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I think Shadow’s portrayal in this issue was fine. The fact he was more level headed and open to suggestions is a step in the right direction. (Maybe it also means that SEGA is loosening the reins too hopefully.) Shows that he’s growing as a character. Also that painting is awesome. Great work to Natalie Haines.
Yeah but it's such an obvious case of character regression. Like it seems that Sega doesn't know what to do with him ever since his character arc ended in sonic 06, so they were like "hey let's keep him as an edgy douche as a cheap ploy to induce internal conflict amongst the crew, that way he's more relevant as a character😀" like gtfo here
I just recently went and 100% Shadow The Hedgehog, and no. Sonic does not encounter Shadow Androids, but even if there’s a storyline mission I’m blanking out where he does, none of the storylines were canon, except for the Last Story. So, Sonic commenting and actually meeting the Shadow Androids is a nice touch
The closest path to actually being 'canon' would be Neutral-Neutral-Dark-Hero-Hero-Dark, AKA 'Together With Maria', since it's the one that has him get angry at GUN, remember a flashback of Maria that puts him back on the right path, see the Shadow Androids, and meet the GUN Commander, the last of which is heard briefly in the Last Story. Plus him protecting the ruins of the ARK gives him a nice place to brood.
@@ffffffffROTHY I forget some of the actual story details, but me and a friend looked at ALL the story paths, and they contradict the Last Story in some way. I always wanted the Archie Comics to give an actual main story, but Ian took it different way. At least I got some good Archie Shadow stories in the end
Yeah, while it's been...a literal decade(??) from what I can recall, Shadow Androids were active enemies only in Eggman base stages. More often than not, Omega was an ally in those stages. So, while I can't be fully confident, hypothetically, it feels unlikely that Sonic or Tails met a Shadow Android on any path. Before clicking reply, I quickly checked the wiki and while it can't guarantee accurate information, it did repeat what little information I could recall. It says Shadow Android only appear in Iron Jungle and Lava Shelter. Both have Omega as the ally.
I don’t agree that Shadow should be more aggressive. I’m fine with his actions being aggressive, but Shadow rarely get’s Angry in the games. He’s usually very calm.
I Can let that one slide. Shadow The Hedgehog is a game where you Can choose What Shadow Can become. He Can become just like he was in SA2 as a hero, or he Can become a villain because of Black Doom convinced him to believe that humanity is evil. Not to mention they 10 endings are non canon. Though many people critisises that fact, but the Way i see it. These are just possible choices of What Shadow Can become. But the point of all 10 endings is that This is What Shadow does NOT become. In the end of the game, he decides to move on from his past. In the end of the game he says “Adios, Shadow the hedgehog” because the Shadow that wanted to fufill his promise to Maria is truly gone, because after hearing why he was created (He did not regain his memories), he hates his past and want nothing to do with it. From now on, Shadow decides who he shall become.
@@Boi-wot uk at first Ian read all that but I know in the end shadow isn’t an aggressive character unless he has to I just said that quote because he said shadow never got angry in the games😂
In Shadow's game, the androids only appear in the last two middle path levels, Iron Jungle and Lava Shelter. Omega is the Hero companion in both. They also are teased in the Team Dark ending of Heroes, but again only Rouge and Omega see them.
I swear, every time Omega shows up in IDW, he somehow gets his ass kicked. First, he got obliterated by infinite in tie-in comic, then he got trashed by Zombots, Then he got turned into a Mac suit just to get torn apart by himself ,after that he got repaired just to be wrecked along side Gemerl, and now he’s getting overwhelmed by Shadow Androids.
Worf effect, it's kinda funny considering Omega tanked multiple spin dashes from a brainwashed and bloodlusted Shadow in the Archie comics (Post-reboot) yet got easily torned apart by a weaken Zombot Shadow in IDW. I like Omega and his lines but its kinda too on the nose to make the "big strong monotone" character a jobber (He literally spent several issues as just a head lol!).
