Was Terminator Salvation Really That Bad? 

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Terminator: Salvation compared to Dark Fate is a masterpiece.

It also has Michael Ironside doing Michael Ironside things... 🤣

For me, Salvation is the best Terminator sequel after T2. It has a great aesthetic and finally moves the story into the post-war future while continuing some of the threads from the last one. Whereas all the other sequels keep doing retcon continuations. Christian Bale is great casting for John Connor, with the film choosing to focus on his rise and building up his legend, rather than throwing us into the thick of things. Anton Yelchin is also great as a young Kyle Reese and embodies the character far more than Jai in the next movie. The fan service is also well done, with it referencing things from the past films without being too in your face like most movies now. The biggest problem for me is the focus on Markus as a Point of View Character, which makes sense given the original ending. Though, I'm glad they changed it, because otherwise we would've gotten a fan reaction similar to Dark Fate years earlier. If any Terminator movie besides 2 gets another sequel, I'd prefer this with Bale returning as John Conner at the height of the resistance.

I just don’t get why they didn’t go for the Cameron future war look. All I wanted was a blue filtered skull littered wasteland with purple laser beams.

I thought it was awesome. I would have far preferred a sequel to this than Genisys or Dark Fate.

It has flaws, but I'll take it over Sega Genesis and Dark Fate.

This movie is once again, VASTLY underrated. Thanks for giving us your review of the film. Glad to know this film is getting recognition it deserves. This is one of the best Terminator films and my favorite of the first 4.

I feel the best way to watch these movies is: Number one Number two and then a Choose Your Own Adventure of picking whichever one of the sequels you want to watch after that. Excluding Genisys of course.

They should rename it "Terminator: At least it's not Dark Fate"

Christian Bale was rumoured to have travelled forward in time to 2018 in order to prepare for the role.

As a friend of my father said about Terminator Salvation: "We got a convoy here!" because some of the plot holes were so big you could drive a convoy of 18 wheelers through them. That being said, it was a fun romp.

15 Years AGO!??? WTF I am closing in FAST on "TERMINATION" ... F*ck

Genuinely did not mind Salvation because it did not infringe or retcon the first two movies, while expanding on the universe. I would have far preferred if they skipped T3 and went straight to Salvation, sure it didn't approach the first two films, but it had far more potential.

The real reason why there wasn't a sequel to this movie, is that it's not the box office performance, but rather the company who made it, The Halcyon Company went out of business and filed for bankruptcy in 2013

It's a shame they never carried forth with Salvation's Trilogy idea. It sounds like it would have been better than what we got.

My only gripe was A, they didn't have the phased plasma rifles shooting purplish-pink lasers and B, the fact that they spent their time outside in daylight when Reese said in T1 that you stay down by day but at night you can move around; that last one likely changed due to time-travel shenanigans but still it's something to keep in mind, otherwise it was a decent enjoyable film IMHO.

Love or hate this movie, Christian Bale as John Connor is genius casting.

I also find it interesting that the original ending to the movie was that John’s was carried out but his heart wasn’t holding up. Before he died, he recorded key updates of the future he knew from Sarah along with the rest of the cassettes she had left him. Kate came up with the suggestion that Marcus underwent an operation to essentially wear John’s skin and they don’t tell anyone John had died. Marcus agreed and became the new John Connor which is how he was able destroy Terminators so effectively. Ultimately though, that ending tested poorly with test audiences on the basis they didn’t like the idea of John dying or being turned in to a terminator in any way. It’s ironic that years later they tried both of those concepts in 2 separate movies. Clearly they didn’t learn from Salvations test audience.

Terminator Salvation should have been the last movie in the franchise. It should have been lasers, battles, learning Skynet's weaknesses, defeating the rogue AI, and ending the film by sending Kyle Reece back in time to save Sarah Connor.

Dave - I just remember it being boring. the worst sin for a terminator movie.

Whatever problems Salvation had, it actually continued the story. I would've loved to see that story continued. Instead, the next movie put the franchise on an infinite loop so that the story will never be completed.

As several other movies from the late 2000s, it was mediocre back then but is now a masterpiece compared to what we get today.

You didn't touch on what the original plan was; to kill John Connor and replace him with the Marcus character who would pretend to be John Connor. I'm glad they did not do that stupid idea.

Man, I'm right there with ya Dave! I've covered sci-fi film and TV professionally for a decade, went to film school and have sold and optioned scripts in Hollywood and have NEVER understood the hate for Terminator: Salvation. The Director's Cut is killer! The movie has a compelling cast, an interesting story that explains how the John Connor story is really partly a Marcus Wright story, it's got the Harvester robot, cool cycle-bots, and those frightening scenes in the Skynet factory. I have no clue, honestly! Love the T-600s in the desolated streets recoiling after they fire their heavy guns! The score is great, and even Bryce Dallas Howard turns in a decent performance! And how about that boss TRAILER using NIN's The Day the World Went Away?!! We have forgotten how good we all had it.

