Tragic Flight of the PC-12 Medevac- N273SM | Full ATC+On Guard Calls | Flight Simulator Re-enactment 

Thanks for your sincere comments. That must have been a shaking experience learning about the news so close to home. Very informative to get the true facts about the severity of the weather. Having severe turbulence reported (not light or moderate) plus the icing and significant snow puts a very different light on the decision as a GO or a NO GO. Thanks again and all the best. I have pinned your comment for a period of time.

​@@TheFlightLevelVery well done video sir! Just subbed! Keep it up! And thanks for not overpowering the m usic.

@@billcallahan9303 Thanks very much! I appreciate the support. We try our best to balance the music with information. Blue skies!

Thanks so much for your first hand experience adding to the conversation. So true about not even seeing the taxiway properly - decision made to turn back. I have pinned your comment! Blue skies.

The taxi part, that was a for sure no go. 😔

@@TheFlightLevel I think the other problem is overconfidence in the PC12. It being certified for day and night single pilot IFR and to fly into known icing conditions... They are out in bad weather all the time with a single pilot and successfully completing the missions. That being said the single pilot really isn't set up for success if they experience something like an autopilot failure at night in bad weather. Unfortunately most air medical programs don't have the budget or pilots for two pilot operations but it would definitely improve safety.

I also flew as a flight Paramedic, and agree with Montanamedic 100%. We also used a 3 to go, or 4 in the Diamond Jet, and 1 to no… I flew on the Bell 212, and the Mitsubishi Diamond Jet… I never encountered any pushback by any crew member on a decision to turn back, and I certainly never pushed back… It only happened occasionally, but when you fly a 212 into a fog bank @1500-2000 feet agl, in the hill country, it’ll get your attention… I can’t imagine a chopper in mountains. Condolences to the crew and passengers of this flight. My working career, after Fire/EMS, “offshore drilling,” ended with me flying first in a crew helicopter with CPR on me taking place, along with AED defibrillations, 2 days in a Trinidadian hospital, and then a Jet flight with Reva Air, from Trinidad to Ft. Lauderdale, followed by another jet flight with Reva air from Fl to Texas… I shouldn’t be here, but I am due to the hard work of a lot of folks from Trinidad to Tx… I can state, it’s better being upright treating a patient than it is to be horizontal and being treated… 2.5 weeks unconscious, 60 days in 5 hospitals, in two countries and two states… Side note, it’s a great big world, but a small family… Reva Air is where a close friend of mine was a Command Pilot before he was killed in a car crash. All of the crew on both flights I found out later were also friends of his and had flown with him many times.

@@Firedog9100 Thank you for your story. What an experience and great to hear your spirit and journey with folks that made it possible. I have come to realize that these videos not only convey aviation events but provide a window for some to open up with thanks about their journey with a happy ending. Blue skies to you!

Fabulous comment! You wonder what must have gone through the pilot’s mind at that time missing the taxiway. The pressure to fly despite various warnings for a troubled flight. Thanks for watching!

Thanks for taking the time to tell us this story! What a heart felt sensible decision. No meeting is worth playing the odds against increased weather risk for flight safety. Cheers!

Thanks for watching! Your words certainly add to the mood and atmosphere related to the entire story. Best regards!

What is an “after mate” We aren’t all pilots yaknow

@@travelwithtony5767 Think he meant aftermath.

@@MichaelR-pk8zu I think he just made up the story. lol

@@travelwithtony5767doughball.

Thanks for your insight and experience! I was hoping to get some confirmation in relation to the urgency aspect. So, so tragic for pushing an unnecessary time frame if this was indeed the case for this flight. Blue skies for your helicopter flights!

I concur. Flight medic going on my 28th year. It has only gotten worse in my career.

The number of times I had a patient WALK on to the plane...maddening. I'm sure it's even worse for you whirly-gig guys. It's all a liability-dodge, and we're all paying for it.

@@matthewcoleman1919 yup. Super frustrating to fly out to pick up a patient who clearly doesn’t need a helicopter. Can’t tell you how often it happens where the patient is looking around all excited, having a good time like they’re on a ride at the county fair. There needs to be some kind of decision matrix in the process that will tell the doctors “no, that situation does not warrant an aviation asset”.

Hey clown shoes, how about you stick to flying the planes and let the doctors make the medical decisions? This is the part where you tell me you know more than the doctors?!? The ignorant arrogance in this thread is absolutely ridiculous...

Several in the last few months did same, and died.

Not “severe” weather. No mention of more than light to some moderate turbulence.

Weather well within the capabilities of the aircraft. I have flown the PC12 in similar conditions at night many times it’s designed for this kind of flying

Within the capabilities of the aircraft but not the pilot, clearly. Tragic.

​@@PNGPilot91 I'm sure the dead pilot said the exact same thing.

