Although I have to work hard, as a High School Graduate, to keep up with your big words, it feels good to have found like minded people. I have been so dispondant and depressed since the Church got caught up in Trumpism, and the "Center moved", especially when it was magnified by the 2020 Pandemic/Big Lie. I left my SBC church after many tearful and prayerful nights and days. God keeps telling me, as I lose heart and focus, to Trust Him, He knows what He's doing. This Broadcast has really helped me and lifted my Spirit. Thank you. I look forward to reading your books and listening to what you have to say. Thank You Both, TimmyDon Neeley.
I agree with you wholeheartedly and thank you for speaking up. Helps to know other believers are out there who feel the same way I do about all this. Thank you.
Be encouraged, your not in the wrong simply because you choose the least traveled path. The Bible says “Enter in the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the path that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But SMALL is the gate and NARROW the road that leads to life, and only a FEW find it. Matt. 7:13-14.
Your testimony is so beautiful, I'm in Australia but paying a lot of attention to the craziness going on in USA because it makes me worried and sad. I just wish voices like yours could be louder but we are the blessed meek I guess :)
@Jared7726 I knew that I couldn't be the only one that felt this way, Jared. It's just so hard to conceive that they cannot see they are ruining our Democracy with this Big Lie. If we no longer have confidence in our electoral system, then, that's the beginning of the end of America. They are weakening our Democracy also when they say that our institutions of Law, like the Justice Dept. and the FBI are corrupt. It's frustrating when life long friends and family spout talking points from Faux News and they sound just like Tucker Carlson, yet they say things like, "I don't listen to the news" One day I want to dismiss all of them and say, "You are out of my life till you leave this cult." Then, I realize, that kind of attitude is what lead to a Civil War. All I can do is pray and trust God. Thanks for your support Jared.
Very interesting conversation. Kudos to the host, Rev Moore who did it in an open and inviting way, not at all confrontational. My idea of an open dialogue
A very knowledgeable, impressive lady! Her work is especially important in a time when today’s fundamentalist Christians exercise an outsized political power that has very negative and damaging affects on the rest of.society. It would be sad if they were only hurting themselves , but it is tragic how much beyond themselves this goes. Institutions such as the Republican Party and the Supreme Court have been consumed by this influence . I don’t see how we solve this problem, but I appreciate her insight into how we got here.
That was a good point about those who seek power. It's often the most wicked that have nothing to lose by fighting to gain power that seek it. The good Christians tend to be meek and humble and those are not traits that do well when seeking power.
Used to be a member of the SBC in my youth and can testify to the staggering emphasis on white male patriarchy. Disappointed that Russell Moore pointedly downplays this at the very end, but sadly not surprised. It just may be too engrained in him by now to discount women. He likely can’t help himself. It was a good book and completely on the mark.) Also not surprised at the outraged white males in the comments roundly condemning a woman in God’s name. This is literally muscle memory. White male patriarchy gotta white male patriarchy. By their fruit you shall know them. I actually wonder if some of the impotent rage woven into some of this is cultural and comes from the South having lost the Civil War. I wonder how far back in US history the author could trace this and how regional it would prove to be. And to any woman still in the SBC: get out. You don’t need to spend your life under this kind of oppressive yoke when there are other denominations out there who don’t confuse white patriarchy for the essence of the Gospel. Listen to Jimmy Carter. He was right.
I didn’t hear Moore downplaying anything du Mez said at the end, and certainly did not hear anything that would could as “discounting women”. I only heard him disagreeing with du Mez’s claim that one can’t define Evangelicalism.
@@deannadelmar9863a previous editor in chief, Mark Galli, sadly was forced out at Christianity today, for speaking out against rump. Thankfully Rev Moore has stood strong. We need him.
@@Amick44Galli’s argument against Trump was largely strategic and leaned much more heavily on Trump’s phone call than on serious theological or policy considerations. Did you even read Galli’s editorial?
