Hey guys! today we've got something a bit different today, we'll discuss multiplayer and some of the things you should consider when making sets with multiplayer in mind!
19:15 This is actually very interesting and can be used to your advantage. You can purposely parry attacks from your teanmates to trigger things like Insta-block, Anchor Rage and Offensive Guard. It also works if one of your partners is wyvern-riding and you block the riden monster attacks, which is quite easier to perform. It's a bit situational, but it can be pulled off and it's a way to increase the value of these skills in multiplayer.
You can also Anchor Rage a Blast Toad in case the Monster sleeps, it's a good way of waking it up as the Toad does a lot of damage and it leads to an insta knock-down while buffing your weapon.
Great video. Some really interesting points there. After 120 hunts with the Lance I am completely sold! Even though it doesn’t have any big hitting moves, I have never felt more effective at constant damage. Once you get the hang of the mobility and the monsters moves you can match the aggression of pretty much anything in Rise. Lance boy for life now!
i think a lot of people from the older series think of the lack of mobility of lance. yeah, rise's lance is pretty solid for movement but does take time to learn if you were used to the poke, poke, poke from older games. but, like you said, once you get mobility down - it's an awesome weapon :)
On flinch free in multiplayer - I tend to just assume that everyone has at least one level of flinch free and attack through them. I also tend to do poke - poke - poke - hop for my main combo, which generally doesn't affect other people. I find that unless I'm charging over someone, I can't flinch others unless I make a point to do it. That being said, if my attacks are tripping someone up it's so so easy to just... angle the pokes a different direction. Or do a couple side hops. Again, you really have to be trying to flinch someone with lance. And if a lance player is doing that to you in multiplayer it means that they really are a bit of an asshole. Or just ignorant, but either scenario is not fun to play with. Or they're getting revenge on their cannon happy siblings for knocking them clear across the map with their Wyvern fire.
I've steered completely away from Spiral thrust in favor of Anchor rage even though it'd be more dps, and quite frankly i don't need it when we got Sheathing retreat. Examples: Monster turns away from you? Sheathing retreat over the monster & unsheathe to get a hit on the head again. Monster runs away? Sheathing retreat backwards to thrust yourself against the monster and use the charge to close the last gap needed. Also, my mindset for MP lancing is usually: "Oh, the monster attacks on me? Cool." if not, i guess a tail cut works too? Mostly been playing exclusively elemental builds without Offensive guard and it's been working out quite well tbh.
Diversion skill generally doesn't affect too much in multiplayer because everyone does an average of equal amount of damage, but it is exceptionally helpful in single player with pets and followers. And from your description it does align with my experience as well, especially when single player the helpers don't do that much damage and the percentage of damage you do is magnitudes greater than all of them combined so diversion skill generally end up guaranteeing you being always picked for the attack.
I can assure you the monster does not attack the player doing the most damage to it. I feel like There are some hunts where its obvious longsword expert, or bowgun users who are playing perfect, and not getting hit, but the monster will still follow me around the whole time even though I am contributing no dps, and suffering the whole hunt. Usually when I play Hunting horn, or hammer, and just want to bonk the head in peace.
They said there is aggro generation bonus for quest taker, and i feel that the one who get the first hit (in every area) will get hit more often, idk how exactly is it
@@benjamin7354 probably both right, probably a higher percentage of chasing top dps with a smaller chance to target support players. the monsters do seem to target low hp players... that's for sure :D
For gap closing move, try to use sheathing retreat instead of spiral thrust. Using Sheathing retreat + one wirebug roll will give you lot of reach that usually will reach monster running around. Combine with shield dash/dash attack you will extend the reach further.
If aggro is based on damage the influence it has is close to negligible. I run a DPS tracker and play with my wife, I'm consistently 80% of total damage on any given hunt. I havnt at any point noticed the monster attacking me more or less then when I'm playing with my other friends that do a lot more. I play all weapons and this holds true for all of them. It's entirely possible **diversion** the skill can increase aggro based on damage done. This I have no idea about as I don't run the skill. However the default system is not noticably influenced at all by damage, status, or elemental damage applied. I would be much more convinced that it has to do with situational factors such as "Distance from Monster", "Current Health", "Stun Status", and "Action Being Performed"(Like Sharpening, drinking a potion, or setting a trap). These are least in personal experience seem to be consistent situations I'll see the monster swap aggro to attack someone. **Especially** sharpening.
I've been playing since Tri and I've always SWORE that monsters will IMMEDIATELY go and attack whoever is sharpening lmao. I have absolutely zero data and science to back this up, and it's probably not true, but it's my own little personal head-cannon that monsters will always go for people with low health/preoccupied with other animations.😂
heres some things i found out about monster agroo,host always get more focused(this is why u shouldnt host with a range weapon,meele user would spend more time chasing the monter than hitting them losing so much dps and if u do stay close to your hunter budies or play spread),exploiting monster weakness like element or weak spots or faster hitting weapon will get u more agroo for example lbg with long barrel, pierce,mail of hell fire and sneak atack vs s bazelguse will make u an agroo sponge,monter switch agroo when hit their target and sometimes they dont ,hard to find how it works(tested this on duo hunts and monter switch agroo if the hunter that didnt got hit hits the monter),long s with harvest moon its the biggest agroo taker of the game when u are the host,best way to get a feel of how agroo works its in duos and btw que more duos people they are more fun and balaced 4 hunter hunts on high anomalies level are ridiculous easy ,monters stays most of the time on the ground :(,diversion seem to have no effect on multiplayer as you said its neglectable i could be wrong in a loot of this so let me know
Best advice for everyone in multiplayer with lance. Sharpening has major agro, I use speed sharpening max , with sheating retreat as TAUNT. works very well to keep agro
Fantastic vid, got me thinking of building some more elemental based sets or even proper support ones with sleep/para depending on the matchup. One weird thought that came to mind was using frostcraft if hunting with ranged weapon users to get around monsters that move across wide areas a lot, especially paired with sheathing retreat, and whether or not it would make enough of a difference to use in that scenario. I'm curious to see what can work since it would be fun to mix up my usual play style with the weapon, especially with the huge variety of armor skills to play with in sunbreak's end game.
