Two Evils - Jin Guangyao & Nie Huaisang | The Untamed FMV 

The same argument can be made for Meng Yao with an added element of familial & social abuse and victimization.

@@blackgold2521 I don't know... They both pretty smart but the difference is, Nie can keep it a secret and actually can handle it when people still mock him... Yao always had a temper when it came to some special words. (If you know what I mean...) so I wouldn't put him on the same page with Nie. Also, Yao had a BIG problem with his revenge wish... I mean, isn't that what makes a villain? Of course you can excuse him like "but he was always misunderstood and not loved enough blah-" (Well, Nie always was misunderstood then...) and of course you can say that Nie also wanted revenge for his brother, but actually he not only planned Yaos death for revenge, Yao also blamed others (Wei Wuxian) and did some naughty things with his power as Clan leader, so you can call Nies plan to kill Yao, "an act for greater good". His dead also helped other people and the truth they gained from it was necessary for Wei Wuxians "innocence". You couldn't trust Yao but you could trust Nie, because he still can put others above himself and act responsible. (wow I sound like I'm really going against Yao. That was not the plan, they're both humans and some are more like this and some more like that...) You can call them what you want but I just want to make sure that this both characters are DEFENETLY not alike and Nie was A LOT less villain than Yao could ever be...

@@blackgold2521 In my mind the thing that mostly separates them is that Jin Guangyao kept doing iffy things in pursuit of even more power, even after he had reached his goal of being not only head of the Jin clan, but Chief Cultivator. Nie Huaisang's conversation with Wei Wuxian the very last time they meet makes it seem like now that he's achieved his revenge, he's done with the manipulation. Jin Guangyao's story is a tragedy because he absolutely was treated terribly, and for a good deal of the story he was an underdog you could root for, but as someone who has experienced abuse myself I think it's also important to not use it as an excuse or dismissal for bad behavior. (It's not as obvious in the Untamed as it is in the book but Nie Huaisang also grew up in a likely somewhat abusive environment where he was constantly on edge - his father died of a qi deviation, meaning that as a child he would have been around an irritable man with a sword much like his brother near his own end. And in the novel, Nie Mingjue burns Huaisang's art and fans and actually attacks him during a qi deviation, injuring his arm and leg. It's not the same type of abuse and neglect that Jin Guangyao had, for sure, but it is another interesting parallel between them.)

@@foozlesprite He didn't continue doing as much as trying to "maintain" the shit he started or it would all fall apart. It's not like he would be able to become a saint with Xue Yang around. A dude who knows EVERYTHING he's done & can spill his secrets at any time & can drop receipts that HE [Jin Guangyao] can't hide. He was just on losers ride to hell really. Even if he really wanted to stop. It's not like you can expect him (JGY) to really STOP when his frenemy (XY) would like holding his (JGY) sins over his head b/c he (XY) likes doing bad things & wants to keep doing it.

Right-

What do u mean?

Sounds like Once upon a time concept :)

@@areeshadodo3485He is the one who gave Mo Xuanyu the idea of resurrecting Wei Ying. He also helped Wei Ying and Lan Zhan in their investigation against JGY.

very true... very true... 👀🤭🤫

Infect he is very powerful he was the one who got wei wuxian back,also he was the one who put nie mingjue in the box thingy with all the smoke

No one remembers that he once loved Meng Yao before he became Jing GuangYao

I've watched the untamed about 2 times and im still confused as to why nie huaisang is evil ,can you please explain to me

Hello!! He wanted revenge for what Jin Guangyao did to his brother, Nie Mingjue. To do this he manipulated people (Mo Xuanyu into sacrificing himself to bring back Wei Wuxian supposedly, and also Lan Xichen at the end of the show into stabbing Jin Guangyao. Also pretty sure he stabbed himself in that scene and blamed SuShe?). His manipulation for revenge is what makes his morals questionable, I think is the general consensus! Hope this helps!

May I add, what is right, what​ is wrong?☑️❌, ⚫⚪?

