3:55 fun fact: Tom cruise is gone on record saying if you could hearing what Forest Gump said was "Sometimes when people go to Vietnam, they go home to their mommas without any legs. Sometimes they don't go home at all. That's a bad thing. That's all I have to say about that." So not completely unaware.
What I really hate about Jenny's story is that her tendency to be with abusive boyfriends is not even about herself, but about Forrest. They exist to make Forrest look better in comparison. Take the Black Panther scene for example: Jenny is beaten up in plain sight (by another white man, no less) and no one but Forrest intervenes, not even other women. Because black women activists in the 70s were apparently fine with abuse. And there were there no 1970s women right activists who could help an abused woman in the middle of a hippie camp, either. I get that Jenny goes from abusive relationship to another because she doesn't know anything else, but then the solution for her shouldn't be MARRY THE NICE GUY (even though you have nothing in common), but try to find a path that doesn't involve self-destruction. Alas, that would mean NO SEX for Forrest. The sad thing, a lot of people don't see it that way and think that Jenny is a bitch who doesn't deserve him.
This is honestly the first time I've seen discussion of this film outside of where it fits into Hollywood's - and culture's in general - treatment of disability and mental illness. Very interesting to see as such.
Omg I did _not_ remember all that stuff about Jenny Black panther party and aids were totally left out of my movie knowledge- I just remembered the stuff forest did like run and go to war
I think of this movie as a way for America to look back on the turmoil of our past without ... thinking about it too hard. For example, as a child Forrest runs past prisoners who are doing forced manual labor (in chains). Does the movie offer a commentary on this practice? No. By having a disinterested protagonist the movie makes no attempt to discuss moral discomfort. Hell, Forrest Gump is physically and verbally attacked by other children in his town because he has mental and physical disabilities, and he has no opinion on that, either! He never confronts his attackers or tells anyone that he wishes people would treat him differently. The only time he addresses how he feels about his own mental abilities is when he stands up to Jenny, saying, "I may not be a smart man, but I know what love is." Can you imagine how awkward it was for him to go back to that small town in Alabama where the people he sees every day hurled rocks at him as a kid? (Also, if that's how they treated Forrest, imagine what those boys did to other disabled children who were too slow to out-run them .... yikes).
this reminds me a bit of an essay i read about how lisa is the character of the simpsons who always ends up suffering or humilliated because of her attempts at activism or at progressing personally or at defending her beliefs. the writer of the essay stated that the simpsons rewarded homer for his stupidity and punished lisa for trying to do anything different. i think its interesting to keep in mind, though, that many of the writers of the simpsons often said that lisa was usually their mouthpiece and the character through which they more often than not voiced their opinions and worries. they were, at the same time, deeply disillusioned with the fact that, or at least how they perceived it, most people are more homers than lisas and being an average american was more rewarding and accepted than questioning the authorities. i dont think this is whats going on in forrest gump, but i do think its an interesting comparison. on the other hand, forrest gump usually reminds me of big fish, the tim burton movie. the silliness there is amped up, its even more "apolitical" and fantastical and goes even further at trying to make out its main character as an admirable hero. in the case of that movie, its his embittered son who performs the part of the foil to contrast with the father's optimistic perspective on life.
In the first few seasons, it was always portrayed as "Lisa is right to want change, but the world sucks" and as the series went on it became "the world sucks, so Lisa is wrong to try to change it". That latter attitude is the one portrayed in Forrest imo
I always saw Jenny as a terribly tragic character but ultimately a hero like Forrest was. Just she never had the same road as Forrest from the very start and life is like that... She got caught in a terrible loop but she always seemed to strive for better and eventually escape..even if she got yanked into the bad yet again. Her fate seemed kind of sealed from the start. It is terribly depressing that it seems some people who shine bright are still tormented by the past..Forrest had a loving mother who fought for him when others wanted her to give up on her son. I always thought it spoke to how different upbringings can deeply impact our lives, more so than even disabilities . Also for some reason assumed she had cancer not AIDs? Also I am interested to know how you think Bubba fits into the narrative too.
