The problem with sex testing in sports

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Caster Semenya’s court case is the latest chapter in a long and confusing history.
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This spring, the Court of Arbitration for Sport upheld rules imposed by the International Association of Athletic Federations (IAAF) limiting the participation of female athletes with high levels of testosterone. On the other side of the decision was Caster Semenya: a South African runner who has repeatedly been penalized by sports officials throughout her career. The IAAF has gone through many iterations of their female regulations throughout the past decade, and Caster Semenya has been targeted with each successive policy. Most recently, the regulation has been a testosterone limit of five nanomoles per liter.
Throughout the past decade, the media has been following Semenya's story closely and shaping a narrative that is often misguided or inaccurate. In this video we piece together the underlying issues relevant to sex testing in sports and contextualize them within the long history of scrutinizing female athletes. By covering the controversy surrounding 2016 women’s 800 meters Olympic gold medalist Caster Semenya, along with historical events concerning Polish sprinter Ewa Klobukowska and Indian sprinter Dutee Chand, the goal is to help explain how athletic officials have repeatedly failed in their attempt to establish definitive sex testing regulations for female competitors.
Sources:
Sex, gender, DSD, and other terminology:
www.familyfoundation.org/biolo...
www.seattlechildrens.org/clin...
interactadvocates.org/
www.nhs.uk/conditions/disorde...
www.med.umich.edu/yourchild/t...
IAAF policy:
www.iaaf.org/news/iaaf-news/i...
www.iaaf.org/news/press-relea...
www.utpjournals.press/doi/pdf...
medicine.yale.edu/rnacenter/a...
IAAF study:
bjsm.bmj.com/content/51/17/1309
IAAF study criticism and research:
www.sportsintegrityinitiative...
www.sportsintegrityinitiative...
Testosterone research:
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2...
link.springer.com/article/10....
Olympic data:
www.olympic.org/women-in-spor...
www.olympic.org/women-in-spor...
Vox.com is a news website that helps you cut through the noise and understand what's really driving the events in the headlines. Check out www.vox.com.
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Опубликовано:

28 июн 2019

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Комментарии : 9 тыс.

@colinmurphy2214 4 года назад

Why didn’t they mention her XY chromosomes? That’s incredibly relevant

@botany500kojak 4 года назад

Doesn't fit with their agenda.

@Noodlecow2 4 года назад

Also she is born that way, she isn't trans.

@tyronechillifoot5573 4 года назад

Source?

@srrv7396 4 года назад

I was totally expecting them to explain that she's intersex when they brought up that news outlets wrongly say she's transgender.

@zanehenderson8478 4 года назад

@@InfraRedNeck Except that it doesn't Shes intersex, not trans. Which either way she would still be a woman.

@ricefarmer5246 4 года назад

“Pull ya pants down, I need to approve you for the olympics”

@KingHarry 3 года назад

That's not even enough.

@ricefarmer5246 3 года назад

H D Take their shirt off then?

@rappermerch7785 3 года назад

My doctor told me something similar during my prostate exam, he kept both hands on my shoulder the whole time to keep me calm! What a nice gentleman!

@niklasdd7745 3 года назад

seems legit...

@RockBrentwood 3 года назад

*Nut* *Probe* ! Or, if the results are made public domain or open source - *Gnut* *Probe* !

@chrish7508 3 года назад

Did they seriously do this whole video without mentioning that Semanya is intersex? She's XY. Seems pretty relevant. And presumably is testosterone is no big deal, then one can only assume there would be no problem with athletes artificially raising their levels, no?

@maxbedo9645 3 года назад

Thank you for pointing that out ...I was waiting for that info.

@rdablock 3 года назад

most athletes use them though, it's just that they don't get caught

@MBjenny143 3 года назад

xy would make her a man, if she's intersex she's most likely XXY :) don't spread misinformation

@katabaker9678 3 года назад

@@MBjenny143 Actually, Intersex can be XY with androgen insensitivity.

@Somerandomdude-ev2uh 3 года назад

Noone said Testostorne wasnt important. They are saying it's strange to make it the test when there are so many other factors.

@Whatsayoutuber 3 года назад

I wish Vox had mentioned that she has XXY chromosomes. I would have preferred for more of the video to be about that, because most people don’t have much of a grasp on those genetics, and we would like to learn more. However, I am glad that they pointed out the discrimination in the testing of certain individuals. I’m personally at a loss for how testosterone testing could be better than chromosome testing, so a lesson on intersex would be super informative.

@arissamazumder Год назад

No I’m pretty sure she has XY with androgen (I think that’s what it’s called)

@Stringbean0000 Год назад

she has 5α-Reductase 2 deficiency

@reeldirtiestudios Год назад

That's literal bull she was born a man nothing could be clearer than that it even sounds manlier than a lot of men walking around it looks like a man and has the strength of a man

@arissamazumder Год назад

@@reeldirtiestudios she’s intersex that means that she’s born both a woman and a man and the only one who thinks she walks and talks like a man is you and your toxic masculinity. Grow up.

@AJTheInvisibleGirl Год назад

@@reeldirtiestudios she’s XXY. That’s the facts.

@yakkyjoe1 4 года назад

Testosterone not linked to performance??? Why are steroids banned then?

@nathanj2439 4 года назад

He never said that. He said that it's not the only factor which means that it shouldn't be the only thing looked at and it certainly shouldn't be the determining factor for who gets to compete.

@aparnamuthuthai8743 4 года назад

Testosterone is linked to muscle mass more consistently. And if a person naturally produces high levels of it , then who are you to say that's invalid? Do u want everyone to have same starting point? Then why not engineer athletes. The goal is to provide wqual opportunities. But not everyone is born equal. Albiet, trying to change that I not only whimsical ,that have also failed miserably at it. P sure how the older testings we're looked down upon , current testings will also be looked down upon in the future.

@akiakiii5879 4 года назад

You weren't listening

@ItsJustMeJackJ 4 года назад

No One Specific they were listening, you can’t read, they never said it was the only thing so relax your comment, read again and think before posting it like this other comment should have done

@TheAmericanCatholic 4 года назад

why didn't vox include that she was intersex which makes a big different

@stuckupcurlyguy 4 года назад

I think it's most concerning that they test based on whoever looks most suspicious. If they're going to enforce a standard, it should be all top athletes who are tested.

@jac.o.blayne 4 года назад

I agree

@theludvigmaxis1 4 года назад

Your Boy Mr Mac irrelevant to the video. Most top women will pass the test, the question is what the criteria should be.

@TheSongwritingCat 4 года назад

Yeah... definitely getting a bit of a eugenics, phrenology, etc. vibe. Foppington would approve.

@whatever6223 4 года назад

The suspicion is actually based on the history of performance. Not on athlete's looks as implied in the video.

@radium05 4 года назад

I think it takes performance into consideration. Kinda like Lance Armstrong consistently winning, or athletes in other sports shattering records quite easily. There is a point where you have to ask if there's a possible leap in human evolution, or a spike in the methods of cheaters. I'm not saying they cheated, but the difference was enough to force questions.

@Whatsayoutuber 3 года назад

I don’t understand why they changed from chromosome testing to testosterone testing. Especially since we likely have better understanding of intersex individuals than we did in the 1960s. I don’t really approve of many of these regulations, but if any test exists, it seems like it should be more sensible and accurate than hormonal testing.

@garrysmith5562 2 года назад

Your approval is important. I hope to gain it some day.

