Trade Toyota Reliability for Jeep? JL Xtreme Recon Reviewed By a Toyota Guy | Jeep vs Toyota 

Thanks! Although the legendary 80 series also has a solid front axle, it is mechanically different from the wrangler. LC80's front axle uses a radius arm setup while the wrangler uses 5 link. (The rear axles of both vehicle use 5 link though). The radius arm inherently bind more so it has less flex when comparing same level of mods. The radius arm will naturally provide better on road handling. That's why both land cruisers and the older G-wagons adopt this for their front axles. It is a more balanced setup for street and crawl.

@@TinkerersAdventure oh thanks kai! Didnt know the jeeps used a 5 link! I thought all solid axles were the same as the 80!

Corners like a bathtub on wheels? Is that good or bad? My 80 corners like it's on rails, surprisingly tight radius off road. So all good here. Also, my lockers stay engaged for as long as I want them to be regardless how many times I turn off the engine. Does a Jeep or Bronco do that? My 80 came with hood struts. Does $60k for a Jeep or Bronco get one the same? My 80 will run with more than half the fuses removed/blown. Will a Jeep or Bronco do the same? I can remove any axle shaft on the trail in 30 minutes. I can run on a single axle shaft, front or rear indefinitely. Can one do the same in a Jeep or Bronco? Electrical trumps electronic all day long. What really needs to happen is a Rubicon to reach 30 years old. THEN see what's what. Odds are all that tech won't last. They're already struggling at 3 or 5 years old to maintain their 'advantage' provided by the cheaper, less robust tech at new. And the costs to maintain are way out of proportion to each other.

@@samjohnson9894 What was the price point of the 80 back in the day? They where top of the line vehicles

Thank you. Glad to hear! I like keep learning from each other

Jeep's 3.6L is supposed to be very reliable. Don't know about everything else.

​@@jeffk464 like most modern vehicles, it's all in the maintenance 🤷🏽‍♂️

@@treyroberts8124 nobody maintains anything

@@JasonLee-lv7tm most probably don't, I choose not to be in that category lol. I'm beyond uptight about maintenance.

@@treyroberts8124 I used to work for Firestone and Goodyear as a Technician. And let me tell you how 95% of auto owners don't properly maintain their vehicles.

a machine is a machine and they're subject to breakdown regardless of manufacturer. It's the process and way it's modified that determine it's strength and/or weakness. Any machine will outperform the other if modified properly and not done in vain. Ford, Dodge, Ram, GM, Jeep, Toyota, Nissan, it doesn't matter. Do it right or get a bad feel for any particular manufacturer. Do it right and your ego floats like a helium balloon. Good luck with your new Toyota (and don't look back)

@@d.s7741 say that to the faulty Kia engines catching fire, manufacturers do make an impact on reliability.

FJ owner here and appreciate the pros of jeeps

Bro watch out saying something like the the jeepers will come for you in the comment section haha

@@dylanandrew1122 - in the last industry I worked in we called it "operator error", but I didn't want to get all philosophical

So which one win?

On my 4th jeep and had 4 Toyotas. If Toyota went straight axle, it would probably be 5th Toyota and not 5th jeep.

Ooo that v8. Man I want one of those

I have an 04 with the 4.7 V8... they are not impressive . They do fine but not a wow factor. The V6 actually has more HP and less tourqe.

@@Thecherokee4x4 you have the non-VVTI 4.7. I’ve had a 99 Land Cruiser and an ‘02 Tundra both of which had the non-VVTI 4.7 I agree that these aren’t much to write home about. The ‘05 with VVTI makes an additional 35hp and is quite an improvement, though.

@@sorrywrongnumber5280 I have two V6's, and they perform just fine.

You had an oil leak with the 3.6l? Did you make sure your oil filter housing wasnt being over torqued? Thats a huge issue and i own a 3.6l, lube techs over torque the shitty plastic housing. Should have been aluminum to prevent the issue in the first place

Nobody is saying there aren't some jeeps that will achieve high mileage without issue (if there are people saying this, then they are dumb). These anecdotes exist for all cars. However when looking at a large enough population of each of these vehicles is when the average reliability of the Jeeps will lag far behind Toyotas. I like both vehicles btw. I drive an FJ but I also love jeeps. I hope your jeep continues to serve you without issue.

Same. I had to make the choice as well and went with the 4Runner specifically because 75% of my time in it is spend doing family stuff on road. It is also more than capable for my needs offroad (light crawling and moderate trails). If I was building specifically for off-road I would have gone with the Jeep.

whats IFS?

