Nixon does suggest that getting rid of one of the lieutenants might not be the worst thing, that being the upside to which he alluded before. Winters brightens and chooses Peacock. (LiveJournal: @marymary) There’s something I always admired in that scene that speaks of Winters, his ideology and leadership and yet, it also speaks to something inside every man too. Shaving under such circumstances might be far a cry from the domesticity of a man shaving with warm, fresh water at home. Yet both conjure up images of masculinity. Winters shaves because he is a man. Regardless of where they might be, or their circumstance, shaving is what men do. Although Winters continues to hold himself to those standards he set during peace-time, he doesn’t judge or hold those men to account for not shaving themselves. Shaving each day, whatever the situation, is a means and a method to learn how to treat ourselves and others with respect. Shaving is a reminder that you’re not perfect, that you’re a work in progress, but most importantly that if you don’t work to maintain those standards you set yourself you can go backward by just doing nothing. (Gents Cafe) YOU CAN WATCH THIS TV MINI SERIES "BAND OF BROTHERS" (2001), THROUGH OUR WEBSITE IN OUR BIO
I think you really got the wrong idea from him shaving. He shaves because he's a good officer, and in their situation maintaining good order and discipline is critical. He's not just a high rank, he's highly respected and he knows he does not have the luxury of relaxing on any military standards. It has nothing to do with being a man.
@@jasonr8525 Exactly, shaving is just mandatory for an officer of his rank. Doesn't make him less of an awesome leader, but it's not like he had a choice
Contrary to common belief many women do have some level of facial hair, depending on genetics. Microscopic stubble essentially. I think it peaks through because all humans used to be way harrier a million years ago. But due to stigma it’s not talked about a lot. And those women are usually plucking, shaving, or waxing it discreetly because of the stigma. Or if they have lighter hair leave it be because no one really notices (it’s often on the under part of the chin. Though some will have like the ghost of a ghost of a mustache). Then you have people like Harnaam Kaur, who has a magnificent beard and will never shave it because she’s a Sikh. It’s interesting stuff! That being said I agree with the others and think Winters mostly shaved because it’s an officer thing and he had expectations on him to present a certain way. Plenty of the other men were bearded but weren’t less manly or less civilized for rocking their Bastogne beards. Beard were more practical anyway in that environment because it would keep their faces warmer
@@jasonr8525I was just about to say this. He doesn’t shave because he’s a good man he shaves because he’s an officer in a leadership position. He sets the example at all times despite circumstances and because he is disciplined.
@@Mo-re8yoThat's no lie some guys here don't want to Go back or Stay here, the thing is. It depends on the individuals. Personally, I want to get out of the country. I'm in and fighting the front lines. Because of my identity. That's how scary some of us can be. You just gotta find that 1 individual who wants to dearly go home and send them home. With a nice 30 day vacation.
@dommaschk never know when theres a sniper or an enemy platoon in the area. no fancy thermals, lidar, scout drones, etc to spot enemies. most enemy finding was done by infantry standard issue mk1 eyeballs spotting an enemy combattant and relaying that by various means. planes were loud and slow, and couldnt fly as high back then, so it was hard to spot the enemies without them knowing they had been spotted and thus alerting them to impending attack or at least enemy presence to follow. Even in vietnam you never saluted an officer in the field for the same reason, its really damned hard to find a quiet enemy sneaking around before he shoots.
They may not have liked him very much, but he's on the team and he gets to go home for 30 days. You get a better platoon leader, and he gets to see home, wins all around.
Yeah I suppose what people forget is not only were people just more resilient back then, but also these were hard men. To them this is akin to just ribbing. They still respected him enough to be happy for him that he bo longer shares this burden. Brave heroes all.
@@dommaschknot saying you are wrong (because sound discipline was necessary) but that lack of enthusiasm is because Peacock wasn't liked by the troops - noise discipline was just a good cover
From the book: First platoon was led by Lt. Thomas Peacock, a replacement officer. Webster wrote that “he always obeyed an order without question, argument, or thought.” Webster felt that Peacock “was highly esteemed by his superior officers and cordially disliked by his men. He was too G.I.” Once the platoon came back to Aldbourne from a ten-hour cross-country march; Peacock made the men play a baseball game, because that was what was on the schedule. “Peacock believed in the book; he was in his element in Normandy as battalion supply officer, but as a platoon leader his men hated even to look at him.”
If I recall from the book, he instructed one of his men to sweep the floors of a house they were holding up in. It’s not that he commanded him to do a menial task that was the problem but that it seemed hardly necessary.
