I don't know what Intamin employees have gone to Zamperla, but assuming it's mostly engineers/designers and Cedar Points issue with Intamin is with their management then I can see how having Intamin engineers at Zamperla would make them more willing to give them a chance, just so they don't have to deal with Intamin's management team, just a thought.
This is exactly what I was going to say. My guess is Cedar Fair's issue is wasn't with Intamin's designers and engineers as much as it was with the management team. If Intamin's management handled TTD's reliability and the Shoot the Rapids poorly then that could be what poisoned the well.
I agree, it may have more to do with the culture at Intamin. Here is an example; when Fury cracked, B&M stopped everything they were doing, sent a team and had the new support fabricated in a week. On the flip side, there is Xcelerlator!
This is what I came here to say, Cedar Fair may not have had any issues with the coaster side of Intamin but rather could have been with the financial side or as mentioned above the management aide
I think the relationship between CF and intamin have more to do with the upper management at intamin that's still there rather than the engineers and the people who went over to Zamperla.
My guess is that Cedar Fair's main reason to work with Zamperla is because of their lightning trains. The final nail in the coffin with the original Dragster was the piece coming off of the train and hitting the guest, which is impossible to happen with the lightning train.
Nope..a piece can fly off any ride,any train at any time.Thats why they are freak accidents. All the inspections in the world won't prevent things from happening that we can see..Metal fatigues and starts cracking at microscopic levels..It can happen to anyone
What happened with the Flag Plate dislodging from The Green Train was a Complete Freak Accident. But you have to realize something that may have lead to the Flag Plate dislodging from The Train. When Cedar Point is done with The Non-Destructive Maintenance on The Rollercoaster Trains, Maintenance will return The Trains to the Rollercoaster Site, BUT!! They're sitting on the Main Midway, Next to The Ride, so The Trains are exposed Directly to the elements. Snow, and The Salt that The Maintenance Teams do use to keep The Midways Cleared, because That's The Most Busiest Time. The Off-Season. It Absolutely Sounds Like That Flag Plate had erosion that Wasn't Noticed, Leading Up to The Freak Accident. I have a feeling that when the Non-Destructive Maintenance is done now will The Trains, They're being Installed Directly onto The Tracks, and Wrapped in Protective Plastic for Protection. If you look at Pics from Winter Chill Out, There's Pics of The Rollercoaster Trains sitting on The Midway in Snow.🎢❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️
@@ninjagirl226 The new trains will be reaching their limits with TT2. It's crazy how CF didn't want to gamble with Intamin again, yet they are taking a huge gamble with Zamperla, their new untested trains, and them being new to big coaster projects. Intamin, on the other hand, has had 20 years since they built Top Thrill to improve and mature.
It makes sense because we as coaster enthusiasts only think of coaster manufacturers in terms of their ride design, whereas parks think of manufacturers in terms of their long-term support that they offer for maintenance and downtime prevention. Intamin is notorious for not keeping a stock of spare parts at the ready and this causes parks to routinely wait long periods to have them manufactured and oftentimes at the back end of a waiting list. From the perspective of a industrial customer, it makes perfect sense to choose a manufacturer that has the same exact ride design team that you enjoyed previously, but has better logistics
When I think of my favorite coasters. I think of fantastic trains and comfortability, airtime, and launches. Technically this has all 3. And you guys really have to figure out that you go from 0-74, 0-100 and 0-120. No small increases. Like the numbers are throwing everyone for a mental loop.
@Spike-sk7ql each direction change has a moment of zero. Zero acceleration and speed in either direction. Then gravity kicks in. Even tho all 3 launches don't start at the zero point, you are still going from zero to 100+ mph
Maybe it wasn't the workers who switched over to Zamperla that Cedar Fair didn't want to work with, but like, upper management still at Intamin. Or it just doesn't matter at all to them and ONLY the lowest price matters. They'll likely regret that choice though. Just like in construction, the cheapest bid is never what you want to go with. Unless it's only like 5% off or something, a normal variation.