@@quincy189 Independent Front Suspension

@@quincy189 independent front suspension

@5'2 legendary balding indian janitor I'm the dumbest person on earth and I know what it means.. independent front suspension

That's why many Jeepers have satellite phones, Lol. I go out to Mojave and Death Valley quite often in a single vehicle, Tacoma with over 285K miles, in 110+f and notice quite few lone Toyotas exploring whereas many Jeepers explore in groups. Tiger vs lions, you know both are capable 😄. Having said that, I was stuck for 9 hours in a nasty mud, trying to cross dry riverbed out in the westside of Death Valley a few years ago, bottomed out so no recovery board helped, had a winch but no solid trees out there😪, had a hi-lift but no good size rocks nearby😥, finally rescued by two passing Jeepers so I love seeing souped up Jeepers out there!

@@matrix-fh9tn have you seen that solo winch anchor ⚓️ shovel thingy? Basically you can use it to winch off the sand and mud... check it out

Thanks! How does the Jeep handle in sands? I’m very curious. I guess the sand is so soft and mushy so maybe the solid front axle handling would be “covered”? It’d be pretty different from dirt or gravel roads I suppose.

@@TinkerersAdventure the jeeps are more nimble and can change direction easier, for example whilst going parallel on a dune on an angle, they can successfully turn up the dune without losing much momentum due to the wheelbase being shorter. They can fit larger tires as well, giving more floatation. When riding the crest of the dune, they tend to be not difficult to control due to that short wheelbase. The axle does scrape the sand, but it's so soft it didn't really impact the handling. The 1gr-fe engine is stronger, than the 3.5 pentastar, doesn't overheat (even in 46c ambient Temps it's fine) and can climb farther, go higher, and remain on the crests with less skill. You can run it with the a/c on and not lose the ability to climb. Jeeps have an easier time in general, but everyone gets stuck eventually. They have an easier time of modding, with more options available. I'm in a Prado, because it's also my daily driver and the maintenance on the jeeps is just more hassle. The sand has no bottom. You float on it with 11 psi up front and 9psi in the back. Larger tires = better, but also needs more power, so the crazy guys chip their Toyotas (image, headers etc etc) and run in 4 lo 5th gear @ 139kph. Not an exaggerated figure. Some of them use the supercharger, and at that level of extreme skill and performance the 3.5 jeeps can't keep up, and the 392s leap to the fore, although again they're in the garage far more often. There are a few broncos and Suzuki Jimny's out there as well, as well as Ford raptors and Tundras, but the large trucks simply can't do the technical stuff at they get high centered and then you have to snatch recovery so often it's a bore.

@@randomuser6306 thanks for the insight! That is very cool. A totally different game from anything I’m familiar with.

Disagree. Properly set up Toyota’s can do any rock crawling a Jeep can do.

@@ZoneTelevision properly set up with solid front axles yes

I have owned 2 xj's and 2 wranglers. Nothing like an xj

@@ZoneTelevision but when the Yotas are built like that they cease from being what makes Toyotas so nice and reliable, and resembles more like a Jeep

@@bradlaflamme6127 Wellllll....... nothing like a TJ........... TJ and XJ are very similar but the TJ is a notch above.............

The funny thing is that our FJ’s will still be driving around and going on camping trips long after most Jeeps haven been traded in or are in the junk yard with major repairs. You can’t beat time & Toyota is the only one consistently winning that battle.

I really liked how objective he was.

So true. I myself don't fall for high specs marketing as my starting point are MY needs....for overlanding I need reliability and reasonable tyre size (I don't go too big)..

@@purificator1004 Most Australian and South African overlanders only run tall skinny tires as they are more readily available in most parts of the world. Unlike big, wide tires (37" & up).

Seems you need to watch 4wd 24/7 for some genuine overlanding.

@@travelinman482 255/75 - 85 17R is perfect for me and my 4Runner.

@@purificator1004jeeps handle larger tires pretty well. 35s aren’t much of a jump in diameter / weight. And for overlanding they’re available in most countries. We opted for the raptor size (35-ish) BFGs assuming that that tire would be pretty easy to come by throughout the Americas. But it turns out that even odd ball sizes aren’t too hard to come by (another traveler was able to get a new set of 37x13.5r20 in Medellin Colombia). I think a lot of the foreign travelers stick to smaller tires for multiple reasons. First it’s easy and doesn’t require modification. Second, many countries have significant restrictions on modifications. And third larger tires add expense and most overlanders tend to invest in travel over modifications. At the end of the day for overland travel finding the “perfect” vehicle isn’t as big of a deal as people make it out to be… in fact we might even switch to a Defender 110 for our next trip just to have more living space and to experience the Land Rover community for ourselves.

