My dad now 85 years old and doing well was a tank mechanic in Korea no combat , thank God but he kept the tanks on TRACK he was an excellent automatic transmission rebuilder in the 60s and 70s retirement in the late 90 s and now we brothers and my son have a job rebuilding automatic transmissions called Edwards Brothers transmissions ROANOKE RAPIDS NC
@@RobertFothergill-u1z well, I think Washington NC IS near the southern coast I'm on the Virginia border on I - 95 ROANOKE RAPIDS NC , I'LL BE GLAD to help you out with any automatic transmission needs
The skew gears were a source of problems throughout the life of RR engines. They have very high pressure contact points. P.S. Ducati used bevel gears in their camshaft drives and were considered to be completely fail safe.
@@neilmchardy9061 very true I was racing with various Ducati and never had any problems with the bevel gears, confirmed by my Ducati friends! But the pistons and the roll bearings are stressed crankshaft and is considered a bit weak. Regarding the Rolls-Royce Merlin the bevel gears required very careful precision work...
@@neilmchardy9061 But at the same time, well designed (helix angle, tolerances) skew gears are inherently more durable than straight cut gears. I totally agree that Ducati's "coppie coniche" bevel gears are fantastic in their engines (heck! as an italian biker a Ducati was/is a prime choice also for the desmodromic valve train design!), but in the end it's a very different engine with different acceptable maintenance timetables from a V8 Tank engine
I'd love to know how many full size Offy engines were built because I'm sure the number would be shockingly low. The block was notoriously hard to cast and it's said that only one small foundry on Oakland cast all of them. Others tried but no one claimed success. What I really would love to know is what was the Offy that started the Indy 500 the most times. My bet is at least 10. I consider the DGS engine an offy and the last time a Offy/DGS started it finished third. They dissipated so quickly because the Cosworth DFX was more economical than trying to make more Offy parts. Of course the same could be said for the FOYT/FORD V8 which powered AJ to his fourth win in 1977 and was gone from AJ's car in 1978.
My dad was a GM man before the war and a Cadillac man in the 50s,60s, and 70s, but he always bought Ford trucks for his business. Dad was with the Third Armored Division and he said the Ford powered tanks never let them down ever. He was glad his tank had the Ford V8 during the Bulge.
At the Ohio State fair ,1969 tractor pulls. Back then, modified tractors were powered by BB Chevrolets and other auto designed equipment. The Modified's pulled the best distance was 240 feet. Then this Minneapolis Moline 1000 that had been pulled around all day staged. When he started that monster, it had a low roar that one knew something great was going to happen. He pulled 287 ft. and the only thing stopped him a water line had blew off and the driver was getting scalded. After he returned to the pits, we ran down to see what powered it ? The driver said it was a Sherman tank engine. For a bunch of 18 year old's that was better than any ride at the fair! I'll never forget the torque that thing made.
When I was about 12 years old I was riding my bike around my neighborhood and happened to see into my neighbors open gate that he had one of the biggest engines I had ever seen. Of course with my mechanical obsession I had to go take a look. Turns out it was a ford GAA tank engine that my neighbor Barry was building to put into a car hauler to move his show cars. became my friend for many many years god rest his soul. We never did end up finishing that project but hearing that engine start up for the first time with its coffee tin sized pistons when I must’ve been around 15 years old was an amazing experience. I learned so much getting the opportunity to work on such a specialized engine at an early age just by chance. He was a really cool dude. Also worked a lot on his stutz race car another experience I’ll never forget.
That is what engineering is capable of when you dont have a budget but want it RIGHT....Most car manufacturers have a budget that does not allow this kind of engineering.
Now Ford makes engines that have wet belts that fail in under 30k miles, water pumps in the oil jacket - so that when the pump leaks the water is in the oil and destroys the engine. The drive train is so convoluted that mechanics need tons of hours just to get to the problem. Lets get back to the car manufacturers of the 1940's.
Awe, poor boomer doesn't understand modern tech... 1940s engines had 50hp and got 10mpg out of a 6 liter displacement ,so I don't think anybody wants to go back to the 1940s.
Yeah poor boomer who understands modern tech and wants to revert back to the 40’s when things lasted more than 5 years. I’ll take the 50 hp that I can expect reliability out of. I’ll pay the extra money in fuel. Thats cheaper in the long run. That’s the cheat code us smarter millennials learned. Never underestimate wisdom. Can’t learn that in college. Oh how’s that working out for you. 😂 It’s not that’s why you want us to pay for that as well. That boomer you’re talking about…That built the in infrastructure we still use…That we wouldn’t have with your mindset…he didn’t have his hand out expecting anything.