@Vero2yu 3 месяца назад

Those who are intersx could do an Xray so they know where to put them, probably that will give accurate results and not be ambiguous soo, bye.

@rey82rey82 3 месяца назад

@IronBalls 3 года назад

Vox will argue here that there is no link between testosterone and performance, then in another video will argue that testosterone inhibitors is enough to allow trans women to compete in women’s events

@WynnofThule 3 года назад

"...it's unclear how testosterone can be singled out as the defining factor." That's directly from the video. The point isn't to say testosterone has no influence, the point is that it's a complex multifaceted issue, and reducing it to one little molecule doesn't do it justice.

@IronBalls 3 года назад

@@WynnofThule But that’s exactly my point - “cannot be singled out” but yet inhibitors (and only on them for a year at that) is enough to see you qualify for women’s events.

@atruv2089 3 года назад

She's not trans btw.

@kakalimukherjee3297 2 года назад

@@WynnofThule And completely skip the point that she is XY

@prickayeey8420 2 года назад

Whatever fits their agenda

@coolnewpants 4 года назад

I think the video could have given more detail about why chromosome testing was abandoned as a measure.

@JerseySean666 4 года назад

It doesn't allow transgender people to compete, which is why they introduced the ridiculous testosterone limits and why we have the problem we have now.

@cuineform3708 4 года назад

@@JerseySean666 I feel like there's more to it than that, but I've done 0 research on it

@friederkumpf 4 года назад

@@JerseySean666 transsex not transgender... at least your not like Fox and gone for that little mistake on purpose;)

@Alex-fm5ke 4 года назад

@pseudophori6541 4 года назад

JerseySean666 actually it’s because it excludes intersex people

@zakki5630 4 года назад

Athletics is never going to be completely fair. Athletes are supposed to have genetic advantages to one another. That's what makes them good athletes.

@zakki5630 4 года назад

Plus hard work and dedication, of course.

@arturoguillen2125 4 года назад

True. What makes someone a great athlete has lots to do with natural advantages

@aienbalosaienbalos4186 4 года назад

That’s exactly why there is separation to keep things fair and preventing natural beasts from just winning it all with less work. I’m not saying this case in particular is justified. I’m saying the argument, it’s natural therefore fair is wrong; or at least not at all how things are decided nowadays. If so, we’d have men and women competing together, and ignore their genetic advantages...

@rpenguinboy 4 года назад

But it's unfair to put biological men and women in the same events and expect equal opportunity

@kefkapalazzo1 4 года назад

No one said they’d be completely fair. What point are you trying to make?

@sheminaarmorer2874 2 года назад

I'm glad she is a mentally strong woman because all this public scrutiny is embarrassing and psychologically damaging.

@tarnw3301 Год назад

Well, dude has a medical condition which allows him to be the father of the two children he has with his wife...also, he got a lot of cash. The public scrutiny was only a small fee he paid for helping to destroy women's sports.

@gvc7314 Год назад

@@codingwithflavio8534 exactly it's called women sports for a reason trans people shouldn't be allowed to compete

@orionfernandes4587 Год назад

That thing is not a man or a woman. Something else all together.

@oceanusprocellarum6853 Год назад

@@orionfernandes4587 “that thing” bruh

@orionfernandes4587 Год назад

@@oceanusprocellarum6853 Well, One can’t expect to be referred to as a human being when one considers oneself as something inhuman.

@devashishojha7313 3 года назад

wait why was her being intersex conveniently ignored?

@malango255 3 года назад

Because the video has an agender and that goes against it.

@LM-ml2uc 3 года назад

They no longer use that as a criteria

@markzuck8486 2 года назад

Goes against the Vox agenda

@ems7623 2 года назад

It was heavily implied, not ignored. However, I am unsure why they were not more explicit about this.

@DSQueenie 2 года назад

5:35

@maltzXD 4 года назад

The video conveniently avoids mentioning that Semenya has XY chromosome.

@dinahmyte3749 4 года назад

She's intersex but not a man

@ggefryg 4 года назад

@@dinahmyte3749 define a man

@timenspacetraveler7964 4 года назад

Gefry Grullon a person who identifies as a man. theres the full definition right there

@ggefryg 4 года назад

@@timenspacetraveler7964 And that's your definition

@ricehair8807 4 года назад

@@timenspacetraveler7964 lol thats why some people says they identify themselves as an apache helicopter because of crazy people like u

@blahblahblah5790 4 года назад

Bolt should of not competed in the Olympics, he was confirmed to be a rare species of cheetah that stands upright.

@robmoney4life 4 года назад

Lol

@___zeke___7581 4 года назад

He actually confirmed that he’s the manifestation of lightning in an organic form

@thesneakymemedealer5071 4 года назад

@@___zeke___7581 why do you think he has *Bolt* in his name

@lovelykitty42 3 года назад

Ruby Rembiszewski, yes *he* what’s your point

@RecMan1 3 года назад

@@lovelykitty42 *Bolt* is an "it".

@ArtemisScribe 3 года назад

it infuriates me that the IAAF gives the mildest bans to intentional cheats but has persecuted Semenya for over a decade.

@arsaeterna4285 3 года назад

there is NO doubt testosterone helps you perform especially in long distances, as testosterone doesn't switch on until an hour into effort (warm ups not included) if she produces it naturally, she deserves the medal this is an athletic competition, not a beauty contest

@adityanayak872 2 года назад

testosterone is the reason men and women has different tournaments, the only issue is which category to put in

@GulagExpress1 2 года назад

@@adityanayak872 it doesn't take a whole lot of eyesight and understanding to realize that her body is of a very masculine build. Nobody can deny that, and if they do, they're too scared to offend anyone or act out of the political correctness line. She is built like a man. Compete with men.

@jlbeeen 2 года назад

@@adityanayak872 That's where it would be nice if there was a category in the middle for people like that who don't fit in either side.

@dusscode 2 года назад

no, it’s an athletic competition, not a genetic competition

@zayk7095 2 года назад

@@dusscode then put men and women together? It is an athletic competition within a genetic competition

@Mcmatthew99 4 года назад

"You try to run in front of me, and I jump you." New life philosophy.

@lucaquinn7707 4 года назад

George Costarica you what mate?

@marbleplexus 4 года назад

@George Costarica dude go away lmao

@MulataLinda8 4 года назад

💥💥💥💥

@manuelcorona5207 4 года назад

George Costarica that’s why Costa Rica losing today to Mexico 🤕

@TPerm-hj4sf 4 года назад

There are a lot of man in front of him, try to jump the tough ones for a change.

@IceLacrima 4 года назад

Isn't it normal that some people have a natural advantage in certain sports? I don't get why it would be a big issue in this case.

@aienbalosaienbalos4186 4 года назад

IceLacrima That’s exactly why there is separation to keep things fair and preventing natural beasts from just winning it all with less work. I’m not saying this case in particular is justified. I’m saying the argument “it’s natural therefore fair” is wrong; or at least not at all how things are decided nowadays. If so, we’d have men and women competing together, and ignore their genetic advantages...

@Radicus 4 года назад

There is no point in sports and competitions if one specific person wins 90% of time and others have no chances to win.

@someshyv 4 года назад

Yes. strip Phelps of all of his medals. He should not be allowed to compete with regular human beings

@Sannidor 4 года назад

So why adults don't compete with children?

@johnfitzgerald7618 4 года назад

When do they start making the taller basketball players stoop during games? It could be done in the same way it's done with testosterone -- define people statistically as abnormal.

