The rules of casting two spells in a round in D&D - Rules Lawyer 

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Isn't overriding rules remove all fun?

I know, these folks use the term "RAW" so much you'd think they're Gordon Ramsay.

@@Crazmuss Well it depends...if a DM overrides rules so much that you are no longer playing dnd, you propably should tell them to try a different system. If they make a small modification every now and then for the sake of simplicity and immersion it should be ok.

I'm like that at every card or board game. Cause if we don't follow rules, we are just savages

Yeah it’s quite unbelievable

@@VivaLaDirtLeague Okay AlAn! Okay!

He only remembers rules if he wants to mess with people. Lol.

Wow! Completely missed that!

@oky Hey, look. I have nothing against your beliefs, but could you please stop spamming that link which has nothing to do with the comment or the video in all the comment sections? Its very rude and annoying.

One aoe spell and they'd be done for, though.

Not if all of them died in a single hit

I'm not sure if you're missing the bit but I think the joke is that the guy keeps dying and the player keeps making an identical character to take his place. This is evidenced by the fact that the 3rd brother does not show up until the second brother died. Ergo, the brothers cannot fight together because they did not exist until they were needed. ~RU-vid comments lawyer

@@KaptainFalkon Yep, that's exactly the joke here. Players that just do an exact copy of the same character when it dies.

Which identical brothers? I see none ;)

Absolutely not a coincidence :P

@@VivaLaDirtLeague No such thing as a coincidence to a GM. That's just another Hook.

​@Viva La Dirt League LOL After having sat through 141 episodes of Bodger / Rowan going "And who are you?" "Why are we doing this?" And if by a slip-up in the space time continuum, Rowan actually does remember somer something - it's hand our to Rob "Inspiration please" I am loving the sheer brilliance of Rowan being pedantic about the rules 😂😂😂

Still 23 more variations available!

@@Dzugashvili Future plot: Qargrim is mistaken for his late brother Cargrim. "I am not Kargrim either!"

@@Dzugashvili Just 23? Nay... it starts over again at Fhargrim on death 27...

@@iMAB1977 yesssss

that dwarf lady needs a new hobby

It seems that slipped under a lot of people's radar.

A man of good taste here I see

I though that was where this was going from the very beginning hah! #DMBlaming

*Ahem* Per the DMG, page 235, "Dice Rolling", Third Bullet Point: "Rolling behind a screen lets you fudge the results if you want to." 😉

It was him feigning that he thought the dm should. The only reason he rules lawyered so hard is he wants that player gone. Look at the backstories episode for further context.

It's the archetype of the player that refuses to play anything but their "most awesome" build.

​@@SchlossRitter See I've done the fun thing in mine where all the re-rolls are related but they're all *completely* different. 1st character self-righteous paladin, 2nd character brother monk who is as annoying as scrappy doo, 3rd- warlock sister who thinks her brothers are idiots, 4th character: evil uncle ranger. and so on. It's curse of strahd so I was expecting many, many rerolls. So I wanted to keep it simple, whilst allowing for variation and better reasons for the appearance of new heroes. Been over a year... haven't had to reroll - meaning that the rich and complex back story as to why all of these people from the same family are being dragged into barovia

I love the half a second pause as he throws together another almost identical name.

Our rules lawyer was the opposite kind of problem. Our DM once said, "If you have a backup character already written, you can bring him in on the next turn after you die because I don't want people to have to feel left out" So the smartarsed rules lawyer of the group secretly kept a stack of 10 perfectly identical bards in his binder who all shared the backstory of alternate reality versions of the original character brought to our world through a magical anomaly. The rules lawyer realized that a magically trapped floor was only activated by living things so instead of solving the puzzle the old fashioned way, he ran character after character out onto the floor building a bridge of dead bodies for the party to cross on. After the first couple of suicides, the DM realized what the player was doing and almost put a stop to it until another player chimed in something about how maybe all of the versions of himself were from such similar realities that they all decided to try to charge across the floor at the same time when they all collapsed into the same dimension. After a long pause we got an "I'll... allow it..." That house rule got added to our big book of things that are too broken to allow more than once and, the running gag of the group moving forward when faced with a tricky puzzle was "If only we had a pile of dead bards..."

