.... the only other hard tail advertised are custom shop versions for $4500.... so that should answer why people block their trem vs. Buying a hardboiled version 😅
I’ve never been a serious strat player, but I found this utterly fascinating. Thank you again for the time, effort and knowledge you’ve shared. Like always, TPS does not let us down 🙌
One tip for multi-string bends with a floating team. It is actually possible to do them in-tune. If you rest the back of your picking hand on the bridge, you can apply some counter-pressure to keep the bridge from getting pulled along with the bend. One easy drill is to pick a note and while picking that note over and over, bend an adjacent string (no need to pick the ‘bent’ note during this drill) and listen to the note while applying pressure to the bridge. Varying the hand pressure by on the bridge, you can listen for how much pressure is needed to keep the note in-tune. You’ll soon develop a natural feel for how to counter the notes being pulled out of tune during an adjacent bend. 👍
There is a big con to a floating vibrato that you failed to mention. This con may be specific to me and how I play but I would suspect it's likely quite common and that is that I tend to rest my hand on the bridge. The result is that even the slightest bit of downward pressure on the bridge will noticeably impact the tuning. As I said, this playing "style" may be particular to me but I suspect it's a much more common position.
Yes, same with me. I tend to rest my hand on the bridge, and while I have a Floyd Rose system, it has three same effect. BTW, I thought I wanted a FR, but I hate it! I'm seriously considering taking the "clamp" part off of the nut, and replacing the nut with a GraphTek one. I really hate it, it makes it a pain to change anything, and it's totally unnecessary. A properly setup and maintained Strat-type trem (vibrato) is fine.
The trick is to rest you hand closer to the pivot point. If yuu're on a Strat type trem, you may want to change saddle screws if they stick up high and are sharp. In the long run, you'll want to refine your technique, so you don't put excessive pressure on the bridge.
@@jeffro. You can carry a Floyd Rose equipped guitar around by just the whammy bar and it won't go out of tune. It's a double locking system. The string is clamped at the bridge and nut and can't slip. The locknut is the clamp at the nut end. It's necessary for that level of tuning stability. Double locking systems are the only type of trem that can't go out of tune. Floyd Rose is the most common design for guitars with headstock mounted tuners. The Steinberger "R" trem design is a common aftermarket trem for headless guitars. I actually put locknuts on the vast majority of my guitars builds. With a locknut, all tuning stability issues on the headstock end of the guitar go away.
A couple things you can do for string on string are: if the unbent string is being fretted, you can bend those strings slightly to bring them up to pitch, or if the strings are open you can use your picking hand to put pressure on the bridge so it doesn't come up with the bend. Neither are perfect but both help.
Does anyone ever check the 3 screws - Under the Saddles that hold the bridge upper & lower together to see if they are Tight? They Come Loose & Effect Tuning. I Setup Guitars & Every Strat Bridge -> I Check & They Are Loose! You Have To Loosen All The Saddles - Check the 3 Screws - Clean The Bridge - Now you Have To Re-Intonate the Guitar.. I charge Money & A job done Well - Is Well Done... Hey - Wood Block - You Disconnected the String Ground by Pulling The Springs???
What I do with my vintage (6 screw) tremolo is watch the bridge as I slowly tighten the outside screws to when I see the back of the bridge start to raise, I stop and then turn the screws back a smidge.. I then tighten the 4 inner screws to where they are slightly looser than the 2 outer ones... Best tutorial I've seen so far on this topic. Thank you.
Few people consider that the later patents for the Mustang, Jazzmaster and Jaguar models' vibrato mechanisms were "advancements". Though the Mustang was a lower end model, its vibrato was more stable both lowering and raising pitch, but had a kind of Bigsby "clunky" appearance. Celebrity uses of the Stratocaster, Buddy Holly, Jimi Hendrix, etc, over-shadowed the fact that both later models were Leo's improvements (phase reversal, thumb-wheel "pots" - that wouldn't unintentionally be "rolled", etc). Before I met and for a brief period played with Johnny Guitar Watson, as a high-schooler, (his main guitar in the 1970's) I thought the Jaguar was some lame-ass model. Leo had patents for several vibratos, AFTER the Strat... because HE believed they were improvements. But like the original 70's Les Paul Signature model, players thought their heroes played a model that was "the best" both Fender and Gibson offered. The original Les Paul Signature, with its BOTH low impedence XLR and standard output jacks, was a flop. Because it was "too clean" when super distortion DeMarzio pickups were the rage. But when I demoed that thing, it was absolutely the loudest most hi-fi guitar I have EVER play - Marshall 100 Full volume, muted the strings, I thought the amp was still on "stand-by" No, our heroes weren't always playing the "best model available". And the equipment they used was a much smaller factor than players realize. I've often used "crap" rigs and gotten comments, "how are you getting that sound out of that 'junk??" The inventors tried to lead us to the next levels of design, but our heroes had more influence.