8:24 I can confirm, Sonic and Co. have never encountered the Shadow Androids ever. The only ones who know do their existence apart from Eggman, are Team Dark, Whisper, Mimic, and Tangle. The only time the Shadow Androids appear in Shadow 05 are in Iron Jungle and Lava Shelter, where Shadow only teams up Omega to go through those locations. And ever since the Eggman Base trap in Tangle & Whisper, they haven’t appeared in any *major* storylines until Urban Warfare (this IDW arc)
Technically wouldn't Rouge have had to been briefed after, as after the whole fiasco, both went to work for GUN? ...then again this is 06 we're talking about so... eh who knows
@@tsyumamatsuthehavenofguard32 Briefed about what? I don't see any reason for GUN to feel the need to tell Rouge about the androids. Though, as others have pointed out, this is irrelevant because Rouge knew about the androids before GUN did. Rouge and Omega were the first ones to see the androids back in Sonic Heroes.
I'm glad thst Shadow's character has improved since the Metal Virus arc. He seems more strategic and aware of the circumstances than before and while I do wish we saw a bit more of his softer side, this is a step in the right direction.
I really like that they showed the cover actually being painted on a canvas before, as that truly impressed me. Imagine how much that would go for in an auction. We need a Sonic Art museum asap!
I think I know what I actually want. I think ALL I WANT is for Shadow to be a team player, to be a part of the group, and to treat his rivalry with Sonic a bit more competitively than grudgingly. This chapter does that, I think, so I’m kind of happy. It really feels like Shadow is a part of the colourful cast, and not some black horse.
Shadow was pretty good here. I like he's shown to be offended, yet acting level and coordinately, working with the others to think of a strategy. Maybe if they were to show a bit more of the dynamic he has with Team Dark...
Rouge's smooshing panel reminded me of Sonic Chronicles, where she gets introduced by flirting with Sonic and Amy cries out for her to back off. Combined with Adam's habit of making Sonic girls notably bustier and of course it would break twitter...
I wouldn’t call it a hate fetish so much as I’d call it SEGA execs who don’t get his character. Ian and Evan are really trying to write him right, but the execs want him to be a shallow Vegeta knock-off and not the layered, brooding, but ultimately caring antihero he was by the end of 06.
I'm surprised idw was able to finally characterize Shadow I'm happy to show that Sega's management has started to get better in recent years than in 2017.
8:23 To put the records out there, Sonic and Tails never encounter the Shadow Androids, nor do they really ever show involvement in the Shadow Android story in any scenarios. It's only Shadow and Omega, and even then, Shadow's Android worries is never actually said to Sonic and Tails, either. It started with Team Dark, stayed with Team Dark, and much like the actual Androids, was basically gone after Shadow the Hedgehog until now.
Huge Shadow (05) fan here, I play the game regularly so I feel equipped to answer your question! In the game, the only time Sonic comes close to seeing the Androids is at Iron Jungle, which Sonic was at prior to travelling to the ARK. He isn’t shown fighting Androids, and he doesn’t comment on them. Shadow fights them alongside Omega but not Sonic. So it’s not impossible Sonic saw some Androids there, but likely he missed the party there!
3:00 DAMN, that art is super beautiful, good representation and theme fallen angel makes sense, and FINALLY someone brings back the Shadow Androids. Notice the yellow streaks, it's like a blend of the androids and the P2 Shadow in his game's vs mode, as the androids were metalic while the P2 was more life like... can't wait until the Metal March where they get brought up.
10:27 pretty sure he can use chaos control (teleportation at least) without a chaos emerald or the stopping time thing since he's kinda done both in SA2 and forces and the way he gave out the line that said he didn't have enough energy to do it made sound more like it's unusual rather than expected.