I read an article some years back (wish I could remember who wrote it) They were talking about why the automotive industry can't find enough qualified mechanics They blame it on mechanics not keeping up with modern technology I blame it on the "labor guide" not keeping up with modern technology!!!
Brian, you have managed to capture the innate curiosity of the ever wondering gear head mind combined with enthusiasm for interesting historical context translated into video form for another awesome watch.
One of the best engines that almost no one has heard of! What I like best about the engine, well besides the sound it makes, is the lack of chain drive for the camshaft. Todays engines, including Ford, some of the weak points are the chain drive. This is a fantastic engine. Kids today have no idea what came out of WWII and how it is benefiting them in their rice rockets. You can definitely tell that the Merlin was the inspiration, but Ford did what Ford does best and that was to make it cheaper and faster to build. Europe today still over engineers their engines, making them costly to build and repair, however they do produce some nice machines. Great video, thank you.
Cam chains are fine, but they need small links to handle the inertial forces at the crank sprockets. Duplex or triple row to handle the loads and adequate oil jets.
Timing belts are a problem, chains are not. Properly spec'd, a timing chain will outlive the engine. My wife's Ford Edge is a DOHC with phasers and has the original chain at 260K miles. I changed the pump 5 years ago and cheaped out and just changed the pump. Still running.
War, or, better said, the military, are behind the modern evolution of so many things in automotive, weapons (duh!), aviation, engineering, metallurgy, medicine, pharmacy, communications, electronics, etc. Without the power of states and the immense dedicated budget (a good chunk of which isn't even in the public knowledge) we would not enjoy the world as it is today. Just saying... internet was originally a military project (in 1969, at the peak of the Cold War, the US DoD’s Advanced Research Projects Agency started building a network of computers before universities and other government research centers were eventually looped into the network. It was ARPAnet, from which, after many years, the world wide web evolved
I saw a couple of GAA's on pulling tractors in the late 70's/early 80's. People weren't modifying them for power back then, and naturally aspirated big block Chevies could beat them. I had a friend in Phoenix, AZ about 15 years ago that had one he was going to put in a street car. I visited him and he showed me the innards. It was quite an achievement of design that was far advanced from Ford's typical flathead 4's and V8's.
Brian, I’ve been a gear head my entire life and never knew anything about these engines. I’m 68 now and love learning from every one of your videos! The podcasts, too. I read an “alternate” reason why Ford refused to build the Merlin: supposedly he said he couldn’t produce it to Rolls-Royce’s high precision standards, and Packard said Ha! Hold my beer and watch this. This story was told by a Packard enthusiast who evidently got the story wrong. It figures Henry Ford was on the wrong side of history. I daily a restored 1931 Ford Model A Roadster, and love it, but that Henry Ford was a really bad guy. Keep it up Brian! I can’t wait for your next history lesson!
It was the other way round, the Americans were into high volume production and parts interchangeability. They couldn't believe how low the precision standards were on the Merlin and effectively blue printed it. i.e. built it to much higher tolerances than Rolls Royce ever could with their older machinery. The RR Derby engines were originally virtually hand built with parts matched by tolerance, so yes, you could end up with a precision engine but it took too long to manufacter each one. When I worked in the drawing office at JCB excavators in the mid 80's our chief engineer who was about to retire saw war time srevice in the merlin factory and was charged with checking component tolerances and went into great detail about this.
@@russellmills4878 You are absolutely correct. Ford expertise was of course Mass Production and that requires high precision. With a capital intensive operation such as say the Rouge plant you cant afford to have the assembly line go down. If the parts coming into that line are not consistent the line stops and you are now burning money, in wages and the idle machinery you paid millions for. On a trip to England I visited a Birmingham museum that was mostly dedicated to the history of the textile industry. But there was a display of a Ford built Merlin (not a GAA) in the museum, because the plant had been located in Birmingham. In the description in front of this engine was the story of the British government reaching out to Ford to produce the engine because Rolls Royce could not produce engine in the quantities needed. The British War department paid for the plant, and the machinery Ford needed to be able to produce the Merlin in the numbers required for aircraft production. That description with the display included the fact that Ford had to take the RR blueprints, and rework them for mass production, as the RR blueprints were overly reliant on the craftsmanship of their regular rank and file employees.