@@mandovillarreal5625 From the book: The company prepared to spend the night in Uden. The men who had been there were amazed when the men who had undergone the shelling in Veghel dug foxholes 4 feet deep; they had only dug 6 inches or so into the ground and let it go at that. The officers had billets in houses in Uden. Lieutenant Peacock of 1st platoon approached Webster’s foxhole and told him to come along. Webster climbed out, and they walked to Peacock’s billet above a liquor store on the village square. “Take that broom and sweep this room out,” Peacock ordered. “Yes, sir,” Webster replied, thinking to himself, What kind of a man is this? He decided, “I would rather starve to death as a bum in civilian life than be a private in the army.”
From the book: Your platoon commander, Lieutenant Peacock, has been awarded a thirty-day furlough to the States and he leaves today.” He explained that the PR man at Division HQ thought it would be a great idea to send one officer from each regiment involved in the heroic defense of Bastogne to the States for a war bond drive and other publicity purposes. Colonel Sink decided to make the selection by drawing lots. Captain Nixon won, Peacock came in second in the 506th. Nixon said he had already seen the States and didn’t want to go, so Peacock got the assignment. Everyone looked at Peacock, who stammered, “I have been awarded this furlough, I feel certain, because of the great job you men did in Holland and here, and the only thing I can say is thanks.” Sergeant McCreary jumped up, ran to Peacock, and started pumping his hand, saying, “Boy, am I glad to hear you’re going home, Lieutenant! That’s the best news we’ve had since we left Mourmelon.” Peacock, completely misunderstanding, blushed. He said he felt overwhelmed, that praise from one of the men was the highest praise. The sergeants smiled at each other. They were feeling as happy to see Peacock going as he was to be going. The noncoms felt they had carried his load throughout Holland and the Ardennes. “No one tried harder than Peacock,” Christenson declared, “but it was a job he was not cut out for.” Peacock announced that Lieutenant Foley was taking command of the platoon. Then with a cheery “Good luck to you all,” he was gone.
@@plainlake really sounds like a guy who was in his element when he could do the math for divisions really. Unfortunately in the military that job is usually reserved for an officer. To be in charge of. So you can guess where a replacement officer might come from for a division if they're short on officers.
@@plainlake Not a sub-par officer, just a sub-par line officer. There are the the officers good for being behind a desk and admin, and then there are those that are in the field leading the men.
That's interesting. Something people don't often think about is that some people are cut out for different jobs. And there's nothing wrong with that, they just need to figure that out before somebody potentially gets hurt or whatever. My first PL was a great guy. Not a good platoon leader, but a real nice guy, cared about what he did. Anyway, when he got promoted to company XO, he absolutely slaughtered it, he was the best damn XO I had ever seen before or after him
I served 32 years in the USAF and I have promoted several officers to positions, and I quote: 'which best serve the needs of the Air Force after careful observation and evaluation'. It usually works out for the best AND usually has the added benefit of the 'promoted' officer being oblivious to the actual reason behind the transfer/promotion. In other words, standard procedure among observant commanders. JB III, Major General, USAF (ret.)
If he's seen all 48 states ( and Alaska and Hawaii ), then he'd been an extremely travelled man. In those days, people seldom stepped out of their home states !
To Bad Peacock died in Automobil Crash in 1948 with his Mom. He maybe a by the Book Guy and not a good Combat Leader but he seemed Genuinely like a Nice person.
He wasn't malicious, he never intended to make things miserable, so he gets a pass. He just didn't have a feel for leadership. He was a good manager, but a poor leader. There are lots of places for officers like that, just not at the front.
@@alan5506 "Dike was a poor soldier and leader and was often unavailable during combat; these traits earned him the pejorative nickname of "Foxhole Norman" among the members of Easy Company." I heard the series exaggerates his character, but he's portrayed as incompetent, unhelpful and uncaring.
This is what you call a win win scenario. Winters is happy he gets an unreliable lieutenant out, he is happy to go home and the guys are happy to get a guy driving them crazy away for awhile.
It's not really the cold, but the dirt. I've gone 40+ days without a bath/shower multiple times in my time in the Army. You get dirtier than you can imagine in that time, even under relatively good circumstances. Even after splashing water on your face, you still feel the dirt and dried sweat on you as you pull the razor across your face. It's trapped in your pores is my guess. Shave cream just made me feel even dirtier with slight residue it leaves, so I just never bothered with it. I can't imagine what these guys went through as we had it pretty good by comparison.
Even worse if you have a bad razor and minimal shaving cream, messes up the skin bad with all the grime and dirt forming a sandpaper like surface to try and scrape off.
@@jackpeters2884finally someone else who hated using shaving cream in the field. My unit thought I was insane for dry shaving and then looked at me like I was a window licker when I tried to explain why
What I find interesting is that Winters could have sent Dike away and it would have solved all their problems. But at the same time any number of his men deserved a trip back home so in the end he gave it to someone else. Peacock may not have been the best platoon leader but Winters said in an earlier scene "God bless him, no one tries harder." Meaning that he isn't as bad as Dike and actually makes the effort.
