I agree to that but my comment was more about the difference in handling power between someone used to standard cars and those accustomed to more hp in their everyday vehicles. I get where you're coming from i just dont feel its relevant to what I meant.
@@MSAutoSnapMeans f all about ability or natural skill though. If it's about experience a lot of older people have been on the road for a long time yet still can't drive for manure. Just saying...
Certainly! It's really nuts timelessly. But this is not as fast as your run of the mill vette nowadays. It's so weird where priorities land year to year.
@@ryelor123 It was made by a few blokes in Blackpool building cars out of fibreglass with no ABS or traction control, what did you expect? 🤦♂️ But, you know that does remind me of a few other cars like the Dodge Viper, the Chevrolet Corvette… but at least those had small engines. Oh wait. 🧐🧐🧐 Americans…
It’s funny, this car was available to drive in Gran Turismo 2 and it was completely undriveable in the game as well. Even with suspension tuning, full downforce and the longest gear ratios and final drive the game would take, it would like the tires in 5th gear. I learned so much from trying to fix this car in the game, I was able to jump in and use an alignment rack when I started working on cars in real life.
@@terrarium12 so why didn’t they just capitalize on the market then? makes no sense the viper was still sold and it’s considered a widow maker because it’s to crazy. this wouldn’t be to far off. Just develop it with traction control and sell it to individuals with proper training or retired and new racers they have money and skill
Looking at today´s hypercar market, I can´t help but feel TVR had absolute gold in their hands with the Speed 12. While they were absolutely right that it was far too dangerous, especially without modern safety features, they would have been ahead of Bugatti by almost a decade.
They screwed up big time and drove the whole brand into the ground with cost cutting cheap materials on the speed six that this car was based on. They used cast engine internals and sub- recycled soda can alloy pistons that would break every 20-30k Miles with minimally spirited driving. I'm sure they went all out for these prototypes, as they did for the 6.
Nope, nope, nope. TVR could never achieve that. They built "track ready" cars not hypercars. Look at the frames under the Cerberas, look at the crude aero, look at the hardware on hand. The would never have geared it to be a high top speed car. It would have killed anyone who tried to pass 150 mph in it. They should have stuck with what they knew well. 1050-1200 kg, 350-500 hp thrill rides. This thing only helped their downfall. That could have been a happy niche for them a'la Donkervoort, or KTM automotive. I think the owner let his feelings get the better of him and he threw common sense out the window. It's a damn shame. I think the Sagaris was their winning formula, a car that will impress with performance even today.
Some people don't know how much safer modern vehicles are. Porsche 930 (Which is a 911 made between `74 and `89) had 282HP and it was nicknamed "The Widowmaker" because people were crashing them. 282hp on 1350kg is a lot! Imagine 1000hp on 1000kg. This is an insane amount of power for a 90s vehicle. Nowadays kiddos jump in 500-700hp cars, they punch the pedal and they get home safe and sound because modern cars have many safety features.
I can imagine if an untrained driver just pushed the gas on this thing a little too hard you'd spin out and crash at 100 mph immediately. RWDs are already the most dangerous drivetrain, especially one that weighs nearly nothing and puts out the power of a small airplane. they had seatbelts and airbags back then but they didn't often have stability control, collision detection cameras/auto braking, etc
@perkypears well, kinda. He'll crash, but not at 100mph. It's probably going to be at around 30-50mph. I don't know about which car you're speaking, but a small airplane has around 100-350hp so if you're talking about the Porsche, you're right. More than 350hp it's not going to be a small airplane (excluding those very few examples of modified small planes) Regarding the difficulty in drivetrains, I'd say that the motorcycle drivetrains are more difficult. The RWD is difficult, but it has two wheels moving and two additional keeping the car in place :D Of course, in practice, keeping a bike in place is easy when the rider has brains.
This generation is a widowmaker because of the turbo, which had so much lag that when it kicked in, it surprised drivers who were not prepared for such a long delay in the turbo's operation. TVR is a different story - the car had no power assists and operated only on the driver's skills, which, as we know, can vary.
A 1000hp from a Naturally Aspirated 7.7l, V12 sounds pretty Insane for a car developed in the 90's and giving it such power to weight ratio, no wonder!!😳
Oh they could do some insane things with cars. But at some point its like we really gonna hand over cars that can do over 250mph to the public freely? It was the Viper basically that never came. If they built the car now they might have more luck with safety and aerodynamics for driver safety..
@@unkindled6410no it was NA. The cerbera 3.5 V8 made 350hp NA. They were doing proper super cars long before ferarri etc who just lobbed turbo's in everything going into the 80's.
My posted comment before reading yours. "Only advanced pro's could ever think of selecting and then managing to drive this beast on #GranTurismo for #PS2." ;]
@TranceFur That's like saying firearms manufacturers are somewhat responsible for the shootings that happen. It's not on their conscience. We have free will. If someone chooses to be a dick, then that's on them. Not the manufacturer. I imagine he simply didn't see the point in making a car that the majority of owners would crash within the first week. Even though it's not a waste of the companies money, as they wouldn't be paying out, it makes sense that he figured it'd be best not to put it into production. If the power isn't really usable, then it's kind of a waste. So I think it's got less to do with him not wanting it on his conscience, and more to do with simply knowing that the power and torque were too great, and not user friendly. Pointless having such a beast if even on a track you can't really go past 1/3 throttle without spinning. Although there are definitely drivers out there that could peddle it and would enjoy the difficulty.
