Simple reason. The A-10C in DCS is one of the most complex modules from DCS due to its computer and all of those switches. Yes this flight stick will be a huge help since those switches and buttons SHOULD work as they would on a A-10, but I highly doubt Luke will spend the time over the course of days (or weeks if he's slow) learning how to fly the A-10 for this review. However I am agreement with you, I do think they should've tested the game the Joystick was made for, even at the cost of time.
For sure this module is complex, but not difficult. At least for me it wasn't. I managed to learn 80-90% of the checklists in a single rainy saturday ... Maybe I'm an "alien" :D
I'm jealous of you man.. I wish I could learn the A-10C as fast as you. But people do learn at different paces and I'm pretty sure it would've been a new experience for Luke since I don't think he's ever played a DCS module in like... ever
@@Dagoth_Ur_1 Yea. the primary trigger is a 2 stage. at around 40-50% depress you get trigger 1 and a full depress activates both buttons. Also there is no twist access on this stick.
2 stage trigger for either firing the laser for LGBs or stabilizing the plane. There's a reason it has it LTT. Using a flight sim stick for an arcade game just doesn't work out.
Have you seen the detailed cockpits of star citizen ships? They have warthog style joysticks in their ships. Honestly though who cares what they use it for, space sims are just as deserving of warthog greatness.
Why do you review a device designed specifically for flight simulators, DCS in particular, and then completely avoid any testing on one, especially considering you can get dcs:world for free with 2 planes? It's like reviewing a baseball bat by playing cricket.
Probably because even the free/easymode planes in DCS are way way way out of anyone at LTT's depth. They would probably have been flamed more for trying to cover it than by not doing it. And I actually think that was a perfectly good decision - there are many other reviews of this product in the more hardcore sim community.
@@Mythricia1988 sure, DCS is tricky for tech reviewers and journos who can't put time into it, but flying in a straight line with a roll or a turn at some point wouldn't exactly require a US Navy pilot to pull it off
I like how it doesn't look cheap and is made with quality, although I think I would prefer the thrusters to move quicker. As a side note, I'm glad LMG is reviewing H.O.T.A.S, especially now that Elite Dangerous has been released on steam. Hoping to see some more of this.
Don't get me wrong, I'm sure I'd have plenty of fun being better than simple Simon while flying my Origin 300i with a TM Warthog in Star Citizen but it would have been nice to see more than the mere mention of a flight sim in the review of a product purpose built for flight sims since people who are interested in the device are highly likely to want to know how it performs in its' natural habitat.
Jimmy Blonde I agree with that. When I see a Warthog HOTAS review, I expect to see some DCS on those screens. A heavy, deliberate trigger makes a lot more sense when you're only pulling it for a half-second in a three-hour play session. The thing's target audience, though, is already well aware of its existence and quality. They either have one, are saving up for one, or decided long ago that it wasn't worth it for them. I don't expect a lot of gamers to buy kit like this for Battlefield or ARMA.
They're definitely aware of its' reputation, maybe not so conversant with its' full functionality and the real advantages of owning one. I'd like to see another video exploring that.
This stick, the MFG pedals, a sturdy steel base to mount it all on, and a VR setup in Elite Dangerous was an absolutely phenomenal gaming experience. I had to make myself stop because it was eating up all my time.
Your review was pretty accurate, I was explaining it to a friend and it was almost word for word. This stick is awesome, previously running an x52 pro which was pretty damn good the Warthog blows it away. In VR I didn’t struggle to feel my way around the flip and toggle switches. I setup for pulling out the throttle to engage afterburner on the F-14 in DCS. It’s a little awkward and not native to the F-14 but something that gives dynamic to the gameplay. You’re absolutely right about the trigger, launching missiles is oddly satisfying compared to other Hotas. I’ve spent some time in military grade sim cockpits, short of having a pressure resistance stick this is about as close as you’re gunna get for your home. I would say it’s worth the money.