We had an NCO like that when I deployed. No matter what job he was given he would try his absolute DAMNDEST and always fuck it up. Fantastic guy, just sucked at the jobs we had available for him. Felt sorry for the guy. Some people are just fish in the sky.
One of the worst traits in a leader is blind naivete, especially when you don't see or notice the veiled hints of hate, loathing, and distain from your own troops. He was getting roasted like a choice piece of meat at a BQ, and he was completely clueless, which is not a quality that an officer should have when leading troops.
Sobel got that exact hints of hate, loathing, and disdain from his own troops. Yet almost all of them praised his training in the hindsight. Go figure.
@user-by6ri3cu4y no not "almost all". Some credited Sobels extreme hazing for making them so tough. Others like Winters credited his men for having it within themselves. And I would argue that Winters is probably the one who was right. Not every company, not every regiment -so on and so forth- had the extreme hazing that Sobel gave the men of easy, yet so many men formed the same bonds and found the same hard-nosed attitude in combat and achieved the same heroic acts. Sobel was a man with deep personal issues, and he took them out on the men of easy. His portrayal in BOB is fair.
"I just wish they told me there was a war on." Love that line. Perfectly captures his personality. He's almost too aloof for this world but it somehow works!
@@imxploring It's a problem of motivation, all right? Now if I work my ass off and Initech ships a few extra units, I don't see another dime, so where's the motivation? And here's something else, Bob: I have eight different bosses right now
Dike ends his career in the US Army after serving in WW2 and Korea a Lt. Colonel and was awarded the silver star, two bronze stars, and and two purple hearts. Perhaps of all the people done dirty by Band of Brothers Dike was done the worst.
And went on to have a productive, adventurous postwar career, practicing international law and prospecting for uranium. While Winters had to get Nix's dad to hire him for a make-work job.
Awards lost their meaning for me after seeing Sr NCOs and Officers who seldom left the TOC much less the Green Zone awarded everything from ARCOMs to Silver Stars while the ones busting their azzes were lucky to get an AAM.
@Fireball-ky3sr 😂😂😂 if that ain't the truth. When I was downrange we had the commanding general of 4th ID at the time come down to personally talk to select Soldiers of different supporting Units. These Soldiers were selected due to their efforts and support of the mission, every single one of those soldiers busted their ass day in and day out no questions asked and performed to the highest standards. I was one of those Soldiers. I left theater with an AAM, and a Handshake, and the NCO's left with MSMs, except the one Corporal who got an Arcom. He was a corporal for 1 month, didn't deserve the promotion, and didn't do anything special. He was just friends with the Platoon Sergeant. So as to say I am not sitting at home enjoying my life not having to deal with that bullshit, and i make way more money now.
I dunno, they dumped all over Sobel, too. Yes, the men hated him but they all recognized later that without his training, many more of them would've been wounded or killed. The show was also pretty crappy to Blithe, saying he died during the war when in fact he survived and, after a few years away from the army, reenlisted and stayed in the service for the rest of his life, dying while on active duty in West Germany in 1967.
Yup. Much like Charles Lee, his story was told in the only way "patriotic historians" know: by villifying them in order to ensure somebody else is the hero.
I started watching the series again because of these videos. I'm glad they are on here to remind everyone that we had a generation that gave up everything for us all. But I can't wait to get to this part I don't remember it too well. One reason why I enjoyed this series is because my step grandpa was in the 506. I remember his funeral in the 80s and talk about military Honor's. It was a sight for sure for a young kid at the time.
Writings by Winters and Webster as well as others are critical of Peacock. Winters described him as a "by the book officer but no soldier". You may be confusing with Lt Shames who was discussed in the episode as someone possibly too abusive to be a candidate to replace Dike and kinda treated dismissively when he suggested promoting Bull left none of the Platoons under competent leadership. Exacerbated further in the character having one spoken line which was to hurl abuse at a soldier. Shames wasn't everyone's cup of tea but he was well regarded as a battlefield leader. Winters may have had reservations giving him Easy, but it's unlikely he thought there was a leadership problem in his platoon. There's also defenders of Dike and Sobel. Dike is a complex debate - he was commended for his actions on D-Day and had a successful post-Easy career and then in-between is this highly critical perspective by the men of Easy. Sobel had a long career in the military worthy of respect, just not as a combat commander.
Perhaps my memory is faulty (highly likely in fact) but I could swear that I read right after the series came out that one of the Easy vets thought they did Peacock wrong in the series. Stating that Peacock bravely pulled him to safety after he was shot. It’s been 20 something years and I’m trying to search for it.