The audio clip from a nearby residence was also very suggestive of a flat spin.

Thanks for visiting and commenting. The PC-12 is definitely a capable aircraft as you indicate. We can hope there is some movement to enhance the safety and lower the risk with improved measures/guidelines by the responsible parties.

I use to fly TBMs part 135, and the company specifically did not get the single pilot with autopilot opspec to force us to have 2 person crews on all 135 flights for the safety benifit, and so then the SIC, typically a someone newer pilot, could also build time and log it. Since the TBM and PC12 are single pilot only aircraft, you normally cannot log SIC time in it, only the PIC can log the time.

@@noelstoehr965 Great to hear the logistics of your flying experience! Blue skies!

Thanks for your insightful comments! I think your words “icing on the cake” are so true about the situation in question. We certainly hope to see some initiatives to make similar flights safer. Cheers!

More like the straw that broke the camel's back, since icing on the cake would be a term used for something good that is happening. This icing is not good.

@@mediocreman2 Point well taken! Cheers!

No problem! Thanks for your good wishes! Cheers and blue skies!

When you click like 👍🏼 you help the channel. It doesn't mean that you "like" the tragedy but rather the channel owner's work. 😊

@@Alicia-BG Thanks for watching and thanks for explaining! It is funny about the dislikes on a video. The most inspirational and popular video on YT will have dislikes. I assume people hit dislikes because they can, not because of reason. They never leave a comment why they dislike the video. There is a 98% like rate for this video as I type this message, so we are in very good shape. Thanks again. Cheers!

@@TheFlightLevel you're very welcome 🙂

And yet everyone is dead!

@@jerryclayton4616 I did not say nothing happened. Only that it was routine until something happened. This is also why two pilots in airplanes like this is much safer.

@@jerryclayton4616 settle down. We need to evaluate this accident with the information available, so that we can learn from this. Nonsequiter emotional outbursts contributes nothing to the conversation.

@747driver3...Great commentary.. Totally agree with you.....

I have to agree with you. Flying at night in the mountains and being IMC, these cancel each other out. Pilot is on instruments either way. Which ever kicked the autopilot off, ice or turbulence, the pilot should have watched and trusted the instruments. I think the pilot was in his late 20's and if so, he should be fairly fresh to instrument flying. In other words, how does a pilot get so quickly complacent with the use of an autopilot that a pilot forgets the fundamental of IFR flight? There were 2 or 3 crashes like this one in less than a year and I don't understand.

Great to receive your comments! Risk awareness will hopefully enhance the safety of these flights. Cheers!

⁠I was coming here to say exactly the same thing. It is always sad when any accident ends in fatalities, but the way this was presented was excellent.

@@TheGreyAreaBetween Thanks for watching and very glad you enjoyed the structure of the presentation! BTW cool user name!

@@TheFlightLevel Thank you for putting this together. You’ve done a fantastic job and I look forward to what is to come in the future. You certainly deserve the plaudits and appreciation for the work you’ve put into this. As for the username, it was an extension of my band name ‘the grey area’, a name I settled on when trying to figure out what genre I fit into, that being the grey area between various genres whilst never really fitting any. I’m happy you like the name, it’s much appreciated. One day I’ll get round to doing some video work to post things on RU-vid, but that’s a long way off right now I think (I’ve been telling myself I’ll get round to it for the past 15 years).

@@TheGreyAreaBetween Thanks again! I don't rush these videos out the door. Try to gather as much info as possible and edit down between 10 and 15 minutes. Sometimes you are rewarded. Cheers!

Excellent point. It took about a minute for the airplane to resume the correct heading to the BLKJK transition after the first deviation. Wonder how many times the pilot tried to engage the AP after the first disconnect? Thanks for watching!

Thanks for watching and especially commenting. The mix of mountains and desert in Nevada can certainly make for some nasty wind and turbulence. Another vote for a 2 pilot operation in IMC conditions. Blue skies!

Not sure if two pilots would have made much of a difference in this scenario if they both would agree to takeoff. But I guess if the implication is that the presence of two pilots increases likelihood of vetoing the go decision than it would be advisable. Although there are plenty of historical examples of two pilot operations in which poor decisions are made that result in tragedy.

@@VoluntaryPlanet I was talking about in general. Yeah, not that it would have prevented this.

@@nuclearrabbit1 You only have to go about 10 miles from Reno over to Truckee to find an example of why even something as simple as 2 being better than 1 is of course not all that simple (N605TR)

@@VoluntaryPlanet If two pilots are less likely to fly in bad weather there is a problem with one or both of the pilots or the program itself.

Thanks for the visit! I appreciate your words. Cheers!

Thanks very much. I appreciate your support! Quality over quantity! Cheers!