According to Ian Flynn, SEGA's current stance on it is that he "always" has an Emerald when he does Chaos Control. This, of course, is a retcon, but it is important to bear in mind the current rules during the current arc. Edit: After sleeping on it, the way it's worded here makes it sound like the "Schrodinger's Reference" to Super Knuckles in Frontiers. Like it fits with the current rules, but if they backtrack, it'll still make sense.
@@Mepphy99 considering he's already got chaos energy inside of him i feel he should be able to do it on his own just like he does- spear, boost, and blast on his own
If Tangle, Whisper, and Lanolin are intangible… how come they can still walk on the ground just fine? You could say that the laws of gravity still apply to them, but wouldn’t that mean they’d just phase trough the each of the upper floors of Eggman’s tower, Danny Phantom-style? Are they floating? Are just the bottoms of their feet tangible? Why do their clothes and weapons count as a part of “their atoms?”
@@MONKEYmaddness54 …and yet Whisper can’t “consciously” make her weapons (which somehow counts as a part of HER atoms) interact with Eggman’s still-beating heart. None of it makes sense. It’s absolutely contrived for the for the sake of the plot; that’s it. No discussion needed.
ALL HAIL SHADOW! WOOOO! But seriously, I’m so happy that his character is finally getting justice! But I do agree that he does need to be used sparingly do to his power. And with Sonic prime coming out very soon his character will have a lot of attention! Thanks for keeping us up on the Sonic comics, can’t wait for the next one!
I think that the release of Sonic Prime has helped shift Sega's stance on how Shadow may be written. That show had a Shadow that, in my mind, sits as a compromise between Sega's desire for an something like an edgy loner antagonist, and many fans' desires for (as one might put it) a maybe edgy hero of calm sentiment and great talent. With how well Shadow was received in that show, playing out as a hero who seemingly cared greatly (and emotionally) about the world's safety BUT still harshly butt heads with Sonic and expressed anger and antagonism towards the blue blur, I think that maybe Sega is being more open with letting Shadow's character shift elsewhere. Sonic Frontiers' success may also be worth something, e.g. giving Sega greater reason to trust in the comic writers, but that's less specific. Regardless of anything else, it should be noted that Evan Stanley talked a bit on tumblr about some direction she was given writing Shadow in an (at the time) upcoming story- presumably this one. If I recall correctly, she said that Sega wanted her to write Shadow as a bit more calculated and reasonable- maybe not changing his actions, but at least having him explain himself. That, at the very least, is CERTAINLY on display here. This story line was (is? 61 left on a kinda weird note) absolutely great. I kinda feel like Lanolin's big action debut was a bit overshadowed (or rather, over-SHADOWED :D) by everyone else's stuff, but still, it was so good. I'm terribly excited for more of all these characters- especially since this story kinda brought so many of the characters ALL together for the first time, or at least the first time since the metal virus. I didn't realize how much I wanted more Blaze and Silver, or even Amy, and after that whole show, I REALLY want more of Team Dark, solo or together frankly.
Honestly really liked Shadow here - as you say a bit of edge is fun, and Shadow is designed to be edgy (in a good way) Also really enjoyed the other characters, especially Blaze and Silver, neither got much but what was there was really fun (especially Blaze’s expressions)
After seeing so much discourse and well thought out arguments over what Shadow SHOULD be, I dont even know what to expect at this point. I was satisfied with his portrayal in this arc, but anything could happen with future arcs and games.
Eggman is routinely using world ending threats now. First a grey goo scenario, then an infinitely replicating city. When Eggman makes a move, it requires your full attention.
@kian7406 so a lesbian couple is now empty lust? Sounds you're jealous that you can't get int to he action between 2 consenting people, perv, Cope and seeth hettie
This issue* of shadow gave me think of nazo unleashed. Shadow pulls up, he’s pretty competent in battle, got a moment to shine, Allies rejoice at shadow being cool, sonic shows a bit of envy, big bad claps back with overwhelming force It’s all connected man! he’s just not packing a gun this time around 😂 It’s a good start restarting the character of shadow compared to him in the metal virus saga *”comic issue”, not “gripe”
I think that’s the problem with having a ‘lancer’ character. If they’re strong, they’re never allowed to shine, because they would end the story. Vegeta is such a poster-child for this kind of thing.
