Agree on all of it, and will add that engines make heat as a byproduct of doing work. So, once your cold engine has had oil pressure for long enough to be circulated throughout, put it (gently!) to work! And continue working it gently until it's closer to normal operating temperature.
I'm NOT a mechanic but I did buy my first Cat in 1984. When I change my fuel filters I change my primary run the truck, then change the secondary to avoid getting too much air in the system. If they're both changed at the same time that's when I've had issues getteing her started. Happy New Year.
Brother if your check valve right by your primary filter housing is bad that what happens but if it’s working right you shouldn’t have problems changing them both at the same time
There was a Cat training video back in the day that showed how oil fills gaps between moving parts at low idle vs elevated. It was showing how increasing the RPM pulls oil into these spaces creating a thicker cushion so to speak. Does your training dept still show those old videos on liner cavitation and whatnot?
For cold starts during below freezing temperatures, once I have the engine running, and oil pressure is achieved, I then bump the idle to no more than 800 rpm, then I monitor the oil temperature. Once the oil temperature is past 120, I’ll start driving it, but using minimal power and gradually increase the power as the temperature rises to operating temp.
Nooo… don’t raise the rpm at 10 degrees. Don’t want to starve the bearings, due to cavitation. Wait until the coolant temp begins to raise ,then idle up. Once it reaches 130 degrees, then drive away nice n easy. Keep the rpm’s under 1500, until coolant temp gets close to 180 degrees. I’ve seen Cummins techs come out, start a cold engine ( 30 degrees) and just pin the throttle to the floor. It’s not their engine, so they don’t give a shit.
Lubrication depends on the oil and the temp of the oil. Once the oil pressure is up if the oil and metal temp (for an engine that has no extra heat left in it) is above the lower oil rated temp you have good protection. The engine MATERIALS still need to warm up, so yeah no revving wildly, take it easy but KNOW you have proper lubrication. What temps? 0W -40C/F 5W -30C/-20F 10W -18C/0F 15W -9C/15F
Automotive industry has a major problem with extended service intervals now. Falls along with rule #3- way too many problems could be hidden during that 10k mile oil change span. Especially with these DI engines that love fuel dilution….
Happy New Year! Great video like usual. The whole idling deal, i follow what my cat dealer guys told me, if its below 20 degrees, start and idle for about 3 to 5 mins, then bring it up to 1000 to 1200 rpm
On my 2018 Pete 567 with the Cummins X15, when I change my fuel filters, I install both new ones empty. I then just cycle the key several times which runs the electric lift pump that pumps fuel from the tank. It will fill both fuel filters (the sound changes and you can tell when they're full). I then start the truck and it runs normally. Easy.
Happy New Year Josh. Best Wishes. Thank you for the dedicated DOTW. Your humor is spot on. Made me laugh. Perfect ones to start the year. Looking forward to sending more this coming year. I learned more from you how diesel engine work with temperature. The components affected. Cheers Josh. Thank you for the channel. Lots of new knowledge all the time. 👍💪👊🎉
Believe me man, we have a fleet of shredding, roll off, front load, & rear load garbage trucks (mostly px7/9 or x15) & the idle dpf clogging is real. You can actually tell when trucks run on city vs suburban routes so we try to rotate the fleet throughout the week to spread out the highway miles vs downtown alley hopping.
You could also be like us & 'forget' to PM a 938m loader than feeds a recycling MRU for 5000 hours straight if you want a fun time. Literally no greasing, oil, or filters - for 5000 hours Shop manager claims unit 'wasn't in the PM tracking system' that site plant mechanic said 'hey I never got assigned to PM it'....
@@24allixThat kinda falls on the person operating it too because he should be greasing it at least once a day too. And when the operator does their daily inspections the hours should be written on the filters and when they're checking things over should notice things like that.