Little known fact, Christian Bale actually joined a set of freedoms fighters, became their leader, faught a war and time travelled into the future to do this role properly.

The one thing I m very grateful to about Terminator Salvation is that it brought to life the infamous and hilarious Christian Bale rant.

I had a blast working on this film, especially before things went to woke. It was good times back then.

If they were going to make more Terminator movies after T2 they should have all been set in the future timeline before the events of the original Terminator, showing John becoming leader of the resistance, his friendship with Kyle Reese, and the final destruction of Skynet before Kyle and the T-800 are sent back to 1984 and 1995. That could have been a great post-apocalyptic trilogy.

The biggest problem was that the Marcus plot twist was spoiled in the trailer. I think most of us would have preferred Marcus’ cyborg reveal to have been a shock to the audience. It also didn’t help that Marcus’ character really doesn’t change. He’s the same person in his prison cell that he is smashing the chair through a Skynet window….we never even find out what his crime was, only that his actions caused the deaths of his brother and two cops. That’s kind of important when the theme of the movie is salvation.

The appearance of the CGI-Arnold T-800 was worth the ticket price alone.

Salvation deserves kudos for breaking free from the time travel plot and depicting the post-apocalyptic world, but they should not have made it a continuation of the new timeline established by T3 and didn't quite get it right in their execution. It's not a bad film but unfortunately the rights owner at the time went bust and the timeline established in Salvation was stopped in its tracks. Unfortunately since this film there were two attempts to reboot the franchise that shat all over the legacy of the first two films leading people to conclude that only T1 and T2 exist in the timeline.

Fun fact: the entire Marcus story line is a left over from a previous iteration of the script which saw JC die and Marcus surgically alter his face to take over the role of JC in a “the idea of John is more important than the actual guy” twist. The reason they left the story in the final movie was because they had already signed Sam Worthington on behest of James Cameron

This movie has grown on me over the years. I like it. I don't especially think of it as a Terminator movie. More like a stand alone sci-fi movie. It dared to at least break out and do it's own thing.

Salvation is the REAL T3, as the real T3 it continues T2, at worst, it would have potentially ended the franchise, the Sarah Conner Chronicles is AMAZING if you like Terminator and want to see Sarah and John only a few years past T2. T2-Infiltrator is an excellent book.

Are we not going to talk about how that giant robot somehow snuck up on the humans at the gas station? No sound to get there, but when it rips the roof off, you hear all its servos whining. No comment about that?

The movie missed the mark by not making it about the war between humanity and skynet. Sure there were some cool fights but the fact we’re following some random nobody on a mission we barely understand undermines the story. What we wanted was the first five minutes of Terminator 2 made into a proper movie. It was that simple.

I actually really liked it. Was disappointed we didn't see the rest of the future war.

I always liked this one as it was the first time the war itself took the centre stage but the biggest problem with Terminator is it will always be judged by T2 standards. An impossible bar to beat.

I liked this movie. They had really cool designs and finally moved on from the present. I was sick of the formula of having a terminator guardian. It was about the war and John finally accepting his role as leader of the resistance.

Your voice is one of the few I can take in on a hungover day... thank you 🙏🏼

This movie had the right idea, but the wrong execution. It cleanly broke away from the whole time travel schtick from the original two films and established a premise set in the future war itself. Problem is, they should've made John the leader of the resistance like he should've been and end the movie with the resistance winning, Skynet sending their first terminator back to 1984 and the resistance sending Kyle. Everything comes full circle.

I remember 2009, setting up my pc, Stereo and couch. We watched 1,2 and 3 back to back. Went to the cinema to see 4 and it was so different to what we expected. Years later rewatching it, it was a better experience.

Terminator Salvation is the only movie in the franchise that does not involve with any time travel

The company that held the rights to the Terminator franchise, Halcyon, went bankrupt and that’s why there wasn’t a proper follow up to Salvation.

It came about just before the woke tsunami hit.

I don't mind it. It at least tried to do something different . I rank the Terminator movies exactly as you do.

After playing Terminator: Resistance, I developed an appreciation for this film. The whole timeline of the War Against SkyNet is a huge market. If there was a sequel, I really feel like we could have seen the Resistance closer to when SkyNet is destroyed in 2029. That is the visual gap between semi-modern military tech and the jump to plasma warfare.

