@zabeehtaizai2356 there are none. They would rather kill themselves honorably then turn into an abomination. Even if they did turn, they probably would still kill themselves.
Truly CA in their unparalleled genius was considerate of Dawi players. Thus, the Thunderbarge is both an army killer and needs 0 micro, so you can use it both in pvp boxes and in pve corner camping to great effect.
well yeah, honestly,as it should be, because, look, its not 1 unit u have to control all the time, its like, theres a whole bunch of dudes up on that thing, shooting, etc, dropping bombs, all u do is the piloting, you tell it where to go. That is nice, that makes sense for me.
@@Erebus2075 "Barely pay for itself"? The thing got like 4,5k value and cost what, 3k? 4,5k is like 40% of your funds in land battles, is it not? lets see how many other things cost nearly 3k and consistently pay for themselves without constant and careful micro... Changeling? Blue Scribes? Dread Saurian RoR? Greater Demon Lords? Malekith on his dragon? Teclis on Arcane Phoenix? I wager exactly none of these. Not unless aided by copious amounts of healing. This is more op than Mama O was with 0 counterplay unless you walk into a ton of guns deliberately. Flyers cant hurt it cuz they cant catch up to it. Im okay with how it works, but it has to be tuned down. Ive seen the Thunderer guns killing the Khorne Juggernaut RoR in basically seconds. Also 1,5k spear dmg into Saytang, a construct made of stone, and also coincidentelly one of the most op things in the game? Tells you about the Barge right there.
I'm kind of curious if Cathay had targeted the thunderbarge with the sky junk rockets it could have done a fair bit of damage, since close range like that every rocket would probably hit, considering how massive the barge is.
@@woodlands_ I'm wondering this too! Turin had a really nice army with those bolt throwers - since Cathay needed to choose between them and the Thunderbarge.
Man, I'm torn. The Thunderbarge is the coolest thing ever, but holy hell is it busted. I think if they make it a lot slower it would be alright, maybe? Seeing it outrun those Crowmen was silly.
I think makes it like inverse heart of winter where it has stages of ever increasing speed and damage. If left on for max duration should do something especially bad like rooting it for a solid chuck of time or making it take a massive chunk of sudden damage
Imo the best solution would be to remove "fire whilst moving" as long as the afterburner is on. So you are either shooting everything around you, or you are using your improved speed to flee or resposition, not both at once
Alternatively have a random chance every time it is activated to explode, dealing lots of damage to the thunderbarge and disabling it for the rest of the game. Also a cap to the duration
Those bolt throwers being cheap, yet a crucial target for the cannons really goes great with the Thunderbarge! Hard to choose what to focus on with the cannons, I imagine.
But, if its not like that, then, honestly, its like, just a cathay lantern, so, in my own humble opinion, it should stay as it is, for real, And, he did what? put some crow men onto the thunderbarge? why not go dragon form and go after the thunderbarge, that would honestly, at least for me, make more sense, or focus it down with artillery, from far away, because it IS a big target, not hard to miss.
@@Zoey-- yes, understandable, but, what does the 17% heal does? whom does it? whom does it replenish? Cathay cannons are very accurate man. they can def blast a thunderbarge, and that 17% heal wont count for much nlg, thats my opinion dou. You can just push the thunderbarge in there, with no care, otherwise it will get killed.
Dwarfs became the bane of non ranged factions. Basically one army with engineers, 2 of this barges, a couple of gyro copters and gyrobombers to intercept flying units and the rest in long range canon artillery and defenders for it and you can kill everything in the north easily (except SKAVEN)
Yeah I don't see how vampire counts are ever fighting this... greenskins will struggle too. What about slaanesh, chaos or god forbid NURGLE vs this monster. I don't think anti-infantry flying units are going to touch it at 13k hp with that much speed and constant dps.
Well, investing that heavily into air units will leave your land units weaker. A full on rush with VC or Slaneesh could win you the game or force the air units to land
@@kluasvt828The thunderbarge can't land and I'm not sure if it doesn't have too much leadership to rout from army losses if it hasn't taken any damage.
Neither the blimp or the landship should have their speed ability. If they are going to be this massive powerhouse for damage, having an ability that just ignores positioning misplay shouldn't exist, and being able to just "nope" away from any melee units is dumb
IF it was a one time use only that they cant control in a straight line doesnt seem to bad but yeah both are way over tuned currently. even if the landship gets overwhelmed and swarmed it punishes the player with an explosion....
I love that you have to build an entire army around the barge. No dwarf infantry lineup, no functional artillery, just pieces to deal with the barge’s counters and support units. A single barge is a doomstack. Malakai should get one as a mount.
