The Snooker vs Pool Debate - Judd Trump's 2021 U.S. Open Journey 

most asian, eu and me pool players are pretty decent at snooker too. in the US its probably different because of "the lack of space" so they stay on the toysrus pool table most of the time or 10ft "snooker" tables lol.

@@thacasualpoolplaya at professional level like the likes of O’Sullivan trump Selby hendry and Davis did

@@SonOfTheSoil834 there have been times where top pool players played maon tour but didn't perform too well, just like the other one around. Only 1 time a snooker pro won a pool tournament, after he had already been translating to pool for six years. Selby, white and davis have always played both games, so they did a bit better then other snooker pros.

@@mr.lootybutthole 👍🏾

@@mr.lootybutthole i'm actually really hoping for selby to try a 9-ball game since he originally came from UK pool if i'm not mistaken

I played 8 ball for a pub team. I always went for an hour at snooker before a match, it was a big help in my game.

That game is TOO different. Reyes is the only one I know who even tried to bridge the gap. However, skills he learned in carom made Reyes a unique force to be reckoned with. I watched Sayginer play live and give an expo. The physicists need to study him. He breaks all the rules of physics.

Blomdahl is insanely good at pool, probably better than any snooker player. I think he might be the most talented cueist in the world (although he is up there in age).

@@Gotwired Perhaps he started pool when he was already old. I watched him live at Sang Lee's in Queens. I miss Sang Lee. He was one of the sweetest people on the planet.

Back in the late 80's or the early 90's, I actually played pool against some of the best 3-rail players in Denmark. Nelin and Sørensen and they were great at pool (a lot better than me, ha, even if I did play in the top division at the time), but they weren't at the level of the best pool players (Nielsen, who has beaten Earl Strickland and has been ranked #1 in the world in 2000) in my country and certainly not on the world stage. Nelin and Sørensen became team world champs in 3-rail in 1995 and Nelin and Laursen won that title the year after. Nelin has won silver at the world champs and Sørensen has won bronze, so they are absolute class. If they practised pool as much as they practised 3-rail, they would also have become world class players there, absolutely. Any cue master could learn to play the other games, but I believe that pool is the more forgiving game of pool, caram (rail) and snooker. While they require different skill sets to master, once you get into the mindset of the game itself - and that takes a couple of years of hard practise - a master can play them all. However, pool is clearly easier to learn. We've seen masters of the other games go and play pool at a relatively high level, including for instance Davis and Ronnie beating the best at pool and Selby (all three are snooker players) winning a high ranking pool tournament. We've also seen snooker players do very well in the Mosconi Cup with Davis being one of the players with the most wins historically. Also Reyes went from caram to pool and was probably the best pool player ever. No one has really made it from pool to either caram or snooker and done as well, not even close to it.

Check out when Blomdahl and Reyes played against each other 3 cushion and 9 ball, it's great.

the chances of a snooker player winning a major pool tournament - extremely low. the chances of a pool player winning a major snooker tournament - zero

@kosinus great points

@kosinus - Pool is definitely easier 😂

@kosinus sorry, but I agree with OP. Most of the time position play on a pool table is literally child's play especially in 9 ball and I think youre forgetting or maybe don't know that the reds in snooker normally take up about 3 feet by 3 feet of the table since the best strategy is to move the reds as little as possible on break. When a player is having a good frame in snooker I.e. potting ball after ball they only use about half the table. Position shots in snooker are much more difficult and require more consistency as for safety shots it is definitely easier to do them in snooker but you don't even see safety shots in 9 ball certainly not in proportion to how many you see in snooker. In my opinion the size of the pockets and length of the table supersedes your points and ultimately makes the game easier for example youre point about a mistake being more deadly I will agree with. But why is that the case? Because it is so much easier to run a rack in pool then to pot every remaining ball or enough to gaurentee a win in snooker. I think pool at world class level it is harder to win at for each player since a degree of luck at that level is a more significant factor than for an average player.

It’s not objectively easier. It requires different skills with more focus on pocketing in snooker and more focus on position in pool. Good position play compensates larger table size and smaller pockets in most cases. Smaller table makes pocketing easier but play pool on a 7 foot table instead of a 9 foot table and position play gets a lot harder as the position windows get smaller and blocking of balls gets more likely. Pattern play is different as you try to clear balls from the rail in snooker whilst you position on them in pool. Rules are different in the disciplines making nine ball different from eight ball and again different from straight pool. Would even say pool allows less than snooker. Most comparable to snooker would probably be straight pool. Would be interesting to see pro snooker players against pro pool players in that discipline. Safety play is a lot harder in pool as you have to hit a rail after first contact. Not just rolling the white behind a ball as in snooker. Also no foul and miss as in snooker. You get one chance to get out of a safety and ideally leave a resafe. If you fail, ball in hand for the opponent and with that loss of the game in most cases.