Agreed....I have nothing but admiration for this man

@@angelinemnyavanu4707 but did he have to use the most innocent man in the whole story for is vengeance?The one who always just wanted to help. Use him and destroy his soul for ever. NH imo is evil and a coward.

thank you so much! ❤️ i agree, they’re each very complex, it’s one of my favorite things about the story ☺️

Yeah. He literally had no one left. Everyone he cared about was dead or gone in some way. I truly pitied him for carrying his grief by himself only to be left even more alone after avenging his only family.

yay thank you! ❤️ It was actually a happy coincidence, i was struggling with the ending and the audio fit perfectly there! 😂

Compared to the Jin Guangyao and his evil daddy NHS has a super low body count (in the show). In the Burial Mounds scene with Su She it's been pointed out he was the only Nie there. He was willing to risk himself, but not his disciples.

I hate MengYao and don't find any redeemable qualities in him. He was all about greed and power. He killed absolutely anyone who block his path. He is nothing different from Xu Yang. NHS on the contrary is not remotely evil. He know he can't never win by himself against MengYao that's why he planned everything carefully. Some of his schemes were risky and he put the juniors at risk but his intent were never to kill anyone. His goal was only to eliminate MengYao and avenge his brother.

@@zelulu1000 Same! I tried to like Meng Yao, but I can't find any redeeming qualities. Once it turned out he killed almost all the prostitutes after forcing them to have sex with a Corpse I wanted the character to die. That was so messed up to do to those poor women :(

@@maximesaindon3552 Meng Yao wasn't pure evil. He built the lookout towers to protect common people, which no noble has ever cared about. He truly cared for LX, his nephew and his sister, the only people who have ever shown him respect despite his status. Of course, he committed crimes, I'm not trying to exuse them. But seeing MY as a purely evil character is just missing the whole point of the novel/drama which strongly enforces the idea of there being no such thing as good/bad, it is simply a matter of perspective. In the scene where MY dies, you can see that WWX is the last person to exit the temple. Before that, he just stand there and looks at MY with tears in his eyes, because he understands like no other what it feels like to be broken beyond repair. MY has been abused for his whole life. While WWX grew up as a first disciple surrounded by loving siblings and a loving "step-father", MY grew up in a brothel with only his beloved mother who was constantly abused. And to think that despite all of his intelligence and talents, people still thought he had no right to exist just because he was a bastard and because of his mother's profession, the things he neither chose nor could change. People who grow up like that just don't come out unscathed. His desire for recognition, for proving his right to exist led him astray, but I believe that had MY grew up in a loving family, had he not been abused all his life, he could have been absolutely brilliant, with all his talents and intelligence.

@@zelulu1000 MY was never about greed and power. His mother wished for him to become his father's son, and MY eventually became obsessed with the idea. All the crimes he committed after being accepted into the Jin clan was folloving JGH's orders in order to gain his father's recognition and love. Eventually he understood that was never going to happen and set his mind on taking revenge for his mother and for himself. And isn't revenge the reason you condone NH's actions?

thank you so much!! ❤️ i totally agree, when I was listening to songs for video inspiration I immediately thought of these two’s arcs and the similarities (and slight differences). also omg your fanfic inspo ?! pls drop a link if you want 💕☺️💕

tencitizens Ahhh 🙈 Right now its still Niebro-centric but later on it will be Nieyao. Not a lot of people like the ship so the fic might not be to your taste. Do you still want the link 😅?

yaaaaassss all fic is good fic!! 💕😂

tencitizens Here it is archiveofourown.org/works/20987693/chapters/49908308 When I write about NHS and JGY meeting I’ll be sure to link your vid. Its going to be so juicy hahahaha

ahhh thank you!! I’ll be sure to check it out!! ☺️

The last sentence of your comment gave me chills 👍

Watch the spinoff, Fatal Journey

@@LindaTran88 I watched that but what I mean is his physical strength.

