I think you underestimate Theodore Bruckners leadership debuff in combination with Griffon Lords, especially with Todbringer. This will easily break low leadership factions such as Skaven or Orks. The debuff combination may also crumble away demons.
Mainly because dwarfs have had nothing for a long time and finally get talked about and used in fine if they need the thunderbarge slightly in multiplayer but they need to leave it alone in campaign and they better not nerf it to the ground in multiplayer.
@@Amalvipls you can buy the DLCs individually. I can get the land ship without getting the rest of the Nurgle DLC. It's not that I don't want the Toad Dragon, it's just the Toad Dragon is on a roster I don't play as.
Dwarf units seem to be where I expected them to be. With the exception that I forgot that Garagrim existed and I assumed grudge rakers to replace trollhammer torpedos in function since those were reworked. On paper they have higher dps than chorf blunderbusses due to faster reload, but I guess they have different targeting or something. It could be that whatever makes chorf blunderbusses hit their own engaged units so easily makes them better at hitting the center of mass of their target, while dwarf targeting makes them aim higher or something like that.
Wow! Now this was a Total War: Warhammer 3 video on the Thrones of Decay DLC. As a gamer, I feel informed and refreshed. Many should watch this video and share in my experience
I really think ironsides were meant to be a repeater unit with higher burst than normal handgunners. CA removed the guns but haven't updated their stats to be a good normal handgunners.
@@AlmeneBerangerjust give them more range and DMG. They have more hp than chaos warriors per model so actually won't bleed models very fast and be great for heals.
They technically have more missile damage than handgunners. What kills them is that they have only 60 models versus the Handgunners 90 which means Handgunners have way more damage potential per volley.
@@darthplagueis13 Well if you calculate the damage: Ironsides do about 20% more damage than handgunners (yes even with 30 less). Missile damage of the units is identical (5 dmg and 17 AP). Ironsides just shoot nearly twice as fast without the standing still buff. 7 sec reload vs 13 sec. At the same time they are far more accurate even without the buff and are a bit more resistant to range fire.
I'd take this with a grain of salt given Human Boy is wrong about some of the basic stats he describes. They have the same range as handgunners and if they're doing less damage I'd wager the units actively bugged. I expect Grudgerakers are similarly being underestimated. Edit: I'd like to make a correction here, Nuln Ironsides are likely pretty poor for the price due to having only 60 entities rather than the 90 of normal handguns. I'd wager this is hold over from the repeater design but with the listed damage numbers and range 60 entities is likely to disappoint compared to handgunners by price (and handgunners aren't that great themselves). Open to being wrong here of course but this seems less far fetched on Human Boys part.
The thing for me though is that I think we should probably look at them at least a few months after the DLC is released because it seems that the gameplay that we are shown is very highly controlled by CA because I haven't seen any artillery at all except cannons for the Empire I think is kind of a bit weird as they are, if not, one of the most essential units in any empire army.
I agree with 90% of this, but as a 1.000+ hours player, I think I can put my two cents on this topic. 1- Thunderbarge is good but NOT that good compared to other S+ units. If we are talking only about this DLC, yes it is the best unit. If it's just an overall, I would put it mid tier A 2- Elspeth is a monster. Good magic, good feats and she has the most beautiful drake in game. Tier S hands down, her campaign if you manage to end the vampires fast, is the easiest campaign I've ever played on this game, manily because she alone is a monster with not so hard micro. 3- Hocland is top tier, but Nuln is not that bad. Hochland have the highest range , no dicussion here and slightly more damage (2 points), BUT, but, they are 24 dudes vs 45 from Nuln (which by the way have a passive that boost their acurracy in 40% and faster recharge rate) and, just in case the enemy manages to go throught your shooting units, Nuln can fight really well while Hochland will just vanish into oblivion really easy. It is true that if you hide in the trees Hochland, they will shoot while hidding which is why they are so strong, but still, a bit predictable. Yes you have longer range, yes you can shoot for free, but the higher the difficulty or the skill of the human foe, the easier to counter Hochland. Nuln at least have greater numbers and can sustain more damage when forced to go melee combat. You have to take those factors in consideration as well, and I think while they are not really good, they aren't that bad. Maybe the last tier B or the first tier C in my opinion. And as much as I love the Doomseekers , it's sad I can't say tehy belong to something higher than B
I wonder how ironsides will perform in optimal conditions. GBoG did some showcasing vs zombies, and the difference was clear, but the obvious question is how they're likely to perform in an actual fight.
Is Tyranidface the only special Tamurkhan legendary character you can use in pvp? I suppose that makes some sense, but its a shame the others are campaign only.
Because you get only 60 of them in a unit whilst Handgunners get 90. They actually deal more damage per shot, but it's not enough to compensate for Handgunners having 50% more models.