I’ve just now purchased a Fender Strat (JV Mod 60’s). As a life-long Gibby player, this is my first 6 screw vibrato guitar. I’ve had some super strats w/Floyds but those are just not my thing. As far as a proper strat vibrato, I’m thinking I’ll go the way of flat to the body as I feel blocking, trem-locking and so on seem to remove the soul of the Strat itself which to me defeats the purpose of having the darned thing to begin either with. Great tutorial here 🏁
I've played Strat's for 32 years, worked for various amp manufacturers and worked a stint in a shop as a guitar tech, still managed to learn two things from this video. Thanks :)
I've always set my Strats for down-bend only and will continue to do so, but I have mine set basically as a fail safe for a string break so the spring tension is just holding it flat against the body and there's minimal elasticity/effort for down-bends but if I break a string it's going nowhere.
Yep. Decades of guitar work here too, but though it has always been there, I rarely thought about how string BENDS effect ALL strings' pitch in a floating setup. Just as it effects them all when a string breaks
Hey, Mick, Great, great vid, man. As usual. @paultaylor said it all better than l could. Just want to add - 'Need l say more . . . ?' 'The proof is in the pudding . . .' All now redefined by manic wiggles, wobbles and warbles followed by devastating dive bombs followed by a pristinely in tune open E chord. 'Nuff said.'
Some cheap string trees aren't bent/don't have a curve in them and it's really worth looking out for. On a good guitar (like your lovely original strat there) you can see the non-bent string tree is fitted at an angle to reduce friction. On some cheaper guitars (I found this recently on a road worn neck I got off ebay) sometimes you will find a non-curved string tree fitted at a flat angle designed for bent string trees. This makes tuning stability HORRENDOUS as the strings constantly bind on the string tree. Swapping to a bent/curved pure vintage string tree made a WORLD of difference. From a completely unusable trem to the best of any of my strats. Also... WD-40 isn't a lubricant! It cleans but it doesn't lubricate! Stick to the pencil graphite! 😄 Love the vids!
I've got 2 Strats, a Squier Classic Vibe and a Fender Custom Shop 59. While I love the Custom Shop, it's much harder to bend strings then the Squier. Both have the 6 screw bridge/trem. I know I should know this but why would one be so much easier if both using the same 10 gauge strings? I've tried to mirror the Squier by having the bridge flush with the body and have experimented with slightly floating but just cant get the bending to match. Any ideas?
Hey, Chums! Very comprehensive as usual! Possibly the best video I've ever seen about setting up the Strat vibrato. One tip when changing strings with a floating trem -- I typically place a pad of post-it notes under the bridge plate when changing the strings (of course the string package works well too). The benefit of using a pad of post-it notes is that I can remove pages of post-it notes to allow for a perfect fit under the bridge plate. Thanks for the great video!!
Fully floating is the only way to go. its the way Leo designed it to work. Having said that, strat trem is the worst thing ever, but its better than every alternative, haha.
The average listener does not hear spring noise/rattle, nor does anyone strum the springs like you did to make a lot of noise from them. I’ve always loved recordings (usually classic stuff on analog) with background & instrument/equipment noise. The studio realm has become this very weird sterile….. thing, which sucks. Thus, shitty things like auto tune. Ridiculous. Good episode 🤘🏼
Flat block is my preferred method on my MIJ Strat, I also put in some narrow plastic tubing inside the springs to stop the vibration/buzzing. This work on the floating setup as well
If you go to very light strings say zippy slinky or even Tony Iommi light (low E .032) should you change the nut if the guitar came with lets say a .048 low E?
OK, you sold me. Sticking with my Tele.😛 Update: Well Mick, I watched this video while thinking about buying a strat. Had one for a short time in the past and this vid reminded me of why I sold it. Sooooo, new strat coming Monday. Couldn't resist. Thanks! Hope I don't cuss at you later. Great vid like all That Pedal Show vids. Say hey to Dan.