You may have hit the nail on the head, disorientation on the ground caused by snow did not unduly phase the pilot and he corrected it, so I think that there is something missing. My suspicions are that the rudder or elevator started jamming due to ice or snow. In this situation, attempts to clear them by movement can make things a whole lot worse. If the aircraft was not responding to inputs normally, they should have aborted the flight and got back on the ground. Sadly we will never know whether the pilot was in this situation, but I would have thought that the pilot was unable to carry out the correct first rule in an emergency, which is to manually fly straight and level. Needless to say, that is assuming that you are not heading towards high terrain.

That was my thinking too when I watched Juan's analysis with the ADSB data: icing. However, the initial turn was corrected. What happens later is less clear. This story does not show it but not long after the suspected autopilot disconnect, and subsequent heading departure and correction, there are large variations of speed that are not accompanied by the expected variation in altitude, i.e. speed getting very low, as in a high pitch up attitude, but without the climb that should happen if trading a/s for altitude with preserved climb power. That is very suspicious for a sharp decrease in performance as seen in severe ice contamination. A possibility would be propeller icing and the associated vibrations, which would have led the pilot to reduce power while simultaneously pitching up to maintain altitude. Another is tailplane icing, ever increasing force to keep a level attitude until running out completely, and a subsequent tailplane stall, leading to the extreme nose down attitude necessary to build enough a/s for inflight breakup.

@@pchantreau So many unanswered questions. My thoughts were that ice on the tailplane jammed the rudder and elevators. We have no detailed information on the situation in the cabin. If the patient was on a table prepped for surgery, this could have rolled forward upsetting the trim. In reality, their was probably a combination of circumstances that brought the aircraft down

Hey, good to have you on board for your support! Cheers!

Thank you for watching and commenting. Certainly, a second pilot can make a significant impact on reducing the stress and workload, especially for IMC flights. Extremely unfortunate that we will not have a definitive answer for this flight. PS: You may want to check the first two words of your comment (highlighted to a link?)

Or a second pilot would just have added another fatality. Look at all the two pilot crew aircraft that crash.

Thanks for watching! Quality over quantity! Cheers!

Absolutely! As if the turbulence wasn’t enough, just chilling to imagine the last 30-60 seconds of the aircraft descent for all on board.

Yes, very chilling to think about the last 30-60 seconds in such an accelerated descent.

Thanks for visiting! I am not aware of any de-icing or anti-icing info for this flight. Perhaps someone from the Reno airport can chime in about de-icing protocol for the Medevac flights.

I am glad you said this. I totally agree.

Thanks for your words! Interesting about not knowing the patient’s condition re influencing the decision to fly. Risk assessment definitely needs to be modified to avoid a similar tragedy! Cheers!

Thanks very much for your very descriptive story. Great to hear how these experiences shake down. You are here to tell your adventures because of informed risk aversive decisions. Cheers to you!

Thanks for commenting! Perhaps the pilot was not ahead of deicing. As you indicate, icing can bring down a plane very quickly.

Second pilot for sure could have helped too.

Thanks for your comments and support. Yes, error on the time zone notation. Good catch! Once in a while the odd mistake slips through the editing. Cheers!

@@TheFlightLevel Absolutely understand. Outside of that I liked the vid (and time standard is not a huge impact such as forgetting about victims during these breakdowns as I've seen in other productions.) QUESTION: How did you produce the sim. Is that DCS or something else?

@@skibum415 The sim is Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020. Thanks again for watching and commenting!

Thanks so much for your first hand experience. As you mention, severe turbulence puts a different light on the exact weather conditions. Overwhelming is a great descriptive in addition to the stress encountered in flight. I have personally returned to my departing airport a couple of times due to unexpected severe turbulence. Glad everything worked out for you on that flight. It shakes you. Blue skies!

Cheers

Thanks for your words and perspective! Getting some terrific stories with this video. Understandable about upper management pressure to fly; but improved operations and decisions need to outweigh unnecessary risk. Glad to hear you are on the right side of the grass with your excellent risk management decisions! Fabulous!

Did you FLY fixed wing and Rotary Wing? Or did you fly IN fixed wing and rotary wing?

@@heartlandhawk4513 We all fly in the aircraft, just depends on which seat you keep warm while flying, some right, some left, some in the back with the cargo.

Absolutely. It is very difficult to understand the urgency to put the patient through a known turbulent flight at the minimum, let alone the outcome.

Thanks for watching and thanks for your insight!

Been flying Fixed Wing and RW EMS for decades. 40 years as a pilot with over 11K hours. I NEVER HAVE HAD WEATHER DECISIONS SECOND GUESSESD. EVER. If anyone has their weather decisions second guessed as a pilot RUN! The safety culture is severely lacking.

@@heartlandhawk4513 Glad you worked for more ethical companies/company than I did. The safety record industry wide is terrible. Especially among the rotors. It didn't break my heart that after a year of EMS I was able to move on. And heres the kicker....the poor patient who is already sick or injured thinks they are on their way to better treatment and then they end up dead.