Hi Josh on the subject of warming up on cold start I have to say even though mostly same rules apply to most diesel engines how ever there are some differences in technicalities even between same manufacture engine models for instance c7 and c15 are different in cold start up settings for example c7 as soon as starts rpm jumps up for while and that’s because displacement is not quite enough to make a proper heat on compression stroke when cylinder walls and pistons are cold , on the opposite side c15 ideals on 500 rpm right after cold start and it depends on how cold ambient temperature is it might take up to couple of minutes to jump up to normal ideal speed which normally is 6.75 to 700 rpm and per caterpillars themselves you don’t have to warm your engine up as long as you have proper oil pressure and they recommend that you should drive in low RPMs if you have to move right away however, with all due respect to everybody’s opinion, I owned, drove and worked on my own since 1984 and I can tell you there are many reasons that I personally warm up my big cats at least to 130° before I roll and one of them reasons are oil pressure is too high most of my trucks are at 80 psi Even at 40° ambient at a start up and I don’t like to cause oil leaks the second most important reason is cylinder liners and Pistons are obviously made out of different materials and for sure they don’t warm up at the same rate neither do they expand at the same rate so you see what I’m getting at. and that’s why cat setting it self starts up at low rpm then jumps up And lastly, about Westgate of Turbo, I have to disagree with some of your input. I think they are totally horseshit, and everybody who has single turbo cat should either change it to non waste gated turbo or pinch that stupid hose, for it causes more disadvantage, than advantage if any,like it derates Turbo boost, raises, EGT greatly,causes bad fuel mileage, and I can keep on going, after all it sets to open after 25 psi (really 🤨😒)and I think the only advantage it would have to lower the back pressure of the exhaust manifold, which that has never been a problem with GarrettTurbo or OE cat equipped turbo which is 1.42 AR at its hot side which That means,is big enough even without wast gate To flow all the exhaust gas through out the turbine housing without creating back pressure so in reality, there are no advantages to have that damn waste gate it’s almost like having a very bad leak from air to air 😅however you should definitely have a pyrometer gauge to monitor your EGT and not to let your boost go up excessively which is over 38 pounds except accert twin turbo
Great advice. On my ISX-15 they tell you to install the fuel filters dry and switch the ignition on and off about 5 times then lift pump fills the filters. It still starts rough but once started and run for a few then shut it off and check for leaks. Then it starts fine. Happy New Year
Who's "they"? If you're using Cummins recommended fleet gaurd fuel filters, they come with a plug in the center for a reason. Pre fill through the outer holes.
On a Detroit, 60 series, I would install the fuel filters dry, then put around 12 pounds of air pressure in the fuel tank and mine had a bleed screw open it just a bit and wait for the fuel to come out. Tighten the screw. Start engine, it would usually start right off and run at about 1000 RPM and it would be just fine. Detroit even recommends to NOT use the electric fuel pump to prime the fuel system.
before the plug it was recommended by cummins to install dry and use primer pump to fill, and its much easier than spilling fuel everywhere especially if your using the extended life engine filter, just bleed it at the compucheck port, easy peasy. @@ericb8030
@@ericb8030 Yes they do - but NOT because the engine manufacturer wants the filters pre-filled. Rather because if they are going to be pre-filled then it is better to fill them on the dirty side.
I worked for Caterpillar for 30years in TECC in Mossville, and worked with John Goldsmith In Alabama for a number of years. Enjoy you show and know he knows more about these older engines than anyone, goodluck
Yes Sir, prefilling filters, makes me a lot of money. I have had a couple piston failures, oil filter was prefilled. The foil was apparently pushed into the oil jug. Poured directly into the unfiltered port. Eventually made it to a spray jet and plugged it up, early 92U engine. Second, MBN, oil filter must have been dropped in oil dry. As I dug parts of oil dry out of two spray jets, again seized pistons. Improper maintenance, is the fast way to the repair shop. Also putting new dirty parts on. Had a REGEN engine that I replaced the fuel enable valve. Before I installed it, I took starting fluid and washed it off, onto a lint free rag. You could see the metal fragments that washed off the threads. As my first cousin told me once, John you can never be to clean building an engine. Have a safe and a Happy New Year to the Josh Family.