You can find much better options out there than just the Warthog now. Back when this review was released perhaps the Warthog is "as close as you're gonna get" as you called it, but nowadays you have companies VKB, Virpil or Winwing that make much better products with better technology. Mind you, the Warthog is still a good piece of kit, but now they're nowhere close to the top when it comes to HOTAS, especially for the current price.
***** And what about people who get motion sickness from wearing them? Or people who just don't want to wear headgear to use a computer? Pretty sure I'm not clueless, you're just being close-minded.
you don't want fast response in flight sims or even space sims, you want to learn your controls and get reliable response, flight tactics are all about being able to do the same thing over and over, twitch responses are rarely consistent, practiced responses are much more reliable.
I wonder if you guys are going to review the Thrustmaster T.16000M FCS HOTAS. It's going to cost around 130 USD and it's one of the very few mid-range HOTAS systems out there. Wondering if we should stick to the 60 dollar range with stuff like the T-Flight HOTAS X. Will putting down twice the money be worth it?
When is it coming out and is it expected to be able to switch for left handed use as well? I was looking at the T16000M but if this is coming out, I might just have to wait a little longer. I'm so excited for Star Citizen!!!
Jesse Reyes It is coming out early September, the 2nd according to some websites. It is essentially, from what I've read and seen, a updated T16000M plus a new throttle. Looking forward to it, too!
for the trigger, I take some clear tape and put it over the trigger, place my finger on the trigger, press halfway and them wrap the tape around the back. now it will be much shorter and quicker. simple tip for anyone who likes a short travel trigger. love the videos BTW!
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Fuck vessel. In one years time I wanna see how much you use it when you have to pay to watch reviews of shit that you will probably never get (let's be real here). I can watch it here 3 days later and save shit loads of money.
For those of you watching now, if you are eyeing the DCS F-16C, it should be noted the stick on the A-10C for which this was made was actually retrofitted from the 16 when the 10 was upgraded to the C model- some buttons do different things, but they are the same buttons, in the same stick. So, this is a replica of the 16C stick (minus the slight forward tilt, and with more movement) as well.
I own it and I use it for my flying in Prepar3D, love it! Feels solid, had a Thrustmaster Hotas Cougar before and the Warthog is a drewm to fly with, so solid and precise.
I have always been a major proponent of the ergonomic corner desk, when I was young I always wanted a battle station or cockpit, so I set up a corner desk inside of a large utility closet and the sound was great inside there, I just got tired of using my closet space for a desk. This was long before any of us had anything like battles stations, or cockpits in our homes. A corner desk gives you a more ergonomic pocket that you can customize, put a large curved monitor in the corner, using the vesa mounting option at eye level, it's a good foundation for a corner cockpit. Plus you can actually use it as a desk. Then you can use a HOTAS on top, or whatever you like and it will feel better.
I agree with "The Stowaway" and I absolutely love DCS World (not steam edition but rather Open Beta). I use this HOTAS for every jet and module I own in DCS. It's such a beast and once I pair it with the proper rudder pedals I will be so happy. I'm holding off on setting up a profile for ED just yet because omg the amount of bindings lol. It's the beastiest beast of a HOTAS I've ever used! (I'm also a disabled prior USAF Special Operations veteran so this HOTAS was already on my mind when I was looking for one to purchase for myself !! :) )
@@inscrutablewut Only takes a few minutes. The game literally has an easy start button for lazy people. But I don't come to Linus for quality reviews. They are shills for whichever sponsor is paying that day.
@@inscrutablewut the A-10 is complex when you actually intend to fly it properly and thoroughly, when it comes to JUST flying, the SAS pretty much balances out even an untrimmed bird
Fábio he stated this... Several times.. He said it wasn't really meant for hair trigger games and it was more for simulation and "real feeling" stuff. That being said, there's nothing wrong with using it for Star Citizen and ED. I'm an avid FSX, P3D, and DCS enthusiast and I can still say that when SC comes out, this will definitely be my HOTAS of choice.