So would Top Thrill 2 be (technically) the first true hybrid coaster if this is an Intamin-Zamperla crossover event? Also Mack Rides doing TT2 woulda been a pretty sick idea. Imagine them making a 420ft, Steel-Taipan style spike instead of the straight, vertical spike that Zamperla are putting in
Something tells me Mack would figure out a way to get a train launched a 50mph up a 400 for spike. They smart like that. I'm still waiting for the day Copperhead stalls in one of those loops, but it never does.
Once we finnaly get a chance to ride top thrill 2 i bet we will all love it. I was a huge fan of the og dragster and have a rollback credit. I think TT2 will be a huge upgrade
This is why I love B&M. They make great yet sometimes generic rides. They definitely stay in the box with what they do best. Cedar point ask for bids to redo Dragster, the other Manufacturers put in redesign bids. B&M is like, nope... Tear this s*&+ down, lets put in a Giga. 😂
Not hard to understand. Simple Cedar Fair has no issue with the engineers but they do have issue with the owners and administration at Intimin. This may stem from Intimins failure to fix the original customer. I deal with two phone companies. One had many engineers leave and go to the new company. There they created and did the things the other company failed to do or address. We went with the new company and they are bending over backwards for us to gain all our business. This is how it works out there in the business jungle.
Hey Brandon, you mentioned that zamperla had the cheapest bid for the reimreimagined dragster, do you know how much that bid was specifically? Do you think that number will eventually be released publicly?
It would make sense to have ex intamin employees (now with zamperla) to work on an intamin ride if they weren't going to hire intamin to do the job. They would already be familiar with ins and outs of the coaster.
Maybe the new Six Flags has plans to eventually add a B and M giga at Cedar Point. Not sure where but could be in the cards. I’m loving the new look of Top Thrill 2 and can’t wait to check it out. Also, I didn’t know that some of the old Intamin regime are now with Zamperla. That actually makes me feel better about this.
I really can't stand the fact that people hate on Zamperla so much, give them a chance. I thought enthusiasts are supposed to embrace parks and ride manufacturer s and not rip them to threads
It’s usually the sales or senior management that is the people dealing with the customer. The rank and file site employees have little to do with customer relations. Besides, Dragster was built so long ago, many of the people who worked on it would be retired.
The construction videos seem to reveal that Zampintaminerla is doing a great job with Top Thrill 2. Still, I really wish that Cedar Flags went with more LSMs halfway up the top hat to provide a true rollback experience from near the top during the initial launch - and an airtime speed hill between the launches. And the name Top Thrill 2 is a flop thrill too. 🤦🏻♂️ The company could have come up with a much better name, like Sky Bolt Skull Crush or something more exciting than TT2 🌤️⚡️💀🔨💥 However, I am grateful that Top Thrill Dragster wasn’t renamed Batman the Ride, Goliath or even Kingda Ka 2. 😅🙏🏽
Why is it ironic? What’s so hard to understand? Cedar fair doesn’t want to work with Intamin…. They never said anything about the engineers and designers. I just don’t see the need for this video.
The B&M Giga would have been nice. But I think I would have wanted the Mack idea. I can imagine a bigger version of Beyond The Cloud in that area. Which would have been sick.
I don't know for fact what manufacturers submitted as bids, but if Intamin was given an opportunity they may have submitted a bid to remove and replace. I think it's fair to assume that Cedar Fair and Intamin look at the Accelerator experiment as a business failure. I think it's fair to assume that Intamin would have preferred starting fresh.
You’re the man dude. Yes, you predicted a giga to replace top thrill 2. That’s funny that B&M suggested a giga to replace top thrill as well. You need to be hired at B&M dude. Remember to smile today and keep riding coasters.
It can make perfect sense. This is purely hypothetical, but nobody knows how intamin as a business works. Maybe they aren’t a good company to work for and that’s why employees leave (HYPOTHETICAL). For example, just because intamin are unreliable doesn’t mean that the employees who have left - are. Zamperla may have better business acumen. May be better at making decisions. May make better choices. We just have no idea but just because Zamperla has ex intamin employees doesn’t mean they are another version of intamin.