As an evangelical Presbyterian in Ireland I am very reluctant to identify with American evangelicals because of the way some are carrying on church life. I cannot support the idea of Christian nationalism. I have seen how wrapping the Christian church in the red, white and blue of your flag or our flag has done such damage to my community. I do believe in the stoning work of Jesus and I do believe in the practices of evangelism. I worked with Camlus Crusade for Christ before training for the Presbyterian church in Ireland. With all that in mind I still cannot stand with trumpiznism. I have my struggles with complimentarianism🎉 and equality. I suspect the truth is much more nuanced. Today there are too many Christian’s who believe they, and they alone are right. Thank you for talking about these things in a calm atmosphere. I am heart broken to hear how so many believers are ie g called out by those who are always right. Even the Gospel Coalition is being called out as us Tim Keller, Alistair Begg and others. Jesus and John Wayne has so much value. Even for an old conservative like me who in the USA would probably be called communist.
Thank you for this conversation. I am (a secular Jewish liberal) trying to make sense of the very dangerous state of our country as the right is working to destroy democracy and install a white Christian male nationalism. I saw some of this danger since the gop adopted the southern strategy and Reagan embraced evangelicals for shared political power. I appreciate the constructive conversation although I am not educated in christian (or jewish) scripture to understand some of it. I do just hope that all religions accept others with love ... and abandon that one must believe in the "one true god," or spends eternity in hell. Love is better than that.
_" do just hope that all religions accept others with love ... and abandon that one must believe in the "one true god," or spends eternity in hell."_ There is no getting around the Bible saying that Christ is the only way to God and heaven. You can't make the Bible say what you wish it to say. ALL who reject Jesus end up in the lake of fire. Bottom line. We Christians can ignore talking about that Truth with others but we can't change it for it is Truth.
I can’t imagine anything more masculine than the way Jesus conducted Himself during his trial when He was slandered and treated like a blasphemer. He remained silent, trusting in His Father to glorify Him and raise Him from the dead, giving Him the victory over Sin and Death.
As a main line protestant pastor I see my part of the church as being a mirror image of the problem that the author describes. A different set of cultural values is taking the place of the gospel. However the exclusion of nonwhite people is something we do have directly in common.
I am committed to being myself. We can only use what we were given to work with. I don't waste my time anymore trying to ask myself if what I'm doing is masculine or feminine. I figure that if I do it, it's feminine because I'm a woman. If a man does something, it's masculine because he's male.
To look deep into what has happened in evangelism without not seeing the amazing work God has done is bad resurch. This book written to critique a few leaders failures over the nationals history falls short at best when there have been Hundreds of amazing Christian evangelicals preaching the true gospel. Jesus and John Wayne is so far off on the evangelical world i grew up with books like "Wild a Heart" and " Bringing up boys". They are fantastic books teaching Men to be Men. We as Christian men need masculine leaders that haven't pushovers but truly follow biblical masculinity.. We need men like Paul and Barnabas that stood up to athoritarian dictates. Jesus and John Wayne in no way represent thousands of strong Christian men that protect there familys from the crazy WOKE world we live in. Its good to see many Christian leaders finally standing up against books like this. We need to impowering men to love like Jesus and serve our country. Roman's 13
@@HearGodsWord Like what? Russian Orthodox where it's headed by a KGB thug that thinks Putin is the new messiah? Or in Europe where Christians are baptized into the state church as infants and never have anything to do with God again (which would be my bet of your situation)? In America there is still faith, and many people see amazing things from God!
For those of faith draw your self-respect from what you know were given, existence is the greatest of gifts, and salvation. Basing self-respect on compliance with some group edicts disrespects god and is personally destructive.
@@promomail1768 I just think that the two participants in this discussion were peddling yesterday's tired ideology, which was very predictable and tedious as is often the case with US Christians who attempt to engage with cultural issues. In contrast, thinkers like Peterson and Haidt offer alternatives to the dominant mindset that are facilitated by a strong synthesis of rigorous thought and empirical evidence. For example, it was Peterson who highlighted the significance of men and women throughout history working towards common ends, thus providing an immediate alternative to the idea of the sexual war and the corollary of relationships being predicated on power.
Kristin, take heart, all these evangelicals in question, here, are going to be the ones that Jesus will be telling, begone I never knew you! And that will be final.
There is no Christ in them, and there is no Christ in YOU, but the fight is never "man to man," SON. This Fight is always, if YOU choose God and follow Him. Or, if You choose Satan and follow him! They serve men, not God. And Jesus is the last word from God. Good day, son.