For a fully floating trem a 3mm pad (wood, nylon or similar) as a temporary spacer between the body and trem plate will enable the strings to be brought to pitch more quickly as the string being tuned will affect the ones already fitted much less. Removing the spacer will cause the 'flying height' and tension in the strings to change as the springs are allowed to do their balance thing. But all the strings will be more in the ball park. Useful for changing single strings.
Hi @mikevillegas. You might want to try the Xotic Raw spring for Strat. Xotic claims these are from more flexible metal more closely resembling the 60'ties material. I do find they're much more flexible. Some folks on RU-vid there is a difference soundwise/tonecolour too (I can't tell). I use 3 springs attached straight since scientifically there is no advantage putting them on diagonally, more likely a disadvantage. The guitarworld is full of mumbojumbo- mythology. I'm no expert too but I don't think one should take for granted everything they tell you without questioning or trying it yourself first. 3 springs instead of 5, 4 or 2 springs, and bridge plate about 2 or 3 mm above the body gives the best sound and action on the tremolo effect as far as I can tell. Otherwise the tremolo is just too tight and jumpy to get a nice reaction soundwise. With 2 indeed you have too screw them so tight that there is a disadvantage and 4 or 5 is to much resistance too.
by far the best explanation and critique of the Term/Vibrato setup ..... even better than fender could do ...thank you guys ....keep up the phenomenal work you do
It could just be that I spent lots of time setting it up or just "got lucky", but my floating Strat stays in tune pretty damn good (once its in-tune), while my other two trem guitars (another Strat and a Yamaha) are flush and dont stay in tune as well, particularly after heavy bar use. I can go full Jeff Beck (RIP) on the floater no problem. Strangely, Floater Strat and the flush Yamaha have nice bright ring, warm resonance and sustain, while the flush Strat is deader than the Dodo. Go figure... On second thought the thin zinc block might have something to do with it.
I can’t overstate how comprehensive and totally useful this video is. I’ve been playing strats since 1976. Finally settled on flat to body down bend only: I am not Beck and I play more easily and better with plate flat to body. I know I can’t flutter but I don’t need to. Many a sleepless night agonising. I have 3 strats now. All have trems flat to body. Each with different trem arm tension though. 😁👍🏼
Here's a question... you or someone on RU-vid mentioned that friction also occurs on the saddles and in the string shafts down the sustain block. However, it seems to me that the whole idea of the synchronized tremolo system designed by the incomparable Leo Fender, is that the entire bridge moves together, saddles, strings and all. So no friction should be happening ANYWHERE on the bridge. Am I wrong here? Thanks!
Mick does such a great job of capturing that yin-yang challenge of Strat setup. After a lot of years struggling with setting up guitars, I find I actually enjoy messing with that "tipping point" of a Strat trem and bridge. Even reminds me a little of messing with auto engine carburetors back in the day. Fun video.
Wait wait wait. You can use Monty's Instrument Food to lube the points of friction? I've been wanting some of that stuff for my rosewood boards anyway. Recently been using Nut Sauce AND graphite. Lol I hit it with the graphite first and then apply the Sauce. Works great but I'm down to try the Monty's.
I also love fully floating for the extra sustain - hear me out ! As the bridge plate pushes into the screws a bit more I always find that the body may resonate less, but I get more net sustain out of the guitar
I think Darrell Braun has a video on exactly this, but his tests showed that the most sustain was blocked, followed by decked. I studied applied science and physics so I think I can explain why to my understanding. So when we talk sustain, we are actually talking about energy conservation, it's how long the string will continue to vibrate. When it vibrates, it is getting fractionally longer and shorter with each individual vibration (that's the frequency, Hz). Going between two fixed points means it will vibrate the longest, as it's not imparting any of this elastic energy moving those points closer together. A floating trem is held by spring tension balancing with the strings, it's the opposite of 2 fixed points. because the string is pulling against a spring rather than a fixed position, the energy in the string imparts some of this energy as a slightly stretch to the trem spring, and given back from the elastic energy stored in the trem spring when the string fractionally lengthens. BUT the trem doesn't give the elastic energy it absorbed back to the one played string, it imparts energy evenly to all the strings. That means (for atleast a single string played on its own) you get less sustain as a floating trem shares the energy it absorbed evenly between all the strings, as well as absorbing some itself (hence you get buzzing or ringing trem springs). Best way to visualise it I can think of is 6 ropes tied between a thick and a thin flexible tree. If you pull on one rope, the thin tree bends, the rest of the ropes slacken off and are under less/no tension. When you let go any elastic energy stored in the bent tree is released onto all the ropes and not just the rope you pulled on.