I don't like when shadow is portrayed being insulted so easily or annoyed by everyone. I always liked when he was more mature and showed no emotion when challenged because he was so confident in himself.
This is why I love IDW it’s always taking things from other media but Sonic, also I would love your thoughts on IDW being Canon now Love your vids keep up the good work.
When you say IDW being canon, are you referring to that one thing Ian Flynn said on a podcast about how there would be no continuity issues if its made canon? or was it made canon through some actual official material or announcement?(That isn't them acknowledging there is a person named tangle, because by that logic Sonic Boom is canon)
They have gone on to say that IDW is canon after Frontiers, and characters like Jewel, the Restoration and Starline have been mentioned in recent media. Granted, Twitter Takeovers aren't canon but Tailstube is (Jewel was mentioned in the latest Tailstube video. Spiral Hill, Tangle's home, was mentioned in the first Tailstube as well). IDW has always been very consistent with the canon and was made with the intention of being accurate to the games. I think it's fair to say at this point that IDW Sonic is indeed canon.
Eggperial city feels like a great video game. Lots of badnicks to fight, A few mini boss levels (Shadow Androids). They even have game exclusive power ups that disappear next issue. Tell me you couldn't see the fake chaos emerald growths being used ad a pop up power attack for your character to use!
From what I remember, Shadow and Omega were the only ones that fought the androids in STH. Rogue first discovered them with Omega at the end of SH's dark story.
I'm pretty sure only the Chaotix knew of the Shadow Androids during one of the Shadow missions, at the very least, just Vector because he was a part of the endings where Shadow tries to confirm from Eggman if he really is an Android. But no, Sonic and his friends have never seen the Androids, or heard about them, except Rouge of course
Vector is only part of an ending with Black Doom, where Shadow gets depressed about the destruction caused by his creation. Omega is the only companion involved in the Shadow android stuff.
@@Havik61 ohh, right, right, I got that one mixed up with the ending with Shadow and Omega beating Eggman together. ...well shit, none of the Sonic cast knew about Shadow Androids except Team Dark
In more recent issues, Eggman has stated how useless Orbot, Cubot, and other badniks are. How he always has to do everything himself. Which has me wondering, when/if/how will IDW incorporate Sage into the comics? Will she appear in a time skip? Or perhaps make her debut some other way? We know the IDW comics take place sometime after Sonic Forces, and Frontiers was the next mainline game after Forces (after five years had passed). But, I can only see Sage’s involvement in the comics in a time-skip at some point. I’d love to see how she’d interact with the rest of the main cast. Some think Shadow would see Maria in Sage. I’m certainly curious how Omega would interact with Sage, an AI created by Eggman. Considering he’s all about destroying Eggman robots. Sage would be a special case.
When I read this I actually thought that red light could be reference to choas blast from the shadow the hedgehog game after building up enough choas energy it explodes out of him.
12:59 didnt Shadow say that the Chaos Energy of the Fake emeralds IS distorted? Maybe the distorted Chaos Energy overwhelmed Shadow and caused that explosion
kinda hurts hearing shadow say he cant use his powers without a chaos emerald when in sonic battle, he said he draws out the power from his heart to use his chaos abilities
Yeah sorta lame to lock what makes his moveset unique behind having an emerald instead of just saying "his powers are stronger, effective, and more efficient with one". You can even have a plot point where using a Chaos Emerald is like a crutch for insufficient talent in Chaos Control instead using the "thoughts turned into power" mantra.
I don't think it's necessarily that. He's probably currently by the time the others showed up his chaos energy reserves were depleted. He was able to use chaos control in Forces without an emerald.