@@nosajimiki5885 I would have allowed it. Sounds like a cool idea and it's definitely original.

I think it's the DM, and he plays more roles too if I'm not mistaken. He's amazing in this series, and the one they play DnD on their seperate channel...To be fair though this whole team is fantastic!

@@KostasTsou94No, it's Byron, plays delivery man in Bored series. DM IRL is Rob, plays here the judge.

@@KostasTsou94 Byron plays the brother characters. Rob is the DM and the Fighter. Byron appears more in the Bored series.

my identical brother...(struggles to remember name)...

Why not shake it up once with the "Hah I didn't actually die and now I've returned" gag. The dwarfs constantly dying is definitely funny and I think It'd be funny to hear about how one survived. That and the more identical brothers you add to the brood the more you gotta feel sorry for their mother 😆

Too bad he now has to deal with an army of identical brothers.

Yes

@@westenev Well killing those identical brothers one after one is his objective actually. So he has been dealing with it for a while...

​@ all it takes is "ONE" bad day

Stop calling the DM judge!

Having never been in a court before, can I ask for that to be written in stone above every court?

@@Chraan some tables call the DM judge or referee.

@@Chraan Robert is a player in VLDL. In NPC DND he's the DM

With that he makes a pretty good Architect.

@@Taccou I'm so glad I wasn't the only one who caught that haha

Needed to turn subs on. Damn there are so many unknown words to me

As a lawyer, no he wouldn't. We are taught to avoid legalese. The only people who still like using language like that are politicians. Seriously, try reading executive orders or statutes some time.

@oky Yes the D&D parody Video is totally the right place to convert people to Islam...

Military rules, in various countries, have been put in place after all the siblings in a family were killed in a single action, to reduce the risks of this. For instance all being onboard the same sinking ship, or being members of a unit which got wiped out (in WW1 a single shell could and did kill entire families serving in the same platoon). So it is not unreasonable that a respected elder might ban members of the family from adventuring together in the same party, for similar reasons. Especially as adventuring is even more high risk than serving in the military!

@@Temp0raryName u r so involved man 😂😍

That would be metagaming.

Every DM has been there

And flailing his arm when Rowan push all the blame on him

Sometimes I wonder how DM manage to keep their sanity when they deal with that bullshit.

Captain Teague has entered the chat: The code is the law

Sri Sumbhajee proclaims this all to be folly! Hang the Code!

“Me? I’m dishonest, and a dishonest man you can always trust to be dishonest. Honestly. It’s the honest ones you want to watch out for because you can never predict when they’re going to do something incredibly… stupid.”

Parley?

Uhh, Joshamee Gibbs?

Don't forget the quizzical "9 plus **stuff** hits?...ok good" because he often forgets his attack bonus.

@@DaedalusRaistlin It's been 5 for a long time now!!! 🤣🤣🤣

@@Nemo.404 Like that matters. He can't remember even when it's the next of three hits in a row.

In all fairness it's perfect for his barbarian lmfao

This character seems to be less Bodger and more PlayTech manager

Excellent reasoning. lol Except they would all be different races most likely.

Carmons from gears of war be like

Why are all of them "identical twins" though? I already imagine bbeg who made a factory for producing those "twins" for the sole reason of spying and interfering with PCs. And killing them will not help, because the next would immediately takes his place. Trying to dispose of them with another methods will just make the next one loudly announce how heinous deeds was done to his relative by this party, throwing their reputation into the mud. And the last confrontation would be an army of those.

@@Med1umentor Because the Bard's genetics are clearly superior and overpower those of inferior Non-Bardic descent.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

@yes Wow, this link is so relevant to the video and comment it's unbelievable... (because it's not...)

Nice reference haha

* _argrim

Yeah I'm starting to get the feeling he will be this universe's Kenny.

@@isidornimages I've only seen this one in the series, but i still immediately scrolled down to see who's talking about the who killed Kenny joke.