Guys, It is everything nice but it looks like you just forgot the most important thing. HOTAS Warthog was specially made for A-10C addon for DCS:World.
Yes im late to the party but i just got one - the quality is truly top notch! I used to have a Saitex X52 Pro but never like the stick's limp tension. The Warthog stick has great tension, tight, weighted and robust. The price has went up to $500 due to demand exceeding supply but its totally worth it. I no longer have "game peripherals" on my desk, i have military grade aviation components .
IL-2 Sturmovik Battle of Stalingrad, and the extension Battle of Moscow. Also known as IL-2 BOS and IL-2 BOM are now 64bit and are great. You must also get a trackIR5 for head tracking in the cockpit.
Agreed other than I'd say skip the TrackIR - I used mine exactly 3 times and the effect it added was very marginal. While I know the cost is much higher if you want more immersion than monitor(s) VR is the way to go. Warthog + VR + Elite Dangerous = you are flying in space.
If you are serious about flight sims trackir is invaluable, anyone into combat flight simulations will tell you the same. If you didn't use it more than 3 times I honestly don't think you even gave it a fair chance. While VR is cool and all the readability of gagues etc in sims like DCS still isn't good enough due to the fairly low display resolutions of the current VR headsets, untill that improves TrackIR is still the way to go.
The main thing missed here is how good flying the DCS A-10C is in this thing. The entire HOTAS system is completely accurate to THAT aircraft, so if you are a fan of high fidelity sims, you cannot go wrong with the DCS A-10C. Strap on an Oculus and set your PC up to minmise judder, and being able to feel our way around this HOTAS system is one of the best experiences in flight simming. The big BUT is that I do mean *simming*. Its a hardcore product, both the A-10C and this stick. If you are the kind of person that loves study sims and has the patience to figure them out (Arma 3 A-10 yank and bankers will hate it), then sitting down, running a startup routine super quick, taxiing to a runway and applying full throttle with a great many of the actual physical controls available, then its an experience that is unmatched.
You forgot one important thing. You need to buy rudder pedals, as it doesn't have twist. I know many Elite Dangerous players who have to use a switch for Yaw which is kinda garbage.
Yaw in ED is not exactly the most important thing, especially on heavier ships. And if you really cant live with yaw on HAT switch, then go buy pedals, if you have money for Warthog, you definitely can afford pedals too. Meanwhile the Warthog stick without yaw axis is much more precise than any yawing stick ever will be simply because you cant input wrong movement by operating 3 axies with one hand.
Ok you've made a few points. First yes yaw does matter and I fly all ships of all mass categories. It especially matters in interdictions. Second my opening point is still sailiant as all other sticks even half the warthogs price are twist. People assume the warthog is also twist. I definatly did until one of my buddies mentioned it didn't. The T.16000m has the exact same sensor and twist as the warthog so I'd like to see a comparison to see, if your theory is correct. I do agree about the if you buy a warthog you should afford petals but again Luke should have mentioned this. It's a legit discussion to have and he shortchanged the audience.
***** yes its a legit problem with the review im with you on that one. as for the theory, it is physically impossible for human to not to input movement on X and Y axis on a stick when manipulating Z twist axis. You can get used to it, you can mitigate it but the physical fact is that Z axis will always introduce "noise" movement on main two axies. The reason that Hog doesnt have the Y axis is most probably exactly that reasoning and the fact its targeted at enthusiast buyers that are expected to have rudder pedals. And i too shared the "why the hell it doesnt have twist" thinking for a while, but more info i looked up on the Hog more i slotted into "it actually makes sense" mentality ... so today i ordered mine after 4 months of "should i, should i not" ... xD and i do not have pedals yet btw, those are on my buylist for next month (probably TM or Saitek cheap ones before i commit to something more expensive like MFG Crosswind or Slaw Device which are both on order pay up front handcrafted builds :) )
Asghaad I'm by no means suggesting it should have twist, though a premium stick from TM should exist with twist and the new FCS system isn't quite that. Also the warthog is the official A-10 stick, and the A-10 doesn't twist. I was simply saying a test between the T.16000 and the WH would be interesting to see how much effect there is. For now I'm buying the new FCS stick.