They could've had it so he has like a tethered connection to chaos energy that allows him to use chaos powers without an emerald however it's limited and not as strong with a chaos emerald.have it so the connection can be disrupted by energy waves and a large distance from the chaos emerald
@@sonic5993 I gave a suggestion to limit his abilities. He can still do that just not as effective. Like he can perform a finite amount of Chaos abilities at a time. Basically resource management and find intresting ways to make use of them. I just feel like there are more creative ways to do that then what they did. Even lends itself to actually build on how the series magic system works. (Cause it desperately needs it).
Damn all these groups, around 5:30 it... it's giving me Sonic Heroes vibes, especially with the... ahem grand metropolis that repairs itself. Even in the weird alternate world, Lanolin, Whisper, and Tangle in a group of 3. There's Team Dark, Team Sonic without Knuckles, Amy is hanging with Silver and Blaze the Silver Campaign group in 06... all that's missing is Knuckles and Team Chaotix dang it.
So glad you're finally covering Sonic 2 ROM hacks! Sonic 2: Return of Shadow is pretty advanced for its time and what it was made on and... oh. it's about another idw comic...
I became a big fan of Rouge at soms point between Generations and the Metal Virus Arc (so maybe around Forces Era), but the IDW comics have really made me like Omega a lot, too. To be fair, I didn't play KOTOR, so while I know who HK-47 is, Omega doesn't feel too derivative.
It is interesting that Sonic never encountered the shadow androids. They looked different but at the end of some paths in Sonic Heroes I recall shadow androids being fightable enemies, but I guess that was only on team dark's path or something? That or my memory is fuzzy.
From what i understand, the chaos move Shadow was going to do before exploding was a Chaos Blast, Since technically speaking a Chaos Blast is unleashing energy as an explosion, it would make sence that the fake emeralds used that energy liberation as a scape route, which by extention forced the system to create more emeralds to keep stability and causing more energy to escape until Eggman manages to reboot the system and add a limit to how much energy can be produced as a way to prevent an overload.
To answer your question is sonic has encountered shadow androids in shadow the hedgehog, NOPE only shadow and omega have seen the androids on a true neutral run
Ok this video had by far the funniest patreon supporter readthrough Like this is the first one I've seen nick literally stop reading the names to look up something on google lmfao
Shadow is a tragic character because of maria the only game that got shadows portrait right is sa2 he aint edgy he only wants to find his purpose in the world i hope sega uses this character more
I usually just compared Shadow to other rival characters like Protoman.EXE and Zero a no- nonsense character who gets stuff done when ordered to and more importantly help with no fuss when necessary.
8:27 No, shockingly! Sonic never knew the existence of the Shadow Androids! He never saw the MASSIVE lineup of them aboard The Egg Fleet in Heroes, he never encountered a single one In Shadow The Hedgehog, and he definitely didn't see any in the IDW canon either. Hell, the only Shadow Android he ever met was the one from Sonic Heroes and he didn't even know it wasn't the real shadow!
Team Dark and Eggman are the only characters from the games aware of the Shadow Androids, in Shadow The Hedgehog, Sonic and his friends efforts(Excluding Team Chaotix, they were researching GUN, Eggman, and the ARKs databases) were fully focused on the Black Arms with Sonic occasionally challenging Shadow to take out a big ship, race to the Chaos Emerald, or chase down Black Doom. Sonic doesn't see a single Badnik in the game, nor does he interact with Dr. Eggman until the Final Story but even then they hardly acknowledge the others presence. Funnily enough, Knuckles, Amy, and Team Chaotix have more moments with the Doctor than Sonic himself in Shadow's game.
8:10 The only two levels with Shadow androids were the final two neutral ones you team up with Omega in those. So no. Nobody besides Team Dark should know about the shadow androids.
Off the top of my head, the only character I remember who also encountered shadow androids in Shadow the Hedgehog was Omega. They appear elsewhere, but I can only remember Omega