Well Prefilling in itself is not the problem...being an idiot is going to ruin anything...But prefilling is better than starting an engine with ZERO oil pressure for 10-30 seconds. I have rebuilt thousands of engines...and prefilled tens of thousands of filters....I have NEVER had a Pre-Fill-Failure... But then again, I'm not an idiot... If one is not going to pre-fill oil filters...spinning the engine over with the starter to prime the oil system before starting it, is a better way... On the OLD Mack we had My Father would prefill, AND spin engine over with the "Engine Stop Cable" pushed in...To build pressure...Therefore the engine never fired without oil pressure...He also warmed it at 1000-1100 RPM for 15-45 minutes daily...That engine/truck went more miles than ALL of its "sister" trucks...
Every morning I start my truck as soon as it builds oil pressure I crank the R.P.M to about 1000 . And yes I check the oil and coolant. Good video josh keep up the good work
Here in central Texas it normally don't get that cold, but I still put a high idle switch in my 06 6.0 I don't idle any more than I have to. Fluids are pretty easy to check on my 6.0 and my 7.3 IDI I retired from trucking but still love my diesels
Because diesels do not generate much heat, unlike spark-ignition engines. They take a long, long time to warm up at idle, so we run at a fast idle to generate more heat.
Agree on extended cool idles doing damage mostly from excess carbon deposits BUT; swift temperature changes and high reciprocation speeds will cause different metals to expand and different rates, causing cylinder wall chaffing, loosening of fasteners, and cracking of hard metals such as exhaust manifolds
I'm with you on this point. N14 here. Cold or warm weather, I'll start, low idle for 1 minute then high idle ~1000. When oil temp rises to minimum 120* then I feel it's ready. In freezing weather it does take up to 10 minutes but I'm not shock heating the different metals involved
I thank everyone who said thank you for the DOTW. I am leaving You are welcome man under the comment. My replies are disappearing. I dont know why. My apologies. Hopefully they will show up. Cheers guys. Thank you Josh for all your hard work and teaching. Best wishes.
On my 97 7.3 powerstroke I did efuel with 2 spin on filters back on the frame rail, the rear tank is sumped and the fuel level is above the filter heads when at least half full. Pull both filters, put the primary on, turn the fuel back on and wait for the fuel to come out of the secondary head, put it on and then turn the fuel pump on and let it fill(regulated return system). As another note I've seen Cat heavy equipment with a "primer" switch on the frame near the fuel filters. That should be standard on all engines.
Happy New year , as well to everyone else!! When I designed my fuel filter/system for my truck, I put pre and post filters valves. So that I can isolate the filters. Change the filters W/S ,, fuel filter. So close the valves pre and post, change the filters, as the fuel was clean so dumped it back into the fuel tank. lubed the filter O-rings and installed them. Opened the Pre valve/as well the fuel return valve to the fuel tank, then bumped the electrical pump in tank .Circulated the fuel back to the tank then let it sit for about 5 mins to let any air trapped in to rise to the return tank valve. Then run the pump again for a few mins to remove any air. Closed the return tank valve opened the valve to the engine. It fired right up. Yes I have left a few other things out but that is the just of my design. I wasted?? about a tea spoon of diesel. SO I FIGURED IT WAS A success!!! The Cat 0749 filter is rusting badly. so it is not going to last that distance of that filter change. Guess I will stick with the Donaldson 1000 and the 1313 or is it the other way around???
We run 185f thermostats in are heavy haul trucks that have c-15s in them. Engines are great, still wish we had our 3406c engines, they were the best we ever had.
Good info Josh. I run my 3126 at high idle for a couple of minutes and it seems to do the trick. A goo d indicator is when the airbox heater kicks off. I can tell when it wasn't long enough because the boost is low when I start driving. Happy New Year.
I idled my 2017 f350 2 weeks ago for 34 hours straight doing my restart. When I hit thr road it blew white smoke for few miles and disappeared. Next day my cp4 exploded. Idk if the cp4 had anything to do with idling 34 hours but it was a new cp4 by powerhouse diesel less then 25k miles on it.