This probably puts my discomfort with how this movie treats Jenny in better words than I ever could. My personal, also cynical, reading that I interpret from the film is more a commentary on the concept of apoliticalness as a means of ignorance as bliss. Forrest is unaware, and follows the mold because it just seems like what he should do, based on no real moral metric, unquestioning. He is rewarded again and again by following the mold, and only does the right thing situationally, When presented with what is an obvious moral decision from his perspective, like stopping Jenny's abusive boyfriend. He lives a longer, more rewarding (from a traditional american perspective,) life than Jenny, a socially conscious intelligent woman aligning herself with the oppressed. It's a hard, HARD thing on the mind and emotions to understand that you, or people you care about, are oppressed and actively treated as lesser by society, or that the governing body your country is lead by is corrupt and inhumane. The stress of knowing and comprehending that you have to fight the good fight, and taking responsibility for doing that into your own hands as an activist is incredibly emotionally taxing, but Jenny, as an abused woman who understands what it's like to be hurt by people who hold power over you, can't live with herself if she doesn't try to do something. Many lefties I know, myself included, are depressed or emotionally hurt by our awareness of how fucked the world is, and a lot of folks turn to less than healthy means to cope with that awareness. I think Jenny's life is reflective of the painful struggle of the socially conscious of her time, (as well as the sad tendency of some people with abusive histories who dont get help or therapy to self-medicate and fall back into abusive relationships after getting out, already groomed by previous experiences,) and Forrest's is reflective of the socially ignorant non-minority, and whether intentional or not, provides an interesting perspective on the concept of being apolitical. Because whether he's political or not, politics still fundamentally affect his life. He fights in a war that kills his best friend. And just when you think he'll get to say something about that, he's silenced by his government for making a negative political statement on the war, according to Tom Hanks, who made a statement of what Forrest actually said in his speech in an interview, it being a simple statement about how sometimes, the war in Vietnam sent people home to mom without legs, or it didn't send people home at all, and that he thinks that's a very bad thing. While this is maybe just as cynical as the interpretation presented, it very much is less politically conservative and anti-intellectual, and it certainly helps me enjoy watching the movie more, lmao
^This Loved the video, but also felt the movie was less politically conservative and anti-intellectual and more apolitical in an "ignorance is bliss" way. I was precisely thinking about Lieutenant Dan and Forrest's dead friend as statements that the movie isn't apolitical, that it acknowledges the effects of cultural events, and the ways it leads to tragedy. I tend to summarize the movie as "life goes on", because I think that's what the movie depicts: Forrest lives through an impressive list of events, yet he's oblivious to all of it, just like most people are throughout their life, even if the tragedy is still happening around them.
Excellent video!! These parts of Forrest Gump have troubled me as well. I had previously assumed that Jenny died of cancer, and the thought of her actually having AIDS instead bothered me so much (did the writers like punishing Jenny THAT much??) that I looked it up. from IMDB's trivia page: "The virus that claims Jenny's life is not specified in the film. Director Robert Zemeckis never revealed what her affliction was, stating that it was irrelevant, and that he didn't even tell Robin Wright. Jenny says in the movie that the doctors do not know what the virus is, and that they can do nothing about it. This information, combined with the time period in which she got sick (early 80s), coincided with the HIV epidemic, so many people assumed Jenny died of AIDS. However, in the sequel book "Gump & Co" the author mentions that Jenny dies from Hepatitis C, contracted as a former drug addict in the 70s. Hepatitis C was an unknown disease until 1989. It was often fatal until effective treatments were developed during the 2000s." so there's that, I guess? still not great, but :/
You ever notice how a poor, uneducated black kid who is implied to have been drafted is killed in Vietnam and the movie never ponders upon that with any more depth than that it made tbe protagonist upset? Jenny never comments on Bubba, Forrest's mother never comments on Bubba, Liutenant Dan never comments on Bubba specifically, and Bubba's own family never even comments on it. It doesn't change the protagonist in any manner and doesn't effect his motivations (he was going to go into shrimping anyways). In fact it's the logical conclusion that with Lieutenant Dan as Gump's business partner instead of Bubba that he's better off financially. Later on Lieutenant Dan, a man who chose to die in a war for glory and tradition, gets to show up later in a snazzy outfit with prosthetic legs and a wife who is implied to be vietnamese, signalling that he's recovered psychologically from what he suffered in Vietnam, but no mention of poor, young black man who was drafted and never had an opportunity to have a real life. Just a thought.
