The Roman Ideal of Female Beauty 

bro, how were they heating their houses; did they require a wood business delivery? Was the city of pompeii full of smoke from the fireplaces?

can you please share the name of other history channels worth following? others pls feel free to suggest also what your fav is

​@@LiviuXSAKings and generals is good for learning about campaigns and conquests, Invicta is another pretty good one. Historymarche has crazy production quality, if you want a podcast "The history of Rome" by Mike duncan is a staple and my favorite when it comes to learning about Rome, its long and fairly thorough.

​​@@LiviuXSAHistory time is good to but I feel he has a tendency to leave things out here and there but that could just be me nitpicking Edit: Sandrhoman's videos when it comes to soldiers, war and tactics are some of the best, and his animations are pretty good to. Oversimplified is good to, but as the name suggests it's more of a quick overall coverage. I could find more if you'd like, or if you want a specific topic I could probably find that to, I spend a unhealthy amount of time watching history content 😅

@@LiviuXSA Fire of Learning, Fortress of Lugh, Invicta, Real Crusades History, The Histocrat, History Matters, Thersites the Historian, Epimetheus, Asha Logos, History Uncovered, Dovahhaty, Embrace historia, HistoryMarche, History Time, Archaia Historia, Masaman, Historia Civilis, BazBattles, Epic History TV, Neglected History, LindyBeige, Jabzy. Have fun!

Dan Davis, Fall of civilizations, and history with Cy included with all the previously named. But imo fall of civilizations is top tier content.

I actually thought it was real, like Vogue had a look on roman/greek ancient fashion. I would have read that

I was tickled by Rome hub

@@KingSlimjeezy hermaphrodite porn.

the one time Anitinoos went swiming didn't work out so well

@@kleinweichkleinweich Don't have to know how to swim to shred that powder! Extreme! (Now I'm picturing Antinous in a Mountain Dew/Surge/Doritos commercial from the late 90s/early 2000s with a Nu Metal soundtrack)

ru-vid.comhfk5qxjALso?si=BOBWrqV_caFq38hw @@jona.scholt4362

Scandinavians have been skiing for thousands of years, so it's actually not that farfetched.

​@@kleinweichkleinweich Haha ! 😅

Agreed. I think it has something to do for our modern inclination to stress liberalism. For instance, I noticed women usually have long hair across many different cultures and time periods.

⁠@@user-qq8uf2rn9p as far as I am aware for most of history men had long hair too. Ancient Romans are rather an exception. We in the west adopted the “empire” aesthetic of short cropped hair at the start of the nineteenth century. Before that not only men wore long hair, they also used wigs to compensate for nature deficiencies. 😊

True. Youth, light skin, regular facial features and an hourglass body are widespread standards for feminine beauty. Even if exceptions to some standards exist I doubt that there ever was a society that didn't had youth as a feminine beauty standard.

It's trivially easy to demonstrate that standards of beauty are different across time and place. You don't need to look as far back as the Etruscans; just look at differences in hairstyles and apparel between, say, 1980, and today. Or how fair skin was at various points considered highly attractive, whereas today many women go to tanning salons. Similarly, large breasts were considered unattractive in (certain) Roman periods, since they were associated with older women, but now they are considered desirable by many.

@@Unknown-jt1jo Yes it is obvious that there are different fashions and cultural changes too. I'm just tired of historians stressing how we can't apply our current thinking to the past. For one part that is obvious, as you say, and for another part it is not true.

😭

Ahhh ! 😂🎉 It's that tragic expression of loneliness and disdain when you turn on the football.

@@anjou6497 ?

"being able to afford a stylist, not looking good" I highly doubt that is the only reason. They're known to sacrifice comfort to look good. "The big hairdos of the 80s looked goofy and that's a firsthand account." For you but not for me.

Full of 💩

If you think the hairdos of the ‘80s looked goofy you never watched pictures of the previous decades. Or of Trump. 😂

80s hairdos were the pinnacle of beauty. We truly live in society expunged of culture if we're now claiming they are anything but

Only the truly cultured will appreciate this comment.

dodgy comment

They had to make use without shoeboxes

"You must go for that little blue jar, Patton's Kiss and Tell" (Donald Fagen)😃

Theres tons of blondes in Italy...especially in North Italy, where they constitute the majority of the population in many areas. I find it quite funny this stereotype - almost always coming from the US - about Italians only having brown hair. I always have american friends acting surprised when they come to Italy and realize that blonde hair are quite common, just like Italians with asian traits or black or latino etc. Italy is a quite multiethnic place, and it has been for millenials.