I agree Thomas. Theses evangelicals are fast to attack. It reveals pride and arrogance. Unfortunately only a few will seek this path. If your in the minority your more likely to be on the right path. Matt. 7:13-14. If they believe the BIG LIE it’s certainly not a good sign 2 Thess. 2:1112.
@@promomail1768 As you attack them? The irony. I do love the very people embracing a secular massive admin state out to ignore and deny God all of the time use the Bible to prop up the massive secular administrative state
@@robertfetrow4612 Who is them? The Bible makes it simple, if your focus is on the government. The Bible has its own Props” for government. Matt.22:22 “Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s; and unto Gods the things that are God’s. God does not condone bad government read Isaiah 10:1-4. Concerning civil duties Roman 13:1-7 and duties to the gospel Romans 13:8-14. The bureaucratic structure of government Exodus 18:13-27. Your response gives me the impression you have a worshipful hatred of government not inspired by the word of God. I could be wrong only God can read a heart. May God bless you.
And they come into Bethany. And a certain woman whose brother had died was there. And, coming, she prostrated herself before Jesus and says to him, "Son of David, have mercy on me." But the disciples rebuked her. And Jesus, being angered, went off with her into the garden where the tomb was, and straightway a great cry was heard from the tomb. And going near Jesus rolled away the stone from the door of the tomb. And straightway, going in where the youth was, he stretched forth his hand and raised him, seizing his hand. But the youth, looking upon him, loved him and began to beseech him that he might be with him. And going out of the tomb they came into the house of the youth, for he was rich. And after six days Jesus told him what to do and in the evening the youth comes to him, wearing a linen cloth over his naked body. And he remained with him that night, for Jesus taught him the mystery of the kingdom of God. And thence, arising, he returned to the other side of the Jordan.[19]
Scripture is clear about what is sin and not sin and the differences between me and women GOD is colourblind and so should we be. But we cannot redefine what behaviours are sinful..
Commenting at 7:43: it's because of the slippery nature of the bybull that people will (as humans do) choose to focus on what taps on their inner most demons. I once met a very strong women who said to me, it's not about getting along generally, but about whether our demons can get along. The bybull is a dangerous thing, and some people will like that I have said that. Our patriarch, who aren't in heaven, unhallowed be thy name...
Kristin shows how unfortunately, this worship of maleness has caused conservative Christianity to attract men with emotional problems, many with narcissism. In fact, conservative religion in general whether it be Christianity, Judaism, or Islam has this problem. Acknowledging that true Christianity is separate and distinct from conservative religion will help.
She’s not merely “describing what’s she’s seeing”-you know enough to see what’s going on instead of just asking her softball questions, Moore-but advocating. She is prescribing. She’s prescribing rather than describing our Exile away from any notion of Christendom. She has no respect for common or prevenient grace which holds societies together. Without some overlap between church and state you are preaching a gospel which has no public dimension. You know better than this, Moore, but you love your NY Times bona fides more than Christendom. You love her approval.
Commenting at 18:52: because of the fear of death, dying and fitting in. Purpose, maybe. I would love this shit to be true, but I know it's not worth following. So death makes this place really precious.
They don’t come right out and say it. It’s intrinsic in their message. If you can’t understand that then I have a simpler version. “Whoever has ears, let them hear.” Thoughts and prayers!
@@pcb462 Maybe its you reading that into the message or maybe you can give us direct examples of where preachers told us to be men and be mean. Thats basically what her message is which is clearly off. BUt hey, per her hippies are non binary and true representatives of what Christ wants of men.
@@robertfetrow4612 your response confirms everything we need to know. Thank you for being honest and upfront about your views. I much rather deal with someone like you than someone who hides their bigotry and evil. Thoughts and prayers.
@@robertfetrow4612 My heart goes out to you. It’s not your fault you can’t see this. The Bible tells us, “The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit.” 1 Corinthians 2:14. I hope you find Jesus.
Commenting at 5:13. Hucksters see religion as a good gig. Some comedian has a good bit on that...but the sad part is that if one believes in such unsupportable ideas, it's a slippery slope to dumber and more dangerous shit. People like these should be doing all they can to rid their church of this shit.