The topic of idling, is optimized idle good or bad? I had a 2020 Cascadia that would start 20 times a night, I know that system has been around for ages (at least 20 years) but it would always fire, idle real low then bump up 6-700 and just about every day it would regen while parked (I was on paper so obviously I didn’t sit still long). But occasionally it would shut off during regen and fire back up and start regeneration again. It regenned on the hwy as well like it should, then would repeat the process. I was in and out of Freightliner it seemed every week because my cruise would set itself at governed speed, which was 78, it would set itself on ramps, in traffic, all kinds of wonderful places. I still have video of it doing it on the off ramp in Yakima, you couldn’t cancel it and there was no warning, it would just do it. Now that has nothing to do with idling, but there were sooooo many electrical issues with that truck so I can only assume other issues were happening. The truck only had 71 miles on it when I got it so everything was warranty work, but I was in every Freightliner in CO, CA, WA, OR, ID and UT it felt like. I ended up getting out of the truck, but they blamed it on new trailers, wheel speed sensors, driver not knowing how to set the cruise was my favorite one. I get the dash looks like a video game now, but it wasn’t like I was driving a space shuttle. Long story short, could any of that been attributed to opti idle? As in the electronics of it? Denver Freightliner ended up fixing it, but by that point I was out of the truck, but that was after over 170k and I couldn’t care less what happened to it
Efficiency is not practical in today’s world. Just my opinion. I operate a thirty year old truck and still live by the old standards. Start it at home and don’t shut it off till you are home. The moment you shut it down, problems will arise and resources are thin nowadays. You are on a mechanic side of the issues while we are on the driving side of the issues.
That all depends on what county one is in and if a reliable delete system has been developed, do it the wrong way and engines have been know to fail with huge $$$ consequences. Having said that, I know locally where I am there are some shops that do a lot of tried and true delete programs because of very poor pollution systems that can't handle northern winters with a must to be able to keep the engine running. Unfortunately it most likely also deletes any engine warranty !. And in the states if caught they treat you worse then a mass murderer by the sounds of it.
My truck was having cooling issues its a 6.7 cummins 24v in a 2011 ram 3500. The mechanics put in a thermostat that opens at 190F normal operating temp is 200F is that of concern or is it ok? It runs good now they did it as a just in case I guess
I used to let my truck warm up for 20 minutes everyday. Then I started using high idle (1,200rpm) til it gets to 100• then I drive it around it around 1500rpm til it’s up to temp
Thanks Josh, I have a 01 freightliner fl70 3126 cat engine. Is the cruise control is how you raise your engine idol? If so mine is not working but my engine does idol up for about 30 seconds when the engine is cold. I definitely need to take it to shop and get my cruise control fixed since it doesn't work at all right now.
Been watching the channel for a little while now brotha, got a question for ya. How would you as a young diesel tech try and get your foot in the door. Going through the diesel program at Nic right now and been trying to find some sort of mechanic job over here in north Idaho. But just can’t seem to get anywhere, I’ve got 2 years of experience at a body shop and a lot of time turning wrenches. Any tips help! Have a good new year
When you're idling your diesel engine you are not wasting a lot of fuel. You're only wasting a littke fuel. With no load on the engine, you are burning the bare minimum fuel to acheive the crankshaft to rotate at 500-600 rpm depending on your engine.
I owned a VW Rabbit diesel, and one Christmas Eve I worked a midnight to eight shift. The temperature dropped to well below zero, and when I got back to HQ, I started the car, then ended my shift, changed into my civilian clothes, and went to the car. It had started well, and idled well for around thirty minutes. When I attempted to drive home, the engine would not go above idle. I drove the eight miles home in first gear on the five speed transmission. I started using anti gel additives at that time. It was an ugly situation
Happy new year and thank you ! I have had to fight with a few places over dumping dirty diesel into the clean side of my Cummins fuel filter and I always get the same response. We’ve always done this way so now I have to do everything on my truck because nobody takes any pride in their work so I appreciate the fact that you care about your work and your attention to detail.
Always like your video content, Happy New Year! In a while once the information becomes more known, it would be very interesting to hear about what Cummins 1.6 billion dollar settlement with the US EPA on its RAM Cummins engine diesel emission defeat device implementations have been experienced in the industry. Has this been a well known and kept secret? Even though this is for the HD pickup truck market the big question is how much technology transfer takes place between it and the HD over-the-road X15 Diesel? Cummins is seen as the leading Diesel emissions technology company in the world. Why would Cummins risk its reputation when it should have the knowhow to make these systems work correctly? It took a long time for VW's diesel emissions defeat device system to become well documented and then longer to qualify it was by intent of upper management. It is still hard to believe. Now Cummins appears to has been complicit in a similar behavior at late as the 2020s. In the case of large HD over-the-road diesels it could be understood there was no ready means to provide a workable engine right after the 2010 NOx limits so some type of defeat device was needed to allow operation. That is a long time ago in advancing technology by 2019. Cummins appears to be have continued with some type of diesel emission defeat device with new implementation as late as 2019. These are for HD pickup truck Cummins Diesels, but it does seem such upper management decision level intents would share discussion with all the Cummins Diesel design engineers.