Triplets, not twins, at this point. But I expect they’ll be up to septuplets soon enough.

balgrim is up next

Lol

@@Albtraum_TDDC Now I’m hoping that Rob wrote a script where the DM forces him to make some kind of change to the character sheet, so we get a Schwarzenegger/DeVito style twin.

hmm I just remembered in one of the first big RPG campaigns I played, we had a Paladin who died, but was replaced by his brother and the party kept it a secret from the world so we could keep the facade of a prophecy. We were basically playing the plot of the Magician books by Feist. I think it was "A Darkness at Sethanon" I was playing a mage like Pug and he was a knight like Thomas. That was probably the longest campaign we ever had, over a year long, we started level 1 and ended like 12, where we saved the world but party all dead or insane. AD&D 2nd edition was almost new back then in 1995...

RU-vid is full of bots these days :/

when you realize Rowan wants everyone else to die, so he gets all the loot.

Bodger: Where are we again Bodger: What are we doing again Bodger: How did we get here again Bodger: Why are we here again Bodger: When can I hit something with my axe

@@VivaLaDirtLeague Bodger: I feel an urge to ruin this goliath mental health

@@VivaLaDirtLeague Greg: *Sighs audibly in frustration.*

"9 plus eerrrr whatever"

To be fair, in NPC DnD Rowan’s character has negative intelligence and plays his character that way, mostly. :)

@@SithLadyLumiya That's right, Bodger isn't the brightest candle on the cake but as a player Rowan doesn't seem to care memorizing his modifiers and...eeerr...stuff xD I think I would have too difficulties to remember all my stats and class and race details when I'm not playing on a regular basis. But that's what I like about NPC DnD, it's not taken too seriously :D

That's because he hates being reminded about the rules. Either he doesn't enjoy the game and wishes it was more like straight improv without any rules (no shame since he comes from an acting background having never played D&D) or he's too lazy to learn the rules and help the game, his friends, and in this case, the company.

@@Veritas.0 Actually I don't care (read in Rowan xD ) why he does it - it's hilarious and I wouldn't watch comedians, especially the Viva guys, that take the game seriously. That being said, when talking with a friend about it who's an experienced PnP player - he said that forgetting stuff about their characters happens to experienced players and DMs all time

One on each letter of Alphabet.

@@igorbobryshev2783 Oh at least! There’s also “Th-“ and “Sh-“ and “Ch-“ prefixes, and he could branch out into other combinations.

All of them.

They also all are conveniently the right level as the prevously deceased twin brother.

as many as he needs.

No, that’s just normal lawyering. A real rules lawyer lets you start over

That's not rules lawyering, though, since it's neither a stretching of the rules text nor is it to the advantage of the lawyer.

I wonder if that's Allan.

@@blacklight4720 i was about to type the same thing, lol!

It's the classic movements of an extra. Throwing your head around, pointing with your open hand, etc. You'll see it All The Time in almost any show or movie. Go watch anything set in a school and watch the background people when there's a scene everyone is looking at the MC. Thankfully, they made it work really well in this. :)

@Odile Mwaro Living with a disab... sorry, expressively challenged like that you probably end up learning how to compensate for it...

@@blacklight4720 either Alan or Adam..those two get mixed up all the time

The best kind of correct.

Thr technically game is the best game.

Well, technically, being only technically correct isn't actually being correct.

@@12HitCombo why care about facts when you're right?

Yeah but there is a rule where DM can override all rules so technically dm is always right. ofcourse doing so a lot makes the game kinda dumb.

Why? I'd be disappointed with the druid.

Ughhhh, aghhhhh!!! I wann.. I wanna punch.. I wanna punch you, but I can’t.. cuz you’re a fictional character.. AAUGGHGHHHHHHHH….. 😆😂😂

That sums up every episode of BORED...except for the brief time he's genuinely nice during those brief periods in that 1 when he gets a concussion.

and that is what I call a based DM

"Ok but the enemies can do it too" is the single worst way to resolve this sort of issue.

Like the commentor above it, I don’t love that solution because enemies already shouldn’t play by player rules. But also, I think that if you do that then are you also going to house rule buffs for martials? Are monks allowed to use 2 ki points in a turn to do 2 flurry of blows on top of their attack? Can a Paladin spend 2 spell slots on smite for the same attack? Can a Rogue Sneak attack twice per turn? Or at the very least take 2 cunning actions on a turn? Can a Barbarian stack 2 rages on the same combat? And I honestly don’t even know what you could do for the fighter.

Ummm actually.......he says that in an ironic sense and I chose to ignore your irony. Soooooo..yeah

Does Rob carry a bucket of ketchup? In that case, I can imagine!