***** well i was also thinking about buying the T.16000M FCS instead but i decided that if im going to spend money on HOTAS i will go all the way and buy Warthog, get used to it for a month then buy pedals for it :) and considering that im going to plug it in my 3000+ EUR computer rig (including monitor and other peripherals ) i think holding back to buy mid-low range HOTAS wouldnt be my style xD yeah i know im crazy when it comes to my beloved PC xD
To review this and not show it with DCS A10c is a waste of time! And the trigger is so heavy and has such a long travel distance because it is two position, no mention of that here!!! In the A10c, the first position steadies the aircraft on target and the second position fires the cannon. As for the included software, I've never used it. Connect this to your computer, start up DCS A10c and all buttons are automatically assigned to exactly what they have to do So, basically, this HOTAS and Throttle was built for DCS. Yes you can use it for other games, but unless you have DCS, its wasted on everything else.
He literally talked out of his ass when he said "the software is a nightmare when binding buttons". It was built for DCS you fkn dweeb. I have literally seen this hotas in action from a friend of mine, plugged it right it, loaded up free flight in the a-10, everything functioned.
Also, the A-10C is not a 'fighter jet.' It is an attack aircraft, specifically, used for CAS. (close air support, keeping the bullet sponges known as the Army and Marines safe)
wobbly868 Woooo? Really? Did you hear that from Discovery? The only real qualities it had were its range and high maximum speeds. The rest of success was formed by the tactics where the P51 attacked germans from above, who in their turn had to deal with the bombers. In case of Bf109 - they had additional cannons on the wings which restricted their speed and maneuverability. In a straight combat fighter vs fighter it's not so good. Now if we talk La-7... There was a scenario when two P51 attacked two La-7 by surprise mistakening them for FW190. The first La-7 was taken down easily, but the second one shot down both P51's. Now if we talk British Hawker Tempests... Well it's good you guys didn't have to fight those :p
My brother has this and your video doesn't represent the quality of it. Somehow it just does not look as high quality as it actually is. You should also have included some clicking sounds to show how stiff everything is.
Yes it leave us all wondering now what we didn't see that could possibly make this even better. Would be unfortunate to watch linustechtips videos with two grains of salt instead of just one :P If we see more such comments I mean.
K3V0M I do know what you mean. In the flesh the thing does look better than in the video, you can see that its painted metal whereas the video seems to add a plasticky effect. Definitely one to look at for real.
I bought this right when it came out, and ever since it has never let me down. No part failed, or showed any weakness in construction, and even it it did, you could take it apart and exchange the faulty part. This is the last HOTAS you will ever buy. I've had the REALLY old Saitek 32, the blue one after it, and then this beast, and considering it's build quality, this could sell at the double price, and still be worth it!
My X-45 (the blue ancestor to the 32 that you mentioned!) just died today, and I've spent the day agonizing over what to replace it with. I'm stuck between X-56 as a stop-gap, this Warthog as a high-ish-end plug and play option, or go buck wild with like a custom setup using a VKB flight stick, rudder pedals, and like a Warthog standalone throttle.... Really makes you wish you could actually test any of these products before buying to see if it fits your desires eh. Anyway. How would you describe the flight stick motion compared to the X-32 or X-45? Both of those old sticks use the frankly awful single spring, causing a massive central bump and this weird sensation that once you've moved the stick in one direction, it no longer has any resistance going a new direction... Since the spring is already compressed by the first motion. Does the Warthog have "disconnected" axes, so to speak? If you move it up or down fully, does is still have the expected amount of resistance going left and right? And vice versa... And does it have a "bump" when you pass by the center? Would love to know since you have experienced the X-45, as I have! Should be able to relate.