A lot of people are saying this movie has conservative messages, but let's think about that for a second. The only reason this movie is called a conservative movie, is because of the way it paints the New Left as unstable. Of course they are unstable, just like Jenny, it is born from a place of hurt and confusion but is ultimately not bad in nature and the source of a new future. Conservatives are not painted in a positive light at all, they are the source of all that hurt and confusion. They are the past we are all trying to run away from. The old as Alabama house that we are all throwing rocks at. The system that the black panthers are fighting. The conservative Nixon. The way I see it we have Forrest, who goes on doing everything conservatives supposedly preach, but notice how unlike them, he doesn't let it get into his head and shares his success with those less fortunate, not to look good, but to actually help, even if it comes at a huge personal cost. The conservatives that surround him simply look in confusion as he does things so out of the ordinary. His mother teaches him to consider himself the same as everyone else. He never really forces his lifestyle on anyone or calls it the ideal way of living. Heck he even breaks the centuries long military tradition of Lieutenant Dan. Forrest is open to change and open to new things, even if they call him stupid. He succeeds by rejecting the conservative bad habits, and taking only the useful things, which aren't necessarily conservative or traditional values and behaviors, but simple descent things that even liberals would follow. He simply wants to do good and help everyone while at it, even those who are less fortunate.
Jenny was “punished” because of her constant drug use and promiscuity and negligence while Forrest was rewarded because of his work ethic, bravery and compassion, Jenny’s failure and Forrest success had zero to do with politics and more to do with making the best of a bad situation, both Jenny and Forrest were dealt shitty hands but only Forrest made the best of them cards 🃏
Great video! This is one of my favorite movies and I still felt this reading as a very valid and useful one to take into account. I have a slightly different, actually positive view of it but I don't know how to articulate it at the moment. Might comment later on it.
The most successful (the guy who gets Forrest invested in Apple and is therefore responsible for the majority of their wealth) and arguably happiest character in Forrest Gump is Lieutenant Dan, who is supposed to be smart enough to know better but goes and fights an unjust war in Vietnam anyways, leading his men into an ambush that gets Bubba killed and possibly a jungle Napalmed.
The fact that this movie is still so well liked in a modern perspective, regardless of the anti-intellectualism undertones in the movie you talk about, really show how good of a script this movie has, and how good of an actor Tom Hanks is. If it weren't for the guy playing the lead role, I think this movie would of been forgotten a long time ago, as there is no other actor who could have pulled this off.
Its a really well made movie but its simple to its core and easy to digest moral values appeal to most i agree with every point this video makes, that is why i think its overrated. And most people will defend this movie more than any other movie
“Forrest Gump is a conservative, anti-intellectual movie that promotes political disengagement and unwavering adherence to mainstream culture as the only means to happiness and success.” Correct, and that’s a good thing.
Also, I hate how this movie fetishizes motherhood: Forrest's mother goes as far as prostituting herself - which is portrayed as a sacrifice - in order to get Forrest into a school and she seems to have no other interests than being a mother to him, even on her freaking deathbed. Jenny doesn't have a mother who could "save" her from the abusive father and so she ends up going through abuse her entire life, UNTIL she gets a kid of her own, then she feels herself worthy of happiness and love. Not only that she seems to get this divine clarity out of motherhood that now she should take over Forrest's mother's role and be the patient mother figure for him and their son, because that is all that really matters. I just... ugh, ew.
@DLeCo True, but "family" can be more than biological family, caring for each other more than being a mother, and ideology can be healthier than the blind obedience often found in religion.... (in my estimation) :)
I think Forrest Gump is generally an awful movie (outside of this video's points, even) but Forrest's mom not having interests is because she's a perfunctory character and it would not serve the story to focus on her in ways that don't involve Forrest.
There needs to be a second part on this: How this being the most popular American movie in America reflects on... well... Americans and their relationship to their own history.