This why I keep my GMC 2500hd in my garage and plug it in before I go anywhere in the winter months. A lot of school bus engines get nuked because some drivers cannot be bothered to lift the hood each morning to check fluids or even check the ground under the engine.
Good topics, I would add the following: What Cat calls a "coolant" or "temperature" regulator is not an ordinary thermostat. Cat engines have an internal coolant bypass system which when the regulator is closed, allows coolant to only flow round and round in the block until it gets warm then the regulator shuts off that passage and opens the passage to the rad. Helps in warming up faster. But, people mistake the regulator for a common auto thermostat, which simply blocks flow and they think if there is an overheating problem removing the regulator might fix it, not realizing removing the regulator merely allows the coolant to avoid going to the rad, just going around and around in the block. Contributing to an overheating problem, which then get diagnosed as a plugged rad or head gasket or other problem. Comments on warming up and idling, pretty true. Remember however, starting at -40 is a whole different matter than -4. At -40 you wanna make sure the oil drips off the stick before you even try to crank it, then idle gently if it starts, raising rpms slowly. And even then there is no guarantee, only minimization of damage. Idling all night at low idle is a mistake, I agree, got to get the revs up a bit and splash the oil around. The old pup/starting gasoline engines were a real education in starting diesel engines. Really a work of ingenuity, they shared the same water jacket as the big engine so it warmed up the big engine a bit and the exhaust from the small engine passed though a tube in the big engine intake manifold, warming the intake air. The big engine had a compression release that was employed while rolling it over until the oil pressure was up and things were ready to start. Filling filters is a bit of a sore point for me. I fill them, from the outside/dirty side [remembering some filters are opposite flow] or not. My attitude with oil filters is if you have an oil pump that puts out say 30 gpm at idle it will fill the filter in seconds, if it doesn't you have a larger problem. I've had it happen then being blamed for not pre-filling the filter. As for fuel filters, notice Cummins filters for some time have a plug in the center to be removed after filling. Good idea. Like your advice.
All standard automotive coolant thermostats function in the same manner: they are closed when the coolant is cold, and force the coolant to circulate around the block. Once the coolant approaches operating temperature the stat slowly starts to open and allow coolant to reach the radiator. Eventually, the stat is fully open and almost all coolant flow is through the radiator. No automotive stat closes off coolant movement; if it did you would see uneven heating of the block and possible damage. The coolant must keep moving at all times. So......a Cat coolant regulator is simply a standard coolant thermostat with a new-age name.
Thanks for the pictures Jerry or is it Gerry? I don't know, but I'm sure it matters to him. Anyway Happy New Year to Mr. Josh Ape and everyone else here.
I have a truck with Volvo d13 its mixing diesel with fuel. had the dealership change all six injectors and cups. But it still has the same problem what do you think the problem might be?
Fleetguard comes with a cap On its fuel filter so when you fill it it's fuels forced to go through the filter before it hits the center obviously you take the cap off once you install it
AC is extremely energy intensive. The reason it works well on a belt drive is because you’re providing 2-3HP or something to it in that way. If you need 2KW from a battery you’re going to have a bad time. Even a Tesla power wall which is huge and heavy would only be able to run AC for possibly 5 hours.