Well it does have a noticeable Zero-spot, but i guess due to it's weight, the bump going over it does not feel too bad. That zero-spot is ever so small, that even with the slightest deviation from the axis you won't notice it all. In fact, i just took it to check your question, and i had to move it 5 times to hit the axis right to feel it. During flight i doubt you will hit the spot. I have taken this joystick apart a few times, because the mechanism behind it allows something cool: You can adjust the tension of the spring. It has 2 springs, one below and a big one on top. If you change that, you can bring down the tension by about 70%! Because i mostly fly helicopters, i am not a huge fan of high tension joysticks, makes hovering to much harder, but with my helicopter setup, you can kill that zero-spot off completely, no bump whatsoever.
Holger Heinrich That sounds really great, thanks a lot for the feedback and that tip - even though I mostly fly DCS jets, I'm not a fan of high tension either, I prefer a stick that just kind of barely self-centers, and it sounds like I can make it pretty much however I want with some tinkering. Great stuff! I've also seen some more significant hardware mods being developed as kits for this stick, and heck even some stick bases that is compatible with the Warthog stick... So it seems no matter what I do, this will stay relevant for a long time. I think you just sold a Warthog, Thrustmaster owes you a share :D Thanks again for the feedback!
I got this kit when it was on sale at Micro Center for $300 so I could play some Elite: Dangerous. It is everything Luke said it is. You'll never get me to go back to my old Microsoft Sidewinder joystick after using this HOTAS kit. Recommended.
The software does provide a lot of control, though. Keys can be set to toggle between different key presses and and can change their purpose based on a long button press or quick button press. It comes with its own simple programing language for key control. Basically, it's an advanced system that requires a good deal of learning to use, but it gives the user an insane amount of control regarding how the buttons work.
the first time i heard a youtuber pronounce warthog correct, it is wart hog, not war thog, like most yourubers pronounce it, thank you for pronouncing it the right way
One thing that wasn't mentioned is that one of the reasons for the long travel on the trigger is that it's actually two buttons. There is a click about a quarter to a third of the way along the travel and another when it's all the way in. This can be bound in most games to two separate functions. Obviously, if the travel was really short, you'd be activating both functions by accident so the long travel is there so you don't accidentally activate the second trigger by mistake. There is also an adjustable screw that allows you to adjust the travel on the pinky trigger so it can be as long or as short as you like so that one can be a hair trigger if you prefer. There are also lift points on the throttle so you can slide the throttle past 0 into an idle position (which contains a programmable button if you wanted it to, for example, disable the engine). There is also the same at the top end, beyond the 100% that also contains a button for afterburner/turbo/overdrive functionality.
I've had mine since it's inception and love the metal/quality feel of the stick in particular. A former F-18 pilot, I find the throttle to stiff in comparison the the '18's in any but it's lowest friction setting. I like the stick but would like the adapter for a true fighter, between the knees feeling. There is one available as I understand it.
Decided on the CH HOTAS instead though I must admit I liked the idea of the quality of the Warthog. CH Manager software (though ancient looking) is rock solid.
The reason it has a long trigger is because it is a two stage trigger like the real A-10. First stage on the A-10 stabilizes the plane for strafing runs with the gun then second stage is the actual trigger.
This is the first time that something I bought in Europe was cheaper in North America. I bought my HOTAS Warthog three years ago for 300 euros, which is 410 Canadian Dollars. As for the unit, it's amazing, especially if you are going to use it for the DCS A-10C. With the DCS A-10C, it's a plug and play device, so no configuration needed. I use it for other sims, such as Elite Dangerous, other DCS modules, Flight Simulator X and X-Plane. If you're looking for realism, this is where it's at. Also, if you learn to properly use this thing, you'll have an advantage over most other simmers in combat situations, because you have the precision of the stick which is unmatched.