@kosinus Which was exactly my point in my post. You can't just go into Pool and expecting to crush it just because you are great at Snooker. Because the competition in both are so ridiculously high that even if pool is the slightly simpler game, its still just as hard due to the competition. That being said there is a reason why there are a bunch of Snooker players having been moderately successful in Pool, but not the other way around.

Yes that's correct in general.. The Stricklands and the Varners of the time are only pool shooters.. But to every rule, there is an exception.. Efren, Bustamante and the Filipino pool invasion rocked the pool world.. After that, it's not all about pocketing.. There are bank safeties, two-way shots, multiple banks, banks from jaws of the pocket, exhibition like shots etc..

What bs you are talking.

The point is Trump was at least able to be competitive even if he lost at pool. The pool player however would't be competitive at snooker

@@24magiccarrot no sh*t

@@24magiccarrot Trump was not competitive. He only beat amateurs and the first professional he played (Shaw) he lost 11-1.

Mark Selby enters the chat.

@@sohorabhossain4615 Mark Selby started playing snooker at 9 years of age, he is as much as a snooker player as he is a pool player. Just because he started pool the year before doesn´t make him exclusively a pool player. The argument is whether a pool player who only plays pool can suddenly begin to play snooker as an adult against snooker pros and actually win. The answer is a very definitive no. Ronnie O´Sullivan on the other hand, has wins over and competitive matches with pool world champions.

Snooker is for poor people.

@@red88alert haha a table cost 10x more than a pool table

​@red88alert So why is Reyes a pauper in comparison to O'Sullivan, Hendry, Davis etc? A good season for a snooker player can see well over £1,000,000 in prize money, however a good season for a pool player is around $100-150k. Pool is the much poorer relative here. You need to educate yourself.

Seriously? He was butthurt and whiny as hell.

Good analogy

Indycar and F1 fans DO get along...the minute NASCAR comes on.

@@Adrenaline416 😂😂 there's always someone to pick on 😁

Your analogy still repeats what the video mention… Will the driver of Indycar do better at F1 races or will the driver of F1 do better in Indycar races? Then again in comes nascar..

@@starhawkflyingbright6905 yup it repeats it because I agree that we should show respect in both directions. For me, it is not an interesting or relevant question to ask "who is best at what other sport" , I'm just enjoying it all.

Idk who it is he lost to in the loser bracket but it probably wasn’t a top 30 player. I didn’t think Judd was going to win but expected him to do better. I’m also a snooker fan and when you watch them play it just seems like of course, any pro snooker player can hold their own against the best pool players, especially since they did so well in the late 90’s and early 00’. I’m just a average 540 Fargo so what the hell do I know…. I guess I still feel that the 25 best snooker players would fare better at pool than pool players playing snooker, and I know that is going to get all sorts of undies in a bunch just my opinion. Cheers to all and be nice!

He lost to a 739 on the losers side, that would be around a top 400 fargo rated player, maybe a top 800-1000 if you include players that aren't fargo rated.

Even after that video lol dude xD that is not how professional sports work. Pool is so "easy" that you can loose against a pro without ever missing a shot. At the highest level the ground difficulty is meaningless. Potting is "easier" you are not allowed to make mistakes and have to make harder pot attempts in close situations.

@@mr.lootybutthole Potting is always more difficult on a snooker table

Pool players can not play snooker until they get through qschool anyone can play in most pool tournaments. Snooker players have to be strong potters

trying to play snooker on a full-sized table after spending a career on a half-sized pool table (with wider pockets, to boot) would be absurdly difficult. it'd be a VERY steep learning curve, and that's even without learning/implementing all the tactics that snooker requires.

Agree. Comparing snooker and pool is like comparing tennis and padel.

And if I remember correctly he also played snooker in Scotland.

YES

What the hell did you think they gonna pronounce it ? Snickers ?

@@novemberrain9526 snuk-er is the usual American pronunciation

They often pronounce it so it rhymes with "looker."

@@johnk-pc2zx That's the correct pronunciation.

....some fans.

@@fifthof1795 well yeah some fans, I wasn't counting myself after all 🤣

Probably would struggle. I think that would be obvious. Weird that "has" to be asked? Trying to make some kind of point "mate?"