thank you so much!! 💕

thank you so much! ☺️

thank you so much!! ☺️💕

thank you!! ❤️ I’m really glad you like the lyrics, it’s my first time trying this style hehe 😅

🥺 thank you so much!!! ❤️

thank you! 🥰

thank you so much!!! ❤️ I think so too! I loved Fatal Journey but I wanted more between these two 👀

But JGY literally did stop everything after killing his father. If you follow the timeline, you'll see that his father's assassination was the last "evil" project of his. But years later his past caught up with him. Also, JGY never hungered for power. Literally never. The only thing he desired was his father's recognition and becoming a Jin, because that's what his mother kept on telling him he must do. So he did everything his father asked from him. And when he realized JGS will never love him, he took revenge. It was never about power. Also, do you really think NHS's gaslighting deranged MX into killing himself isn't evil? Putting the lives of the disciples in danger isn't evil?

So why did JGY kill his father's children then? Don't tell me they also did evil to him, why did he try to kill WWX, you know he was the one who told his father and led everyone to believe that WWX had yin iron which was why the whole issue started, why did he manipulate the last battle where WWX killed himself, why did he keep experimenting with the stygian amulet after WWX, he and XY tried to make fierce puppets, why did he do that, why did he kidnap the disciples of the clans including his own cousin, and put them in the burial mound to be killed by puppets, why did he tell SS and his disciples to play chaos music so all the clans will lose their spirit power and become puppet food? Mind you this was after he killed his father, and was head of the clan, btw his wife wasn't pregnant out of wedlock he slept with her, and then killed the child cuz he knew the child was an abomination. JGY was a sickening person, ok he wasn't loved enough and stuff but he could easily have risen above that and made a name for himself, he was extremely smart, strong, and had someone who was willing to support him but he didn't, let's not forget he tried to use his cousin to block the sword wen ning threw at him in the end and that was why LZ cut off his arm. He was just plain evil and power-hungry, but he always tries to justify himself, and that's the difference between him and NHS

thank you!! 💕

thank you! 🥰

Thank you!! 🥰

He is the one who planned everything from bringing back wei wuxian to the end where he pretended mang yao was going to attack zawu jun*. That's why in the last scene wei wuxian said, "lan sect has an important rule, "Dont make friends with evil"

He's not a villain, he was just driven by revenge to kill JGY using him to kill his brother. Let's not forget WWX also wanted to kill someone for breaking his nephews bracelet.

i have to rewatch the entire thing, it’s been ages i’ve forgotten the entire storyline

hi! Those scenes were from the spinoff movie - The Untamed: Fatal Journey ☺️

WWX is a bit of a hypocrite. However I think Lan Zhan understands NHS. He also killed a lot of people to protect the burial mounds and it seems like he acknowledges what he did was bad, but equally bad people got away. In thr drama LWJ is very quick to say JGY is guilty which makes me wonder....

I mean, they were at war. At some point “a soldier who happened to be born in a different country” can’t be expected to be treated like an innocent.

I think that last conversation between WWX and NHS indicates that WWX really did understand. And didn't cast blame either. But one of the things I really like about NHS, and why I consider him less evil than JGY, Is that NHS understands himself better than JGY does. He's aware of his flaws and defects, and nasty tendencies and controls them as best he can. THIS is what really makes the difference, in my not at all humble opinion!

Absolutely, and that makes him a changed man after death. He is no different, he has flaws and mishaps, and he did kill because he couldn't control his anger. But at last he self destructs himself upon realizing the horror he unleased after the death of his shijie.

Let's say both of them

It was the mob, the people.

Meng yao

In the show? Meng Yao. He killed his dad (super understandable), but then killed the prostitutes involved, either killed his son or let him die when he could've done something, Shiije's death, NMJ (and if you watch Fatal Journey trust me you'll really understand NHS' hatred towards JGY). NHS did bad things, but he also did a lot of good and his stuff is manipulation. He can manipulate people, but they still have free will which is probably why it took a decade to get justice & revenge. Final verdict of evilness would be JGY/Meng Yao > NHS.