@@RelicOnMaui if you are talking about one spring being played and the others receiving energy from it then yup, but the correct term is energy transfer as it doesn't just go directly into momentum (kinetic and vibration are both examples of momentum). I might be misreading your comment so happy to chat if I have the wrong end of the stick?
I don't have a degree in physics, even if I sounded like a wanna be. I was actually thinking of an explanation of an old science toy (Newton's Cradle - it's on Wikipedia) - hanging steel balls - you swung one on one end and the other end moved, but the middle 3 remained stationary. if you swung two, only the outside two on the other side moved. Up to Four Fascinating. It's still in my parent's home (a museum) over 55 years later! @@Philter-Coffee
It's like TPS read my mind! But I'm still torn! I don't want to ruin the feel of my guitar... but warbles are tempting 😅. What the hey... you only live once... does having locking tuners eliminate the tuning stability issue?😮
Here's how I float my Strats and I never go out of tune... Loosen the spring claw in the back and remove the springd. Take the bridge off, then take the saddles off the plate but keep them in order. Clean it with Windex, no dirt, dust or wax underneath or anywhere,. Clean and polish the body surface as well. Run a thin bead of Break-Free rifle lubricant along the fulcrum pivot point underneath the plate. Carefully place it back into the cavity, screw the six screws mostly in and add a wee bit of the lube right under the screw heads with a toothpick or such. Tighten them down but leave a tiny bit of daylight between the plate and screw head and set all six screws equally. Hook the springs back on and set the claw fairly tight. String it up and tune to pitch. Once the set-up is relatively done, put the whammy bar in and re-adjust the springs so that when you pull the trem up flush to the body, your G string pulls up to a perfect A. That may sound like a lot but it's really not, it's just enough clearance to wang without the plate banging againt the body. It's perfectly balanced and it's also a fun Page-like trick to pull the open G up to an A. I also add a smidgen of Blue Lok-Tite to the saddle height screws so they don't sink over time and remain stable. Of course there's more, like how the neck tenon is pitched in the neck pocket as you don't want the bridge saddles set too high or too low. And of course the nut slots, string trees and amount of wraps around the posts is another bucket of tweaks. If you want to set it flush/blocked like Hendrix, Clapton, SRV, pre-80's Gilmour, ect... you'll have to back-pitch the neck tenon with a shim or neck-tilt adjustment so that the saddles aren't jacked up too high. I've even gone as far as sanding out the neck pockets on most of my Fenders to get the action right (Slightly tilted down on the low E side) but that's risky if you're not a luthier. Oh yeah, 4 or 5 springs will feel/sound more surfy and springy, and 3 springs or 3 in a V-shape came about in the 80's with Floyd Roses, ultra-light strings, shredding and dive bombs and such. It's a more modern feel. The good news is once you set everything right, it should be good for years with minimal tweaks. :D
Thanks! 1. You say you set all 6 screws with a minimal gap? 2. My 50s type vibrato is hard as fuck to operate, even with just 2 springs. Any ides why? I have 9-42 strings on.
Try getting some raw vintage springs. They are much better tension and comfortable to run with 4 or 5 springs. Most of the modern strings are much higher tension. Also found tuning stability better with them. Those plus Callahan are best combo I’ve found - damn near impossible to knock out of tune once string broken in
@@andersestes It's hard to say, have to see what's going on but it was never designed for 2 springs. Could be bad springs. I've seen weird things like that. Gibson was shipping some of their guitars with Floyd Roses about 12 years ago and they were a disaster. Turned out weak springs was the problem.
The best way to use a Strat trem is to give it to JAM Pedals and ask them to put a piezo on it and make it into a pedal! Then you can have the trem without needing the guitar! 😁
This is the most controversial TPS episode ever (for me personally) and I have many thoughts. I've also had a few wines 😁 Will come back later. Should say that it's excellent, as always, but I have very differing opinions, as wrong or right as they may be.