It doesn't have short travel on the trigger, It instantly shoots. When you pull it all the way back it's a secondary button. If you gently squeeze you can fire primary weapon then secondary with full pull. Or whatever you can binid it to with being creative.
Forgot to mention that the stick can be replaced and customized with the F-16 stick. Looking forward to ordering mine. I have been waiting to get this setup for almost 15 years!! :-D
What I want to know is why we are using plane-styled thrust for space games - play some Space Engineers and get used to the way that turning the way you're facing DOES NOT equal moving in that direction, it just feels like that's the way it should be...
Surprised that Luke didn't mention it, but it's important to note that the Warthog stick doesn't have a twist axis and that if you want that extra control, you'll need to fork out for some rudder pedals. Not a dealbreaker by any means, just important to note, especially for space sims where you need all the axes you can get.
I love the design so much, the Throttle being a little slow even with low friction is a little of a turn off as I definitely cut throttle for a bunch of maneuvers and could see myself forcing it. That said having dual engine control is amazing and the amount of potential keybinds is exactly what i'm after. Overall think I will aim to save for this and live with the throttle being relatively sluggish.
You know why the trigger is so slow that’s because in the a-10 if you are flying direct to your target but are not in range you can already push the trigger to a certain point because it’s a 2 stage trigger and when your in range and lined up with your gun the only thing you have to do is push it a little bit further and bam enemy dead
A few players I know use this in Elite Dangerous. I play it in VR (which is simply amazing) and I have the Thrustmaster T16000m flight stick, but for throttle and other flight controls, I went with a razer tartarus chroma. has all the buttons I need to play Elite in VR with everything reachable without moving the hand off the rest.
Owned the Warthog A10C stick for a year or two, and its like new still. One switch is starting to wear a little bit, but its because i use it constantly. Its a Simulator Stick, not to be 1337 in games, although the added weight and stiffness to the stick is superior for precise movement, it is hard to make twitch movements and fast arcady gameplay, I wouldnt use this in warthunder or any arcady type of game. You need a game where physics and weight is modelled. I mostly play Elite with it today, sometimes DCS. But in Elite, its fantastic. I would only recommend it, if you are a sim player.
I wish Luke had made note that it's the best software on the market that comes from a manufacturer. It may not be great, but it is the best when looking at all the options. I own this thing and it is beyond fantastic.
I got this stick only from Microcenter open box for $145. It is absolutely bad ass. I was originally gonna go with a CH Fighter stick and only got this to resale, but this thing feels so good I had to keep it. It is a little tough to move, actually tough isn't the right word. It is smooth and 'tight', but it doesn't really fatigue me. I've only played Elite with it so far though.
Immersion is the main reason I play video games :-) I may never drive a Ferrari in real life, but with the right peripherals I'll come real close haha. And that's good enough for me.
I wish there was a joystick between the warthog and the rest. I like the warthog quality, accuracy and deadzone. Wish it also had a more modern video game button layout/quantity, a console tumbstick, and torso twist. And of course for half the price :p
If you're in the price range for this, you should definitely consider stuff like VKB sticks or Virpil. You can get extenders that make the stick a lot taller and give you even more control. And I don't recommend the throttle at all -- it's a lot of specialized switches for the A10C, many are "permanent" so don't act as on/off buttons, and if you're flying in VR, they're hard to use. A CH throttle isn't anywhere near as cool, but it's way more functional.
Also the software might seem clunky but the ability to write custom scripts (which the Saitek sticks don't have) gives it almost unlimited possibilities. It's designed more like an engineering software than a driver for a game controller
Thrustmaster makes some really high quality racing wheels, but i had no idea that they made flight sticks as well. Perhaps one day this bad boy will sit next to my T300 RS.
It is mostly plug and play even with the DCS A-10C flight sim. The software works fine but will take time to learn to fully enjoy its depth and capability.