Thanks! And you summed it up perfectly. I will be making a video specifically on tire fitment. But you’ve got all the right ideas already!

What steered you away from 33s and a 2 inch lift? Genuinely curious because I hear that a lot as well. But it's usually from reputable sources so don't see anything wrong with that advice. Thanks!

@@jamiethomas8975 The lift in itself isn't necessarily a bad thing, but as mentioned both in this video and in the IFS videos, relying on lift to clear larger tires only works if one doesn't expect to use the suspension's full range of articulation (i.e., you're not going off road). In an IFS vehicle, a lift kit doesn't change the suspension's range of motion; all it does it alter ride height within that range. So when your suspension flexes upwards, it is possible (and likely) that the wheels travel up to where they were before the lift. This means that if the tires rub without a lift, they will rub even with a lift if the terrain causes them to come up far enough. Hope this helps!

@@TinkerersAdventure your content is so vastly superior I wish you had time to do more videos!!! Any chance you have friends with the Chevy Colorado ZR2 or a Ford bronco to do comparisons on those?

@@shootinbruin3614 don’t forget that Tacomas on FJs still have a solid rear axle with extended bump stops and all. My 35s just barely don’t rub the top of my wheel well. But yea 35s or bust 😂

He's specifically comparing the Wrangler not the made in Mexico soft roaders Jeep pump out

What year of Jeep did you own? New or old when you bought it? Did you keep it on the pavement or ride it hard off-road?

225, 000 miles even Jeep won’t belive you. 😂

There’s an old saying in Africa and Australia, you may take any 4wd drive off roading but if you want to come back to civilization, do make sure you take a TOYOTA. 😂

@@nunyabizness9885 I -as a consumer - shouldn't care where my vehicle is made. It's the manufacturer's concern to deliver quality product, and chrysler is anything but the one that does.

The JL at stock can go up to a 37" if I recall. If not, definitely a 35". I think the fenders of the Rubicon is a tad higher.

@@williamlee7782 The North American Rubicon has high line fenders and can clear 37's.

I think that accurately sums it up in few words: primarily on road? IFS/Toyota. Primarily off-road? SFA/Jeep. I own a Jeep JKU, and I will say, the steering play issue is rig and build specific. Mine is largely fine. That said, if I wanted an overland/travel rig, I would probably end up with a Taco (or Tundra - to tow the jeep to and from off-road/rock-crawling parks :))

Your coment doesn't make any sense, if toyota is an ancient vehicle and jeep keep upgrading and still can't make it right, toyota is well known for is quality, 4runner is made in Japan completely, in one of the best plants in the world, you need more facts, toyota TRD been racing in dakar rallys for decades, one of the taughtes endurance races in the world, Chrysler quality is almost non existence.

@@rudyrey5600 toyota selling brand new vehicles in 2022 with drum brakes, 14mpg, and 5 speed autos determined that was a lie

@@rudyrey5600 I didn't say anything about quality or dependability. It is a very old design that has many limitations compared to a more modern chassis.

LMAO! pretty sad that an ancient economy truck regularly goes 200,000+ miles without major repairs and the so called "updated" jeeps keep breaking before 60,000 miles.

I put a $6500 suspension on my diesel Gladiator and it laughs at stuff my stock Raptor is pushed by. Then in slow speed it does stuff that would break my old tacoma. Best vehicle ive ever owned bar none

@@mattbrew11 I agree, I am very particular with handling and I did bunch of mods on my m3s. But when I was researching off-road vehicles I realized it's just impossible to have handling and capable at the same time. Bought jeep WJ and I went to little John bull, black bear and red cone pass. Then I sold it and bought a power wagon, I would just prefer the dark side lol

I'm pretty sure the new Toyotas will be less robust. They are going to a coil spring rear end

​@@jeffk464 the Tacoma is light, if it were a 1 ton there might be need for concern. But 1/2 tons, Wranglers, even the Power Wagon have run coils for years and there haven't been any reliability issues out of them

I just wish Toyota would offer lower gears in their Offroad and Pro models (like Jeeps rubicon). Of course, moving the body mount back 2 or 3 inches would definitely be preferred.

Agree. Solid axle Toyotas, whether 80s (old school, no longer sold), 70s (old school, still sold, but never in North America) are pretty hard to beat overall.

Thanks! I love the LC80s. I would love have a new 79 which we don’t get in the US.