An interesting analysis but if I could offer some criticism, what is wrong with Jenny becoming a mother at the end and being happy? I think modern society has a tendency to look down on housewives and mothers unjustly. They are often portrayed as lazy and boring women of no personality, when they are actually performing a very important service to society. Studies also show housewives are happier than working women (on average).
I'm not opposed to motherhood in anyway, but the fact that Jenny only gets redeemed and only gets to be happy when she takes up "traditional" roles for womanhood does play into my rather cynical reading.
What the movie is about is " fate ".. the feather represents fate. Certain things happen in life that will happen no matter if you want them to or not. That's the difference between Forrest and Jenny ... Jenny tried to make her own fate, Forrest just went with it.. Jenny and Forrest's relationship and marriage was fate... Lieutenant Dan believed his fate was to die in war. The speech Forrest gave at Jenny's grave states this clearly.. Jenny got her wish and was " turned into a bird to fly far far away " .. Forrest got his wish which was Jenny to reciprocate love and see how much he loved her even though she thought herself unlovable... It was fate. I think Forrest was not dumb as to not understand his surroundings but was smart enough to know something's can't be changed avoided or be made to happen. Like the saying goes " grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can and the wisdom to know the difference "
Well I feel like the movie is more saying, if you go with the wind, it’ll take you to some interesting places. Forrest is open to the experiences that people suggest to him, not being bound by any idea of what his future should look like.
To be completely honest, I hate this movie because of how popular and standardized it is. "Oh, WHAT? You've never seen FOREST GUMP?! What, have you been living UNDER A ROCK?!"
I'd say tho that you're looking at Forrest's "rewards" in the way most of us would, but let's keep in mind that in actuality, he only gets what he truly desires at the same time as Jenny, he didn't really care about money or fame. Also, I feel that most of what Jenny gets punished for is being unable to move on from her past, not that that is something easy at all for her, but the attitude towards traumatic experiences in life that gets rewarded is Forrest's, and later on Dann's: to move on, embrace the present and... Make piece with God, I guess. All three are quite tragic characters. Not that I think your reading isn't valid
wouldn't it had been funny if Jenny's political activeness had been directed in the other direction and that lead her to a bad path which then lead her back to Forest? dunno if that would have been any better, I'm sure that would lead to other iffy implications, but it would have been interesting to see what kind of movie that would have been and how people would have reacted to it. what messages would have been taken from it
I always read the film almost as satire; that the American "exceptionalism" is represented by Forrest, that all the experiences like going to war, stock market success, fame etc isn't necessarily intellectual - but that it's so simple that "even Forrest Gump can do it" that its luck or activity thinking as little as possible that garners success in such endeavours; - a good soldier shouldn't think, the stock market is luck, fame is relative and often ridiculous and wisdom only needs good intent and compassion & doesn't have to come from the "wise". This doesn't address the contrast with Ginny, the video is a more encompassing reading of the film, and brutal in its honesty - but i don't think that the two readings (or more) are mutually exclusive - they both make narrative sense and don't contradict each other, just adding more understanding of a cultural touchstone of a movie. Thank you for your video essay!
My opinion about Jenny and Forrest Gump is that they are opposites in luck. Sure, Forrest Gump is born with two disabilities-a physcial one and a borderline mental one-but he very much-for lack of a better way to phrase it-"overcomes" the physcial one and even the mborderline mental one never stops him from achieving more then most people do in their whole life. Additionally, while Forrest Gum[p's father left them when Forrrest Gump was young he still had his mother for a lot of his life and she is very positively portrayed. Sure, he goes to fight in Vietnam and his best good friend dies but he surivived, saved many lives and became a war hero, so that's really quite a positive otucome for a soldier who fought in Vietnam or any war really. Jenny, on the other hand, not only loses one parent but the other parent is implied to be a drunken child molester. Then, she is kicked out of eductation, is forced to sing songs naked, gets an abusive boyfriend-who is very much is not Forrest Gump-gets AIDS and dies of it. I don't think that either of these outcomes is entirely just because of them, I wonder if the idea is that it's fate or chance or a little of both, like Forrest Gump says. Also, on the whole "Forrest Gump is unitelligent and succeeds in life, therefore the movie anti-intellectual" I disagree. I don't think the movie is saying it's bad to be intelleigent, just that you don't always need to be so to succeed in life. I think the movie, with the charactrer of Forrest Gump and Lieutenant Dan, is trying to say that disabilities don't have to stop you from succeeding in life, which as someone with autism is a message I like. Yes, some people don't consider autism a disability, but I think that that's making minor distinctions.