@lucho2868 3 года назад

8:40 "And she's right. It's entirely unethical to administer drugs to someone who doesn't need them"

@Paul-vf2wl 2 года назад

It was probably a mistake they should have just banned her outright.

@blue.orangeade Год назад

If she doesn't wanna take them she doesn't have to. But she can't compete.

@chadthurs8078 3 года назад

"naturally high levels of testosterone" - if it is natural then she should compete as a woman

@ULICKMYBUTCRACK 3 года назад

well “she” is a dude

@livewellwitheds6885 2 года назад

@@ULICKMYBUTCRACK you don't understand intersex at all, clearly

@PedroKing19 2 года назад

@@ULICKMYBUTCRACK bruh if even the World Medical association is with her then maybe you should shut tf up

@cookiecream1348 2 года назад

@@ULICKMYBUTCRACK You couldn’t be in that sport if you were a man. They wouldn’t even allow you in there. You’re just sick in the head

@joeewell4846 5 дней назад

There are many women athletes with relatively high amounts of natural testosterone, yet only certain women are picked for criticism.

@ogdenatwood161 4 года назад

Vox: Testosterone isn’t the only factor to determine who is success, there’s no scientific backing Also Vox: the top 3 women from 2016 olympics all have high testosterone

@OneMeInMyself 4 года назад

get this some more upvotes!

@ogdenatwood161 4 года назад

Tim Evans that is not an applicable example. A correlation is scientifically known as a pattern also. They, CORRELATE so they are related in a pattern. When the top 3 women from 2016 and ones from years prior also get affected by the new regulations that is a correlation/pattern to show that higher testosterone does mean a higher athletic prowess?

@TextbookBoxingGB 4 года назад

Kralj Slovan what agenda is that?

@radium05 4 года назад

@Tim Evans That was such a swing and miss, dude. Your example killed the little dignity your argument had.

@Cillian1 4 года назад

@Tim Evans The 3 fastest women all have have T levels over 5 times the average. "Correlation, not causation" 🤣🤣🤣🤣

@ThePumpkinToad 3 года назад

Thanks to the comments for clearing up that she's intersex and has a Y chromosome. I feel like Vox should have mentioned that

@adhisharavind6393 3 года назад

@Cruiser he has a chromosome disorder and he is sort of a man.

@caitepriestley881 3 года назад

@@adhisharavind6393 *she

@bettievw 3 года назад

They mentioned that she is intersex.

@makilikespies 3 года назад

But it was mentioned... while not directly.

@taylorfireflame 3 года назад

@@adhisharavind6393 Rude

@austinjoseph2881 2 года назад

So should we disqualify basketball players over 7 feet now for "unfair advantages"?

@sungod9797 3 года назад

“Testosterone is correlated with lean body mass... but it’s not the only thing that contributes to that” Sure, just like VO2 max isn’t the only thing contributing to endurance, and knowledge isn’t the only thing contributing to Jeopardy performance, etc. However, it is a huge and significantly causative force that gives a substantial advantage. By this logic anabolic steroids shouldn’t be banned because they (mimicking testosterone’s effect) aren’t the only thing contributing to performance.

@andrew4363 3 года назад

Haha “2020 olympics” Good joke!

@m.yxcs1 3 года назад

Andrew Harron LOL hopefully corona ends soon and 2021Olympics actually happen

@Urboidaboi 3 года назад

Lol

@notjozie1008 3 года назад

lol

@DiaryofGee 3 года назад

Lol

@stopostobozijisinje 3 года назад

All of us waiting for karate on olympics

@adnankassem8114 4 года назад

I don't know if this is true - but based on some quick internet research I just did, it says the she was born with a y chromosome. I feel like that is relevant to the discussion at hand and the video totally did not mention it. She is an intersex person with characteristics of both sexes. Also testosterone is definitely a performance enhancer - it is not the only factor but it is a significant factor. That is why drugs that enhance it are banned as PEDs - even in men's sports. The sad thing is that I feel like they are banning her for competing how she was born. She may have been born intersex and that is giving her an advantage - but shes not cheating to get an advantage. Then at the same time; is it fair to the other women who are competing? I don't know this is a complicated issue... Anyway interesting video.

@RonnyDoplo 4 года назад

@@CW-yt5kq What do you mean by willfully transgender?

@whitykitty2651 4 года назад

Its not really that complicated if you think about it. Everywhere there are standards. In the military, you have to be a certain weight, height. You can't have any medical deformities without clearance. This is very similar. In order to compete, she would need clearance of these standards. If she can't be cleared to have the same standard as the other women, she shouldn't be allowed to compete. I bet if anything, she could run with the men. Even then, its not like everyone is allowed to compete anyway so why should she be able to when she has a clear advantage against everyone else; not much of a competition if you ask me.

@mukkaar 4 года назад

I think it's not fair for her to be conpeting against regular women, just like it's not fair for someone in combat sports to fight in different weight class. People try to make this much more complicated or racial/sexist than it is. I mean if in future we can do operation that significantly enhances your athletic ability, should that person be allowed to compete against normal people? We have banned doping for exactly this reason, it gives totally unfair edge in competition.

@gehankaviratne6915 4 года назад

I say to all women. You went through all these years to get equality and a place in the world. Now it seems you are faced with this issue. I would use these obstacles to train harder and keep chasing until you beat these types of obstacles. World is never fair so I say rise above it. In the end everything will work out.

@Charvak-Atheist 4 года назад

Then she must be allowed to participate in men's athletics

@coldgrandpa Год назад

I am a woman who can grow a beard, naturally. But I could never in a million years run a race like her.

@notfunny3397 6 месяцев назад

That's more common than you might think

@austinmccarty1152 3 года назад

Why can’t they just use what’s written on their birth certificate. I think that is a pretty standard measure no tests needed.

@ABoxIsMyHome 2 года назад

Lol that doesn’t apply to intersex you boomer

@betweenthepanels9145 4 года назад

Michael Phelps produces less lactic acid in his muscle (I believe that is its name) and nobody complains about his genetic advantage.

@betweenthepanels9145 4 года назад

iuvenis animo this is rooted in preserving „competitive integrity.“ sex is just another category.

@inamib.9786 4 года назад

iuvenis animo what’s your point exactly? Most athletes have natural advantages over non-athletes. They’re tall, have better abilities to build muscle, have an advantageous body shape. That’s the point of sports, highlighting human excellence in physical abilities. Semenya and other women like her are being penalized for their natural born advantages despite being born and raised women

@aienbalosaienbalos4186 4 года назад

Between the Panels but everyone separated men and women for their genetic advantage. So saying uh it’s natural therefore fair is wrong, or at least not at all how things are decided nowadays. If so; you’d have men and women competing with each other:

@m.s.1753 4 года назад

Between the Panels and his wing span is the longest swimming and don’t forget his feet, size 14.

@F1ll1nTh3Blanks 4 года назад

@iuvenis animo It's about extraordinary biological advantages. In her case it's to do with her hormones. No one is questioning her sex, genius.

@CH-lg3st 4 года назад

This video glanced over the chromosome part so quickly it sad to see this as educational

@CH-lg3st 4 года назад

@Ad Lockhorst thanks but this isnt how you make friends

@Freshie207 4 года назад

Yeah but most people struggle to really follow any of that stuff, as a man with Klinefelter's I've had to explain this to quite a few people and outside those with a biology or medical degree everybody really struggles to follow it

@dragondov 4 года назад

@Ad Lockhorst Glanced is correct too.