Am I the only one who thinks adding a b&m giga to cedar point is redundant with millennium force in the same park. Imo it doesn’t make sense to add another giga to the park because it doesn’t add any diversity to their lineup.
Well, intimin is still intimin when the management has not been changed. I think the reason why they will not work with intimin is because of decisions management made, and not the ones of the employees.
Your comments are very factual as usual. Was wondering when you were going too voice your opinion even I was thinking what you stated and I’m sure not as informed as u are. Wishing you and your family 🎃🍁🎃Happy Thanksgiving 🎃🍁🎃😊
I've never understood Cedar Fair's hatred towards certain manufactures including RMC when literally no other chain has any problems with them. If anything, they should blame themselves for having poor maintenance and that they need to step it up. It's easier to blame the manufactures for their problems but they also need to consider what they are doing to negatively impact their rides as well.
I can’t think of the name, but there is a woody coaster company that had engineers form a new company after its bankruptcy. There are several factors and levels to a company as others pointed out already, so it is hard to say.
Former Custom Coasters International employees started both the Gravity Group and Great Coasters International. CCI themselves were related to other companies like The Dinn Corp. I believe Denise Dinn went to S&S after CCI folded.
Cedar Point seems to be acting like Zamperla is the only ones they talked to, which doesn't impress me. Wondering how you have this information, but it makes more sense. The thing about the "cheapest bid" is it depends on the scale. I'm guessing even Zamp could easily cost them $15M or maybe 10 for taking a chance. Intamin was almost surely double that. It's not just a few bucks, it's the difference between the project being worthwhile or B&M having the right idea with just starting over.
Cedar Fair probably doesn't have beef with the actual engineers designing the rides at Intamin, it's likely management vs management. Cedar Fair has an excellent relationship with Zamperla, so a bunch of former Intamin guys working there is great as they now have access to that talent without having to deal with their Intamin baggage.
Brandon are you in Ohio or in Charlotte, NC? I always thought you were in Charlotte but you mentioned making videos in Ohio. Just curious! Remember to smile today and keep ridin coasters 😎
Cedar Fair probably didn't like working with Intamin Corporate/Management which is probably why you saw a bunch of Intamin Employees jump ship to Zamperla. Bad management/corporate structure is the #1 cause for a mass Exodus of employees. Id be willing to bet Zamperla is wanting to make a big splash into the coaster market and are offering the former Intamin Employees much more creative freedom than what Intamin was offering. Like one of the previous comments said, id be willing to bet most of those former employees are ride designers/engineers.
There is tons of reasons why they didn't go with Intamin and it has nothing to do with some former engineers going to work for Zamperla. Intamin's final product was constantly plagued with issues and management was extremely tough to work with to get those resolved. Sandor Kernacs was awful to work with from my understanding. Intamin also failed to get service products and materials out in a timely manner. Then also take into account the long string of failures with Intamin rides not just at Cedar Fair but other companies as well. After Skyrush Hershey isn't working with Intamin anymore either.