Rolls-Royce was still hand building merlin engines using obsolete methods of fitting individual parts to an engine, with no interchangeability between one engine and another... completely unsuitable for American standards and production volumes. Britian desperately needed more engines and looked to America for a solution. Ford turned down the Merlin offer for good reasons. Packard had excess capacity and won the contract. the rest is history.
In my first reply, I tried my best to keep it as short as possible but there is yet more to know about this story for a full understanding. First of all, Henry Ford was a pacifist who absolutely detested war of any kind. So, prior to Pearl Harbor and the entry of the U.S. into the war, Henry Ford was not open to the production of any war material. That explains his refusal to produce the Merlin in any of his North American factories. After Pearl Harbor and formal declarations of war of course Ford plants were duly converted to the production of any number of critical components for the American war effort. These included Jeeps, and most famously the B-24 bomber built in Willow Run in an entirely new plant designed expressly for bomber production. However, prior to Ford Motor Companies' reorganization of their international operations which took place in the 1960's the overseas operations were separate companies with a mixture of ownership between the Ford parent company and local ownership. Henry wanted local ownership of significant amounts of the stock so that their operations would not be regarded as outsiders in each of those countries. That is how Ford came to produce Merlin engines in Birmingham (see my previous comment with the details of that) and why the British war department had to pay for the plant and the tooling so Ford of Britain could build those Merlin's in the quantities needed. Henry would not have allowed the production of Merlin's in the Dagenham plant.
Heidrich Performance is the RU-vid channel with the GAA Mustang, it used to be called the Locomotive Breath channel or something like that. Cool stuff.
@@ldnwholesale8552they also made a V8 version, my friend Pete Grieve is working on one for a drag racing Land Rover. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-CgV9skMYLxo.htmlsi=uI8dTF4DcrORb4Qn
The Meteor had an 8 cylinder version too. My friend Peter Grieve is working on a turbocharged one for his drag racing Land Rover. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-CgV9skMYLxo.htmlsi=uI8dTF4DcrORb4Qn
I remember being surprised to discover how many tanks were powered with aero motors until I realized that power-to-weight ratio is as important in a tank as an aircraft.
Correct on the pulling use The only one currently running (in the US anyway) that I know of is Doug Roberts of Carthage, MO called The Patriot. Twin turbo on alcohol.
Wow, this is the best video of the Ford GAA I've ever seen. With regard to how Ford came into possession of the Merlin blueprints a little known fact is that Ford produced Merlin engines for the British War department in a plant in Birmingham England. On a trip to England I visited a Birmingham museum that was mostly dedicated to the history of the textile industry. But there was a display of a Ford built Merlin (not a GAA) in the museum, because the plant had been located in Birmingham. In the description in front of this engine was the story of the British government reaching out to Ford to produce the engine because Rolls Royce could not produce engine in the quantities needed. The British War department paid for the plant, and the machinery Ford needed to be able to produce the Merlin in the numbers required for aircraft production. That description with the display included the fact that Ford had to take the RR blueprints, and rework them for mass production, as the RR blueprints were overly reliant on the craftsmanship of their regular rank and file employees.
A Barra turbo 6, Whipple Coyote, and GAA are the Ford engines I've always wanted to swap. If you could get one of these to fit in a 32 5 window or 4 door Lincoln Continental with a pair of 91 or 98mm turbos it would be just so damn cool.
What a guy Maurice Olly was , The problem is that there were Thousands of guys and women like him whose effort helped turn the tide in the second world war , that were never personally thanked for what they achieved . I think we should all say thank you .
This is such a great American story by a ruthless business man. This was very well narrirated and explained. I really enjoyed listening and watching it. Thank you for sharing.
Yes, you have got the story. I have tried to spread the story M. Ollie told in his book but who would expect such a story from a book with that title? My personal opinion was that Ford thought they could build better than the R-R engine and were trying to get the Pentagon to except the Ford engine as a substitute for the Merlin and they failed. Interesting that Knudsen was the former president of GM and it leaves the question in my mind, was he looking out for Allison by blocking the Ford V12? Also interesting that the Mustang was built by North American Aviation which was also majority owned by GM. So many interesting things to investigate here. The Mustang was built at the British request but not with the Merlin, though they wasted little time in installing Merlins in Mustangs when they had them. The British also ordered P-38 lightings without the counter rotating turbocharged engines they normally had, which brings the question 'were they just wanting Lighting airframes that they would install Merlin engines in? I can only wonder.