@cosmosisrose 4 года назад

Well, it glossed over the physical exam part too. Even more so than it did with the chromosomes. You know why? Because this video is about the testosterone tests, not the other two.

@cypherusuh 4 года назад

Never think that anything made by Vox news is a legitimate educational material. Most of them are either purely entertainment, or politically motivated content

@plabanpratim5202 3 года назад

Why chromosomes are not considered the standard, I don't get it.

@slifer9990 3 года назад

They are.

@blitszina2570 3 года назад

That's the thing, she has an xxy chromosome so that's what causes the higher testosterone but not high enough to be on equal footing with men

@Sapphiregriffin 3 года назад

@@blitszina2570 but enough to make it an unequal footing with women.

@blitszina2570 3 года назад

@@Sapphiregriffin then where should she be then? It's unfair to deny her on something she has no control over

@acowfrommars3565 3 года назад

@@blitszina2570 Put them in the special olympics

@kalisperafilatoi Год назад

That is like saying people who are too tall can’t compete in basketball… Like their physiology favors them in the sport and that is normal

@ivo9202 3 года назад

Its almost as if competitive sports naturally favors people with physiological superiority...🤔

@cornel9116 3 года назад

not really...

@boriswilcox5121 3 года назад

Bob The Builder do you wanna expand on that?

@cornel9116 3 года назад

@@boriswilcox5121 i dont understand sorry

@jonasvm 3 года назад

you probably meant to say: "Its almost as if physiological superiority naturally favors people in competitive sports ...🤔"

@prizmarvalschi1319 3 года назад

Blame the Greco-Romans

@aids2132 4 года назад

Olympic committee: Drugs are unethical and unfair, we'll test you to make sure you're not using them Also committee: Take these drugs if you wanna compete

@CocoaCookies_ 4 года назад

Yep, that accurately sums up their logic.

@amandadadesky5192 4 года назад

@Almost Mr. Worldwide Except they DO effect her performance, so...🤷‍♀️

@chingizzhylkybayev8575 4 года назад

@@amandadadesky5192 do you know the difference between affect and enhance?

@kefkapalazzo1 4 года назад

Chingiz Zhylkybayev she doesn’t even know the difference between effect and affect

@amandadadesky5192 4 года назад

@@chingizzhylkybayev8575 Yes, I do. Both things effect performance, and making certain athletes handicap themselves just because of their natural prowess is wrong. Also, they aren't testing all participants, just ones that look "suspicious." Notice that most of these women are not "conventionally" attractive by Western standards, and that is the metric being used to determine suspicion.

@danielgeorgetheoneandonly 3 года назад

They’ll call you a man when you’re too good

@generalpompeyo 3 года назад

This video is confusing and seems bised towards identity politics ideology...

@amys4544 3 года назад

If this is such a big deal then why not let people with similar levels of testosterone compete with each other?

@daisigner 3 года назад

because they are very few

@cicadaboi101 3 года назад

Why not make everyone compete with eachother. Then we'll fjnd the actual best

@Ilove_drpepper 3 года назад

Because as they said, testosterone is not the only factor

@skfoxjrxzz5051 3 года назад

That’s going to make things so complicating

@nicknameinuse1607 3 года назад

Because it's just running. Nobody takes this sport seriously

@tommasoparadisi6670 4 года назад

I'd say 2 things: - Saying testosterone levels are linked to performance doesn't mean they're THE ONLY determining factor. The video spends two minutes talking about other factors that might play a role in athletic performance as if the claim was "it's all about your testosterone levels". -Caster Semenya was born with XY chromosomes. I feel like that should be included in the video.

@lu881 4 года назад

So what now? You want her to be a man?

@yslpn 4 года назад

@@lu881 But she is a man

@karljonson3287 4 года назад

@@lu881 she a man bruh

@joshperkins7201 4 года назад

So she’s a he

@FriedPi-mc5yt 4 года назад

Luthando Nqakala XY=dude

@omphilekhoza4507 3 года назад

We’re with you Caster!🇿🇦

@jcxkzhgco3050 3 года назад

She’s intersex, she shouldn’t compete with women or men. Other women got cheated because of her

@omphilekhoza4507 3 года назад

@@jcxkzhgco3050 wa phapha aona di facts

@MikePhoenix007 Год назад

I can't believe I watched 12 minutes of a video on a topic from one of the supposedly high-end production channels and learnt *absolutely nothing* on said topic.

@aaronvaughn2671 4 года назад

She was born with XY chromosomes, I can’t believe they didn’t mention this Edit: As 95% of the comments pointed out, it’s XXY

@chroylikesfish 4 года назад

he*

@steavenjosey 4 года назад

Because VOX is super left and that Y Chromosome does not fit their narrative.

@darksideorbit8898 4 года назад

@@steavenjosey They definitely should've mentioned it but she has characteristics of both sexes, and I don't think it's fair to not let someone run because of how they were born. But she also has a clear advantage over others. So what?

@BYRIANIoGRIEF 4 года назад

@@darksideorbit8898 I imagine it's because that isn't why she was banned, she was banned because of her testosterone levels. I think one of the most illuminating parts of this video is that only those athletes deemed "suspicious" are subjected to testing. That alone carries the potential for clear discrimination.

@gaswe9236 4 года назад

She was born with XY chromosomes because she's intersex. Which they mentioned.

@Fuad052793 4 года назад

So Vox, you guys sure did leave a lot of people more confused than before they had started to watch this video. Define intersex, make sure to explain the distinction between transgender and intersex, define Semenya's chromosomes. You guys did none of that. Disappointed.

@logoslive 4 года назад

It didn't have to to get the point across.

@Lectar117 4 года назад

@@logoslive Semenya has an intersex condition. That information matters.

@de7io407 4 года назад

@@logoslive i was pretty confused and wondering why they didnt just state this simple information

@pagesummer7628 4 года назад

de7io because it doesn’t fit their agenda

@Fuad052793 4 года назад

@@logoslive If not then why is there so much confusion in the comment section? Try to be more objective please.

@thomasaquinas5262 3 года назад

I'd love to know what competitions test and which ones don't. I think that several of the all-time champions in sports would be toppled with more testing. I don't think Armstrong was the sole beneficiary of banned substances...

@gm9413 3 года назад

here a shield and sword for you who are scrolling down, good luck down there!

@spencer4679 3 года назад

Thank you sir I think I need it

@alisa8869 3 года назад

Thanks

@Yuvalmory 4 года назад

Some females with polycystic ovaries have high levels of testosterone, they're basically saying we're not women just because of one hormone.

@Apostate_ofmind 4 года назад

yuval mor-yosef thats why they should test cromosomes again. we have the tecnology and its more black and white than not

@believein1 4 года назад

"Science" today does nothing else but destroy nature.

@Stevonz1234 4 года назад

If men have naturally super high test levels they also aren't allowed to compete. It's a fairness thing.

@Elmotrix 4 года назад

no, they say it would be unfair to compete against other women. Not the same thing.

@atallsteve 4 года назад

they're saying that she is not allowed to compete against other women because of the high levels of testosterone which she probably has because she has XY chromosomes just like men.

@mztscrazytown1463 4 года назад

Taking a drug to reduce your performance is an exact contradiction of the no doping ruling. This group is completely discriminatory

@aidan2521 4 года назад

cnn also called Ralph Northam a republican during his scandal

@Nanocrafters 4 года назад

@@aidan2521 thanks

@storyls 4 года назад

Terri Mullen She is free to not take those drugs and compete in men's events.