Rule number one is..... The DM rules.

@@meoff7602 That's rule zero.

@@meoff7602 rule zero

And then complain about it. .. it's rather Manager Rowan.

@@FaultAndDakranon that's so true

To be fair Targrim was a bit of a D!ck in the first episode.

@@grlmgor so true

@@grlmgor most of them seem to be in it for their own personal glory?

I'm strongly in favor of bending rules in ways that make sense. For example, it makes sense to let someone slow down an action. It also makes sense to let her cast a touch spell with one hand while holding the weapon in the other hand. And finally, anyone who pulls what Rowan did should be killed. It is absolutely unacceptable to tell someone "yes, you can do that" and then say they can't do it, but can't start over, either.

@@cymond He was using devil's advocate lawyering. Whilst she implied "can I do this and also cast the cure" that is not actually what she said. Rowan correctly answered the question that was put to him.

Ha ha ha ha... No... The Lich King can raise 100+ Undead with Bone Armor... Can players do that?... Of course not. There is a degree... Even as a God... But Gods can bleed... "Unfit for Divinity."

@@absolstoryoffiction6615 You're replying to my comment? I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying. I'm saying that if the rules are bent for a player, then all the enemies will be able to take advantage of it as well. Of course NPC's have abilities players don't have, that's not the point. The idea is to present an effective argument for not bending the rules. Keeping in mind that sometimes the rule of cool can trump that, on a rare basis. 😎

@@Hawkwinter01 True... But it's all case by case... I usually go by RAW so it swings both ways between players and DMs.

nice

Nice

I don't know how to process him being reasonable

He just wanted to make sure Targrim died.

@oky Yes the D&D parody Video is totally the right place to convert people to Islam...

All just a plan to kill of Targrim, unknowing that yet another identical brother will take his place 😄

@@bubeable That's how he has all those titles and accomplishments - "Targrim" isn't a person, it's an army of clones. They are all level one, but overpower all their enemies with infinite numbers. When one Targrim falls, another appears to take its place!

Right, the players shouldn't be able to actually make meaningful decisions, just change the rules on a whim whenever you feel like it. Why even have players at all?

@@mrosskne That doesn't stop you from making meaningful decisions. It's meant to make you think and come up with your own rules. D&D was intended to be home brew rather than here's a set of rules.

@oky no one asked, gtfo

It's much worse when the rules lawyer is the DM. Been there.

@oky what bombing shi* is that?

I've DMed for that guy before. He'd go on these big rules rants. Then the moment he finished them I'd just chime in with a "I'll allow it" and shut it down. After the 3rd time he learned to just shut his mouth. I know the rules and I enforce them when needed. If I'm not saying something it's because I've chosen to allow it.

That's why the DM should intervene and say "But I'll allow it."

Bad guys don need to follow rules. That's why D&D rules starting to fail so bad if heroes are trying to do things but cannot happen

When you lower constitution to minimum and take a low health class.

The powerful backline mage always dies with one blow

Agreed, but the DM was too busy not fudging the dice apparently lol.

Yeah this is how I roll too

I was hoping they'd call a retcon

@@pattsw I would have loved to see the tape rewind back to the beginning of her turn, with each argument.

Funny thing is also, if you cast the action spell first you can follow with the bonus action spell. Neither need to be a cantrip

True. But he clearly decided that the dwarf needed to die, for his over-acting!

Not when the DM is... Terrible... It's a bad a omen if an experienced player, who was the former DM, to set things right for the game.

Never played D&D, actually, but doesn't DM have to specify the rules before the game started? Or at least override them only after some precedent.

@@amegatron07 that's entirely up to the discretion of the DM, honestly. Though a good DM will clearly lay out the rules in advance. Players won't put up with bad DM

@@amegatron07 Too many rules and yet not enough to hit literally every situation. For example, trying to leap off a ledge onto your horse waiting below. The handbook can help you find your characters jump distance, but whether you can land on your horse isn't written anywhere. Usually a dm will decide, either its so trivial you get it for free or you have to roll an athletics check based on how difficult it is. Jumping across a chasm that's just a bit beyond your normal jump distance? Roll an acrobatics dc 15.