Back in the '90s Cat developed a system called MorElectric. This was a genmotor replacing the flywheel, starter motor and alternator. It could make 30kW (50HP?) @ 48V (just like the Cybertruck is doing today). Cabin cooling was an ELECTRIC heating & cooling airconditioner (size to mount under the seat). 48V enabled electric waterpump oil pump fuel transfer pump but NOT the fan - they need 30+HP to drive. It also meant you could plug the truck into a power outlet and have full heating/cooling with no engine running. The BIG benefit for reliability was removing the lines for air con and heating systems and going to rigid lines. This didn't go very far - though Cat did change to electric cabin cooling package in the roof to get the reliability improvements. Also Cat Industrial engines is again talking about the 30kW genmotor (well they did a few years ago I haven't looked more recently). FYI the people that REALLY wanted it was the US armed Forces - an inbuilt generator with EVERY truck. The beauty they saw was no extra cooling system packaging etc etc. They wanted 60kW though - not sure where that all went to. Maybe it is its time now
@@ianloy1854 That’s cool. If trucks were geared up with electric heating and cooling that would enable all truck stops to have power outlets and operate more like powered RV sites. Not sure if truck drivers would prefer to pay $10 for power overnight or idle their engines though. I’m sure a lot of people would complain about needing to pay, while idling the truck overnight probably contributes to an expensive rebuild lol.
Thanks Josh, regarding my issue with oil pressure drop! Most likely my oil filter collapse or something like that installed new one and everything works fine. Still doing an oil sample once I do my oil change this month
I wish I could show this to my neighbor with the everything-deleted 7.3 he'd idle for 90 minutes every morning in the winter. I am not kidding. 90 minutes. At least he got another one that still has the SCR, DPF and muffler, it's more easily ignorable.
Question for you. Start the engine is cold outside, no block heater because im at truck stop for my 10hrs. You say idle 1 min then fastidle 1k 12k RPM. Oil is still cold and oil pressure go crazy like over 100 psi. Is it dammage the engine ? Only new Paccar Mx13-21 put an variable oil pump who solve tha problem. What do you think ?
that the way the older paccars were, just keep it under the 100 psi and let the back pressure valve work it will warm up the engine very fast aka idle.
Hi Joshu this is Danny i have a question about overhead adjustment , I have 3406e engine on TDC but i did not know with one is compression #1 or #6 how do i find out ? thank you.
The opposite cylinder will be in overlap. Also if your on TDC 1, exhaust valve on number two will be open. Just the opposite if your on TDC 6, number five exhaust valve will be open.
You're so right about the importance of running the right thermostat. I even saw an engine overheat with no thermostat installed. Turns out the coolant was running through the system so fast it wasn't in the radiator long enough to cool down. When it gets hot outside it takes longer for that coolant to cool off. The start-stop flow from those thermostats opening and closing gives it the time to do that. Happy new year!🎉😅
I must disagree. The Btus/minute being dissipated by the radiator are proportional to fluid (coolant) velocity. Moving the fluid faster will raise the average temperature of the radiator, and the differential between radiator and cooling air will increase. This results in more Btus/minute being transferred from fluid to air. If you saw an engine overheating, it wasn't because of a missing thermostat. The thermostat has just one job: prevent the coolant from entering the radiator until the engine is close to operating temperature. I see this misunderstanding often with hydronic floor heating systems. Many people think running hot water through a zone loop more slowly allows more heat to enter the room. This is wrong. A higher velocity raises the average temperature of the loop and increases output. It's somewhat counter-intuitive.
Happy new Year, I start my old 1HZ 80 series Landcruiser every night to pump the oil up when I get to full oil pressure I shut it down. Next day start and full oil pressure straight away, Take care enjoy and I will send some you great destruction pictures, we are the ER of components, rather large ones
Southern Pacific management ignored past practices and were proud of themselves for saving fuel costs by directing that locomotive engines be turned off by operators instead idling while parked. Shortly after that management involvement, the shops were ordering replacement train diesel engines. The cool down and heat up cycles were cracking the V16 engine blocks. Since locomotive diesel engines cost more than diesel fuel, management reversed their executive orders to employees and allowed the operators to return to letting the engines idle. So, Item #1 was a very expensive and destructive for train diesel engines.
Happy new year... I have one question what kined of problems is there with a D333 engine and D334 engine, o and what is the diffarens between the D334 and 1674 engine
If anyone knows of a relocation kit or part for a 3406E I would appreciate it. My oil filter is behind the frame rail which makes me paranoid about dirt landing in my filter when I change it.