@gregjr.8268 4 года назад

exactly my thoughts

@alexpalacios4502 4 года назад

@@storyls so then if men take those drugs and fall below 5, can they then run in the womens events? by your logic, you should answer yes

@brianbutton6346 3 года назад

Thank you for the commenters for including what Vox left out. I have reliably counted on Vox to provide information not clouded with advocacy. This video is an outlier. You get an F.

@LoxsannB 3 года назад

Dude this channel has such an agenda

@julien_lemur2302 3 года назад

why dont they make a competition for women with high testosterone

@kiraanastasiaandersen1145 3 года назад

Then one for small feet, one for long legs and one for good abs

@julien_lemur2302 3 года назад

Kira Anastasia Andersen i will do one better one for blacks one for whites

@kiraanastasiaandersen1145 3 года назад

abrezov aimich twitter would love that

@canaldofred2366 3 года назад

Why dont they make women vs women and men vs men, without putting men to compete with women.

@jobeiden 4 года назад

so funny how i had only heard about this as a transgender issue, and until watching this i thought she was trans. people rlly be unimformed

@Pontif11 4 года назад

Unless the people you heard it from were talking about non trans athletes they weren't uninformed, they were talking about something else.

@flavioptferreira 4 года назад

@big unattractive womane Yeah, you should know, right?

@mankytoes 4 года назад

This video is still misinforming people, because it doesn't use the term "intersex" once. That is what Castor is. And it's a big problem for athletics, because athletics, like much of society operates on the assumption that everyone is either a man or a woman.

@pabloplato 4 года назад

maybe a sign that you need to seek out better and more responsible news sources?

@spellbound1875 4 года назад

@@mankytoes ...the video talks about DSD "also known as intersex". It's most definitely mentioned in the video.

@quito787 4 года назад

To have a complete discourse, Vox needs to mention that Semenya has XY chromosomes.

@gonzo7758 4 года назад

that would not meet their agenda.

@jilliand3713 4 года назад

she is intersex tho. It's not that simple scientifically

@michaelgray1803 4 года назад

Man

@bgrg 4 года назад

@@jilliand3713 if that is the case then I do truly feel sorry for Semenya.

@Historyboi-vn7gd 4 года назад

She Is intersex that doesn't mean anything

@theprincipal2994 Год назад

I think people tend to forget that sports are NOT fair whatsoever. There's a reason we have 1st, 2nd, and third place. It's hilarious when sports officials try to make it "fair" without taking to account that people will naturally be stronger, faster, and taller than other athletes which will give them an advantage.

@ojmotswane 2 года назад

In other words, you can take drugs to reduce your performance but you can’t take drugs to increase your performance.

@rebekalanska2119 4 года назад

Isnt sport about genetical advantages anyways?

@sammysaito529 4 года назад

Yeah pretty much

@darktrooperdalek7991 4 года назад

At this point in time, yeah.

@countzulu99 4 года назад

Only if you're a guy apparently

@soraya.e5482 4 года назад

No it's about people working on a craft not science experiments

@mitchellbaker2872 4 года назад

Rebeka Beka mate she’s a ducking man ,

@jackkraken3888 4 года назад

VOX, I think you forgot to mention that Castor Semenya has XY chormosomes, has no womb nor ovaries and has internal testes. I really wanted to know how these affect a person but I didn't get an answer.

@BBaloa 4 года назад

this comment needs more likes.

@HelmuthGerka 4 года назад

Soo she's a man? The the ban is needed.

@MsZsc 4 года назад

Intersex but still a woman Just need to discus whether she has an unfair advantage or not though

@alma8508 4 года назад

@@MsZsc how is she still a woman? She has xy chromosomes. Doesn't chromosomes determine one's sex? I'm genuinely confused but curious. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

@RDRGUY15 4 года назад

Wait what? No uterus or ovaries

@KenanTheFab 2 года назад

Imagine literally being born with a natural advantage, not induced by drugs, medical operations or anything of that sort, and getting banned for it. Rip Phelps, Bolt and probs other athletes

@soundninja99 2 года назад

Imagine if Usain Bolt has to defend his species. "The only test we have to confirm someone is human is top speed..."

@aidanmoretz2722 4 года назад

God these writers clearly tried to manipulate facts. The reason testosterone is linked to performance is because testosterone has been directly proven to increase muscle mass (hence why steroids are made primarily up of testosterone). As a result, men (because they produce wayyy more testosterone than woman) have more muscle and can perform with higher athletic ability. It’s clearly unfair that someone who was born as a man (and naturally produces testosterone which increases muscle mass) should be allowed to compete against someone who has no ability whatsoever to increase testosterone levels (and as a result muscle mass).

@vittoria4913 4 года назад

She was not born a man! Please watch till the end before leaving ignorant comments. She was born an intersex woman.

@bernadettk.7713 4 года назад

Chiarity she was born with a y chromosome... she possesses the characteristics of both sexes which is why she has far higher testosterone levels than the rest which IS a performance enhancer

@aidanmoretz2722 4 года назад

Chiarity I think bern k pretty much summed up the point.

@fantanfor23arsiden88 4 года назад

@TheProphetPepe Why should you be punished for being born a certain way?. Why can't the women take medical treat meant to higher there testosterone level if they want to compete then?.

@aidanfredericks6117 4 года назад

Fantan she should be punished because she has a very clearly unfair advantage against the other women. She needs to have her testosterone levels lowered or compete with the men

@penitenttangent7346 4 года назад

Phelps asserting dominance with that T pose. 3:27

@SpaghettiKillah 3 года назад

This is a headache: she's BORN that way...high level of testosterone DO enhance performance, otherwise it would be allowed for men. Having said that, if she's BORN with an NATURAL advantage, how's that different from a boxer that has a higher reach even if it's the same height and weight category as his opponent? How's that different from a swimmer who has natural wide and big feet and big long arms vs a short swimmer ? If they measure something (in this case Testosterone levels) then it's time to have racing CATEGORIES...like in boxing..heavier fighters can't fight smaller ones. Similarly, women with under 10 testosterone level run in one category...females who NATURALLY produce over 10 race in another. That seems to be the fairest.

@haywoodjblome4768 2 года назад

Yes and she was born with an XY chromosome..

@johannesziaether3916 2 года назад

@@haywoodjblome4768 Ig she was born as XXY

@Paul-vf2wl 2 года назад

@@johannesziaether3916 No 46xy

@johannesziaether3916 2 года назад

@@Paul-vf2wl it's sad tho she always played with women and she suddenly she has to leave.... Because she wasn't doing it as a trick.

@Paul-vf2wl 2 года назад

@@johannesziaether3916 It is sad it wasn't an easy decision it was unfair to her but letting her stay was unfair to everyone else. The Olympics made it clear how dominant Intersex athletes are specifically at 800m.

@sach3457 3 года назад

the ban is like saying anyone 7 feet tall cant play in the nba

@JeanPaul-ie4ug 3 года назад

No, it's like the wnba banning men

@unreallilac5554 3 года назад

@@JeanPaul-ie4ug no it’s really not. She’s intersex yes but she’s still a woman she just has naturally higher levels of testosterone does that offer some kind of athletic advantage in specific situations yes but you should not be discriminated against for this she had no choice on how she came out of the womb she just decided to make do with what she had and she is a professional international athlete. She should not be discriminated against just because of her naturally higher amounts of testosterone

@EdyMar77 3 года назад

@@unreallilac5554 If she is intersex its NOT a woman , or a man , that is what INTERSEX means.