I like mine floating. As long as you set it up right and make sure there are no sharp edges the only way it goes out is if you break the string, but you can mitigate that with fresh strings. Mine sustains great, sounds clearer to me, and stays in tune wonderfully. If you have trouble rub chapstick in the nut. Don’t be afraid to try floating, once you get used to it you’re good to go
I go a step further and drop a small ball bearing ON TOP of the small compression spring after I place it in the vibrato hole, it gets rid of that grinding feeling/noise of the trem bar once it is screwed in place and the turning action is silky smooth....The ball bearing is a tad small than a standard BB you would find in a regular BB gun. I also tried putting the BB in the hole BEFORE the spring, but liked it better the other way. someone sells a small kit online now which includes a spring, a ball bearing, and get this, a small magnetic disc than covers the whole to keep everything from falling out for those who unscrew thier trem bar (me), before they put the guitar back in the case for the night....I bought 10!
17:00 You’ve got it exactly backwards, Mick. Titanium is both softer and less slippery than steel. If your principal aim is a low-friction bearing surface, then titanium is a worse choice than hardened steel, and will typically require compensating techniques such as lubrication.
It's a journey for all of us to find exactly what we prefer, and this video covers all the elements needed to fine tune one's bridge setup. For me a slight bit of float (4 springs in back) and the slanted claw bar as used by Mr. Beck does the job. Your tip about the tension of the bridge screws from a video quite a while ago really was a big step toward a perfect setup, the claw bar angle is another. Experimenting with being fully decked vs amounts of float got me where I am very happy with the tone and feel. Everything about TPS is why the internet exists, I can't thank you all enough for the info, entertainment, and feeling of community. Huge thumbs up for all you do 👍 Enjoy the vacation time!
Great vid as everr, many thanks. I was a luthier for many years and must have worked on at least a billion Strats - would have liked access to this vid 30 years ago. It's everything I learned about Strat trems (yes, vibratos ) presented and explained with an ease and facility I could never quite muster... Quick tip RE using a pencil to lubricate the nut: An HB pencil is 50% graphite, 50% clay. The softer the pencil, the greater the graphite content; from memory a 1B pencil has a greater graphite content, than the HB up to 9B which is 90% graphite. 100% graphite sticks are readily available from art suppliers for next to no money and are noticably better than the pencil based competition. For my money 100% graphite trumps nut sauce etc, but that's just me. I find a mix of 100% graphite stick and vaseline an excellent string tree lubricant, having sanded and contoured the leading/trailing edges to taste. Name brands are all well and good, but there's usually a cheap alternative. IME the cheapo chango is as good as if not better...
yes, a great video. His reiterations were not double talk to me. The important points were explained thru out with different view points. except for those "back, back' times when it gets wacky. You know sometimes I mess things up, ,just to try and fix em' and thats coming from my " can't leave well enough alone" alias' counterpart! its a spring/string thing.
Pending a decently balanced floating setup and a stable neck, it’s IMO the down-bend only setup that’s least tuning-stable: When the strings loosen during a down-bend, the strings slide towards the tuners’ posts, over the nut, and when they re-tighten, towards the end of the down-bend, the nut friction will impair their sliding back over the nut. With a floating system, a pull on the bar resets the strings back in place, an option that’s not available in down-bend only mode--you’ll have to bend each string one by one with your left hand in order to pull them back into place.
As for 2-point trems, US Std or FR-type, you want the plate flat, equal height on both sides, not cock-eyed or it will wear out the knife edges and just not work as well. The Fender Am Std trem is easy, find the plate height sweet spot where the saddles are at a sensible height, then tilt the trem slightly forward so you don't clack into the body with wide vibrato. It's tougher with a FR though. StewMac used to sell a shim kit to customize the saddle heights, I dunno about now. Ibanez and other overseas pot metal hardware will just wear out anyway, then you just chuck it in the trash. That's about it.
I've been scavenging the internet for many many years searching for information on strat setups. This is THE BEST video... It covers pretty much everything on tremolo setup. Thank you!
As a experiment I removed the backplate and place some foam in the cavity on top of the trem springs and put back on the backplate and it did alter the sound which was not as mellow as I like it to be. I wounder if adding more springs would it change the sound?. My strat is a Blacktop version mahogany body with 2 humbucker Gibson style PU and 5 way switch. Made in Mexico fantastic sustain and tone.
My Floating Gotoh 510 on my Suhr SSS is phenomenal. It honestly has: incredible tuning stability & return-to-pitch. This guitar made me sell my Vintage Fender Strat. Fantastic job with this Mick. "You got Forensic" with it !!!
I just got a Player Strat that I put a 510 on. It's such an exceptional trem. I can't say enough good things about it. I put the Fender locking tuners and replaced the string tree with a TUSQ version (cream). Good to go!