@@DavideGobbicchi Almost all Italian immigrants to the Americas came from Southern Italy, where dark hair and somewhat dark skin are the norm. Those are the only "Italians" that most people in the United States have ever seen, so it's natural for them to presume that that's what Italians in Italy look like as well.

​@@DavideGobbicchi Yes, though strong, thick dark hair has something to do with past genetics dealing with weather; much like darker skin in Africa copes much better with scorching heat than paler europeans...and it's interesting too, that chestnut coloured horses have more fragile skin, and prefer sun on their backs rather than harsh winter cold...

@@DavideGobbicchi The blondes in Italy are rare, many italian blondes are dyed, not naturally blondes. Only one or two regions have many natural blondes. This can easy verified observing that there are more italian female blondes than male ones. This is because the italian women usually have brown or black hair, like the men, but due to fashion, many women dye their hairs, because men found them more attractive.

@@DavideGobbicchi The north of Italy is of Slavic origin, most of them have the R1a haplogroup, as you go south, Africans start to predominate.

I just wrote about the same so I very much agree.

Well the Scots play bagpipe so I think we'll have to search somewhere up north.

And yet to the present day, Italian men seem very attracted to women who have blonde and even red hair. I received a lot of attention when I went out on the street because of my auburn hair, even from men half my age.

The Romans never reached "Germania". They tried twice, the first time no one came back, the second only Caesar and a dozen others. The Germans are also a people of smoky origin, in today's Germany everything that is beautiful and blond is actually of Slavic origin.

@@serahloeffelroberts9901 And if you had just seen an auburn woman,when I appear with steel blue eyes and a height of 190 cm.

@@serahloeffelroberts9901Red hair isn’t at all uncommon in Italy.

So funny 🤣🤣🤣🤣 xdddd I have never heard that before. You r really funny

Cringe

THEY HIT THA PENTAGON LYLE!

Take the words of a postmodernist with a grain of salt.

theres a difference between what the loudest people are shouting and what people actually think. in the 60s the loudest people were shouting that women should be a certain way, not fit, but men all really felt that a fit woman is more attractive than a not-fit one. the biological hard-wired desire for a young, healthy, fit, intelligent woman doesnt change with politics or decades.

That’s still how it is. It’s not like dudes are out there seeking girls with “athletic” bodies. More like “not fat” but I suppose some girls think that means becoming some kind of bodybuilder, but no guy wants that

​@@noahkreb6827I'm the guy. I'm the guy that wants that.

​@@brianmahoney4156how do you know what they all really felt?

@@twosharksinatrenchcoat No the male beauty standard is whatever women wanted, do you think that men don't know what men get the most attention from women?

❤❤

'A Victorian experiment of finding the "typical criminal" by averaging hundreds of photos together resulted in a face better looking than expected.' I don't think that supports your argument.

@hilariousname6826 Why not? With a high enough sample, the deviations from a perfect face start canceling each other out.

How on earth does the idea that the "typical criminal" is 'better looking than expected' support the idea that there are 'objective standards of beauty'? At best, it seems a circular argument.@@screamingalgae9380

@@screamingalgae9380 I'd be wary of most claims of their being a globally objective beauty standard. Can get really uncomfortable if it goes in a bad direction. Lol.

*Cue Sir Mixalot and Nicki Minhaj*

Yes there is an aphrodite statue, the kalipigos, which is translated as the one with a beautiful butt. She was mentioned and shown in the video.

If im not mistaken i believe one of his older videos touched on the topic. You might want to check his channel

Only the unwashed/unimaginative barbarians of the north would have found them acceptable, I'm sure. Let us hope the current fad of doing so becomes ancient history itself.

​@@jrodowenspeople have tattooed themselves for thousands of years so i doubt it will stop 😂

I'd expect, at the very least, they'd be against something that would obviously poison their water.

​@@kanrakucheeseYou'd think so, but I remember reading about Roman Iberian mines that blackened the nearby rivers and filled the skies with soot. I'd love to see a video about it.

Not really! Ancient Rome was really, really nasty: it wasn't rivalled until Birmingham and Manchester et al in the 19th century, which were genuinely terrible places pollution-wise. The amount of smog was absolutely incredible.