@sirkowski 4 года назад

You don't ban the tallest basketball players because they have a genetic advantage over the shorter players.

@tristanferencevic453 4 года назад

exactly

@s1ddh4r7h.p 4 года назад

PREACH.

@Jobe-13 4 года назад

sirkowski ikr

@zakai1769 4 года назад

Exactly

@GhostGuy764 4 года назад

We do have weight classes in many other sports tho. If your possition is that we shouldn't discriminate based on natural ability then why not desegregate sports. Ofc then we'd have the problem that males would vastly out compete against females.

@rapaconda 4 года назад

“It’s not the only factor” but it’s a pretty bloody big one

@progoregamer959 4 года назад

I don't like how I get this

@progoregamer959 4 года назад

Don't women get cramps causeing them fatigue

@chessgeneral100 4 года назад

Exactly! And actually it's a little selfish of her demanding anyone to understand her, but herself never feels what all other athletes that compete against her feel like

@bige8949 4 года назад

Yeah, imagine a dude at UFC admitting to taking anabolic steroids for years "They weren't the only factor I won"

@ruethegreat 4 года назад

Ummm u do know that there are diseases like polysistic ovarian syndrome that causes testosterone to increase rapidly in females right? Even if it is not how we r born... and trust me just by looking at someone u can’t tell that... so that’s just utterly wrong !

@bryanxovox 3 года назад

Simple. Women w high testosterone.. Athlete Man trying to compete as a women.. not athlete

@yummypopsicle8046 3 года назад

Yes u right idk why no one gets that

@WaywardEnding 3 года назад

Well, she indetifies herself as a woman but she got XXY chromosomes.

@fievosfry4822 3 года назад

I find this so strange because many top athletes have natural physical attributes which heighten their performance eg. Tall basket ball players, Phelps large feet and long arms ect.. Shes only being critiqued because she is a woman and is so successful

@thunder8332 3 года назад

Why weren’t the William sister as heavily criticized. I haven’t seen any critism towards them. They are women they are successful.

@Paul-vf2wl 2 года назад

Those top athletes don't have a different genotype than the other people they are competing against.

@awezone404 Год назад

not she its he . he actually is pretending to be a woman to win an competition

@snap9342 3 года назад

It is very hard to actually make the whole tournament completely fair for everyone. This is basically like not allowing a player from playing basketball because he is naturally very tall.

@srensen3081 3 года назад

tt317 exactly, the y chromosome is the whole reason men and women arent competing against each other

@wntergirl23 3 года назад

@@nick_steele9790 That would be sensible but rules are now made to suit the rare exceptions.

@thapelomaraisane8705 3 года назад

That is an incredibly weak argument. These criteria are similar to weight classes in boxing.

@snap9342 3 года назад

@@thapelomaraisane8705 No. first of all, you can control your weight way more easily compared to your height which relates to your genetics and is basically impossible to change. The fact that weight can be changed easily just makes the rules and regulation very easy to handle. Second of all, it's hard to make a section for each particular range of chromosomes since we dont have that much amount of people to actually hold events as large as the olympics. Now what did you say again?

@blood-agent-j1012 3 года назад

In no way is that the same.

@alexc2265 4 года назад

Yeah, this feels like a no-win situation.

@alexc7857 4 года назад

@Alex C yes

@gruntingskunk2237 3 года назад

Alex C I like you

@Ah_liyah 3 года назад

@@alexc7857 you guys have the same name :0

@alexc7857 3 года назад

@@Ah_liyah that's because we are the same person

@alexc7857 3 года назад

@@gruntingskunk2237 ❤

@juanpierro9734 3 года назад

Great video despite not looking to address the elephant in the room...

@dermatze9172 3 года назад

What do you mean?

@despacheeto 3 года назад

Shes literally just built different

@warrior_of_liberation 4 года назад

"...and news outlets have wrongly portrayed her as transgender." Damn, *FOX* lived up to my expectations. Exactly what i hoped it would.😂😂

@warrior_of_liberation 4 года назад

@Tobby Isiba and you are saying based on what?

@mitchellbaker2872 4 года назад

Mautik Ganvir you have such a brainwashed mind

@La-playy 4 года назад

@@warrior_of_liberation do you really trust what Fox say?

@warrior_of_liberation 4 года назад

@@mitchellbaker2872 You are always welcomed to correct me.

@Miquelalalaa 4 года назад

Mautik Ganvir She is intersex I believe, but with XY chromosomes she has a biological advantage, that no woman can complete with.

@abdullahsaeed7542 4 года назад

Obviously some athletes are going to have a physical advantage over others this what makes them win Obviously Phelps is not a man he's cheetah running that fast

@rs0582 4 года назад

Mas Abd She is basically a man. She has testosterone levels around the lower average of men, she is an XY variant of intersex and tests XY on all her cells (not included in the video), and she is not built like a majority of the women she’s competing against. The only difference between her and most men out there is her genitalia. Women’s sports are separate from men’s sports due to the massive differences between males and females. Males are just better at these kinds of sports because of those differences, and if she has more in common with men then she shouldn’t be competing against women. It’s just not fair.

@Moosa27 4 года назад

@@rs0582 All your reply still didn't answer the original comment. Also, she literally has 1 hormone different than other females

@rs0582 4 года назад

Moosa27 She has the same cells as men and has 8 times the testosterone of a normal woman. Those are some of the big things that make men, men. (other than genitalia)

@TheMongooseOfDoom 4 года назад

@@Moosa27 If she wants to compete as a man, there is nothing stopping her. The IAAF has to make some kind of distinction to tell who can qualify for women's sports. I think they know it's not perfect, there isn't a good alternative. They can't just say: Sex is not clearly defined, so let's throw all the athletes together. They have to draw a line somehow, and that's the best they could come up with.

@b.l.m2427 4 года назад

exactly

@jenevans9004 2 года назад

I met Casta in Pretoria when I was in high school. She is such an amazing person and didn’t deserve any of what the media was saying. We love you Catsa 🇿🇦🇧🇼

@walkerpaulp6526 2 года назад

Nope we don't

@accelworld6.031 2 года назад

@Walkerpaup We don’t care about you or your opinion

@walkerpaulp6526 2 года назад

@@accelworld6.031 no no pal it's not "We" It's "I" Lotta racists out there white lives matter

@accelworld6.031 2 года назад

@@walkerpaulp6526 there is no link with racism , nobody even talked about that and if you mention it , it just shows how a hater you are. I advise you to stop hating for nothing , you are ruining your own life.

@blueguise23 2 года назад

Didn't deserve to be born Intersexed?

@calgsus911 2 года назад

Never knew this intersex thing existed on a chromosomal level. That is very interesting. I’m interested in knowing if this is common, and how common it is in sexes with higher and lower levels of testosterone.

@KingJupiter 2 года назад

Afaik it's very rare at 1:1.000.000

@Adam-mv4fw Год назад

@@KingJupiter take away three zeros, then yes

@KingJupiter Год назад

@@Adam-mv4fw Depends on definiton we're both wrong, it's between 1,7% and 0,018%

@Adam-mv4fw Год назад

@@KingJupiter then why did you take the lower end instead of averaging it?