Hopefully the final NTSB will shed more light on the exact cause(s). The in-flight break up occurred during the final minute during the rapid descent when the plane entered the spiral. The airframe was overstressed with the excessive G forces.

Good catch. Should be Pacific Standard Time! Pacific Daylight Time (PDT) is a North American time zone in use from the second Sunday in March to the first Sunday in November during Daylight Saving Time (DST). Pacific Standard Time (PST) is used during the remainder of the year. Thanks for watching!

I thought the same thing when seeing the right side of the windshield intact! So much of the airframe ripped and twisted and/or separated. Can’t answer that one!

I think you are 100% correct from the info available. There was no urgency to fly in poor weather conditions. Logistics and risk management really need to be evaluated when human lives are put at risk above safety and transport urgency.

Thanks so much for taking the time to post your thoughts. If you are correct about the air transportation not being needed, this is all the more tragic. I wondered when making the video if the necessity for air transportation was made public. We can only hope that awareness here will change policy to reduce/prevent these accidents.

Thanks for watching and thanks for your comment. Cheers!

Thanks for joining in! We know exactly what you mean. It is very difficult to imagine the urgency that resulted in losing 5 individuals rather than waiting for better weather.

They are being flown poorly.

Instrument meteorological conditions - you fly by referring to the airplane panel gauges. On guard refers to pilots and air traffic controllers that transmit on a frequency in attempt to contact an aircraft that is not responding.

I like the way you think! I wish more people would (could) think. I was an Air Ambulance pilot, flying this very aircraft, and her sister ship 5SM. based there in Reno. We flew in bad weather all the damn time! Ever been to Reno in the Winter time?? Ask the Donner party 😅 These people were working to save someone's life! Imagine calling and needing an Ambulance, and they tell you to "hang in there little camper, until the weather gets better" Lots of people second guessing-- very sad 😢 and extremely disrespectful.

Hey Scooter, I guess you've seen it all, haven't ya'? Even with a lite dusting of snow on a dark night, could obscure the taxi stripe-- I've seen it several times... You must have too with your vast Aeronautical experience-- So why the need to talk smack about a pilot who was working to help save someone's life?? You're a real jewel 😊

And the trouble with letting medics and nurses make decisions about what weather is safe to fly in, is like me (the pilot) telling them how to care for the patient! At some point, people need to stay in their lane and recognize that they have a very limited knowledge of a topic. My nurses, and paramedics trusted me to know what was safe-- and I took that extremely serious. Nobody likes being scared in an airplane

Thanks for watching! Yes, very hard with the criteria you list to come out logging a successful flight every time under turbulent IMC conditions.

Copy! That is my British versus American English shining through. Thanks for watching!

Thanks for watching. No, I am not the NTSB. I just use the information in the public reports to summarize the flights.

@@TheFlightLevel u have ntsb logo

@@holobolo1661 Yes, important to credit the appropriate authorities for your source material with authenticity.

@@TheFlightLevel wow they gave it to u thats so cool. maybe one day u can work for them. good job

Thanks for watching! The majority here share your view. Someone indicated that this flight was not urgent and the patient could have been transported by ground or the next day. All the more tragic if this was indeed the case. Cheers!

Thanks! MSFS is a great program to add an extra dimension of realism and presence to the story. Cheers!

No one said turbulence was the cause of the

@@sixwillwin They said turbulence knocked off the auto pilot and then the pilot got special disorientation.

@@MidnightWarrior1976 nobody knows because the pilot is dead. And you don’t need an auto pilot to fly an airplane in turbulence. By definition, light and moderate turbulence is almost an every day occurrence.

@@sixwillwin The video specifically said that turbulence knocked off the auto pilot which then left a confused cockpit who went down from the EXTREMELY COMMON spatial orientation. (JFK Jr.) Exactly what part of that do you not understand?

@@MidnightWarrior1976 OK somebody on RU-vid said it’s true so it must be. What do I know about it? I flew air ambulance in King Airs for 31 years! I’ve flown 8000 patients in those 31 years. Yeah I know a little bit about it…. Now tell me your qualifications? Oh, you watch RU-vid. Got it.

Telling them no is pretty common. The pilot does not know, nor do they care, about patient condition.

@@heartlandhawk4513 I'm saying that a bad pilot could let this cloud his judgement. That's what the E in PAVE is for

The aircraft broke apart from exceeding its maximum safe speed before it hit the ground. An aircraft hitting the ground in several pieces in free fall is gonna have less energy than an aircraft hitting the ground in one piece with the engine running.

Thanks for commenting. Your key words are "unnecessary urgency". We can only hope that videos like this enhance awareness and move the powers to be towards safer guidelines for medical evacuations.

You don't know what you're talking about.