Those who are encouraging racism and discrimination are those such as this book author who are seeing color and race and gender in everything they encounter
This is off topic….but….Russell, is that your signature look? I mean, I like it just fine. Just seems that you wear that shirt and jacket more often than not for your show?
The interview has hints of nationalism which distracts all from the main issue. True Christianity has never received a "Black Perspective". The Black Christian, whether conservative or liberal has the same problem. The Black story has never been told. Smh..
That wouldnt sell. There is no bigger church than the Black church against many of the things she is blaming the evangelical church for. If she went down that road the people loving her message would call her a racist
Pamela....you are exactly correct. I'll go one step further. If we actually get rid of organized religion? This world would become a better place, less wars, fighting and my all-time favorite....LESS JUDGMENT of others.
Look...anybody with any brains knows that real Christianity is about living the good life. About beautiful homes, stylish clothing, luxury automobiles, enhancement surgery, Botox, real estate investments, healthy stock portfolios, etc. I mean, after all, nobody will ever be as dialed in to Jesus as the Apostles were, and look at the blessed lives they lived. I just feel like God wants me to be happy. In fact, I received a word during morning prayer that He really wants me to have that luxurious new Mercedes Benz motorhome and to go on that fabulous two-week vacation. to Bora Bora. He says I deserve it, and doggone it, I agree! I sure do love the Lord. My God is the greatest God.
She clearly has not met Jesus if the bible and scripture she is so delusional and I pray GOD will forgive and change her mind and out turn her back to HIMSELF. How can she live with herself .
St. Augustine about how to live a Christian. Firstly. Read the scripture to see what it tells you. But know that it is open to interpretation. Secondly. Listen to the Holy Spirit to see where you are led. But know that can be clouded by emotion. Lastly. Do you actions come through the Love of Jesus Christ and do your actions exhibit that Love. If your actions do not meet these criteria then they do not come from God.
This woman is not good at scriptural exigence she is just using and stories or cherry picking men who have sinned from high levels of leadership and the same thing exist in all other areas of society she is so dangerous .
Read the scriptures on GODS boundaries on immoral sinful sexual behaviour. Christianity has not blamed women for sexual issues for over 30 year it’s just a lie to say Christian’s or the scripture support the idea it’s woman’s fault if men sin in sexually unbiblical behaviour
We know who she disagrees with and that she hate White males and blames them. Our nations sin is immorality fatherlessness adultery pornography homosexuality transgender values etc …
She is so lost and so insecure and thinks she has found some truth and it’s just not true it’s idea reborn. She has never debated a evangelical male theologian who know scripture and the gospel ever!!! She is self deluded lives an echo chamber cherry picking only fallen sinful evangelical men but their is hypocrites everywhere. She is wolf in sheeps clothing
C'mon bro, I saw a handout a church was using for rape victims that said God might let women be raped if they were hanging out with ungodly friends. There are people out there who think that God approves of these things, like God could use rape as a punishment. How disgusting! They're not reasonable people - and you're 100% right, it is NOT Biblical - but they exist unfortunately. Just think of that pastor recently who raped a 16 year old girl and when he got found out about it called it "adultery" and his church crowded around him to pray for him while the victim had to see that behavior. That was a pretty viral video recently. There has always been a thread of women hatred among certain theologians and priests BUT they just use the Bible to justify it, in fact anyone can be a sick bastard of any religion or none. We just have to have zero tolerance for abuse, exploitation or gender-based hatred against anyone man or woman, it's a sickness that shouldn't be part of our religion.
I love Russell but you can tell he felt uncomfortable because he perpetuated and was complicit in much of the toxic evangelical culture that was racist, misogynistic and all about power.
mark says that jesus had a beloved disciple named john. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naked_fugitive why is this considered figurative when many christians see most of the new testament literally? is christianity a homosexual religion?
Ummmmm ... It IS possible to "love" WITHOUT sex. It's possible to respect, care for, and enjoy the company of another person and still ("gasp") keep your clothes on.
I love Russell but that conversation was hard for him. She tore down the house he have identified with for so long. Evangelicalism is and has been garbage !