@KingJupiter Год назад

@@Adam-mv4fw I watched a video on that "Trans-Korean" guy once, with a Trans person giving ocmmentary, they said "1:1.000.000"

@TheMcKenzieHaus 4 года назад

Honestly, how she isn’t depressed and suicidal is beyond me. Imagine the whole world debating if you are a woman or not.

@mxRian4 4 года назад

C.L Mckenzie she is super strong and fierce. I follow her on IG.

@brendanwasnothere 4 года назад

probs all that testosterone

@Ithzzz 4 года назад

@@brendanwasnothere lol im ded

@bluepalmsmusic 4 года назад

She is a strong woman! 💪🏿

@frank1015 4 года назад

i know right he is a guy

@Albanez39 4 года назад

Next up: People over 2metres tall won't be able to play basketball.

@rs0582 4 года назад

Lisergiko She is basically a man. She has testosterone levels around the lower average of men, she is an XY variant of intersex and tests XY on all her cells (not included in the video), and she is not built like a majority of the women she’s competing against. The only difference between her and most men out there is her genitalia. Women’s sports are separate from men’s sports due to the massive differences between males and females. Males are just better at these kinds of sports because of those differences, and if she has more in common with men then she shouldn’t be competing against women. It’s just not fair.

@alexn.2901 4 года назад

@@rs0582 🙄🙄🙄🙄

@Toby-yf7ze 4 года назад

@@alexn.2901 I mean he's completely right as far as I can see. Maybe put forward an alternative argument? I'm interested to see what you disagree with here.

@caveshlin 4 года назад

@@rs0582 That's very true. It doesn't seem fair to 'true' women to have to compete against her. But on the other hand, the conditions for her to actually compete are also quite ridiculous. If she is forced to take meds to lower test, she can basically never participate in her natural state ever again, which pretty much goes against the Olympics code of ethics and rules. She also has a very poor chance of winning against males in the same category if she competes in the men's divisions. The Olympics were meant to showcase the best of human athletes in their natural state. She just seems too fast for women, and not fast enough for men. To the world, it just seems like the committee wants Semenya to lose or not compete at all. And if the regulatory committee is so adamant about hormone changing meds, why not push for regular women to actually take test boosting meds in order to compete with Semenya? Just food for thought lol

@rs0582 4 года назад

caveshlin Sadly I don’t think there is a scenario where everyone wins here, but keeping the integrity of women’s sports should always keep priority. Plus giving other atheists more testosterone is both doping, and can have severe side effects. Someone here has to loose, and I’d rather it be one runner than all the other Olympic teams out there with passionate people and a new chance to grasp that gold.

@palithepancake2873 Год назад

Lets ban people who are naturally gifted in a sport, in a competition about being good at a sport. checks out.

@Guesswhokk 2 года назад

How do you draw the line for unfair advantage? Even though naturally gifted. Answer - Don't draw a line.

@kung-fukennyfamily 4 года назад

I really feel sorry for Semenya . All this intrusion and humiliation .

@neurosin 4 года назад

I sympathize but do not feel sorry. She is a badass and is much stronger than me physically and emotionally!

@watermelonsheloves 4 года назад

@@neurosin I agree with you! I also think she would rather have us support her than feel sorry for her.

@a.ivarouqa7017 4 года назад

it's noble of you to sympathize , but such stories are unfortunately inevitable when the criteria that separate between the women/men brackets is being debated. a line has to be drawn somewhere to protect the women's bracket, even though and it's never gonna be perfect .

@jackkraken3888 4 года назад

The problem is more complex than Vox is letting on. Apparently she has no womb no ovaries and has internal testes. I don't know how to think about this.

@manuvillada5697 4 года назад

I feel bad for the actual women who are getting crushed by this dude no matter how much they train

@sean7930 3 года назад

The sheer amount of important information not included by vox is incredible.

@scottperkins5038 3 года назад

Maybe it's just me but I've always seen Box as a jumping off point for a topic, something like this is always going to gloss over or skip important information but these are the cliff notes. Vox is about "understanding the news" not presenting it.

@fairy5668 3 года назад

Like what? Also if your username is unironic then idk if you're particularly credible

@ganeshprem3043 3 года назад

My thoughts exactly! Vox is shamelessly dishonest and omitted vital information so as to allow them to misrepresent the actual matter. I'm certain they're deleting all the comments that go against their narrative.

@vinos1629 3 года назад

@@fairy5668 They have a Y chromosome ..

@bananacarlin 3 года назад

@@ganeshprem3043 been 3 weeks and your comment hasn’t been removed.

@avarmauk 3 года назад

I really feel for Semenya. I hope she can have her day in the light.

@abi_4906 2 года назад

Y chromosome helps lol

@peterschaeffer 3 месяца назад

Caster is a man, not a 'she'

@Neanzo 2 года назад

If there are testosterone limits for women, are there testosterone limits for men an well, or can they have any natural advantage and keep competing?

@Neanzo Год назад

@B Babbich I think you need to reread my comment. 😂

@Neanzo Год назад

@B Babbich And I'm not talking about men getting extra testosterone. I'm talking about the natural levels they have, which can vary a lot from one man to another.

@Neanzo Год назад

@B Babbich I think you must've misunderstood my comment from the beginning because "get more testosterone" doesn't make sense, even if you were making a joke, unless that joke was based on intentionally misinterpreting what I said.

@ngzilin880 4 года назад

11:11 “you try to be in front of me, I jump you” Wise words said

@ryanmarie4461 4 года назад

NZL_ Vernice "thats how life is" my new role model

@Marcus-uu5qf 4 года назад

@@ryanmarie4461 Thats how life *it* is*

@Marcus-uu5qf 4 года назад

@Daniel Kalz ?

@I_Am_ThatGuy 4 года назад

Erianuoluwa Ogunwole He*

@alexandermunoz6564 4 года назад

This video was missing some info that wasn't clarified completely.

@bennettgraham9637 4 года назад

Alexander Muñoz ?

@nathanj2439 4 года назад

Pretty sure this vid would be a 2 hour movie instead of a 12 minute video if they went to detail

@alexandermunoz6564 4 года назад

@@nathanj2439 True

@evanthefish1857 4 года назад

Bennett Graham he has xy chromosomes, vox completely left out that fact

@dawsonarrington6177 3 года назад

We should just have women and men compete together. Top humans competing. In my opinion is just makes men and women not seem equal when they are competing separate.

@zmeyagosho Год назад

So, let me get this straight - testosterone is not proven to have an effect on performance, but all top 3 runners in the olympics have high testosterone?

@ulysserk8161 Год назад

Congratulations, you’ve just discovered the need to differentiate causation and correlation 🥳

@user-ci3xc5bz5h 4 года назад

Michael Phelps has naturally webbed feet granting a boost in speed. "stRiP hiM oF HiS meDaLs."

@rs0582 4 года назад

The Won She is basically a man. She has testosterone levels around the lower average of men, she is an XY variant of intersex and tests XY on all her cells (not included in the video), and she is not built like a majority of the women she’s competing against. The only difference between her and most men out there is her genitalia. Women’s sports are separate from men’s sports due to the massive differences between males and females. Males are just better at these kinds of sports because of those differences, and if she has more in common with men then she shouldn’t be competing against women. It’s just not fair.