As broken as the thunderbarge is, I'll find it bittersweet when it gets its desperately needed nerfs. Watching this early version in action has been hilarious and awesome every time.
Aside from the Thunderbarge being OP, I'm really glad they added all the Dwarf units I've said in streams that they could reasonably get, aside from the Shard Dragon.
@@gohomehero Those are not units the Dwarfs could reasonably get. At no point after the formation of the vortex did they ever get them working, and to me that's like asking for Grimnir to be a Legendary Lord.
@@arlissmith876 Those are not units the Dwarfs could reasonably get. At no point after the formation of the vortex did they ever get them working, and to me that's like asking for Grimnir to be a Legendary Lord.
It is completely insane that the Thunderbarge, a huge blimp, has 120 armour (a literal steam tank only has 40 more) and a non-committal, reusable speed boost. I'm sure this and the other big new special units will all be fun to play, but they are so low skill and low risk, I'm already bored of watching it after 2-3 games. Playing against them will probably suck even more.
Just like with Ikit, youre better off autoresolving if the army has even one of these things in it. Unfortunately, as opposed to Skaven, Dwarfs have the best autoresolve in the entire game, so you'll lose a lot either way.
@@Grivehn Really depends on who you're playing any faction with good shooting and artillery will destroy this thing if its controlled by AI in campaign. AI just doesn't build armies very well so in a matchup like this those Cathay Cannons would be completely unopposed to just slaughter it in moments.
@@Grivehn It won't be that bad in campaign since you can just bring a lot of cannons, shotguns (Blunderbusses for example will kill it pretty quick) or your own fliers.
Honestly some people in the comments want it nerfed way to hard, imo the only thing that needs to be done is a slight cost increase and disabling the Weapons while it's speedbosting. The biggest problem I can tell from the videos I have seen is that it can simply run away and avoid it's counters all the while still firing in all directions and even slowly killing it's pursuers. If it has to stop dealing damage to avoid getting swarmed and then retreat to the dwarven lines for support to get it's pursuers of it's back it'll greatly diminish the destruction it does and forces some of the Dwarven units to actually actively support it which will leave possible openings for enemies to approach and deal with the Dwarven Army. That would also highly increase the skill needed to play it effectively which sounds fun to me as well.
It does feel like they are trying some new things for upcoming games (ww1/40k) with the whole steam tank mechanic with more armor infront and less at the back etc and also with the thunderbarge with the whole flying. And yes I know we had flying before but it seems way different with the thunderbarge xd
Just played vs the thunderbarge as ogre kingdoms, it straight up floated over each of my units oneshotting them essentially with those drop bombs. Had 2 leadbelchers and 1 ironblaster on it for the entire match, but they barely moved the giant healthbar lol.
It was so fun seeing the Thunderbarge in action. Since you can't target things with it (except for the harpoon, god I loved seeing that) it's biggest counter should be counter artillery since they can focus it down. If it's turn out to be a menace it might be a good idea to increase the cost to reduce your army size if you want to bring such a beauty onto the field. Hard to tell with such a low sample size but I guess time will tell.
There are two things that could fix ot real easy. While it uses speed boost it is disarmed as well as taking dmg. Should get cooldown between uses (imagine recharging fuel for it) Maybe some price increase as well, but that should be fine
Hopefully they will nerf the afterburner, increasing the damage, giving it a duration and a cooldown. If the speed is manageable then you will only need to deal with the armor, high health and insane damage output.
the boost should have a long cooldown and do more damage. The blimp should be like 3500 gold, nothing less. Don't make it weaker, just make is extremely expensive
Couldn't agree more, nerfing is a tool that should be used very carefully. Gold increases and increased cooldown on the speed increase make far more sense!
@@callumsevers776CA could make these debates pointless and save us the trouble by not deliberately making units OP with DLC release. If it didn't appear as strong and a bit more reasonable people wouldn't be clamouring for nerfs or yelling to keep it as it is. It's the same old story for like 7 years.
We haven't even got to play with the Thunderbarge yet, and people are already complaining about how op it is. I get it, it sucks facing it in multiplayer and I agree. But I don't want campaign units being nerfed to accommodate multiplayer. The campaign stuff should remain wild and fun. I think limiting the boost ability to a one-time-use per battle would eliminate the kiting problems without taking away from the epicness of the unit.