The problem is if it's true intamin wanted to remove iron dragon that would have given them more room to accelerate over the top hat Zamperla is relying on the cars weight and design if this doesn't work they have a real problem on there hands
@@ellexking9136 they need MOAR, preferably near the front of the park to help alleviate crowds in frontier town. Something else to draw people away from Maverick and Steve
@@trollmylove Even If Cedar Point would add a Giga Rollercoaster in the front of the park, Maverick, and Steel Vengeance will Still be Very Popular. I don't know how far you go back, But when Cedar Point added Corkscrew in 1976, and Gemini in 1978, The Jumbo Jet was Still VERY POPULAR, giving Over a Million Rides in its last 2 Unannounced Years of Operation that ended at The End of The 78 season. You know there's a saying. A Rollercoaster doesn't have to be The Longest, Tallest, Steepest, and The Fastest to be Great. Both Maverick and Steel Vengeance offers 5 ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ Rides. That will Never Die like it did for Magnum XL2Painful. Janky, and Painful.🤣
I think they are going to replace magnum with something game changing, as to why they didn't replace top thrill with a coaster as it sits so close to Magnum. as far as the employees, that's not abnormal in a niche field. I think a lot of broken promises and ride issues is the reasoning behind the lack of confidence in INTamin
It's actually very simple: it's all about $. especially now in the U.S. with inflation. Cedar Point also already has one of only 6 full LAYOUT giga coasters in the world and it's not even as good as Steel Vengeance which is also in the park, so a Strata coaster of any kind gives this park what it needs to fill in that record breaking gap. In conclusion: I'm thinking more positively about this coaster than you are; now's not the time to complain that I'm being negative. You are. Cheer up, my friend! In turn: you can cheer me up when I'm "down" later. It's like a roller coaster or something. ;) Take your own advice and be positive or whatever. 😉❤
Hey Brandon hope you're well. I'm just speculating but it could be one of these two scenarios 1. Intamin has/wants to wash their hands and distance themselves from Top Thrill. This would explain why CF is going to Zamperla who is basically Intamin Jr. Right now with the employee shift. I don't know enough of the facts to be sure, but this could explain the situation. 2. I know the aftermath of the accident is not pretty at all. It could also be reversed. CF doesn't want to work with Intamin but has an opportunity to use Intamin knowledge by working with Zamperla who has ex Intamin employees. This would also explain the decision. Not work with Intamin (for unknown reason) yet still have engineers who have vast knowledge of Intamin. Anywho. Haven't commented in awhile. Day job is crazy busy. I miss my ride op days and sometimes dream of going back to the industry. Lol Take care friend. Maybe next summer we can meet up, ride some coasters and just have some fun.
I think Cedar Point dropped the ball with this "Reimagining". They could've easily went for the height record and they could've easily extended the track. What a waste to have all that energy coming down from the top hat just to have it come to a sudden stop.....smh
do you think they chose the lowest bidder because they knew the six flags merger was coming down the pike? I hope they manage to get the high iron finished on the spike before the weather goes down the crapper. it's supposed to be warm through next week. by rights, we should be in the death grip of winter by now so this is unseasonably warm by northeast Ohio standards
Hey there Brandon, I really like your new video! 😃👍👍 This is something that’s rather confusing. I mean, Cedar Fair doesn’t want to work with Intamin anymore, but they hired Zamperla to design and reimagine Top Thrill 2 at Cedar Point?!?! However, Zamperla is filled with ex-Intamin employees. It’s 100% mind-boggling here! We’ll just have to see how things work in the next few weeks.
Wait, so Cedar Fair took an unsolicited bid from Intamin to fix TTD. Odd! At least thats what it sounds like since you said Intamin put together a bid for this, and you said Cedar Fair wont work with Intamin. So it muat have been unsolicited. Odd!
@@TP_Recommendations Well here's a shout-out from the Glass City 😎 next time you're at CP I'll try to stop by if I can and say hey... I've been going to cedar point since I've been 2...
Think of it this way, lets say the management sucks at Intamin and all the good people left to work for zamperla... Cedar Point is still working with intamin, theyre just called zamperla now lol
Perhaps Intiman, and Zamprela have Secretly Merged into 1 Company, and Keeping it Secret??🤣 It's Intiman That's Actually doing All of the Electrical Systems, Structural, and Track Work, and Zamprela is Supplying their Lightning Trains?? God I Hope that's The Case!!!🙏🏾🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
It's a PR nightmare. It's the name Intamin they don't want asso iated with the park. Shoot the Rapids almost killed 8 people when it broke and flipped. That's my guess
There's nothing puzzling about it, your just making a nonsense video per usual. Intamin engineers getting hired over to Zamperla started happening 4 to 5 years ago when Zamperla started revamping their lineups. This is a nothing burger, the issue with Intamin were likely with management being asses about their stuff breaking down and not offering good support.