The thing with Doomseekers is, you kind of want them to fight chaff. At the beginning of the battle, anyways. Because they have to be in melee to charge their spin and they have to get kills to charge up their passive, but when you charge them straight into other elite infantry such as Hoemasters, they kind of just die within about 30 seconds whilst taking the enemy to half health. On paper, you arguably want them fighting zombies for two minutes before doing anything else.
Couldn’t you use epidimus with just stuff like Beasts of Nurgle and more high value demons with marauder support? Instead of just dropping a full line of plague bearers
Putting Grudge Rakers above Ironsides is actually insane. At least the Ironsides do their job, even if they have to be manually targeted to spread their shots properly. The Grudge Rakers are just actually broken against infantry and don't work. They put infantry into "knock down" state which as we know means no damage can be done, the resulting 0 damage Grudge Rakers do to infantry is embarrassing and isn't working right even after 5.0.3
The tier list pandering is a good first step, but I think we're really going to need some reaction faces on the thumbnail with Fortnite font to get to the next level.
The demon slayer not getting armor piercing feels weird, right? If he's supposed to grind up infantry shouldnt he be able to actually kill the actually threatening infantry? because using a lord to clear unarmored chaff and give a buff or two sucks imo :/
He's not even supposed to be a infantry killer. He has killed giants and dragons, and now hunts daemon. Literally the best kind of slayer besides Gotrek. He should be able to take on anything.
I think they just wanted him to be the character version of regular Slayers, so twim axes, anti-large, some missile block but not majority ap. Though from what I've heard, his ap is pretty good for a unit that isn't dedicated anti-armour.
I don't understand. Why are people talking about Ironsides having less damage output? are we playing different games? Ironsides delete handgunners. Were they buffed before launch?
Ya but they cost 950 while being almost as veurnable as normal handgunners so its not worth it most of the time it's the same reason sister of avelron are niche even tho there the strongest high elf archer
@darkomihajlovski3135 basically comes down to campaign vs multi here. Sisters being one of the greatest units in campaign. Ironsides appear to be very good in campaign from what I've seen. They probably don't offer as much in multi (rate of fire is already nearly double before thier ability kicks in)
You're so wrong about Ironsides. They have the black powder discipline skill which means they have higher accuracy and fire rate than handgunners which combined with their higher missile damage, amounts to greater damage output over multiple volleys than handgunners despite their lower model count. They also have the same range as handgunners, greater leadership, better melee stats and more ammo.
I haven't watched any of this vid yet, and I don't know the channel. But I've seen enough of Ironsides to say they are excellent compared to Handgunners in campaign, but I could see how they might be worse in multi, due to cost and depending on how often your disrupting rate of fire. Which, if undisturbed, is still putting out more damage than Handgunners larger entitie count.
The daemon slayer lord had anti large in all the other pre-release material I have seen. It would be ridiculous If CA made him a weak combat character. I mean th guy kills dragons and giants on the regular, why did they make him a suport lord...
Bruckner has an AOE leadership debuff that stacks with white cloak of Ulric and the griffon, so .... I think you can get up to -20 leadership with him and toddy. I think he's kickass.
How do you miss that Daemon Slayers have anti large? He said it multiple times. He also has magical attacks. I am no MP expert, nor do I disagree he might be bad, but the very fact he missed something that clear and obvious immediately makes me doubt the rest of the rankings.
Slayer pirates have a terrible stat line. Most of their cost comes from being unbreakable but without armour and no poor damage output, I just cannot see them ever getting their value back. All the weakness of a slayer none of the strengths
Balance does not magically disappear in campaign just because you can buff units. This argument is mindbogglingly stupid. If you can buff a low tier unit that is shit and also buff a high tier unit that is overpowered then the high tier unit is still overpowered. This update is packed with overpowered garbage. It is clear to me CA doesn't think people want a strategic challenge anymore they just want some overpowered shit that steamrolls everything else with zero effort. All hail Thunderbarge, all hail bullshit purplesun artillery, all hail crown of nemesis. In my not so humble opinion this is the worst update CA has ever done. It's completely broken and it contains stuff that doesn't make sense from neither a lore nor from a game design perspective yet people cheer them on blindly as if they did something good. We're lucky they abandoned WH2 before they ruined it as well.
I mean it’s single player, just don’t use the silly stuff? Ai is dumb as heck most of the time in battles. Multiplayer the balance matters way more as it against humans.
My point more was campaign is just fun and the ai are too dumb to really abuse anything you do. I run queek, a hero I name ska, a warlock engineer and 17 stormvermin to steam roll fools. Are stormvermin good? Fuck no but it doesn't matter because you and I are so much better than the ai. That was more my point
campaign is easy anyways. it still can be fun but it only ever felt challenging to me when i kinda trolled or went for additional objectives like a 0 defeat run