@@robertbihn3005 Yes, accept, as substitute for Rolls Royce engines the contract was written for. Ford thought they had "a better idea" about aircraft engines. All indications were that they may have been right but they tried to sell it the wrong way.
They had asked Depression-Era America to pony up taxes to pay the huge sunken investment in aero engines so they were not to be discarded lightly. Folks back home heard a breath of scandal about procurement - it could be Administration-Ending.
Nicely put Brian I thought I had a decent handle on this motor then you dropped that bomb of a military document on me. I still continue to drool over this motor after finding out about it as a teenager in the mid to late 90s. Thanks for telling its story.
The other main advantage of the Ford design: 80 octane fuel. Compared to the 100+ required by the Merlin and Meteor tank version. Cheaper and a whole lot safer to operate, especially in combat vehicles.
The Merlin engines were really cool tho. I think it’s cool that the spitfire and P51 were eventually designed around at the time was one of the hottest motors period. Late war 65 serious had close to 2800hp
@@TheJMan1K Unfortunately Rolls-Royce blundered by not developing the Griffon instead of the Merlin, the Merlin was too smaller by the time the war got going. The P-51 was a generation ahead of Spitfire.
I know it was an experimental aircraft engine that barely existed, but I'd love to see a video on the Rolls Royce Crecy. Arguably the most advanced piston engine of all time.
Ooh yes! Flight Dojo and Curious Droid have both done pretty good videos on the Crecy. What a monster. That and the Napier Sabre are about as good as big piston engines got.
The starting and idle of the engine at 10:52 was awesome! I'd ten times rather hear that kind of purring engine than some smarmy music track, and not even voiced over. In fact I replayed it a dozen times ...🥰
As someone who likes outlaw dirt winged sprint cars mechanical direct methanol injection direct drive V8s... and also a fan of history this is pretty cool🤩
I always wondered why they didn't use a cross plane crank in these or open up the bank angle to 90°. It also seems crazy the valves floated with an OHC setup at such low rpms and that they used such a large ex valve size relative to the intake valve size for such low rpm operation where you would want TQ. I would imagine that with modern technology you could make 2,000hp with boost on a GAA with no sweat for short bursts. You would probably need some tall gears to use it though. Like a 2.26-2.73 axle ratio with a 28"-34" rear tire and gears similar to a close ratio T-56 magnum with the 0.50:1 6th gear. So much for saying a flat plane V8 can't be larger than 5.2L like the claim was years ago about the GT350 having the largest production flat plane V8.
They were set at 60 degrees because this engine initially was designed to be a V12. The narrow bank angle though was a blessing in disguise because it fit more easily in the cramped quarters of a tank. The vibrations were dampened out by a heavy flywheel and vibration dampener.
Large ex valve is a benefit for low compression engine like this one.i wonder about valve float too.the valves are probably heavy and stiffer spring may have caused reliability issues with the oil of the day.maybe served as rev limiter for 6in stroke cast crank.
So this is the grand daddy of A: most drag motors and B: The 572 Ford Hemi (and World Products Merlin I guess?) that Bob Chandler’s Bigfoot raced to dozens of championships in the 80’s,90’s, and 2000’s? Unreal! Also it kinda sounds like a monster truck or early dragster in that sound clip. Showing this to my friend who loves WW2 history and tanks.
I need one of those, no...everyone needs one of those! I saw a tunnel hull speed boat that was powered by a supercharged Merlin at a race meet once, it was incredible to hear but the boat driver seemed to have some problems and it sank slowly as it went around the circuit. The Merlin was powerful enough to keep propelling the boat even when it was mostly under water with just the engine and cockpit above the waterline, I was impressed!
Apart from the use of gears surprisingly modern. One thing for sure they fitted a true range of weird and unusual engines to tanks during WW2. From the twin Caddy flatheads, the dual 671's the crazy Chrysler flat head radial thing there was some creative desperate stuff going on.
Mr. Lohnes,your research and storytelling are amazing. I thought I knew the history of hot rodding and early American cars until I started watching your shows. I don't know how many there are but I will watch them all, it's just a matter of how many times.. Thank You again Sir..