Even non league players would beat shaw. Pools takes no skill compared to snooker. Especially 9 ball

And here come the asinine replies. Getting exactly what you were looking for, aren't you.

Snooker is an objectively harder sport

Some have come from snooker..,eg . Pagulayan But I think it's a commercial thing you can earn regular money at pool whereas snooker is a bit of a closed shop ..

We don't see pro pool players in snooker tournaments because you have to somehow qualify to the tour and it takes a lot more dedication than just signing up for US open. Most top 9ball players are able to get 60+ breaks pretty often, obviously they would be huge underdogs against anyone from like top 30 but I'm pretty sure players like Shaw would easily manage to stay in tour if they focused on snooker. Konrad Juszczyszyn, polish pool player, managed to win back to back medals (gold and sliver) in Polish Snooker Championships against some of the Europe's finest amateur players

The guestion about difficulty is absurd. Russian pyramid is way more difficult than snooker. So what? Also in golf you see the ball going to the hole with the first try much more rarely than snooker.

For having worked in a pool hall you know really not a lot mate. 1. Multiple times i have seen fouls being called and do it myself. Maybe your experience is an american thing? 2. You have to play 1 year of qualification for maintour, while all pool competitions are open. That is why you have only seen 2 pool pros in maintour.

@@nakke3 I would like to see a Russian pyramid player play in a snooker tournament. Lol

If you were a true pool "fan" you would watch Earl Regardless of not "liking" him... That's some little kid sh!t...! Earl was/is an amazing player....! And you missed some of the best 9 ball ever played. I don't care for Shaw, but I watch him play some fantastic pool...!

I like snooker as an American

Exactly.

Now that’s a good point.

More difficult isn't the same as better

@@nakkadu well yeah snooker is more impressive to watch and no pool player has ever played in a pro snooker tournament

@@Jackster__ So what if a pool player hasn't played professional snooker? That doesn't mean snooker is a better game.

I played a fair bit of snooker when I was in college, but now just pool. Hard to find snooker in the US. I do prefer it, but I just don't see it happening here.

And that’s a big problem with why snooker is losing popularity in England. It’s kind of like golf where rich people are gatekeeping it and common people are just moving on to things that are easier to play. Pool will never die out as long as there’s tables in every single bar and tournaments have a low barrier of entry. If you want people to enjoy a game you have to let them play the game

Very well said ....

@@williamhrivnak7345 who told you snooker is losing popularity?

Winner breaks is an absolute joke!

Masters has a very boisterous crowd but most tournaments have a pretty polite crowd.

Fully agree. I bet that at 14:1, Snooker players would fare waaaaaaaay better than 9 ball.

The only person I know who’s made it as a professional in snooker, 8 ball and 9 ball is Chris Melling. You can’t be at peak level for all three as shown.

This video was only about playing pool. If you want to debate that ask him for another video.

@@dannygjk What??? The title says The Snooker & Pool debate, he never mentioned anything about a pool player playing snooker without much training, IT WOULD BE RIDICULOUS !! A pool player would NEVER play snooker without proper and extensive training and practice and that’s a FACT!!

@@chevive7 Seriously is English your first language? You misunderstood my comment. I meant if you want to debate the reverse case then ask him to make a video on that.

@@dannygjk the title of the video is "The Snooker vs Pool Debate" @chevive7 is correct there should also be a reverse

3 cushion, russian piramids.. snooker guys lose to amateurs there , different games

In Judd’s own words, “it would take 6 months to a year of playing every single day for me to even have a chance”. There’s no doubt he could make the jump if he really wanted to; he’s one of the best in the world at potting balls. But he would have to actually put in the work. Anyone who thinks he could just play a few racks at a pool hall and then go compete against the top players is laughable.

"He's a full blown snooker prodigy on par with Ronnie and Alex Higgins in terms of talent" nah, calm down... Ronnie and Alex Higgins are on another level, Judd is good, he is very good, but not even close to the other two.

@@sirisoj In terms of talent, he is

And what I haven't seen anyone mention is that Judd's biggest strength on a snooker table (his cue power) is pretty much wasted on a much smaller table.

@@sinocte Snooker has smaller balls. Basic physics tells the rest of the story. Besides, cue power doesn’t really mean anything for professionals of either pool or snooker. Only novice players of either cue sport care about cue power because they don’t yet have the technical capabilities and fundamentals to move the cue ball how they want to.

@@sirisoj Haters gonna hate I guess 🤷‍♂️. And yeah, if that’s what you’re tunneling in on, at this point either you don’t actually follow snooker or you’re a hater.