They did say that about a few guys, but I don't remember it being about him. A few have come out later admitting they did Sobel dirty. While at the time everybody hated his guts for his intense training regime, they almost unanimously credit him for their survival, but nobody was willing to openly admit it. Sobel also did actually jump into the war and actually did somewhat decent. While he wasn't much as a leader, he was a good but harsh instructor. There was also an issue with the story about Albert Blythe. In the series it's claimed he died in 1948, but his son later revealed he didn't. He even continued on to serve in the Korean War and died somewhere in the '60's...
It was Lieutenant Dike that they did dirty. The show presented him as a coward which simply wasn’t true. The show presents Dike as being a poor leader having a panic attack during the assault on Foy. The truth that the show left out was that Dike was actually severely wounded which is why he couldn’t continue leading the men. In reality Dike was actually a hero. Months before the battle at Foy Dike received a medal for running out into an active battlefield to carry two wounded men to safety. He definitely deserved more respect than the show gave him.
They also did Lt Ed Shames dirty as well. He gets 5 seconds as the 'shouting officer who's seen too many war movies' in a scene very close to this one. Lt Ed Shames jumped on D-Day as 1st Sgt of I Company. He received a battlefield commission on June 14th and transferred to command Easy's 3rd Platoon. He was a strict and disciplined officer and his men would follow him anywhere. He and Popeye Wynn took out a German tank with a bazooka pretty much like how Welsh did it in the episode about Carentan. He despised Nixon and called him a 'hopeless fall down drunk'. His interviews are on RU-vid.
@@nandoman4769Dike wasn't done dirty, now you could say that the way the assault on Foy could have been presented more accurately, the men of easy simply stated that when he was needed in the day to day of the battle of the buldge he wasn't there. What he did prior to, or after his time as the C.O. of easy has any bearing on that reality. People all across the military have high and low points in their career. Winters set the record straight on how replacing him during the assault went down, he also set the record straight on Blithe. And not all of the men said that Sobels training saved them, SOME did. And jumping into Normandy and doing some good on the individual or squad level is completely different than being incapable of leading a whole company.
LMMAOFF , Nix with his Deadpan Humor ' was one of many great things about this series , guys like this would've made a horrific time go that much better !
My father was a pilot in Vietnam. They had a guy who was a danger to himself in the air and to others. They loved him but were worried. They sent him back to the states to fly with an esteemed display squadron. Though dangerous, Combat flying was very different than display and he is still alive today
So remembering the episode (and disregarding real-life discrepancies), Winters and Nixon were discussing Easy's leadership issues, stating Dike (disinterested), Shames (shouting), and Peacock (lack of leadership), with Compton being the only combat capable LT left. Presumably, Winters couldn't choose Dike (which would have let him promote Compton?), so it was a choice of Shames or Peacock, and Peacock was the best for Easy (ie, the weakest link)?
In hindsight, it would've been a lot better for Buck if Winters had picked him: the battle right after Peacock leaves is the one that breaks him. Of course, without Buck in that battle, and with Peacock instead, perhaps more men would've been wounded or killed. We never get to find out what would've happened had we made different choices.
I'm not comfortable with how the 'unpopular' guys in this book/series are panned. These are real people who served in a war and we are getting only one perspective . What do their children and grandchildren think!?
The Band of Brothers is a history book, it aims to show the reality and the opinions of the men who served, not glorify anyone. No one is perfect and they shouldn't be treated as such.
@DogKacique It is a series of memoirs rather than a solid historical narrative and has some major factual errors. For example, Dike is represented as having frozen in combat rather than having being shot at Foy. Blithe is said to have died shortly after the war rather than serving again in Korea and living until 1967 is another. If Ambrose had wanted to, both could have been corrected, but he was writing a collective memoir of the mens experiences and recollections rather than a strictly historical narrative. It is a good book and definitely has some historical value, but is not a fact checked historical narrative, but the recollections of men who were trying to recall things that happened 50 years previously. Unsurprisingly they didn't get everything correct and neither should they be expected to, but equally the book should be read with that in mind and not thought of as being as reliable as material that pulls information from contemporary records.
The third soldier who congratulates Peacock on leaving is Magneto from X-Men and the British guy from Inglorious Basterds. This actor takes every opportunity to kill nazis in film.
I don't recall hearing stories of Officers being that cool per my late great grandfather. (He was part of D-day Normandy US Army, either Utah or Omaha.)
- Remember they wanted me to go to R n R for a little , I decided to stay on mission till it was over. That helicopter that went to RnR got shot down ,, Chinook , 15 people over Fallujah 2003 .. was really about to get on to relax with my guy who was on QRF with me .. Rip Pfc Dagestino ☀️ Rip to all our bros n sis's . Could tell in this clip it meant alot to all them.. ✊♠️