Anton Yelchin is the saving grace of this film. He was taken from us too soon.

The movie had great potential and they should have focused more on the relationship between John and Reese but it was 2009, so they had to force insert Sam "zero charisma but Hollywood likes me" Worthington into the film...

I still remember Christian Bale's leaked on set rant. It's still legendary to this day.

It would have been awesome if Terminator 3 was in the Terminator 2 future. So it follows John Connor as the human resistance general. There could be some major battle scenes and so forth. The story would also follow Reece and how he climbed the ranks in Connor's army. There would also be scenes how the resistance tries to reverse engineer Skynet's technology. So in the end the human resistance is getting wiped out. Massive casualties. In the last push John and Reece go into Skynet and infiltrate it's time machine. John reveals to Reece he is his father and he pushes him into the machine. While at the same the time portal is still open, two T-800's and a T-1000 sprint through the burning infrastructure and dive in. A dying Connor listens to his ear com. Command's last message comes through in a static broken female voice. They thank him for his service, and they inform him Uncle Bob successfully went through.

What I've always commended and respected this film for was the use of real puppets for the humanoid terminators. It makes them feel much more real, tangible and therefore more intimidating. If you watch the behind the scenes, those puppets are so intricately designed with so much detail I can imagine it's honestly scary being near one even when it's lifeless. I don't know why it wasn't the norm to use them in other films. I imagine it would still be much cheaper than relying solely on CGI. It also helps the actors deliver stronger performances when the terminator that's menacingly crawling towards them is actually there on set.

It was far better than the latest terminator movies. Or any other movie released lately.

The thing is during this cinematic period we were all spoiled for choice we took movies for granted thinking how much better they can only ever get as the years go on. Oh how we were all wrong…

People often forget that Bryce Dallas Howard was Mrs John Connor here, which is why when she directed episodes of The Mandalorian, the Night of a Thousand Tears looks like a tribute to to the Terminator movies

I definitely felt the same way back then when then movie came out. I wasn't disappointed at all, infact I felt it was better than Terminator 3. The fact we finally had a movie that was set in the future was a big deal to me, it's just a shame it didn't do that well at the box office.

The crazy backstory of this movie was about the changing of the ending due to the backlash of a Drew McWeeny article covering the story leak: evidently John Connor was going to die in the original ending. The story then continuing with John Connor's face being transplanted onto that hybrid Terminator. Obviously the fan base went ballistic with the news leak so the powers that be made a last minute change to the story: heart transplant surgery in the middle of a war zone.

I think the biggest weakness of the movie hands down was the silly Sam Worthington not knowing he's a terminator plotline instead of having John Connor be the protagonist as he's basically a side character in this.

I loved this one.. I never understood the hate... Was hoping at the time to get a whole trilogy set in the future world!

I agree. In my imaginary cannon. T1,T2,T-Salvation is my three Terminator movie trilogy.

I enjoyed this film, certainly looking back it is far better than what came later.

I thought it was good! Just impossible to stand in the shadow of a perfect film in Terminator 2: Judgement Day. If that film isn't in the top 5 movies of all the time then there's something wrong.

Considering what came after, this was "King Lear". 15 years later, the crap the comes out now makes this film look mighty fine!

I remember really liking it, saying it was a step up in the right direction after T3, and was really hyped to watch a 5th and final film where the actual war would happen.

Fun fact: the original draft of the script had a twist ending where John Connor actually dies, and Marcus has his skin replaced with John's to assume his identity and lead the resistance in his place.

I think everyone wanted the future world depicted in the original movies, laser beams and all. While it wasn't a bad movie per se. The fact that it didn't have that template was deeply disappointing to me

Our movie writing standards have fallen since the late 2000s/early 2010s.

The last good Terminator Movie. After that came Genishit and Dark Fart.

I liked salvation. Was bummed that it was abandoned. Nice review 🍻

It woulda been great if they just focused on Christian Bales John Connor. This movie got bundled into with Hollywoods obsession to push Sam Worthington as the next big star.

John Connor = A Plot Marcus Wright = B Plot

First three films and 3/4 of Salvation: "Kill John Connor." 4th quarter of Salavation: "Ackshually, we just want to capture him for whatever reason.☝️" Also, the machines are too damn stupid to triangulate a simple radio signal from a submarine and literally blow the resistance out of the water. _THAT'S_ why yes, it really is that bad.

It would've been much better if they hadn't spoiled the twist in the trailer. A very solid sci fi action film.

The iffy plot aside, the main issue of the film is it just didn't look or feel like the future war we saw in terminator 1 & 2, which is all we wanted from a film set during the future war.

even blade runner 2049 did have a box - office success but some how people are starting to understand what a gem, it is!