Right up to episode where he wears an orange parka and lives through a streak of natural 20 checks

The Many Deaths of Targrim will be a good watch

Let's see how many "--grim"s they can make

Umm maybe because of the fact that he DID every D&D video so far?

@@bubeable oh bore off you pedant it was obviously rhetorical😅

I know! I could almost see his black shirt.

I think Alan was the skeleton

he is good at acting a douchebag so obviously it would be him acting the role haha

You don't have to know what is going on. You just have to know the rules and pay enough attention to hear when some needs a good rule slap.

Only 23 other letters but don't forget you can use sounds like "br" "ch" "sh" at the begining

@@kylekopac5685 You have a problem with Oolty or something?

Objection - "the funniest" is already a superlative, therefore vis-a-vis hencewith notwithstanding the aforementioned henceforth the word "most" is redundant

Todal deck

But then we wouldn’t have had “I’m not ‘your honor’” and “what stenographer?”

Yeah it is downright biblical - But in the bible it clearly states - I wrote the goddamn thing.

Yeah. That's what would happen in actual D&D.

what issues?

@mike at the time this episode came out, Rowan could bearly remember how to use rage on his Barbarian on the D&D channel, so him spouting rules was ironic. That that much has changed a year later...

As a DM I want them to use their spell slots...All the more quicker that they run out of gas. Usually limit the second spell to 2nd level or lower.

@@Big_B_007 It mostly doesn't matter, as long as you aren't using two level-able spells: two Fireballs is a no-go, but something with a set effect (like Invisibility,) and Fireball wouldn't break things.

@@wwusirius you and my DM would be great friends. “Okay, you go into the cave, and find 9 Ice Trolls. 3 are grouped, 1 is at a higher ground out of site to you but he can see you from where he is at, 1 is swimming underwater in a pool just at the cave’s entrance and is waiting for ambush, and the last one is a Druid who has transformed into a Blue Dragon”.

@@Big_B_007 It potentially makes a dangerous precedent. With hardcore players this may lead to balance issues and make spellcasters even more powerful than they are. DMs can of course overule rules, but they have to be consistent about it which can open them up to exploits they have not foreseen.

@@Oncus2 Aye, consistency is very important. My only issue was that they let her think option B would work, then objected again after she cast the 1st spell. If the game was stopped for rule clarification on if X could be done, then they should have told her neither option A or B would work, then resumed game play. Let the player make an informed decision. I half expected Rowen to say, I said you can cast it, I didn't say it would work.

Bryon works at Playtech? o0

Bryan?

Should have started alphabetically with Argrim, then Bargrim, and now Cargrim

agreed

And its... Rowan?!

@@VivaLaDirtLeague Not buying it Rowan can barely remember how Rage works!🤣

Rob has been trying since the start, LoL.

.... And the reason I prefer other, far superior systems, over d&d. The amount of nitpicking ninnies is overwhelming and not fun

Yeah, that's why my favourite DM would override rules during gameplay and run through how it should with with the player afterwards so the game didn't grind to a halt, and they got a good turn still. RP more important than paperwork, when it comes to not being familiar with rules.

Totally, but like its one bonus action a round, one free action, one move action, one attack action.. So surely speaking... right... A Bonus action AND an Attack action spell SHOULD be allowed right.... right.... ......RIGHT? :D

@@kheldarath for anything other than spells, yeah. The problem with being able to cast 2 spells a turn (ignoring that sorcerers can make any spell a bonus action with quicken), is that full casters are already WAY stronger than the other classes at higher levels. So letting them have even more advantages just isn't fair.

@@colby1398 Yep, that's the whole point of knowing the rules. So many people are saying just do it how you want! The rules aren't rules just guidelines has never been in a game where the DM keeps making bad calls and one player ends up with the do everything, kill everything, get everything OP character and everyone else at the table gets to watch them be great whilst they can't do anything because all the 'DM calls' made were against them and stole their abilities from them. The rules are there because they were tested to be fair and provide a fun game. If you want 'rule-less' D&D then just join an improv group and enjoy role play without rules... (except even structured improv has rules).

True, i was on his side until the "you already cast shillellagh" and "shillellagh ends when you drop your weapon" bit. As a DM i'd probably just let the player retcon that they cast shillellagh once they realised they can't do that along with cure wounds.