I remember reading that Caesar banned carts inside the city limits of Rome because they were big and noisy and dropped horse poops everywhere.

Other than that, I don't think a civilization which doomed itself by turning every forest area into farmlands in Italy, cared much about the environment.

Celts in Italy are sun cancer farms.

Goths and Bulgarians: Do you know why?

No - it was recounted pointedly as not from an 'official record'.

I'm guessing tanned/dark skin would be on that list.

They would lay hay or any other kind of soft plant in a big sack and use it as mattress, like we did before latex and modern mattresses.

It’s quite possible that the woman bent over the lightly padded platform, or crouched on it , with the client behind her. Time is money in a brothel.

Short answer is Yes, but the only specific example I know is the statue of Athena at the Parthenon.

Nope.

@@hilariousname6826 If you can't argue your case why even comment?

@@hilariousname6826 You better not tell any woman she is beautiful then, since beauty being subjective would make it a meaningless term.

@@ericgarcia4049 whether or not fries taste good is subjective because some people just don‘t like fries, this does not mean me telling my mom the fries she made are tasty is a meaningless statement. What a non-sequitur. How are subjective statements meaningless? „I love you“ is a subjective statement as well. Please establish that subjective statements are indeed meaningless (and what meaningless means here or why someone ought to care it‘s meaningless) before you just jump to that concluding statement.

​@@hannahgoldkamp8888 Hannah, I'm tired of writing really long comments no one ever reads. If I parsed out every little distinction I'd be here all night, but I'll indulge you a bit. Yes, every one of us perceives reality from a subjective perspective that's all we know from experience. Instead of fries let's say it's 60 degrees outside: a Floridian might think that's cold, a Michigander might think that's warm, but the objective truth is that it's 60F outside, no matter how you perceive that temperature to be. Same for how you like your coffee, favorite colors, etc, in these cases your subjective statements are not meaningless, but they are just your subjective experiences and opinions of our objective reality. The principle of there being an objective truth (or beauty) however is a different thing entirely. If it's 60F outside and a news station starts gaslighting people telling them it's 80F and another one says it's 40F, etc, until no one can agree on what temp it is then the entire concept of measuring temperature would become meaningless at best. Hell just start making thermometers with random numbers at that point. This is far from the true insidious evil of moral relativism however, because truth and virtue are infinitely more fundamental than physical experiences like taste or temperature. When a civilization is taken over by moral relativism, it becomes insane, acts against nature and reality itself, and is ultimately destroyed. You can see it in Western civilization right now which is now at war with many basic truths and yes reality itself in contentious political battles as we speak, I'm sure I don't have to name them, but this war on reality actually started as a war against beauty. We could probably discuss that ad infinitum as well. An interesting thing about the concept of beauty you might not know is that in the 50's and 60's it is well documented that the US government and intelligence agencies funded and promoted post-modern art as a weapon of psychological warfare. The state-party line is that it was intended as a form of cultural weaponization against the Soviets, but it was actually much more nefarious than that. You can read a lot about this but in short they wanted to promote art that was ugly, vapid, and disordered and reward it financially to the public. Why you might ask? Well this reveals an interesting and inseparable connection between truth and beauty itself, because even if you want to argue they did not intend it initially they soon discovered that if a people can't agree or distinguish what is objectively beautiful, then they will not be able to distinguish what is objectively true either. You want proof it worked? Look at all the millions and millions of useful idiots saying things like, "this is my truth" or "that's only your truth", "don't challenge my truth", etc without acknowledging for one second that there is only THE TRUTH, and various degrees of perception aka opinions about the truth of something. Go look up a picture of one of Michelangelo's masterpieces like the David and then a picture of that damn toilet seat with "R Mutt" written in sharpie and tell me which is objectively more beautiful? You instinctively know the right answer to that question; and if you say neither it's only in the eye of the beholder, you're only lying to yourself. Take this comparison to the nth degree and you can conceptualize the ultimate uncreated truth, goodness, and beauty which is God and also its ultimate but yet finite corruption and hideousness which is the devil. I wrote more stuff but I took it out and I'm going to leave it here. I would appreciate your response on these thoughts, I don't like how many people just disagree with me and then won't respond once I present my case.

In the medieval times, being fat meant you were well-off, meaning you were attractive. So yeah beauty changes over time. I mean there's a reason why Rubens painted all that fat women.