Oh, christ. Is there something that is not a human rights violation or some conspiracy? It was impossible to keep that thing on the road with early 90s technology. This was built on a shoestring budget. Much like the Viper and look how that thing wrapped itself around every tree and telephone pole in the US just for touching the gas on cold tyres. And that had less than HALF the power.
Do you know or realize how big of a power 1hp/kg is? And how little safety features it had? Thats insane power for a car this raw in terms of safety. In the track? Buy and go use it, no one will care if owner dies. But most of the buyers would try to use this beast in streets which would result same or even worse than notorious crowd eating mustangs.
Good heart or not it wasnt his place to decide whats best for people. Couldve still produced it and just made it a track only car or smth. If someone cant handle a vehicle thats theyre own fault
@TheSmallmoney id sleep no worse than i normally sleep. Its not a companies fault that someone used their product innapropiately, dangerously or recklessly
Actually it is. Case closed. He's a good man so as he practices. Bugatti is more money driven that is their God. But this mans God must be Jesus Christ considering he didn't allow people to literal kill themselves. @@ThePhantomGodofNight
I have seen the car in person and it is breathtaking. An all time favourite for sure...it's a shame they couldn't have de-tuned it to be 'slightly' safer as I would have loved to have seen and heard these on the road.
Hands down one of the most beautiful/magnificent vehicles ever created. Too bad it didn't get more recognition. The segaris is also an amazing looking vehicle
I remember the tvr was one of my favourites in project Gotham racing. It was a great concept. I respect the engineers for scrapping the project and saving lives. The car was uncontrollable in the video game. Couldn’t image driving one in real life.
I had a Guinness world records book in gradeschool in the early 2000's and this was the fastest production car in the world. There were photos of this car and I would marvel at them as a child. It's so cool to see this again here.
TVR always had manufacturing, reliability and budget issues. I dont believe for one second that it was cancelled because it was "too dangerous", unless they were talking concerns about bits falling off it 😆
I think that’s part of the ethics, tbf. Ie: If you’re Peter Wheeler, you know the kind of reputation your cars have, is it really wise to double down on that? 😅 Knowing that you can’t reach the same standards of a Formula One team.
If they had gotten bought out by some automotive giant to be their new sports/race car division, they definitely would have been able to work out the reliability problems. It's like when Lancia races, they don't use the same budget parts & construction when they stick a driver they expect to cross the checker flags in their car, just the customer.
It would be right at home with today's hypercars!!! I wish someone would duplicate this "British Viper"!!! .....so much power in a 'miata' ..... the real widow-maker😅..... dammit Wheeler! Maybe SSC (VENOM) could do it
I was hoping to find this comment as I think he done a very nobel thing. He could have just gone for the money but instead thought about the potential carnage such a machine would have caused on the open road.
This was my go to car on forza whenever I'd race friends or family. One time my cousin was im picking the Bugatti you'll never beat me and I just like ok and proceeded to smoke him at Lemans lol.
Except he didn’t, basically every car TVR made was dangerous, as dangerous as a dodge viper basically, that’s every car they made not just 1 model, this was just too far.
That's why around that time they started mounting spoilers to the chassis frame, not the body panels like ontop of the trunk. Instead, *THRU* the trunk.
@@Racing_Foxbring any piece of crap car from Europe to America and see it get dusted by your average modified car on the highway. America by far has the best car culture, anything and everything anyone wants is right here and it's cheap and plentiful so cmon, euro trash weakling.
or in otherwords wanted to avoid lawsuits when some asshat totals his car because they could not handle it, i don't blame him tbh maybe should of made them sign a waver
How much torque? Likely a wide enough band to make street driving with WIDE ratio 5 or 6speed a hand full for most. 12 spd was not used in a Dodge Daytona, rest is history & mere One-upmanship...
The owner of TVR didn’t want the deaths on his conscience… He felt sure the Speed 12 would kill people, it was so raw. It would have been incredible converted to 4WD.
The owner of the company remembered he’s British and is on the decline. Hence the last minute decision to abandon glory. That car would have been a death trap like most of the super cars of that era. Difference is, those cars were actually made. In all seriousness, I’m sure this official story from TVR is just a coverup because in reality there’s no way that little outfit was gonna be able to produce dozens of those Cerbera Speed 12s. Way more complex than the cars they’ve been churning out at that point.
I'd imagine the truth is somewhere inbetween. A complex build with plenty of potential gremlins and it was like a kamikazi fighter with 4 wheels. Still a shame it never went into production properly, what a weapon.
I saw this circa 2010 at the nec Birmingham with new owners and they were putting a Mercedes engine in it. I had a good conversation with it's the owner. I also saw it for sale on ebay and I one of the pictures it was setting a speed camera off in the picture. I'm also sure it was supposed to have 880 hp. Amazing dream car
In grand tourismo game I couldn't keep it in the track, I remember how the rpm would fly to 9k sounding deep and it would just slide all over the place lol core memory right there
It was actually being developed for the GT1 race group. . But changing regulations and the fact that it was incapable of being a safe road vehicle killed it off. However it was used in the British GT championship a few times. They built 3
The McLaren F1 is a very tame, calm, and composed driving car. Even when you floor it, and drive it to its limits. So there was no way the Speed-12 would ever have matched it in any way, shape, or form. THATS why they cancelled its production. It was a P.O.S.
Honestly, you gotta respect the CEO for putting hit foot down and saying no. At a certain point, risking lives for profit just doesn’t sit right with some people.
2.9 0-60 while also having the weight of a Harley road glide would’ve taken so many lives. Thankfully the owner was smart enough to stop it before it did
Regular tvr's were considered hard to drive Widowmakers at the time. so it says a lot that this is the car that made the owner of the company grow self preservation.