Old aircraft mechanic here. Whether it is a radial engine with a master rod and many link rods connected to it or Rolls Royce Style master rod/link rod per pair of cylinders- the geometry is such that it affects piston position vs crank degrees necessitating tweaking the camshaft grind and ignition timing on the link rod cylinders. I prefer side-by-side-on-a-throw arrangement with fork-and-blade coming in second.
Yet another outstanding presentation Brian. Admittedly, this piece of history is brand new to us and as such, we wished there was more to soak up like a sponge. All the best to you and we'll be watching and listing to your colorful and always entertaining commentary coming from Pomona. Cheers!
Great as always. I saw a couple of these in a barn as a kid in the late 80s. Wish I knew what they were at the time. Ah missed opportunity? Thanks as always great work.
Dealing in used machinery in Washington state, I came across a GSA Government auction that offered a hand full of Chrysler 426 Hemi engines. Some were Marine and others traditional. I still wish i had gone.
I enjoy the way you introduce and explain the genesis story and mention just enough technical information so as to illustrate the clever thinking applied by Ford's people. I've now learned about a great NA gasoline engine. Thank you!
Love this story. Incredible technology for this time frame. There were some really smart people working on this stuff. Amazing! Great job Brian! Keep 'em comin'.
Great bit of engine history man. I really enjoyed it... I've always loved American made vehicles, from all the brands. It's too bad Ford doesn't have that kind of work ethic these days... None of them do.
I'm just lovin this channel I can't get enough of this stuff I had no idea that such exotica such as sodium filled valves existed back this far and beautiful things such as shaft and gear driven four valve DOHC keep up the good work this is gear head ( or as we say in Australia petrolhead ) heaven ❤
In December, 1961 at Ft. Knox Ky. we were doing tank recovery training in a WW2 and Korean War era Tank Recovery Vehicle which was basically an M-4 Sherman modified for the job. The turret was removed and an open top assembly shaped like a turret replaced it. The engine was a Ford GAA V-8. One of the mechanics training us noticed that the engine was over heating so he foolishly opened the radiator cap. A gushing streamer of boiling water shot up and deflected off of the slanted rear of the fake turret and hit him right in the face. This incident ended our training for the day and sent the mechanic to the post hospital. We never did find out how he made out. By the way, the GAA engine sounded great when it was going through the gears.
I really enjoyed this video. Got to hand it to the guys who designed and built these motors. Someone suggested a video on the "OFFY" engine, That would be another Great video. Thanks for this video.
Great video as always Brian! One of my favorite tank engines other than the Chrysler Multibank and the Leyland L60 Maybe you should make a video on the Chrylser Multibank as well? (If you're up for it of course)
What a great video. More information than I have ever been able to glean on my own. Henry Ford produced a better airplane engine than the Merlin but was rebuffed by the military as they wanted to simplify logistics. Ford was justifiably upset and refused to participate in making the Merlin engine which then was produced by Packard. Aluminum block, double over head cam with 4 valves per cylinder. Absolutely incredible.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,At 73 years here...[ born 1951 ] . ; .As a kid my mom knew I was a gearhead by my actions...She told me the things I did at 2 years old.....I've been a drag racing fanatic since 1965 , when I read my first Car Craft magazine,,,which I still have [ preserved ]........................About seven or more years ago NHRA , had a pay for view of all the seasonal meets of drag racing ; called NHRA All Access,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,This Is where I first heard Brian Lohnes voice... Totally enjoyed his input at the racetracks when the racing was on.....I knew he was destined to become a main fixture in NHRA broadcasting .......Next in line for him was the job at FOX tv........And behold today,,,These awesome you tube presentations ; energized by his gearhead passion and dedication to Engines,,, men and machines , and all that goes with them.........Thank you brother gearhead........
Still working on a book on the US Tank Engines… the GAA is extremely complex compared to other engines. It has every bell and whistle. Minus fuel injection and super charging. However fuel injection was planned for the V8 once it was working on the V12. And super charging was suggested originally for the V12 Areo and suggested again for the V12 GAC. And it’s not unreasonable to expect it to be applied eventually to the GAA.
Great overview of the Ford GAA, it is one of the missed opportunities of WW2 that the V12 didn't make it into a P51 mustang. The ford V12 would have been more powerful, more fuel efficient cheeper to produce, more reliable and have much lower part count than the RR Merlin. It would have been one of the greatest aircraft engines of WW2 no doubt.