This is interesting. Although I must say on the first half of the video analysing Forest as a standard white christian american, as a non-american viewer I absolutely didn't get this from the movie and it seemed more as a critic of the classic american culture, of its impact on rewarding basically anyone for acts for couldn't care less for.
The only way i could enjoy this movie was by imagining that it was made as an ironic commentary. But i don‘t think it was, was it? Like, they‘re completely serious? My best friend loves this movie and I feel so bad but I just can‘t like it.
I love this commentary! (and I'm not even a feminist). I just couldn't stand the passive-aggressive politics of this movie! The: keep your head down, obey orders and never ask questions then you will succeed, no matter what your circumstances …. POLITICAL message. … And then the producers had the audacity to say there was nothing political about it! Everything is political in my estimation! Or to quote Bob Dylan: "you got to serve somebody, it may be the devil or it may be the lord, but you GOT TO serve somebody" (everything you do serve to help or hurt, but it DEFINITELY is not "neutral") When people say they are not political, they are just serving up their politics "under the radar"
The aspect of Forrest being too stupid to be racist was also a "huh?" for me. I liked the film, though I think it did depict liberals/hippies in a mostly negative way. That aside, I'd like to see a Forrest Gump meets Slingblade movie.
I came to this after a video about the myth of Forrest Gump was recommended the me. The video basically just praises the capitalist nature of the film.
I think you're interpreting the film in a far too didactic method - I understand you're attempting to interpret what the didactic message is from the movie. There's some truth in what you say, but since you're already openly biased towards one type of political message - a feminist one - I feel you infuse your analysis with too much of your own didactic message. Basically all your critiques of the movie and its message are compounded three times over in your own analysis - so this is not very convincing to anyone that doesn't already agree with you.
i hate this movie and how it just ...also ignores disability politics and discussions of disability, also has the supercrip narrative just fucking baked into the thing...really don't like it at all
Mmmmhmmm. I didn't go into it in the video at all, but the fact that Forrest just like...cursed his, what, scoliosis in the beginning by...running fast?
it ignores it on purpose because the whole point of the movie is to show how forest percieved things. he doesn't really care about his disability, he only addresses it in one ocassion and it rarely impairs him from doing what he wants. so it makes sense that in amovie that is literally meant to be a recalling of events from forest's perspective his disability isn't given much attention
i can totally see where you get your opinions from and i am aware you are aware that the movie isn't actively trying to convey most of the themes you are talking about, and that as a piece of art it is 100% open to interpretation from every expectator. but like i personally am not a fan of seeing things in such a cynic way (yeah I know that's the whole point of the video). i think the movie is a lot more innocent than what you're interpreting it to be.
I apologize for the Lunatic who made this video critique and posted in on you tube. He was a movie student of mine, and he always said the only way he can get famous if he does rag down the best movie that was ever made. So again, consider this a guy who’s really dumm -- to be exposed.
Why you expect people to have political opinions? I know quite some many people who does not like politics and they have a very good reason and honestly I wouldn’t blame them.
@@normaaliihminen722 Do you think it is justified when american companies profit off of modern day slavery and the prolonging of foreign wars? Frankly I dont see how anyone could think that is in any way justifiable.
@@Alex-kn5tr I’m sure you have evidence that America is THE black sheep of modern company in contrast to European counterparts. Where is this evidence?
forrest gump is a movie, not a tweet by trump. its supposed to be about a guys life, not some deep political statement. its an amazing movie and to be honest, your favorite movie could be read the same way if you looked at it like this. now stop blabbering about a movie and do something productive. maybe if you didnt have a political opinion like forrest you would get more views and subs.