I also like the alternate brake better, but I get the thinking also in winner brakes. Alternate brake means the match can be over before the end because you can't really win 6-7 in a row at the pro level. With the winner brakes, the opponent can get back from 0-7 to win 8-7 so the match is live until the final shot.

@@nakke3 But more often the match is dead after the first frame.

@@Ed-Pavlov That's not true. It's rare to see the pros make 5-6 brake and runs in a row if the three point rule is in effect. Slow braking or bar table or 8-ball is a different story.

Hmmm, I would agree with you if you were talking aboug English pool on the 7-ft table, which is all about tight spaces and complex patterns. I think 9-ball is more about being incredibly good at the use of extreme English, bank shots, kick shots, jump shots and other tricks, and of course the break.

@@dhirajpallin2572 ahh, well yes I am talking about 8-ball on a 7-foot table, that’s what I predominantly play here in Australia :)

Me too bro@@4231jerome

Agreed 100%. It's safe to assume that top snooker players are already above average pool players to begin with. They are not just good enough to beat the top pool players outright. But if these guys were to spend a few months on the pool table they can definitely be on par with the top 3 pool players. It doesn't work that way for pool players though.

3 cushion, russian piramids.. snooker guys lose to amateurs there , different games

@@lo0ksik so who from your game won anything outside of it? Or even competed?

I've never played snooker (except for pool on a snooker table), but my first assumption is that rounded pocket openings make pocketing more precise (no shots down the cushion, right?). How many innings (or strokes or minutes) take place in an average pro competition between two players in both genres? My assumption about game theory in general is that the simpler or luck-based the game (backgammon, blackjack, baseball), the more it has to be stretched into a "Best of..." series to lessen luck's effect. If you try to tell me the answer(s) I promise I'll find some snooker match on RU-vid!

@@raygrinders3918 you're over analysing it. snooker is much more difficult because the table is much bigger and the pockets far smaller relative to the ball, so both position and pocketing are far harder. Being a good 9 ball player is hard (as opposed to eight ball which I normally play) but snooker is on another level.

The counter being its easier to get out of certain situations. 9 ball is attack focused, snooker is much more defensive. I would say 9 ball is not the best crossover for snooker players compared to other formats.

How many times in a match does a player move the cue ball 3 or 4 rails? In pool you're using the rails much more

@@0Caracalla you obviously have never watched much snooker

I don’t say pool is easy. And top 9 ball players are awesome skill level. Effren Reyes etc. but snooker is the harder game. Without doubt

Nah. Having played both, snooker is so much harder to master than pool. Even a 8 Yr old who has played both can realize it.

@@donjohn2239 I agree with you, and I said the same thing in my comment. My point was, for guy's like shaw who can cue that accurately and with the control that he does... he could be a pro snooker player with a few years of dedication to the game. They're all hitting a cue ball with a stick. Both games are about speed control, accuracy, and spin understanding. Judd and Shaw both check all of those boxes. What separates them... is table knowledge in a particular discipline and table design differences. Both of which could be learned and mastered within a few years when you have those other boxes checked at a mastery level.

@@0351marinemike I would easily say it won't be like that considering how many pool players have tried to get to snooker. Not saying pool is easy but not easy to crossover to snooker If we compare it to the reverse.

@@donjohn2239 I suppose you're right... but O'sullivan and Trump haven't won anything in pool either when they've tried. I think it boils down to dedication to the new variation of billiards... nobody has completely quit the discipline that makes their money to fully dedicate themselves to the other discipline.

@@0351marinemike Well how many pool players have tried going to snooker?

Snooker is harder

great comment.

that is because no one else in the world besides the British care about snooker

@@JamesJoyce12 I don't agree with you. In recent years you can see more and more Chinese players in Snooker. This proves Snooker is becoming more and more popular in China.

@@JamesJoyce12 disagree completely, snooker is being widely accepted and appreciated more and more around the world. Snooker is a more advanced game than pool and that’s why it is a spectacle 👌🏼

@@JamesJoyce12 no it’s just you realising pool players will never do it

@@TanWam I am sure that made perfect sense in your brain - but when you actually wrote it down - it lost all meaning

3 cushion, russian piramids.. snooker guys lose to amateurs there , different games

@@lo0ksik yes true. Thanks for replying

Winner breaks

@@sinocte Hopefully eventually official matches will always be alternating.

Facts

True.

and you won't be holding your breath ;)

100% On a basic level snooker is harder. But theres so much more.