Agree 100%. Glad you are loving it. That Gotoh 510 is "Sick" ( it's Japanese ) = do they make Anything that isn't high-quality with great Attention to Detail?@@TomBailey
Compliments on your vid. On my 6 screw trems I Place a small O-ring under the 1st and 6th screw hole through which the screw Is then inserted. The other screws don't get screwed down as much, Just up a bit. Happy plays!
It should go without saying... but, on a floating vintage 6 screw also check the screws are 1: straight and 2: in good condition. A mate of mine was having issues and when I took the screws out they were all bent and some had nicks on the smooth part. I replaced them with some new good quality ones and all his issues went away. This is especially common on guitars with lower quality hardware where the screws are made from material that's really just too soft for purpose. He was going to replace the whole bridge but all that was needed was a new set of screws.
I disagree with the comment that you can't hear the springs when the trem is blocked. I most certainly can and I seem to remember reading Eric Clapton commenting on the springs still influencing the sound of his Strat(s). I block my trem front and back, so I can easily pop the blocks out and have a fully floating trem with minimal bridge re-adjustments...if any.
Fender vibrato Boggles my mind…. It’s amazing yet easier to set up my strat now…!!…this guy is a genius…Leo fender was a genius….today I was just putting on new strings and I was wishing I had a friend to explain things to me after all these many years..and here I found the answer …I also have a modern player strat also and it came to me as a demo model and the vibrato was set up perfectly ….!!!!Amazingly…. I live in fear of ever putting new strings on it..
If you play LIVE , with it you definitely want it flat with the body . This way, if a string breaks, the entire guitar wont go out of tune! You dont need it to pull up, that's what BENDING is for!
if youre picky, you can put mufflematerial inside the springs...:just take an old string , make it a u-loop/fishhook,push it throu the spring , attach it to the muff, and pull the muff ..., no more spring rattle...
Someone told me that if I deck my tremolo, I can’t properly do a vibrato on any notes or chords because a proper vibrato goes both up and down in pitch just like it does when you do a vibrato on the fretboard with your finger. I thought vibrato is just an oscillation and has nothing to do with pitch modulation. That’s the definition anyway. But I cannot find an example, guitar or otherwise (like vocal) to prove this odd theory wrong.
Stick some solid tuning into you springs. You won’t hear those trem springs. I put tape onto my springs and I put silicone tubing inside the springs. The reverb from my springs was awful before.
Where was this video two months ago? 😅 I just inherited my step-dad's 1983 strat and it is my first strat. The vibrato on the thing just vexed me so I took it to a luthier to help me get it set up (it hadn't been worked on in maybe 20 years).
A tip for the final stage of floating the trem: 1) tune new and stretched strings to pitch 2) use post-it notes to stack under bridge (and raise) until the G string is tuned to the pitch you want your vibrato to acheive. (eg down half-step to F#) 3) with post-its still in place, tune all strings (including the G) to regular pitch 4) remove post-its. Guitar will be out of tune. Flip guitar over and tune by adjusting claw screws This will save you so much back-and-forth tuning and it will be set up perfectly to your liking every time.
Revisiting this video. I set all my vibratos to float, it just works best for me, to each his/her own. However, I did resort back to Fender vintage saddles on one of my Strats that I had installed GraphTech saddles on. GraphTech saddles work beautifully on one of my other Strats, but didn't on the other. I put the vintage saddles on and the Strat plays better than it has for a long time. I fully believe that sometimes the guitar dictates what is going to work best with it. It will tell you what it likes and what it doesn't.
Well explained great vid you either love them hate them, i have mine flat to body 5 springs locking tuners,only after heavy dive bombing does it go out a little which is expected,again its your preference ,if you dont stretch out you strings properly you will always have tuning problems,also it may make your action higher in some cases ,and effect intonation ,i too did watch Darrel vid for tips with tuning your trem ,Mr jeff Beck was the ultimate master of the trem on strats
A subtlety with vibrato, finger vibrato only raises the pitch, decked trem will only lower the pitch. You need the floating trem to raise and lower the pitch around the true note. Moot for me, mine is blocked a la clapton. Had the same strat for 30 years, I do understand it better now though, great video.
Great video. I've got a little Squire strat that I've blocked. I've tried removing and setting up the floating bridge and it just sucks the tone right out of it. To the point where I forgo the whammy all together.
![The Perfect Stratocaster Trem / Vibrato Setup [Floating, Flat Or Blocked?]](/img/logo.svg){kind=logo}