One thing I do is having a Sleep weapon on my cat or dog, they do enough damage to make the monster sleep 2 times in a 10-15 min hunt. I'd say Lance "support" is by trying to keep aggro with Diversion and K.Os, so Slugger is also an option in case you really want to focus on support (wide-range is always welcome)
Omg that last point you were talking about, with flinch free not working with guard reminded me of a hilarious hunt the other day! So, my roommate and I were hunting risen Teo (me on lance, him on rapid fire pierce LBG), and at one point I just catch the edge of his shots and so my hunter starts blocking. Except his shots come too close together for me to ever leave my guard animation, so I'm just freaken stuck there as he CHEWS through my stamina lmao. By the time he registers that I'm telling him to STOP SHOOTING ME, Teo had prepared a nice big explosion attack for me and my zero stam 🙃 That was quest since it was a no cart investigation, but holy crap was it funny 😂 I usually only run lance in solo or friend lobbies. Sometimes I'll run it in randoms but I usually just switch to SA or something a bit more mobile. I did join a random investigation yesterday that had THREE lance users lol. Was a really fun hunt! I got a great clip of 2 of us using skyward thrust PERFECTLY in sync with each other hahaha
new update now, new deco prevents interactions so spiral thrust is great now. sheathing retreat is great in combination with frostcraft. turn around, retreat to move forwards, then run towards the monster. by the time u reach and start attacking, u get a burst of frostcraft bonus.
Lance in my opinion feels really strong. Even with a heavy bowgunner in my team i can still stay close to their dps pretty easily because i can stick to the monster so well and just keep wacking and ignoring all of their moves. Only issue is it got a bit repetitive after going through all of low/high rank (changing things up with new switch skills has helped though). Me and my friends did all our matches in a group and are currently finishing up the last couple high rank things (we could have started master rank already but i wanted everyone to do the all mother fight to cap off the normal game before moving on to master rank. I’ve already seen it on switch but i wanted my friends on pc to see it since i thought it had some memorable meme moments.)
Here's my experience as a lance main who do solo hunts, squad hunts with friends and random lobby hopping. I disagree that big slow hard hitting moves gets better in multiplayer, if a monster is focusing someone else its ridiculously hard to land any slow move on a decent hitzone. Lance is kidda like gunlance in this regard where it's constant dps and positioning tool it got in sunbreak allows it to stick close to the monster and lay down the damage non stop no matter who the monster's chasing after. When the monster is down I also find that offensive guard is pretty much always active as you guard dash through your squadmate's attacks when they gang up on the head. Multiplayer also cover lance's biggest weakness, it's slow time to sheathe and heal as the party could heal you or take the monster's aggro. As for aggro I'm fairly certain (from experience, not hard evidence) that damage dealt highly effects who the monster aggro, but also the monster will prioritize the quest's host (the guy who posted, with red name). Comes in really handy for posting risen quests or hard investigations for lower level players. Lance especially come in clutch as our parries are stationary and allows for other players who can't parry multiple attacks to wait for an opportunity to stack up on the lancer (shout to my GS main friend). My only multiplayer specific recommendation for lance sets are to consider adding wirebug whisperer to enable more sheathing retreat for positioning. Great video as always.
Yes, i also noticed there was a lack of mentioning that offensive guard procs on team mate attacks. Nothing easier then guard dashing through dual blades to proc offensive guard.
As a lance player who does both solo and multiplayer hunts, here is my advice, though it can be situational as well Do not chase a monster around in a party hunt, unless it is knocked down. Instead of using spiral thrust to chase a knocked down monster, use sheathing retreat and go straight into dash attack/shield charge. Predict which party member (usually the person targeted the least) and orbit that party member to get OG to proc.
I have an experience that i think dan optimize diversion, Always hit first and keep attacking alone for like 5-10 sec before your teammate start attacking, I feel that aggro more stabilize that way, One of things that make aggro shifted is when you knocked back far enough, and teammates keep attacking, its always about 75% aggro shifted Thats my experience
When discussing movement options you did not mention using sheathing retreat or twin vines. I tried using twin vines but it breaks too often when monsters move far away, it could really use a buff to range and duration and a reduction in animation commitment. It goes unused when it appears to have been designed for solving some of the issues multiplayer introduces: Increasing threat and guard level. Too bad it is just so unusable. Sheathing retreat doesn't knock down allies and allows for more fine grained control of where you end up. It also requires a bit more practice to become proficient. With sheathing retreat into shield dash you can get to a downed monster really quickly from anywhere from an unsheathed state. Sheathing retreat works really well for chasing monsters being kited by LBGs across the map with fanning maneuver. Unless there are multiple LBGs and the monster decides to jump back and forth between them resulting in no wirebugs being used by the LBGs to get away and you using wirebugs to chase. But at that point the LBGs just have to use their massive damage to carry the fact that they make it impossible to deal decent DPS as a melee weapon.