The basic premise of doing a Terminator future-war movie has potential, but there's way, way too much dumb for me. I keep going, "How, despite several thousand aquatic robots nearby, does Skynet not discover the human base, when it's surrounded by magnetic mines? How does our hero not wonder why he never needs to eat? How do you survive a heart transplant when antibiotics are rare enough to kill over, let alone organ rejection drugs? Why don't the infiltration cyborgs, now established to all be walking atomic bombs, just go to human bases and explode?"... And so on, for several pages. If it was all so captivating that I never asked those questions at the time, that would be one thing... But it's just not.

I also appreciated what they were trying to do in T:S as I had been waiting for a movie set in the post-apocalyptic future for decades. My main issue with T:S was that Skynet knew that Kyle Reese was John Conner’s father. Then on top of that, it’s goofy plot to use Kyle as bait to kill John instead of simply killing Kyle and preventing his existence. I just couldn’t get over that.

Sam worthington was a bad choice. He is so boring. Maybe they should have concentrated on bale.

Flawed, but decent. The Throwminator thing was inexcusable. The chases with the T-1000 in Judgement Day felt very dread-filled. If he caught up to them, no more John.

I always really liked Salvation, and never understood why it was so maligned. As you said the Sam W character is weak, but there are lots of pluses that outweigh that. Good video.

I have no recollection of what youre talking about. The terminator story clearly ended with Terminator 2. They couldnt make any more movies after that.

I always liked it. It's kinda like the Halloween 3 of the Terminator franchise.

I actually enjoyed the hell out of this when it came out. Watched it at a early preview during my theater manager days. Great action movie and definitely needed to be continued.

I really liked the movie when it came out, even more so now... Never understood the hate. I really think they should have kept going with this as a series. If I recall they were meant to make a trilogy? Even a sequel. I think fans and producers are kicking themselves for scraping this with what we got after.

I really quite enjoyed Salvation, personally, even as a huge fan of the earlier movies, and was really disappointed when it was not given a sequel to pad out what it had started... I best remember it though for the irony that it was the second recent (at the time) movie that Christian Bale's performance as the lead protagonist was upstaged by the antagonist (the other being Dark Knight, with the late Heath Ledger's amazing portrayal of the The Joker)...

I really liked this film because it was set during the war - I just wanted it to cover more of the war campaign than it did to be honest! From the straggler survivors, linking up with Crystal Peak from T3, how they became a proper fighting force etc etc Good stuff but not enough of what really captured my imagination when I saw the opening sequences in T1 and T2.

You're 100 percent on point with this one.

Was it that bad? Yes. It ridiculously contradicted established cannon, and it was yet another vehicle for Sam Worthington to fail at generating any star power. I love the reference to John Connor as the man of prophecy, when there literally wasn't any prophecy about him at all, and even if there was how the hell would anybody know about it? Also, for some reason stand issue 5.56 M4's can now take down metal, which is also dumb.

I enjoyed it. Just wish it had the look of the flashback/forwards from the first 2 films.

The biggest problem the movie has, storyline wise, is that it contradicts what Kyle said in terminator 1 when he tells Sarah that they don't go out during the day

Salvation was better than T3.

I remember reading how T4 was originally gonna be about just Marcus, with Connor having a cameo at the end. They then decided last minute to make Connor a main character. I’m glad they changed their mind, Connor is the main character of the franchise, at least up to this point.

I loved it, and I wanted more. The T-600s were really cool. Oversized, and clunky. The T-800 was scary again. It certainly had a misstep or two, but I rewatch it 1-2 times a year

It’s funny you’re onto this too. I’ve been revisiting this and frankly kept thinking “ why don’t I like this?” Because I actually do. Turns out I like watching it for all the things they tried to do. I always love the practical effects. And compared to the current state of movies I think it’s quite enjoyable. After much resistance I consider it cannon and happy to call it Terminator 4.

I loved salvation. Best terminator sequel since T2.

"If you can hear my voice you ARE the resistance." - 😎🤘 I dug it! Would like another set in the Future!

The timeline does fit. This story fills out the storyline before the first story(1984) is told. This story is one potential future that leads to the 1984 story. The other storylines (T2, Dark Fate, Genesis, etc) are alternate outcomes stemming from the 1984 story, each becoming different realities as a result. The first story leading up to time travel has to occur first before the timelines can be created

Saw this one at a drive-in theater in RI. Was awesome and is still a fond memory for me, while being infinitely better than anything that came afterward.

Better than Dark Fate doesn't mean it can't be a piece of garbage. Both can be true.