True. My FZJ80 didn't dragged its belly on the rocks like my JKU did thanks to the shorter wheelbase but the rear of it sure did. As for my JKU it didn't dragged its rear on the rocks lol. Just different breakover and departure angles.

@@jthor8373 too true! I got the 4x4 Labs rear bumper, and that helped a lot with departure angle. But I still drag back there. At least I don’t need to worry about it now though. That’s a tough bumper.

They probably want to keep the discussion focused on production vehicles (at least in the US). If you talk about 80-series then you can also start talking about SAS-ed 3rd gen 4Runners or YJ/TJ. It won’t end till you’ve gotten to the CJ2A :D

Same here. Even though I’m very jealous of those 37s and big flex, the FJ is the better fit for me overall.

I’d love to fit 37s, easily and be able to turn them daily. Sadly, that isn’t happening.

A JLU Rubicon has a higher payload than a Tacoma TRD off road-- 1350 compared to 1100 pounds for the Tacoma.

The used jeep market being so high in some ways makes it high used price a wash buy high and sale high.

They really can't load up a yota and go do a hard trail you will be blowing cvs, steering rack, bent tie rods. I know I've got a pig of a yota and selling it to get a jeep.

Yes, even for a small guy like me, the wrangler interior feels a lot tighter. Great for avoiding trees on the trail and stick my head out the window for spotting tho.

Johnathan Ward from icon design made the prototype for Toyota, and they completely butchered his vision.... They asked for his help as a FJ cruiser restorer he knew what the enthusiast wanted .. Toyota claimed he had full creative control and they will produce for the most part what he will design them.... His words are that the production FJ is a complete POS as to what he created. They didn't use not one idea, component, or design element from his prototype, and Toyota completely ghosted him..... I assume you didn't pick TJ generation wrangler because of it's size? The last real and reliable wrangler. It's the perfect offroader no matter what variant you preference. Maybe the e46 m3 or the 964/993 of the jeep brand.

For rock crawling, sure. But 98% of them are daily drivers that rarely leave the road and solid front axles are miserable for daily driving.

@@DeuceDeuceBravo I really wouldn't say miserable... G wagons came with solid front axles until 2018. The major differences are steering vagueness and bump steer but overall ride is not much different. And i wouldn't limit it to rock crawling either... anything deeper than washboard bumps (even small-average ruts) will be smoother with a solid axle because the entire corner of the vehicle doesn't tip into the rut due to the vastly increased flex and downtravel you get vs IFS.

@@Shakshuka69 Fair points. But manufacturers are moving away from solid axles entirely - including rear axle - because the vast majority of buyers prefer a better ride/handling on the road. Even the Bronco went IFS. But there will always be Jeeps for the hardcore. I have friends with Wranglers and I couldn't tolerate that ride in a daily driver, but obviously that's subjective.

@@DeuceDeuceBravo This is true, however Australians are sitting on waiting lists to buy 79 series Landcruisers that are rough and barebones with optional air-conditioning for $120k aud ($75k USD!) so I think there's room for more than just Jeep in the market space. The Ineos Grenadier is (allegedly) coming to the US next year so it will be interesting to see how that does.

@@DeuceDeuceBravo I never understood why people make up percentages on how much a vehicle is used offroad. 98% is completely made up especially when you consider the life of a vehicle. Sure a brand new jeep might not see dirt it's first year but who's to say it won't see dirt down the road in the coming years? And solid axle ride quality can be totally fine if properly looked after. Unless you have a back made of glass?

392 motors aren’t bullet proof. They are prone to lifter failures with higher mileage and mix with bad maintenance.

You’re talking about 100k plus hemis which it common on mds engines. Other than that they’re bulletproof compared to the 3.6 pentastar engine

@@markserna24 can’t claim a motor being bullet proof if they have issues like this prone to happening. No need to exaggerate, The 392 is just more reliable than the 3.6 v6. Toyota is a great example of bullet proof motor. From 4 cylinder such as their 22R to 6 cylinder, the famous 2JZ to V8 like the 1UZ-FE. If anything the Jeeps in-line 6 4.0 is a top contender when it comes to reliability. I’ve had 2 Jeeps with the inline 6 4.0 with over 250k and runs very strong and never had an issue.

I would much rather choose the hemis over the 4.0 due to the constant oil leaks, manifold cracking, and water pump/coolant failures. The 4.0 is more reliable than the 3.6 yes. The difference is the 4.0 can run with a blown head gasket and the 3.6 can’t seen it many times.

@@markserna24 I have not experienced any of those besides an oil leak.