@@maximesaindon3552 NHS's manipulation is no different from MY's. NHS made MX kill himself. He was also willing to bring shame upon MY's wife, who has never done a thing wrong. He manipulated LXC into killing the person he cared deeply about, making him blame himself for the rest of his life for it. And you still say NHS is better than MY? I would say his position in life was better. MY had to fight tooth and nail for the scrapes of recognition, while NHS had a secured position in society, being a sect heir. But when he set a goal, he didn't hesitate while disposing of casualties. I love both characters, but I undestand they both did wrong things and none is better than the other. Also, strictly speaking, MY is not a villain, WR is. In literature terms, he, XY and NHS are more anti-heroes.

WW literally killed three thousand people before committing suicide. NH made MX kill himself to ressurect WWW in order to carry out his revenge. None of these characters can be defined as good or bad, it is just a matter of perspective. But you can't defend WW and NH and badmouth MY without sounding hypocritical. Even more so if you take in consideration that MY had it much worse as a child. WW and NH had loving families and respect. MY had no one, and was constantly made to listen to people offending him and his beloved perished mother. Society just broke him and then called him evil, isn't that so very rightful and just.

@@user-qn1ly4wg8y MXY was already suicidal and on verge on committing suicide. NHS only gave him the tool to have his vengeance done after his death. The mob that persecuted WWX and push him to have a mental breakdown are responsible for the thousand people WWX killed when he lost control. I have never considered NHS or WWX perfect but for what i know they have never intended to kill innocent people for power or greed. To say that because MY has a fucked up childhood is somehow an excuse for all the murders he chose to do in order to climb and maintain power is mind-boggling to me. Marrying his sister and killing her... Did she ever humiliated him or his mother? Killing the sect leader who refuse the construction of the towers and eradicating his entire clan, was it because this sect leader and the countless innocent members of his sect humiliated him and his beloved mother.... Letting XY go in his rampant killing spray was it because he was humiliated and his beloved mother? What a fuckup logic!

hey guys! I love discussing the Untamed, and thank you for watching my video! Let’s keep it nice here in the comments and respect everyone’s different opinions, it’s one of my favorite aspects of this show ☺️

@@tencitizens Sorry, i somehow come a bit harsh when commenting passionately but i really have not a single ill feeling toward any of the Untamed fans commenting here. :-) Pasionnate discussions are not to be taken as hostility if so the world will really be full of hypocrites unable to tell what they think or how they feel.

@@zelulu1000 You're not making any sense. The mob who treated WWX bad is at fault for WWX's killing thousands of people, but somehow the very same mob who also treated JGY awfully isn't at fault for JGY's killings? How is that even supposed to work? Double standards? Also, where is it written or shown that MX was suicidal before meeting NHS? And even if he was, you think it's alright to nudge him to off himself? Because it is not alright. JGY did not kill his sister, I suggest you rewatch the show before hating the character for things he didn't do. And he married her to save her reputation, because they conceived a child before the wedding, when they had not been aware of their relation. I also don't understand how you came up with the idea that JGY committed all his crimes for power. He didn't. It was because he craved to get recognition from his father! All his childhood his mother had been telling him that he was supposed to become a Jin, so of course he became obsessed with the idea. Only when he finally understood his father would never love him did he decide to kill him. And yes, a lot of things he did were in the name of his beloved mother, who was sold to a brothel where she was raped and humiliated till her death. And yes, having a shitty childhood is a good explanation, because human psychology is formed during childhood when the brain is still developing. Imagine little MY watching his mother, the only person in the world who loved him and cared for him, suffering there, being raped and humiliated by all those noble cultivators. Imagine all of them calling his beloved mother a whore on a daily basis. Imagine being pushed down the stairs by your own father, and having no one to turn to for help, having all those noble cultivators laughing at you for being naive and wanting to be accepted. So no, I do not excuse his actions, but I also do not blame JGY for how he turned out. The mob did everything in its power to create the monster, and then was surprised when the monster turned against them.