I think that thunder burner thing and the other similar ability on the land ship should have some side effects For example it should give the ship ability to escape melee but the expense of stopping the entire crew from shooting while this ability is active So even if you kept that thing on the whole time you know you can flee but you can't shoot back either And it makes sense too because you are travelling at much faster speed that you normally can and for that your crew need to brace for it and this will prevent them from shooting at the same time
I wish that was a model for Old World, because I’d love to paint it. Can’t wait to get the new Dawi coming in tabletop and the game! Oh and that thing should cost like 5k gold. 😂
Terrible intensity skill. Some things never change. They could double the value and halve the required kills and it still would have been maybe 20% wardsave for a 0 armor unit under 50% health.
My contribution would be that three changes are needed, one is that it’s bombs should be manual control, there is no reason why Cathay’s Lantern units should need to be manual but the thunder barge isn’t. The second change is that the Thunder barge should not have a boost to its turning radius, that makes no sense, if the boost is on it should be forced to move forward at high speed. A cool-down is definitely needed on the boost.
Hey Turin! Love the content as always! However it seems like the audio level of your uploads is quite low compared to other videos on youtube. Even if I turn my music volume to minimum and turn the audio of your video to max the music just barely has lower volume than your video.
At least the Thunderbarge make a little more sense than gyrocopters for that particular fantasy setting...I think... whell you have a dwarf flying boat-zeppelin/flying fortress (the WW2 bomber) with artillery vs. a steampunk Apache Attack heli, with very angry small people with long beards in both.
I saw other videos with the Thunderbarge. It needs a self-damage boost and a speed nerf, maybe make its max speed 75, I love its idea and I wouldn't want to see it change much, but something needs to be done.
Im waiting to see a domination match before solidifying my opinion on the Thunderbarge. If I had to make some changes based on what I’ve seen so far: - Cost more - Double thunderburner damage - Lower thunderburner speed (60-75) - Swap shotguns with regular thunderers, or reduce shotgun range.
So you're telling me that one of the most expensive units in the game with an entire army built around supporting it or covering it's support is strong against an army that barely brought a handful of counters and left the rest fallow? wowee zowie, shocking!
2 crows to kill tier 5 unit without ranged support? That decision was bad, I think. I think thunder-burner needs some limitation or more self-destruct damage for giving enemies air-force chance, for reward, CA should make some ability that makes thunderbarges to aim its cannons (it works like skill, but thuderbage's cannon aims the target even if it's moving until thunderbarge can't shoot because of arc)
2 crows and 2 grand cannons, arguable one of the best cannon units in the game. the issue is the best counterplay seems to be artillery but Dwarves already have the best counter arty play as well.
@@Hurricayne92 Well, it seems Cathay player concentrate on shooting bolt thrower first, the player didn't try to shoot the thunder barge. I wonder if the player brought ranged unit instead of Jade warrior. since thunderbarge can't aim things, I think concentrate on range unit with some bait units is the key to kill thunder barge for now rather than artillery. What I seem is the burner is the OP that evades the melee attack of some powerful air units. It looks good that you can micro control things for effective play, but that's too much.
The afterburner needs at least a significant cooldown once deactivated and an accelerating damage when left on. It's okay in principle but right now being able to just leave it on means it's just the stats it has.
Increase the cost, nerf its HP, or increase self-damage on the ability for the Thunderbarge. But Dwarfs have been the EXACT same since the multiplayer days of WH1, I remember that, I was there. The only thing for Dwarfs that had any meaningful change over the years were the Runesmiths where CA never really knew what to do with the Runes and how they should work, I remember the days where you would just bring like 2 or 3 Runesmiths and spam Rune of Wrath and Ruin (which did a fixed DoT back then) and just melt units over the course of a battle. Now the Dwarfs get access to a whole new arsenal in the form of various Slayer units & Slayer lords and artillery powerhouses (as they should be) and people immediately start crying. Even if the Thunderbarge gets nerfed, and it probably should, be it by way of cost or health, if you bring no counters to the Thunderbarge it will and should demolish your army. Two onyx crowmen aren't gonna cut it lmao.
Why does it have 13k HP? Why does it have effectively infinite ammo? Why does it have fire whilst moving? Why does it require no manual targeting whatsoever? Why does it have the most damaging missile ability in the game? Why does it have toggleable speed buff that makes it effectively immune to melee units in the air while taking negligible damage?
The spell that reverse shooting should be good against a Thunderbarge, no? I mean, it never stop shooting, and has a lot of different way, all of them being VERY powerful
I’m actually more scared about this thing being insanely op at launch than it being completely useless. Not because I’m worried about it in its overpowered state, but because when CA gives it the nerf hammer it might be a nerf nuke that makes it useless and then CA will never fix it because they already tried once.