@wavetail 4 года назад

RS05 but the differences between men and women aren’t just levels of testosterone. That’s part of what the video was talking about. Just because a woman had high testosterone, doesn’t make them a man. Just like if a man has low testosterone, that doesn’t make them a woman. And just like she is not built like a majority of women, doesn’t take away the fact that she’s a woman. They talked about how Michael Phelps has many bodily advantages such as a large torso, double jointed limbs, and webbed feet. But Michael is called lucky for having those natural advantages. As many people have been pointing out in the comments, there are multiple diseases, such as polycystic ovarian syndrome, that cause higher levels of testosterone in women. To women lose their title as women until the disease goes away? Limiting a woman’s right to call herself a woman based on things so literally fluid and arbitrary as testosterone levels is a recipe for disaster. We should be celebrating Semenya and her accomplishments.

@b.l.m2427 4 года назад

@@rs0582 I see that you are replying in almost everyone's comment.

@rs0582 4 года назад

Cra-zy Vi-bez I’m not going to type out the same thing over and over again when I can just be lazy

@haleighe.walthall6069 4 года назад

Luis Antonio Perez, I’ve actually been swimming for 2 years with my swim team and I’ve never been banned from swimming because I have webbed feet. They don’t even help in the water, since the condition doesn’t web the entire foot, only the two toes next to the big toe. So I don’t see the issue with it, it doesn’t give an advantage, since humans biologically don’t know how to use webbed feet.

@CaptainObvio 4 года назад

Your video could’ve done a lot better on explaining why chromosomal sex determination fell out of favour.

@alma8508 4 года назад

Yes like the subject ended abruptly and I found myself immediately being like wait what? Wait here don't go, come back here and explain to me!

@piotrromanski6246 4 года назад

No because it probably wouldn't support voxs agenda

@JerseySean666 4 года назад

It doesn't allow transgender people to compete, which is why they introduced the ridiculous testosterone limits and why we have the problem we have now.

@phxnigtmare 4 года назад

Because they found she had intersex traits, so she never allowed for the results to be published claiming they were 'unscientific' . it was leaked she has no uterus. Look at her wikipedia page for a start it talks about it a bit,

@dinahmyte3749 4 года назад

They did explain it, the wide variety of ways you can be classified as intersex disqualified many women but never applied it to men.

@melli3656 Год назад

I feel like no one in the comments really listened to what was said in the video

@haggismuncher735 3 года назад

I love how Vox are trying to obfuscate and pull out the exception to the rule, rather than the rule in general to say when we should ignore the rule all together.

@KaranSingh-or7yy 4 года назад

She's *genetically gifted.* Every person is *not same.*

@toptechtips187 4 года назад

You spelt he

@toptechtips187 4 года назад

Wrong

@SPEARKO100 4 года назад

@@toptechtips187 *She.

@SPEARKO100 4 года назад

@@toptechtips187 9:54

@DontHatemusiK 4 года назад

@@SPEARKO100 that's a dude, guy

@hannyadisme 4 года назад

All this information shows me is that her body was created to be a beast at sports, and damn right she should take advantage of it!

@Jobe-13 4 года назад

DC Infinity ikr

@bennolan454 4 года назад

It's been proven she has XY chromesomes

@baamonster2 4 года назад

He has internal testes

@jackkraken3888 4 года назад

You're right no need for womb and ovaries and internal testes a beast indeed.

@Definitely_Melnyx 4 года назад

So the very reason why women and men aren’t competing together is because of physical advantage, but why should it be lifted for some individuals, just because they don’t have a donger.

@TheXaminedLife 2 года назад

If athletes are not allowed to take performance-enhancing drugs, then they should not be forced to take performance-limiting drugs. UBU.

@micahvisser3772 Год назад

Why don't we just create different ranges? Like how paralympic sports keep people of the same abilities competing fairly.

@minavamp2811 Год назад

in track and field at this moment. you can count dsd athletes with 1 hand that are competing at the elite level and therefore there aren't enough of them to run against one another in order to have their own category.

@Handle35667 4 года назад

I don’t understand. What’s not accurate about chromosome testing?

@gabrielantunez7642 4 года назад

Feelings

@16kashman 4 года назад

Vox

@danadomino 4 года назад

The question still remains - what do we do with people who are intersex? Do we let them complete, if so, where? What category? Who decides which category they compete in?

@williambarabanitz3858 4 года назад

@@danadomino Two Olympic intersex categories need to be established.

@michaelgray1803 4 года назад

@@danadomino intersex Olympics whatever that is

@fish9468 4 года назад

If all the best athletes have too much testosterone, doesn't that say something?!

@arayagarner2291 4 года назад

I'm confused but they don't.

@alivia214 4 года назад

i don’t think so. People become top athletes due to a mix of natural ability and physical. If woman have naturally higher testosterone levels than thats “natural ability” which makes it easier for them to win. It’s the same as how Michael Phelps has his height or his foot shape. It is just natural ability that these athletes have that helps rise them to the top. I don’t think people should be banned for that.

@johnmoore1495 4 года назад

James Bond how’s it unfair? It’s natural genetic variability, athletes will be different. If you’re talking about these intersex cases then yes I can see how it’s unfair.

@Biggyweezer69 4 года назад

@@johnmoore1495 The difference is that this is mass variation, basically all men have higher testosterone levels than basically all women, this is not the case with other things like Michael Phelps feet and height where there are many guys close to his height (I would say 6+ feet is close to 6'4") compared to the massive difference in T levels between genders. The difference both exists in almost all cases when comparing the two genders and its too extreme of an advantage. They should be banned for extreme genetic advantage it already happens with weight classes.

@conord6123 2 года назад

So why was chromosome testing abandoned? The intersex thing can't possibly come up often enough to give up on chromosome testing, and it seems like a way more legitimate criteria than T. If you are a woman with (naturally) high T, good for you, just like for Phelps. Also forcing people to medicate unnecessarily is messed up.

@victorfp23 3 года назад

3:00 was kind of pointless. No one said Testosterone was the only reason she was good, BUT testosterone does increase athletic performance when all other factors are close to the same, WHICH WITH OLYMPIC ATHLETES are all going to have good coaching, equipment, training, etc.

@wereallpinkinside8452 4 года назад

“in the next Olympics” *laughs in non-spectator*

@problemsolver3254 3 года назад

Bold of you to assume there will be a next Olympics

@trafalgarla 4 года назад

7:05 It's important to note that the study was not just questioned; a correction was issued by the authors because other researchers found there was a lot of bad data which changed the conclusions significantly.

@dilbin97 4 года назад

Do you have info on the correction and conclusion change?

@do_care919 4 года назад

[Citation needed]

@edubsclips5028 4 года назад

Good comment

@camilo3530 4 года назад

How do you explain Semenya bad performance after she was forced to take pills to decrese her testosterone level?

@trafalgarla 4 года назад

@@camilo3530 "bad performance"? She was slightly slower (which can affect her placing because she is not nearly as dominate as athletes like Usain Bolt, Phelps, Mike Tyson are or were) and her experts have already dealt with this argument. The medications she was required to take can affect her and others in many more ways one of which is weight gain which would slow down a runner. There are numerous possible explanations from weight, fatigue, affects on circulation, and even psychological effects that could consciously or subconsciously affect her performance. You would just be conflating correlation with causation if you argue it must be because her testosterone is lower.

@w0nderer82 Год назад

I didn't know her, but she's a winner. Mentally most of all. Love women like that.

@markkaz7754 3 года назад

If anything, people shouldn’t blame the athletes, but find a way to include them fairly because they are exceptional athletes. This is a failure of the system not the athletes, and it seems nobody knows the answer.